F1 Car vs Dragster - the Downforce Showdown
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- Top Fuel Dragsters have some insane aerodynamics, and in this video we will explore why. We will also apply these concepts to an RC Dragster I have been working on to see if they scale. We will add a lot of downforce to an RC Car, and we will see if it actually helps us drive in an RC Drag Race setup.
I've got to say, I really appreciate your videos. I know your channel is still "small" but I commend you. I love your content. Keep up the good work! Hope your channel blows up soon!
Thanks for the kind words and I definitely hope it blows up as well. Then we can get some pretty awesome videos going.
although basic, you have a pretty solid understanding of all the forces at work here. Good stuff.
I would love Kyle from Kyle Engineers to do an analysis of the aero on these. I would imagine that the hollow section in the wheels and the area behind the rear wheel and the body would be generating absolutely massive amounts of drag.
Also a fan of Kyle's videos. For sure an interesting and a subject we can suggest
I've always wondered how he would design an RC car myself. I want to do a build that is pretty much a time attack car, which he has done a lot of lately. Would love his feedback!
@@EngineeringAfterHours That would be very interesting! But I can imagine it would be quite different. Well maybe not as they use models for windtunnel testing..
Another great video mate. I'm keen to do a little speed running too and first thought was 'where?'.. Looking forward to the next one as well :)
I’m honestly surprised you don’t have more subs, I feel like you make very similar videos to Mark Rober.
Thanks! Hopefully you growth continues to build faster over the rest of the year!
Really great video! Your videos inspired me to design my own multi-element rear wing for my rc buggy in Fusion 360!
Awesome explanation. Also, would be interested in a copy of your RC car spreadsheet you used, that's great work in itself.. Keep up the amazing work.
Just got into top fuel and was wondering a lot about the aerodynamics of those things. You explained it perfectly so thanks a heap! Subscribed.
two things i noticed you missed with some of the explaining, one, the dragsters are racing on a surface prepped with glue, allowing grip levels that arent attainable with your parking lot, two, the dragsters actually do launch with wheel spin, my dad has tested a lot on how slip affects grip and found that a wheel speed about 15 mph faster than car speed allowed for the best grip on a bias ply tire.
P.S. sorry about my grammar i didnt feel like using it, secondly im interested to see what you can do with these rc’s, as i have been interested in doing things like this to them for a long time although i havent yet learned how to. Again sorry for the grammar.
I didn't want to mess with track prep on this one but I do mention it on some of the other videos. This thing would be a beast with it.
And yeah dragsters have to dance the fine line between wheel spin and violent hops. If i could set this throttle to be maybe 10% speed instantly and then the delay I would be able to replicate that....but with this software I don't think it's possible. Maybe I'll keep playing to see if I can make it work. Good mention on that front
Awesome video! I battled the rear braking issue a lot with my streamliner and found the key is to have enough weight in the front to keep it going straight, which of course is counterproductive to traction (I'm working on traction control/ABS right now).
Some dragsters also run a solid airfoil for the uprights on the rear wing to help move the center of pressure rearward. They make some awesome functional scale parachutes which are over priced. I'm most likely going to use a nylon or dynema rocket parachute once I get over 100mph.
That next project in the background looks interesting. Getting power to the ground off road can be a challenge.
The record is up to 223mph now if I'm not mistaken, that is insane for a fricn little rc car 😳
They sell an rc parachute, it's by rj speed and it's $50, servo activated. Just something to consider
Apparently the Dumbo RC transmitter has a very good range on it, but it would mean you would need to have to find a way to put all the smart features on the car.
Drag chutes are a must, they're there for safety reasons as well as breaking.
But I would like to ask something. Do the full sized top fuel dragsters have open, closed or LSD differentials?
😀👍
Imagine it with some ground effect 🤔
good idea!
Lol thats actually in the works. It'll look more like a land speed car with most downforce coming from underbody aero.
@@EngineeringAfterHours I'm exited to watch that!
I'm running proline belted reaction tires on my 2wd no prep RC drag car. Those tires should be capable of getting you to 100 mph and should have superior grip to the BSR's on the launch. As far as running on a real drag strip I highly recommend just showing up on street night, I plan on doing the same thing with my 4wd 8s drag car but only running 1/8th mile, my goal is to eventually grudge race a real no prep car or 2 and shock the world when they see the numbers a castle XLX2 and TP Power motor can put down. or better yet... if you're willing to split a track rental halfway between us (I live in New Jersey) I'll race you heads up with no wings on my car purely for the content and entertainment value. at least they won't throw us out for not meeting safety spec, lol.
Also why is the top wing element completely vertical at the rear edge of a real top fuel dragster? Wouldn't that create thousands of lbs more drag for marginal gains in downforce at over 300 mph?
Would a smaller rear wing work better for top fuel dragster. They travel at high speed VERY quickly so all that downforce at the rear not too good. The rear wing is there for stability mainly.
I think DRS would he the most ideal solution for top fuel in terms of hitting higher speeds and better times, but theyre also nearing the limit of their tire rating so they don't want to go that route.
@@EngineeringAfterHours that's sounds like a great idea. For the first 3 sec the flap Is closed then For the last 3 it's open. Maby having a system that would only allow them to open the flap after the first 3 sec to prevent them overdoing it.
Hello i really like your videos. Can you make car with crazy downforce
Before watching, I am curious how you plan to compensate for the thrust that is created from the exhausts during the first meters that obviously cannot be easily simulated in RC. Cool project!
I was referring to 5:58 in this video by Driver61:
czcams.com/video/8HsCB8gdV3c/video.html
Also interesting video is this one by papadakisracing:
czcams.com/video/F98lUtez3EU/video.html
Ah 2:00 in the video you are also talking about it. Cool!
You are well studied I see! The main reason I didn't do anything is because off the weight it adds. But I have considered something like a catapult launch or magnetic tracks until the downforce is high
@@EngineeringAfterHours Thanks for answering. How about something with a regulated co2 cardridge with something like a volume multiplier (bernoulli principle) so it works for +- 2 seconds or something like that. It would indeed add mass but that may not be too much of an issue since you can't use all the available power anyway at the moment. It would add cost and complexitiy though so I can understand why you wouldn't want to experiment with it within the realm of rc drag racing
Are the wings 3D printed they look really smooth? I have been working on a F1 3D printed car (HPD EVO) and I have been playing with my rear wing design using SolidWorks Flow Simulation... but I don't know much about CFD
Yes I used an elegoo mars 3 printer. Resin prints are always really smooth
How much do you generally spend on a project like this? Because it looks really fun to do this and I might look into doing things like this myself.
It's all over the place in terms of cost. I try to buy common motors, radios and such so that cost growth is limited, but this was an example of a pricier build. I already had the castle motor/esc combo, the transmitter/receiver is like $250 or something, wheels are in the $50-60 range and then I bought the frame for another $250 or so. I make my own wings and all that so its really low cost. I'll also use this chassis in probably 2 more videos to average the cost per video down.
My next video will be nearly free because I am just reusing an old rc and building it into a sand dragster. Since I have 3D printers and CNC equipment, those parts are low cost for me.
Okay and if you make your own wings do you have a 3d printer?
POG
How tethered cars are going up to 400-500 km/h (they are toy cars with nitro engines)?
I'm aware of tether cars hitting in the 300kmh range but not the 500kmh range. Either way it's waaaay easier to get a tether car up to speed because the runways is "infinite" and there isn't a need to steer. So they can just run a ton of laps with a super low drag car to get their speed. I think their race tracks are also banked, so you don't need much downforce...which reduces their drag.
With RC cars you have to find a runway very long and smooth and the car has to be steered the whole time. The cars are typically larger to accommodate surface imperfections so they need even more power. You need longer range radio equipment for RC as well.
@@EngineeringAfterHours buy a tether car and try to see how fast it will go
Ok I get the dragster side of the video but I'm not seeing it on the F1 side
The reference to f1 is just there because I had always assumed F1 cars were the highest downforce race car there is. While researching this video I learned it's actually a top fuel and thought that was a pretty interesting fact. I had some more technical overviews comparing the traction limitations between them, but it just dragged on and felt like it was unnecessary.
Can you make a wing with DRS?
I think that's a good idea, I probably will in a video or 2
@@EngineeringAfterHours I think you are neighbors with my parents. Was that P*****R high school?
You could program the wing for dynamic downforce and drag based on the speed. Maybe break 5 seconds to 200.
@@joshuawolftexas I dont think that's the name of the school. I'm in north texas.
@@EngineeringAfterHours prosper high school/ Celina.
Make a 2020 f1 car with vortex generator
I don't see why a strip wouldn't let you run that down the quarter mile. Would be funny as hell watching a Hellcat get smoked a little RC car 🤣
Design a touring car that puts x-ray to shame!!!!!
Dragster technology is very limited by fia rules which is why I hate topfuel dragsters
first
although I hate just to say first thats a stupid comment
Then why do you do it?
At least it means people are watching!
@@Giuliana-w1f because i wanted to be first haha