Primer Test
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- In this video we go over the effects using a different primer can have. I used 5 different primer. Lets get into the velocity and group size difference while using the same projectile and loose BH209 powder 70 gr by weight.
Updated Test Results : www.suburbanhu...
I have been using the Cheddite primers since I started muzzle loading and only had 1 hang fire that I recall. I tried the Federal Muzzleloader specific primers and I had two hang fires in 10 shots. It was also the first time that I tried White Hots. I usually shoot Blackhorn 209 but haven't been able to find any in Canada so I had to try something new. I think I have watched all these muzzle loader tests of yours 10 times now. Thanks for putting them all together.
Thank you!! I haven’t had any hang fires from the MZ specific primers but based off the FPS difference I would rather shot the standard or Magnum primers. BH209 was hard to find for awhile there but 2 weeks prior to TN muzzleloader season they came out in force. But at $83 per 8oz jug they aren’t moving too fast. Thanks again for watching and good luck out there this season
I am using the Winchester 209 in my CVA Optima, with 2 pellets of IMR White hots and 245 gr Powerbelt Aerotip, group great. I switched from the 295gr Powerbelts to the 245gr, first shot bullseye.
That's awesome!! My rifle also seems to prefer the heavier projectiles. Thanks for watching and good luck out there.
Cleaning the breech in between tests would be good to see. I had hangfire and misfire issues with my CVA Accura MR years ago. I called blackhorn 209 and he said all CVA Blackhorn breech plugs need to have the flash channel cleaned with 1/8th inch drill bit and the flash hole cleaned with a torch tip cleaner. I had always ran the torch tip cleaner but near thought about the flash channel. I use a little T handle drill bit holder with an 1/8th inch bit and it works amazingly. Blackhorn also recommended using a small O-Ring in the bottom of the primer pocket if your primer comes out dirty after shooting. They said this is caused from poor head spacing and the o ring seals it back up sending more of the primers energy into the flash channel rather then backwards around the primer. The o rings are good for about 5 to 10 shots.
Hate to hear you had issues. CVA sales that channel tool you mentioned. I do use it every time that I clean the breech plug. Which is between each group. That would be a super simple video to do. Thanks for the comment.
Here is a link to that Breech cleaning tool
amzn.to/3NvuubW
@suburbanhunt3653 Thanks. I had my issues back in 2013. Blackhorn209 was relatively new, and CVA had just released the blackhorn compatible breech. They didn't make that tool yet. It's probably because of issues people like me had back then that they saw the necessity to come out with that kit...lol
Watched both vids. Primers do make a difference but as far as group size you are neglecting or just not testing, different bullets and sabots. That can make a huge , huge difference in group sizes. I doubt if all of us have the money, time, or place to really test the huge variety of bullets out there now for accuracy, let alone terminal performance. Which is why CZcams is such a huge resource for us. Sadly for me, the bullet that works the best out of my gun is no longer in production and I will need to work up a load again when I get low. It was a Hornady with a concave base, no sabot or skirt, just expanded the round itself into the bore. Great shooter but hard to load due to it being almost bore diameter. Powerbelts don't work even a little for me in my gun. Nobody ever said it was going to be easy, LOL.
That sucks to hear you lost your favorite projectile. As for test.. the only way to show the effect the primer has, all other aspects have to be the same. I used PowerBelt 245gr coppers because I the more of them. I have tested several projectiles with multiple powders. Hope that sharing my results, in some way, help other shooters. The Hornady FTX is most accurate over all the test that I’ve done. And I’m testing the ELD-X now…. Let me tell you they are awesome!!! Hope you find a new combo that works for you and hopefully in some small way we helped. Thank you for watching.
@@suburbanhunt3653 I watch your other vids with different projectiles so you are doing good work. Hornady is a pain in the ass, they make great stuff generally and the it gets discontinued. I was shocked to see the pyrodex punch sub MOA, I use 777 magnum pellets in my load, need the extra to push a no skirt copper slug into the riffling. The bullet is Hornady FPB 350 Gr. ballistic tipped ,Concave base, no skirt or sabot.. Found them online but the sites were fake so never wasted my money. That's another issue, fake sites all over the place, gotta check before sending them bank card info !
Thank you for breaking my heart, I've used the Winchester T7 the last couple of years mainly all I could fine but will be looking for the other top ones. Thanks for a good video and good information.
Thank you for watching. If what you use works… what kind of groups are you getting? What powder or pellets are you using? Have you ever had issues with the rifle going off? I had hear rumor but so far not seeing to much to back it up. Lower speeds yes but the rumor was not firing.
@@suburbanhunt3653 I've go a CVA ACCURA V2 PR use pellets Triple 7 100gr and the last 3 yrs used Winchester T7 primers. Like I said mainly all I found. For the misfires no problem at the range or hunting... no problems but 1 and my fault. Hunting in Ohio and opening day HARD Rain all day turned to snow that night and freezing cold next day, now I use those finger cots some call them condons over my barrel in wet weather but did not change my load. Yes a doe came within range and misfire. I took the old powder out yes wet so it was my fault not the primer. Only time they have not fired and have used them in bad weather before with good luck. Exactly Im thinking of going back to 150gr T-7 it shot better than 100gr. Only reason I changed was trouble finding powder 3-4 yrs ago and getting low on it. I'm not a big time shooter but I'm happy with 2 inch at 100yds. The 150gr does better than 100gr with my setup but always looking to improve.
@@1Whitetail I understand the wet powder situation. Been there. Thank you for the story and the info!! And you are 100% right properly placed 2inch groups will drop them every time. No matter what you choose to do good luck out there this year brother almost time
@@suburbanhunt3653 Good luck to you also and maybe get to see your success or not on video, we take the bad same as the good.
@@1Whitetail you most definitely will. Thank you
The 777 primers and the cooler primers I heard were an attempt to curb the 'crud ring' from pellets. My take on THAT is crud rings are user error as much as anything. Won't get into why but can I get 20 rounds out of 777 pellets before cleaning. I want as hot a primer as I can get and the Federal 209A seems to be it as far as hot goes. We will be trying the BH209 powder next season as I think my pellet days are about done.
The Federal 209A definitely get the job done. Best of luck with the BH209 next year. Thanks for watching.
What you don't want is the primer pushing the charge before it ignites. That is the sweet spot with them.
Have you tried homemade primers?
No Sir. I have heard you can make your own but I’m not sure about it.
There's a small mold. You cut up aluminum cans into small pieces. Then use a punch to make the primer cup. Next add the primer compound. Then add ether or alcohol to the compound. When it dries the primer is ready.
There are different molds for different size primers. I made one size
I really like all your tests. Please keep it up. I have decided to use Triple 7 pellets but I am now considering using the Triple 7 powder based on the fact that it sounds like the pellets go bad after a while and the powder appears to have a longer shelf life. Do you have a video that shows the comparison between using the magnum load of Triple 7 pellets (3) versus Triple 7 powder (I think this is 120 grains but not sure).
Thank you. I've haven't gotten to the Triple 7 Loose yet. I have both the FFG and FFFG powder and I plan to compare then to see what, if any, difference there is between them. As for the shelf live, yes pellet will go bad way faster then powder. Part of that is the packaging. The pellet box don't make a great seal while the loose power does. Me personally, prior to start all these test, would throw the box away after the second season. All real data to explain why. I just know they went bad so that what a opted to do. Thanks for watching.
@@suburbanhunt3653 Store pellets in a sealed ammo box with dessicant or in a ziplock bag in a chest freezer.
@@jeffhays1968 that’s a pretty good idea
Accuracy then killing power is the most important in my book
1000% agree. Thanks for watching
good report.
Thank you for watching.
I have two breech plugs for my TC triumph, clean them n change often. BH 209 is the best if you do your part. I’ve tried all those primers n had misfires. Get the hottest primer you can find?
You have had misfires on all? Yikes. If that is the case I would really look at love to CVA. I’m not sure how the firing pin works on TC but with the exception of two all misfire we’re due to dirty or fouled firing pin. Again I clean my rifle every third round including the flash hole. Even with a fouled pin I have only had around 7 misfires, across several primers. That being said yes… I use Federal 209A or CCI magnums when in the woods. But I have had great success with Cheddite also. Thanks for watching hope this helps.
How do your primers fit in your breech plug? I have a blackhorn 209 quick release breech plug and my winchester 209 primers are very loose in the primer pocket. They wiggle all around and are also much taller than the primer pocket so that the shoulder does not get anywhere near touching the breech plug. I feel like there is something wrong with the breech plug but even the replacement i received has the same issue.
They were loose for me also. Take a look at this chart for the sizes of the different primers. The Winchester are “smaller and taller” than the others. I have had them slip out in certain shot shells when reloading.
www.trapshooters.com/threads/primers-size-physical-size-only.824407/
Federal 209 A is my go to. Maybe another test?
I will look for some but primers are very hit or miss with regards to finding them. I have a good amount of CCI mag and Cheddite primers but I’ve not been able to find any Federals. If you have a lead on some shot me the link and I will pick them up.
Try pyrodex / triple seven powder with different primers see if they cause iratic accuracy?
Can do. Thanks for the suggestion
Have you tried the federal 209a? I tried them after not being able to find the cci Magnum primers which I've been shooting for years. Keep the videos coming and thanks From a fellow Tennessean
I have been able to find any. But another subscriber met my just out of St Louis and donated a sleeve. Video forthcoming. Thank you watching and good luck this season.
Spend the $$ to purchase a breech plug conversion kit from Arrowhead Rifles that utilizes Large Rifle magnum primers. This will solve all the ignition problems when using Blackhorn 209 (Black Gold) powder.
LRP are almost as hard to find at this time. I pray that changes but I don’t it in the near future. Good luck and thanks for watching
@@suburbanhunt3653 Granted, all primers are hard to find. What I am saying is, that in order to eliminate a fail to fire situation when using Blackhorn 209, switch to Large Rifle magnum primers. Often times smaller local gun stores are the place to find them, as online stores get cleaned out of inventory quickly. So other than the extra dollars needed to purchase the Arrowhead breech plug conversion kit, there isn't much disadvantage to the primer availability issue. A few months ago I found LRM primers at a large big box store and also two smaller gun stores. To save the Hazmat fee, I purchased from the smaller gun store. Blackhorn itself is hard to find and when you do, it's way overpriced. I paid $69.99 per 8 ounce bottle a year and a half ago at a local gun dealer. About 3 months ago I found some at the same dealer for a friend of mine. This time they had pasted a sticker over the top of the original 69.99 sticker that increased the price to $79.99. Needed it, paid the price. Capitalism works when the supply side isn't drastically less than demand. Right now, due to numerous reasons, the supply-demand ratio is completely out of whack. Remember the companies that are gouging you now and know who to vote for when you go to the ballot box.
Which primers are the cleanest if you shoot one to dry the breech plug. I use the win. triple 7 and if you shoot one to dry things out what a mess in the barrel. You have to clean the barrel again.
To be honest I’ve not heard of using a primer to dry a barrel. I know that some people pop a primer to foul the barrel rather than running a full round. Sorry to say I’m not sure.
Where the hell did you come across a gold mine of primers lol. Those things are like gold in my area. None can be had
Honestly I travel a lot for work. I have have spent a lot of time going to gun stores and reloading shops with many ending up empty handed. Even with that it took a subscriber finding the Federals and mailing them to me for me to test them all. You are 100% correct they are like gold!! Which is why I’m willing to test them to help others with what primers they can find.
Triple 7 primers suck! I’ll never use em again after last night. Costed me my biggest buck in my life. Had a perfectly clean gun! After getting a perfect shot at a wide 10 the primer went off but my powder didn’t. Put in another primer and this time the primer went off and the powder ignited about a full second and a half later which I had already pulled my head off the gun. I know my powder wasn’t wet as it was brand new and had been loaded just prior to walking to my blind.
Oh my lord in heaven!!! That is my worst nightmare and why I never got into the old 11 percussion caps. I’ve not experienced a delay with 209 primers before. What type of powder/pellets? It may sound stupid but did you handle the pellets by hand. I have heard rumor the oil on your hands can cause issues but never known anyone personally. Man I hate that for you in the worst way!!
@@suburbanhunt3653 I used triple 7 pellets with a hornady bore drive ftx. Yes you’re right I have heard using your fingers can cause that as well but I used the pipe cleaner that comes with them to load them.
@@suburbanhunt3653 also I made sure before even leaving the house that the gun was clean as well as dry inside. The breach plug was cleaned and you could see daylight through it as well. Had to of either been the primer not being hot enough or an act of God. I’m hoping I get another opportunity at him.
@@PoorBoyPursuits I figured. I recommend Federal 209A. But Cheddite and CCI 209mags work great too. I’ve seen more Cheddite on the shelves more then anything else. Best of luck the rest of the season
@@suburbanhunt3653 I will definitely try the federal 209A I just read that they are apparently a hotter primer. Do you have personal experience with them??
And you found the Black Unicorn powder?? You definitely paid for that stuff lol
Yes Sir. Going rate is around $83 per 8oz jug
@@suburbanhunt3653 I paid 36 dollars 3 years ago for it lol. At Cabela's
TRIPLE 777 JUNK IN COLD WEATHER TO COOL NOT HOT ENOUGH!! SOMETIMES NO IGNITION.
Interesting havent heard that before. How cold we talking? TN doesnt usually get crazy cold. Honestly by then we are well into modern rifle so I’ve not experienced that myself
HERE IN NY SNOW ON GROUND, THE TEST SHOWED THEY ARE COOLER SO WHY BOTHER USE THE BEST THEN NO WORRIES. REMINGTON PRIMERS, CCI THE BEST.@@suburbanhunt3653
Which muzzleloader?
I’m using my CVA Optima V2
@suburbanhunt3653 that's a good one. I hope to get one someday. All I have is a couple of caplocks, .54 and .50 cal. Time to move into modern day. Great vid!
@@yellowjacket548 Thank you. The important thing is to use what you have. Of what you have works… run it. Thanks again for watching