Philadelphia Trolleys - Part Two - From PTC to SEPTA
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- čas přidán 16. 02. 2021
- Philadelphia once had America's largest trolley system. By the end of the 20th century the network had been reduced to the South West subway-surface routes. Shown are the last years of PTC era & the birth of SEPTA.
Philadelphia once had America's largest trolley system. By the end of the 20th century the network had been reduced to the South West subway-surface routes. Shown are the last years of PTC era & the birth of SEPTA. Jeff Marinoff, Richard Vible, David Ashley films. narrated. Extended 90 min DVD
This was excellent....so nostalgic...i was a 23 trolley rider as a kid....way too many weirdos now. My 94 yr old nana was one of the first black women to cashier for ptc!
Miss my hometown. Germantown Ave was around the corner from my house. That's the route my dad drove. I love riding the 23 trolley and the bus when they stopped using the trolley. It's was amazing growing up in the 80s and having a dad that worked in Septa.
23 and 15
I am so glad this footage exists of the PTC Trolley system, It really is a major way for Philadelphians to get to work and school. When the Northeast was developed they went to the "trackless" trolleys and buses. The Subway Surface cars still exist as part of Septa.system. it is a very unique transportation system, Thank you.
Thank you for the upload. The 50 and 47 trolley were my favorite, Unfortunately the 47 was short lived service ended in 1969 but, the 50 lasted into late 1980 and I rode it to school and later work.
I have many memories from the 1970s riding the Trolley down Girard Avenue with my Grandmom. I miss those days. A simple way of life.
Amazing to see a PCC going through essentially a field in Eastwick.
03:00 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 someone did drive into the trolley portal at 40th & Woodland recently and made it all the way to 33rd. I'm still impressed. That's at least two sharp turns.
You know it
I remember that
Remember riding the old PTC 10 trolley with the bared windows,you could actually smell the tunnel as you travel to and back from Center City…with 13th st being the eastbound terminus…
Choo choo! I'm a train and I approve this excellent video!
AMAZING FOOTAGE!!!
It’s so good to see this footage wasn’t lost so all generations can share seeing some history and the pride people held in their communities and transit systems!!!
Times have definitely changed…
I worked for Septa in the eighties Fixing the track on third shift a very cold night in the winter months.
Also plowed Main Street in Darby for PennDOT in the two thousand s what a bumpy ride it was The trolley line was great on island road the 37 bus line goes past my house all day and night along the industrial highway route 291
Amazing how these lines survived into the present!!
I'm not sure how true it is, but as a kid I heard that NCL even wanted to bustify the subway-surface routes but couldn't figure out how to run diesels underground.
NCL's anti-rail mindset has infected SEPTA ever since, although it looks like the new CEO is much more in favor of streetcars.
@@Poisson4147 SEPTA is getting 135 new Trolleys, they should start arriving by 2027, route 15 is having it's PCC cars refurbished, it should reopen within a year, there are actually talks about expanding the system.
@@mrjsanchez1 Great points! I'm a member of a couple of transit-advocacy groups and have been following the plans for a while. The new cars will be longer, articulated, and with low floors to simplify entry and exit.
There are already plans to extend the 10 about a half-mile to an intermodal station at the Overbrook RRD stop, also talk (but nothing specific) about extending Route 36 to the airport. Also the new cars will be double-ended - I wonder if there's enough compatibility of signals, etc. to allow full connectivity with the ex-Red Arrow lines ... ?!
Superb video! I lived in North Philadelphia and the Routes 23 and 60 were my lifelines, although I rode all of the lines mentioned in the video often. Great nostalgia. I recall during one major snowstorm in the 1950's, a back up of 23s on Germantown Avenue which stretched from Huntington Street to near Alleghany Avenue. Quite a sight.
It’s a shame that there are no videos that capture the sound of the trolleys and bells. One of my favorite sounds as a child
Thanks for sharing. I rode the 47, 50, 60 and 56 mostly. This sure brings back memories. I also learned where the saying "Brick Shithouse " came from.
My grandad was a conductor on the Frankford line this is cool to see how the city was back in the day
I rode the trolleys, miss them. I live in nc. Loved the video, got to see old neighborhoods.
My Uncle used to be the operator of the trolley that went on Germantown Ave.
Wow!!! It's amazing to see what my neighborhood looked like back in the 50s and 60s. Lo g before I was even a twinkle in my mother's eyes
Would love to see footage of the old subway surface trolleys operating in the tunnel during those days...I was a wee little kid when they did!
Those lines clanging and the electric clicks used to put me to sleep at night. Especially the bells.
Nowadays people don't understand the love of the trolley car until you explain it made you mobile free to rome around the city on your own to meet girls! Then they start to understand the infatuation with the trolley line and what it meant especially to young people. And with the trollies you didn't need a car to get around they took you everywhere that you could want to go work ,home, school, movies, on a date. It was your personal chauffer around town.
The 10, 11, 13, 34 and 36 still run exactly like this video describes.
Well, tbh not quite exactly. They were cut back at their outer ends after the 1950s takeover by NCL.
That said there's been some semi-serious discussion about extending the 10 to Overbrook and the 36 to the airport.
This was awesome to see the Godfrey Loop back then. It is around the corner where I live....thanks for posting this, it was a late night treat. THANKS YOU👍
Many great memories of the trolley boat cars and trolley routes. A time totally opposite of today.
i would love to see old time ELs in service from this time period or earlier
SEPTA's had essentially zero interest in preserving historic equipment. From what I've heard they trashed almost everything. About 20-30 years ago they took a bunch of serviceable PCCs that could have been rehabbed or sold to San Francisco / a museum / etc., but instead stuck them under a section of I-95 where they rotted.
I have this video on dvd since last year
FINE AS A PORCUPINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
One set of my grandparents lived in a city where PCC's ran and I rode on some of them.
I like the video
Orb and raised in Philadelphia. Rode many of these lines over the years. Sad that most are long gone. People and things seemed more pleasant and peaceful then, I miss those days. I also traveled frank ford elevated, broad street subway, and red arrow lines as well as Pennsylvania, Reading and B&O railroads. Still miss all of these.
Phila always plays second fiddle to NY and Chi in the modeling genre. Love to see some SEPTA EL & subway models come to the market. And on trolleys, the Norristown HSL is pretty cool too.
That was a particularly fast trolley!
Being only 90 miles from NY is a blessing and course.
Very well done!
Wow! This is, indeed, a work-of-art! Soooo many memories! I once attempted (when I was about 5-yrs old), to board the 50-Olney trolley, as we lived on Tasker, between 4th and 5th Streets in S. Philly. My Mom caught me before I was able to board. When I was 13, I then rode the 23-Germantown from 11th and Tasker to the Bethlehem Loop every weekend, as a relative moved to Fort Washington. I seriously MISS the (what was) amazing Trolley Network that once was! What hurts and INFURIATES me is, as the WORLD is investing in rail infrastructure, SEPTA spares NO expense to DESTROY something that survived so much over a century! SHAMEFUL!!! Literally I have cried a number of times when I think of the stupidity of a Transit Agency such as SEPTA!
I used the 47 from Indiana Ave to Girard and with a transfer took the 15 to 17th st. St. Joe's Prep was at 17th & Stiles. Did this from Sept 1951 to June 1955. Did not realize it was soon to end!
Wow Love That Video
you want nostalgic have one of Melbourne's W class tram run these street, it sure may look out of place but dam good to see
Rode 47 from 5th and Rockland to 8th and market many times with mom shopping at dept. Stores. Thanks for the memories
How does one get a list of the music used in this video? I love listening to this vintage jazzy music :) Would love to know the names and artists.
I lived around the corner from the car barn at 26th and Allegheny ave
When I was a kid, my grandparents would take us to the zoo either by driving down and parking at the Richmond/Westmoreland loop or we would take the 73 from Bridesburg down to the loop. Even through my years attending high school at Central, I would take any chance to jump on one of the trolleys whether at Broad St & Girard Ave (for the 15) or Broad/Erie (for the 56). Its a shame how pretty much every neighborhood shown in this video (except Chestnut Hill) has gone downhill over the decades. Such beautiful areas of the city left to rot away out of lack of pride for their communities.
So true....but now chestnut hill is having robberies and shootings...that woulda never happened when i was coming up.
@@dr.b1346 Such a shame that so many part of the city have become a shining example of urban blight
Hey I went to Central High School too.
I was in 271. 🎉
I took the trolley below the subway in center City philly.good times,a bit scary with the brick walls and rickety rails
I own this video, love it and play it often, along with part one, "Philadelphia Streetcars". I have one correction since I lived for 15 years near the Darby Loop. It is located at 9th & Main Sts., not at 11th & Main, as was stated by Jeff Marinoff in the video.
Gary, everybody is entitled to make a mistake now and then. I misspoke on the 11th & Main. But at least I pronounced names correctly......lol..... I've seen outrageous mistakes on videos, old VHS tapes and in books.
I never rode the PCCs. I'm more of a Kawasaki person. I especially love the K-cars seen at 5:04-6:07 & 9:06-10:07 and man, I miss that paint scheme with the rollsigns.
Great video
whoa! These were classic
By any chance is there a part one of this video.
I miss that old livery on the Kawasakis
This older type tram looks like soviet РВЗ-6. Even those "wings" on the nose...
Love the trolleys love the 60s they were great times
The Marshall road loop still there I think it was a very well travelled line for people who needed transportation back then and still today with gas prices over five dollars a gallon Septa does a great job all day long and night for the city residents scenic it was but dangerous.
They were great times for the luxe Rene st my mom graduated from little flower in 1950 and was married in 1952 I was born in1954 great times for Philadelphia I knew many my name is John Stier the green paint scheme was the best
My dad worked at fourth and arch I had a grandfather work the 23 line till he died and his brother also worked the 23 till the sixties and I worked at fair mount ave in the eighties
The Godfrey loop was a sight for sore eyes in the bad weather nights cold and snowy
Chestnut hill always reminded me of rich people of Philadelphia what a time for the 23 gongs clacking gorgas lane always reminded me of noblest
Great times for pic and septa
where is part 1?
Yeah, WHERE IS THE FIRST ONE¿?¿
Would Love to See!!!
I remember the restaurant and old bridge the rt 76(bus) went over at the Darby terminal.
Subway operation was so much better before CBTC was installed.
What song is playing at the end?
You look at the past vs now and most of them are gone
Where's part 1? Did it get taken down?
yup and that same rail now sits dormant and abandoned. I never understood why they never bothered to cover any of the tracks on Germantown Ave.
Every so often there's talk of restoring trolleys on part of Germantown Ave. Knowing Philly it will almost certainly never get beyond the talk stage but it may be enough to prevent permanent destruction of the rails.
I don't understand why SEPTA didn't save the surface streetcar routes. I Wish that they purchased 😪 former Torontos TTC Bombardier cars to run the surface routes.
The PTC was starting to have trouble after WWII due to wear and tear during the war, competition from (subsidized) highways, and other factors. In the mid-1950s National City Lines took over their management and of course almost immediately started to rip out trolley services all over the city. Reportedly they wanted to "bustify" the subway-surface lines too but couldn't figure out how to make the tunnels compatible with buses.
NCL wasn't the only reason streetcar systems failed but they took major advantage of existing weaknesses to destroy a lot of lines that might have survived otherwise. When SEPTA was formed in the mid-1960s they inherited a lot of NCL's anti-rail mindset. Even 50+ years later it still colors a lot of their decisions, although it seems that the new CEO is trying to change things.
I will never understand why NCL purchased PTC. Unlike the other properties NCL acquired, PTC has rapid transit subway lines (Broad Street and Market-Frankford). How would NCL bustitute subway lines? one-53-passenger bus vs. 6X67-passenger subway train. Also, the cities that kept their trolleys has trolley subway tunnels (Boston, Philly, San Francisco, and Toronto, with Washinton, D.C. being the exception), so NCL didn't think that one through. So I guess after that, NCL didn't want to acquire properties that has subways.
@@josephheston9238 A friend wrote his master's thesis on NCL and used Philly as one of his case studies. To the extent that I remember his conclusions NCL was willing to weaken any system they couldn't destroy because it still meant more buses.
When they took over PTC Philly had one of the largest trolley fleets in the country, after LA and a couple of other cities. Within three years of the takeover they'd converted 24 lines to bus operation and discontinued service on 3 others. In addition PTC had little or no GM equipment in its fleet prior to NCL's takeover; after that almost all buses were ordered from GM.
They also put in place pro-bus, anti-rail management that lasted into the SEPTA days a decade later and beyond. SEPTA was abandoning trolley lines as late as the early 1990s (!)
While as you note it was far from total destruction; even so they turned Philadelphia from a rails-first operation into a heavily bus-dependent city, which I'm guessing was enough for their appetite.
I don't have a source to back it up, but reportedly there WERE rumors that NCL looked into replacing the subway-surface streetcars with buses but couldn't solve the issues of clearances and ventilation. If true, that could account for why they didn't seriously attack other cities with underground rails.
How did the street track switches work..?
The electric switches worked by the power off (to go straight) or on (to turn) position of the car's controller at the time the car rolled over the sensor. The overhead line had a switch that worked the same way.
@@Telcom100 ty
37 went all the way to Chester! When did that end?
37 still go to Chester......as a bus route
@@ogtripplog I would think there are many bus routes to Chester, but since this was a trolly video, I was commenting on trolleys going to Chester, not amazed about buses going there..
37 Route to Chester ended in 1946. It was cutback at route 420 until 1956
It still does that i know....its right at the corner of my block in s. Philly.
About the 4:30 mark this is totally wrong on the method of operation on Route 34. Route 34 was one man, not two, and was pay leave eastbound to subway and pay enter westbound.
This is Part 2 where is part 1
17:10 music
I love the scene (50:30) where it looks like a little girl is with her Mother or Grandmother and the way she holds her because she has no seatbelt!!!
People paid attention back in those days!!!
Back then I remember when we never wore seatbelts, and always did dangerous things but never saw anyone during my life (over 45 years so far) injured!!!
Kids did always get scraped knees but they got right back up and was actually part of the fun and lessons Learned throughout life!!!
Nowadays you would probably have multiple deaths immediately shutting it down INDEFINITELY because of no safety belts or something???
The crazy part is that a non-zero amount of the cars shown in this video are still in use in 2022. And not just the 15 trolleys, which are constantly on bus substitution.
My grandma took the 50 or47 to work to good n plenty at Germantown and sascky
? The 15 is the only route that uses PCCs in revenue service. Everything else is K-cars. The Route 15s are technically called PCC-II cars because they're complete rebuilds. The shells are original but nearly everything else is either a rehab or replacement.
Again no 10 trolly,west phila did not exist.
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Nobody here is interested.
Missing from the photos. The foul graffiti and trash everywhere.