Will It Run? How-To Evaluate a Force 120 Two-Stroke Outboard Motor: PROJECT PONTOON Ep 2
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- čas přidán 10. 09. 2024
- Will it run? In this weeks video, we will do a basic evaluation on my Force 120 hp outboard that came with my Project Pontoon. In what kind of condition is the fuel system, spark system, engine internals and does everything work as it should?
Force outboards were originally manufactured by Chrysler/West Bend. The Chrysler outboard line was purchased by Bayliner in the 1980s and became part of the Bruswick Corporation when it purchased Bayliner around 1990. Since Mercury Marine was Brunswick's outboard line, Force became a sub-brand or Mercury. As the 1990s progressed, with each model year, the Force line became less a Chrysler outboard and started using more Mercury parts. Production ceased after the 1999 model year.
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Compression Tester: amzn.to/422E5M3
Check back for the next video where we will rehabilitate the fuel system and get the motor running on the carburetors.
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I worked at a Chrysler/Force dealer in the mid 80’s. We sold Mariners and Johnson on package Javelin boats. Our owner loved Chrysler/Force but rest of the crew didn’t. The 125’s back in 1985 were bad about blowing the number 1 piston typically on the first trip out for customers. US marine wound ship is a new short block no questions asked. The 50’s and 85’s were the better engines but all Forces were slower and less reliable but cheaper than all other makes. This is a great video and found like you have a fun project.
Thank you for the insider's perspective.
Nice video looks like a fun project
I'm troubleshooting a Force outboard I just bought. Here's hoping. 🤞🏻
Hopefully it is nothing too involved. The big problem with the Force motors is the inconsistency in what actual parts were used for a specific model year. In a given year, there may have been three or four different lower units used but the parts manual only lists one. For instance, you may have to buy three or more water pump kits to assemble the right number of parts to replace your impeller. Some of the forums have very knowledgeable former Force/Chrysler/Mercury techs that are willing to assist with part number identification. The Force motors seem to have a bit of a cult following but parts are expensive and figuring out exactly what you need is not easy.
Should have throttle wide open when checking compression
I agree
I have the exact same boat and I change the fuel pump now the problem is when I turn it on it starts to accelerate from 0 to 60 by its self I had to change the fuel pump because it had a whole in it and it was passing raw gasoline threw it any clue what it could be
Revving up takes two things, fuel and air. If you have a vacuum leak, you could have the engine over rev.. A stuck open throttle plate could cause over revving too.
The symptom I had was if I pumped up the fuel bulb, I would get fuel running out the exhaust.
@@DougsMessyGarage What can I do then?
@@user-vl2je8mz5s check to make sure the throttle plates in all of the crabs are closing to as near as 100% as possible (a slight crack open is fine, that's for idle). Make sure the carburetors are seated properly, cannot pull air around the base. Check to make sure the gaskets around the intake are intact. Since you have had the fuel pump off and it opens to the crankcase, that is likely where your air leak is coming from. It would take a fair amount of air to rev up quite a bit. Hopes this helps.
Hello! Thanks for the video! I have same motor, but my forth cylinder have no compression. Should be restoring. Watching you from Kazakhstan)
Be careful when ordering parts. Force was terrible about following the parts manual. A '94 motor might have a '93 power head and possibly a '92 lower unit. When ordering parts, it can be hard to figure out exactly what you have and thus what to order. Best of luck with the repair.
You don't need to hand prime it! Just squeeze the bulb on the fuel line a few times, Then s you turn the key to start it, push in on the key. That will prime it
Pushing the key in chokes it
Squeeze it till it gets hard (sounds Freudian). You can hear the fuel enter the carbs.
Great stuff Dough, love the content, good explanation, don’t mind the fools in the comments
Thanks, and thanks for watching
Force is all scrap parts from Chrysler outboards when they crashed. Then mercury bought them over and slapped some of there parts on and used some of the Chrysler parts. Then they named it force
A pretty accurate summary except I believe some of the Chrysler parts were third party so there were often several different versions of the same item used throughout one model year, depending on availability. Figuring out what lower unit is on what outboard is a pain.
Chrysler outboards did not crash but had to be sold as part of the government bailout in the late 70’s. Chrysler outboards were actually a profitable division of Chrysler. US Marine bought them in the mid-80’s and re-badged them Force outboards. Brunswick .(Mercury outboards parent company) purchased USMarine in the late 80’s which included Force. Mercury started adding addressing some of Force’s issues that dated back to Chrysler with better casting, ignitions, lower units and more. Emissions killed Force in the late 90’s when 4 strokes and heavy emissions requirements came about. Once again, they did not crash.
@@melrose9252 Thanks Mel. Your history tracks what I have learned about them. Force outboards certainly seem to have a loyal following.
I have a 1996 mercury force 120hp. And it has been an excellent motor. I have found that most bad mouthing about this motor are from guys who have never owned one and from a friend of a friend's cousin says it's a bad motor. Typical internet replies.
Hey Doug. Question. Why does the upper carb and lower carb use different size jet. Why don’t both carbs use same size jets. I just don’t get it. I run snowmobiles for ever and just would nvr make sense to run different size jets from one carb to the other so why would the 120hp do this?
I will have to take a look in the service manual and see what it says.
@@DougsMessyGarage I have my Manuel it says .088 upper carb and .090 for lower carb but that don’t explain why they do that.
@@DougsMessyGarage as far as testing compression it’s always been known to hold it wide open while cranking but in manual it says it as well. Mine has 185-190 psi across all cylinders. So extremely good compression
@@acurarl9929 185-190 sounds a bit high for a two stroke, even with the carbs completely removed. How confident are you in the accuracy of your gauges? 150ish is considered new on these engines I believe so that's why I ask about your gauges. It is supposedly normal for the top and bottom cyls to be slightly higher than the center two by about 5 PSI according to a long time Force mechanic I was messaging with on the iBoats Forum when I was checking out my outboard.
As for the different jet sizes, I suspect there is some kind of casting shape issue that affects smooth mixture flow into the lower two cyls and that is likely why they run the larger jet. This is only a guess on my part though.
@@DougsMessyGarage you got my wheels turning now. I’m sure I can test the compression tester using air compressor and seeing if tester reads what my compressor regulator says it’s putting out. I guess I should try an test the tester.
Really do need to be wide open to get proper compression readings
That what the book says
How do you work the trim
The Force had a toggle switch on the steering console that operated the trim/lift. I have since upgraded the boat to a Yammy 4 stroke and it has the trim/lift on the throttle control.
Hi
gosh i hate carbs with a passion. i always say, life would be easier if every motor is fuel injected
True enough but then you are relying on the integrity of wiring and these old motors were known for wiring issues too.
Save your money and buy a better engineered motor. I had a 98’75hp that was just dead weight on my boat. A friend of mine has a marine shop and he had a bin out back that they threw those U.S. Marine motors in and sold it to the scrap man.
I suppose I mostly agree. My Force came as an inoperative throw-in on my pontoon boat and I was successful in resurrecting it. I now have a Yamaha four stroke on the 'Toon and am much happier. I am thinking of getting another project boat to put the Force on because I basically got it dialed in right when I found the deal on the Yamaha but thoughts are cheap.
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Your mic is a little bit to sensitive, for me.
Thanks for the feedback
You have no idea, that’s true it is, now that’s likely a lot of dribble. How about you just be happy and talk to the camera like a goofball
A successful fail
Blah blah blah,
Fumble Fumble Fumble
Thanks for watching