Julie de Azevedo Hanks: Mormonism & Mental Health [Mormonism Live 195]
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- čas přidán 13. 09. 2024
- Welcome to this special episode of Mormonism Live, where hosts Bill Reel and Radio Free Mormon are joined by the renowned therapist, author, and social worker, Julie de Azevedo Hanks. Known for her candid discussions on mental health, relationships, and navigating faith transitions, Julie brings her unique perspective to the complexities of living within Mormon culture. In this episode, we dive deep into the intersection of faith and psychology, explore the challenges of maintaining authenticity in a religious community, and discuss the importance of mental health awareness in the LDS Church. Whether you're on your own faith journey or interested in the evolving dynamics of Mormonism, this conversation promises to be enlightening and thought-provoking. Don't miss it!
Julie de Azevedo Hanks is an award-winning singer and songwriter, licensed therapist, author, speaker, and consultant. She also blogs on women’s emotional health, self-care, and relationships and contributes regularly to social media, radio, and other media. She is a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
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What a great episode! Loved hearing from Dr. Julie deAzevedo Hanks!👏
Julie, thank you so much for your bravery and intelligence in opposition. You are a strength to the Mormon community at large ❤️
I really appreciate your work, Julie! I was told multiple times growing up that I needed pray or read my scriptures more in order to feel better. At almost 40, I learned of a rare genetic disorder that is my actual problem. It's important for people to make their own authority and listen to their intuition. The men in the church don't want us to have any authority or listen to our intuition because they know they are wrong. Thank you for this episode!! Y'all are the best!! ❤
Why reject Biblical truth?
We are commanded to test any teacher or "prophet" to see if it conflicts with previous revelation. The bible tells us to watch out for false teachers and examine the scripture just like the Bereans did to see if what the Apostle Paul was teaching was truth.
For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15 It is not surprising, then, if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. 2 Corinthians 11:13-15
Acts 17:11
Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and EXAMINED the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.
Test Joseph Smith AGAINST the words of God Jesus affirmed.
Luke 24:44 He said to them, “This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms.”
"Before me NO god was formed, nor shall there be ANY after me.” (Isaiah 43:10)
If Mormonism is true, then God could not make this claim, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of J.S. and LDS members. Isaiah 44:6 says, "I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is NO God." & "Is there any God besides me?.. I know not one". God is saying there is NOT an infinite amount of Gods, and there is none like Him.
LDS teaches that there is. He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did" (King Follett Sermon) Either the BIBLE or LDS is FALSE.
Jesus said ALL scripture will NOT fade away but "MANY WOLVES in sheep's clothing" will come trying to ADD to the word. Mathew 7:15 Joseph Smith changed Jesus, the Father and added you can become a GOD.
It hurts my heart to see Mormons fall for Satan's lie that we can become God when there is only one eternal biblical God.
God gave us critical thinking & logical reasoning for a reason, he tells us to EXAMINE and TEST what we are being taught for TRUTH. The bible withstands the truth test. Joseph Smith's version FAILS the truth test. It's your eternity, study it for yourself. God bless.
LDS FALSE Apostle: "The law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." Brigham Young Journal of Discourses, Vol. 10, p. 110
"The only men who become Gods, even the sons of Gods are those that enter into polygamy." (Brigham Young) Journal of Discourses 11 p.269
God Bless.
@@brettpinion4233 maybe it's simpler than that.... Intuition = God ❤️ Religion was brought in to confuse. Much love to you!
@@edsqueenlarene6917 Thank you for the love. I love you to and I cannot love you and not share God's truth. The God of the bible is about relationship, not empty "religion".
It is of extreme importance: If ye continue in MY WORD, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. John 8:32
Why would his disciples preach he was the Messiah unto death, never recant and never seek fame, sex, money, honor, power or anything except prison, poverty, beatings and scorn?
The most reasonable answer is they had seen the prophesized Messiah rise from the dead. The first Christian Martyr.
Acts 7:55-58
But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked up to heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. “Look,” he said, “I see heaven open and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.”
At this they covered their ears, cried out in a loud voice, and rushed together at him. 58They dragged him out of the city and began to stone him. Meanwhile the witnesses laid their garments at the feet of a young man named Saul"
Why would Saul become Paul and lay aside all his power, wealth and honor to be beaten, stoned and finally killed if he had not seen the risen Christ?
You might not be aware of the evidence for the life of Jesus and how Christianity spread not by the sword but by believers who were ostracized and sometimes killed.
Evidence exists that Jesus was God in the flesh in the letters of Paul, written between 20 and 30 years (50 to 60 AD) after the crucifixion.
A couple of decades later (70 to 80 AD) , the New Testament Gospels were written, which do appear to contain first-hand testimonies.
Byron McCane, archaeologist and historian of religions and Judaism at the Atlantic University of Florida, both the baptism and the crucifixion are stories that the first Christians are unlikely to have invented, since neither of them “supports their interests in any way,” "the crucifixion was a humiliating punishment reserved for criminals.”
In year 93 AD, the Pharisee historian Flavius Josephus left in his work Jewish Antiquities at least one indisputable reference to James( leader of the church in Jerusalem) & the “brother of Jesus." Josephus specified which Jesus he was referring to by adding the phrase “who is called Messiah,” or, since he was writing in Greek, Christos.
The longer passage in Josephus’s Jewish Antiquities (Book 18) that refers to Jesus is known as the Testimonium Flavianum. After extracting what appear to be later Christian additions, the remaining text appears to be pure Josephus and acknowledges Jesus and his crucifixion.
In year 110 AD the Roman governor Pliny the Younger wrote to Emperor Trajan that early Christians would “sing hymns to Christ as to a god.” Many scholars also believe Roman historian Suetonius references Jesus in noting that Emperor Claudius had expelled Jews from Rome who “were making constant disturbances at the instigation of Chrestus.”
Roman Senator Tacitus also wrote about Jesus explaining that the founder of the sect of Christians was executed during the mandate of Emperor Tiberius, when Pontius Pilate was governing in Judea for crimes against the state, and a religious movement of his followers sprang up in his wake.
In Annals of Imperial Rome, a 1st century history of the Roman Empire written A.D. 116 by the Roman senator and historian Tacitus. Chronicling the burning of Rome in A.D. 64, Tacitus mentions that Emperor Nero falsely blamed “the persons commonly called Christians, who were hated for their enormities. Christus, the founder of the name, was put to death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius.”
Atheist, historian and Bible expert Bart Ehrman vigorously defends the historicity of Jesus, and provides a compelling portrait of the man from Nazareth. "The Jesus you discover here may not be the Jesus you had hoped to meet-but he did exist, whether we like it or not.”
The crucifixion is historical (archaeologist & biblical researcher Eric Meyers, professor Jewish studies at Duke U.)
As far as we know, no ancient person ever seriously argued that Jesus did not exist. Theissen and Merz, Historical Jesus, p. 63.
@brettpinion4233 A true and loving God would never require a sacrifice to save anyone. The end.
@@edsqueenlarene6917 God is sacrificing himself. God is true and loving. You leave out the all Holy and all Just part. To leave out the Holy and Just part is to create your own God (idolatry).
God is Love. 1 John 1:9 ESV
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
God also Just
Isaiah 13:11 ESV
I will punish the world for its evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; I will put an end to the pomp of the arrogant, and lay low the pompous pride of the ruthless.
So you must follow the leaders when it comes to garments but if you ignore the leaders when it comes to working and being a stay at home mom. You are elevated to leadership and praised
Julie Hanks rocks!
I’m out of the church, but I have family including grandchildren who are still in. Thank you, Julie for being a voice for the doctrine of personal authority!
Every missionary relies on people using their personal authority to defy their previous belief systems in order to choose to join the church. The church is always fine with personal authority when it goes their direction so they’re just going to have to accept that personal authority is what the war in heaven was about, and that God insisted upon personal authority!
I adore Dr Hanks. It is so comforting to see that my active mom follows her.
And thanks for the music of my youth too!
You are my heroine! I saw you perform at Ricks College many moons ago, and I loved, loved, loved Saturday's Warrior when I was younger! Now you speak to my soul. You are a balm in Gilead to all of us who have been hurt by the oversimplification of our relationship with Jesus Christ through the church institution. Thank you for everything you've said that has given a voice to millions of LDS women across the globe!!
Thank you, Julie dear. We have been waiting patiently for one such as you to reappear!
Jacob is also only about the Brethren’s authority when they agree with his opinions too-entirely special pleading. He’s one of the easiest to highlight examples of how people build their deity in their image, not the other way around.
Bingo
I asked one of Jacob's siblings If because he was the only sibling standing in his family that is still an active Mormon that he may be showing a Nephi complex, trying to prove to someone, maybe himself or his parents, that he is trying to make up for his sibling's Mormon short comings. The sibling indicated that my observation may be a Possibility. It is interesting, Julie, that Jacob reported you to the Church. I remember thinking after experiencing his first podcast that he was skating on thin ice and could easily embarrass his LDS leadership enough that his membership could be on the line. Jacob seems to act as if he is more Mormon than the prophet and smarter than the other leading brethren. As a retired professor, I have learned be be wary around college professors and students that show such tendencies in academia.
Jacob's parents and other family are in the same ward and stake as my family. He definitely has a complex. His parents are both politicians and are John Birch rightwingers, the Jacob apple fell straight down from the tree. He went to an expensive porochial school, and is entitled and has no self awareness.
@@joshua.snyder Josh, I appreciate your comments. I watched Jacob debate Trent Horn(?) and felt him trying to be Kind to Trent, but it appeared to me that his kindness and positive comments were a bit condescending. I am not a mental health professional, but I must confess that I sleep with one. May the blessing of Thor, Zeus, and Hera be with you, my Boy!!!
Free agency is greatly misunderstood in the church, partly because of unfounded talks such as Bednar’s talk on what he calls “ Moral agency” I saw that on my mission where the Mission President would tell us to stick to the rules and many missionaries would cut short teaching a discussion just because it would pass the time to be home, I had instances where the spirit led me to help a poor family buying milk and bread to a very poor family and the next day get a call from the mission President telling me that what I did was wrong and against the mission rules, my companion reported it to the mission President and he didn’t like it. If I were to follow all the leaders say I would never know who Christ really is. The church does not care about our salvation, they care about compliance. Heaven forbid you serve God outside the church, or donate tithes to directly to the poor. That’s the insanity that goes on inside the church.
The scripture says "The Kingdom of God is within us." We need to trust our inner voice. Indeed we don't need a middle-man to communicate with God for us. We have a direct line to our creator.
Loved this episode! Some of my tbm family follow Julie and I know it’s helping with black and white thinking!
Thanks Julie for helping people live Mormonism in healthier way! And thank you for sharing that it isn’t right for everyone!
Never heard of your guest but I really liked her. She seemed so….sensible.
When I joined the church in 1974, my bishop adamantly advised me that I would lose my temple recommend if I worked outside the home. Maybe this advice varies with different bishops, but this guidance was enforced for me by imposing fear of losing my eternal blessings.
Watching this the day after… The problem with the church doctrine is they want us to recognize that we’re broken and that we need a savior. What Julie is saying and what we have learned as ex-Mormons is that we are not broken and we don’t need a savior.We are simply human beings. So yeah, we have a big disconnect with what Jacob is trying to say and what the church has put forth as doctrine.
When I started to listen to my personal authority I literally reclaimed my life and my mental health.
I also realised that the external authority (the patriarchy) had very little to say that was of value to me).
@@debbieshrubb1222 Spring boarding from your excellent comment: TBMs get the personal authority thing wrong, and in all fairness I don’t know that stating it in terms of “claiming personal authority” is all that helpful, as if flies directly in the face of their value of obedience. Much more effective, IMO to illustrate the dead end in TBM logic. In this case, what’s happening is that a member who follows their conscience in opposition to a prophetic utterance is following that same inner voice that is said to be the basis of a testimony in the first place. The Church is playing with fire in trying to draw a distinction between those.
@@aBrewster29 I find it fairly fruitless to engage in discussions with religious affiliates; rather I talk about my experience.
They can make of it what they may as I would have when I was in the thrall of LDS Mormonism.
Very interesting. Thank you.
I was one of the commenters on instagram on the Camille Johnson quote. I still feel very angry about it. That was a slap in the face. The most painful thing about it was the smack down by regularTBM women who participated in the gaslighting.
I watch and appreciate you guys. In fact, I love RFM. My view continues to intensify, particularly listening to the general direction of your program. When people are encouraged to step away from Mormonism, to embrace the mind (self) centered religion of secularism. These pilgrims are moving away from the fire of the frying pan, into the furnace itself
Only Jacob Mormons right. It's his whole schtick. He sprinkles in some macho style "defend your faith" stuff that he interprets not as personal faith, but more of a Deznut faith defense. I love everytime he opens his mouth and exposes how toxic Mormonism can be under the hood.
Based on my admittedly anecdotal observation, the recent garment crackdown has largely been ignored by millennials and younger . A lot of Gen-Xers are ignoring it too.
And boomers, too 😂
Thanks!
Interestingly over the last few years I had two different priesthood blessings in which BOTH said I should pray to Heavenly Mother.
Jacob is such an 🫏
Is the donkey the property of someone’s horse?
💙💙💙💙💙
Jacob's letter to the stake president is obsequious.
I'd like to ask Jacob Hansen if there is anything his church told him to do that would be too much.
He has stated several occasions that if the Church ever accepts gay marriage he will leave.
TheSandyStone please be considerate of others watching and listening to the show. Thank you!
Achoo Acchoo Achooo !
May I please have a tissue ?
There is no one-way to be
a great LDS Woman 💎
This guy is a cult all on his own!! He is like a aheep who thinks hes the only one who knows it all. Ugh.
He is an ass clown.
I'm one of those women who thought being a wife, mother and homemaker was the most important work I could ever do. I am one of the best and brightest who chose to grow through those rolls and wouldn't change a thing.
Why reject Biblical truth?
We are commanded to test any teacher or "prophet" to see if it conflicts with previous revelation. The bible tells us to watch out for false teachers and examine the scripture just like the Bereans did to see if what the Apostle Paul was teaching was truth.
For such people are false apostles, deceitful workers, masquerading as apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. 15 It is not surprising, then, if his servants also masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve. 2 Corinthians 11:13-15
Acts 17:11
Now the Berean Jews were of more noble character than those in Thessalonica, for they received the message with great eagerness and EXAMINED the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true.
Test Joseph Smith AGAINST the words of God Jesus affirmed.
Luke 24:44 He said to them, “This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms.”
"Before me NO god was formed, nor shall there be ANY after me.” (Isaiah 43:10)
If Mormonism is true, then God could not make this claim, for he was just a man at one point; nor could he claim that no gods would come after him, for that is the goal of J.S. and LDS members. Isaiah 44:6 says, "I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is NO God." & "Is there any God besides me?.. I know not one". God is saying there is NOT an infinite amount of Gods, and there is none like Him.
LDS teaches that there is. He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did" (King Follett Sermon) Either the BIBLE or LDS is FALSE.
Jesus said ALL scripture will NOT fade away but "MANY WOLVES in sheep's clothing" will come trying to ADD to the word. Mathew 7:15 Joseph Smith changed Jesus, the Father and added you can become a GOD.
It hurts my heart to see Mormons fall for Satan's lie that we can become God when there is only one eternal biblical God.
God gave us critical thinking & logical reasoning for a reason, he tells us to EXAMINE and TEST what we are being taught for TRUTH. The bible withstands the truth test. Joseph Smith's version FAILS the truth test. It's your eternity, study it for yourself. God bless.
LDS FALSE Apostle: "The law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." Brigham Young Journal of Discourses, Vol. 10, p. 110
"The only men who become Gods, even the sons of Gods are those that enter into polygamy." (Brigham Young) Journal of Discourses 11 p.269
God Bless.
Good for you and you must be one of the fortunate women who has a husband who is prosperous enough to support you and your children.
Ok. And...so? You did what you wanted. All women deserve to live the life THEY want. Whatever that looks like.
. He became prosperous because he could concentrate on his trade while I took care of most things like childcare, finances, making appointments and attending our children's activities and school meetings that occurred during the day. We both worked very hard. It wasn't a wealthy life but it was a good life.
Of course. For me being a full time at home mom was perfect. My mother was a fulltime homemaker as we're both my grandmother's. I adored all of them and wanted to be like them. At one point I did daycare in my home. We have to start esteeming at home moms. They are doing a tough job that is so important to our society.
Our fairly new Bishop- who recently moved here to Pa from Utah- does something I find strange. Whenever he calls someone to a RS position he does not do it from the pulpit as had always been done in the past- instead he comes into the RS room to announce the calling and ask for a sustaining vote. I find that degrading - as if it’s not a real calling.
That’s not just your bishop. It’s a thing now.
@@yeshalloweenis this true ? More info.
Regarding time stamp around 53:30-- the church may verbally "get it right" by encouraging close family relationships. But the church's doctrine does not model how to do it. The church takes time and money away from families, and does not truly, expertly promote strong families. Maybe a few privileged families got lucky in the church.
But the church teaches favoritism, exclusion, not inviting family to weddings and events, keeping secrets, shame, competition and bad family time management-- so many toxic family behaviors!
An organization or corporation does not "get it right" just by proclaiming something. The church boasts a lot of things like charity and family, that they fail demonstrably at-- compared to other healthier organizations.
What!!! Jacob Hanson only has 2 children!! Tut! Tut!! (What happened to multiple and replenish the earth?!)
Perhaps he is unable to convince his wife of that proposition.
@@Geoplanetjane I wondered how his wife copes?
He has 4 kids
Bednar sounds more and more like Hitler.
Please Don’t demean Hitler..
Bednar is a (re)tard. He needs to disappear...
Yup
Bednar gives me so much ick! 🤢
But I can't get over your tattle tale letter writing campaign against Dr. Hanks. Um. Hey there is life beyond 2nd grade.
For sure
When we all stand before God, to be perfectly judged...this one thing we all will be aware of...we will be standing there with total understanding that everything we are standing there with, will have to do with our own choices
Absolute free agency will be subject to His judgement....
I wonder how therapists at LDS family services keep their code of ethics while remaining in the church's pocket.
I think their talking about every choice has a consequence, your free to choose good or evil
I just realized that Julie Hanks is the granddaughter of Alyce King of the "King Sisters!" Perhaps Dr Hanks can refer Jacob to some kind of mental therapy! lol
Sometimes I want to be on these shows to help channel the thinking of someone like Jacob. Not that I agree with him, only that I know his kind of thinking well because I was taught it and controlled by it for a long time.
For example: agency is still a thing. You can choose to act in accordance to God's will and commandments, or not. You have the power in the end to choose and act how you will. You just have to also accept the consequences for those choices and behaviors.
Jacob's letter to her Stake Pres is interesting. He states his bonafide as a High Priest, but closes mentioning he's not a "judge in Israel", showing he understands he's not in a bishopric or stake presidency calling that can actually judge her on behalf of the church. The church did away with High Priests some years ago, UNLESS you are in a Bishopric or higher leadership position, at the end of which, you are not a high priest anymore - I was actually in a bishopric when this change happened. They didn't actually strip all the old timers of their high priest title, but they stripped the authority of it and confined its use. So his opening High Priest bonafide is hollow, but he still flashes it like a sheriff's badge.
I completely agree that Julie saying we should be our own authorities is obviously the healthy thing to do. But, in Mormonism, it's always been that we dont *really* get to choose what we want. I was taught that free agency allows us to choose: A. God's way ( which means whatever the leaders say), or
B. Satan's way. Our choice was good vs. evil; and strict obedience to the leaders was the only way to earn celestial glory. So, to say that the leaders are changing what they are saying now doesn't ring true to me. They are doubling down on what I've always heard.
41:30 I bet that made Jacob so sour! 😆
We are autonomous beings making our own decisions regarding how we choose to worship while believing Christ and His gospel and church teach truths that make our lives better so we prayerfully follow the same doctrines and prophetic teachings Christ taught in His church when He was upon the earth while prayerfully CHOOSING to believe interpretation our prophets give. It’s that simple.
Julie says she's neutral about people's choices and doesn't tell them what to do - but she does it all the time! She's always telling people what to do and think; it's in almost every quote of herself that she posts. She's just claiming it is common sense and has to do with mental health, and she's able to say these things because she has expertise. Well, the General Authorities have expertise in spiritual health. Julie might feel that their counsel interferes with mental health, but they would say her counsel interferes with spiritual health. It all depends on whom we want to trust and consider most reliable.
Where to even begin with your comment... I'm going to a counselor who is working to undo the significant damage an lds counselor (freshly graduated from the BYU program and working for church services) did to me and my family. Even my bishop at the time was baffled by the things he said. I now know it was unethical, and he could have been barred from practicing. So again, where to begin with your comment? You have NO idea what you are talking about and how ridiculous you sound.
@@robinann922 Your comment has NOTHING to do with what I said.
It absolutely does, but you just keep on doing you. I 'm not here to fight with you. I had very genuine reasons to leave. I was not "offended" as so many members like to say 😆 but, your ignorant words and your attitude are another testament to me that I was right to leave. And to tell you the truth, no matter what you think or say, I testify to you, since I left "the church" I have never been as mentally healthy and close to my Savior as I am now.. And I know He cheers me on in my journey. Enough said. Peace ✌️
Oooooh. 33:13 Jacob conflates harm with a lack of comfort.
People expect to be pushed beyond their current state. Hurting people violates the fruits doctrine, whereby people are under a scriptural mandate to evaluate teachings by their intrinsic goodness. Jacob simply views the bad fruits as acceptable collateral damage to his dogmatic views. Orthodoxy is often lacking in empathy.
Yes, obedience matters…but obedience to what?
How do you define “hurting people”?
@@imawordgirl First of all, I love that question given your screen name. I’m no Webster or Oxford, but here’s a stab at it: an incursion into one’s wellbeing.
For the most part I think people can identify pretty straightforwardly when they are experiencing harm. I find the looming question is purpose. It hurts like hell to reset a broken bone, but it’s needed for healing. The initial break hurt as well, but without net benefit.
Within a church context I see a lot of instances where benefit is presupposed-ideas and actions are considered good merely because they come from the Church. And if we experience harm in that, well, it must be a failing on our part or just something we are to endure. That’s actually putting the cart before the horse scripturally.
Julie spoke of the depression and suicide she sees in professional practice. Again, we’re contrasting harm against discomfort. It’s uncomfortable to admit you made a mistake, but I don’t think you can describe that in terms of experiencing harm. It’s uncomfortable to open your mind to other opinions and views. But it’s not harm.
@@aBrewster29 Thanks for your thoughtful reply. Your definition of harm includes another subjective term: “well-being.” It sounds like you are linking that with an absence of depression and suicidality. And you reference Julie seeing such symptoms in her clients. Please keep in mind that Julie attracts many clients who are disaffected to some degree with the Church. Her observations are an interesting data point, but without context, they aren’t necessarily representative of anything but her own clients.
Are you familiar with the repressed memory scandal in the 90s and the role that therapists played in that? They created or exacerbated symptoms in their clients as they assumed that most of their clients’ problems were caused by repressed memories of sexual abuse. Most of them were probably well-meaning, but their work ended up ruining lives and families. Could some therapists like Julie actually be creating or reinforcing problems in their clients with their continual messaging that the Church causes harm?
I don’t doubt some people experience difficulties that have a connection to the Church. But causes of such problems are often complex. You’re right that it’s not helpful to presuppose benefit, but it’s also not helpful to presuppose harm. And there is actually good research showing that members of the Church have better mental health overall than others.
@@imawordgirl I wholeheartedly agree with the complexity, which is why I added that individuals can typically sort that out for themselves over time. To that end, I see it as problematic that the Church does not give people room to do that in many, many cases. Hence my reaction to Jacob’s conflation of discomfort and harm.
Jacob. World outside of Mormon bubble. Call Home.
SorryTo ask, but you guys seem to assume we all know….. what the heck is Deznat or Desnat????????
It's short for Deseret Nation. They use the hashtag #deznat when the post arrogant, critical, condescending, cruel, Mormon apologetic comments on the Internet.
Deseret nationals- they believe we need to return to the theocracy of BY's Utah territory, including the violence, bigotry, and misogyny. I see them as adjacent to the preppers and white power movements
I don’t think DezNat is really a thing anymore.
Why didn’t you invite me on to have this conversation with Julie? You have my contact info.
Guess you would rather talk about me than with me?
Also Julie why don’t you come talk to me. I have invited you on my show multiple times.
Please, Jacob. Don’t force Julie to get a restraining order.
I can't believe Jacob went to Hank's Bishop n Stake Prez and told on her! LOL
Jacob,
The Duggars and many others have had alot of success showing their so called boring lives. People long to see the importance of family life on tv and social media.
Does Jacob have any older children that have left? That need extra love and care? Julie does and so do I. He likely wouldn’t be so black n white I’m guessing if he did….idk. I just can’t with it.
how about using a computer instead of the iphone? you know the machines made for the tasks you're planning. 🤔
So - when a parent says "You must go to school until you have a college degree", are they being unjust on their children (the church is unjust and hot healthy) ? Or are they being consistent and healthy in most cases, whereas the church is hypocritical?
As I type this you are saying that it is important to mental health to feel "in control of your life" . . . this argument has holes from normal parenting.
Maybe I need to watch the full show ?
💙💙💙💙💙