Hey BEAT family! I got a deep one for you all today. WARNING: This video is not for those who simply want to just skim through and get a quick answer. I had to take my time with this and really try to break this down and look at it from all sides. I hope you appreciate and enjoy this video and I look forward to hearing your thoughts as always below. Enjoy!
@@jdj2022 no. My position has been the same throughout. You may have been slightly misunderstood or perhaps I wasn't as clear as I should have been. Can you help me understand what you thought my position was on this so I can clarify?
My take on the elect has always been to Jews/12 tribes of Isreal. He chose (or promised) Abraham certain things. It shows consistency in the two Testaments. God chose (predestined) his people (Isrealites) to be "the Elect". He didn't choose us gentiles but through Jesus, we are adopted to the Elect. Grafted to the vine by accepting the finished work of Salvation. The idea of a predestined elect is to show God's consistancy through the different dispensations.
Only God knows the depths of who we are as humans. He is very mysterious, no matter how you explan it. Romans 8:29 💝 "For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren."
Brother Allen, you leave out the possibility that, along with other mysteries of scripture, both are true. That God chooses, and we have no part in the decision, which is the Calvinist view, and that people have to make a decision, which is the Armenian view. Is it not possible that God chooses, ANd we must also decide to either accept His gift or reject it? In other words, neither The calvinist View nor the Armenian view are 100% correct. There are many things about God that are both/and as opposed to either/or. Perhaps this is one of them.
The last part of this video where Allen talks about bringing the gospel to as many people as possible is so true. I finally built up the courage through Jesus of course, to do this with a young man I encountered while on patrol ( I’m a police officer). This guy had basically lost all hope, was having suicidal thoughts and was seeking to be committed to a mental health facility. I drove him to a local hospital for assistance, but while I drove him there I decided to try my hand at evangelism. I asked him how many times he had been through this broken man made system, which he replied multiple times. Clearly the system isn’t helping and he is stuck in an endless cycle of misery and pain. So I asked him if he believes in God, which he replied yes. When I asked if he knew the gospel, he replied no. When explained the gospel to him and recommended putting his troubles on the savior, his eyes lit up. By the time we were done with our conversation along with an invitation to my church, he was in a completely different state of mind. He went from a man who had no hope whatsoever to someone who had just been given the world. I have been praying for him ever since that he will continue to seek the Lord and hope to see him at my next church service. I was very hesitant about trying to evangelize a complete stranger for a long time, and I continued to pray to God to give me the strength, the feeling I had after this encounter was amazing. If your like me, continue to ask God for the strength and get out there, you won’t regret it.
Great story and you should be highly commended. I About 14 years ago, I became very suicidal myself (7 attempts) and was admitted to a mental health facility three times. I think Allen's view that God predestines some to go to heaven and others to go to hell before they are even born is very misplaced. You said the young man's eyes lit up when you told him to give his troubles to the Lord (the very thing I ended up doing which completely broke my suicidal cycle, something three batteries of psychiatrists could not do). But what do you think he would have thought if you told him what Allen said in his video that God preordained at the beginning of time who was going to be saved and who was going to be unsaved no matter how much they believed in God? If it was me, I would have become even more suicidal after hearing that.
@@Madlou thank you very much, glory to God. Yea I agree with u, I don’t necessarily agree with this message either but I don’t pretend to know the answers to these questions by any means. And you know as well as I do that bringing this point up before someone in that state of mind would be a terrible idea. That’s why I just kept it simple and told him about the gospel that he had never heard before. And praise the Lord that he helped you out of your troubles as well Louis, may he continue to bless you. And thank you for the kind words sir.
He knows us from beginning to end but in life we still have free will. He knows exactly what we will do with that free will which is to follow him or not.
Thankfully we do not have the ability to see who and who will not receive mercy from God. Instead we are called to spread the Gospel. Some may not be saved the moment of hearing the gospel the 1st time. I’m sure many if not all who are saved can say we have seen God save someone at his own time and at his own will.
@@RichWeigel this is not Biblical. We were once dead in our sins. Those who are dead cannot choose to make themselves alive. Jesus said we must be reborn- we did not choose to be born the first time and similarly we cannot choose to be born again. All glory be to God for salvation by grace through faith in his only begotten son Jesus Christ. He chose us. We did not choose Him. Faith is a gift from God that we do not choose or earn.
@@codykelly9650 Nowhere does it say faith is a gift. Ever. That is a twisting of the grammar of Ephesians 2. Romans 6:23 shows it is salvation, not faith, that is the gift.
God's omniscience should not be confused with predestination: He has declared the end from the beginning! He has given us free will; choose you this day whom ye will serve! God is good! Be blessed!!!🙏🤗💞
@@jonathanharness2962 So, are you telling me that you can or cannot accept His offer of salvation? He gives everyone a choice; just because He knows what each individual will do does not mean that they were predestined to heaven or hell! For example, Judas choice to betray Christ; it was his own choice, but God knew that he would. I hope this will help you understand the difference between an all-knowing God, and being predestined!🙏🤗💞
@@Richard-kf7py Judas was the son of perdition, chosen to betray Christ before the foundation of the world. Read Ephesians carefully and prayerfully and you will mature and understand Salvation is all of God and none of our doing.
@@jonathanharness2962 This is not a salvational issue, but we will just have to agree to disagree on this topic. I still love you as my brother in Christ. We will meet in the air!💯💞
John 3.16. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, that who so ever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life 🕊Amen.
ja und die die glauben sind dazu bestimmt, die anderen hassen Gott, seine Gebote und lehnen es ab, weil das eine gefallene Welt ist und der Teufel herrscht heir als Fürst und verblendet die Sinne der Ungläubigen...nur wer aus Gott geboren wird, sucht Gott, die anderen nicht...ihr seid ihr nicht in einer neutralen Zone
The Lord gives me strength, it’s only because of him I have persevered. I have two beautiful boys both are autistic. My husband passed away years ago. I’m all alone. I lost my job over declining the vaccine. LIKE MANY OTHERS! I declined due to my pre existing health conditions lupus and heart disease. I’ve been struggling to provide for myself and my children since losing my job from Forsyth hospital. I’m now waitressing, and I’m thankful, but I’m not making nearly enough to get by. Groceries are super expensive. Every month is a battle to not end up on the streets with my two children. I’m constantly in fear of losing my home. To even think about being on the streets with two young children is terrifying. But even as I face homelessness seemingly every month. I have faith, God will provide. With GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE! Faith over fear.
God bless you my sister in Christ! Just don’t give up and never stop believing He is working it out for you! You will not lose your home!!! I agree with you in prayer
God bless you and your little ones. my condolences for your loss and I can not imagine how you must feel, but we have a strong mighty father and all things work together for those who love the Lord. I declare in Jesus name your blessing is coming, I can see your faith is unyielding, please stay in faith and watch the Glory of God!!🙏🙏🙏🙏
I don’t know if you are apart of a church family, and is firmly planted there, however I strongly encourage that. Being planted in a sound biblical church they should be able to help you. Pray and ask God to lead you a biblical church.
I had the thought "God knows who will be saved and who will not be so he had chosen" but after watching this I realize He knows, but He also knows who and why they aren't saved. Salvation is offered to all, not all will accept it.
Because of God’s character He knows who will be saved. But He still allows mankind to make that choice. God knew ‘Job’ would never ‘curse’ Him for example.
God knew who would be saved because He chose them before the beginning of time. You have to realize man's condition to understand just how bad of shape were in. We are naturally totally dead in sins and trespasses and at enmity with God. We hate God and not only want nothing to do with Him, but rebel against Him. We were dead! That's not a figure of speech. It means to die or to be dead. A spiritually dead person can't make spiritual decisions, he can't discern them AND it's all foolishness to him. If indeed man choose God, it's all essentially 'luck' on man's part. But one must realize that if spiritual things are foolishness to (the natural) man, how unlikely is he to make the foolish choice! Rather, as the Bible indicates, that man must be quickened to spiritual life, he can now discern and make a good choice. A choice, that due to his new nature, is the only logical choice. The spiritual man makes the right choice everytime, because all those that are born again (spiritual life) will overcome, and those who overcome will make it to heaven.
@cdr 777 not what I'm talking about. They'll ultimately run back to Christ. Logically, I think what you're asserting has the potential end of a once true believer rejecting Christ, and we are told, absolutely unequivocally, that will not happen.
@cdr 777 I didn't say you said that, simply that if you logically extend out the idea that a spiritual person could ultimately make the wrong decision, his end is perdition, and absolute impossibility.
@Ben Jones let's have a public discussion about this so people can understand each position correctly. That's not what Arminians believe at would you be willing to do that ?
Thank you for this teaching. I was in the Army in 1967 and expected to be deployed to Vietnam soon. I started attending a Southern Baptist church near Fort Sam Huston in San Antonio Texas. I accepted Jesus as my Savior and was baptized. However, later I attended a conference where a pastor tought that if a person wasn’t elect they were lost no matter what they did or didn’t do, even if they professed Jesus and were baptized. This crushed my heart because I couldn't tell if I was elect or not. As a result I stopped going to church and returned to my former life habits, drinking and womanizing. However, I would periodically study the Bible and as I studied I began to realize that my desire to know Jesus and follow him proved that I was elect, so I started changing and cleaned up my life (a long process). If the teaching on predestination is not handled correctly it can drive people away from Jesus. Today I attend church and read the Bible daily and I have a strong attachment to Jesus.
My view was always this: there is predestination in the sense that God has a perfect plan for each of us to follow. Yet we have the free will to choose to follow that plan (by HIS power and HIS might), or to stray from that path, typically via the avenue of sin. Everyone has equal chance for salvation. it is available to all of us. However some people ultimately send themselves to Hell by rejecting Jesus, so he gives them over to their sin. Or as you said will pass over some people because they do not want him. He knocked, they said no.
I understand that he would of been just in letting all of us perish, IF he didn't plan or will for Lucifer to rebel against him, and then humanity to rebel. Since the rebellion was a part of his will, it doesn't make sense to me why we would deserve destruction when God was willing everything??
@@WhoAreYe You do understand that God created us that way right?? How could we be morally responsible for our actions if life is predetermined by our creator. We were created with a sinful nature by God and then punished for such a nature that was bestowed on us? How is that mercy?
@@edwin6146 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump done vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory- 24 even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles? This is Paul's response to EXACTLY this line of questioning. "Who are you , O MAN, to answer back to God?" This is just like in the book of Job when God finally answers Job and basically tells Him "Where were you when I laid the foundations of the world? Did you give me counsel?"
@@douglasmcnay644 That doesn't answer the objection. I never made a claim that God couldn't do as he pleased however to hold the title "Worthy of Worship" one must be perfect (without flaw). In a deterministic view.. God is the author of evil. There is no way around that. If God is the author of evil then he Can't be morally perfect. If God is not morally perfect then he isn't perfect which means he is not worthy of worship. Yahweh would be no better than Allah of Islam. I find that to be troubling and it doesn't follow logical
Pray God lifts the scales from the lukewarm and lost eyes, opens their ears and soften their hearts. Pray God brings revival to the earth. Pray the Lord of Harvest send forth laborers into the harvest. Pray God strengthens His children, gives them more discernment and wakes them 🙏🏻
What's predetermined is not that the wicked is wicked, it's the judgment. They were designated beforehand for judgment BECAUSE they turned away from the grace.
Right people acting so delusional down here God knew who would accept him or not before humans were created he chosen those that accepted him and left alone those that reject him we all know God chosen us no one would Automatically choose God unless he has drawn us to him!!
When we talked about this in Bible College, it nearly destroyed my faith. Maybe that's why it's often not talked about in most churches, outside of denominational statements of belief. I have a hard time believing God would bring a person into this world without a chance of Salvation.
Honestly this has to be the best video I’ve ever watched that summed up these three schools of thought. When going through Bible college I struggled with this topic so so much. And I remember one day in class we were having this discussion. Lots of verses were being thrown left and right and lots of convincing arguments were made from both sides of the aisle. But I still remember at the end of that class when my professor stood up and said so eloquently “so if some verses support this school of thought and other support the other than which is true? Well the truth of the matter is I don’t know…. And it is completely ok that I do not know. Because Gods ways are higher than our ways. And to be honest I doubt my human finite brain could comprehend the truth if it were given to me by God himself. But what I do know is that God has instructed me to GO INTO ALL THE WORD AND PREACH THE GOSPEL. And that is exactly what I will do. And whatever results come from it I will credit to God and give him praise for it.” That day I learned the doctrine of “I don’t know” and it has given me so much peace in life. I do believe that I am to read and study the scriptures and learn as much from them as God will allow me too. And as a pastor I strive to do that every day and then share what I learn with others. I love this topic and I think this video summarizes the different schools of thought on this topic so well. Great job brother.
the answer is both..its not either or..there is predestination but gives you choice in that destiny .its ridiculous to only pick some scriptures and make that ones virw cuz its a hslf truth
@@thegrigs777 that’s the only conclusion I can come to with it. Best and simplest way I can think to say it is God elects some but leaves the door open for others and his grace extends to all. That’s at least what the Bible seems to sah.
@@thegrigs777 He predestines people to hell like He predestined you to write that comment. Did He write it for you? No. So easy to understand but unnecessarily complicated. *1 Peter 2:6-8* how can you take anybody who complicates this Bible passage seriously?
@@thegrigs777 you also can’t choose God as a natural man unless God intervenes. *John 6:44* *2 Timothy 2:25* Watch people not being able to handle consistency now.
Remember the parable of the marriage in Matthew 22? When the chosen ones rejected the offer, the king requested his servant to call AS MANY AS possible, and no one was left uninvited, rather one was rejected because he came to the marriage in the wrong apparel (not clothed with the righteousness of Christ), YET many are called and few are chosen. Conclusion, all men do get access to salvation but those who do not put their trust and confidence in Jesus do not have salvation, those who believe are saved, all are called (Acts 17:30) but only those who to believe (have trust and confidence) are the chosen.
Also when the Bible talks of those chosen falling to come to the party and then everyone is invited its speaking of jews and gentiles. How the jews rejected Jesus and in their place the gentiles were invited
On that last point, it seems like the question was sidestepped. Even if we do not know who is the elect, the question was “why would it matter if we share the gospel or not?” If the elect will go the heaven anyway, why preach the gospel to them if it’s inevitable?
God is good, brother! It's His mercy that gives us understanding; our very being is due to His mercy. None can boast. Thanks for posting this video (by God's grace)!
Even as wild sinners God still grants us the ability to believe. That is pure grace and mercy! Especially after we believe we realize how mighty that grace is.
This was spot on brother! Praise God for He is gracious & merciful and is faithful to fulfill His promise of forgiving all who turn to Christ in faith. 🙌🏽 He is a Father to the fatherless, our Rescuer, our Refuge, our Salvation.
Ephesians 2:8-9 says, 'By Grace, you have been saved through Faith. It is the gift of God, not from your works, so no one may boast.' Indeed, from the beginning of human race, the Grace was given freely to Adam and Eve when they were created to become God's children. When the first parents lost the Grace by disobeying God and, thus, committing the Original Sin, their descendants are born into the world without Grace, the life of their souls. No human beings, however holy they may be, could cancel the Original Sin and obtain the lost Grace. Only One Man, Incarnate Word, promised Messiah and Savior, could do that with His Suffering and Death on the Cross. And He, Jesus Christ Our Lord, gives the Grace freely to those who believe in Him and baptized through the teachings and ministry of the One, Holy, Catholic, Apostolic Church He founded on St. Peter (Matt 16:18) and sent to all nations to teach (Matt 28:20, Mark 16:16).
Ephesians 2:10 says, 'we are created (namely, reborn) in Christ Jesus for the good works that we should walk in them,' which the baptized promises to God during the ceremony of the Sacrament of Baptism. 1 John 3:9 says, 'no one begotten by God commits sin.' To retain the Grace received, the baptized must not sin; otherwise, he will lose the Grace much the same way as our first parents lost it and death came. 'You are called to be holy (1 Cor 1:2).' 'No one who fails to act in righteousness belongs to God (1 John 3:10).'
Now, after receiving the Sacrament of Baptism, could anyone live in the world without committing a sin and preserve the Grace? Yes, one can, but, since we are still weak against temptations, It will require assiduous efforts on our part to cooperate with the Graces given through the Sacraments Our Lord instituted in the Church, particularly, the Sacrament of Confession and the Holy Eucharist. Without the Graces from Sacraments administered by the Catholic Church, one cannot be saved. That's why 'Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus (outside the Church, no salvation)' is a Catholic Dogma (Catechism No. 846). For further information on this, please watch The Forgotten Dogma: No Salvation Outside the Catholic Church by Father Isaac Mary Relyea on CZcams.
Brother Allen! I'm watching this 1 year and 1 day from the date you posted it, and I am thankful for this clarification. I have recently been saved and I've given my life entirely to my Lord & Savior Jesus Christ. I find your videos to be very helpful and educational with many questions I have. Thank you for your work.
Think of every despicable act there is on planet earth; murder, rape, child molestation, Satan worship, ALL religions that deny the deity of Christ, pornography, alcohol, drugs, and on and on; Calvinism says, "God in His sovereignty CAUSES all of these to happen. Sorry, I don't see that in the Bible. God in His sovereignty gives man SOME free will to choose Christ or not, to choose right from wrong, to choose good from evil. Unfortunately, man often chooses badly. The result: all the evil that the Calvinist says, God caused. My Bible says God IS love and is without sin. Here is absolute Biblical proof that God does NOT cause or determine everything; In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” So, while God does predestine some things, He does NOT predestine everything. It is like a university predestining a football team next year, but giving free will to each individual player to decide whether or not to try out for the team.
People going to Hell is always their choice. The Bible clearly states that God has no pleasure in the death of the wicked but that he turns from his wicked way and live-Ezekiel 33:11.
You can't simply justify it. No one is chosing Hell. They'll most certainly be _sent_ probably kicking and screaming. I don't know why Parr thought it was a good idea to try to explain it away. These are some of those contradictions. They're *still* contradictions, whether people want to acknowledge it or not. Thing is, when you say God is in control, the sole creator of all, and holds all knowledge, past and present, there's no WAY that everything that happens and will ever happen, is not deliberate on account of God. You can't have all power without all responsibility.
@@wulfosaurus1835 Allen explained it well at 22:01. Yes God does harden but he hardens the ones that have Committed to themselves that they want nothing to do with him, do you not realize how much this world hates God? If God were to show up in the sky right now do you really think unbelievers would be leaping up for joy like a believer would? No, they’ll be terrified, they’ll worship God out of fear instead of out of love. God is not a dictator, He wants a world in which there is peace and love, if your scared of God and hate him because of the love and conviction of your sins then you won’t live with him for eternity. If you won’t let someone that hates and disrespect you live with you then why should God allow someone that hates him to live with him forever?
If He did something like poke out of the clouds and affirm His Word to people, you can BET that nearly ALL would start acting straight. People don't "hate" for the sake of hating. There's always reasons, reasonable and unreasonable. If God made hateful people, why would He even make them anyway at all?
Fantastic message! God is clearly not double minded! God already knew according to His foreknowledge what people would do. He knew people were going to go hell based upon their choices, not that He predestined anyone to chose to reject His plan of salvation or redemption just so they would go to hell for the fun of it. 💥🔥❤❤
Before I start watching I want to thank God for this message and also brother Allen for allowing God to use you to touch on such a difficult topic. Alpha and Omega the beginning and the end the first and the last! Nothing is nor ever will be a “surprise” to the almighty creator. Father let your will be done 🙏🏾
If The Lord predestined some to go to hell and not others, then that wouldn't be fair, which goes against everything that He stands for. Because The Lord is just, i believe that we all are given an opportunity to receive Him and His kingdom.
I'm far from being a calvinist but what you just said is not true. Because we've all fall short to the glory of God, our punishment is death which is totally JUST. If God wants to gives grace to one more than another it is His will and the saved ones only gets God's favor to be saved. The saved one gets grace, the unsaved one gets justice. God is still just. God loves everyone and there's no doubt about that. BUT! It is clear from the bible that God is more favorable towards some than others. As i said, i am not a calvinist and i have somewhat of an arminianist view towards predestination, but it is biblical that God gives more grace to some than others.
@@Simplement_ChrétienYes, amen! I certainly agree with you, brother. :) There are just far too many Bible verses that emphasize God's choosing from the old treatment to the new testament. And let's not forget Romans 9! I know that whenever God revealed His grace, love and power to me that it was Him alone doing it and it was NONE of my own effort! He was so gracious, and His timing was perfect and out of nowhere. ❤️❤️ I had no ability to believe, no desire for God and I in fact hated Him. I had loved Him years before but I was fallen. Well, one day He found a way to overwhelm me and reveal Himself to me again, and I it was ALL Him doing it. God must intervene and show His grace to us my revealing Himself to us, and it's when and if He so desires to. Man God is good. So good. ❤️❤️
Fair? God has every right to end us. Our sin alone is reason enough for that. We all fall short of the glory. His grace is what saves us and He CHOOSES his children
@@Solidsolo1028 Amen. None of us are deserving of God revealing Himself and saving any of us. The fact that He chose to save me and reveal Himself to me makes me love Him more than if it was my by my own choice! It's impossible for me to have faith without God giving it to me. Those who say they believe by free will and that they didn't have an instant change in their spirit have a false Jesus because it's impossible not to change once God reveals Himself to a person. You instantly want to be around other believers, you suddenly want to immerse yourself in the word of God, and you have unspeakable joy. I heard a fella on CZcams, (free grace teacher who believes in free will), say that every morning he reads the same scripture every morning and he repeatedly says out loud I am saved by grace through faith and not of works least any man should boast" until he's convinced he's saved. The problem with that is that Jesus told us not to repeat the same words, or prayers hoping that they would come true. That's a form of witchcraft. If you don't have faith then ask God to increase your faith, but don't keep repeating the same thing until you have convinced yourself. That's not of God.
I believe that God knows Who is going to hell and Who is going to Heaven because of he is omniscient, however he did not predestinate us. He came to save the world, even when not all of us is going to be saved, that is what I believe.
Please read Ephesians carefully. God has chosen whom He has chosen to be with Him. The majority of people want a sinful life and God let's them have it.
@@jonathanharness2962 that's a lie of the devil that only ignorant clowns fall for, the holy gospel is God's plan for our salvation and you don't believe in it, you're not a Christian and you're not saved
@@jonathanharness2962 If you're referring to this verse Ephesians 1:4-5 KJV According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: [5] Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will, It says He has chosen those *in Him* meaning, in Christ, *whosoever* that may be, before the foundation of the earth He decided those people would be holy and without blame before Him in love. That's not talking about salvation. This verse is talking about the destination that was planned for born again believers, not about non-believers being saved. And verse 5 also is not talking about salvation at all, but the redemption of the body.
"basically saying a person's salvation largely depends on them, which goes against scripture" I respectfully disagree with this premise, which my Calvinistic friends always bring up. Those that disagree don't say "salvation LARGELY depends on them", only that the person believed as per the following scriptures. (Obviously repentance is involved also) i.e. Rom 10 "that if you will confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes resulting in righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made resulting in salvation. For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes in him will not be disappointed.” Rom 3 "Because by the works of the law, no flesh will be justified in his sight; for through the law comes the knowledge of sin. But now apart from the law, a righteousness of God has been revealed, being testified by the law and the prophets; even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ to all and on all those who believe. For there is no distinction, for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God." Salvation is a gift from God, as all have sinned. No one deserves it. Eph 2 "for by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, that no one would boast Jn 6 They said therefore to him, “What must we do, that we may work the works of God? Jesus answered them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.” Jn 1:12 "He came to his own, and those who were his own didn’t receive him. But as many as received him, to them he gave the right to become God’s children, to those who believe in his name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." Lastly, some state believing in Jesus is " largely depending on themselves" and " against scripture"....okay. Others say it's just not suppressing the truth and exercising the faith God has given all people. By repentance and belief they become born again. Rom 1 states all people know God exists i.e. some faith. " For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known of God is revealed in them, for God revealed it to them. For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse."
Calvinists don't believe the saving power of the Holy Gospel which is God's plan for our salvation, if God did choose some and not others, the gospel wouldn't be good news to whoever God doesn't choose
John 3:16 doesn't say anything about man's ability. It simply says that everyone believing in Jesus will be saved. John 3 also says you must be born again to even See the kingdom of God.
This was such a thorough and well thought out video. It’s what I’ve been searching for. You broke it all down in a way I can understand. Thank you Allen. Also, this makes me fear and thank God more.
A true Christian who follows Jesus Christ fully is transported from the kingdom of darkness to the Kingdom of light, he goes from being a child of the devil to being adopted by God. When people are adopting a child, they CHOOSE to adopt the child that’s why it is called CHOSEN in scripture. Romans 8: 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
I believe he knows the future from the beginning. Therefore he knows what we will choose. Whether we follow him or not. We have free will and God knows what we will do with it. God bless 🙂🙏
But He also made you and has the ability to _change_ hearts and minds. And He knows full well who could benefit from God's action, as with He does with His chosen anyway. Think it out, everything that happens is His Will. It's deliberate. Also, beware ANYONE who says don't use logic. He uses "logic" for arguments in _his_ favor when it suits him. Don't use logic. Yeah, don't think, just listen to me.
Exactly. He has already seen the ending. He knows who chooses Him and who doesn’t. It’s not that he sent people to hell but He already saw that they rejected Him
Bingo! I could upend all he taught in one Scripture. Dueteronomy 30:15 - 20. When God said "I set before you this day, life and death." It's the PLAN that God has predestined, not people. Whatever you chose becomes your predestination. And just because God knows everything does not make Him personally responsible for our choices
@@mpskin49 Beware when you try to sum up God’s will and Word in one verse. He gave us thousands for a reason, and many are ignored that completely refute this view, particularly in the New Testament. You could randomly take a verse from Deut. and convince everyone they must be circumcised. Peter, Paul, James, Jude, and others refuted that with LOGIC.
God plz don't leave me. It's been a season of unbearably agonizing things. I've stumbled, ive gotten up. I dont even know when the hits will stop coming. I give it all to you Father
I would much rather stand before God someday believing He's merciful and didn't predestine anyone to hell and find out I'm wrong than stand before Him believing He's the author of evil and pre-destined almost all of His creation to hell as Calvinism teaches.
I stand with the truth, God is the One who saves us and without God pulling us out, all of us would be there in the sinful world. I also understand that the wrath of God is finite though, so the ones who will taste the wrath, will suffer but for a finite amount of time.
That is not what Calvinism teaches. There is no injustice with God. I highly recommend RC Sproul’s book, “Chosen by God” for a better understanding of the doctrines of grace (reformed theology). At the very least, to better understand this doctrine and not a caricature of it.
Idk if this is the truth but, i believe we all have an equal chance, which is why God appointed US to help direct others to him, because everyone can be saved, he wants as many of his children saved as possible COME ON GUYS!
I was thinking the same thing about Leighton! He is a former Calvinist and understands how they misinterpret scripture, namely the predestination verse… Election is not to eternal life…but to service in the plan and purposes of God. And In Romans 9: 14-29, Paul is talking about Israel. < God’s grace IS available to ALL.
The problem with Leighton is that he never really understood Calvinistic Soteriology, but he believes that he does, so he doesn’t listen to proper explanations. There is nothing to be gained for a Calvinist to speak to Leighton.
@@HelloTygr This is literally what almost every Calvinist resorts to in the end lol "You don't understand Calvinism!!" You seem like the kind of person that would watch the William Lane Craig vs James White debate and at the end of it accuse WLC of not understanding Calvinism lol
He already knows the end from the beginning, so he knows those who will cry out for him to be their savior. Thank you Jesus for your sacrifice on the ✝️ ❤.
I've heard it put, "The sign over the gate to heaven says 'Those who pass through this gate have chosen God' but once in heaven it reads, 'Those who have passed through this gate have been chosen by God.'" Either way I thank God I was chosen...
God chooses us or does not choose us, what earthen vessel can argue with the potter saying why have you made me such? Our salvation is by his will, for his purpose, and not ours, we have no part in it... We are that lost that God has to intervene....... At least that's how it was explained to me by a John MacArthur video
@@krustysurfer that is true. Salvation is 100% the work of the Lord. It is His salvation. We don’t deserve heaven that’s why it is a gift of God not earned by works.
The Gospel, is the call. If you hear, grace has been extended to you. Until you hear the call, you cannot respond. That’s why the gospel is the power for salvation. Those who have been predestined, respond to the call (the gospel) once it’s been given. That is why we must go preach the good news of the kingdom, to send out the call.
Some people hear the call and accept it with joy in their hearts but because they are not fertile enough soil spiritually speaking their faith quench and they fall back to the world.
Thank you Corinne for this perspective and illustration! I recently accepted the life-changing grace of Jesus after 27 years of suffering and denial of His will which I believe He was using to prepare me for the ability TO accept His grace since I was not spiritually mature enough (not necessarily to be held unaccountable, but within my feeble humanity I couldn't begin to grasp the concept). I can see now how He destined me to come to Him precisely in summer of 2022, and I am humbled beyond belief that He would do so, I still cannot describe how extraordinary my experience has been. I am on FIRE to fulfill His will and be able to shepherd the elect into His Kingdom, and I thank God for people like you and the brothers and sisters in these comments who are part in furthering my knowledge of my Father and KING. 😊😊💕💕
why tho? i want to be with God but i have to do tons of exobiblical resrarch to understand it. i KNOW im not perfect. i am working on praying more and swearing less eta, but none of that matters, so how do i make sure im chosen? why not make a hell for bad humans, instead throwing them right in the same stinking hole as THE LITTERAL DEVIL!!!!???!!!
During the times of "CZcams preachers" pointing out faults of other preachers, this message was full of the Holy Spirit. Well done brother in Christ. I thank God for your message.
Thank you for bring forth this knowledge and helping me tackle this difficult question. I often had the thought that if my actions dont matter and the choice was never mine, than why even play the game. But you reminding me of the fact that no one gets into heaven by their own earthly acts but only through gods grace are they saved. Total mind set shift for me so thank you.
This is one of the best podcasts I have ever listened to. You answered so many questions I have had in my five year journey with Christ. Thank you so much! You have no idea how much this helped me understand the timing of my own personal salvation.
I still dont know if im one of the elect because I gave my life to Christ 7 years ago and I was at peace and on fire for God at first and then something happned kind of a snowball effect and now im a real mess I know I want a relationship with Jesus and to be Holy I want to hate sin but my flesh always is to strong I dont get it its confusing and depressing have you had any similar experience or know anyone who has ?
I’ve been there. Please have heart and believe. Don’t give up on God cause he won’t give up on you. Don’t allow your heart to become so hardened that you can’t sincerely repent. Pray and ask God to change your heart. Talk to God and tell him your thoughts and slowly but surely you will start reversing back to where you once had fire. Be patient with yourself. Especially after backsliding. The first step is to REPENT. ask for forgiveness and don’t go back to that sin. You can’t do it without the Lord because our flesh is weak. God knows this so he waits for us. But you need to repent as soon as possible. I pray you will be guided by our Lord. God bless you.
@@Goldtaker23 I don’t know but I think it’s pretty clear you are one of the elect because of your desire. Someone who isn’t saved doesn’t have a desire God.
@Ben Jones I agree fully with what you say I think I'm still a babe as I've had a terrible time I'm various ways during my walk so I've not grown I want to grow more than anything though
@@Goldtaker23 You’re assuming that being a Jesus follower is somehow temptation free or sin free? The fact that you’re struggling is proof that you have been chosen by God. But if you’re serious about following Christ be willing to make sacrifices in order to bear spiritual fruit.
I was just finished reading Romans nine. Never heard of " double" predestination. You have just given me a clear understanding of the doctrine of predestination. Thank you.
What would be called double predestination outside of this certain belief of God would be nothing more than a fuller scope of what already goes on. For with the natural eye we perceive what man does. With the spiritual eye we perceive what God does. But is our spiritual eye so developed that we can plumb the depths of God? Just because I say that some are predestined to hell does not mean that some men just can't go to God, on a earthly level. It just means that some won't come, no matter what. This is evident in the world and in our preaching. How that some men resist until death and how others step in as amooth as butter. Or the opposite. How some men are drawn in like a breath in child labor, like Christ speaks of in John, there being joy in heaven because a child is born unto us, or others resist until there dying day and there receive Christ. They could not have resisted God choosing them by any means.
I agree with you Alan, great explanation, I tend to steer away from conversations around subjects like these, it can lead to arguments and pride, best to just stay obedient and faithful to our Lord and to just trust Him.
2 peter 3:9 Esv The lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you; not wishing that any should parish but thst all should reach repentance
@@peterfox7663 you are right 👍 these so called spiritual leaders have no idea what the bible really teaches. Jesus spent three and a half years sitting up the way to understand the bible.And commanded his disciples to keep it going.read Matthew 28:16-20
Predestination is like this: a teacher who says, "Anyone who gets 50% or more in the exam will get to go on our field trip next Saturday." The teacher does his part and then each student has to do his or her part. The reward and criteria for selection are determined by God. It is predestined but not in the minuscule and unjust way most Christians believe. To see it any other way is to see God as unjust. Then it would be to worship an idol (or a false image of God).
@@mandooakes8509 the apostles clearly talk about maintaining the faith, choosing God and the like. I think we may have an erroneous idea of what heresy is.
@@republiccooper If by "doing our part" you meant we had to do something (work) to get to heaven, than that is a heresy. If you by, "doing our part" you meant that we accept the free gift of salvation. Then no heresy. If that's what you meant than I would change your analogy to, a present that God puts in our lap. We choose whether or not to accept and open the gift.
@@mandooakes8509 After all, we work out "our own salvation with fear and trembling." If what I said is heresy, we should take it up with Paul, the apostle.
Seriously thank you for this. I’ve been struggling with this even though it’s so clear in the scripture. I appreciate the way you break things down and take your time explaining scripture!
He doesn't torture them for eternity : fear the one who can Destroy both body and soul / cast into the lake of fire - second death. So the airline ticket is correct.
This video is the best explanation of predestination I have seen so far, it’s very clear and easy to understand. Great work this video was extremely edifying.
This video was a terrible terrible explanation of predestination. God has not predestined that certain people would be believers, He's predestined to save believers! The will of the Father is that those who look to the son and believe will have eternal life! It is by believing that we may have life in His name. Those predestined in Ephesians 1 are... the faithful in Christ! Please re-read, and see that no one is predestined to become the faithful in Christ... the faithful in Christ are to be adopted as sons! You may feel edified by this video, but this video impugns God's character and distorts the very gospel itself.
@@christian_gamer_guy6447 Belief is a prerequisite for salvation, so to say God predestined salvation but not belief is a logical error. So if we are predestined to salvation, so then are we predestined for belief in Christ. Just as an orphan is chosen for adoption, by no act of his own, God has adopted His elect by His own choosing. From the passage you cited: ”In love He predestined us for adoption to Himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of His will” (Ephesians 1:5).
@@andyj6384 "Belief is a prerequisite for salvation, so to say God predestined salvation but not belief is a logical error." No. There is no reason, biblical or otherwise, to think that God determines our belief. He want's us all to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth, and He is convicting the world of sin and drawing all men to Himself, but He doesn't force people to believe. He's chosen to save the faithful in Christ, He hasn't chosen some people to be believers. "So if we are predestined to salvation, so then are we predestined for belief in Christ." No one outside of Christ is destined to be saved. If we are in Christ, we are adopted as sons. We are sealed in Christ when we hear the gospel and believe, as Ephesians 1:13 says. "God has adopted His elect by His own choosing. " Yes, and "For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” (John 6:40). He's chosen to save believers. it is by believing that we may have life in His name (John 20:31). We gain access to God's grace by our faith (Romans 5:2). His will is to save the faithful in Christ. "From the passage you cited: ”In love He predestined us for adoption to Himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of His will” (Ephesians 1:5)." Right... and the "us" here, are the faithful in Christ Jesus from verse 1 that He's talking about. He's talking to believers. Paul never says that God has chosen someone outside of Christ to be in Christ and be saved... no, it says He's chosen "us *in Him* " before the foundation of the world. He's chosen, from the foundation of the world, to save those who are in Christ or, us in Him. Notice how it does not say that He's chosen us TO BE in Christ. Calvinists often have a very hard time seeing this clearly, and I would urge you to take your time and really be honest with the text.
Pastor? I've been so grateful for your videos. Your simple and straightforward way of spreading the word is so refreshing. I'm honored to call you my brother, Bob
I am so glad that I came across your video. This is an awesome explanation of Armininism and Calvinism. I thank God every day for His grace and mercy in my life. I am now a brand new subscriber and I am looking forward to watching more of your videos. Thank You and God Bless.
John 3:16 pretty much puts the stop on calvinism or Acts 13:43 men can be persuaded in the grace of God, Acts 13:46 men can accept or reject the gospel, Acts 13:47 the gospel is for all men, John 6:40 those who believe are ordained to eternal life...etcetera and on and on and on....God knows the end game but we are not robots, we have free will to choose life or death, believe the gospel or reject it. Just because God knows who will accept the gospel does not make us pre destined, it just means He is the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last. He is omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent.
Agreed with the added insight of love. Just because he CAN see who will choose, does not mean he actually chooses to use this ability. What is to say he could have created us, and not looked ahead at the outcome, and be loving and rooting for us this whole time and sad and disappointed when we don't make it but overwhelmed with joy when we do? Why would the master rejoice in Luke 15:11-32 when the prodigal son returns if he already knew he would return????!!!!!
Allen, I will be producing a respectful video in response to this soon but I want you to know you’re always welcome to come on to my broadcast and discuss these things openly and cordially as brothers. I appreciate your ministry. -Leighton
Thanks Leighton. It is necessary to get an actual non Calvinist point of view on the points raised by Allen Parr. The suppositions, such as don't use logic and the straw man argument of God's Sovereignty Vs man's free will is disappointing to hear from Allen Parr who one assumes is suggesting that he is giving equal weight to the options he presents before coming to his view. The copout at the end that perhaps I'll change my mind in the future cements the view that perhaps he should do a more detailed investigation including both Calvinist and non Calvinists before influencing his significant audience. By the way I find most of Allen's information useful to get me to read my Bible with discernment and hopefully clarity from The Holy Spirit.
You better be on your knees thanking God for His mercy everyday. He didn’t have to save you, but He chose to do so. God never planned on saving everyone.
Thank you! This is something I’ve heard but have been rather confused about. You’ve given me such insight. We should feel so honored to serve such a merciful father. My husband has introduced me to your teachings and my knowledge has grown deeper. I have the upmost respect for your humbleness in the way you apologized about the music video picture on the one you did of Beyoncé. I don’t understand how those who even remotely identify as Christians can listen to any kind of this worldly music these days. My husband and I was absolutely floored at the words of it but then again, neither of us know why we was with the conditions of the way this world is. Anyways, sorry I just got off topic but I wanted to thank you for that. May the Lord bless and keep you and your family. -❤️Your Sister In Christ, Lesly
Awesome breakdown Brother Allen. Yes, a very difficult doctrine for our minds to grasp. I am sensitive to those who may struggle with this. Especially if they are being exposed to it for the very first time. It took me a long time to understand it as well. Due, in large part, to my one -sided exposure to God's love and mercy at the expense of not being exposed to God's righteousness and justice. Even now, there are days that I struggle with the Doctrine of Double Predestination. That is, until I prayerfully go back to the Scriptures, and see a complete and balanced view of God. And the Scriptures remind me that God loves us and that He also loves righteousness and justice (Psalm 33:5). Both sides need to be on display for the world to see and for us to have an accurate and balanced view of God. Also, I think we naturally get caught up asking the question, "Why does God choose some to be saved and passes over others?' When the real question we should be asking ourselves is, "Why does God choose anybody to be saved?" That being said, this does not mean that we leap for joy and do cartwheels when the Holy Spirit brings illumination to our minds concerning this tough doctrine. Like you stated, it just magnifies the AMAZING GRACE of God for choosing us before the foundations of the earth and for not giving us what we wanted as well. What this doctrine does for me, is that it causes me to ask, Why did you choose to save a wretched sinner like me, Lord? Why ME?
@@EricSmyth4Christ Amen brother! I'll add this- What he did see in me was my sin. And now, because of His amazing, overwhelming, unexplainable, grace towards me, He now sees the imputed righteousness of Christ in me! 2 Corinthians 5:21 Thank you for your reply brother.
@@davewatson2124 Hi Dave. Great question. Space does not allow me to go into detail about the sinful and immoral lifestyle I lived prior to 2004 and how resistant I was to God and the things of God. I had no desire to know Him or to please him in word, deed, or thought. I neither feared Him or reverenced Him. I lived a self-absorbed life and questioned God's very existence. The last thing I ever thought I would do in my life was to follow Jesus Christ. But one day in December 2004, I was sitting in a school office and in the midst of hearing some hard news about my daughter, I looked up with tears in my eyes and mouthed the words, "O' God," And all I can tell you is that something happened to me in that office that cannot be put into words because it has to be experienced. All I know is that I walked out of that office a changed man. All of a sudden, I had a deep desire to know God, read the Bible and to be around other believers in a church setting. Prior to that day, I could not retain God in my thinking for 5 minutes. Since that day, I have a constant awareness of His presence (not that I always feel His presence) and as I read and studied the Bible, I became convinced that the Bible is the Word of God, that Jesus is the only way to the Father and that I needed to repent of my sin and to believe unto Him for the salvation of my soul. At the time, I did not have an understanding as to what had occurred. But I now know that in that principals office, God graciously caused me to be born again. I say this because since that day, I have a burning desire to know Christ, to worship Christ, to love and obey Christ, to serve Christ, and to honor Him in all that I do. None of these desires were alive in me for the first 40 years of my life. This experience and the fruit that the Holy Spirit is now producing in me, is how I know that God graciously chose me. To God be ALL the glory! Thank you again for your great question Dave.
@@loum.2864 Hi Lou You have similar circumstances to me. I was brought up in a Christian home but lived a sinful life as a teenager and young man and all the way until i was about 50. I got on my knees at work one day and asked Jesus into my life and slowly changed my ways. I read my Bible and pray every day. I attend Church and i was Baptised a couple of years ago. Now according to Alenn Parr who is a Calvanist i can not be sure i am going to Heaven [ nor can you ] I am now scared that Jesus will say to me those words "depart from me i never knew you" To me the Calvanist view makes a mockery of John 3 : 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son so that all who believe in him will not perish but have eternal life. Regards.
I look at it like, " God doesn't want anyone to perish. He calls everyone to repent and come to the knowledge of Salvation. We all have free will. So He calls us, BUT we have to want to hear His call. He who has an ear let him hear. Some hear His call and some do not hear His call.
Would love you to watch a video called. Romans 9 De-Calvanized. Channel name Beyond The Fundamentals. I think you would enjoy it. Both yourself and Allen.
@@thebeatagp i know you dont call yourself a Calvanist and im not calling you one either but i would love for you to watch video titled ‘Romans 9 De-Calvanized’ by channel name Beyond The Fundamentals. I think you and Corey would find it interesting at least.
@@thebeatagp Mr Allen if hell is predestined by God does that not imply that he's abandoned his purpose for creating the Earth? If the answer to the question is yes then what he said about himself at Isaiah 55:10 and 11 cannot be true.
Good morning Allen. I appreciate your teaching. You have a very clear, simple way of explaining the Bible. Thank you. As long as you’re in the public eye, and a stand for a truth and you love the Lord, you’re always going to be criticized, shame on those people. Continue pressing on toward the goal 🙏🏼
In one of my visitations to hell, Jesus showed me a person who was a Christian (Jesus said “he was a Christian like you”). But the guy unfortunately started sleeping around (1 cor 6:9). He died middle aged and went to hell forever it was dark but Jesus lit up the area, he asked Jesus for another chance but unfortunately it was too late for him, Pretty sad, Repent and ask Jesus to help you with your struggles (James 4:7)
If God predetermines some to go to Heaven, then it's impossible He doesn't predestine people to Hell, with proves His favoritism of some over others, before their births, which negates Him being just, loving, and fair.
Well tbh it's true some people aren't meant for heaven and u can tell cus they never accept Jesus no matter what but all huans deserve hell so it's fair God chooses who he wants to be with him
Thank you Allen. I sat down this Saturday morning just to hear this and watch this video and now I find myself in a full on study! Your presentation was delivered beautifully and leads me to the word for further study. I appreciate your service to God and look forward to more teaching. Thx
Whoa hold up Allen Saying God is not logical, but theological is just NOT TRUE. Theological meaning = Relating to the study of theology, and pastoral training (why would God need pastoral training. Logical or Being Logical = meaning. Is something that makes sense according to the rules of logic or something that is rational. Make not mistake EVERYTHING God does or say makes sense. And just because some people don't understand it, It's not God, it us. and what does the bible tell us to do. Ask. for wisdom and understanding. Jas 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
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Thank you Allen for your clarification of this subject. Even in my church has been the subject of free will. Even I know that I am saved by God's wonderful grace and mercy. My father was a pastor at our church for 60 years. His favorite sayings which I keep today " The heart of the matter is the matter of the heart" and " It's not about religion but your relationship". Thank you for your words of wisdom.
I've always been under the understanding that when he says he's chosen people before the creation of the world, he is speaking of everyone. I believe God has chosen everyone before the creation of time to love him. I believe that's part of what it means to be made in his image. However, I also believe that some of us are stubborn and stuck in our ways and he will leave those who want to be stuck in their ways. I don't believe that makes it works based just because we choose to have faith. I think that's what makes us have to walk in humility because Jesus did not have to go to the cross for anyone. But because of Jesus' sacrifice we can now have full access to the Holy of Holies and live in all that God has called us to live. So in summary: I believe what Jesus says in Matthew 22:14, "Many are called, but few are chosen." God calls on all of us to believe in him, but few of us are chosen because we're not wearing the right "wedding clothes". We're not chosen because we refuse to follow our King and live in his ways. It doesn't make us better or more wise, but it makes us humble enough to trust in Jesus instead of our own flesh.
The question is, what did the atonement accomplish? Did christ die to merely make salvation possible, and then man needs to have faith to actuate that atonement? Or did Christ actually accomplish His goal, when He said it is finished.
@@Terror1Void I believe he accomplished his goal by creating a gate for us to walk through. However, luckily God doesn't force us to walk through that gate.
@@Terror1Void I didn't say he failed. He succeeded at dying for our sins. I just don't believe Scripture supports the idea that God forces us to follow him.
I thank God, for using you, brother Island Allen in Jesus' mighty name. For such a time like this I am blessed every time for the word of God in you brother keep up the great work of God.🙏
Hi Mr. Allen, I appreciate your courage to tackle this difficult topic and even make an effort to explain the Calvinism side. I have a question though, how can you explain the verses that talk about salvation is really for EVERYONE? How will you reconcile those verses in relation to other verses that speak about election? Thank you for acknowledging me and for making an effort to answer my questions.
@@John-jh5ks You do realize the one who is reading the Bible has to interpret the words written on the page right? Just “you and your Bible” theology is a great way to interpret the Bible in your own image. You have to properly exegete the text to determine what the scriptures are teaching.
@@John-jh5ks that makes no sense. We are supposed to benefit off of the wisdom of others to interpret the Bible. This doesn't mean we are making others some sort of Pope with the authority to infallible impart truth.
Not a good scope of both sides bro. I could not disagree more with your conclusions on some passages and your general conclusion. Calvinism is broken, and you can’t glean over it by telling believers to be thankful that God elected them. Can you imagine how wild it must be for an unbeliever watching this video hearing that. I think you’d do this conversation much better justice if you invited folks from the other side to talk and state their case. Love you brother, you are doing a great job
Calvinism is one of the biggest smears on God’s character that was ever invented by man. You don’t reach the teaching of Calvinism/Augustine by reading the Bible. Someone has to tech it to you. If you tie that to “eternal conscious torment” (which also has less scripture than other points of view), God becomes the person that he would never allow us to be. It’s like me eternally tormenting you (the reader) for being blind - and I’m the one blinding you!
I will say this, and please hear me out. It is my belief that God provided the way for Salvation through His sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross. It is up to man to choose whether or not to accept that Gift of Salvation. Not that men should boast that they choose and others didn't, but instead in the reverence of the sacrifice that Christ made, they give all glory honor and praise to Jesus, who is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. The Bible clearly paints the picture that God desires all to come to Him, even though He realizes that not all of them will, He wants them to have the chance to do so. Just like when man walked in the garden and they had the choice not to eat from the fruit, God gave them a choice because God is a just God and a loving Father and wants us to choose to obey Him and to follow after Him, rather than it be forced and we would be as mere puppets never having the opportunity to know anything else. The idea of predestination takes all the idea of choice out of the equation and it makes it seem that God didn't desire for all of mankind to come to Him and is contrary to the well established character of God. God sent the prophets in hopes that the people would repent, in fact he turned away an army at the doorstep of Israel/Judah because a king repented and thus he and his people would not face the wrath of God that day. It was a choice, not that the king would be glorified for becoming humble, but for the king to realize that he needed the King of Kings to guide and protect him. God gave man the choice in the garden. Jesus gave the rich young ruler a choice. He gave the disciples a choice, they could have said no and went about their lives. He gives you and I the choice to accept His free gift of Eternal Life, and after that we have the choice to walk in Him. The Bible clearly says that if we draw close to God, that He will draw close to us, that if we walk in The Spirit, that we will not fulfill the desires of the flesh, that if we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us of all unrighteousness, if we humble ourselves before the Lord, that He will exault us in due time, that faith without works is dead. God wants us to choose Him. He wants action from us, not that it would be a passive predefined amount of people who would choose Him and those who wouldn't, He wants man to choose righteousness. He is a just God and worthy of all glory honor and praise. How much more glory and honor would it bring a man to say these people choose me to be the leader of their life, vs, I made this predefined small group to follow after me and here they are. How much more would be the glory to God to say these of man kind have chosen to follow after Me despite all that the world would give, despite all the battles of the flesh they would face, they still choose Me. The time of God choosing a select group of people already occurred once and the Israelites disobeyed God and hence why He sent Jesus to save the world from their sins and not just a select few, He opened the gates of heaven to the world of they choose to accept it. The veil was torn in two, by your way of thinking, the veil is still in place, blocking people out, but that is not the case. The Gospel is very clear in that whosoever believes in Him shall have everlasting life. For you or anyone to say otherwise puts more glory on men who are "chosen" than on God, who wants man to choose to follow after Him. By your thinking the saved could view themselves as higher than those who are not saved, and therefore could lead to pride and arrogance in the man because he views himself as chosen and others as not chosen, and this prideful and arrogant attitude is not what God wants us to have. He wants us to be humble. We have seen where this attitude of chosen and not chosen had led in areas throughout history, it typically doesn't end well.
@@aprophetsreward he also didn't mention where do those who have walked away from the faith, deconstructed, or denounced their faith fit into his predestination equation. If that line of thinking was correct then once the predestined came to Christ then that would be it, no other choice to the contrary, but that isn't what we see happening. As much as my heart breaks for those who walk away from the faith, deconstruct it, or denounce it, it is an occurrence that happens, which goes back to my point that salvation is a choice, faith is a choice.
It’s simple. Receive the kingdom of God like a child, and receive his word like a child. Don’t put too much into it. Don’t be putting extra things in scripture. Take the raw scripture with its original meaning and go with what you read. There are vessels of wrath and vessels of mercy. Predestination is a thing. Who are you to question God? Who are you to answer back to God? Asking him why have you made me like this? God has rights over the clay he created.
Thank you Allen for your passion in sharing the truth to us and what the Word of God is really saying about these topics. I appreciate the hard work and sincerity you always put into your videos. Now I finally have a better understanding about predestination and how God pass overs those who do not want Jesus in their life. God bless you!
The gospel was so simple when I got saved years ago, it was saved by grace through faith in Christ and you're good forever. Why does it seem so complicated nowadays? This is a really good question!
Alan, Even though I knew you and I do not agree on Calvanism I was looking forward hearing why you believe Calvinism to be true. However, I was disappointed in a couple of areas. There are 4. points I will address; the first 3 will be short the third will take a little longer to address. 1. You start with Armenianism vs Calvinism. There are other POV - see Sotoriology 101 for an example. 2. Man centered vs. God centered. This is not how a non-Calvinist thinks about this topic. You should not straw man the other side. 3. If this were my first time listening to you and I heard you say; "Don't use Logic", I would have turned your video off and never returned. However, I am a subscriber so I've heard a lot of good things from you. I will also remain a subscriber. God created logic and I believe expects us to use it. God is logical and he is theological. 4. I like the way you said Calvinists must take both side of Predestination. If God chooses some to heaven, than God has chosen the rest to go to Hell. A lot of folks try to get out of that and you didn't. However you did try to downplay it and show how merciful God is to allow some to go to Heaven. You used the tickets to Hawaii as an analogy. Your analogy paints this doctrine in a pleasant view and it shouldn't be pleasant. Let's choose a different analogy. I have 2 boys and they are in a raging ocean and will drown if I don't do anything. I have the ability to save both boys and nothing can stop me from saving them both. I choose to save one, not for any other reason than my choice. Would you look at me and say how merciful I was that I saved one? No you wouldn't; nobody would ( this is where you don't want us to logic). God created us all and could save all of us, but Calvinism says that he chose not to save all, just some. I could also use your analogy with a couple of tweeks. Everybody is in the Airport (Earth) and there only 2 destinations we can go, Hawaii or (pick the worst place you can think of). There are enough planes to take everyone to one of these places and all the planes are capable of getting to both destinations. Now the Airlines (God) chooses a few people to go to Hawaii and the rest have to go to the other place. We don't see that as loving or merciful that they/God chose a few to go to Hawaii. You need to own this too. It is not loving or merciful to those who didn't have the option of going to Hawaii. If God is all loving, how can you reconcile this. You can't, so you tell us not to use logic. Like I said earlier, there are more than two options for understanding these verses. Great scholars disagree on this and shouldn't say that it is clearly this or that. If it were clear, than we wouldn't have true Bible believing Christians disagreeing on this topic.
I agree. I was surprised he came to the conclusion he did, since I usually believe mostly the same things. But there are many more scripture verses that disprove this. I will still subscribe and watch, but I’m disappointed. I think when these verses that are taken as “elect” and the flip side, others chosen for hell, they are either wording issues OR God choosing some individuals for specific tasks (like prophets, John the Baptist, Nebuchadnezzar, etc.) Mike Winger does a very long video on the unbiblical view of Calvinism and why - it’s almost two hours, I think. Really good.
WOW BROTHER ALLEN !!!! Thank you so much for explaining these concepts…our church is spending one full year (all groups, men’s, Women’s, Youth ) studying the book of Romans. I pondered how our Pastor was going to handle Romans 9: 15-18……. "….mercy on whom He wills, hardens whom He wills" At the end of the sermon he said, "you don’t think this is fair ? And you don’t understand it ? ……remember this , He is God, you are not " Thank you again Rich A
I LOVE this channel. Nothing like an in-depth study. It´s exactly the long-form presentation CZcams was made for. Thank you for taking such good advantage of that.
I have just subscribed!! Thank you very much for always delivering with sound scriptures. Listening to you is like sitting at Bible study with a friend or family member! I'm so excited to be back ( I was backsliding for awhile)to learning about the gospel. My holy spirit is yearning for this knowledge! I like the diverse topics of your videos as well, and you always put scripture first!! May God continue to bless you, and help you deliver his word! 🤗🙏🏽🌅
We, as human beings, just can't seem to help it. This temptation to mind other people's business. In this case, we actually want to mind God's business. Instead of just being obedient with humility and doing our part as commanded, we want to also KNOW all about God's part, have it explained to us clearly so that His part makes sense to us too, despite Him telling us plainly that some things are for Him to know only and that we cannot know everything like He does. There are some things we can know - actually a LOT of things we can know - but there are some things we can't know. We are the created, not the Creator. Yes, right now at this very moment our Living God knows EXACTLY who is going to Hell, who is not, along with everything that leads up to that, and everything that happens after that. We shouldn't try to judge (as fair or unfair) what we don't understand but we do it anyway, it is what it is lol. The main problem is that people can't reconcile in their minds how it is possible for us to have our free will - here on earth in our dimension of time - while God not only knows what we will do at all times, but has actually orchestrated every aspect of us and our behavior - outside of our dimension of time. God exists in a manner we can't comprehend just as we exist in a way that ants can't comprehend. Most of us don't quite consider it in that way, and when we try to, it blows us away. The concept of our agency not originating with us is a challenging concept for human beings in many ways. I appreciate and agree with the way you summed this up - this is yet another reason (of countless) to orient ourselves towards the position of being thankful to God... that's what we should take away from this discussion. God Bless You!
Your reply helped me. Years ago I was praying for the salvation of my dad. I heard inside my head a verbal reply I fully believe was God. " I will do all that is my part.". I was shocked and relieved because it wasn't my own thought. Since then I have been trying to understand what he meant by that. It could mean my dad's part is to respond in faith, or maybe that all of it is God's part. Who really knows? I think I need to give up trying to know what God's part is and stay in my own lane. My unbelieving dad will be 86 this year but is still in his right mind. Waiting to see what it turns out. Btw I only had this type of response to prayer two times in my 30+ years of Christian life. Rare.
@@charlotteroath9904 Amen!!! I think that God Blessed you greatly when He responded to you and told you that. He assured you that He has this covered according to His purpose.
Thanks for that encouragement. I just woke up at 4 am and sat up in bed wide awake. I was thinking about my post. Suddenly it came to me. Yes, God has his part in salvation. Based on what he said, there is another part. Obviously there is another part. I assumed the other part was my dad's response. Maybe what I should have realized all these years is the other part is mine. Mine is to tell the gospel . God's part and my part. Not God's part and my dad's part. I need to try again.
I like my pastor's explanation of predestination and it's very simple: God made everything in the universe including time, He can see all of time at the same time and see what we would do with our lives over time. Before He set it all in motion, He predetermined that those who chose Jesus would be with Him in heaven when time ended. That's it.
@@willp.8120 Literally all you have to do is read it in context in Romans and in Malachi... and the rest of the Bible for that matter. It's a much, much harder sell to say they're being treated individually here.
If God doesn't intervene with drawing the elect, no one chooses him, we all go to hell. We all chose flesh over spirit because that is our nature until God does a miracle with our heart.
To ANY who believe, He gives the right to become children of God. Everyone has the same opportunity to get saved because He desires none to perish. Human beings having free will doesn't mean He doesn't know the future.
@@SpiritLife James 1:1-Israelites, 1Corinthians1:2-Israelites, Ephesians 1:1-Israelites. Romans1:7-Israelites. Romans 9:4-5, The Adoption, the glory, the COVENANTS, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the PROMISES all pertain to Israelites. From Genesis to Revelation and beyond, the scriptures were written by, to and for Israelites. These letters were written exclusively to Israelites, therefore everything in those letters only pertains to Israelites. Christ only came for Israelite. Romans 9:5 and Matthew 15:24.
@@christopherbarge414 John 17:20 Jesus said “I am not praying only for these men but for all those who will believe in me through their message." The disciples spread their message (of faith in Jesus) to the Gentiles. They died in foreign lands preaching to Gentiles. God told Peter to offer the Gospel to the Gentiles and Holy Spirit was baptizing them. Paul called himself the apostle to the Gentiles. The gospel is to all and much of the new testament was written DIRECTLY to gentiles like in Rome, Corinth, etc.
@@SpiritLife The scriptures do not contradict. You said, "I am not praying only for these men but for all those who will believe in me through their message". That is true. Jesus already restricted that in (Matthew 15:24) I am not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. This is also reenforced in (Acts 5:31) Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to ISRAEL, and forgiveness of sins. The reason that there is an apparent contradiction, is because you don't understand that all the "GENTILES" that Paul preached to were also "Israelites". (1Crinthians 10:1-2) Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; How could Paul say to the Corinthians, "all our fathers" if they were not Israelites?
Another good, touchy subject. One of Chuck Missler's last books, "The Sovereignty of Man" covered this subject in a pretty good way. The super short answer is "pre knowledge is not the same as pre destination". I appreciate longer vidoes. Shorts are awful, but that's just my opinion.
So I'm not questioning God's fairness since we all deserve to go to hell. But how is this doctrine in keeping with the heart of the one who said that he is not willing that any should perish? I'm thinking a passage of Romans nine is actually describing how God predestined the way of faith instead of works so that no man may boast that he saved himself or that he's somehow earned it. I do believe it takes God's divine grace and mercy to even have the gift of faith and to be saved which is why we should pray for everyone.
This is what God says about predestination: ““But if a wicked person turns away from all the sins they have committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, that person will surely live; they will not die. None of the offenses they have committed will be remembered against them. Because of the righteous things they have done, they will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign Lord. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?” Ezekiel 18:21-23 NIV
Judas seemed to have been predestined, but he had free will to refuse to betray Jesus. It is a mystery we may never grasp. Satan entered him. Did he have no choice after that?
I’m under the impression that God put Judas in that position, because he knew that given the choice, Judas would betray Jesus. Judas still had the free choice to not do so, in that case God would have found someone else who was willing to betray Jesus and put them in the position Judas was in, or Jesus would have ended up on the cross by another means entirely
@@JesusIsLord7773 you’re right., even isaiah said one of his disciples will betray him but isaiah wasn’t just specific about the person,,, someone had to betray jesus that night for him to die for our sins
Just sharing my salvation story. God brought me to a place where He gave me the choice between going on in my old life or following Him. Now, without God drawing me, then saving me, I would have no hope. Salvation is from Him but I remember He gave that choice before He saved me. There was a struggle between what my friends and family would say and giving myself totally to God. Some Christians say, just saying yes to God is a work and I saved myself. However, if God didn’t draw me I wouldn’t have had the chance to say yes in the first place.
I was saved bc of being tormented by demons. A light bulb clicked and I cried, "help" to Jesus. (Understood my sin and how it offended God, prior to this.) All I asked for was help and I woke up saved/born again. He saved me when I cried for help, i don't feel like my story has my thumbprint on it at all. So, I can see the Calvinist view very easily.
Congrats brother Allen! Your almost at a million subscribers! That is so wonderful to see. Praise the Lord and may the Lord continue to bless you for all your faithful work and efforts for the Kingdom. Hallelujah!
A true Christian who follows Jesus Christ fully is transported from the kingdom of darkness to the Kingdom of light, he goes from being a child of the devil to being adopted by God. When people are adopting a child, they CHOOSE to adopt the child that’s why it is called CHOSEN in scripture. Romans 8: 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
In one of my visitations to hell, Jesus showed me a person who was a Christian (Jesus said “he was a Christian like you”). But the guy unfortunately started sleeping around (1 cor 6:9). He died middle aged and went to hell forever it was dark but Jesus lit up the area, he asked Jesus for another chance but unfortunately it was too late for him, Pretty sad, Repent and ask Jesus to help you with your struggles (James 4:7)
Thank you so much for this very powerful insight. I’m always very grateful and appreciative of your research you’ve shared with listeners to help gain clarity on important topics you’ve discussed! May God continue to bless you the speaker and the listeners of His Word, according to His own Divine Plan of Salvation for all Eternity!
First off thanks brother for this video I cant say that I 100% agree nor disagree, even after the video and years of studying this topic, I admit that I just dont know But I do see God giving people the opportunity to choose Him. With all the bible verses explained in the video, it’s clear. And I dont see us choosing Christ as a reason to boast and say to myself when I am in Heaven that I made a good choice and my neighbor did not. I dont see how saying Yes or No to Salvation/Christ is a Work, when the work that actually mattered and that has true value is already done and accomplished in Christ Jesus. I see salvation as a gift already wrapped up and placed at my doorstep, I cleary dont deserve this Gift, I deserve the opposite but in God’s mercy He places it at my doorstep, just because I bend down and pick up this Gift, in my opinion, is Not a Work. I see the Work as already being done based of Scripture Also I do not ignore the verses in which explains God choosing us, some verses lack context, some that Calvinist use, like some talk about choosing specific people for specific task and choosing in terms of the Gentiles. Overall in God’s Soverignty, He can do whatever He wants and still be Holy, because He doesnt have to save anyone of us a good explination of Romans 9 is Mike Winger’s video czcams.com/video/7y4yjSwEkfY/video.html
I just went on ChatGPT, and it gave very different implications for the first "prepared" (in verse 22). I'd like your thoughts on this. GPT: Romans 9:22: κατηρτισμένα (katērtismena) • Word: κατηρτισμένα (katērtismena) • Root: καταρτίζω (katartizō) • Meaning: To prepare, to make ready, to fit or adapt, to complete, to mend. • Grammatical Form: Perfect passive participle, nominative plural neuter. Romans 9:22: κατηρτισμένα (katērtismena) • Translation: "prepared for destruction." • Context: This verse speaks about the objects of God's wrath. The use of the perfect passive participle form suggests that these objects have been prepared or fitted for destruction, emphasizing a completed action with lasting effects. • Implications: The term can imply that these objects are in a state of readiness or fitness for destruction. The passive voice suggests that the preparation is something done to them rather than by them. Please explain this, as contrasted with what you teach here?
God bless you for covering this tough topic. I believe in predestination. I also believe that everyone who ends up in Hell deserves that judgment. Because in Romans 1:21 it says that those going to Hell knew God but CHOSE not to worship Him. So while it is true that God predestines us, we have been called to "make our election sure". It's a two-way street between eternity and our time-bound realm.
DW: Just as long as we understand - in Calvinism - people are *MADE* to deserve destruction. John Calvin -quote He foresees future events *ONLY* in consequence of his decree (Institutes Vol ii. p. 169.) Calvinist Paul Helms -quote His foreknowledge is simply his knowledge of what he has decreed. (Divine Foreknowledge - Four Views pg 12) In the Arminian version of divine foreknowledge and divine sovereignty - people are held accountable for what they are *FOUND* to be and *FOUND* to do. In the Calvinist version of divine foreknowledge and divine sovereignty - people are held accountable for what they are *MADE* to be and *MADE* to do. Everything is established at the foundation of the world - by an infallible decree. And no ALTERNATIVE of that which is decreed is granted to the creature.
“God is not logical, He is theological”… I love you as a brother in the Lord, Allen, but I have to admit this is one of the cringiest lines I’ve heard in a while!
I disagree with your comment. Do you think humans can obtain God's level of understanding? Not possible. ps anyone who says cringe is super sus as a Christian.
@@lf1899 I don’t disagree with what Allen was trying to say, I disagree with his use of words. “Theological” is not some God-level of logic, it’s the study of God and by extension his Word. So in effect Allen was saying “God is not logical, he is the study of himself.” And I’m sorry if the use of cringe offends you (I wasn’t aware that it was a word that made people question one’s salvation) but I though it was a nicer term than “stupid.”
When you take things out of context, & just focus on a statement alone, Everything becomes cringe / weird. I think I agree with Allen he was just telling that Gods thoughts are higher than ours. Plain & simple.
@@pramodjingade6581 you obviously didn’t bother reading this thread since I said just above your comment that I don’t disagree with Allen either, showing that I know what he was trying to say. I was simply pointing out that his use of words were cringe. And context doesn’t change that. He said something that is factually incorrect because he was trying to play on words, which is why I said that it was cringe.
the verse in Peter says 'not willing that any OF US should perish" that is what it says in the greek. The verse in Timothy that says ALL men, doesnt mean every single person, in context Paul is speaking to gentile nations outside of Israel , the only place that had the light of God upon them prior to Christ declaring 'go out into all the world'
I'm just thinking about how none of us deserves mercy. We all deserve to go to hell. And i'm thankful that God even decided to choose the small flock He will save. We have a too high view of ourselves that's why we think that all people have a chance...
There is NO ROOM for misunderstanding ..For God so love the World.I could not and Never will believe that God sent people to hell for His Glory.True disappointed 😢
Then I do believe you need to go and reread Exodus where God was hardening Pharaoh's heart against the people of Israel. And God doesn't predestin people to hell, if you lived your life without committing one sin you will go to heaven. Problem is we are all sinners and all deserve judgment.
Hey BEAT family! I got a deep one for you all today. WARNING: This video is not for those who simply want to just skim through and get a quick answer. I had to take my time with this and really try to break this down and look at it from all sides. I hope you appreciate and enjoy this video and I look forward to hearing your thoughts as always below. Enjoy!
Did your view point change on this? Your previous videos on Calvinism you seemed to disagree with Calvinists.
@@jdj2022 no. My position has been the same throughout. You may have been slightly misunderstood or perhaps I wasn't as clear as I should have been. Can you help me understand what you thought my position was on this so I can clarify?
My take on the elect has always been to Jews/12 tribes of Isreal. He chose (or promised) Abraham certain things. It shows consistency in the two Testaments.
God chose (predestined) his people (Isrealites) to be "the Elect".
He didn't choose us gentiles but through Jesus, we are adopted to the Elect. Grafted to the vine by accepting the finished work of Salvation.
The idea of a predestined elect is to show God's consistancy through the different dispensations.
Only God knows the depths of who we are as humans. He is very mysterious, no matter how you explan it.
Romans 8:29 💝
"For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren."
Brother Allen, you leave out the possibility that, along with other mysteries of scripture, both are true. That God chooses, and we have no part in the decision, which is the Calvinist view, and that people have to make a decision, which is the Armenian view. Is it not possible that God chooses, ANd we must also decide to either accept His gift or reject it? In other words, neither The calvinist View nor the Armenian view are 100% correct. There are many things about God that are both/and as opposed to either/or. Perhaps this is one of them.
The last part of this video where Allen talks about bringing the gospel to as many people as possible is so true. I finally built up the courage through Jesus of course, to do this with a young man I encountered while on patrol ( I’m a police officer). This guy had basically lost all hope, was having suicidal thoughts and was seeking to be committed to a mental health facility. I drove him to a local hospital for assistance, but while I drove him there I decided to try my hand at evangelism. I asked him how many times he had been through this broken man made system, which he replied multiple times. Clearly the system isn’t helping and he is stuck in an endless cycle of misery and pain. So I asked him if he believes in God, which he replied yes. When I asked if he knew the gospel, he replied no. When explained the gospel to him and recommended putting his troubles on the savior, his eyes lit up. By the time we were done with our conversation along with an invitation to my church, he was in a completely different state of mind. He went from a man who had no hope whatsoever to someone who had just been given the world. I have been praying for him ever since that he will continue to seek the Lord and hope to see him at my next church service. I was very hesitant about trying to evangelize a complete stranger for a long time, and I continued to pray to God to give me the strength, the feeling I had after this encounter was amazing. If your like me, continue to ask God for the strength and get out there, you won’t regret it.
Great story and you should be highly commended. I About 14 years ago, I became very suicidal myself (7 attempts) and was admitted to a mental health facility three times. I think Allen's view that God predestines some to go to heaven and others to go to hell before they are even born is very misplaced. You said the young man's eyes lit up when you told him to give his troubles to the Lord (the very thing I ended up doing which completely broke my suicidal cycle, something three batteries of psychiatrists could not do). But what do you think he would have thought if you told him what Allen said in his video that God preordained at the beginning of time who was going to be saved and who was going to be unsaved no matter how much they believed in God? If it was me, I would have become even more suicidal after hearing that.
@@Madlou thank you very much, glory to God. Yea I agree with u, I don’t necessarily agree with this message either but I don’t pretend to know the answers to these questions by any means. And you know as well as I do that bringing this point up before someone in that state of mind would be a terrible idea. That’s why I just kept it simple and told him about the gospel that he had never heard before. And praise the Lord that he helped you out of your troubles as well Louis, may he continue to bless you. And thank you for the kind words sir.
Oh man. What a testimony!
HalleluYAH! 🙏 That's wonderful! Well done!
Wow. That was such an amazing story. Thank you for sharing. ❤️
Because God knows all things, I do believe He knows who will get saved and knows who will reject Him.
I hope you don't mean we are the one who choose to accept or refuse the salvation, then God just act upon that
He knows us from beginning to end but in life we still have free will. He knows exactly what we will do with that free will which is to follow him or not.
Thankfully we do not have the ability to see who and who will not receive mercy from God. Instead we are called to spread the Gospel. Some may not be saved the moment of hearing the gospel the 1st time. I’m sure many if not all who are saved can say we have seen God save someone at his own time and at his own will.
@@RichWeigel this is not Biblical. We were once dead in our sins. Those who are dead cannot choose to make themselves alive. Jesus said we must be reborn- we did not choose to be born the first time and similarly we cannot choose to be born again. All glory be to God for salvation by grace through faith in his only begotten son Jesus Christ. He chose us. We did not choose Him. Faith is a gift from God that we do not choose or earn.
@@codykelly9650 Nowhere does it say faith is a gift. Ever. That is a twisting of the grammar of Ephesians 2. Romans 6:23 shows it is salvation, not faith, that is the gift.
God's omniscience should not be confused with predestination: He has declared the end from the beginning! He has given us free will; choose you this day whom ye will serve! God is good! Be blessed!!!🙏🤗💞
Amen to that. Thank God, for he is good!!!
Then I guess you took Ephesians out of your Bible. Alan is 100% correct in his teaching.
@@jonathanharness2962 So, are you telling me that you can or cannot accept His offer of salvation? He gives everyone a choice; just because He knows what each individual will do does not mean that they were predestined to heaven or hell! For example, Judas choice to betray Christ; it was his own choice, but God knew that he would. I hope this will help you understand the difference between an all-knowing God, and being predestined!🙏🤗💞
@@Richard-kf7py Judas was the son of perdition, chosen to betray Christ before the foundation of the world. Read Ephesians carefully and prayerfully and you will mature and understand Salvation is all of God and none of our doing.
@@jonathanharness2962 This is not a salvational issue, but we will just have to agree to disagree on this topic. I still love you as my brother in Christ. We will meet in the air!💯💞
John 3.16.
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, that who so ever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life 🕊Amen.
ja und die die glauben sind dazu bestimmt, die anderen hassen Gott, seine Gebote und lehnen es ab, weil das eine gefallene Welt ist und der Teufel herrscht heir als Fürst und verblendet die Sinne der Ungläubigen...nur wer aus Gott geboren wird, sucht Gott, die anderen nicht...ihr seid ihr nicht in einer neutralen Zone
The Lord gives me strength, it’s only because of him I have persevered. I have two beautiful boys both are autistic. My husband passed away years ago. I’m all alone. I lost my job over declining the vaccine. LIKE MANY OTHERS! I declined due to my pre existing health conditions lupus and heart disease. I’ve been struggling to provide for myself and my children since losing my job from Forsyth hospital. I’m now waitressing, and I’m thankful, but I’m not making nearly enough to get by. Groceries are super expensive. Every month is a battle to not end up on the streets with my two children. I’m constantly in fear of losing my home. To even think about being on the streets with two young children is terrifying. But even as I face homelessness seemingly every month. I have faith, God will provide. With GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE! Faith over fear.
God bless you my sister in Christ! Just don’t give up and never stop believing He is working it out for you! You will not lose your home!!! I agree with you in prayer
Mark 11:21
Amen sis and condolences for your loss. I pray God's hand of protection and peace be upon you and your family in Jesus name amen 🙏
God bless you and your little ones. my condolences for your loss and I can not imagine how you must feel, but we have a strong mighty father and all things work together for those who love the Lord. I declare in Jesus name your blessing is coming, I can see your faith is unyielding, please stay in faith and watch the Glory of God!!🙏🙏🙏🙏
I don’t know if you are apart of a church family, and is firmly planted there, however I strongly encourage that. Being planted in a sound biblical church they should be able to help you. Pray and ask God to lead you a biblical church.
I had the thought "God knows who will be saved and who will not be so he had chosen" but after watching this I realize He knows, but He also knows who and why they aren't saved. Salvation is offered to all, not all will accept it.
Well said🙏🏼
Because of God’s character He knows who will be saved. But He still allows mankind to make that choice. God knew ‘Job’ would never ‘curse’ Him for example.
God knew who would be saved because He chose them before the beginning of time. You have to realize man's condition to understand just how bad of shape were in. We are naturally totally dead in sins and trespasses and at enmity with God. We hate God and not only want nothing to do with Him, but rebel against Him. We were dead! That's not a figure of speech. It means to die or to be dead. A spiritually dead person can't make spiritual decisions, he can't discern them AND it's all foolishness to him. If indeed man choose God, it's all essentially 'luck' on man's part. But one must realize that if spiritual things are foolishness to (the natural) man, how unlikely is he to make the foolish choice! Rather, as the Bible indicates, that man must be quickened to spiritual life, he can now discern and make a good choice. A choice, that due to his new nature, is the only logical choice. The spiritual man makes the right choice everytime, because all those that are born again (spiritual life) will overcome, and those who overcome will make it to heaven.
@cdr 777 not what I'm talking about. They'll ultimately run back to Christ. Logically, I think what you're asserting has the potential end of a once true believer rejecting Christ, and we are told, absolutely unequivocally, that will not happen.
@cdr 777 I didn't say you said that, simply that if you logically extend out the idea that a spiritual person could ultimately make the wrong decision, his end is perdition, and absolute impossibility.
the part where he said thank God that he has chosen us hit me. I never thought of it that way. Another thing to be grateful for.
@Ben Jones he doesn't choose us arbitrarily
@Ben Jones you're misinterpreting Romans 9
@Ben Jones let's have a public discussion about this so people can understand each position correctly. That's not what Arminians believe at would you be willing to do that ?
@Ben Jones it's pointless to argue about it, if calvanism is real then there are people who are predetermined to disagree with it.
@Ben Jones i think the biggest mistake is thinking an omniscient God can't get his will done through free creatures
Thank you for this teaching. I was in the Army in 1967 and expected to be deployed to Vietnam soon. I started attending a Southern Baptist church near Fort Sam Huston in San Antonio Texas. I accepted Jesus as my Savior and was baptized. However, later I attended a conference where a pastor tought that if a person wasn’t elect they were lost no matter what they did or didn’t do, even if they professed Jesus and were baptized. This crushed my heart because I couldn't tell if I was elect or not. As a result I stopped going to church and returned to my former life habits, drinking and womanizing. However, I would periodically study the Bible and as I studied I began to realize that my desire to know Jesus and follow him proved that I was elect, so I started changing and cleaned up my life (a long process). If the teaching on predestination is not handled correctly it can drive people away from Jesus. Today I attend church and read the Bible daily and I have a strong attachment to Jesus.
My view was always this: there is predestination in the sense that God has a perfect plan for each of us to follow. Yet we have the free will to choose to follow that plan (by HIS power and HIS might), or to stray from that path, typically via the avenue of sin. Everyone has equal chance for salvation. it is available to all of us. However some people ultimately send themselves to Hell by rejecting Jesus, so he gives them over to their sin. Or as you said will pass over some people because they do not want him. He knocked, they said no.
I hold your view. I am not a Calvinist.
Jesus didn't physically show up to anyone's door.
And yet, humans are referred to as "imperfect," yet are expected to choose the "perfect" plan, or be punished for not doing so. Excellent. 👍
@@watchandjewelryloft4713 that's why Jesus is our ONLY WAY to God. God has given us grace and the chance to live eternal life thru His Son Jesus. 💖
@@janey5338 What proof do you have of such a claim?
The fact that God chose anyone is such a great mystery. He would have been just and perfect to let all of us go our own way.
This. This right here. None of us deserve salvation. We all deserve hell
I understand that he would of been just in letting all of us perish, IF he didn't plan or will for Lucifer to rebel against him, and then humanity to rebel. Since the rebellion was a part of his will, it doesn't make sense to me why we would deserve destruction when God was willing everything??
@@WhoAreYe You do understand that God created us that way right?? How could we be morally responsible for our actions if life is predetermined by our creator. We were created with a sinful nature by God and then punished for such a nature that was bestowed on us? How is that mercy?
@@edwin6146
20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump done vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory- 24 even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?
This is Paul's response to EXACTLY this line of questioning. "Who are you , O MAN, to answer back to God?" This is just like in the book of Job when God finally answers Job and basically tells Him "Where were you when I laid the foundations of the world? Did you give me counsel?"
@@douglasmcnay644 That doesn't answer the objection. I never made a claim that God couldn't do as he pleased however to hold the title "Worthy of Worship" one must be perfect (without flaw). In a deterministic view.. God is the author of evil. There is no way around that. If God is the author of evil then he Can't be morally perfect. If God is not morally perfect then he isn't perfect which means he is not worthy of worship. Yahweh would be no better than Allah of Islam. I find that to be troubling and it doesn't follow logical
Pray God lifts the scales from the lukewarm and lost eyes, opens their ears and soften their hearts. Pray God brings revival to the earth. Pray the Lord of Harvest send forth laborers into the harvest. Pray God strengthens His children, gives them more discernment and wakes them 🙏🏻
Amen
Amen 🙏
Amen and Amen
Amen
Amén To that !
What's predetermined is not that the wicked is wicked, it's the judgment. They were designated beforehand for judgment BECAUSE they turned away from the grace.
Right people acting so delusional down here God knew who would accept him or not before humans were created he chosen those that accepted him and left alone those that reject him we all know God chosen us no one would Automatically choose God unless he has drawn us to him!!
When we talked about this in Bible College, it nearly destroyed my faith. Maybe that's why it's often not talked about in most churches, outside of denominational statements of belief.
I have a hard time believing God would bring a person into this world without a chance of Salvation.
That's because the Bible doesn't say that he does. You have a hard time believing it because it isn't in there.
I recommend James W. Knox's CZcams sermon titled One of Calvin's Blunders. Excellent!
@@josephbrandenburg4373 you’re absolutely right!
Which makes me wonder why Parr would even think this video is a good idea if he's trying to keep people believing in _hell_
It’s all over the Bible.
Honestly this has to be the best video I’ve ever watched that summed up these three schools of thought. When going through Bible college I struggled with this topic so so much. And I remember one day in class we were having this discussion. Lots of verses were being thrown left and right and lots of convincing arguments were made from both sides of the aisle. But I still remember at the end of that class when my professor stood up and said so eloquently “so if some verses support this school of thought and other support the other than which is true? Well the truth of the matter is I don’t know…. And it is completely ok that I do not know. Because Gods ways are higher than our ways. And to be honest I doubt my human finite brain could comprehend the truth if it were given to me by God himself. But what I do know is that God has instructed me to GO INTO ALL THE WORD AND PREACH THE GOSPEL. And that is exactly what I will do. And whatever results come from it I will credit to God and give him praise for it.” That day I learned the doctrine of “I don’t know” and it has given me so much peace in life. I do believe that I am to read and study the scriptures and learn as much from them as God will allow me too. And as a pastor I strive to do that every day and then share what I learn with others. I love this topic and I think this video summarizes the different schools of thought on this topic so well. Great job brother.
the answer is both..its not either or..there is predestination but gives you choice in that destiny .its ridiculous to only pick some scriptures and make that ones virw cuz its a hslf truth
@@thegrigs777 that’s the only conclusion I can come to with it. Best and simplest way I can think to say it is God elects some but leaves the door open for others and his grace extends to all. That’s at least what the Bible seems to sah.
*say
@@thegrigs777 He predestines people to hell like He predestined you to write that comment. Did He write it for you? No. So easy to understand but unnecessarily complicated. *1 Peter 2:6-8* how can you take anybody who complicates this Bible passage seriously?
@@thegrigs777 you also can’t choose God as a natural man unless God intervenes. *John 6:44* *2 Timothy 2:25*
Watch people not being able to handle consistency now.
Remember the parable of the marriage in Matthew 22? When the chosen ones rejected the offer, the king requested his servant to call AS MANY AS possible, and no one was left uninvited, rather one was rejected because he came to the marriage in the wrong apparel (not clothed with the righteousness of Christ), YET many are called and few are chosen. Conclusion, all men do get access to salvation but those who do not put their trust and confidence in Jesus do not have salvation, those who believe are saved, all are called (Acts 17:30) but only those who to believe (have trust and confidence) are the chosen.
Also when the Bible talks of those chosen falling to come to the party and then everyone is invited its speaking of jews and gentiles. How the jews rejected Jesus and in their place the gentiles were invited
@@newtonmutea They freely rejected. Not because GOD enjoyed making them reject HIMSELF.
Most people reject God so only a few are chosen
On that last point, it seems like the question was sidestepped. Even if we do not know who is the elect, the question was “why would it matter if we share the gospel or not?” If the elect will go the heaven anyway, why preach the gospel to them if it’s inevitable?
God is good, brother! It's His mercy that gives us understanding; our very being is due to His mercy. None can boast. Thanks for posting this video (by God's grace)!
Even as wild sinners God still grants us the ability to believe. That is pure grace and mercy! Especially after we believe we realize how mighty that grace is.
This was spot on brother! Praise God for He is gracious & merciful and is faithful to fulfill His promise of forgiving all who turn to Christ in faith. 🙌🏽 He is a Father to the fatherless, our Rescuer, our Refuge, our Salvation.
Ephesians 2:8-9 says, 'By Grace, you have been saved through Faith. It is the gift of God, not from your works, so no one may boast.' Indeed, from the beginning of human race, the Grace was given freely to Adam and Eve when they were created to become God's children. When the first parents lost the Grace by disobeying God and, thus, committing the Original Sin, their descendants are born into the world without Grace, the life of their souls. No human beings, however holy they may be, could cancel the Original Sin and obtain the lost Grace. Only One Man, Incarnate Word, promised Messiah and Savior, could do that with His Suffering and Death on the Cross. And He, Jesus Christ Our Lord, gives the Grace freely to those who believe in Him and baptized through the teachings and ministry of the One, Holy, Catholic, Apostolic Church He founded on St. Peter (Matt 16:18) and sent to all nations to teach (Matt 28:20, Mark 16:16).
Ephesians 2:10 says, 'we are created (namely, reborn) in Christ Jesus for the good works that we should walk in them,' which the baptized promises to God during the ceremony of the Sacrament of Baptism. 1 John 3:9 says, 'no one begotten by God commits sin.' To retain the Grace received, the baptized must not sin; otherwise, he will lose the Grace much the same way as our first parents lost it and death came. 'You are called to be holy (1 Cor 1:2).' 'No one who fails to act in righteousness belongs to God (1 John 3:10).'
Now, after receiving the Sacrament of Baptism, could anyone live in the world without committing a sin and preserve the Grace? Yes, one can, but, since we are still weak against temptations, It will require assiduous efforts on our part to cooperate with the Graces given through the Sacraments Our Lord instituted in the Church, particularly, the Sacrament of Confession and the Holy Eucharist. Without the Graces from Sacraments administered by the Catholic Church, one cannot be saved. That's why 'Extra Ecclesiam nulla salus (outside the Church, no salvation)' is a Catholic Dogma (Catechism No. 846). For further information on this, please watch The Forgotten Dogma: No Salvation Outside the Catholic Church by Father Isaac Mary Relyea on CZcams.
Brother Allen! I'm watching this 1 year and 1 day from the date you posted it, and I am thankful for this clarification. I have recently been saved and I've given my life entirely to my Lord & Savior Jesus Christ. I find your videos to be very helpful and educational with many questions I have. Thank you for your work.
Think of every despicable act there is on planet earth; murder, rape, child molestation, Satan worship, ALL religions that deny the deity of Christ, pornography, alcohol, drugs, and on and on; Calvinism says, "God in His sovereignty CAUSES all of these to happen. Sorry, I don't see that in the Bible. God in His sovereignty gives man SOME free will to choose Christ or not, to choose right from wrong, to choose good from evil. Unfortunately, man often chooses badly. The result: all the evil that the Calvinist says, God caused. My Bible says God IS love and is without sin. Here is absolute Biblical proof that God does NOT cause or determine everything; In Jeremiah 19:5 God says, “They have built the high places of Baal to burn their children in the fire as offerings to Baal-something I did NOT COMMAND or mention, nor did it enter my mind.” So, while God does predestine some things, He does NOT predestine everything. It is like a university predestining a football team next year, but giving free will to each individual player to decide whether or not to try out for the team.
People going to Hell is always their choice. The Bible clearly states that God has no pleasure in the death of the wicked but that he turns from his wicked way and live-Ezekiel 33:11.
Amen! Period!!!
You can't simply justify it. No one is chosing Hell. They'll most certainly be _sent_ probably kicking and screaming.
I don't know why Parr thought it was a good idea to try to explain it away. These are some of those contradictions. They're *still* contradictions, whether people want to acknowledge it or not.
Thing is, when you say God is in control, the sole creator of all, and holds all knowledge, past and present, there's no WAY that everything that happens and will ever happen, is not deliberate on account of God.
You can't have all power without all responsibility.
Your username is fax
@@wulfosaurus1835 Allen explained it well at 22:01. Yes God does harden but he hardens the ones that have Committed to themselves that they want nothing to do with him, do you not realize how much this world hates God? If God were to show up in the sky right now do you really think unbelievers would be leaping up for joy like a believer would? No, they’ll be terrified, they’ll worship God out of fear instead of out of love. God is not a dictator, He wants a world in which there is peace and love, if your scared of God and hate him because of the love and conviction of your sins then you won’t live with him for eternity. If you won’t let someone that hates and disrespect you live with you then why should God allow someone that hates him to live with him forever?
If He did something like poke out of the clouds and affirm His Word to people, you can BET that nearly ALL would start acting straight.
People don't "hate" for the sake of hating. There's always reasons, reasonable and unreasonable.
If God made hateful people, why would He even make them anyway at all?
Fantastic message! God is clearly not double minded! God already knew according to His foreknowledge what people would do. He knew people were going to go hell based upon their choices, not that He predestined anyone to chose to reject His plan of salvation or redemption just so they would go to hell for the fun of it. 💥🔥❤❤
Before I start watching I want to thank God for this message and also brother Allen for allowing God to use you to touch on such a difficult topic. Alpha and Omega the beginning and the end the first and the last! Nothing is nor ever will be a “surprise” to the almighty creator. Father let your will be done 🙏🏾
If The Lord predestined some to go to hell and not others, then that wouldn't be fair, which goes against everything that He stands for. Because The Lord is just, i believe that we all are given an opportunity to receive Him and His kingdom.
I'm far from being a calvinist but what you just said is not true. Because we've all fall short to the glory of God, our punishment is death which is totally JUST. If God wants to gives grace to one more than another it is His will and the saved ones only gets God's favor to be saved. The saved one gets grace, the unsaved one gets justice. God is still just. God loves everyone and there's no doubt about that. BUT! It is clear from the bible that God is more favorable towards some than others. As i said, i am not a calvinist and i have somewhat of an arminianist view towards predestination, but it is biblical that God gives more grace to some than others.
@@Simplement_ChrétienYes, amen! I certainly agree with you, brother. :)
There are just far too many Bible verses that emphasize God's choosing from the old treatment to the new testament. And let's not forget Romans 9!
I know that whenever God revealed His grace, love and power to me that it was Him alone doing it and it was NONE of my own effort! He was so gracious, and His timing was perfect and out of nowhere. ❤️❤️
I had no ability to believe, no desire for God and I in fact hated Him. I had loved Him years before but I was fallen. Well, one day He found a way to overwhelm me and reveal Himself to me again, and I it was ALL Him doing it. God must intervene and show His grace to us my revealing Himself to us, and it's when and if He so desires to. Man God is good. So good. ❤️❤️
Fair? God has every right to end us. Our sin alone is reason enough for that. We all fall short of the glory. His grace is what saves us and He CHOOSES his children
@@Solidsolo1028 Amen. None of us are deserving of God revealing Himself and saving any of us. The fact that He chose to save me and reveal Himself to me makes me love Him more than if it was my by my own choice! It's impossible for me to have faith without God giving it to me. Those who say they believe by free will and that they didn't have an instant change in their spirit have a false Jesus because it's impossible not to change once God reveals Himself to a person. You instantly want to be around other believers, you suddenly want to immerse yourself in the word of God, and you have unspeakable joy.
I heard a fella on CZcams, (free grace teacher who believes in free will), say that every morning he reads the same scripture every morning and he repeatedly says out loud I am saved by grace through faith and not of works least any man should boast" until he's convinced he's saved. The problem with that is that Jesus told us not to repeat the same words, or prayers hoping that they would come true. That's a form of witchcraft. If you don't have faith then ask God to increase your faith, but don't keep repeating the same thing until you have convinced yourself. That's not of God.
@@Solidsolo1028I think the problem is the Eternal torments version of hell in combination with election.
I believe that God knows Who is going to hell and Who is going to Heaven because of he is omniscient, however he did not predestinate us. He came to save the world, even when not all of us is going to be saved, that is what I believe.
I agree
Please read Ephesians carefully. God has chosen whom He has chosen to be with Him. The majority of people want a sinful life and God let's them have it.
Christopher I'm right there with you bro
@@jonathanharness2962 that's a lie of the devil that only ignorant clowns fall for, the holy gospel is God's plan for our salvation and you don't believe in it, you're not a Christian and you're not saved
@@jonathanharness2962 If you're referring to this verse
Ephesians 1:4-5 KJV
According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: [5] Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
It says He has chosen those *in Him* meaning, in Christ, *whosoever* that may be, before the foundation of the earth He decided those people would be holy and without blame before Him in love. That's not talking about salvation.
This verse is talking about the destination that was planned for born again believers, not about non-believers being saved.
And verse 5 also is not talking about salvation at all, but the redemption of the body.
"basically saying a person's salvation largely depends on them, which goes against scripture" I respectfully disagree with this premise, which my Calvinistic friends always bring up.
Those that disagree don't say "salvation LARGELY depends on them", only that the person believed as per the following scriptures. (Obviously repentance is involved also)
i.e. Rom 10 "that if you will confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes resulting in righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made resulting in salvation. For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes in him will not be disappointed.”
Rom 3 "Because by the works of the law, no flesh will be justified in his sight; for through the law comes the knowledge of sin. But now apart from the law, a righteousness of God has been revealed, being testified by the law and the prophets; even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ to all and on all those who believe. For there is no distinction, for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God."
Salvation is a gift from God, as all have sinned. No one deserves it. Eph 2 "for by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, that no one would boast Jn 6 They said therefore to him, “What must we do, that we may work the works of God? Jesus answered them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.” Jn 1:12 "He came to his own, and those who were his own didn’t receive him. But as many as received him, to them he gave the right to become God’s children, to those who believe in his name: who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."
Lastly, some state believing in Jesus is " largely depending on themselves" and " against scripture"....okay. Others say it's just not suppressing the truth and exercising the faith God has given all people. By repentance and belief they become born again. Rom 1 states all people know God exists i.e. some faith. " For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because that which is known of God is revealed in them, for God revealed it to them. For the invisible things of him since the creation of the world are clearly seen, being perceived through the things that are made, even his everlasting power and divinity, that they may be without excuse."
👏👏
Well said!
Calvinists don't believe the saving power of the Holy Gospel which is God's plan for our salvation, if God did choose some and not others, the gospel wouldn't be good news to whoever God doesn't choose
No.
The bible says that whosoever believes on the Lord Jesus Christ shall be saved and have everlasting life. So that's what I believe
John 3:16 doesn't say anything about man's ability. It simply says that everyone believing in Jesus will be saved. John 3 also says you must be born again to even See the kingdom of God.
This was such a thorough and well thought out video. It’s what I’ve been searching for. You broke it all down in a way I can understand. Thank you Allen. Also, this makes me fear and thank God more.
A true Christian who follows Jesus Christ fully is transported from the kingdom of darkness to the Kingdom of light, he goes from being a child of the devil to being adopted by God. When people are adopting a child, they CHOOSE to adopt the child that’s why it is called CHOSEN in scripture.
Romans 8: 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
I believe he knows the future from the beginning. Therefore he knows what we will choose. Whether we follow him or not. We have free will and God knows what we will do with it. God bless 🙂🙏
But He also made you and has the ability to _change_ hearts and minds. And He knows full well who could benefit from God's action, as with He does with His chosen anyway.
Think it out, everything that happens is His Will. It's deliberate.
Also, beware ANYONE who says don't use logic. He uses "logic" for arguments in _his_ favor when it suits him.
Don't use logic. Yeah, don't think, just listen to me.
Exactly. He has already seen the ending. He knows who chooses Him and who doesn’t. It’s not that he sent people to hell but He already saw that they rejected Him
Bingo! I could upend all he taught in one Scripture. Dueteronomy 30:15 - 20. When God said "I set before you this day, life and death." It's the PLAN that God has predestined, not people. Whatever you chose becomes your predestination. And just because God knows everything does not make Him personally responsible for our choices
@@mpskin49 Beware when you try to sum up God’s will and Word in one verse. He gave us thousands for a reason, and many are ignored that completely refute this view, particularly in the New Testament. You could randomly take a verse from Deut. and convince everyone they must be circumcised. Peter, Paul, James, Jude, and others refuted that with LOGIC.
@@tracykarol my goodness gracious! Pray for discernment because you're wayyy off! Geesh!
God plz don't leave me. It's been a season of unbearably agonizing things. I've stumbled, ive gotten up. I dont even know when the hits will stop coming. I give it all to you Father
He won't leave u
@@Yahshuaismyeverything Thanks, I believe He loves, ultimately the decision is ours and our free will. I chose Him
I would much rather stand before God someday believing He's merciful and didn't predestine anyone to hell and find out I'm wrong than stand before Him believing He's the author of evil and pre-destined almost all of His creation to hell as Calvinism teaches.
That’s where I stand as well
I stand with the truth, God is the One who saves us and without God pulling us out, all of us would be there in the sinful world. I also understand that the wrath of God is finite though, so the ones who will taste the wrath, will suffer but for a finite amount of time.
That is not what Calvinism teaches. There is no injustice with God. I highly recommend RC Sproul’s book, “Chosen by God” for a better understanding of the doctrines of grace (reformed theology). At the very least, to better understand this doctrine and not a caricature of it.
@@nikokapanen82 are you saying that people who go to hell will only be there for a while and then be released? Or annihilated?
Sin causes people to go to hell. Is God the one that makes a person sin? Every person is responsible for what they do with their own free will.
Idk if this is the truth but, i believe we all have an equal chance, which is why God appointed US to help direct others to him, because everyone can be saved, he wants as many of his children saved as possible
COME ON GUYS!
I appreciate Allen for his teaching ability discussing through these tough, touchy subjects. Thank you Allen 👍
Please watch Leighton Flower's response to this video, and see how terribly twisted Allen has gotten things.
@@christian_gamer_guy6447 I did and I believe Dr. Flowers got it absolutely right 👍.
This was handled with wisdom and care. In complete agreement 🤝 Unity in Christ Jesus my brothers & sisters. 💯
Amen
Amen
As long as unity is not prioritised and obtained at the expense of truth.
If you think this was handled with wisdom, may Satan have mercy on your soul!
@@edwardcopeland5069 Perhaps Dr. Leighton Flowers would have done a better job?
I’d love to hear you informally debate with Leighton Flowers on this. You both have a good heart and are loving towards people with your beliefs.
👍 Love Leighton’s content!
I was thinking the same thing about Leighton! He is a former Calvinist and understands how they misinterpret scripture, namely the predestination verse… Election is not to eternal life…but to service in the plan and purposes of God. And In Romans 9: 14-29, Paul is talking about Israel.
< God’s grace IS available to ALL.
The problem with Leighton is that he never really understood Calvinistic Soteriology, but he believes that he does, so he doesn’t listen to proper explanations. There is nothing to be gained for a Calvinist to speak to Leighton.
@@HelloTygr This is literally what almost every Calvinist resorts to in the end lol "You don't understand Calvinism!!" You seem like the kind of person that would watch the William Lane Craig vs James White debate and at the end of it accuse WLC of not understanding Calvinism lol
@@HelloTygr I dont really think you watch him much otherwise you would know that is not correct.
He already knows the end from the beginning, so he knows those who will cry out for him to be their savior. Thank you Jesus for your sacrifice on the ✝️ ❤.
I've heard it put, "The sign over the gate to heaven says 'Those who pass through this gate have chosen God' but once in heaven it reads, 'Those who have passed through this gate have been chosen by God.'"
Either way I thank God I was chosen...
Amen!
I'm thankful God doesn't practice favoritism, so anyone who believes in Jesus will be saved and not a group of chosen favorites.
So how do you know you were chosen ?
God chooses us or does not choose us, what earthen vessel can argue with the potter saying why have you made me such?
Our salvation is by his will, for his purpose, and not ours, we have no part in it... We are that lost that God has to intervene....... At least that's how it was explained to me by a John MacArthur video
@@krustysurfer that is true. Salvation is 100% the work of the Lord. It is His salvation. We don’t deserve heaven that’s why it is a gift of God not earned by works.
The Gospel, is the call. If you hear, grace has been extended to you. Until you hear the call, you cannot respond. That’s why the gospel is the power for salvation. Those who have been predestined, respond to the call (the gospel) once it’s been given. That is why we must go preach the good news of the kingdom, to send out the call.
Some people hear the call and accept it with joy in their hearts but because they are not fertile enough soil spiritually speaking their faith quench and they fall back to the world.
Well said... GOD be with you and your family
Exactly!!
Thank you Corinne for this perspective and illustration! I recently accepted the life-changing grace of Jesus after 27 years of suffering and denial of His will which I believe He was using to prepare me for the ability TO accept His grace since I was not spiritually mature enough (not necessarily to be held unaccountable, but within my feeble humanity I couldn't begin to grasp the concept). I can see now how He destined me to come to Him precisely in summer of 2022, and I am humbled beyond belief that He would do so, I still cannot describe how extraordinary my experience has been. I am on FIRE to fulfill His will and be able to shepherd the elect into His Kingdom, and I thank God for people like you and the brothers and sisters in these comments who are part in furthering my knowledge of my Father and KING. 😊😊💕💕
why tho? i want to be with God but i have to do tons of exobiblical resrarch to understand it. i KNOW im not perfect. i am working on praying more and swearing less eta, but none of that matters, so how do i make sure im chosen? why not make a hell for bad humans, instead throwing them right in the same stinking hole as THE LITTERAL DEVIL!!!!???!!!
During the times of "CZcams preachers" pointing out faults of other preachers, this message was full of the Holy Spirit. Well done brother in Christ. I thank God for your message.
He’s wrong. Did god send a lying spirit.
How do you know he's wrong?@@pnscar3
Thank you for bring forth this knowledge and helping me tackle this difficult question. I often had the thought that if my actions dont matter and the choice was never mine, than why even play the game. But you reminding me of the fact that no one gets into heaven by their own earthly acts but only through gods grace are they saved. Total mind set shift for me so thank you.
This is one of the best podcasts I have ever listened to. You answered so many questions I have had in my five year journey with Christ. Thank you so much! You have no idea how much this helped me understand the timing of my own personal salvation.
I still dont know if im one of the elect because I gave my life to Christ 7 years ago and I was at peace and on fire for God at first and then something happned kind of a snowball effect and now im a real mess I know I want a relationship with Jesus and to be Holy I want to hate sin but my flesh always is to strong I dont get it its confusing and depressing have you had any similar experience or know anyone who has ?
I’ve been there. Please have heart and believe. Don’t give up on God cause he won’t give up on you. Don’t allow your heart to become so hardened that you can’t sincerely repent. Pray and ask God to change your heart. Talk to God and tell him your thoughts and slowly but surely you will start reversing back to where you once had fire. Be patient with yourself. Especially after backsliding. The first step is to REPENT. ask for forgiveness and don’t go back to that sin. You can’t do it without the Lord because our flesh is weak. God knows this so he waits for us. But you need to repent as soon as possible. I pray you will be guided by our Lord. God bless you.
@@Goldtaker23 I don’t know but I think it’s pretty clear you are one of the elect because of your desire. Someone who isn’t saved doesn’t have a desire God.
@Ben Jones I agree fully with what you say I think I'm still a babe as I've had a terrible time I'm various ways during my walk so I've not grown I want to grow more than anything though
@@Goldtaker23 You’re assuming that being a Jesus follower is somehow temptation free or sin free? The fact that you’re struggling is proof that you have been chosen by God. But if you’re serious about following Christ be willing to make sacrifices in order to bear spiritual fruit.
I was just finished reading Romans nine. Never heard of " double" predestination. You have just given me a clear understanding of the doctrine of predestination. Thank you.
What would be called double predestination outside of this certain belief of God would be nothing more than a fuller scope of what already goes on. For with the natural eye we perceive what man does. With the spiritual eye we perceive what God does. But is our spiritual eye so developed that we can plumb the depths of God? Just because I say that some are predestined to hell does not mean that some men just can't go to God, on a earthly level. It just means that some won't come, no matter what. This is evident in the world and in our preaching. How that some men resist until death and how others step in as amooth as butter. Or the opposite. How some men are drawn in like a breath in child labor, like Christ speaks of in John, there being joy in heaven because a child is born unto us, or others resist until there dying day and there receive Christ. They could not have resisted God choosing them by any means.
There is a Non-Calvinistic way to read Romans 9. I encourage you to look into those brother.
I agree with you Alan, great explanation, I tend to steer away from conversations around subjects like these, it can lead to arguments and pride, best to just stay obedient and faithful to our Lord and to just trust Him.
Exactly 💯
Heathens don't understand the ways of the Spiritual life for they are carnal minded. And don't understand the Spiritual truths.
@@torri4777 Amen 🙏
2 peter 3:9 Esv
The lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you; not wishing that any should parish but thst all should reach repentance
I’m teaching this tomorrow online. What perfect timing!!
Wow! I hope you find it helpful. This is a very difficult topic to try and understand.
Hopefully you don't use his teaching on this, as it is lousy
@@thebeatagp Why is Jesus going to resurrect both the righteous and the unrighteous? read John 5:28
@@peterfox7663 you are right 👍 these so called spiritual leaders have no idea what the bible really teaches. Jesus spent three and a half years sitting up the way to understand the bible.And commanded his disciples to keep it going.read Matthew 28:16-20
@@peterfox7663 wow, I found you on CZcams lol
Predestination is like this: a teacher who says, "Anyone who gets 50% or more in the exam will get to go on our field trip next Saturday." The teacher does his part and then each student has to do his or her part. The reward and criteria for selection are determined by God. It is predestined but not in the minuscule and unjust way most Christians believe. To see it any other way is to see God as unjust. Then it would be to worship an idol (or a false image of God).
What you just said is considered a heresy. We don't do anything to get to Heaven. It is all God's work.
@@mandooakes8509 the apostles clearly talk about maintaining the faith, choosing God and the like. I think we may have an erroneous idea of what heresy is.
@@republiccooper If by "doing our part" you meant we had to do something (work) to get to heaven, than that is a heresy. If you by, "doing our part" you meant that we accept the free gift of salvation. Then no heresy. If that's what you meant than I would change your analogy to, a present that God puts in our lap. We choose whether or not to accept and open the gift.
@@mandooakes8509 After all, we work out "our own salvation with fear and trembling." If what I said is heresy, we should take it up with Paul, the apostle.
@@mandooakes8509 all through scripture our part is to believe on Christ.
Seriously thank you for this. I’ve been struggling with this even though it’s so clear in the scripture. I appreciate the way you break things down and take your time explaining scripture!
try "Soteriology101" and "Beyond the Fundamentals" if you want clarity :)
@@unitedstates3068 I respect their positions even if they are different than mine. We are all using the same book to arrive at our positions.
@@thebeatagp very classy. I like that!
The airline ticket example falls apart when you consider this is about torturing people for eternity
Yeah, my thoughts exactly.
He doesn't torture them for eternity : fear the one who can Destroy both body and soul / cast into the lake of fire - second death. So the airline ticket is correct.
It's a lottery slot
This video is the best explanation of predestination I have seen so far, it’s very clear and easy to understand. Great work this video was extremely edifying.
Thanks so much David Grays, I'm so glad you found it helpful! Thanks again for taking the time to watch. God bless you!
This video was a terrible terrible explanation of predestination. God has not predestined that certain people would be believers, He's predestined to save believers! The will of the Father is that those who look to the son and believe will have eternal life! It is by believing that we may have life in His name. Those predestined in Ephesians 1 are... the faithful in Christ! Please re-read, and see that no one is predestined to become the faithful in Christ... the faithful in Christ are to be adopted as sons!
You may feel edified by this video, but this video impugns God's character and distorts the very gospel itself.
@@christian_gamer_guy6447 Belief is a prerequisite for salvation, so to say God predestined salvation but not belief is a logical error. So if we are predestined to salvation, so then are we predestined for belief in Christ. Just as an orphan is chosen for adoption, by no act of his own, God has adopted His elect by His own choosing. From the passage you cited: ”In love He predestined us for adoption to Himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of His will” (Ephesians 1:5).
@@andyj6384 "Belief is a prerequisite for salvation, so to say God predestined salvation but not belief is a logical error."
No. There is no reason, biblical or otherwise, to think that God determines our belief. He want's us all to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth, and He is convicting the world of sin and drawing all men to Himself, but He doesn't force people to believe. He's chosen to save the faithful in Christ, He hasn't chosen some people to be believers.
"So if we are predestined to salvation, so then are we predestined for belief in Christ."
No one outside of Christ is destined to be saved. If we are in Christ, we are adopted as sons. We are sealed in Christ when we hear the gospel and believe, as Ephesians 1:13 says.
"God has adopted His elect by His own choosing. "
Yes, and "For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” (John 6:40). He's chosen to save believers. it is by believing that we may have life in His name (John 20:31). We gain access to God's grace by our faith (Romans 5:2). His will is to save the faithful in Christ.
"From the passage you cited: ”In love He predestined us for adoption to Himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of His will” (Ephesians 1:5)."
Right... and the "us" here, are the faithful in Christ Jesus from verse 1 that He's talking about. He's talking to believers. Paul never says that God has chosen someone outside of Christ to be in Christ and be saved... no, it says He's chosen "us *in Him* " before the foundation of the world. He's chosen, from the foundation of the world, to save those who are in Christ or, us in Him. Notice how it does not say that He's chosen us TO BE in Christ. Calvinists often have a very hard time seeing this clearly, and I would urge you to take your time and really be honest with the text.
@@christian_gamer_guy6447 this was good, thank you...it really makes it much easier to understand and also explain to others!
HE already knew who would say yes to His power and who wouldn't
🙌✝️
But is that what is meant by predestination,
In that case, DUH ofc he knew. The only thing that makes any or this relevant is if he made them PLANNING for them to reject him
So very true , Sovereign GOD HE is , knows all before we are born .
Pastor? I've been so grateful for your videos. Your simple and straightforward way of spreading the word is so refreshing. I'm honored to call you my brother, Bob
I am so glad that I came across your video. This is an awesome explanation of Armininism and Calvinism. I thank God every day for His grace and mercy in my life. I am now a brand new subscriber and I am looking forward to watching more of your videos. Thank You and God Bless.
John 3:16 pretty much puts the stop on calvinism or Acts 13:43 men can be persuaded in the grace of God, Acts 13:46 men can accept or reject the gospel, Acts 13:47 the gospel is for all men, John 6:40 those who believe are ordained to eternal life...etcetera and on and on and on....God knows the end game but we are not robots, we have free will to choose life or death, believe the gospel or reject it. Just because God knows who will accept the gospel does not make us pre destined, it just means He is the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last. He is omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent.
Agreed with the added insight of love. Just because he CAN see who will choose, does not mean he actually chooses to use this ability. What is to say he could have created us, and not looked ahead at the outcome, and be loving and rooting for us this whole time and sad and disappointed when we don't make it but overwhelmed with joy when we do? Why would the master rejoice in Luke 15:11-32 when the prodigal son returns if he already knew he would return????!!!!!
Allen, I will be producing a respectful video in response to this soon but I want you to know you’re always welcome to come on to my broadcast and discuss these things openly and cordially as brothers. I appreciate your ministry. -Leighton
Thanks Leighton. It is necessary to get an actual non Calvinist point of view on the points raised by Allen Parr. The suppositions, such as don't use logic and the straw man argument of God's Sovereignty Vs man's free will is disappointing to hear from Allen Parr who one assumes is suggesting that he is giving equal weight to the options he presents before coming to his view. The copout at the end that perhaps I'll change my mind in the future cements the view that perhaps he should do a more detailed investigation including both Calvinist and non Calvinists before influencing his significant audience. By the way I find most of Allen's information useful to get me to read my Bible with discernment and hopefully clarity from The Holy Spirit.
He might not see your comment, Leighton. Maybe reach out to him directly to get him on your broadcast. His email is on the "about" tab on his channel.
Our Lord's will is to have ALL of us be with Him in Heaven. Amen. Even in the Old Testament!
UNSCRIPTURAL!!
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I urge you to read Matthew 25:41 my friend
You better be on your knees thanking God for His mercy everyday. He didn’t have to save you, but He chose to do so. God never planned on saving everyone.
I would love to see him and Dr. Leighton Flowers, from the Soteriology 101 channel, have a decision about this topic.
Thank you! This is something I’ve heard but have been rather confused about. You’ve given me such insight. We should feel so honored to serve such a merciful father. My husband has introduced me to your teachings and my knowledge has grown deeper. I have the upmost respect for your humbleness in the way you apologized about the music video picture on the one you did of Beyoncé. I don’t understand how those who even remotely identify as Christians can listen to any kind of this worldly music these days. My husband and I was absolutely floored at the words of it but then again, neither of us know why we was with the conditions of the way this world is. Anyways, sorry I just got off topic but I wanted to thank you for that. May the Lord bless and keep you and your family. -❤️Your Sister In Christ, Lesly
Awesome breakdown Brother Allen. Yes, a very difficult doctrine for our minds to grasp. I am sensitive to those who may struggle with this. Especially if they are being exposed to it for the very first time. It took me a long time to understand it as well. Due, in large part, to my one -sided exposure to God's love and mercy at the expense of not being exposed to God's righteousness and justice. Even now, there are days that I struggle with the Doctrine of Double Predestination. That is, until I prayerfully go back to the Scriptures, and see a complete and balanced view of God. And the Scriptures remind me that God loves us and that He also loves righteousness and justice (Psalm 33:5). Both sides need to be on display for the world to see and for us to have an accurate and balanced view of God. Also, I think we naturally get caught up asking the question, "Why does God choose some to be saved and passes over others?' When the real question we should be asking ourselves is, "Why does God choose anybody to be saved?" That being said, this does not mean that we leap for joy and do cartwheels when the Holy Spirit brings illumination to our minds concerning this tough doctrine. Like you stated, it just magnifies the AMAZING GRACE of God for choosing us before the foundations of the earth and for not giving us what we wanted as well. What this doctrine does for me, is that it causes me to ask, Why did you choose to save a wretched sinner like me, Lord? Why ME?
It’s a question that has been answered very clearly from the Calvinist camp already (by Paul Washer and others)
“God saw NOTHING in you!!!”
@@EricSmyth4Christ Amen brother! I'll add this- What he did see in me was my sin. And now, because of His amazing, overwhelming, unexplainable, grace towards me, He now sees the imputed righteousness of Christ in me!
2 Corinthians 5:21
Thank you for your reply brother.
But how do you know he chose you ?
@@davewatson2124 Hi Dave. Great question. Space does not allow me to go into detail about the sinful and immoral lifestyle I lived prior to 2004 and how resistant I was to God and the things of God. I had no desire to know Him or to please him in word, deed, or thought. I neither feared Him or reverenced Him. I lived a self-absorbed life and questioned God's very existence. The last thing I ever thought I would do in my life was to follow Jesus Christ. But one day in December 2004, I was sitting in a school office and in the midst of hearing some hard news about my daughter, I looked up with tears in my eyes and mouthed the words, "O' God," And all I can tell you is that something happened to me in that office that cannot be put into words because it has to be experienced. All I know is that I walked out of that office a changed man. All of a sudden, I had a deep desire to know God, read the Bible and to be around other believers in a church setting. Prior to that day, I could not retain God in my thinking for 5 minutes. Since that day, I have a constant awareness of His presence (not that I always feel His presence) and as I read and studied the Bible, I became convinced that the Bible is the Word of God, that Jesus is the only way to the Father and that I needed to repent of my sin and to believe unto Him for the salvation of my soul. At the time, I did not have an understanding as to what had occurred. But I now know that in that principals office, God graciously caused me to be born again. I say this because since that day, I have a burning desire to know Christ, to worship Christ, to love and obey Christ, to serve Christ, and to honor Him in all that I do. None of these desires were alive in me for the first 40 years of my life. This experience and the fruit that the Holy Spirit is now producing in me, is how I know that God graciously chose me. To God be ALL the glory!
Thank you again for your great question Dave.
@@loum.2864 Hi Lou You have similar circumstances to me. I was brought up in a Christian home but lived a sinful life as a teenager and young man and all the way until i was about 50. I got on my knees at work one day and asked Jesus into my life and slowly changed my ways. I read my Bible and pray every day. I attend Church and i was Baptised a couple of years ago. Now according to Alenn Parr who is a Calvanist i can not be sure i am going to Heaven [ nor can you ] I am now scared that Jesus will say to me those words "depart from me i never knew you" To me the Calvanist view makes a mockery of John 3 : 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son so that all who believe in him will not perish but have eternal life. Regards.
I look at it like, " God doesn't want anyone to perish. He calls everyone to repent and come to the knowledge of Salvation. We all have free will. So He calls us, BUT we have to want to hear His call. He who has an ear let him hear. Some hear His call and some do not hear His call.
I am in agreement with you Allen.
Praise God brother. We usually are my man. Looking forward to connecting soon!
Love both your channels! God bless you both.
Would love you to watch a video called.
Romans 9 De-Calvanized.
Channel name Beyond The Fundamentals.
I think you would enjoy it.
Both yourself and Allen.
@@thebeatagp i know you dont call yourself a Calvanist and im not calling you one either but i would love for you to watch video titled ‘Romans 9 De-Calvanized’ by channel name Beyond The Fundamentals.
I think you and Corey would find it interesting at least.
@@thebeatagp Mr Allen if hell is predestined by God does that not imply that he's abandoned his purpose for creating the Earth? If the answer to the question is yes then what he said about himself at Isaiah 55:10 and 11 cannot be true.
Do you watch Leighton Flowers, I feel he explains these verses well
I agree
He is good at straw-manning Calvinism.
Good morning Allen. I appreciate your teaching. You have a very clear, simple way of explaining the Bible. Thank you. As long as you’re in the public eye, and a stand for a truth and you love the Lord, you’re always going to be criticized, shame on those people. Continue pressing on toward the goal 🙏🏼
In one of my visitations to hell, Jesus showed me a person who was a Christian (Jesus said “he was a Christian like you”). But the guy unfortunately started sleeping around (1 cor 6:9). He died middle aged and went to hell forever it was dark but Jesus lit up the area, he asked Jesus for another chance but unfortunately it was too late for him, Pretty sad, Repent and ask Jesus to help you with your struggles (James 4:7)
If God predetermines some to go to Heaven, then it's impossible He doesn't predestine people to Hell, with proves His favoritism of some over others, before their births, which negates Him being just, loving, and fair.
Well tbh it's true some people aren't meant for heaven and u can tell cus they never accept Jesus no matter what but all huans deserve hell so it's fair God chooses who he wants to be with him
@@Yahshuaismyeverything
If He wants to be with us so badly, why doesn't He show up instead of being a "deadbeat dad"?!
@@aisforapple2494just look at creation It shouts that He exists
Thank you Allen. I sat down this Saturday morning just to hear this and watch this video and now I find myself in a full on study! Your presentation was delivered beautifully and leads me to the word for further study. I appreciate your service to God and look forward to more teaching. Thx
Whoa hold up Allen
Saying God is not logical, but theological is just NOT TRUE.
Theological meaning = Relating to the study of theology, and pastoral training (why would God need pastoral training.
Logical or Being Logical = meaning. Is something that makes sense according to the rules of logic or something that is rational.
Make not mistake EVERYTHING God does or say makes sense.
And just because some people don't understand it, It's not God, it us. and what does the bible tell us to do. Ask. for wisdom and understanding.
Jas 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
Beyond the fundamentals YT
May you study the other views on these Scriptures also and ask God to give you understanding and not calvin
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Thank you Allen for your clarification of this subject. Even in my church has been the subject of free will. Even I know that I am saved by God's wonderful grace and mercy. My father was a pastor at our church for 60 years. His favorite sayings which I keep today " The heart of the matter is the matter of the heart" and " It's not about religion but your relationship". Thank you for your words of wisdom.
Try and let your favorite sayings be scripture.
I am glad you are saved. Praise God!
I've always been under the understanding that when he says he's chosen people before the creation of the world, he is speaking of everyone. I believe God has chosen everyone before the creation of time to love him. I believe that's part of what it means to be made in his image. However, I also believe that some of us are stubborn and stuck in our ways and he will leave those who want to be stuck in their ways. I don't believe that makes it works based just because we choose to have faith. I think that's what makes us have to walk in humility because Jesus did not have to go to the cross for anyone. But because of Jesus' sacrifice we can now have full access to the Holy of Holies and live in all that God has called us to live. So in summary: I believe what Jesus says in Matthew 22:14, "Many are called, but few are chosen." God calls on all of us to believe in him, but few of us are chosen because we're not wearing the right "wedding clothes". We're not chosen because we refuse to follow our King and live in his ways. It doesn't make us better or more wise, but it makes us humble enough to trust in Jesus instead of our own flesh.
The question is, what did the atonement accomplish? Did christ die to merely make salvation possible, and then man needs to have faith to actuate that atonement? Or did Christ actually accomplish His goal, when He said it is finished.
@@Terror1Void I believe he accomplished his goal by creating a gate for us to walk through. However, luckily God doesn't force us to walk through that gate.
@@ExtremeBlackAttack That's just not what the witness of scripture states. God does not fail to save those whom he died for.
@@Terror1Void I didn't say he failed. He succeeded at dying for our sins. I just don't believe Scripture supports the idea that God forces us to follow him.
@@ExtremeBlackAttack If he died for someone's sins, and they end up in Hell, how does that not mean He failed to saved them?
I thank God, for using you, brother Island Allen in Jesus' mighty name. For such a time like this I am blessed every time for the word of God in you brother keep up the great work of God.🙏
Hi Mr. Allen, I appreciate your courage to tackle this difficult topic and even make an effort to explain the Calvinism side. I have a question though, how can you explain the verses that talk about salvation is really for EVERYONE? How will you reconcile those verses in relation to other verses that speak about election? Thank you for acknowledging me and for making an effort to answer my questions.
Read the reformers. Even if you don’t agree with their conclusions, they all address those verses.
@@Particularly_John_Gill Read the bible for all doctrine. Not doctrine or interpretations of sinful men.
@@John-jh5ks You do realize the one who is reading the Bible has to interpret the words written on the page right?
Just “you and your Bible” theology is a great way to interpret the Bible in your own image.
You have to properly exegete the text to determine what the scriptures are teaching.
@@Particularly_John_Gill Most of the so-called reformers still carry their Roman Catholicism with them even after they “reformed”
@@John-jh5ks that makes no sense. We are supposed to benefit off of the wisdom of others to interpret the Bible. This doesn't mean we are making others some sort of Pope with the authority to infallible impart truth.
Not a good scope of both sides bro. I could not disagree more with your conclusions on some passages and your general conclusion. Calvinism is broken, and you can’t glean over it by telling believers to be thankful that God elected them. Can you imagine how wild it must be for an unbeliever watching this video hearing that. I think you’d do this conversation much better justice if you invited folks from the other side to talk and state their case. Love you brother, you are doing a great job
Your ending sentence contradicted everything before it. Just saying.
@@Bruhwthecomb could you elaborate?
Calvinism is one of the biggest smears on God’s character that was ever invented by man. You don’t reach the teaching of Calvinism/Augustine by reading the Bible. Someone has to tech it to you. If you tie that to “eternal conscious torment” (which also has less scripture than other points of view), God becomes the person that he would never allow us to be. It’s like me eternally tormenting you (the reader) for being blind - and I’m the one blinding you!
I will say this, and please hear me out. It is my belief that God provided the way for Salvation through His sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross. It is up to man to choose whether or not to accept that Gift of Salvation. Not that men should boast that they choose and others didn't, but instead in the reverence of the sacrifice that Christ made, they give all glory honor and praise to Jesus, who is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. The Bible clearly paints the picture that God desires all to come to Him, even though He realizes that not all of them will, He wants them to have the chance to do so.
Just like when man walked in the garden and they had the choice not to eat from the fruit, God gave them a choice because God is a just God and a loving Father and wants us to choose to obey Him and to follow after Him, rather than it be forced and we would be as mere puppets never having the opportunity to know anything else.
The idea of predestination takes all the idea of choice out of the equation and it makes it seem that God didn't desire for all of mankind to come to Him and is contrary to the well established character of God. God sent the prophets in hopes that the people would repent, in fact he turned away an army at the doorstep of Israel/Judah because a king repented and thus he and his people would not face the wrath of God that day. It was a choice, not that the king would be glorified for becoming humble, but for the king to realize that he needed the King of Kings to guide and protect him. God gave man the choice in the garden. Jesus gave the rich young ruler a choice. He gave the disciples a choice, they could have said no and went about their lives. He gives you and I the choice to accept His free gift of Eternal Life, and after that we have the choice to walk in Him. The Bible clearly says that if we draw close to God, that He will draw close to us, that if we walk in The Spirit, that we will not fulfill the desires of the flesh, that if we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us of all unrighteousness, if we humble ourselves before the Lord, that He will exault us in due time, that faith without works is dead. God wants us to choose Him. He wants action from us, not that it would be a passive predefined amount of people who would choose Him and those who wouldn't, He wants man to choose righteousness. He is a just God and worthy of all glory honor and praise. How much more glory and honor would it bring a man to say these people choose me to be the leader of their life, vs, I made this predefined small group to follow after me and here they are. How much more would be the glory to God to say these of man kind have chosen to follow after Me despite all that the world would give, despite all the battles of the flesh they would face, they still choose Me.
The time of God choosing a select group of people already occurred once and the Israelites disobeyed God and hence why He sent Jesus to save the world from their sins and not just a select few, He opened the gates of heaven to the world of they choose to accept it. The veil was torn in two, by your way of thinking, the veil is still in place, blocking people out, but that is not the case.
The Gospel is very clear in that whosoever believes in Him shall have everlasting life. For you or anyone to say otherwise puts more glory on men who are "chosen" than on God, who wants man to choose to follow after Him. By your thinking the saved could view themselves as higher than those who are not saved, and therefore could lead to pride and arrogance in the man because he views himself as chosen and others as not chosen, and this prideful and arrogant attitude is not what God wants us to have. He wants us to be humble. We have seen where this attitude of chosen and not chosen had led in areas throughout history, it typically doesn't end well.
Incredibly well said, thank you for speaking up!!
@@aprophetsreward he also didn't mention where do those who have walked away from the faith, deconstructed, or denounced their faith fit into his predestination equation. If that line of thinking was correct then once the predestined came to Christ then that would be it, no other choice to the contrary, but that isn't what we see happening. As much as my heart breaks for those who walk away from the faith, deconstruct it, or denounce it, it is an occurrence that happens, which goes back to my point that salvation is a choice, faith is a choice.
It’s simple. Receive the kingdom of God like a child, and receive his word like a child. Don’t put too much into it. Don’t be putting extra things in scripture. Take the raw scripture with its original meaning and go with what you read. There are vessels of wrath and vessels of mercy. Predestination is a thing. Who are you to question God? Who are you to answer back to God? Asking him why have you made me like this? God has rights over the clay he created.
Thank you Allen for your passion in sharing the truth to us and what the Word of God is really saying about these topics. I appreciate the hard work and sincerity you always put into your videos. Now I finally have a better understanding about predestination and how God pass overs those who do not want Jesus in their life. God bless you!
The gospel was so simple when I got saved years ago, it was saved by grace through faith in Christ and you're good forever. Why does it seem so complicated nowadays? This is a really good question!
Alan, Even though I knew you and I do not agree on Calvanism I was looking forward hearing why you believe Calvinism to be true. However, I was disappointed in a couple of areas. There are 4. points I will address; the first 3 will be short the third will take a little longer to address.
1. You start with Armenianism vs Calvinism. There are other POV - see Sotoriology 101 for an example.
2. Man centered vs. God centered. This is not how a non-Calvinist thinks about this topic. You should not straw man the other side.
3. If this were my first time listening to you and I heard you say; "Don't use Logic", I would have turned your video off and never returned. However, I am a subscriber so I've heard a lot of good things from you. I will also remain a subscriber. God created logic and I believe expects us to use it. God is logical and he is theological.
4. I like the way you said Calvinists must take both side of Predestination. If God chooses some to heaven, than God has chosen the rest to go to Hell. A lot of folks try to get out of that and you didn't.
However you did try to downplay it and show how merciful God is to allow some to go to Heaven. You used the tickets to Hawaii as an analogy. Your analogy paints this doctrine in a pleasant view and it shouldn't be pleasant.
Let's choose a different analogy. I have 2 boys and they are in a raging ocean and will drown if I don't do anything. I have the ability to save both boys and nothing can stop me from saving them both. I choose to save one, not for any other reason than my choice. Would you look at me and say how merciful I was that I saved one? No you wouldn't; nobody would ( this is where you don't want us to logic). God created us all and could save all of us, but Calvinism says that he chose not to save all, just some.
I could also use your analogy with a couple of tweeks. Everybody is in the Airport (Earth) and there only 2 destinations we can go, Hawaii or (pick the worst place you can think of). There are enough planes to take everyone to one of these places and all the planes are capable of getting to both destinations. Now the Airlines (God) chooses a few people to go to Hawaii and the rest have to go to the other place. We don't see that as loving or merciful that they/God chose a few to go to Hawaii.
You need to own this too. It is not loving or merciful to those who didn't have the option of going to Hawaii. If God is all loving, how can you reconcile this. You can't, so you tell us not to use logic.
Like I said earlier, there are more than two options for understanding these verses. Great scholars disagree on this and shouldn't say that it is clearly this or that. If it were clear, than we wouldn't have true Bible believing Christians disagreeing on this topic.
I agree. I was surprised he came to the conclusion he did, since I usually believe mostly the same things. But there are many more scripture verses that disprove this. I will still subscribe and watch, but I’m disappointed. I think when these verses that are taken as “elect” and the flip side, others chosen for hell, they are either wording issues OR God choosing some individuals for specific tasks (like prophets, John the Baptist, Nebuchadnezzar, etc.) Mike Winger does a very long video on the unbiblical view of Calvinism and why - it’s almost two hours, I think. Really good.
Excellent!
WOW BROTHER ALLEN !!!! Thank you so much for explaining these concepts…our church is spending one full year (all groups, men’s, Women’s, Youth ) studying the book of Romans. I pondered how our Pastor was going to handle Romans 9: 15-18……. "….mercy on whom He wills, hardens whom He wills"
At the end of the sermon he said, "you don’t think this is fair ? And you don’t understand it ? ……remember this , He is God, you are not "
Thank you again
Rich A
I LOVE this channel. Nothing like an in-depth study. It´s exactly the long-form presentation CZcams was made for. Thank you for taking such good advantage of that.
I have just subscribed!! Thank you very much for always delivering with sound scriptures. Listening to you is like sitting at Bible study with a friend or family member! I'm so excited to be back ( I was backsliding for awhile)to learning about the gospel. My holy spirit is yearning for this knowledge! I like the diverse topics of your videos as well, and you always put scripture first!! May God continue to bless you, and help you deliver his word! 🤗🙏🏽🌅
I think we all have the choice whether to accept Jesus the Christ as Saviour or not.
I believe so as well but we don’t save ourselves on our own accord. The work was finished through Christ we are told to repent and trust in Him.
In the end, we’re alive right now and are given a chance to follow Jesus. We need to take that offer now.
Would love to see a debate between you and Mike Winger on this. Thank you, Allen.
We, as human beings, just can't seem to help it. This temptation to mind other people's business. In this case, we actually want to mind God's business. Instead of just being obedient with humility and doing our part as commanded, we want to also KNOW all about God's part, have it explained to us clearly so that His part makes sense to us too, despite Him telling us plainly that some things are for Him to know only and that we cannot know everything like He does. There are some things we can know - actually a LOT of things we can know - but there are some things we can't know. We are the created, not the Creator. Yes, right now at this very moment our Living God knows EXACTLY who is going to Hell, who is not, along with everything that leads up to that, and everything that happens after that. We shouldn't try to judge (as fair or unfair) what we don't understand but we do it anyway, it is what it is lol. The main problem is that people can't reconcile in their minds how it is possible for us to have our free will - here on earth in our dimension of time - while God not only knows what we will do at all times, but has actually orchestrated every aspect of us and our behavior - outside of our dimension of time. God exists in a manner we can't comprehend just as we exist in a way that ants can't comprehend. Most of us don't quite consider it in that way, and when we try to, it blows us away. The concept of our agency not originating with us is a challenging concept for human beings in many ways. I appreciate and agree with the way you summed this up - this is yet another reason (of countless) to orient ourselves towards the position of being thankful to God... that's what we should take away from this discussion. God Bless You!
Your reply helped me. Years ago I was praying for the salvation of my dad. I heard inside my head a verbal reply I fully believe was God. " I will do all that is my part.". I was shocked and relieved because it wasn't my own thought. Since then I have been trying to understand what he meant by that. It could mean my dad's part is to respond in faith, or maybe that all of it is God's part. Who really knows? I think I need to give up trying to know what God's part is and stay in my own lane. My unbelieving dad will be 86 this year but is still in his right mind. Waiting to see what it turns out. Btw I only had this type of response to prayer two times in my 30+ years of Christian life. Rare.
@@charlotteroath9904 Amen!!! I think that God Blessed you greatly when He responded to you and told you that. He assured you that He has this covered according to His purpose.
Thanks for that encouragement. I just woke up at 4 am and sat up in bed wide awake. I was thinking about my post. Suddenly it came to me. Yes, God has his part in salvation. Based on what he said, there is another part. Obviously there is another part. I assumed the other part was my dad's response. Maybe what I should have realized all these years is the other part is mine. Mine is to tell the gospel . God's part and my part. Not God's part and my dad's part. I need to try again.
I like my pastor's explanation of predestination and it's very simple: God made everything in the universe including time, He can see all of time at the same time and see what we would do with our lives over time. Before He set it all in motion, He predetermined that those who chose Jesus would be with Him in heaven when time ended. That's it.
A lot of the passages in the Bible, especially including Romans 9, are corporate election like what you described, rather than individual election.
@@christopherbrewer4421 Jacob and Esau are being used as metonyms for their respective nations. It isn't speaking of their individual salvation.
@@josephbrandenburg4373 You can't determine that from scripture. Jacob and Esau are individuals.
@@willp.8120 Literally all you have to do is read it in context in Romans and in Malachi... and the rest of the Bible for that matter. It's a much, much harder sell to say they're being treated individually here.
If God doesn't intervene with drawing the elect, no one chooses him, we all go to hell. We all chose flesh over spirit because that is our nature until God does a miracle with our heart.
None of us deserve His grace.
Exactly God can choose whoever he wants in heaven with him we are none but evil dust of the earth 😂
To ANY who believe, He gives the right to become children of God. Everyone has the same opportunity to get saved because He desires none to perish. Human beings having free will doesn't mean He doesn't know the future.
@SpiritLife The scriptures were not written to EVERYONE!
@@christopherbarge414 that's not what the Bible says.
@@SpiritLife James 1:1-Israelites, 1Corinthians1:2-Israelites, Ephesians 1:1-Israelites. Romans1:7-Israelites. Romans 9:4-5, The Adoption, the glory, the COVENANTS, the giving of the law, the service of God, and the PROMISES all pertain to Israelites. From Genesis to Revelation and beyond, the scriptures were written by, to and for Israelites. These letters were written exclusively to Israelites, therefore everything in those letters only pertains to Israelites. Christ only came for Israelite. Romans 9:5 and Matthew 15:24.
@@christopherbarge414 John 17:20 Jesus said “I am not praying only for these men but for all those who will believe in me through their message." The disciples spread their message (of faith in Jesus) to the Gentiles. They died in foreign lands preaching to Gentiles. God told Peter to offer the Gospel to the Gentiles and Holy Spirit was baptizing them. Paul called himself the apostle to the Gentiles. The gospel is to all and much of the new testament was written DIRECTLY to gentiles like in Rome, Corinth, etc.
@@SpiritLife The scriptures do not contradict. You said, "I am not praying only for these men but for all those who will believe in me through their message". That is true. Jesus already restricted that in (Matthew 15:24) I am not sent but to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. This is also reenforced in (Acts 5:31) Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to ISRAEL, and forgiveness of sins.
The reason that there is an apparent contradiction, is because you don't understand that all the "GENTILES" that Paul preached to were also "Israelites". (1Crinthians 10:1-2) Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; How could Paul say to the Corinthians, "all our fathers" if they were not Israelites?
Another good, touchy subject.
One of Chuck Missler's last books, "The Sovereignty of Man" covered this subject in a pretty good way. The super short answer is "pre knowledge is not the same as pre destination".
I appreciate longer vidoes. Shorts are awful, but that's just my opinion.
Chuck Missler is the man.
@@karricompton Yea, I learned a lot from him. Learned how to learn more, too now that he's moved on to glory.
@@b.delacroix7592 Absolutely. So much of the stuff he taught went over my head. Lol.
So I'm not questioning God's fairness since we all deserve to go to hell. But how is this doctrine in keeping with the heart of the one who said that he is not willing that any should perish? I'm thinking a passage of Romans nine is actually describing how God predestined the way of faith instead of works so that no man may boast that he saved himself or that he's somehow earned it. I do believe it takes God's divine grace and mercy to even have the gift of faith and to be saved which is why we should pray for everyone.
That’s what I believe if you haven’t seen soteriology 101 leighton goes over this subject
This is what God says about predestination:
““But if a wicked person turns away from all the sins they have committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, that person will surely live; they will not die. None of the offenses they have committed will be remembered against them. Because of the righteous things they have done, they will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign Lord. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?”
Ezekiel 18:21-23 NIV
Really appreciate some of these videos, these are some of the exact thoughts I always had and struggled with as an atheist!
Judas seemed to have been predestined, but he had free will to refuse to betray Jesus. It is a mystery we may never grasp. Satan entered him. Did he have no choice after that?
I’m under the impression that God put Judas in that position, because he knew that given the choice, Judas would betray Jesus. Judas still had the free choice to not do so, in that case God would have found someone else who was willing to betray Jesus and put them in the position Judas was in, or Jesus would have ended up on the cross by another means entirely
🎯. I think Calvinism falls apart in many aspects when applied
God knows Judas will betray Jesus, Jesus even said it is better for Judas not to be born.
@@JesusIsLord7773 you’re right., even isaiah said one of his disciples will betray him but isaiah wasn’t just specific about the person,,, someone had to betray jesus that night for him to die for our sins
@@hlokomani falls apart all over the place!!
Just sharing my salvation story. God brought me to a place where He gave me the choice between going on in my old life or following Him. Now, without God drawing me, then saving me, I would have no hope. Salvation is from Him but I remember He gave that choice before He saved me. There was a struggle between what my friends and family would say and giving myself totally to God. Some Christians say, just saying yes to God is a work and I saved myself. However, if God didn’t draw me I wouldn’t have had the chance to say yes in the first place.
Exactly my friend. Just because you accept the gracious gift of God doesn’t make you responsible for that gift, though Calvinist logic says otherwise.
I was saved bc of being tormented by demons. A light bulb clicked and I cried, "help" to Jesus. (Understood my sin and how it offended God, prior to this.) All I asked for was help and I woke up saved/born again. He saved me when I cried for help, i don't feel like my story has my thumbprint on it at all. So, I can see the Calvinist view very easily.
Glory to God! Many blessings to you Brother Allen. Thank you for this thought-provoking video! In grateful humility, I am continuing to learn.
Congrats brother Allen! Your almost at a million subscribers! That is so wonderful to see. Praise the Lord and may the Lord continue to bless you for all your faithful work and efforts for the Kingdom. Hallelujah!
A true Christian who follows Jesus Christ fully is transported from the kingdom of darkness to the Kingdom of light, he goes from being a child of the devil to being adopted by God. When people are adopting a child, they CHOOSE to adopt the child that’s why it is called CHOSEN in scripture.
Romans 8: 15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
In one of my visitations to hell, Jesus showed me a person who was a Christian (Jesus said “he was a Christian like you”). But the guy unfortunately started sleeping around (1 cor 6:9). He died middle aged and went to hell forever it was dark but Jesus lit up the area, he asked Jesus for another chance but unfortunately it was too late for him, Pretty sad, Repent and ask Jesus to help you with your struggles (James 4:7)
Thank you so much for this very powerful insight. I’m always very grateful and appreciative of your research you’ve shared with listeners to help gain clarity on important topics you’ve discussed!
May God continue to bless you the speaker and the listeners of His Word, according to His own Divine Plan of Salvation for all Eternity!
First off thanks brother for this video
I cant say that I 100% agree nor disagree, even after the video and years of studying this topic, I admit that I just dont know
But I do see God giving people the opportunity to choose Him. With all the bible verses explained in the video, it’s clear.
And I dont see us choosing Christ as a reason to boast and say to myself when I am in Heaven that I made a good choice and my neighbor did not.
I dont see how saying Yes or No to Salvation/Christ is a Work, when the work that actually mattered and that has true value is already done and accomplished in Christ Jesus.
I see salvation as a gift already wrapped up and placed at my doorstep, I cleary dont deserve this Gift, I deserve the opposite but in God’s mercy He places it at my doorstep, just because I bend down and pick up this Gift, in my opinion, is Not a Work. I see the Work as already being done based of Scripture
Also I do not ignore the verses in which explains God choosing us, some verses lack context, some that Calvinist use, like some talk about choosing specific people for specific task and choosing in terms of the Gentiles.
Overall in God’s Soverignty, He can do whatever He wants and still be Holy, because He doesnt have to save anyone of us
a good explination of Romans 9 is Mike Winger’s video
czcams.com/video/7y4yjSwEkfY/video.html
I just went on ChatGPT, and it gave very different implications for the first "prepared" (in verse 22). I'd like your thoughts on this.
GPT:
Romans 9:22: κατηρτισμένα (katērtismena)
• Word: κατηρτισμένα (katērtismena)
• Root: καταρτίζω (katartizō)
• Meaning: To prepare, to make ready, to fit or adapt, to complete, to mend.
• Grammatical Form: Perfect passive participle, nominative plural neuter.
Romans 9:22: κατηρτισμένα (katērtismena)
• Translation: "prepared for destruction."
• Context: This verse speaks about the objects of God's wrath. The use of the perfect passive participle form suggests that these objects have been prepared or fitted for destruction, emphasizing a completed action with lasting effects.
• Implications: The term can imply that these objects are in a state of readiness or fitness for destruction. The passive voice suggests that the preparation is something done to them rather than by them.
Please explain this, as contrasted with what you teach here?
God bless you for covering this tough topic. I believe in predestination. I also believe that everyone who ends up in Hell deserves that judgment. Because in Romans 1:21 it says that those going to Hell knew God but CHOSE not to worship Him. So while it is true that God predestines us, we have been called to "make our election sure". It's a two-way street between eternity and our time-bound realm.
DW: Just as long as we understand - in Calvinism - people are *MADE* to deserve destruction.
John Calvin
-quote
He foresees future events *ONLY* in consequence of his decree (Institutes Vol ii. p. 169.)
Calvinist Paul Helms
-quote
His foreknowledge is simply his knowledge of what he has decreed.
(Divine Foreknowledge - Four Views pg 12)
In the Arminian version of divine foreknowledge and divine sovereignty - people are held accountable for what they are *FOUND* to be and *FOUND* to do.
In the Calvinist version of divine foreknowledge and divine sovereignty - people are held accountable for what they are *MADE* to be and *MADE* to do.
Everything is established at the foundation of the world - by an infallible decree.
And no ALTERNATIVE of that which is decreed is granted to the creature.
“God is not logical, He is theological”… I love you as a brother in the Lord, Allen, but I have to admit this is one of the cringiest lines I’ve heard in a while!
He said “God is Knot 🪢 Logical, he is theological.”
I disagree with your comment. Do you think humans can obtain God's level of understanding? Not possible. ps anyone who says cringe is super sus as a Christian.
@@lf1899 I don’t disagree with what Allen was trying to say, I disagree with his use of words. “Theological” is not some God-level of logic, it’s the study of God and by extension his Word. So in effect Allen was saying “God is not logical, he is the study of himself.” And I’m sorry if the use of cringe offends you (I wasn’t aware that it was a word that made people question one’s salvation) but I though it was a nicer term than “stupid.”
When you take things out of context, & just focus on a statement alone, Everything becomes cringe / weird. I think I agree with Allen he was just telling that Gods thoughts are higher than ours. Plain & simple.
@@pramodjingade6581 you obviously didn’t bother reading this thread since I said just above your comment that I don’t disagree with Allen either, showing that I know what he was trying to say. I was simply pointing out that his use of words were cringe. And context doesn’t change that. He said something that is factually incorrect because he was trying to play on words, which is why I said that it was cringe.
the verse in Peter says 'not willing that any OF US should perish" that is what it says in the greek. The verse in Timothy that says ALL men, doesnt mean every single person, in context Paul is speaking to gentile nations outside of Israel , the only place that had the light of God upon them prior to Christ declaring 'go out into all the world'
I'm just thinking about how none of us deserves mercy. We all deserve to go to hell. And i'm thankful that God even decided to choose the small flock He will save. We have a too high view of ourselves that's why we think that all people have a chance...
There is NO ROOM for misunderstanding ..For God so love the World.I could not and Never will believe that God sent people to hell for His Glory.True disappointed 😢
Then I do believe you need to go and reread Exodus where God was hardening Pharaoh's heart against the people of Israel. And God doesn't predestin people to hell, if you lived your life without committing one sin you will go to heaven. Problem is we are all sinners and all deserve judgment.
For Jacob I loved but Esau I hated 😂