Fallout TV Show: What Does it Mean for the Lore?
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- čas přidán 4. 06. 2024
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A new Wizards and Warriors animated lore series will talk about the history of Fallout Universe. In the first episode we will explain how the timeline of Fallout universe diverged from the real world one, the differences between two timelines, will talk about the Resource Crisis, the Resource wars, the Invasion of Canada by the US and the Sino-American War ( • How Did the Fallout Ti... ), while the second will talk about the Great War and the Vaults that Vault-Tec corporation vaunted as something that would save lives, but was really something else ( • Great War and the Vaul... ), while the third will cover the Mariposa Revolt and emergence of Roger Maxson, as well as the origins of the Brotherhood of Steel, the Master and the Unity, and the creation of the Ghouls and Super Mutants ( • Brotherhood of Steel, ... ), while the fourth described the Vault 13's Water Crisis, emergence of the Vault Dweller as the hero of the Wasteland and his travels to Shady Sands, Junktown, the Hub and Necropolis during the Mutant crisis, his struggle against the Master and the battle of Mariposa ( • Mutant Crisis and Rise... ). Our fifth episode will talk about the aftermath of the Unity Crisis, the fate of the Vault Dweller, the rise of the New California Republic and the return of the Enclave ( • Rise of the New Califo... ). I n the new video we will discuss the first season of the Prime TV's Fallout show and what it means for the lore of the universe.
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Writer: Jonathan Woody
Animation and Illustrations: Lito Areta
Narration: OfficiallyDevin ( / officiallydevin )
Editing: Kamran Maharramli
Producer: Nurlan Karimov
Production Music courtesy of Epidemic Sound: www.epidemicsound.com
#Lore #Documentary #Fallout - Krátké a kreslené filmy
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Amazon Bots already pressing the dis-like button.
Dude you got the East Coast and West Coast of the United States mixed up.
how did someone mess up east and west
East? I thought you said Weast?
-Patrick Star
Big Oof.
Ask my f’n wife.
🤦
Christ, I thought these people had editors lol.
For future reference, Never Eat Shredded Wheat
N
W E
S
Yes, thank you, that mnemonic will surely help me remember the names of the 4 cardinal points. They were so hard to remember. I mean, North. Who would have guessed?
Shredded Wheat Never Eat
Got it😊
Shredded wheat ha ha. I learned it was Never Eat Soggy Waffles 🤣
@@fgf4973samee lmaoooo
Mine was Never Eat Sour Watermelon
east and west coast are flipped in the first graphic
How flipped?
I just wanna know if that’s on purpose and this is actually fall out lore or just a mistake
it's at 2:42 lmao
it's made by Americans. They suck at Geography so it happens
Haha, I did not even notice the east/west flip text on the map, however I did notice Bethesda being written on the left side near the actual West Coast, and Interplay/Obsidian written on the right side near the actual East Coast and thought: 'well, that is a missed opportunity...'
U know it's a great start when east and west are shown accurately.
You know that old meme where the guy is raising his finger like he's about to make a point, then he thinks about it for a sec and just walks away?
The shows good, I’m just confused by some of the decisions made.
The ghoul drug seems like a pointless addition/retcon.
They still could have introduced the potential FEV to the squire without making a new drug ghouls need.
Maximus has done nothing but make poor decisions so far.
Them killing off Moldaver without telling us how she got there is odd, because even if we learn how she did later it won’t matter as much because she’s dead.
Also why would moldaver work with raiders if she’s NCR.
And of course the overseer nuking shady sands just seems like a weak way to severely damage the NCR.
Also Moldaver is meant to be a hero? So why was she leading bandits to slaughter innocent vault dwellers, who almost kill Lucy? The daughter of the woman she supposedly loved?
Maximus was such an annoying and pathetic compulsive liar, how am i supposed to root for the guy?
@@rosameltrozo5889 and he let the knight die for such a petty reason.
Yeah I mean how could they destroy shady sands so easily?
The ncr in fonv was so powerful that they had working power armor and vertibirds, like how would they not have the technology available to see and prevent a giant nuke coming down on their city?
And how?
Vault Tec has nukes but the enclave doesnt?
Why is vault Tec suddenly more subtle and powerful than the enclave?
The enclave was literally americas elite class that had the best technology of the pre war world, and they're less powerful than vault tec????
@@adamgonzalez9650 they didn’t really discuss the delivery method of the nuke but I doubt it was a missle, I was thinking more of a man portable bomb (big back pack nuke). But the crater was massive so I guess it would have had to be a missle, probably from a vault tec controlled silo.
It sounds stupid just trying to discuss it….
I cannot stress how important canon is to a fictional universe, whether you are mainstream or counterculture. Some things have to be set in stone, because audiences expect internal consistency in the stories they consume. In the simplest sense, drama occurs when an audience is invested, for example, in a character trying to overcome obstacles to achieve a goal. If a writer cheats by changing the rules of the story, any investment we have in the character's trials is immediately sucked out.
To an outsider, lore might seem like an over-texted, boiler plate revision of the real world, but it's what keeps people interested in a story. In a cynical sense, it's what convinces the consumer to be financially invested.
*Canon. Sorry I keep seeing Cannons everywhere I go and it's getting to the point i needed to say something 😂
Someone needs to read C0DA.
cannon is FULLY subjective.
you can’t enforce your vision or interpretation on another persons imagined and deeply personal connection to Art.
that’s just tyrannical and antithetical to the purpose of art as a device of personal reflection on the part of both the artist and the viewer.
Subjectivity is the entire key. 🤷🏻
god bless though 🖤
Games such as mass effect and dragon age has similar problems with the way their game is played to make a consistent lore.
Those two however allowed you to essentially pick what happened from the previous game
That is so correct. I’m a big Star Trek fan and can’t stand any of the new Star Trek created by JJ as it does not follow cannon in so many ways. Once a franchise gets big minor cannon issues are bound to happen - but when you do the opposite of cannon like in ST: Discovery and then claim it’s in the same universe/ time line etc of the previous Trek show just destroys any credibility.
I cannot stress enough that fictional canon is not IRL religious canon (an even it is sublect to occasional retcon and reinterpretations😉). Also there were as much, if not more, "retcons" and lore adjustments" between Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 as between any other entries in Fallout franchise.
"Somehow, Vault-Tec has returned."
come now we always knew vault tec was around somewhere.
anything else would be idiotic.
they did build the vaults after all, obviously they'd make a couple for themselves to take shelter in.
@@KalleosiniThey had always been portrayed as sadistic mad scientists with too much money at their disposal. The Enclave were the ones who'd always been plotting and scheming.
If they were so confident in the efficacy of cryo tech, then why have a vault do that as an experiment at all?
@@TheBrickMasterB nitpick
@@Kalleosini It really isn't, cryo tech is literally the driver of not just an entire game in the franchise, but the most commercially successful and well known one.
@@TheBrickMasterB so?
An interesting video, but the script needs to be proofread to remove the inaccuracies
How can the ending of Fallout New Vegas not be defined, if the second season is set (or at least visits) New Vegas?
That is a good question. If we visit it in season 2, which seems likely, then it would have to have some event happen that changed it enough from any New Vegas ending to be viable.
Off the top of my head, any one could have won, but not killed Mr. House… some time passes since the end of the 2nd battle of Hoover Damn, someone essentially plugs Mr. House back in and he regains control. Lucy gets to meet Mr. House in season 2 now.
Can it work? Maybe. People will complain if it’s not explained well. They would have to gloss over somethings which feels like bad writing.
You can by making it wishy washy. For example:
"The NCR and the Legion clashed in the battle, it ended in a stalemate, then Caesar died and the Legions slowly fell apart while the NCR overstretched itself struggled internally and with the destruction of Shady Sands it lost it's hold on the Mohave. House lives but was unable to complete his plan and is essentially still stuck just running New Vegas."
This could be seen as the outcome if the player wouldn't have intervened in the story in any way. The courier in this case never joined a side and just walked off leaving them to figure out this mess on their own.
There's no way to avoid the issue without making all the endings of New Vegas irrelevant. Shady Sands being nuked already makes the NCR's ending completely pointless.
@@BradfordCarter > Shady Sands being nuked already makes the NCR's ending completely pointless.
Not quite. If NCR ending of New Vegas is canon than NCR would be in charge of the city when Shady Sands get nuked and NCR either shutters or retreats to its northern holdings abandoning Nevada and Southern Califorina. That leaves NCR-less and Mr. House-less New Vegas in a power vacuum that leads to local groups fighting for control over it that leads to city's apparent sorry state. Or even if Mr. House is still alive in the canon ending he might've tried to use NCR disorder to get the control of the city back from NCR garrison leading to heavy urban fighting that is never good for any city.
Great overview of events, please continue your Fallout series lore videos!
They moved shady sands to LA for the show, which means that the boneyard has also collapsed. The fact that there's zero sign of NCR governance, military or infrastructure in the areas surrounding two major cities makes it seem like they're dead.
The fact they moved it means they’re gonna retcon it and say only they portion of the ncr around LA fell apart
Given that the Boneyard is NCR terratory, and the NCR replaced the cap with the NCR dollar, and given that Philly is trading in caps, seems to suggest that the NCR has suffered complete and total economic collapse, as the money they have been using for nearly 100 years has become worthless. To me, this says that the NCR is gone, and Moldaver's squad are the only ones left.
Couple this with the refugees in Vault 4, who have been there for years by the time of the show, who have not tried to leave to rejoin the rest of the NCR backs up this theory.
The most we will get are cosplaying raiders, some survivors, maybe a ncr ranger character…
Truly disappointing. Hell if u wanted to nuke NCR at least do it with Lonesome Road DLC and not some ridiculous Vault tech crap.
Also on the subject of Vault Tech nuking world/that board meeting. That had to be the dumbest motivation ever conceived.
“We will dominate capitalism… by destroying all markets on earth” Karl Marx couldn’t even make that up with how dumb it is
@@seminoleboy96 What they should have been looking to do was to keep the world on the brink of war, that way scared people would buy their products for peace of mind, because money loses all value when you can't spend it, like in the event of global nuclear war for instance.
@@seminoleboy96Vault Tec has always been like this though. They literally were experimenting on people solely for this possibility. Of course they’d be ready to cause the apocalypse
Loving the comments about the absolute failure of East and West 😂😂😂😂
Love the art styles of your videos
Ok, so the Brotherhood in Fallout 1 were not a techno cult. Yes, they wanted to gather as much technology as they could, but that was to keep it out of the hands of those they saw as having the potential to misuse it and start another war. They were also inventors, as Scribe Vee points the player to go and ask about a new laser pistol they have developed when asked about it. They had their society split in two - Knights were the warriors, and Scribes were the researchers. Paladin is a rank *within* the Knights.
If you want to know about why the Brotherhood shown in the show acts more like those from 3 and 4, it is because they have to be them. The West Coast Brotherhood lost a war against the NCR, and were having to hide in bunkers in order to survive.
Ghouls have never before needed a serum of any kind in order to stop going feral. In fact, Fallout 4's Nuka World DLC has a ghoul searching for a cure to prevent turning feral, and records a holotape stating that there is no cure, and that the process of turning feral can be felt like losing ones mind. That bit of lore is attached to the Kiddy Kingdom questline, which has Oswold The Magnificent, a Glowing One, who was not feral even when all of his friends were and he did not know why.
Contrary to the suggestion in the show that Vault-Tec were the first to drop a nuke, President Dick Richardson outright states in Fallout 2 that it was China that launched first, and that they barely had time to launch their own nukes in retaliation. Also, there is the issue of Robert House being at the meeting, because in New Vegas he states that he ran calculations on a nuclear war, found it was inevitable, and was able to calculate down to almost the very day when the bombs would fly. He was off by 20 hours, which is why he did not have the platinum chip, and was unable to fully protect Vegas. If the show is taken as canon, as stated, then those calculations would have been pointless as he was privy to the plan, and there would be no reason why he would not have had the platinum chip in time.
The Fall of Shady Sands is not referring to "the start of the decline". It is a very distinct and fininte term, and every other time it is used in history, it refers to a very specific date of a catastrophic event. The sacking of Rome by Goths, for example, has a very specific date, rather than a start date and an end date years later. Same with the fall of Constantinople. Therefore, it is only logical to conclude that it FELL (not began falling) in 2277, and then was nuked some time after. This does contradict New Vegas.
There is also the lore contradiction in the show of where Shady Sands is. The show has it located within the LA Boneyard area, which is not where it was located within the games. It was directly between Vault 13 and Vault 15, almost due North of Junktown and the Hub. The only way that it could be THE Shady Sands is if NCR citizens decided to build a new settlement and name it that, or moved the entire city across the desert.
And vault 4 in the show was one of the worst hidden vaults i’ve ever seen. How the hell did The Master not find it if it was in the boneyard
@@seminoleboy96 The only reason I can see is that it simply did not exist.
If it did, with that huge doorway out in the open during the events of Fallout, then... I don't know. Can't even say he did find them and just didn't do anything, because the scientists there would be prime normals, and ripe for dipping.
It could be that Vault-Tec made it look like China nuked America and not the company itself. So I guess that judging by the TV Show’s part of the lore, the US government was unaware and ignorant of Vault-Tec’s sinister intentions.
@@seminoleboy96it’s possible that he saw that everybody in there were mutants. If I remember correctly, he only wanted pure humans much like the Enclave
@@voiceinyourhead8284 they are still close to prime normals, stop making ascusses for bad writting. All this Vaults being so close to the Master is stupid, the Mutant army was searching for Vaults in the area. This whole shitshow and Retcon Wave could have been avoided by not taking California as Location for New Material
I hope the NCR is in fact still active and functional, but it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Todd has infact removed them from the setting for good with this show ...
No, he confirmed that they were still around in an interview.
@@stevenchoza6391 Yeah forgive me for not taking Todd "SIXTEEN times the detail" Howard at his word, lol. The man is a walking meme for saying stuff that turns out to not be true.
It's very likely he simply said that to quench criticism with zero intentions of bringing back the faction, or they are simply no more than some disparate camps of drugged up squatters with no more impact on the setting than random raiders.
Using the voice of Codsworth for the video was a stroke of genius, ngl... 😜😜😜
The Enclave facility is not necessarily on the West Coast. There are mountains in the background, suggesting the Sierra Nevadas or Rockies. The fact that the BoS is informed by the Commonwealth BoS suggests the Rockies. Otherwise the West Coast faction would have found out on their own.
The salt plains, airbases and mountains are almost scraming "Southern/Western Nevada" to me. This may explain why BoS seized Filly. They needed it as a forward base as LA is too far away from their home base to mount an assault from there.
That map got all fucked up at 3:00 wow
Searching for this exact video
love your vids
Thank you wizards and warriors youre videos are extreamly entertaining and well made😎
The airship being the prydwen and not the caswyn raises more questions and problems it would've been better and made more sense if they'd built a new airship since the east cost brotherhood already had the plans and manufacturing knowledge and experience to produce the airships, vertibirds and T-60 power armor
It might have been Prydwen that got crashed, repaired and renamed because of it (as it is often being done with ships)
I miss when lore changes were mistakes that the game makers publically addressed and set right.
What's annoying about this is that they're trying to make this canon but they clearly don't care about Canon but in order to get it to line up they're going to start hitting it with tons of retcons. Either that or they're going to claim this is an alternate timeline to explain all this stuff like with Halo since all of fallout is supposed to be an alternate timeline from World war II
Rings of power take notes lol lol
Do you know that Lucy Maclean's actress? Also voices the League of Legends champion Jinx in Arcane!
She should stick to voice acting tbh, those eyes freak me out 👁️ 🫦 👁️
@@offlineraided?
@@offlineraided lemme guess from that name, rust player? Considering that, you've never talked to a woman before sooo
@@Babagush68 projection and you liked ur own comment lol, she won't date you kid
@@offlineraided touch grass brother, otherwise youre a lost cause
which one is the weast coast?
Well, the writers of the show did say that they're not writing it for the fans. I'm sure their knowledge of the Fallout universe amounts to seeing a physical copy of a Fallout game in a store once. Going to be interesting to see how it all pans out in the end.
Ooh! East? I thought you said "Weast"
Cool!
New Vagas takes place a handful of years before fallout 4.
So a minute tweak is required.
But other than that, well done with the presentation, brilliant work as always and well done on remaining objective to the content being debated in the community.
I, for one, am yet to find a single narrative flaw after several reviewings and analyzes of the show, like Moldaver possibly having some of the technology she developed in emergency storage or have reconstructed a cryostasis pod for emergency use, explaining her presence so many years after the global send off.
Tho if any inconsistencies can be brought forth in a respectful manner, it would be interesting to see how there may or may not be actual loose panels present.
Am I having a stroke or did they mess up East and West?
Bethesda doesn’t understand fallout and never has and never will. They turned fallout into nothing but a “wacky and edgy post apocalypse, with a retro futuristic vibe”. Everything that made fallout actually worthwhile has been stripped away and were left with nothing but a hollow consumable product that people praise because of a sprinkle of good acting and “Easter eggs”.
This was always what Fallout was. But some Idiots of course Ignore this cause they need a cause to get angry to fill their Rage Boner to ditract themself from their shitty lives.
I just look at what happened to Shady Sands as the lingering aftermath of a bad outcome from an old playthrough. Like what happened to the Vault 13 deathclaws.
the house always wins
I think they're gonna keep the war in line with the game lore. China discovered the enclave / vault tec and shot earlier than expected
I doubt Amazon would depict China negatively in any respect, especially after jerking off communism during the pre war flashbacks.
Did you name this channel Wizards and Warriors based on the NES game of the same name? I still have the game, just curious.
Only issue I have with the vid is that the map should have been more focused in on the west coast.
My theory is since BoS wants to bring back civilization (maybe as a new USA), It would be plausible for them to move their chain of command to Washington, especially since that was once the capital of North America. Remembering that in Fallout 4, Arthur Maxson stated that BoS wiped out Capital Wasteland's Mutants, and probably the Ghouls too.
I mean yes but also no. The BoS is itself extremly divided with Subfactions Scism and infighting. Some Parts yes maybe but some others not.
It means they cant make any other interesting factions and have to re-hash BOS for the next 5 games. The Lore is going no-where good or great.
Many series these days look good but are garbage on the story, characters and lore. This looks good and is at least medium on other factors
Loved the show, but I have two problems I hope get better in S2, one is the writing, why did Moldaver have raiders marry/sex with lucy and try to kill her when Moldaver was so good friends with Lucy's mother?
Also hope Maximus gets some motivation to take some initiative and work with the elders for the Brotherhood, the social cohesion of BoS is 0%, everyone hates each other, every BoS squire and paladin seem to hate BoS, it doesn't make sense. But Stargate SG1 and Star Trek TNG also had rocky season 1, hopefully S2 will get better.
Actually, almost all ST series had weak beginnings. TNG, DS9, VOY, ENT, STD..
i am happy, another fallout episode
He dun forgot fallout tactics :O
Bethesda confirmed Shady Sands was nuked in Mid-2280s. 👍🏼
Thought the series was amazing. They captured the vibe and feel of Fallout which is what I thought would be the most difficult thing to do for an adaptation
No, they captured the nonsense of Bethesda
@@rosameltrozo5889 Have you played Fallout 1 or 2? Over the top comical violence is how I would describe Fallout.
@@Samm815 that's not the problem
Omg I wonder if the serum is the same thing Hancock took (possibly also Eddie Winter ?)
I went into fallout totally blind. Never played any of the games. Most of what I know about the series I learned from this channel
Honestly, there is another explanation to the apparent lore contradictions in the Fallout show. That they are giving it the same treatment as League of Legends lore.
That is to say: there is canon, and then there is "canon".
I don't think we have a strong indication of that. There are events that stretch the lore somewhat, but, overall, it makes sense if you consider that every game has multiple endings.
That is idiotic. They confirmed the game is canon to the lore. The inconsistencies are a result of bad writing.
@@WizardsandWarriors No, it does not make sense because the events of the show directly contradict stuff that happens in New Vegas, its bad writting by people that either dont care or activly want to ruin things.
@@sicor94New Vegas isn't a numbered Fallout title so it in itself isn't canon
@@offlineraided Funny seeing how New Vegas is the reworked van Buren, the original fallout 3 with people that worked on black isle and interplay.
If anything, Bethesda has never been able to make an actual fallout game.
For posterity, Todd said the bomb was dropped on Shady Sands right after the events of FNV
Thats just desperate damage control, not what the series said, said series wic bethesda insists its the continuation of fallout.
Shady sands isnt even where shady sands its meant to be, they mixed it with the boneyard because they are lazy, terrible writers that didnt give a damn.
And no-one in New Vegas mentione dit, despite it hapening only 4 years prior?
@@jonbaxter2254 "after." The key operating word I used here was "after"
The show is currently the most recent entry in the Fallout timeline.
@@sicor94 The board is written very weird.
Wherever Maxim is, lies the leadership of all the BOS
Evil corps are evil is so boring. I liked the original version that the vaults are for modeling societies for the program of the generation colonist spaceship.
If I had a nickel for every time amazon made a show about how cooperations are evil I would have 2 nickels which is weird because they are a evil company themselves.
The brotherhood blimp getting from one coast to another is one thing, but how did DogMeat get to Boston??
Lots of dogs have been called Dog Meat. It's not the same dog I think every game.
Did you use an AI to write the script?
I'll start worrying about consistency in fallout lore when Bethesda does. Until then these are all separate stories in parallel universes.
Todd is saving face with the stuff he's saying about the show, he knows he done screwed up with letting the writers of the show, make it with a "don't care about the fans" writing, Boneyard doesn't exist in the show, magically Boneyard is Shady Sands, non of the events of 1, 2 or New Vegas are ever mentioned in the show, the whole "vault 32 raiders are ex-NCR", but apparently Vault 33 had 0 clue about the NCR, there is a ton of retcons and inconsistencies with the show, to call it good from a fan perspective, is like spitting in the face of the OG Fallout makers
The literal OG fallout creator Tim Cain praised the show
Lmao
Todd will do what he always does.
Hell retcon it.
“Oh that wasn’t shady sands in shady sands state. That was new shady sands in the state down south by the boneyard.”
Valts 31, 32, 33, and 4 are all within the Boneyard area.
The Master was in a vault in the Boneyard area, and was actively looking for Humans to dip and turn into his new species.
There is no way four vaults that close to his base of operations just escaped his notice, especially when they are shown to have huge marked doors to the outside world, visible from the surface.
@@Major98 and ? It is still bad, Tim cain can praise the Show all he wants. It still destroy the Westcoast Canon.
good show & this is a seperate timeline to me
BRUH WOW!
Young denzel washington would have made a fantastic Maximus over the current actor (see Book of Eli)
And Fallout Tactics? Tactics is also canon.
I read an interesting interview, it was the developer of the Lonesome Road DLC for New Vegas and he described how the plot of the divide was meant to reset the Fallout world. He commented that the NCR was making things too civilized. Its an interesting viewpoint when you view it in context of the current lore.
That's literally the point of fallout. It's about rebuilding civilization, not 'muh wacky wasteland. lol'.
“Too civilized.”
By what metric is it really?
We have a small chunk of California being alright while majority of North America is still apocalyptic wasteland
That rebuilding of civilisation is what makes some factions so interesting, just nuking them to make a post-post-post-apocalyptic wacky story is silly
Except you don't get the option to "reset" anything. Ulysses only codes two targets before the facility self-destructs, and they're both supply routes, nothing that would destroy NCR or the Legion on its own. Choosing who gets nuked or not nuking anyone is an additional choice for the player to determine the outcome at Hoover Dam. It's not even close to a reset.
"Leave the multi-billion dollar corporation alone"
- Wizards and Warriors, who have obviously been paid handsomely to make all this Fallout content.
Overall positive Reviews from Critics and Viewers. Yeah must be a them problem not a you problem lol.
Brotherhood ending for the win!
It's been three weeks since this video has been out....but ummm have you been informed that California is actually on the west coast and not the East Coast? Always remember the saying "Never Eat Shreed Wheat"
I think people are reading too much into what Todd Howard said. He didn't say Shady Sands wasn't destroyed in 2277; he said New Vegas is cannon and the "bombs fell" after New Vegas, but there is some "confusion" and they had to "tighten" things around this. He seemed to be very carefully choosing his words as well. I think they mixed up the date with First Battle of Hoover Dam and it was too late to change it, so they are effectively retconning the date of New Vegas to 2277, which has no impact on the timeline since nothing else has canonically happened between 2277 and 2281. Fallout has played loose with dates and times before (like what time did the Great War bombs actually fall?), so it is neither a lore-breaking retcon to push New Vegas back a few years, nor is it inconsistent with how the games themselves don't stick doggedly to established cannon.
There are numerous references throughout the show to 2277 specifically, and ages that match up to that year as being when Shady Sands ended. Here are a few:
- The records Norman pulled up showed Hank transferred from Vault 31 in 2271. Hank said he came to Vault 33 to marry Lucy's mother. The purported point of the vault exchanges was breading, so presumably Rose got pregnant not long after Hank transferred, otherwise there would have been some concerns. Lucy says she thought the sun in the vault was real until she was 6, and showed the same flashback we later see is actually Shady Sands. If she were born in 2271, then she stopped believing the sun was real in 2277.
- If Lucy was born in 2271, she would be 25 at the time of the show. The actress was 25 when she was filming the show. Lucy also presents her SPECIAL stats which shows she has had a lot of responsibilities and activities in the vault, including teaching, but says nothing of her grades or anything else to indicate she recently graduated herself. She also seems frustrated with being unable to find a husband, which makes her seem a older than late-teens/early twenties.
- Lucy's brother Norman is younger than her and has already worked, and been fired from, every job in the vault, implying he is at least a few years out of school-aged. If he is in his early 20s, Lucy should be mid-20s. The actor is currently 30, but I think he can easily pull off being early 20s.
- I'll skip Maximus because a lot of people apparently think the 35-year-old actor who plays him looks 19 somehow, so we can just agree to disagree on that.
- Lucy says there was a famine in the vault in 2277, that everyone was quarantined, and that her mother died because of it. That seems like an obvious cover for when Rose would have left the vault with Lucy and Norman, and Hank would have gone after them. The guy with the mustache says he ran for overseer once, but lost to Hank when the famine struck, so it's highly unlikely Hank snuck out again 4-plus years later to nuke Shady Sands and no one noticed the overseer was missing.
- The end credits of Episode 5 (the same episode where we see the Shady Sands Library sign) shows a library book with stamped due dates, with the last date being "Nov 2276" (also, the first due date was "Feb 2189", the year the NCR was formed, which implies the dates aren't just random).
-Vault 4 dweller, and Shady Sands survivor, Birdie says she was 11 when Shady Sands was destroyed. The actress is currently 47, but it looks like they tried to age her down a bit with her hairstyle and I think she could plausibly pass for being ~30, which would mean she was 11 in 2277, but there's no way she could pass for being 26 or younger to fit a 2281 or later date.
- I don't want to keep jumping on the chalkboard, but in Episode 1 there is a shot of Lucy teaching "Our American History" on a vault whiteboard, noting the years: 1776 with a drawing of the Declaration of Independence, 1969 with a drawing of the 13-Commonwealth star pattern seen on pre-war flags, and 2077 with a drawing of a mushroom cloud almost identical to the later chalkboard drawing. This is an obvious symmetrical reference and, notably, there is nothing on the whiteboard about any decline in America, even though the start of the Resource Wars would have been the perfect "decline" to include, and the actual year the bombs fell is used. Lucy's timeline also connects each year with just a line (as is typical in a timeline), but the Vault 4 chalkboard uses an arrow to point to the mushroom cloud after the "fall"/2277 reference.
I think they liked the symmetry of the Great War bombs being 2077 and the bomb destroying Shady Sands exactly 200 years later. I have seen people mix up the date of New Vegas as being in 2277 because of the First Battle of Hoover Dam instead of the actual date the game is set in, so it is perfectly plausible they thought they had the perfect date and everything lined up, until it was too late to change all the things I note above. Neither the chalkboard nor Todd Howard has said the year Shady Sands was destroyed if it wasn't 2277, which would be super easy for them to do unless it is somehow a huge spoiler for Season 2.
Long story short, they put way too much effort into indicating Shady Sands blew up in 2277, they've never given an alternative year, and Todd has been coy about what the chalkboard meant. It is a whole lot easier to just accept that New Vegas was retconned to be in 2277 than to come up with elaborate explanations for why everything I note above doesn't mean that was the year Shady Sands was destroyed. And, what's funny about the whole year argument is it has distracted people from talking about the significant blow the show deals to the NCR as supposedly the most powerful faction in Fallout.
Thank you for bringing it up how likely it is that someone screwed up the dates.
I would actually respect the team behind the show a lot more if they just admitted they got something very wrong and apologize for it.
Oh! I thought you said WEAST
Still begging for more horus heresy
"The Fall of Shady Sands in 2277" doesn't refer to the nuke and is a historical date that was picked retroactively, just like we today say "The Fall of Rome in 476" when to any contemporary Roman there was little difference inbetween 470 and 480. 2281 already showed an overextended and crumbling NCR and according to the time line the nuke happened after the Second Battle of Hoover Dam. So if we go from an Independent or Caesarian victory it makes sense that an already battered NCR descended into infighting after the assassination of President Kimbal and got knocked out by the loss of it's capital with it's remnants relocating to the Hub, New Reno or Vault City. Or even seeking shelter with the Shi in San Francisco.
The ncr was not crumbling. Every nation has issues.
Avelone jsut wanted to be contrarion
Vault City is not part of the NCR.
@@Cesar_1216 Check the Fallout 2 endings, Vault City either allies with the NCR or joins it.
Several NPCs talk about Shady Sands in New Vegas and none seem to feel inclined to say anything about the "fallen" state of the city. Marcus, in Jacobstown, even goes to add that the NCR just won't keep expanding and conquering land and that he doesn't like the Republic's authoritarianism. The NCR wins a hard-earned victory against the BoS and the Legion while, allegedly, their most important city and administrative capital is "falling" or has "fallen", respectively. Also, Pagliarulo seems to disagree with the stated canon about the geographical location of Shady Sands, apparently.
Stop the cope. Industrial slop makers don't know how to write and don't give a damn about actual creativity and good stories. Don't be a tool.
@@Ralphoifyful Again, "the fall" of something is 99% something attributed in retrospective. No Roman went "Oh no, Rome just fell =(" in 476, they probably were pretty confident about Odoacer taking power from a 16 year old posh imbecile. 2277 marks the start of the conflict with the Legion as well as the first battle of Hoover dam which could be used as a nice historic "beginning of the end" marker by historians. Also, nuking Shady Sands was an idea that's been around since _Van Buren_ in the early 2000 when Black Isle still was in charge. Stop being a neckbeard.
Mabey by fall of shady sands ment like economic, they had to change capital
Could also be that the fall of shady sands was recntish like say two to three years before the show, in this way the shock following the fall of the capital hasn’t completely died out and the NCR is still struggling to recover especially considering if the NCR had other problems that weren’t resolved by the time the capital was nuked.
But why would it fall?
If anything shady sands problems was it growth
Except the economic center of the NCR was the Hub, where there was major agricultural center and all of the caravanners were based there. Blowing up Shady Sands would no more end the NCR's economy than blowing up DC would for the US's.
I know what the enclave is up to and it involves a lot of bad writing also a fucking chalk board to deposit exposition is literally the laziest thing in the world cause it leads to shit like this.
What they did with the NCR makes no sense, not only is it silly to make a post-post-apocalyptic story but also it leaves one of the most interesting aspects of the games that is the rebuilding of civilisation on top of the previous one's ruins
Maybe they're going to show us that in the show, instead of her coming out of the vault to an already in progress rebuilt society.
@@winowmak3r so 💩 all over the established lore to essentially recreate it? Bravo Bethesda
@@rosameltrozo5889 people like you are why studios are so hesitant to make this sort of stuff in the first place. It was a good show, I'll allow them some creative license if they can tell me a good story.
@@winowmak3r They should hesitate even more about making 💩 yes, it wasn't even a good story
@@rosameltrozo5889
Most People liked it so yeah you can go and cry all you want nobody gives a shit what you like or want.
I think what happened with the BOS is that the west coast finally adopted their cult of the old ideals of the Brotherhood from Fall out 1 with Maxson having a cult of personality like thing. Let’s say the ship really is called the Caswennan and they just Carved the Prydewen on the side of the ship in honor of Elder Maxson
I genuinely like the show, but die hard fallout fans have every right to hate this show
It was a great show. I'll just consider it off in its own canon for now though.
I think this is the best way to look at it. The show is its own thing and the games are their own thing. Maybe it’s just me being an NCR fan coping lol
It's gonna need some canon welding to work.
They dated a "metaphorical fall" but they didn't date a literal atomic bombing? Pure cope. I mean, maybe these writers are that dumb, but it seems unlikely.
Either way, it's obvious why Todd had them blow up Shady Sands. "That'll show those New Vegas Chuds!!!"
The Enclave base was seen covered in snow when the scientist escaped, so, at a minimum, it was very far North of where Lucy encounters him, and likely it was at least North of the known borders of the NCR.
Would love to see Caesars Legion in the show.
They would have had some random guy nuke it off camera
@@rosameltrozo5889 Or they would have collapsed as they are not very competent without Ceasr and he was terminally ill during New Vegas.
Umm are you guys outsourcing graphic and script work to Ai or people who don't speak English? 🙃
It means the lore's f***ed
I get some people enjoyed this show, but I really didn't like it.
Bad writing and convenient events aside, it just is contrivance after contrivance.
Don't worry you are one of the few sane Person who see the mess for what it is
Shady Sands being nuked before New Vegas and no npc ever mentions it is crazy. New lore contradicts old lore but people seem to forget 😊.
Let's not even get into the board room scene which does nothing but raise questions and contradict lore, let's just take one element Robert Houses being in the room makes no sense, his plans specifically contradicted everything in that room, his entire plan revolved around Vegas not being Nuked, hard to have a true monopoly when you of your board members is building his own technocrat state post Apocalypse, if he had been in the room and knew the exact date then he'd ofmhad the platinum chip ready months in advance...
@@maddlarkin The Board room scene was the final nail in the coffin for me. As though any of the experiments they ran in the vaults were anything short of being outright sadistic. The entire thing was utterly nonsensical.
Shady sands is nuked after the 2nd battle of hoover dam
And if someone hijacked the plan of dropping nukes(like the Enclave) that would explain how Mr house got caught short
@thestanleys3657 Dude, you are head canoning to fill plot holes, it makes no sense. House wouldn't of been in the room, he had his own plans for rebuilding post apocolypse based on his own calculations on when the world tips over the brink and they are in direct opposition to Vault Tec's stated objective here, if his plan had worked as intended Vaul Tec's managers would of come out of cryo to discover a huge technocratic state colonising other planets, forget monopoly they'd of been lucky to survive. Come to think of it if House was in the room where's Bradburton, they were actively chatting about it and both had their own plans so why isn't he there.
The House thing was one example, the entire scene makes no sense, peace isn't on the horizon for years given the state of the war at the time, Repconn shouldn't even be in the room, they're a minor subsidiary of Robco (if I remember correctly) and it's been widely hinted at in canon and stated by the original writers, China launched first, so why is the Vault Tec lady talking about, as for the Enclave, why would they need to hijack anything, the Vaults were built on the US goverments dime which was puppeted by the Enclave, they were behind the whole project to the extent that in Fallout 2 they have override codes to all the Vault doors, Big MT is in the room but no shady Enclave representative, it all makes no sense.
@@thestanleys3657why people like you just cannot accept the fact that the show was full of lore mistakes? You would rather defend them till the of end the time and exhibit god tier level mental gymnastics lol
Guys! Can you please do a Henry V lives?
Obligatory comment about East and West being messed up at the beginning of the video
Nice comment bite though 🤣
This show is awesome 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
I think you all mixed up East and West.
Bethesda has once again shown that they can't do Fallout lore justice
I thought the East and West was just an internal fallout lore that the cardinal directions changed or something but it seems like it was a mistake on their part.
It means the lore doesn’t matter given they blew up the ncr before new Vegas is supposed to begin
Is there still some discussion to this? Lore breaks were evident and heavy. Sure, you can twist it and make sense of it you really try... shame that Bethesda and showrunners don't care about the lore as much as half of people here
East west what
At this point, Fallout feels like Star Wars to me. Just like Star Wars will always be about Jedi and Sith, Fallout will always be about the Brotherhood of Steel and the Enclave. We will never escape them and any attempt to do so will be swatted down by fans and executives.
New Vegas made BoS (or atleast one chapter of them) a minor faction. I don't remember Enclave appearing at all, maybe mentioned, but that's it.
@@RabbitShirak Enclave remenants.
Tv show needs to be non canon, that is stupid if it's really canon
It means they just pulled a force awakens by destroying a previusly stablished setting people liked to reset it and do their own crappy OC, thats what it means
@@chiquita683STRENG GEHEIM
Star War's expanded universe was never canon in the first place as none of it was created by George Lucas. Not to mention Lucas' original plan for the sequel trilogy would have also overridden the old EU.
@@AsymmetricalCrimes And we all benefitted from Disney's new canon...oh wait.
@@sicor94 Who's "we all?" You speak for all Star Wars fans now?
@@AsymmetricalCrimes The declining state of the franchise speaks for itself.
I like your content on this channel and Kings and Generals, but this video got a thumbs down.
Outside of just being a bad show I'm general, it undermines the entire point of the Fallout universe. Originally the world had ended as a result of war between America and China, now we are explicitly told that Vault Tech dropped the bombs because peace talks had affected their profits. No more "war never changes", now its "muh capitalism bad bro".
The appearance of the Prydwyn confirms that neither the Railroad, nor Institute endings can be canon in Fallout 4.
Ghouls are now pretty and invincible. Tanks dozens of bullets and power armor punches. Hilarious.
Outside of lore stuff, every character is just so stupid and so covered in plot armor that there is no immersion at all. My favorite scene was when the scientist escaped the base and dodged a million bullets at point blank range.
Scientist had a high Luck.
How many factual errors are in this video? The mutagen that Thaddeus uses isn't even the same substance as the vials that ghouls have to use.
That drawn title card was a good laugh.
I will forever ignore the bad writing of a bad show.
I speculated that in 2277 after the cripplingly brutal First Battle of Hoover Dam, this gave incentive for Arthur Kimball to make a case that Shady Sands was far too detached from the realities of the Mojave campaign and that a closer capital could better respond to the challenegs ahead of a potebtial counterattack from the Legion. Therefore as its foremer representative from Hub, and its history as an economic Constantinople of thr Wasteland, the NCR council voted to migrate the political center of Power to the Hub to have more organizational control, whilst Shady Sands remained a cultural capital. Hence the sign outside the town marking it as the first capital of the NCR
*Aaron. And your probably right. They just need to actually say it instead of choose the Dark Soulds way of making the audience fill in the blanks.