How Disney Worlds Contribute to the Kingdom Hearts Story (or don’t)
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- čas přidán 20. 08. 2021
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Thumbnail by Kinode!
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Music used (in order):
"The Secret Whispers" from Kingdom Hearts Birth by Sleep (2010)
"Floating in Bliss" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"Shipmeisters' Humoresque" from Kingdom Hearts (2002)
"The Little Chef" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"Olympus Coliseum" from Kingdom Hearts (2002)
"A Day in Agrabah" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"The Escapade" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"Monochrome Dreams" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"The Underworld" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"Winnie the Pooh" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"Hero's Gathering" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"Welcome to Wonderland" from Kingdom Hearts (2002)
"Deep Jungle" from Kingdom Hearts (2002)
"Waltz of the Damned" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"Shipmeisters' Shanty" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"Happy Hair Day" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"A Pirate's Freedom" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"Monstropolis Now" from Kingdom Hearts III (2019)
"A Very Small Wish" from Kingdom Hearts (2002)
"Space Paranoids" from Kingdom Hearts II (2005)
"Destiny Islands" from Kingdom Hearts (2002) - Hry
To Xaldin's credit, Beast has quite a powerful heart. He literally willed himself into Hollow Bastion just out of love for Belle. Beast's example even inspired Sora to keep going. That would be a very powerful Heartless and Nobody. Don't get me wrong, I agree on the point about tunnel vision, but it's not like it's a terrible plan.
Exactly this.
I remember a scrapped KH1 idea about all the Princes/PartyMembers from the worlds teaming up with Sora at Hollow Bastion, instead of only The Beast. I feel like if they had went through with that narrative, a lot more of KH2's plot would be the Org being interested in turning these strong hearts into vessels.
@@Jyukenmaster95 If they had done that, they could've even made it work by having Sora use a modified form of his usual summon magic.
God Christ Jesus bless you all and have a wonderful day my family!
love u all
@@shaun7002 You know that meme about the bird that levitates through sheer force of anger? Imagine that. That's how the Beast got there.
Xaldin getting elbowed by belle who then Steals the rose from him and fuckin runs is the greatest thing a Disney world did in kh2
Did you forget about Woody calling out young xehanort
@@kingdomjayson K. H. 2.
@@kingdomjayson you may want to recheck your numbers there.
@@kingdomjayson
Sully doing what the bbs trio couldn't do to vanitas in kh3
@@raikoedgymoto yeetas vanitas!
*Vexen, looking down on the Pirates crew from above:* Oh. Oh god, that's like a literal, beating heart. Gross, ew, no! I thought you were using the cosmic by-word for soul, but you- Uggghh, I'm going home!
And Soul is also a real thing in the series too.
So is a world based on that movie could have the main threat wanting to use 23 as their new target because of 'emptiness'? That'll be pretty interesting.
That is correct, it is implied that the heart that is the essence of a person and the heart that is the organ of an organism are two different entities in KH universe
Meanwhile Luxord on the deck: I smell mind games
@@masterseal0418 *Xemnas voice* A person is made of body, heart and soul. A Heartless is a heart filled with darkness. A Nobody is a body with no heart, but still a will to live. What does that make you, Twenty-three, for you are a soul with no heart or body? Emptier than any Nobody, unable to be swayed by your heart, and yet full of potential.
I think an important thing in disney worlds is the main characters developing, not just plot itself. The early original worlds are where characters are established, the middle event and end showcases how much they've grown, and all the disney stuff should be leading to that. "My friends are my power" doesn't mean anything if you didn't see and play Sora, Donald, and Goofy growing as friends with their bond becoming stronger throughout the game.
Exactly this
THIS!!
hell yeah! honestly one of my favorite moments in the series is when sora is so pumped to meet santa, and says that riku told him that santa wasnt real once when they were kids. its such a little moment, but it adds so much humanity.
less of a character growth and more of just a character building thing, but i also love all the pirates worlds because sora is just so excited every time to Be A Pirate. (i love them for that and also because watching final fantasy characters interact with Photorealistic Johnny Depp is objectively entertaining.)
Unfortunately you could literally have them do that in any place or world of your own imagination. I think your comment highlights even more how useless Disney worlds are because they have a function that's easily replaceable: Sora and friends don't grow because of the Disney worlds stories they do it *regardless* of them
Probably why Terra’s campaign in BBS is one of my favorites; I think his struggle to accept his inner darkness and to define himself as a hero gets affected by each world he travels to.
Ooh, Deep Jungle has one other aspect that you didn't mention here that I always thought was so cool, and that's how the Heartless aren't there when you first arrive. Rather, you watch Clayton's progression towards evil in his interactions with the gorillas, creating a darkness that eventually lures the Heartless to that world. It's a really cool look at how the Heartless moved about in the context of the first game and how they initially entered new worlds. There's even that scene after where the other Disney villains discuss what happened in the jungle.
I think one of Deep Jungle's strongest parts was its ending before closing keyhole. Tarzan makes very simplimistic connection about having heart and having friends. It is strangely fitting to hear from primitive man and kinda gives "heart" its most definitive function and reason to exist. It is a bit waste that Nobody-concept only seemed to raise the issue being lack of emotions when the unability to be regarded or seen as existing being would have been stronger.
@@Yurikon3 I know it's a late reply, but...
To be fair, the way that a Nobody gains/grows a new heart is through experiences and connections to other people. They can't grow a heart in isolation or cut off from other people, they can only grow one by forging bonds, with friendship obviously being one of the strongest/most reliable (Roxas/Xion/Axel as the greatest example after all).
It's a chicken and egg scenario, where the question is do hearts forge bonds or do bonds create hearts, and the answer is fittingly yes since they are so interdependent.
@@gunnarschlichting9886 Yes, it is understandable function. I just personally think that it still somewhat waters down "fantasy-like" concept. It eventually makes the whole concept of heart kinda nothing-burger thing which doesn't really mean anything special anymore.
It comes down to preference. I personally think that Nobodies being unable to grow heart, no matter what, could have served some sort of "what if" situation where some unlucky fellas try to grasp what it means to be existing being, still unable to gain it. It could be tragic but perhaps make the whole concept of Nobody hit emotions bit harder. Right now the whole Nobody thing seems to be more along the lines of introverts trying to hold chit chats. Nice story but not really that special in fantasy situation.
Like, you experience things but those experiences do not linger on you cause you don't have "heart"/self to contain those experiences. Or you cannot remember something or be remembered cause those memories do not have anchor point. I admit that is a bit mechanical but it could have created some interesting situations.
@@Yurikon3 You're not wrong, it could've been a really interesting idea to explore. It just ended up being incompatible with the ideas and themes of KH as a series going forwards (bonds between people being the greatest source of strength/meaning, being able to forge a bond with anyone as long as you reach out, even if you are physically alone that doesn't mean those bonds don't still matter/exist, etc.).
KH definitely ends up falling on the softer side of world building, where there aren't that many hard and fast rules, and stuff is bent or broken all the time anyway. A similar idea in a different series would be able to make great use of the concept though, and it is a really interesting (if inherently tragic) one.
@@gunnarschlichting9886 Yeah, soft world building is one reason I can't really get that excited on the story that much. When new "revelation" is given it doesn't really have that big impact cause there wasn't any solid truth to hold before it. In that sense having at least one or two solid truths could have give some story-beats more impact.
I still think those themes could have existed and perhaps had more impact with those limitations. Sora being willing to go even against the solid truth to give Roxas agency or being willing to compromise his existence or split his heart so Roxas could exist. Right now this heart-connection thing just feels bit too cheap and handwavy when it comes down to relations between people.
Fun Fact: Riku can kill you for whatever reason in Land of Dragons. There are many other fights in the game that you allow you to die and still progress but apparently Riku is an active threat to Sora in that little instance.
Plot Twist!
I always found that odd. Riku was good by that point and only fighting to hide himself. There’s no way he would kill Sora 😂
@@Gamelover254 maybe he knocked sora out, but there was too many heartless to deal with around them?
love the concept of that fight very grey
Maybe it was just programmed wrong
I'm only 21 minutes in, but I just want to say I appreciate how high you put Kh1 atlantica. A lot of people think it doesn't matter because "you can just skip it and complete the game", but I always thought that scene with king triton destroying the crystal was sooooo important.
and then they ruined it with KH2 and the world being reset into MAJOR Disney movie replay.
And Triton thought Sora's Kingdom Key "shatters peace and brings ruin". It meant he knew about the x-blade.
@Declan McKenna
Ahh the theory that Hercules and Ariel are distant cousins right?
Storywise its decent. But your missing the point why nobody likes Atlantica. Because of its garbage swimming controls
@@cloudshines812 are they even really that bad? I feel like people value traditional control schemes over more functional control schemes. Using the right stick in KH3 underwater was kinda awful. Personally, it was easier for me to remember dodge to go down and jump to go up - unaltered extensions of the base control scheme, just with new context, and in closer proximity to your attack button.
Out of all the worlds in KH2, I think Port Royal had the most untapped potential for this category. The cursed pirates are the perfect parallel to Organization 13 as a whole, a group of people who just want to feel again and will do anything to get that, no matter the cost. I think all this world needed was for Luxord to make that connection himself and have his goal be related to it somehow.
I do think that is the weirdest part of KH2, a lot of the worlds we visit have themes that tie in heavily to the overall Story, but it's rarely actually brought up. I feel like it's just unfortunate missed potential.
Thankfully kh3 made luxord feel a part of the world
“Look at this lot. Aren’t they just beat. Wouldn’t you think our hearts are complete. Wouldn’t you think I’m the man. The man with a hand in every chance. I’ve got heartless and nobodies by me. I’ve got Xaldin’s and Xigbar’s in line. You want games of chance? I’ve got *Plenty*. But who cares? No big deal. I’ll take moreeeeee.”
Darn. I still haven’t mastered the format changes
I might be giving the writers too much grace, but as a newcomer to the series, I figured that if the parallel was apparent enough for me to easily make the connection, I didn't necessarily need anyone in-game to state the world's purpose into text, for its impact to be felt. Sick Operation: Mindcrime profile picture, by the way.
I still find it amazing how Pixar themselves directly helped with the development team to create the worlds for Toy Story and Monsters Inc and it really shows. Like they're not just retellings but actual expansions of the original source material and I wish we could have gotten more worlds in that same vein.
Having the Pixar worlds be told as original stories over the retelling of the movie is the only restriction/change I enjoyed for _Kingdom Hearts III_ cause it takes existing Pixar characters and create a brand new story exclusive to KH (a prequel, sequel, interquel) without creating an alternate version of the film with KH elements and Sora, Donald, and Goofy shoehorned into the plot having them feel out of place. I like that change and I can imagine how other Pixar films like The Incredibles, Coco, Inside Out, Soul and Onward would look like once they have their own worlds in a future KH game.
Pixar is best know for their storytelling which is why the majority of their films (aside from Cars 1-3, Brave, The Good Dinosaur) received critical acclaim and I appreciate the work they've done as an animation studio, on top of that they were the ones who requested to Nomura and Square Enix for the Toy Story and Monster's Inc. worlds to be original stories over a retelling for KH3.
“We are going to be talking about one of the biggest Kingdom Hearts f-words”
Me: Finny Fun?
The word so dangerous it couldn't be listed
Riku Replika upon hearing "finny fun"
"NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!"
After hearing "Finny fun":
Axel: "I'M SO FLATTERED!"
F-dance f-water f-dance?
@@raynathomason1030 LOL
Something else I noticed about Corona. I got a bit of a feeling of nostalgia from it due to its theme of 'exploration'. Sora is literally sharing all the wonders of the world with Rapunzel, like he once enjoyed after leaving Traverse Town and started exploring otherworlds. Nothing explicit in the text but I felt it was trying to recapture that feeling by have Sora pass it on to someone else. Kinda like KH1 Ariel was a mirror for Riku, I feel Rapunzel was a mirror to how Sora used to be. Or I might be reading to much into it lol!
Don't worry, Sora relates his experiences with Rapunzel's when he says he knows how she feels (12:45 in this cutscene comp czcams.com/video/AciRG1Iovcw/video.html).
I felt the same way, recapturing that childhood wonder in the middle of becoming an adult hit me strong in corona, just as san fransokyo was sora taking the phil role of training a generation of young heroes, and showing them what a "true hero" looks like. And corona really pushing his wonder to rapunzel worked really well on the theme of past vs present, where in kh1 he loved just exploring the new worlds, where in 3 its mainly about the mission
Sora Donald and Goofy had zero impact in Corona, they were literally copy and pasted into movie scenes, where you could just see those scenes again wtihout them and it wouldn't change anything. So how is Rapunzel a reflection of Sora??? LOL. There was no contribution other than Sora being a cardboard cutout.
In the novel Sora compares Rapunzel to Riku.
Kairi still doesn’t know the pain of Through the Fire and the Flames on expert mode
I definitely feel like kingdom hearts wouldn’t be the same without the Disney worlds you visit while going about sora’s journey. There is just something amazing when you see all the iconic Disney characters and locations that you grew up with within the game. Also hands down monstopolis was the best world in kh3, I loved it (with the pirates world as my second fave due to its very open and exploratory nature).
Also thank you so much for putting my platinum presto sculpture in at the end!!!
I agree.....however since we’ve been introduced to new charcters as well as new worlds and this Unreality universe. It would be nice to see something new rather then. The same old Disney worlds. An we can always go back an enjoy them from playing the games again. But for mabe KH4 or the next KH game it would be nice to focus *strictly* on the story an explore NEW worlds. Like Scala Ad Caelum or Quadratum. Like I’m fine with having Disney worlds within the same reality as the one we know.
But now that we are entering UNREALITY, hopefully we get all new stuff, characters an worlds and plots. Also in KH3 Sora going on some worlds were pointless... spend most of the game trying to achieve the power of waking then come to find out, he had it in him along. So it’s like what was the purpose to travelling some of the worlds. I get it, its for us to have fun playing but...some of them not all served no purpose in the overall story.
So I think if the next game had NO disney worlds I, sure the franchise would survive.
Monstropolis is probably the best Disney world out of every game
I thought it’d be cool that because Sora is in a new reality you could revisit some of the Disney worlds but they could be all new stories (like not movie related) kind of like an alternate universe scenario. Then they could get tell all new stories that could tie into the game even better. Though I know that won’t happen since Disney is very particular about many of there franchises. I am also enslaved to the franchise so I’ll totally get the game regardless of the amount of Disney within the game :)
@@TheKira708 idk man you just can’t have kingdom hearts without Disney, is like Kirby without dark matter/or something related to it, possible but very difficult without that perk
@@ballownfist3497 Not really though....as I said every KH game up to this point. Has Disney worlds *anyway* so it wouldn’t hurt at all if we got a game with no Disney worlds or characters. I mean hell....to please fans who want Disney worlds they could give us ONE world that is Disney. An the rest New or FF worlds or character’s. in KH3 a lot of fans myself included wasn’t too please that there were NO FF character’s, an yeah I know....when Remind came out we got to see Leon an Aerith an them etc. 😑 but nothin too exciting like fighting alongside them or against them. Like in KH1 an 2. So hopefully in the next game we get to explore new worlds again such as Scala and Unreality worlds that may include FF worlds and more characters.
I think Olympus from KH1 is fondly remembered because it fits well as a "breather" and not a filler world. You can take on it at your own pace and the visits are usually short and sweet, with the developments for Sora's character feeling earned
Its a filler world definetly, its where they slapped the arena mechanic.
I always thought Beasts inclusion in KH1 was unique among the Disney cast because he's the only one to appear in a world that wasn't his own movie world (excluding the Disney Castle characters like Donald and Goofy obviously). Seeing Beast actually involved with a fight against Maleficent, a villain from a completely different movie, was incredibly cool to see.
I really wished they did more world mashing up in later games. Like imagine travelling to worlds and finding them mashing together in pairs before eventually the final world has every single world exclusive party member suddenly available for the final battle to help out. Especially when KH3 actually had the characters talk to one another often when just travelling the world. How cool would it be to see some of the Disney characters from other worlds meeting each other? Like Jack Skelington admiring Sully's scary monstrous appearance because to him scary is actually exciting and fun. Or imagine Peter Pan making a passing comment about not trusting Jack Sparrow for being a pirate because of Hook like
Sparrow: You seem a little on edge. Never fought alongside a man of the sea before?
Pan: I'll help out if your a friend of Sora's but I still don't trust a codfish pirate like you.
Sparrow: I wise decision lad...
I can hear it in my head and this would have been fantastic
Baymax: You seem to be suffering from shock brought on by temperature. Would you like a warm beverage?
Aladdin: Ah, thanks! I'm too used to the heat of the desert, I guess.
Simba: Hey, you seem a bit on edge, Herc.
Hercules: Hmm? Oh, uh... I just, uhhh... Don't wanna talk about it...
Simba: If this is about great uncle Nema, don't fret. Dad exiled him for a reason
I feel the same way about Disney Infinity, funnily enough 4.0 was supposed have this big connected story between all the different properties, that would have been sick to see. The closest thing we got in 3.0 was that Disney Karting/Toybox thing.
@Austin Rocha Tron talking to Hiro and Baymax would be kinda cool too.
That would actually make revisiting old worlds fresh again
I have always adored the way Tron was used in KH2 and felt that it went unappreciated, so I’m quite happy that you recognize it as the Master Class example of story integration.
Agreed. I rewatched Tron recently and it was fantastic - KH2 really nailed the melding of the movie plot with the game plot(albeit less of the movie, but that is good in this case!) and it shines through.
obsessed with how the music matches the point you're talking about like 90% of the time god
Pat, I think the reason Xaldin was so gung ho about the Beast losing his heart was less for the Heartless and moreso for the Nobody The Beast would create.
Remember, that people with iron clad wills who lose their hearts are strong enough to retain their body and memories from their past life. Essentially, just the ORG XIII members. Well...nobody has a tougher will than the Beast. He survived the destruction of his own world and traveled through Gummi Space (without ship) and arrived in Hollow Bastion to save Belle. All through sheer force of will.
Someone with a will that strong would UNDOUBTEDLY retain their form and memories and produce a high ranking Nobody. One who could join the Organization.
I'm convinced this is what Xaldin was after. Their group's ranks were already cut in half after the whole Castle Oblivion fiasco, so I have no doubt Xaldin was potentially hoping for a new ally in the Beast.
Just my theory anyway.
I somehow think that Saix had been better choice for Beast's tempter, cause he was opposite of Saix who lost his way in org.
Xaldin might have worked better in Land of Dragons.
@@Yurikon3 True, but at this point in the story, Saix is still hiding his _true nature_ about his Berserker ability. So in context, it wouldn't nake anymore sense until later on. But you can also argue Saix's single-minded goal of "carrying out the mission at all cost" leaves him uninvested in things outside of that.
@@D-Havoc I don't think there is much point for Saix hiding his true nature. I think beast's flower parallels his and Axel's original goals (a "Rose" which defines their existence) and Saix slowly losing the memory of his mission and becoming impassionate. Beast, seemingly berserk creature trying to be mellow strikes his nerve cause it reminds him of the things he had forgotten or given up. Saix could have easily been the Gaston for the beast cause he has more thematical correspodence. Saving the reveal of Saix's nature to the end does not really matter cause outside the battle mechanics it doesn't have thematic gravitas.
“Nobody has a tougher will than beast”
Terra wants to know your location
@@hunterbachelder3480 His Will did kind of Linger even after he was gone.
"My soul is already far beyond saving"
Me too, Pat. Me too. I'm in so deep that everything they'll throw at me, I'll end up playing.
When Kingdom Hearts fans like us die we’ll actually be placed in a purgatory where we have to sing “Swim this way” and 100% Recoded and the mobile games.
*Xigbar voice*
I’m already half Disney!
Yeah, I don't either way. As long as it has some keybladers doing something flashy.
That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the next KH did focus more on OC. they tend to only go all out disney on the numbered stuff, wheras stuff like Days uses it more as a backdrop and not the focus. Even Birth By Sleep with new disney worlds played the plots super safe and minimally outsdide of Olympus (the only disney world where FF characters show up).
Olympus may not have been too impactful in the moment in KH1, but it gets increasingly more important with each passing game, notably Hercules's role as a hero role model to Sora and how it influences him throughout the series, and the whole "half-pint" narrative started by Phil that came back in full force in KH3.
I wish all the worlds were like that
Ol Phil would be proud of how far Sora and co have come
Kingdom Hearts has always been, as a series, a discussion of the border between light and darkness, as well as the spectrum in between. I think that's why the Disney worlds are important. They're the light in the series. Without them, the series is all dark and edgy. I also think it's intentional. KH1 is the lightest game in tone. It also has most of it's moments being entirely light or entirely dark, with little exploration of subtlety in the spectrum between. Once the organization is introduced in KH2, it's a complex story about a group of characters who have an actual justified goal, going about it with bad methods. Similarly, the worlds have a more complex split between dark and light moments. The theme doesn't really work that well for KH3 or the non-numbered titals, but in KH3 at least the world stories flip between dark and light, along with the main story of the game.
KH1 is actually darkest one in tone. In rest of the series deeper tones are too watered down to actually have that much "dark" in them. Dark and light dichtonomy is also present in those by word only when in KH1 it actually played some thematical gravita. Organization was also bit too bland cast that their goals really didn't have that much meaning behind it. Light and dark theming hasn't really been that much on the plate after KH1, the only one who ever told about "dictatorship of light" was Xehanort but story itself didn't ever give any solid reason to consider light "dominating" power. The series is not really that good at exploring "in-between" of light and dark and mostly ends up watering down both.
KH1 once again did the mid-place exploration best by having Riku as actual proxy with human motivations rather than just some dark-entity being primary cause. After that none of the characters have really truly been on grey area and have only been on the dark due some possession or memory wipe.
@@Yurikon3Yeah no. CoM is easily the darkest game in the series if you truly think about what was done Sora, Nadine, and the Riku Replica
@@Drums_of_Liberation Technically yes, if one considers WHAT happened in there but I was mostly talking about the tone. Mobile games have children slaughtering each other but something in that game's tone makes it feel less... serious. Kinda like one of those "Worms" games.
CoM still manages to be in that line where it gives its darker elements some respect, I'll give it that.
Honestly I always kinda forget that Space Paranoids is really its own world. Just cause in both visits it is so intertwined with what is going on in Hollow Bastion in both cases, that it just feels like a part of it
This man really just said "Kingdom of COVID". 😂😂
i just want to point out showing the clip of beast while saying "kingdom hearts is a separate beast entirely"
that just cracked me up for some reason lmao
30:15 I think it makes some sense that Young Xehanort is the one appearing in Toy Box since he was like, the main antagonist of DDD and wanted to turn Sora into one of his vessels, kinda like how the toys become “vessels” for the Heartless.
and then there's woody
@@jstar3382 “My guess is no one ever loved you before. Because you know nothing about hearts and love.”
Sora's idea that 'seeing a heart is what makes it real' is actually a lesson he learne from Joshua in DDD which is a nice bit of continuity. I also love Tron in KH2 and its part of why I like Tron in DDD too. The end of Rinzler (evil Tron) was more satisfying end to his arc than the actual movie and it was a parallel to the Anti Aqua in KH3. Sora even learned to not hesitate to fight the darkness out of his friends again from Quorra when he hesitated to fight Tron. And it ends with Rinzler reaching for Sora's hands in almost the exact same composition as Aqua and Sora in the fragmentary passage opening and KH3. Then there was the actual callbacks to KH2.
Yet, Tron’s scenes are more effective than any of Aqua’s scenes
I think the second visit to the Land of Dragons has two nice little details that I quite like.
First one is when SDG mention the Organisation, Mulan responds with a "What is that?" Makes her feel like a living person who is allowed to have curiosities outside of her own world. Her also being the one to yell "wait" to Xigbar is pretty nice.
The second one being that The Emperor hypothesises the Storm Rider's identity as one of China's dragons being turned into a heartless. I think it's nifty because it shows him having a bit more wisdom than the average inhabitant of a Disney world, along with giving the Storm Rider a sense of identity beyond "we need a boss for this world."
My favorite part is that they make Heartless out of powerful beings like the dragon in order to create Nobodies, and later on you see a Nobody dragon in the Xemnas fight.
I guess this as good as a place as any to talk about how I think Wonderland was the perfect first Disney world for Sora to visit. If you think about this is the tutorial for how to handle the world order for Sora, and what better world to do that then with a property about a child trying to understand the new world she has stumbled across. It feels like Sora actually takes on the Alice role and uses this knowledge for his etiquette in other worlds, being if someone is in trouble world order be damned, but play by the world's rules otherwise. And it is hinted that Alice is from another world than Wonderland, so the idea of world travel besides gummi ship or destruction of prior world is first hinted at, if small. However, since the video discussed how these minor things held more weight in 2002, i thought i'd mention it.
I really loved when Bell just gut checks Xaldin and she's just booking it with a huge ass grin on her face, affirming that Beauty and the Beast is one of my Favorite Disney movies, no question!
Beast is also awesome in the games. Dude tore his way through dimensions to save Belle after she was taken from him
"Kingdom Hearts is a separate beast entirely." [Shows Beast]
[Positions Xigbar and Xaldin images so Xaldin's lance goes through Xigbar] "Ow."
13:15 Actually, you might notice that Riku is actually fighting the Heartless. He isn't directly attacking Sora. Sora only gets in the way of his attacks while fighting him.
I would like for more worlds in the future to have their lore tie in with the lore of the greater World, like King Triton knowing about the Keyblade War. Instead, however, later games act as though each world is its own separate dimension that sometimes have their own distinct laws of magic and nature (Port Royal KH2, for example). The only world in KH3 to properly tease this was Monsters Inc., when Sulley says that Boo is from another world (oddly, Sora doesn't immediately drop the "world order" pretenses) and when Sulley yeets Vanitas into Arendelle, that banishment door into Corona, and that banishment door into San Fransokyo. Was Mother Gothel around during the original Keyblade War? Were Lord Demanitus and the Master of Masters contemporaries? Do the spirits in Northuldra have some special significance with the worlds' magic? Will we see former Traverse Town refugees and will they address the events surrounding KH1? Are Alice, Wendy, and Jane from the same world? Where do the airplanes mentioned in that San Fransokyo news article go to?
Good friggin' catch on the Monsters Inc. thing. Neither I nor the main characters noticed that that world had better inter-world travel than they did.
I would really like to see some of that expanded universe stuff get addressed as well, but with Quadratum and worldlines becoming the new hotness, I'm afraid those dreams may be kaput. At least we still have these neat little details to muse over.
What about to pirate worlds connecting because Sea
My head canon for the riku fight in Mulan's world in KH2 is that Riku wanted to fight Sora bc throughout KH2 he's constantly questioning himself, and during the credits says the line "I always used to think I was better than you", and his character arc kinda lends himself to wanting to fight Sora to maybe prove something to himself. Obviously, the game doesn't do this, but I like to think it could have been.
@@starvoltnexus3139 Since Riku thought a raft would get them between worlds, and the Jolly Roger was able to sail through the Lanes Between without difficulty, one would think so. Also the whole Caribbean situation with the navy of the East India Trading Company (a British company, not to mention everyone who came from England in the movies) raises questions that are not ever addressed.
Turbo from Wreck It Ralph's world also recognizes that the player is not from their world and is instead an outsider. He doesn't quite exactly recognize what they really are, but regardless he understands they are a visitor to their world.
I have never much minded even the "filler" worlds, since they all as far as I can remember have at least some similar theming to the journey at large. Even things like the string of memory throughout CoM, where it doesn't matter all that much to the story at large but does provide some sort of meaning in the moment. Even though you are basically just going through the same story, it recontextualizes and Sora gets new things from each experience. The Organization spreading out through the worlds feels significant, even if basically nothing happens except for a brief sighting. I just rather like that even if there is little real consequence to a lot of worlds, I never feel like it was totally a waste of time.
In short, even the less good KH worlds are pretty rad in my opinion.
I agree with you and I love how you put this
KH2 is sweating
Thinking about it (before I get too far into the video) Birth By Sleep is the one game where a lot of the worlds do play a role in game.
By the way I love the reference at 22:37 clearly you remember Achmed
oh you mean the guy who loves tigers
One might incorrectly claim he made love to a tiger.
@@RegularPat I see what you did there at 23:22 I get the joke.
the absolute existence of experiment 626, nomura give us proper lilo and stitch world you coward!!!
I love the original stuff in Kingdom Hearts, but when a new game comes out the first thing I'm always most excited for is seeing the banter between Sora, Donald and Goofy and what worlds they visit. I wouldn't have ever got into KH without the Disney stuff. It's a miracle this series exists as it is and that's what makes it so special
Arendale does NOT deserve to be in the same tier as Beast's Castle.
It's unfortunately because of a 1 minute scene within the 1 1/2 hours of bullshit that is Arendelle where Larxene says shit she could've said elsewhere.
That world was so bland it made me stop playing kh3 for months
Edit I wanted to add: I love the frozen movies too so you know the world is bad when I fan kf the movies even finds it bland lol
@@iimuffinsaur Falling off a mountain, the world.
Fair, I feel as if it’s in a tier on it’s own, above clever little sneak, but below master class
Eh? Is even not at the same tier 17:07 is more up ahed
While personally I don't agree with all of your points they are well made and rather than nitpick I'd like to extend my heartfelt thanks for giving the Disney worlds the attention they deserve, especially since a decent chunk of the online fanbase doesn't.
The only kingdom hearts games where I ever felt the Disney worlds didn’t really contribute to the story were Chain of Memories and Union Cross. But even then, UX had at least Enchanted dominion and Wreck it Ralph so there’s that. Regardless, aside from those 2 the Disney worlds DO matter!!! And they were easily my favorite in KH3 & 358/2 Days
The Disney worlds in CoM might not have physical implications on the overarching series plot, but I'd say that game is actually one of the best at having themes within the disney worlds that contribute to the ideas the game as a whole is working towards!
I think UX is the most guilty of non relevant Disney worlds, all the other worlds in the series somewhat weave into the story.
I mean that was kinda the plot point re:com
I didn’t bother playing the mobile game (I can’t sit through 1000+ missions to get a few pieces of lore) but in COM yes it’s basically a recap of KH1 so it’s not as important to feature the Disney worlds.
Days has some very cool moments in the Disney worlds that contribute to Roxas' and sometimes other nobody's character growth, but as a big Days stan I have to say it's offset a little by a huge amount of filler missions.
13:25 actually in a cool detail Riku never directly attacks you during the fight. He only attacks when a heartless is close you’ll only get hurt if you’re in Riku’s line of fire
I’d love to hear your thoughts on the non-numbered titles as well! This was interesting. I never thought of space paranoids like that honestly but I think you made a believer out of me. Thanks for putting out such amazing content!
It's ironic that the two Disney worlds that aren't traditional 'worlds' in the series (Hundred Acre Woods and Space Paranoids) exist on wildly different ends of the spectrum when it comes to overall relevance to the story at large.
I really liked the optional revisit of Pride Lands, like Clayton from KH1, it was a sneaky preview of a future game’s new monster type. Clayton was a sneaky introduction to nobodies (no heart, no see friends. No heart, no friends). Scar’s ghosts were of a kind with unversed. That said it still was pretty optional in regards to the plot at large
I think the implication with the Riku fight in Land of Dragons is that he's trying to run away, but Sora keeps stopping him and Riku has to shake him off. But the game format presents that as "In an enclosed arena, Sora attacks Riku, and Riku mostly avoids fighting Sora".
Pat I literally quit my job today. Thanks for the much needed content.
Im sorry about your job
@@snailspeeed2133 I'm not
Darkness within darkness awaits you!
I think it's funny how in KH canon, Pete goes from just a grumpy, but well meaning guy to a bumbling villain, but in actual Disney canon it feels the opposite, as Pete was very much the villainous type in most of the early classic cartoons, then to a mean-spirited antagonist, but the modern depiction we've had since the 90's has him depicted as a changed man. A grumpy neighbor, but friend to Goofy all the same. Or as an obstacle in the modern cartoons, but not really a villain, like the Disney Junior shows or Wonderful World of Mickey Mouse cartoons.
For me, I think I take ‘filler’ and apply it more towards when there’s a lot of story elements ripped right from the movie, and not new/skewed plots made within the worlds. Because watching a cutscene that follows a movie I’ve already seen to me feels like filler. So the entirety of every cutscene within that world might not be filler, but to me having a lot of unaltered cutscenes definitely ups the feeling of ‘filler’. Not sure if I’m using the word correctly, but I wonder if other people are defining it that way too
- Belle elbowing Xaldin in the guts
- Woody roasting the ever-loving shit out of Young Xehanort
- Sully scaring Vanitas and then yeeting him into God-Knows-Where
Just some stuff you won't get if not for Disney content
I always only thought Marluxia was paired with the Kingdom of COVID because of the association with flowers, but that Rapunzel/Naminé parallel is an excellent catch.
Well my day’s been pretty good, thanks for asking, Pat.
Honestly, the aesthetic of Kingdom Hearts lends so well with the disney worlds. And as much as people want to say they don’t have anything to do with the story, a lot of the individual characters get their own development in those worlds. They learn a lesson that they carry with them through the game. Yes, they aren’t the most important plot points ever, but they have some real relevance when it comes to character development.
Sora, Shrek, and Donkey is EXACTLY what I want.
I'm always floored by how people can say with a straight face that Kingdom Hearts should just drop the Disney worlds. That's like.. The whole point? Why would you ever even consider that? Even if they aren't always good, they're still almost always fun to go through. KH without Disney is just removing the soul from it at that point.
Other then that, I'd just like to say that, even though I agree with most of all of the popular critiques on Arendelle, I've always really liked the Ice Labyrinth for some odd reason... I don't know, I find it to me the neatest part of the world. Even if it literally just comes out of nowhere.
I feel like the more filler-y worlds work better when they're optional rather than mandatory, because wasting time in the Pride Lands doesn't feel so bad when you don't actually have to do it, while still giving the idea that SDG are generally spending each game actively searching for something specific, so these optional worlds give the idea of reaching dead-ends without actually forcing you to go through something irrelevant.
Conversely, if a world's mandatory and still feels like filler, like KH2's Land of Dragons, it's a lot less interesting because it feels like a waste of time to have to slug through this world when it has nothing to do.
And it's my main issue with KH3, since every world except 100 Acre Woods is strictly mandatory, they had to try and make every single world relevant to the larger story, and most of them frankly don't do well enough in that regard.
The only thing I'd really disagree on is Frozen being as high up as it is, but that's probably because the world was so mind-numbing to play I involuntarily forget anything good about it as soon as I finish getting through it every time
Wonderful video! I always thought Space Paranoids felt integral to the story. My brother and I are huge fans of this series. You should do a ranking of all the Kingdom Hearts games.
Thanks! I did actually do an unscripted tier list of the games last year
czcams.com/video/YJ25tXjf668/video.html
@@RegularPat Maybe you should do a top favorite characters list.
I randomly got recommended your channel on reddit and you said bold move. Watching your videos over the last week has greatly improved my life and has given me the itch to play all the games again. I haven't replayed 3 since it first launched, and I'm excited to jump back in. Keep doing you Pat! I can listen to you talk about KH all day. In fact, I have been!
This was really well put together! I found myself agreeing with most of the points you brought up, keep it up, Pat!
You had me at “My soul is already far beyond saving”
No truer statement for my, and many other peoples feelings towards this series.
Please never stop makin these I love watchin super long videos bout games i love while drawing
This is one of my favorite videos you have done! Just saw that you have a follow up, and will look at that one now!
The charm of the series comes from these characters who all at this point have serious trauma, traveling through lighthearted and colorful worlds, a sad story with colorful backdrops. If you remove that Disney juxtaposition it's not a KH game.
24:52 😂 I love that you go from “ steamed my carrots” to “ smacks me ass”
Great vid! Really seems like you get what makes kingdom hearts so good. I’m hoping future games will tie in the Disney worlds to the overall story more often.
Your not the only one
Same here
Wake up, babe, new RegularPat video dropped.
Loved the vid. You mentioned a follow up, I'd love to see one! Love your stuff and watch everything you put out!
Those first 4 minutes of the video sum up exactly what I feel about the notion of removing Disney worlds. Aside from the fact that Disney owns the series,(which many either ignore or aren't aware of), the series has been and always will be a "crossover" of Disney & Final Fantasy/Square properties. Something that might be ignored in this discourse though is the other half: the removal of Final Fantasy which has slowly been occurring and (hopefully) will be reversed.
I mean, since the other half is Square, they could include stuff OTHER than FF
Got to appreciate that “Well, well, well,” bit at the end
Riku/Maleficent/Pete walking on a free way at night it would have been hysterical to see some office worker pulling an all nighter just turn around to see three weirdos on the express way outside of his office building and him freaking out in the background as the former three hold their conversation xD.
"My soul is already beyond saving"
Yep.
Oh boy do I feel that one, but I'm even worse, I'll even play the phone games when they're available
Can't wait till kingdom hearts 4 comes out and you go to a chicken little world were you fight buck cluck's heartless.
You mean he wasn't one already?
@@toonzach2870 😳
I’ll admit, at first I didn’t quite get what you meant by mainline games, since I’ve always thought they were all mainline, and spent the majority of the video thinking “Wow, I haven’t seen any dream drop distance worlds yet! They must’ve all ranked really high!“ I’d love to see the follow up you suggested!
Yeah I should've said "numbered titles"
another great video! Glad to hear these topics explored. To me, KH isn't KH without disney worlds, and I SUPER agree that most of KHII's worlds had the filler problem of being mostly, if not entirely separate from the main plot of the game, which makes the cutscenes easy to skip on subsequent playthroughs.
Vexen: I honestly wasn't expecting this heart in a box to be just a heart...in a box.
Kingdom hearts 3 felt empty of one thing.
Kingdom hearts was ALWAYS, the premise began of mixing Disney and final fantasy. Bam that was the premise he Tatsuya was laughed at his idea first off. But then it exploded and became what it is.
So, all games its literally about pandering to fans and throwing our favorite characters together. Sora and the others respectfully became great characters themselves doing this however it remains the same...
There originally was no final fantasy in kh3 what you see now is download content extra add on.
It felt like a glop of Disney to me even how it ended you can really predict cause...ITS DISNEY. They removed final fantasy they removed suspense I felt no suspense personally because you can see from a mile away as you play. Its saturated in Disney no one is seriously gonna stay dead or actually go away or anything. Nope and of course gonna be happy ending yet throw in twist so another game can be made.
I didn't like the amount of Disney, AMOUNT is keyword here. Getting rid of final fantasy was just a mistake in my opinion and it shows when literally they threw in every final fantasy that would make sense they could for their download content.
So I see them doing opposite approach with next game.
The complaint will be the same but switch roles.
Kingdom hearts need BOTH Disney, and final fantasy
Oh hey, I just realized you never brought up and ranked Dream Drop Distance worlds, lol.
An in depth look at the other games would be awesome. Especially how themes of each world match the overall tone of the story, more so in CoM and 3D.
I don't know if it's just selfishness, but I really want to see Kingdom Hearts worlds based on Blue Sky movies. Disney owns them, I'm nostalgic for them, and if we're going to get anything good out of the studio getting killed it might as well be watching Blu from Rio giving a completely out of character speech about hearts and love or something equivalent.
I definitely liked this and would love that non-numbered titles follow-up
Great video! Also, I laughed out loud at the list of better options for San Fransokyo! Especially Clayton!
13:03-13:04 that heartless popping up and asking if people wanna talk about shipping made me chuckle
15:35 seeing Clayton on that list really got me
Also could you do a follow up video on BBS and DDD ( also CoM and Days if you want to)
(*VERY LONG POST, SORRY I HAD A LOT TO SAY* ;-;)
I personally think the issue lies in that KH1 did it near perfectly. You could tell it was that fine balance of "Disney whimsy" and Square Enix plot. You had Sora developing these deep thoughts on what the heart/soul is and how far to go to save people you care about. Mixed in with the Villains committing crimes in their respective worlds. Think of that one scene in Neverland where Sora is just happy to have flown and can't wait to tell Kairi... it occurs because he developed in that world. It also helps that the Disney Villains are THE villains (I know Ansem slips in at the end but still). Malificent being this dark being who orchestrates everything and showcases how powerful the darkness is when you are in control of it is cool and fun.
You also travel to each world, looking for Kairi and developing skills but the worlds themselves are also personal to Sora. In Jungle he learns that no matter how far away his friends are, they're with him in his heart which is A REALLY BIG IDEA that is played up all the way to Hollow Bastion AND Scalla ad Caleum in KH3. That his friends, are his power and that's all in the beginning hour of the SERIES. In Wonderland you discover that the Princess of Heart are being stolen from their worlds, which is one of the main plots of the game and even hints towards why Kairi is missing. In Atlantica, you learn how Triton knows about the other worlds and that there is something bigger that went on in the past to where OTHER WORLDS knew about the other worlds at one point, a point that makes A LOT MORE SENSE in UX.
It all just mixes well with the dinsey worlds, which is why when you come to the next set of games they feel very forced because the balance has shifted highly on SE side. Malificent being the biggest fuck-up. What does she down other than job and get pushed aside? She was THE big bad in KH1, she was the ring leader and controller of darkness. She could manipulate such crushing magic at her opponent. What does she do now? she... stands a mile away from the plot going "yes. I am here looming over". I have recently replayed KH2, I am still replaying it now and up to the Pridelands again and you really have to wonder... what was the point of the first 2 worlds. Beast is mad and China is in danger. What does Sora learn that advances or hints at a further plot in the game? In Olympus we learned Hades can apparently summon the dead back to life and use them as puppets but what did that have to do with the overall plot?
The Disney Castle/Steamboat sections are just Malificent specific in which she attacks something in the past to hurt it in the present but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with the end game or anything after that point. It's just real estate shopping for her in her quest to own a castle?????? THIS WAS THE BIG BAD IN THE LAST GAME AND HER GOAL IS TO FIND A CASTLE.
BBS, is actually pretty good in intergrating the disney plots because the worlds again enhance the characters. In each world Terra gets dicked about by the villain to be a villain and taking advantage of him, Ven's untapped good energy is enhanced in each world and Aqua fixes the messes Terra leaves behind. It has a very realistic view of siblings and how consequences of actions can ripple through the families. Each world also showcases them developing in some way. Aqua in Cinderella land learns that the darkness can't just be beaten by overwhelming light and that the lighter you shine the more darkness you cast and when you think how she carried her love for Terra and Ven to the end... she didn't turn into a shadow or a heartless like Sora did, she turned into a dark version of herself that was close to Xehanort. She didn't lose control, she was a fully sentient person who had her love and hope switched completely. Terra, manipulated by the adults around him ended up shackled to the very adult who started it. He put his faith and trust in people and every single one of them let him down to the point that he was trapped in a cycle and being blamed left right and center when just "last week" he was competing with his sister over a promotion. In every world, despite him feeling in his gut he is doing wrong he puts more trust in the adults which at the end of the day... is a real thing that can happen to youths. Then you have Ven, the youth and innocence of the player themselves. Every disney world he goes to, he makes friends and has a great time learning about friendship and joy and family. He in some way, fixes the problems his siblings left behind in each world and helps piece things together when inside... he's literally broken in half. You see it at the start and end that he is steamrolling towards confronting his nasty side. A side of himself that he does not want to see, like or hear from but he has to which I personally saw as an allegory from growing up which we all do. And I know that was a long post about BBS but it all adds up when you remember that each part of those journeys takes place IN THE DISNEY WORLDS. You don't go to the Disney worlds, dick about replaying the movies and then get to the Keyblade grave yard and THEN have those revelations.
And this is where KH2 and worse so, 3 fail. The revelations of those two games (for the most part) happen in the SE worlds. You didn't find out Xigbar was in the land of dragons so that he could target specifically the hearts of patriotic men who serve their worlds through and through thus being "strong hearts" for their project. Or how Demyx went to Olympus to take Hades's soul cairn to use for fuel for the Heart project. They just... exist. And then you get to Hollow Bastion and Saix just says the plot for you and then you go to Atlantica to sing about how Ariel is in love.
Space Paranoids is truly what I feel like more KH worlds should strive to be like. A perfect harmony between the original, Disney, and FF characters. I wasn't a huge fan of it due to the aesthetic of the world itself, but narratively and conceptually, it's A+ Kingdom Hearts stuff. Glad to see it at the top of the list.
Please do make a continuation with the other installments this was some 10/10 content my dude
I don’t remember where I heard it, but I really do like the theme park metaphor to describe the worlds in KH. You don’t come to think about your life and relationships (though with how long those lines be at disney world, you might) you just want to hop on some rides, experience the excitement or pleasure of exploring the place, and either bask in the nostalgic feeling you get from being there or make some new memories from the all things you see.
My day has been great thanks for asking
I like how in KH1, the didny worls feel like innocent bystanders caught in the crossfire of the heartless invasion.
Another really great video! an idea I had for a world that could have a really cool connection to the larger series would be a gravity falls world. imagine if something like the key blade or kingdom hearts was an entry in one of the journals, potentially from xehanort going there during his past travels and running into Ford
I wholeheartedly agree with this video. I do hope to see that follow up on other KH games and their Disney worlds when you're ready for it.
In retrospect, Triton's line about the Keyblade shattering peace and bringing ruin feels like a reference to the Keyblade Wars.
I know this is an old video but I'd argue that KH2 Olympus should be clever little sneak tier because of Auron
Twisted Reference I respect that lol thanks for the help as i try to make my own video essay and start to think about the content in the Disney worlds.
You opened my opinions up about the KH3 worlds you praised, especially Monstropolis. Thanks for this video.
I know I'm late to the party, but a lot of great points here. I've always adored the stronger moments in KH games where the characters in the Disney worlds parallel wider KH themes or learn about the bigger world outside of their own in some way. I'd love to "rewrite" Kingdom Hearts with greater emphasis on these kinds of plot points, but it would take a while 😅
I thoroughly enjoyed the video. I would love to see the follow-up video with BBS, 3D and days worlds!
i'm so happy to see some space paranoids love!! it's one of my favorite worlds in the series
This only makes me appreciate the first game so much more and there's already a huge infatuation with it since it is my favorite one in the series, so thank you.
Definitely a very fun and interesting video!
I really hope you’re gonna do BBS/DDD next
PLEASE do a follow up including the worlds of non-numbered games i greatly appreciated this one
They should’ve had Clayton instead of Dark Riku
22:37 I caught the twisted reference
Thank you for this video!!!
thank u for watchin