How I struggled as a beginning story artist
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- čas přidán 5. 07. 2024
- it took me years to get a control of this mindset that led me to getting let go or pulled out from projects
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I think one of my biggest pet peeves about the industry in general is the idea that we as artists don't want to hear the reasons why we were let go and we'd much rather be lied to. I have pretty bad rejection dysphoria with my ASD... After getting diagnosed I was told by my doctor that It's especially common to have a meltdown when ASD folks are lied to, because it messes with their perception of reality. I FELT that so hard and was thinking about it for months. I had a producer run-in last year for similar reasons, and after arguing I literally told them that I need them to just be honest with me and don't summarize, shortcut, or try to 'be nice' when they think I'm slipping. They seemed shocked like they'd never heard anyone ask that to them in their life.
Its an odd balancing act... having your own agency as an artist and working on productions. I have to remind myself that the literal jobtitle of a producer is managing and processing the productions use of MONEY-- and TIME of the artists EQUALING MONEY. So any slowdowns or inconveniences are seen as a threat, and they need to be "handled" in any way possible. Once I started thinking of it that way... I was able to put some "reasoning" into flippant producer/show politics and attitudes. I dont agree with it AT ALL, but as an artist its a perspective that took me a REALLY long time to understand.
I hope that one day the job of a producer requires honesty and chillness! Its the cold and callous stuff that I still can't wrap my head around fully. It makes us doubt outselves and our skills outright.. but that producer not liking your work, that was their opinion. Its not your personal failing. I feel like EVERY producer has a way to make things work...I've literally talked to some who genuinely will fight for all the people on staff to keep their jobs. But when pressure comes in... its more about if they're willing to sacrifice time and money, and we ALL know how that goes.
Hugs
Oh bless you. You are loved.
I too am on the ASD spectrum, ll the rejections in social interactions, and i find out its RSO? also, low self esteem and hyperempathy suck. but they make you human./
as for the industry, thats the irony, its like a warehouse they treat it, BUT we aren't machines. we aren't 24/7. We are more prone to error but we don't completely crash, unless we burnout.
yeah im often afraid of the truth, yknow criticisms. but i gotta know they are helpful when constructive. opinions do not 100% equal critique. (Especially if its closed door. like, 'dont like it'
the industry want results and they will take the path of least resistance. they are both anxious and greedy about their money. (it could all be sunk into a project vs cut corners)
Again, bless you.
p.s. Ive never worked in the industry and honestly, i would rather keep my art and animation as hobby. MAYBE commissions, but im afraid of the industry.
I have ASD and I just tear people I don't trust at all anymore away from me. It's cold shouldered but... it's for the betterment of my mental health. I can't have a toxic person I don't even hardly know by my side whispering in my ear how bad I am or what I "need" to do.
Dude...major props for the reflection and self awareness. Developing certain mindsets and soft skills are SOOO important in the professional world. But they're rarely taught or shared.
Great job on sharing your experience!
As a beginning “personal project artist” this was some REALLY good insight 😧🔥
I'm a beginner too! ^^
Interesting. I worked on a project recently where I was the only animator and had very rough storyboards and the client was expecting a lot more detail, but also had unrealistic time expectations. It was tricky. It’s good to hear your experiences to put things in perspective
I feel like this is exactly why I don't want to enter the "big studio" space when it comes to animation. I am so much a "personal project" kind of artist. I suppose that's why I prefer the idea of doing indie work more. Great insight though! Thanks for sharing!
These studios just seem to want to get away with not hiring a storyboard revisionist 🙄
But storyboard revisionists don't make any 'cents'...right?
I think this mindset that more work = good, doesn’t just infect the animation industry but pretty in all jobs in general. In America, there is a lot of emphasis on work and competition, and it is exhausting to meet up with the expectations of other people. This is why when it comes to art, I usually take things independently, rather than relying on something already established, because that way I have control over what I want to do
I see this work = better results mindset trickle down into the most simplistic things, and that is what I am seeing with your storyboard career. It sucks when you have no control over your own individual autonomy when under a multimillion conglomerate that just wants to generate money
Im making a student film and it's the first time I've done a "proper" storyboard.. I'm actually really struggling with fleshing it out and making it suitable for other people to work from, but I'm trying my best!!
"Anyways that's all bye!" 💪💪 best ending to a video no, I'm not even trolling! Very relatable!
As a beginner aspiring story artist this video was incredible captivating! Thanks for sharing!! 🙏
Interesting perspective and experience. In professional industries (as in those with governing/certification bodies) where the majority of my experience is, I'd actually call what happened to you a leadership failure, rather than a personal one. Not that standards are always met in those fields, but things like setting works expectations and targets, walking through the production cycle/stages, etc, would usually be the responsibilities of management - things like team or project leads. And that would go double for onboarding/orientating new hires. specifically so that there's not wasted time, effort, or talents. I actually thought that would be one of the responsibilities of producers whose job description seemed to fulfill the equivalent role, interesting that it's not.
Completelly agree, that's 100% leadership problem if they didn't comunicate what they were expecting polishing wise and never noted you on it. As you said, that's just waist of talent.
It IS their job to direct you and give feedback, even though they might not do it properly. It's the director/producer/head of story responsibility to get your work approved and align with the studio's style and expectation just as much as yours.
Specially when the issue is polishing and not the storyboard quality itself (story ideas, camera choices, acting etc), which is the easiest to fix
This is golden! I want to be a story artist as well and it's tough to know how to be professional right from the get go. This lets me know what attitudes and practices to avoid. Thanks dude
Wow I never even thought about it this way somehow despite being conscious of the team goals as a whole. I worked with a group of people on an animation project and there was a lot of dispute on the voice of one of the characters. I think it might have been because of how the director wanted to save the voices versus how the sound engineer needed to use them. He couldn't put into words what the issue was cause he kept saying how the voice was good but the way it was done wasn't helpful for the first draft lip syncing. I thought he meant like the body language was against the voice acting or something.
Interesting- I’m what you might describe as a “veteran” having had 40 odd years in animation and the same thing has happened to me at least 4 times, for all the reasons you describe.
Most of my work has been in commercials rather than “long form” and commercials require a totally different approach when storyboarding, ie less breakdown of poses and exposition.
On the most recent gig for a very large company I was “let go” after completing half of a script that they had allocated to me with the intention of boarding the whole script for a TV series episode - was I too slow, drawings not right, too loose, too detailed, wrong hardware set-up - all sorts of reasons but at the end of the day I think was having difficulty in adapting to the concept of a “pipeline” having effectively been “self-directing” for a long time.
Theses issue are all the more important now since productions are distributed globally rather than in centralised studios where everyone works under one roof and communication issues can be dealt with quickly.
Additionally, after 4 such experiences on what could be described as “high profile” projects, I’m not sure I really want to work in what is essentially a factory system devoid of joy unless you are happy to march to the beat of a drum and stay within your limits, despite such benefits as a company account with Uber Eats and paid holidays…but then, I’m not a newbie so my perspective is a little different.
I also didn’t particularly look forward to the weekly zoom review meetings with at least 4 personnel present in various geo’ locations, and not one but three directors..
@@raviswami9852 sir,did you work in Ted Ed?
@@drawforge9640 - No I didn’t - I can’t say what the project was due to NDA’s and in retrospect I think it was a learning experience, so not a complete waste of time.
@@raviswami9852What do you do nowadays then out of curiousity?
Yeah, I had this issue as well. The problem is that some Storyartists are essentially putting themselves in the role of a director when working on a feature film and dictating their work, style, and execution the way they think works best and not necessarily what works for the studio.
I have my method of storyboarding which is essentially straigh-ahead animation. I set an interval timer for 45 seconds and let it run for 45 minutes and my goal is to get one panel done every 45 seconds. With this method I have been able to storyboard TWO PAGES of script in 45 minutes and it is super efficient for me.
However, it is also very difficult to read and it only really works when it is timed out and flipped through quickly. Just a single image rarely conveys enough information because my process is meant to be flipped through, not sat upon.
For some projects people love this style because it means it is very easy to time out and make into an animatic. For other projects it is terrible and people dont understand it so I always make sure to ask a studio/art director as to what they expect from my work and not assume that what I do will automatically work.
I'm glad your friend told you why you got fired, honestly I know it's hard to give critiqs to people, but if everyone assumes people know how it's done without telling them how they want it to get done there are a lot of skilful people whose only problem was not knowing how to do it ú_ù I'm glad you are telling it to people so less people have to suffer for this, thanks Toniko!
I always hear stories of animators who weren’t able to find a job (With diploma and without). So I would like to know if this is true and advice on what to do in this situation.
Ik this sounds harsh but it is the truth my guy. You just have to keep improving the skill that is needed of you. May it be proportions or character design. My dream job is to either work with illustration or animation and i'm grinding my ass off to secure that.
Paid Internships! If you want your foot in the door, it's always best to look for (paid) internships or if one comes your way and it fits in line for what you wanna do, take it! You build professional experience, pay bills, and build a savings.
Having a diploma doesnt get you a job. Being a skilled animator doesnt get you a job.
Being a skilled animator who knows people is how you get a job.
Unfortunately, a lot of "openings" for positions at big animation studios are rarely openings as most hiring practices are done behind the scenes via phone calls or through direct contact. I dont know ANYONE in the animation industry who has gotten a position at a big studio through an application. That's not to say it is impossible, but it is very rare.
I'd say making connections and creating a simple online portfolio is the key. Connections can be classmates, people you’ve met on an animation festival or other events, or co-workers from an internship (you'll also gain some experience here). Basically make friends with people. If they like you, they might be able to help you if an oppertunity shows up.
When it comes to portfolio it is very important to keep it simple and well organized. You gotta think from the perspective of an employer. They often have tons of applications to go through, and very little time to spend on each (let say about 2-3 min). If your portfolio is too disoriented and messy they gonna drop you and move on.
Also make sure the work you show have some similairity to the work the studio produce. If say the studio mainly works with kindergarden content, don't have a bunch of hyper-realistic horror type of art in your portfolio. :P
@@chosensamurott4907 It sounds very harsh, but at the same time inspiring, thank you man I will grind hard asf to make it, however I do recommend involvement with the community to get connections.
They were so harsh for not letting you know! Thanks for sharing
This is actually really good to hear. I very much have a “fix it later” work flow and have always been worried about going into studio work because of that. But now i know where to work to improve
I appreciate these personal stories, people usually don't understand that struggle is a normal part of understanding the process, for better or for worse. Videos like these are very sobering, thank you toniko! 💯
Totally can relate to being let go without being told the real reason. I don't work in the same field, but was let go, while being told that others would be let go as well. Fast forward a year or so and everybody else was still at the company, but me and while I appreciate that the people who let me go didn't want to make it sound like a bad thing, I do agree with you that it's just nice to know why you are being let go, since otherwise you have no idea if you were just doing a bad job or what , if anything you were doing wrong or basically just anything really..
Thanks for sharing and being vulnerable about your experiences!!! Its really Insightful an helpful to keep in mind the difference of work process that needs to be followed between personal and professional projects.
Great video! I think there's also something to be said about being the complete opposite. An artist who is very well geared for studio work. Focuses on the technical side of their job and what the other departments need and gets work rarely sent back to be revised but leads them to find it hard to let go and have the "fix it later" mentality when it comes to personal/ smaller projects.. The best is being able to be both! But as always - easier said than done.
I love your videos and appreciate all of the advice you give! I’m a teen who is interested in the animation field and I’ve been looking for some advice and I’ve always found that you have just what I need! I appreciate you sharing your struggles because you make such a good role model for people like me who aren’t really sure how to achieve my goals in animation! Thanks again! Happy Holidays! ☺️
Only partially related to this video but I just want to say thanks for years of great content. This channel has been an incredibly valuable resource.
This is gold as someone who wants to work in the industry and tends to work on projects from an “all-around” approach. Very much “I’ll get to it later” following whatever inspires me in the moment. Thank you for sharing! I will certainly have to develop more discipline 😅
I love listening to your work advice, it doesn’t just applies to story artist job, but in every kind of job.
Thanks for the insight! that's incredibly useful information
Love from India ..Always Luv Ur Content.Anyone Else From India
This was super insightful, thank you!
10:00 and on... Gol. Dang. TANGENTS.
Thanks for this advice
I'll probably be using it like 10 years from now
ik its already been a year but thank you so much for the advice! im about to go into my first gig and super nervous because i don't wanna mess up my first job.
bro, i love your video. sometime listen to your story make me more confident🤟🤟🤟
Your boarding quick without solid lines means the next bunch can not colour it without redrawing and closing the lines so doing your job twice so that is why you have to close it as the ones doing colour have to have each area/ plane sealed so maybe build the planes so they can colour the shape and contour with the colours better by incorporating it in the drawing so the closed areas of the planes and shape for contour are included in your design and it makes the colour departments jobs easier . Just a suggestion for future. Add -- CLOSED LINES --- SHAPES AND CONTOUR -- PLANES for SHADING that makes their jobs easier!
Storyboarding drawings are not directly transferred to the coloring team…
yay you uploaded :]
thanks for sharing
I loooove your pig and wolf characters, I want to know more about them
Oh no, I need to work on my discipline.
Sameeeee
Thank you! This is so helpful... and a little hard to swallow.. heheh
I can't even do storyboards for myself 😲
Sounds like I should not enter with just my personal experience, but also study the role in the company and how others usually do it in the industry before entering it.
Damn that’s a hard pill to swallow. I always half ass on everything I do
Thank you I feel like I was about to fall in the same hole
It was pretty shitty for them to lie about why they were letting you go. That's why I hate corporations, they're just full of dishonest assholes.
I see that kill la kill nudist beach reference 😏😏
5:45 why would you need to draw on model for a CG show in your boards??? Getting the general look of the character should he fine....right?
It’s a consistence drawing practice. It is useful when you want to revise the angle of the character in a certain sequence.
Hey great vid! Can you do some tutorials please? I really liked your expressions videos, so maybe one on hair or body? Thanks! 😊
i have some on the body already?
@@TonikoPantoja oh! Thanks for telling me! I have not seen it yet but will soon! Sorry for that ahhhh 😅
Wait, so you worked on How to Train Your Dragon? Have you worked with sir Wade Neistadt?
9:00 They didn't like your drawings? lol. Immediately before you said that, I was watching you draw that character (and the one at 1:11 before that) and was thinking how much I really love your style of characters because they look so fresh and expressive. I mean, I LOVE that style. So (unless your style has changed between then and now), they simply have no taste.
nice kill la kill thumbnail reference lmfao
Can I start form my phone 😔
I’m 21 and I’m about to be 22 is it too late to learn to animate
No it is never too late to learn animation!
You still have time! :)
What app u using?
So... it isn't bad that I detail even my animatics? I am torn between being detailed and not.
I think if making detailed work is what you prefer to do, then keep doing it
IS THAT A JOJO REFERENCE?!
Just kidding I know that’s kill la kill
That "Fix it later" mind set is very toxic in any professional environment. I can not stand people like this at all.
PRo tIp: draw characters on model
Me: No shit?
Depressing to hear that you got let go so many times and never even got the reason for why until an ex-co-worker told you. Feedback and criticism is the most important thing you can give an artist, especially one you work with. You might have been unprofessional, but your bosses were too.
Why are your guys so cute? Good advice tho.
Nudisto beech