Teachable - Rules for a Rundown When Two Runners Touch One Base Simultaneously and Are Tagged
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- čas přidán 15. 03. 2021
- In this Teachable, we visit a Cubs-White Sox Spring Training game wherein Chicago-NL runners Jake Marisnick and Cameron Maybin find themselves on second base at the same time as CWS fielder Yoan Moncada prepares to apply tags. Article: www.closecallsports.com/2021/...
Official Baseball Rule 5.06(a)(2) governs this play, stating that in a non-force situation, the preceding runner is entitled to the base, but there's more to this play than simply the rule. An umpire should have possible rules in mind for sticky situations before play begins and, as we see with 2B Umpire Gabe Morales, he clearly had his pre-pitch read in place.
Due to timing, however, see how both R1 and R2 are actually both safe at second base, only for the lead runner Maybin to find himself subsequently thrown out attempting to steal third base. - Sport
I love these. People thinking both are out simply for being on the same base at the same time. No one knows who is or is not out. I've yet to be the umpire calling this, so great description on what I should do here. FYI. I beat Dave J.
Nice job breaking this down Timmy! That said when is your next Livestream? Have a great day and hope that I can talk with you soon.
If there is no force in play, and in this play there isn't, then the base belongs to the lead runner. If there would have been a force as a result of the batter becoming a runner, the base would belong to the following runner.
You got it!!
Interesting breakdown I always thought that when two runners ended up on the same base that the base belonged to the lead runner and the trail runner was out guess I was wrong, thanks for breaking this rule down makes more sense now!!!
Thanks! The process of learning never ends!
You're not wrong,
the only reason this didn't happen here is because by the time they tagged the trailing runner who would be out, as you say, the lead runner had already come off the base
which meant you no longer had two runners on the same base and thus the trailing runner was not automatically out when both are tagged.
@@alexchavez3383 He is wrong. On a batted ball with 1st and 2nd base occupied, the lead runner would be out when tagged if R1 and R2 are on 2nd base.
@@alanhess9306
But we're not talking about a batted ball with a force play here. We're talking about a pickoff play with no force in effect.
@@Rowgue51 True, but I'm saying Tylerhopkins was wrong to believe that when two runners ended up on the same base that the base belonged to the lead runner and the trail runner was out. That's not always true.
Thanks for the explanation
You're welcome! Thanks for watching!
I love this! I always like to imagine a scenario with rule savvy players where the lead runner just does a dance with the base and the fielder trying to tag him in order to save the trailing runner. I'm on, I'm off, I'm on, I'm off...
Always have to think the game!
Well done.
Great job 👍🏽
So the lesson of the story is, if in doubt, tag both players over and over again until you get a definitive "#__ you're out!"
Seems like the runners knew the rule better than the defense.
so what about the Cubs-Milwaukee game a few years back where R2 went back to first base after R1 was called out?
Hey can you explain this for me so there was a person on first and second and the person on first lead off too far and I got the ball thrown to me at first for the pickle but guy at second hesitated to run then when the person at first was almost at second he started to run to third so I threw a perfect throw to third and got him out but my coach yelled at me and told me there was 2 outs and said that was the wrong thing to do and also do you have a video of this happening
Quick comment about abandonment. I believe that runners are free to take any path they wish from base to base as long as no defender is actively attempting to tag them (skunk in the outfield play). In theory a runner is free to run all the way out and touch the outfield fence as they are running from first to second base. They are only required to run in a particular base line once a defender is attempting to tag them. So if a runner ran from second base to the pitcher's mound and then ran to third isn't that ok as long as no defender is attempting a tag? Just curious about the idea of abandonment and when an umpire makes the decision that a base runner has abandoned the next base.
Yes, insofar as the out of the base path rule is concerned. For abandonment, the precise rule is: "After touching first base, he leaves the base path, obviously abandoning his effort to touch the next base" (5.09[b][2]). The general idea is abandonment is declared when the runner, through their actions, indicates they have abandoned their effort to run the bases and it is separate from the base path rule. Pure judgment call as to whether the umpire thinks the runner has, by their actions, indicated they are out for having abandoned.
Disagree. OBR 8.01(d): "Each umpire has authority to disqualify any player, coach, manager or substitute for objecting to decisions or for unsportsmanlike conduct or language, and to eject such disqualified person from the playing field." Even without knowing this rule, which I had to find just now, if the base runner made a travesty of the game in this manner, as an umpire I would've found this to back up my ejection that surely would happen.
This is the only mention of "travesty" in OBR: 5.09(b)(10) "After he has acquired legal possession of a base, he runs the bases in reverse order for the purpose of confusing the defense or making a travesty of the game." Stretching it, this could also be used. Still, I don't think anyone would argue the ejection.
So does this apply to a similar Situation on 3rd Base? Let's assume there is Runner on 3rd and a Runner on 2nd , First Base is Not occupied but the ball is a Hit ground ball so there is No force for the Runner on 2nd Base the Runner on 3rd is in a rundown between 3rd and Home but somehow both runners end Up on 3rd Base .so I assume the trail Runner is Out since there was No force for the Runner on 2nd Base . Or am I completely wrong ? I am relatively new to Baseball, so please don't be too hard on me : )
If you just think about the following Runner that he is simply off his base even though he's touching second base,, the preceding Runner owns the base
It’s the runner who first occupied the base!!
Did you miss like 90 % of the video?
No it's not.
And once again the confusion on plays like these, both from the players and the people watching, is the result of the umpires not doing their job properly. When a fielder is making a tag of a player or a base attempting to make an out you emphatically make a call one way or the other. You don't just stand there like an idiot waiting for them to tag everybody and then try to sort out what the result of the play should be after the fact.