LIVE! Real Lawyer Reacts: Read Trial Day 16 Part 2: Aruba = Motive?
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2024
- #lawyeryouknow #karenread
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So in a jealous rage she waited 3 weeks then ran him over with her car in front of a cop's house. The prosecutor better get to those dots. If I'm on the jury, she's going home.
Same
That is true, the presumption makes no sense.
Presuming the prosecution is right (which isn't how court cases are supposed to work), we still don't know how the car impacted him, how the impact damaged him, how he passed away (instant? blood loss? internal damage? hypothermia? etc), when he passed away, literally anything. How am I supposed to take a relatively benign argument from a month ago seriously as motivation when I'm not informed on the main event of this whole case: if/how Karen did it at all? "Why" is pretty secondary to that.
I agree!! Make it make sense
YEP!
I have never followed a trial before where I was thinking more about whether the witnesses are guilty or not than the defendant.
Yes...me too!!
Yup. Half the time I forget Karen is on trial for murder because I spend so much time asking myself - wtf is this person hiding and why are they just blatantly lying? I feel that way about almost every single witness.
Because they come across as very guilty, very cocky, snarky, uncooperative attitude the two Albert Brothers, Chris and Brian acted like freaking mobsters when they were on the stand. These are people who are used to sweeping anything and everything under the rug with all the friends they have and now, they might be in trouble
Rare instance of irl Phoenix Wright. I wouldn't put it past the defense to call out a specific witness as the culprit at this point.
Maybe they come across that way because they have been torched since this happened .. why is it every person that testifies according to fkr as liars .. are you going to say this when the doctors and hospital staff testify ? The medical examiners ? When you hear everything karen said to him after she left him at 34 Fairview ? It should be interesting to see how the fkr handle all the evidence as it continues to roll out .. will you all believe her if she got on the stand and said I did it I’m sorry ? You all won’t because you all have to believe you’re right .. start doing some critical thinking.. there’s a house with train tracks in the back .. why they put him there ? Why would karen delete the ring videos at his house ? Why would she tell the family she won’t see them anymore ? Why would she pack her bags and not want to be with kids when they are told ? Why would she think he’s dead at 5 am .. it was a snowstorm and he didn’t have a car ? Why would someone wait for someone to die with their phone ? Why would first responders risk their livelihoods.. why all the kids lie ? Why would will there be dna on her tail light ? Why would there tail light fragments on his sweatshirt ?
The fact that the state police interviewed these ladies and none of the witnesses is a HUGE QUESTION MARK for me!! 🤨🤔👀👀
💯💯💯
They didnt interview people at the scene of the crime who normally would be suspects until being ruled out…a big jump to calling them witnesses !
This whole case is so bizarre. I have no idea what happened to John O’Keefe, but with certainty I can say that absolutely nothing they’ve presented so far, gives me any notion that KR is responsible.
Absolutely! Hit the nail on the head. The mass state police are horribly corrupt up here, but it's a good ol' boys network. Sucks for us "unconnected" folk..
I thought he interviewed some no?
So she yelled and swore over a mistaken belief that John made out with with another woman. Within a couple of hours, she learns of her error, apologizes and offers restitution. There is no physical altercation. A MONTH LATER, after Karen and John spend a pleasant evening together, Karen violently attacks John by running him over with her SUV.
WTF?
I don't believe Karen did it. But how are you speaking as if you were a fly on the wall during these moments
I think Jen was on she was saying oh that you know you know where Bella's lives knowing Bella was his ex-girlfriend... And Karen had a jealous streak.
Sorry my talk-to-text is terrible
@@kingsmitty2043I think they are just saying it makes no sense for Karen to do what she was charged for - that there’s gotta be another reason he died. Almost like 80% of what most people think.
@kingsmitty2043 I'm summarizing the testimony of several witnesses who WERE there for these moments, and stating the prosecution's theory of how JO died. Where's the problem?
My husband was involved in a hit and run, the lady hit him and completely ran him over. When she was caught she had huge damage to her van from the impact of his body . My husband is 5”9 195lbs . His injuries were in the chest, all of his ribs shattered like glass and his lungs/intestines and spleen all punctured and he also had massive road rash on his back and a little bit on his arm . Thankfully he survived but when I compare his accident to this one the injuries do not make sense and KR car would definitely have more damage.
100%!! Usually the head injuries come from flying up over the car and landing on the pavement, a straight hit is the lower extremities, cops can find everything from the vehicle, I've even had someone tear end me...the cop said he could see her plate leaving an imprint on my bumper..
FBI experts testified that Johns injuries were NOT caused by any vehicle
If every relationship argument turned into murder, there would be dead people all over the place.
This made me chuckle
Paved with bones! 🤣
Exactly!
🤣 Absolutely. Fact.
But this one did soooo
I really think these ladies were jealous of Karen
Very much so. 🩷🩷🩷 Free Karen Read.
Yes 💯
Unfortunately I think I agree! Hate the whole catty thing
Without a doubt
That is literally ALL I took from this. They were all married to men who weren’t as “selfless” or handsome or whatever as John is. They all wanted him available for their daydreams. How dare Karen come in and actually be his first SERIOUS girlfriend who takes a role in the kids’ lives when these women wanted John to remain indebted to THEM for helping him with his kids!
I think it's not important. Karen apologized in the end. Stuff happens. Not a motive to murder. Sullivan woman a waste of time.
She was more than generous to pay for the room so it is normal and happens to everyone. Waste of time
How was this even allowed in testimony? I forgot judge is sooo bias !
I think it actually hurt the prosecution, as it showed that the investigation focused on distant possibilities, while ignoring closer actual witness that saw John and Karen that evening.
@@wonder5487agreed!
Some things don’t deserve forgiveness. Karen acted like a psycho. Offering to pay for the room was ridiculous! Still, not a motive for murder.
Proctor interviews the 2 sisters 2 weeks after yet doesnt interview people known to be within 100 yards of the crime scene that night. Guaranteed there will be sleazy texts about them also which is perhaps why the defense isnt fighting the testimony here. More to come on it from them.
Its just astounding how this is even being heard in a court.
And the owners of the house where the dead body was doesn't even come outside??? We women hear and see everything and run to see any type of cop, ambulance etc...
Absolutely!!!💯
I think the Defense is sending a very clear message here: "This is ridiculous, we don't have to waste time on it." And I agree.
This Aruba story was not even a nothingburger. It was nothing embedded in nothings. Like nothing else, it convinced me that this is a frivolous indictment and trial.
Also reiterates these people drink a whole lot..classy
So far this story says more about the Sullivan sisters than about Karen Read
@@lillyroth61 And it says most about how weak the defenses case is. PROSECUTION! I meant prosecution!! (Note to self: triple check comments after 3 a.m.)
@@fairgreen42 no it says the prosecution case is garbage.
@@BondJames-vz5wk Absolutely! I meant to say prosecution!
On the other hand: Can you point out to me, where it says, that I said that? 🙈🤪
Anyone really think that the sister sweetly said "Hi, nice to meet you" and didn't say it in an obnoxious way? If so, they haven't been around this type of mean girl before.
Edit: Today's testimony is showing she really didn't buy the coverup story (and she said the sister was "gross", my thought, too). But still, she tried to make nice.
Exactly, she was trying to get a reaction from KR by coming back around the corner and then pretending she introduced herself ever so sweetly
The girl should have just kept quiet and walked away. I think she instigated
@@TheAngryKilljoynfn, but I wouldn't allow ppl to speak to me that way and just walk away. Lol.
So far they’ve proved John had a problem with alcohol and women seemed to like him.
The babysitter with benefits hits different for me ….they want to hurt Karen but personally I feel like they insulted John’s integrity. I’m certain his family knows him to be a better man than one who uses a woman. Gross
I agree. I hope Mrs O'Keefe sees what's going on here. I think Mr O'Keefe does
A huge backfire. These people are heinous, with friends like these…….
The baby sitter with benefits doesn't help with John being a stand up guy ... Karen only came off as a decent person, who clearly loved John a lot. I feel that we have to get through the entire trial before making our minds up fully.
Absolutely, this was an attack on John O'Keefes character, not on Karen Reads.
Yeah, that statement really, really bothered me.
If I were a juror, I would not give a crap what happened in Aruba. Irrelevant and a waste of time to even bring up.
I agree …everyone has their moments….and Karen had a moment
It was 'brought up' for a Reason & BTW - the trial is ongoing so More info is Due. Yawn.
Seeing her bf hugging a half naked girl that she didn’t know, I don’t blame KR. Her boyfriend didn’t arrive until the next day. Seems to me, lots of females were jealous of Karen. John was THEIR friend.
Lally and judge being petty. She did apologize! The witness didn’t. She double downed. This made me think they will do anything to make Karen look bad. Witness was proud of saying the F word again.
They despise Karen for some reason could it be that one or two of their good friends didn’t make the cut with John and they’ve held it against Karen as they see how happy they are
It looks like the women around John O'Keefe were very territorial when it came to him. They are/were obviously very jealous of her. Especially Jen, I think she had the hots for him
Yes I agree! The woman who had a brief relationship with John OKeefe’s partner, was the third woman who became pregnant by Pat. 3 women pregnant at the same time by same man! I won’t disparage these women right now, but reputation’s are questionable by very close reliable connections. Really suspicious!
Yes and while he was heavily intoxicated. (Witness said he was glassy eyed looking over her unable to make eye contact)...
@@noeleen5250I think that's because guys like John make the girl feel inferior and could replace them in a minute!!
All this testimony did for me was bolster the fact that John was a natural charmer with a lot of exes and a lot of close female friends with a lack of boundaries. It feels very high school and by the end of these two sisters, plus Jen & Kerry, I only felt bad for Karen. It didn't really seem like anyone could give a good reason to hate her besides she just wasn't as lovable as John and she let her insecurities show.
The prosecution claimed that this "fight" was so bad, but it was basically an "F" You exchange. I'm convinced that the prosecution knows their case is extremely weak, so they are continually tossing out ridiculous things in an attempt to distract. Such a ridiculous waste of time.
Also, going on vacation with 60 people sounds like a chaotic nightmare to me! Lol
I think Karen as a good woman doesn’t really care for this group of people, but as any of us women would do, we would try because if we love him, we want to be able to socialize with his friends, but these people are brutal and that is why Karen didn’t even want to go into the partyshe knows two-faced they are and was done for the evening
I tough she punch him or punch the girls took a knife 🔪 even his brother testified yes like any couple but never physically. Look at the word he use.. She never throw stuff at him like my mom does to my dad 👨 they are kissing hugging in 4 minutes she turns in to the hulk,,
Lally in pre trial motions exaggerated this so much🤣
I was thinking the same thing!!! 60 mostly strangers all together...a group of friends (not like these guys friends) a group of cousins...yes....and why is she paying attention to the cabana???
No kidding! I usually feel pulled too many directions with even 6-8. Maybe I think to highly of myself, but I am always trying to be mindful of paying attention, at least some, to everyone . And making sure nobody is not having fun is important to me. However this group seems to drink from sunrise till they pass out so maybe that is a different experience.
By listening to these four Woman testify combined their testimony. They help Karen in her case. Of their relationship. Think about it : Karen always paying flipping bills. Karen does adult apologized. All these Womans continue mention his ex's.
Mention John used her as a caregiver of the two children's. Is the reasons of his relationship. You don't think jury not putting these notes together.
Yes, they all portray themselves as immature, mean girls & KR as a mature woman.
I swear, every time I've ever heard someone deny they'd ever be romantic with someone because "he was like my brother (or sister," they always end up hooking up. Every time.
💯🤣
I think the Aruba story is completely irrelevant to this case. I’m honestly surprised this testimony was even allowed .It’s character assassination.
You kids Really need to stick to the cartoons, True crime is way over your heads.
The Sullivan testimonies highlighted once again how poorly this investigation was conducted than it reflected on KR.
The second sister seemed disappointed when the cross ended briefly. So much for her few minutes of fame.
"Babysitter with Benefits" speaks volumes about Jen McCabe and Kerry but nothing about the truth of Karen. She's the victim of that statement.
💯
Only Jen said that. She could have made it up too. Kerry didn't seem at all like how Jen made her out to be.
I thought Kerry was truth. I thought she seemed like a good friend to JO. I also believe she is a small town gossip so I won't feel bad for her when Jen uses her further. She stayed with the script so...
It’s such a low blow. Lacks class. They are jealous
@@MoeS-db1kq they're all so trashy, it's disgusting. All very possessive of this man and show contempt for Karen. If the CW have proof beyond a reasonable doubt they wouldn't need to drag her through the mud to prove she killed him.
Why would the sister ask Marietta if she kissed John if John already said he didn’t kiss her?
Because she knew it was a possibility. She knows her sister !!!
Because Karen Read said it happened to the sister
Just crazy that none of these people seem to have grown emotionally since high school.
She didn’t run him over in Aruba and he didn’t show up with bruises all over. She thought she saw something, reacted, and then apologized when she realized she made a mistake. I don’t think this shows anything really. A lot of people get a little jealous and it never leads to murder.
I saw a comment like "if Karen was a man and had that reaction we would see it as big red flag"
I can hardly wait for John O'Keefe's niece to testify.
@@jenniferrodgers4172It will be interesting to hear what she has to say ! Her testimony will not be televised due to her age!
@@lynneb620are you sure? They usually just don’t point the camera at someone under age but still there is sound.
If she’s found guilty just based on the “evidence” right now then I will definitely know our justice system is messed up. And I might be done watching these cases, it been disappointing me lately. There’s absolutely nothing that shows she did anything.
The state has not rested its case! On what planet do you decide a case before all evidence is in?
@@mandystrong8196 that’s not what I said, maybe re read my comment ….cause they sure haven’t come in with much evidence at all…but I can almost guarantee they don’t have much else to prove she did anything.
This goes to show how corrupt the thin blue line really is!! No matter where it is!!!
The prosecution has not proved anything this far into their case! They don’t have many more witnesses to testify. There is zero evidence on KR.
This was a big nothing burger. Vacation, everyone drinking, thought she saw something she didn’t, apologized for it and paid for part of the sisters stay. Sounds like she had contrition and was apologetic
That probably made her more jealous! Actually, if she was a nice person, she would’ve told Karen no it’s not necessary and accepted, her apology! She must have the hots for John and always has
@@moonchild1569 yeah but it doesn’t matter to what happened that night so waste of time
The more I learn about John the more it becomes obvious that he was a genuinely good dude who was surrounded by truly terrible people.
As opposed to the often drunk foul mouthed screaming banshee who Bought people to be her friend & who was so jealous of another old girlfriend of his who lived near the Alberts, she decided to reverse her Truck at high speed & the end result, severe skull fractures so she took off, leaving him there to freeze to death. Yeah nice lady.
So true. Truly rotten.
I can’t imagine how his family are feeling watching this trial. They have to be questioning everything they’ve been told by LE and the friends who “loved” John.
@@My-22-Cents I hope so. They took out a restraining order against Karen almost immediately. McCabe has brainwashed them since with support groups, find raisers you name it. OJO's mother has said she won't forgive Karen even if she "gets off", I'd want justice for my son's murder above anything and the truth.
She has already made admissions to Lots of people & in her own words in a TV interview "If I hit him & he was incapacitated in some way, I don't remember". Her statement later on, same interview, "I saw him get out the car, he walked up the driveway & I saw him about to go in the side door then I looked down at my phone". HUH? After the ambulance had taken John to hospital, she was saying over & over that she wanted to kill herself which is also an admission of guilt, due to remorse. Another ambulance had to be sent & she was taken to hospital for an assessment. Since she killed John, she has told several versions of what she did & one version was that she was so drunk, her Last memory was of being at the Waterfall. She's nothing but an evil lowlife who behaves exactly like a banshee very often & being so dumb, she can't remember her Lies.
If I was a juror I’d be annoyed as to what these Aruba sisters have to do with anything. I thought the hearsay rule was “present state of mind???” How in the world could a witness talk about a deceased person’s present state of mind? In the end the Aruba people only added to the defense bcuz of Procter interview. Oh no? What? She got jealous of her boyfriend? They were drunk and had a fight? Unbelievable 🤦🏻♀️ She must be a murderer 🙄
I would’ve felt the same way. Like what is the point of this?
Exactly ! Def seems like hearsay!
@@casey5683 after 15 days I guess it fits with the entire prosecution case…what is the point of this?
@@cmeblu75 totally agree. There’s so much nonsense being said and brought into this trial it’ll never end.
@@casey5683 3wks in and we’re still wondering 💭 how did John O’Keefe die??? How can his family sit there and think she killed him? How many more butt dials do you think we’ll hear about? 1. Not likely, but maybe 2. C’mon now… 3. You’ve gotta be F’n kidding me…how stupid do you guys think we are???
60 people on a vacation together, mostly drunk, some people will not get along...and this detective finds the two who didn't agree with Karen...highly suspicious.. plessy interview them within 3 weeks and yet the people in the house he didn't interview till months later...jen jen jen
Always a bad idea to go on vaca with 60 people including catty women.
I can’t wait to hear the medical experts. To tell us if being hit by a car could cause that kind of damage.
Everything happens with alcohol. He could barely walk in Aruba… does anyone remember? I would be upset with my boyfriend if he was in some girls face drunk and all I could see was him from behind. I wouldn’t be Crazy.. it’s not appropriate.
Yes John is a drinker and maybe flirted w the silly girl when intoxicated so sad that they all drink in excess w kids arnd
Especially if she was left taking care of the kids... again while he watched the game and got drunk. I would mad too.
Hugging someone when they first see them is one thing and not inappropriate. But seeing him later and initiating a hug while he's trying to get back to his room is another.
@@Jpfinn3408 ok now let’s blame the victim who has now passed on .. she said he wouldn’t even look at her and looked over her shoulder !
All cops are alcoholics!!
First of all, Lally making the lady relive the death of her boyfriend was disgusting. Secondly, this testimony was only designed for character assassination
🩷🩷🩷
I agree! It was a horrible thing to do to her.
Disagree. Establishing motive. It establishes the background of "Godfather" and thus hostile, jealous over reaction of KR to hugging little sis.
I'm pro Karen Read. Not only do I think she's not guilty, I think she's completely innocent. Secondly, Lally is an idiot but he's doing his job. He is trying to show a motive which in my opinion is ridiculous. This woman loves John O'Keefe and was like family. She wants to help and unearthed feelings about her loved one is a small price to pay for lack of a better word. Emotion is not supposed to be a factor in a murder trial but Lally is doing his JOB. Karen apologized so the motive theory is a far cry from the truth and was forgotten.
@@laurieg66No, if you going to have the jail full. Every couple, fight on vacations. Especially women They can scream and make and blow up ur phone ,welcome to the party. The jurors must be thinking 🤔 oh yes my wife is like Karen, all couples fight did she kill John in Aruba? The next day happy kissing and hugging they go back to usa happy together Having and- attitude like a Latina woman don't make you a killer,, Laly is embarrassing Karen because he doesn't have nada no evidence laly knows who kill John. This a way to lose the case. Karen goes free. Alberts are free . What the hell does Aruba have to do with canton mass? You don't go to the Alberts and the people around but you go to fish in Aruba. Karen needs to sue all of them
This is the CommonWealth grasping at straws. It sounds like Karen dealt with many women blowing up Johns phone. This proved to me that Karen takes ownership when she’s wrong. Just like she did when she believed she hit John with the vehicle. Until the facts came out. I thought the defense handled this appropriately. It proves this is irrelevant. Sounds like The CW is changing gears. Now the motive is jealousy. (Accident, DWI, Jealousy, kids) There’s no crime scene pics of John, they originally said in the media they had her on video hitting John, nope. Four weeks in and I’m waiting for the CommonWealth to put on a legitimate case. Sounds like Carrie and Jen added another theory to their timeline.
I can only imagine how difficult it was for Karen to be the new girl in this long term group of friends. No wonder she was on edge.
I was underwhelmed by the Aruba story. I was expecting to hear of something much more dramatic and with longevity.
Likewise the babysitter & benefits was not shocking like JM made out!
@@shelleyanne8489she used the word horrified and made out that it was bad for Karen! It only made John look bad
You were? I can’t understand how people are still holding out for anything significant from the prosecution.
Procter didn’t interview the Albert family and friend’s separately because he needed them to keep their stories straight!
The Aruba thing is insanely irrelevant
Because you haven’t heard the rest of it !!
@@Babyd320what is the rest?
It is relevant. It shows that KR flaunts her money & a control freak! John didn’t like that!
Omg all guys call thier wives and gfs crazy here and there. It's kinda funny. Unless you're Matt McCabe. His wife is crazy all the time. However, it
was new years eve they were once again drinking, and as even Kerri Robert's stated John dated a lot of girls. As she said while rolling her eyes. I think Laura Sullivan's sister was just waiting for her moment to be on TV. She looked and sounded like a trash mouth tough girl. Karen had the decency to apologize, and tried or did pay for her room. Honestly. I think he did kiss her. He was looking around first to see if he could sneak one in. Funny the girl lives where I live. Don't know her though. I thought it was a low blow it was over a stupid kiss. I don't think Karen had it that easy with John. He had a roaming eye. Lastly, I think Jenn McCabe may have had the hots for John. That girl yesterday and McCabe just seem like mean girls. Karen has it way over those two. She is not only pretty but also smart as hell, and took dam good care of his kids. He should have treated her better. Who the F cares if he kissed her. I doubt she would kill John over jealousy. Karen's a normal girl. I don't even think she's jealous.
Agree, little sister wanted to be a TV hit. Her lines were so polished and scripted, and I told her, "well she sucks" and then looks very self satisfied. Poor Karen in the middle of all this junior high drama.
Imagine her watching this trial afterwards with family and seeing how really bat shit crazy this woman is??? Matt just buys her nice things to shut her up!! He probably cheats on her all day long, like all the other miserable husbands in that group!!
The judge allowing this is just disgraceful.
“Auntie Bev” is likely compromised
If im a juror, please don’t waste my time with drinking drama, I think the only thing I’m sure of in this case is that’s pretty normal with all involved.
If this sullivan sister was such good friends with John, she would have introduced herself to KR at the pool when she was chatting with "johnny"
Wait, the McCabes and Alberts weren’t there when Proctor interviewed the Sullivan? That’s the biggest shocker
😂😂😂
When was it that Jen sat for almost an hour in a car with Proctors wife in Proctors driveway? Wouldn't surprise me, if she got her update then via the wifes phone then, with no "suspicious " phone records.
I’m sure Jen had spoke with the Sullivans
I think Jen told Proctor about the fight for him to go to the Sullivan's as this was the motive. Otherwise how would Proctor even about them
The Aruba motive argument is ridiculous given the video evidence earlier in the evening of the incident. I found it interesting that the police interviewed these two sister early in the investigation while not bothering to interview others until much later on.
They needed to give the Alberts snd McCabes time to get their story straight. So they went and got the Sullivan story…. Because in some way they knew they could use it against Karen
this is ridiculous but half town murder John BCS he don't want kids step on his lawn is not....sure
If this is all they have she “might” have been jealous?????
I think the reason why these girls were questions before anyone else from the inner circle was because Jen made herself the lead investigator and everyone followed along with her conducting the mystery
That one’s a real CU next Tuesday
Hmmm... could very well be.
@@_Amanda_Lynn she even said on the stand that she and berries worked tirelessly on a timeliness to put all the pieces together. It was her theory all along. I'm sure
Every couple fight, argue, disagree, in all manners of actions. I just walk away when my husband gets out of line!!!🤣🤣🤣
Same here. If I’m done, I’m outta there!
Karen got jealous in Aruba, over-reacted, later apologized to the person and offered to pay some of this person's Aruba costs. Lally (and thus the judge) may have assisted the defense with showing how Karen Read reacts to a stressful situation. Dating someone with a very vocal, very closed, very "us vs. them" friend/relative group is stressful especially when participating in social situations. GREAT catch by Jackson, showing that Proctor knew enough to question the sisters from the Aruba trip separately, but yet not the Albert/McCabe friend and relative group. So so so many mistakes by the police in this case has produced reasonable doubt in such abundance that we probably will never know what events led to the death of Officer O'Keefe. Sad for his memory. Sad for his family.
It seems like Proctor was asking, “Do you know ANYONE who can say something bad about Karen?” & the sisters were the best he could come-up with! 😮
Totally. And the best thing they could come up with is that she got angry at a girl that was being inappropriate with her boyfriend (I think she did kiss him)
That’s an awesome argument Peter that you came up with for defense!!! Everyone clearly said they were both happy those nights!!!
Nicole Albert testified that she got home from the Waterfall bar at 12:15 am and crossed paths with her nephew Colin in the foyer at that time.
She said Brian Albert let the dog out in the back yard when he got home. Did they drive home together, or did Brian drive home from the bar with Brian Higgins ahead of her? It sounds like Higgins’ Jeep was already there when she got home.
The exact time Heidi the dog was let out in their fenced-in backyard is very important, because Karen’s car was already there by 12:23 am when Ryan Nagle arrived in his friend’s F150 to talk with his sister outside.
It is possible that John O’Keefe vanished because he snuck into the backyard from the front to take a leak before entering the party. It had to be very close in time to when Chloe the German Shepherd Mix with the bite history was in her yard. The marks on John’s right arm look like a dog attack. I think what happened to him happened in that backyard. Did anyone see him use a restroom while he was at the bar?
The focus on the basement came from data on John’s phone showing he took 70 steps and 3 sets of stairs after leaving the car. I think he took 70 steps. Then someone called his phone several times to locate it where it fell in the yard, and someone picked it up and took it upstairs to look at it.
It is important to confirm whether the garden gate can be opened from the front yard, and whether the backyard is well lit and visible from indoors.
Many people there probably did not know what happened. This may have been an unintended death.
I don’t know when Karen broke her taillight. But it is unrelated to what happened to John.
Love this!!! Karen broke her tail light I believe when she backed out going to look for John, tapped his vehicle with hers.
Almost sounds like God bless his heart he was also flirty and drinks alot
I don’t get it - we know from defense opening that Karen was “exploring” her options but it didn’t go anywhere… we understand that to be Higgins - so I can’t see that she ran him down intentionally - in the 4 min drive from bar…
And if John’s best gal pal thought Karen was a babysitter with benefits - what does that say about John? I don’t see how that’s a negative toward Karen - just more mean girl shit
Catty Canton Conspirators
Jen wanted to be the babysitter with benefits. That’s what has her pantys in such a tight twist. She is pathetic.
And I don’t understand why John would be going out with K Roger’s husband, or be friends with him, if the allegations/police report of DV against his wife (K Roger’s) was accurate. If someone is my good friend, I would have a hard time supporting their relationship.
This whole debacle seems like it could be a series of Real Housewives of Canton….most of them are drinkers,consumed with jealously & hatred…with friends like this lot who needs enemies 🤷🏼♀️
Maybe that Sullivan girl was intoxicated to the point where she probably did make a pass to John. She doesn’t look innocent.
She looks like is still mad about that nonsense
And have you seen how far Pembroke is from Canton on a map? … Proctor went to see this lady from Aruba a week after he died … no relevance and he drove pretty damn far to see her too lmao
They defiantly come across as mean girls. The younger one is really divisive in her tone and body language.
“Jahnnnny” “oh he’s just a brother to me”
Sure Jan.
Right?? 😂 Well said I was like "nice slip in lady"... They all act very territorial about him.
🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄
When she said that, my first thought was, if he was like a brother why would your sister have to ask you if you kissed him? Seems like the sister wouldn't have needed to ask or wonder that if she knew they had a brother-sister type of relationship.
I had a male friend (now deceased) that was like my brother. If anyone had asked me if I kissed him, I would have said "ew. No."
@@justkim9827i just made that comment too! She seemed sad 'it would never happen between them'
Everybody fights in a relationship, that has nothing to do with what happened in this case. I don’t think there’s any couple that you could possibly ever meet that has not had an argument. That’s ridiculous.
I don’t understand a lot in this case. # 1 what killer who just ran someone over will at the crime scene say “did I hit him? Couldn’t I have hit him?” Why would she throw herself in the pool of suspects. Makes no sense.
# 2 How in the world are three parallel scratches on his arm which is a defensive wound, a big black eye and a big gash at the back of his head from being ran over by a car?
Someone please tell me how this is possible, what am I missing?
The two sisters’ testimony helped me understand KR’s personality better. She jumps to conclusions, blows up people’s phones and likes to spend money on people. I could not figure out why she was panicked as soon as she realized John wasn’t home and immediately jumped to the conclusion he was dead ( according to some testimony). Then she called both Jen and Kerry several times and hung up just to call them again. Now I get it. She’s what we used to call “high strung”. Certainly doesn’t get me any closer to guilty. In fact proves her less guilty to me.
I agree some of her reactions are odd.
My dad would call that as flying off the handle.
It was 5am and a blizzard and her memory was of leaving him at the bar at 12am. No confirmation he got to the party. I would freak out too. She also had MS which comes with mood disorders and mental instability as a symptom. That’s why they said remember she has MS. She reacted like an anxious person would. Im my opinion
Seems John had a huge alcohol issue…he was incoherently drunk on New Year’s Eve, hugging and kissing an unknown girl. Karen had enough of this behavior and pretty much at the end of their relationship. KR was going to call it quits with John. Karen did apologize to the Sullivan’s as well.
Karen said "f you", apologized, and offered to pay for the room, so obviously she killed John. Lol
Heehee
😂😂
And waited 6 weeks
And chose to murder him on a cops front lawn
And in all fairness to Karen, "F you" can be a Boston "hello".
It sounds like the friends were jealous of Karen to be honest with you just as much as she was perhaps of him spending his time with them
Btw... There's a video of the angelic being Colin fist fighting someone all over Twitter. I guess everyone wants to get charged with perjury.
Got see that!
I think it shows how immature and catty this girl is that she’s SOOOO satisfied that she finally got to “stick it” to Karen Read. Her face when she looked over at Karen was actually disgusting.
It hasn't occurred to you that there's more to it than just that? Jeez.
I'd be disgusted, too, if I had to face my friend's killer.
@@TheRockbird1 Exactly.
She apologized and tried to make amends. I think Aruba is a nothingburger.
There is much more to it than that incident. Poor kids, a week in Aruba but they had to leave after only 2 days because she was a such a wacko, as usual.
I agree !
@@bethryan9077 listening to their testimony it sounded like John was there longer than 2 days. I heard they left 2 days early so the kids could get back to school…whether that’s true or not idk. But it sounded like they were there 5 days….if I’m remembering their testimony correctly
@@bethryan9077 Laura testified that they arrived earlier than expected since their rooms became available and left two days early so the kids could get ready to go back to school
@@michele36618 Nope & those women didn't speak to John or ever see him again so the 'story' about the kids having to get back to get ready for school did Not come from Him. The women saw him the next day on the island & then they were Gone.
This as a motive to viscously attack him almost a month later after everyone observing them said they were happy together all night is SO far fetched. Hope the jury sees through this
Nothing burger….except that Proctor interviewed these ladies…that was quite telling that he wasn’t investigating but building his case against Karen.
The commonwealth is reaching to far. All couples fight... No big deal. Doesn't change my opinion. This case is the meaning of corruption.
I still don't understand what exactly she is accused of. If someone backed their car into me my body would yield to the car, not bust the tail light
Exactly! Back to basic facts his wounds are not consistent with being hit in reverse in the snow how did he get behind the car? Too much f#@&ery
Completely agree. They seem to think she was traveling about 24 mph in reverse.
Don´t forget the black eyes the cuts on his nose and the "dog" bites on his arm. He was hurt everywhere but the places the car allegedly hit him.
Wouldn’t the left side of the car be damaged if she ran him over? If it was the right her entire car would be on his body
@@chloer2584right! I still dont understand why the right light was damaged
I love this channel. Peter just breaks it down in short form and makes it easy to understand! I am such a law and crime nerd lol so I love being a member of the LYK fam!
That’s what happens when you go to Aruba with a gang of family members 60 people no way Jose
Aruba couldn’t be more irrelevant.
So far, Kerri Roberts has been the only credible witness when even a modicum of evidence as to what happened, and nothing that she testified to implicated Karen Read.
The Aruba thing was more annoying and time consuming than anything.
True. And the ugliness of the "babysitter with benefits" only proves their animosity toward Karen but not the other way around.
Also she did not corroborate JM comment that KR said I hit him. KR said Karen said " did I hit him?"
She was a good witness for the defense.
@@MissPrettywoman628 exactly, she also said that it was Jenn’s idea to go to Fairview, not Karen’s
I found Keri credible, too but I think she was damning for the defense. She was not at Fairview the night before and super close to John. So, hard to argue she was in on any cover up. She testified that Karen called her and said she thought John might be dead. Might have been hit by a snowplow (pretty close to what she is charged w/) Said she had been drinking a lot and couldn't remember what happened (she is charged with driving drunk). Keri testified that John was covered in about four inches of snow and appeared to her to be just a mound of snow on the side of the road, but Karen managed to spot him from a moving car in the dark, in blizzard conditions. And knew immediately it was him. All pretty damning and the defense didn't challenge any of it.
Proctor followed correct protocol on two people irrelevant to what happened that night. Yet, the most important witnesses he handles in a lackadaisical manner which makes Lolly's redirect unnecessary and idiotic.
Everything he does helps the defense 🤦🏿♀️🤦🏿♀️
Karen saw exactly what she thought she saw. Was convinced somehow that she didn't. That girl was laying the groundwork to steal another woman's man and who, really would she tell that to? No one! So she denied it. We have all seen that act before. It's pathetic and disgusting!
Honestly this testimony made John seem sketchy, seems like there were a lot of women around John that wanted him . Karen apologized and did the right thing…..this testimony was useless.
I thought I was the only one seeing this. I've heard some other things that also make John seem sketchy.
Everyone has done things in life that they regret. Imagine having to sit in a courtroom and listen to this nonsense. It never should have been allowed. Karen came off as just being human. She apologized, offered to pay for part of the room. She seems like a nice lady to me.
She came off as a crazy, controlling witch..
I’ve lived for decades in both the UK & the USA. Born & raised in Britain, it seems very strange that lawyers can pitch their arguments to the press, before their client has even gone to court!
This makes the USA the outlier, most countries who’s court system is based on “English Law” do NOT allow lawyers to, “Poison the well” by releasing propaganda for their ‘side’ of the case before the verdict is in!
The defence team did a GREAT job with pre-trial propaganda. They have an expert who is highly knowledgeable in marketing to the media, utilising the internet, social trends, social media etc. #FreeKarenReed 😊😉
Everyone who's from the Boston area is probably listening to this testimony about the Aruba trip and Karen Read's and John O'Keefe's drunken jealous episode and thinking, "Yeah, and? If I thought I saw my drunk bf making out with a pretty younger woman, I'd do a lot more than just make a scene and say, 'Go f*ck yourself!' to the other woman." So I think this jury puts very little if any stock in this testimony but the fact that Trooper Proctor found and interviewed these two (non) witnesses way before interviewing actual witnesses seems to support the Defense's theory that this whole investigation was botched and biased against Karen Read pretty much from the jump. And these witnesses themselves seem to support that narrative. A bunch of very territorial, tight-knit, protective, and hot-headed local Bostonian's (or Canton's) all pointing their fingers at the 'outsider' (who they may or may not have been jealous of) and away from themselves. Doesn't require a massive conspiracy involving a whole bunch of people to steer an investigation in a direction that they want it to go. Just a few extremely motivated and well-connected insiders doing a few shady things and the rest takes care of itself. That's what this looks like to me at this point but I will reserve judgement until both sides have rested. God bless.
Peter looks sharp today-nice blue shirt.
Agree. That shirt color is nice.
Younger sister has an attitude. May not have good boundries. What if Karen hugged on her boyfriend? Disrepectful to Karen. She calls him "Johnny"
Seriously? Karen was way out of line after she was told who it was which was a long time family member she told her FU … Nice I don’t think Karen is this little innocent princess that she’s making herself out to be. I think she’s a bit unhinged.
@@lynngallagher7456 Not really, everything in this trial just makes all these women look like jealous trash. Karen sounds like the only adult woman in this group.
I am waiting to hear the prosecution's theory on when and how KR killed JO. The only thing I am sure of is that there are people hiding things. I was really surprised the judge allowed the testimony from Aruba. I felt it to be prejudicial and did not help me understand how he died.
So far, from the women I've seen on here. Karen Read wouldn't be jealous of any of them 😜 🐶
Sooo many woman like John
They thought he was a good catch!!! But Karen probably knew what he was really like!! My ex exactly!!
John seemed like a good guy, but he was a player and clearly had issues with alcohol as did Karen
Until he got rammed by KR.
Back when I was single if getting into it with a partner and used spicy language and got upset I too would be guilty of murder ..ridiculous! Also I think saying hello while they were arguing was adding fuel to the fire. She should have walked away it was not her business . Why would her sister even need to ask if she kissed John !
Considering the drama around this trial there is no way in hell I would give this pathetic evidence as a motive. They are catty women.
I can't even imagine a normal husband letting their wives act like this??? My brother in laws would say mind your business, don't get involved!!
Thank you for pointing out Jackson's smile at the end. I was watching the live stream but I missed that lil detail! I always love your insight and coverage 🫶🏼
This is absolutely not a motive for murder! I wish the defense attorney would’ve asked her if she’s ever gotten in a fight with her boyfriend!
If Ms. Read's behaviour in Aruba was part of a pattern that Mr. O'Keefe's niece witnessed and corroborates on the stand, well ...
Just my opinion but I didn’t like her saying “it just never would have happened between us” it’s such a weird way to say that. It sounds more like to me that she wanted it to happen but it didn’t. I’m willing to be wrong but something about that phrasing just rubs me the wrong way
They were interviewed way before people who were actually there that night. Seems irrelevant and suspect to me
The prosecutor has to try something to create doubt, and it's pretty sad this is the worst he can come up with? On top of that, the prosecution really makes John look bad. They are making him look like he was using Karen as a babysitter only, like he's a drunk and just a complete mess. They are not doing John's memory any good at all. This is horrible how they are making him out to be.
Thats an excellent point guardian for the children should decide if its even worth they testify. Why put them through testifying if the states case doesn’t connect any dots.
The judges instructions to me were worse than the actual supposed actions of Karen. Much ado about nothing. This judge has shown her bias time and time again. I am 75 yes old and to me all these women sound bored and just looking to make mountains out of mole hills. This Aruba incident was just a nothing issue. When I heard judges instructions I thought like you Karen beat on someone but No just upset. Judge should have never let this in. Hope this judge suffers some consequences
Exactly.
I think this is just an overly close Nick corrupt community. We all know the statements you get when you mention Boston and the police department.
I agree. It's basically 'here's some evidence but don't listen to it'.
Worse than the corruption in the Murdagh case!!
Right?? She was talking about the “crimes” committed, and after hearing, I was like seriously??
She’s human not a murderer!
It was an awful accident I believe.
Not based on fact but my hunch is Karen was about done with the relationship with John. She probably did feel like a glorified babysitter with benefits, the women, the alcohol, his close circle of friends and his dictating how the kids were raised and how things were kept in the house. I love to see KR acquitted!
As a single gal myself I saw the same thing!! The kids, the friends, the drinking, who goes to a bar on the night of a record snowstorm?? With their kids, kids friends etc.... penal people would say, let's just stay home!! Karen knew she was being used...John was a controlling narcasstic man, gaslighting and live bombing her!! No other woman would put up with his crap, she was pretty, educated, successful independent, no kids, no baggage (like Bella's mom) she didn't need John!!
Sounds reasonable but it also seems like you didn't see the video of Karen and John at the waterfall bar.
@@22werwerwerfair but people can act happy in public, and be miserable at home. I don't know one way or another
I "see" the same thing. I also think that he may have encouraged the women.
They should have interviewed them in office.
Or not at all. They didn't interview many of the witnesses in the house for months and longer intentionally once a local blogger/ journalist started writing about it bc our Boston media just reported the bogus narrative the DA and crooked cops fed them. His writing started getting a lot of regular citizens' attention who know how much corruption exists in our one party state already.
I have a theory (if my timeline is accurate)… wasn’t the timing when KR was supposedly in front of the house around the same time when Colin was picked up by AM? What if Colin encountered JO on the way outside and words/fists were exchanged, the guys inside join in and they toss him outside. This might explain why he stopped texting JM. I don’t know if they knew they killed him and it wasn’t realized until the morning when he was found on their lawn so then they decided to blame KR.
I think the defense has a theory that AM didn’t actually pick Colin up when she says she did. Rather he arrived at the time he is saying he left, but that they edited the texts time info, because why would he leave the house when everyone else was getting home? Also, Colin had bruises on his knuckles. They totally knew JO was outside, that’s why JM did her Google search at 2:27am
Colin had a motive. He hated JO because JO arrested him on drug charges. I’m sure there’s more why the Alberts hated JO. His injuries look like he was in a fight, not hit by a car. They said they saw the car move up but if she was going 24mph someone would have seen the SUV in the middle of street.
I’d be surprised if Higgins does take the stand. After being told to preserve his phone he went to a military base and destroyed it. Also he signed a proffer, what’s that about?
Did you hear the prosecution entered his medical records yesterday? So weird!
Also, to the question about Karen leaving right away, it’s because she was sanctioned. She threatened to harm herself. It was horrible while John was in the hospital, they forced Karen into a medical gown and refused her to see him. This is a sad case and horrific they’re doing this to the Reads and OKeefe family.