Heroes are good - let's make statues of them
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- čas přidán 14. 01. 2016
- Nelson was a hero whose deeds were rewarded by massive monuments. Would he get the same treatment today?
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Was Lord Nelson a war-monger? Did he start the Napoleonic Wars? I'd contend that he did not, but that he certainly helped to finish them. In London, there is a huge monumental square to commemorate the man and his great victory at Trafalgar. Would we ever honour someone similar today? I fear that we have developed a mind-set that makes it near impossible to celebrate an heroic act, because every hero has to be used as a 'role-model'.
If you are curious to see Trafalgar Square on Christmas Day, you can see it here. I can recommend cycling in London on that day - you have the bus lanes all to yourself. On any other day, you need much more courage.
In this I say that Landseer "based" the monumental lions on those in the Tower of London. Perhaps I should not have used the word 'based', but it is true that he did sketch and paint the lions there before sculpting the lions.
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Heroes are good - let's make statues of them
/ user "Lindybeige"
Anybody else get this in their recommended after the events in bristol?...
Yep
Aye. And it summarises everything I could possibly have to say about it.
@@tayetrotman But there is a small difference between Nelson and some guy that was doing philantrophic work with the money he got by enslaving about 80.000 people...
@@matthiashesse1996 So let me get this straight some slave trader that was still trading after Britain declare the slave trade illegal, basically brought himself a statue? Buy being generous with his ill gotten wealth?
And people are upset that it got removed?
If there is a statue of Winston Churchill raised by white nationals in honorer of him being a racist, then I would say it needs to be removed.
But If it was raised because he lead Britain through WWII, then the fact he didn't like poc(*) has nothing to do with the statue
*I'm not aware of his personal view on race.
1)If he ever did act on his (supposed) racist views as PM then I would suggest his statues should be amended with a plaque explaining such.
2) Around that time racism wasn't considered completely bad
Finally, I can see no reason why there should be statues to the opponents of emancipation in emancipation park
it would be like raising a statue to Pierre-Charles-Jean-Baptiste-Silvestre de Villeneuve in Trafalgar square
@@SilverMe2004 yeah
youtube algorithm seems to think this is relevant lately...
Very strange.. ;P
Same. Though it makes sense Nelson got a statue in the first place. He was a hero. The statue of Robert R. Lee is strange because he was the loser fighting for the slave owners. Glad we're finally get rid of the statues of the traitors.
@@VirtueCry I dunno, Napoleon lost too, and there are plenty of statues of him. By all accounts Lee was an accomplished general.
Abraham Lincoln named Steven Douglas as one of the 4 horsemen of slavery, yet he has a tomb in the middle of Chicago that nobody seems concerned about tearing down
They tore down a statue of Christopher Columbus recently... I don't think he fought in the civil war, he's just a 'problematic figure' according to leftists.
In the UK they vandalised a statue of Churchill and are calling for the removal of plenty of people who, by modern standards, had 'problematic views'.
In any case as a general principal I don't think historical artefacts should be destroyed by an angry mob.
@@daveh3971 Christopher Columbus was the one to start slavery in the Americas.
General Lee lost. He betrayed his country and should not be honored for it. He will be remembered in the history books, but do not glorify him with statues.
@@VirtueCry I don't think it's up to you or an angry mob who people choose to glorify with statues. I don't like seeing statues of Karl Marx around, since the pursuit of his ideas has led to the deaths of hundreds of millions of people, but people have the right to build statues of him, however misguided I think they are. I certainly don't have the right to destroy something that someone else built just because I don't like it.
CZcams's algorithm has a horrible sense of humour lol
Indeed 😂
yeah its crazy lol
Or some subversive ideas.
Yep
Same
This is awfully relevant.
They won’t tear down Nelson. He wasn’t some awful bigot or slave trader
@@bryelop Unfortunately what you are using there is common sense. These unprincipled rapscallions are without it.
@@KurtisTheLoyalBriton he's actually under threat. there is a website called topple the racists and it's a map with all the statues and plaques they want to remove and Nelson's column is on it
@Winston Mosquehill Not sure tbh since I doubt he ever even met a black person
FearOfFacts that last one isn’t bad
Lady Hamilton also admired Nelson's column.
Oh I say!
Woof!!
*pops monocle*
you should get a statue for that comment
Ohohoho, good one, sir! Good one indeed!
Its so stupid destroying historical maonuments because they dont stand to todays moral standarts. Its like christian purge of antique monuments in 4th c.
+Matīss Veinbergs -- Or like ðe French purge of...basically everyþing not rational during ðeir revolution? or is it too diffrent to compare?
Rainbow Bubbles that was an ideological purge, not an intellectual purge
+Matīss Veinbergs I think you'll find that the "Christian purge of antique monuments in the 4th century" didn't really happen. Furthermore, there was never such purge in Eastern Europe, and in the Western it only started after Rome separated itself from the majority of Christians in 1054.
+jeremiaas15 it didnt happen in eastern europe because there was no christianity there yet you idiot. Also, tell that to the dead Oracules and ruins of ancient greek temples.
+jeremiaas15 There was a noticeable effort to destroy Pagan temples within Rome from Constantine's reign, but I don't know if that's what he meant.
“He did the single greatest thing that anyone could do for mankind”
“that’s right, he stuffed the French.”
@chris younts whos that?
@@erikandersen5790 A guy who stuffed the french. He's also the guy who killed the leader or Nazi Germany. All in all a great guy with some flaws here and there.
@@lemons1559 we should give him a column too then!
@@mazen6446 I don't know why we haven't. A true war hero.
@@lemons1559 Let's not forget, he had a good go at stuffing the soviets, and he did wonders for Germany's economy. But his art wasn't any good, so....
This video is going to get a second life
@Scott Johnstone exactly ha ha
he also has a video questioning Britains status as an EU-Member :-D
to be fair, lady hamilton was a 10. that's worth a statue
:D
Love it
The affair alone should get him the statue
@catothewiser that's what the phrase 10/10 is all about my friend ;)
Probably why the statue was so phallic
I would love to see a statue of somebody that rescued a burning building.
+Alex The Historical Gamer Wouldn't that be almost every fire man? Except of course, when the building burned down to the ground.
(Yeah, I heard his misspeak, too.)
+Alex The Historical Gamer Better, perhaps, than the other take in which I said 'rescue a building from a burning baby'.
indeed. the world would be full of statues for firemen, Doctor, Nurse, policeman and so on.
+Lindybeige It would take a brave man because that sounds terrifying.
+Lindybeige Ah but Lloyd, one must be careful of burning babies! They ruin the lovingly painted walls and fancy tiled and hardwood floors.
we dont raise statues to great men and women because theyre perfect, we raise statues to them because they did great things.
@Wise Alaundo tell that to the retroactive purity testors of the new inquisition.
We also raise statues to people who didn't really do anything but bad stuff because we agree with the bad stuff.
@@thurin84 Um, you realize that the Confederate statues people want to remove are totally justified in being removed, right? It's not a case of "purity testers of a new inquisition." WE;re literally venerating war criminals and slavers who are also traitors. Nothing more anti-American than glorifying Confederate scum. Anyone who advocates Confederate memorials is a Fake-triot.
@@s0515033 what do you mean "we"? and as far as i know only bad people have ever raised statues to bad people (mostly themselves). and who decides whats "bad" and what isnt?
@@s0515033 no. its not that simple. the community obviously felt a reason to erect said statue. it should be up to the MAJORITY of said community if a statue be removed or not. not an easily offended vociferous minority. its EXACTLY a modern purity test by said vociferous minority. they were not judged to be war criminals at the time and should not be judged by a bunch of offended BABIES today. those confederates were also our brothers and sisters and needed to be reintegrated into american society. i mean what are you advocating? that all former confederates should have been rounded up and liquidated in your "fun adult reeducation camps"?
"How disabled do you have to be to be a role model"
perfectly summonized, Mr Lloyd
Who leaves a baby in a burning building? Aside from Spiderman Movie parents.
+Mr47 steam It's traditional.
+Mr47 steam More importantly, what kind of person rescues a burning building and leaves the baby?
+Sipeari People terrified of what that baby might be concealing in his diaper? I mean, even grown people might shit themselves if trapped in a burning building; with a baby it's a given.
+Mr47 steam Superman movie parents.
+Mr47 steam How many floors is this building?
0:35 "He did the single greatest thing that anyone can do for mankind. That's right. He stuffed the French." -Lindybeige
Note to self: stuff French, get statue, be remembered forever.
Then why doesn't Hitler have one?
@@BountyFlamor only the British are allowed to stuff the French, if anyone else does it is cheating
@Caliban777
We have it so well and comfortably nowadays that we're in this topsy turvy society where we celebrate weakness and victimisation. It's surreal to pause and consider it sometimes.
@Jude M
Well, if that's what you took away from my comment then I'm not sure how to engage with you tbh.
Pro-tip: Become a cook in France, offer _huge_ portions.
Well this is topical right about now.
Damn 4 years ahead of your time
Tyrants have been tearing apart our heritage for decades.
Crazy Redd ‘Tyrants’ is a cute way to describe a certain levantic people
@CyberNomad yikes, bunch of nazis in the comments here 😬
@CyberNomad The people making fun or Reddit are far, far worse than the actual people on Reddit because of things like this.
@CyberNomad I'm not the one going "Haha not gamer moment keanu reeves big chingus" in a completely unrepated discussion and big chungus memes, wholesome 100 and keanu reeves were popular on Reddit when there were popular elsewhere.
Also the average Redditor, nay and overwhelming majority of redditors aren't racist and don't use the n-word just like the average CZcamsr, and just like CZcams there are left wing and right wing communites on Reddit (Despite the fact that the latter tarnsh the name of both these sites(and rightfully so)).
Edit:(This is so you know what the edit was, I know many people have a negative opinion of announcng because people on Reddit like to thank people that give them thing sometimes) You also only made fun of the fact that people on Reddit use memes in your original comment, not that they say the n-word.
So TL;DR: He stuffed the French
*_*French stuffing intensifies*_*
Which is a good thing.
@@Ezyasnos wait no
The nonexistent god bless him!
@Dottoman 共匪 Well played.
some people seem to want to forget history. Remember the heros of the past for both there good and there bads.
+Leo Moon Yeah, that is what I get, that some people unless a writing or person lives to current moral standards, it should be banned or erased, which is absurd.
+Leo Moon The thing is that they aren't that bad even by modern standards. Rhodes in civilising Africa will have saved the lives of millions of Africans quite ironically
+Ariel Solomon Barbary slavers from North Africa enslaved millions of white Europeans between the 15th and 19th centuries. Everyone was doing it. Not just white on black.
Stoj "Slaves of the population" refered to colonial laws under which the population became like slaves. This all varied by location and European nation.
The literal slave trade was something completely different.
Nelson's statue atop the column is around 14'6" tall. Nelson himself was around 5'4" tall. That's Horatio of about 2.7 to 1.
Get out
To be fair, Horatio Nelson also stuffed Emma Hamilton and she was no lady.
It seam that he was stuffing a lot , you cheaky Nelson ;-)
Lmao, at least his demeanor was not stuffy, here's some more interesting Admiral Nelson noise if you like. czcams.com/video/utQjIWF2Dhc/video.html
"Thanks Norway"
Norwegians always get giddy when we're mentioned :)
noogai8 you’re a good bunch. Well regarded in the UK. I spent time in Norway when I was in the RM. Good times
I think one other reason why we don't make statues anymore is because of postmodernism and the push for more abstract art. Also the fact that it's a lot harder these days for everyone to agree on who's a hero, typically because of political leanings. You'll certainly see far less recognition of war heroes like Nelson these days because of a large group of people would consider that unfashionable, regardless of their individual actions, good or ill.
+SpitshineSneakers I rather think you don't get so many statues these days because few have done anything resembling the magnitude of the achievements of Nelson in the past 70 odd years, since the last time a military leader had to do something as significant and succeeded. Those that do get statues.
That too. I'm just saying if someone like Nelson did show up, he still wouldn't get a statue because there would be people glossing over the fact that he saved the country from invasion and would simply call him an imperialist warmonger even if he only fought in defensive actions.
+SpitshineSneakers people don't even know what a hero is anymore, the term has been so debased in my country that you're a hero if you fucking get aids or something
+SpitshineSneakers There are statues of Eisenhower and Roosevelt in London, but those were commissioned under Thatcher. hmm... guess you are right
+SpitshineSneakers I am currently in Cape Town and have not seen a statue of Mandela yet. There is only a Boulevard named after him.....and one named after Princess Anne....
I suppose that nowadays you would not put up a statue of a living person. Although I don`t know when Nelsons column was built.
"It's stupid to judge people of the past with the standards of today."
God, if only youtube recommended this earlier, better late than never I guess.
It really depends, though. A lot of people did stuff that was known to be bad when hey were alive, too. The fact that SOME people did some things that were personally questionable is different from venerating horrific people who did basically nothing good. One good deed also doesn't justify venerating someone who lived a lifetime of evil.
@@s0515033 Destroying statues is evil. No one venerates them, they're part of their city, culture and history. Also how do you know they were "evil"? Did your friends in the progressive party told you?
@@s0515033 "Destroying statues is not evil. It's a statue. It has no volition, no will, and no feelings. You can't morally wrong it. How do I know they were "evil.? Holy shit. how is that" was on my notifications. Well I guess inanimated objects don't have any value unless they agree with your ideology, am I wrong?
@@CvnDqnrU This also isn't a left issue. It's a common sense issue. You don't need a liberal professor to tell you erecting a statue to bad people is morally questionable. I don't think to myself "man, I am on the left, we really need to make a statue to communist dictators!"
Because they're bad.
@@s0515033 Only some extremists from one side say statues are bad. We all know it is an ideological issue. You're in no position of doing any kind of city planing, much less destroying things.
Yes, judging the past with the standards of the present is one of the stupidest and easiest things to do. Even more so because sometimes it seems that it is used to block any further discussion.
Modernizing the past also blinds you from truly understanding the real context of past eras. And honestly, being blind to your past makes you blind to how you got to where you are, and thus blind to where you are.
Indeed, but leaving statues up is a decision too. "Does this statue still reflect the values this society has" and if not, shouldn't be replaced with an even cooler person. I agree with Lindybeige that a persons provate life should not affect their statues, but what about when the great thing a person did directly relates to the bad? Churchill's famine of Bengal is directly related to the war effort. The great military acts of Robert E Lee were in service to defending slavery. The statue in Bristol taken down was a man who used his slave wealth for good in England, but it was still slave wealth. I'm not saying statues would be taken down by angry mobs, but there are tough and multifaceted questions here
@@britishnerd3919 I do think that if you have to be perfectly sinless to have a statue, than we would have no statues. So, in a way, having statues of anyone is itself acknowledging the grayness of right and wrong and trying to uplift the exemplary parts of humanity.
It’s a very interesting conversation and I wish it were being had more than the Mob Rule we’ve been seeing. I also think that wether you tear it down, replace it or not, put it in a museum, relocate it, etc, etc has very deep symbolic meaning.
@@MrWesford that's true, but again there are times when the good and the bad a person did is so totally linked that you cant possibly honour one without inadvertently honouring the other.
@@britishnerd3919 and that’s where I would think the value of that person’s statue would be sparking the conversation itself. I think we all are unaware of what the future generations will say of us because of certain things our society tolerates/venerates that change through time.
I’m not really advocating for one side or the other, but my natural position would be to keep all the statues up unless there are specific reasons and agreements to do otherwise.
Because now I’m thinking about what we value in storytelling and how we all find flawed fictional characters the most compelling, but if those characters were non-fictional they would be demonized in many circumstances. Like I said, the conversation is valuable and I’d rather the conversation not disappear with the statues.
In Philadelphia there is a statue of Rocky Balboa.... A fictional character.
+Dexter Riley Detroit has a statue of Robocop.
What would Detroit have done if Kane hadn't been stopped?
lessevdoolbretsim Kane was nothing compared to Clarence Boddicker.
Dexter Riley Are you forgetting Kane was Robocop 2?
lessevdoolbretsim No I didn't forget. I just like Boddicker more.
Welcome to the iconoclasm of the modern progressive movement, Mr Beige.
Hey its sargon! hey sargon! notice me sargon! how do I get into the shitlord club sargon! sargon, sargon sargon sargon sargon sargon.
+Sargon of Akkad Hi! This was a pleasant surprise :)
Are we gonna have statues of fat, crippled women now for the sjw's and femminists?
Wizard 03 Yeah, because they stuffed the manspreaders
+Sargon of Akkad SARGON WATCHES LINDYBEIGE???
This has made my day.
From what I gather it's not a good time for statues in Britain.
No it isn't. See, some people think they have a right to demand any statue they dislike be removed.
In fact, one has been removed from an outdoor MUSEUM.
It's not a good time for common sense in Britain
Ewalds Eiland or anywhere
@@robinturnbull1731 Not anywhere; non-western countries are perfectly fine. Or are there Chinese people toppling Mao statues?
Or in America, or Australia
This video is needed now more than ever.
Slave trading is a lot more scandalous than the affair nelson had lmao
@@kynn884 There are people saying we should tear down statues of Churchill and Queen Victoria too so yeah the video is needed today more then ever
@@Vermbraunt Saddiq decided that those statues should stay for now, which i agree with. I wouldnt worry lol
@Jude M He is the democratically elected mayor of london. And i think it was a commitee. Yeah id say thats ok.
@@kynn884 dude, sadiq is essentially the nero of london. He reasontly partied as his city burned. Under his leadership crimes especially gang related have sky rocketed. Hes a complete wet fish who before getting elected protected known and wanted jihadis and terrorists in court. I mean the mans a joke. (Also mayor of london isnt elected its voted on by guilds, do a simple google search it's literally all down to money and takes years of nepotism before you even have a chance to get voted on)
Here in America, something like 100,000 dollars was raised on kickstarter to fund a statue of Robocop. I'm not sure exactly what that says about my country...
Calvin Lee Well, he is a hero.... XD
Has Robocop stuffed the french?
It doesn't say good things, mr. Lee. Not good at all
It's says that your country is rad, dude
Itsl says they dont know history.
Watching from Kenya. Favourite quotes
"It is stupid to judge people from the past with the standards of today."
"We reward people for their good acts in spite of their personal lives."
Now I understand why some folks are against taking down Winston Churchill's statue.
Thank you.
You understand the arguments that are happening.
this vids gonna get real spicy soon me lads
He's right though.
@@lystic9392 aye aye
@@lystic9392 Quite so.
"It's stupid to judge people of the past by the standards of today"... this is so common sense, yet I fell it should be taught in schools anyway.. together with History.
Not everyone who did something good ever got a statue and far better people have come and gone since Nelson was about killing people.
But let it be REAL history, and not the fables that are taught today.
If you ask who Cecil Rhodes is in Britain, chances are you'll get a whole different picture then when you ask this in Africa, and yet both versions are correct.
The problem is common sense or truth is not what these ppl are after. They only want control. Let them take down one it a fit and they will want another. It's not about racism or justice, it's about power. This has only just started.
They took history off the syllabus years ago
@jocaguz18 people's actions and choices are taken considering the moral and ethical standards of its time. He is not acting or deciding upon what might be right or wrong 200 or 400 or 1000 years latter. If by the standards of his/her day what he/she was doing was not morally questionable, he/she is not guilty of what he/she did.
what's next? criticize Mozart for not using or playing today's music standards? (I guess he would love today's music btw lol) Criticize Leonardo Da Vinci for painting as he did, instead of drawing meaningless scratches on a canvas? or all princes for accepting to rise with absolute power to the throne instead of having elections and giving the choice to the people?
More, what you do today, may be (or you think) is right, you don't know in a 100 years time. maybe you are doing something that then is hideous, how would you feel one day might be spiting on whatever is a memory of you, for something you feel you were doing right?
The past is the past, it's History. And we cannot change it nor should we erase it based on present ideological agendas.. because that's dangerous, that, is the path of tyrants...
I visited the Maritime Museum at Greenwich and stood in front of Nelson's uniform..... it was tiny compared to me (6' 1") but even more so humbling for it's diminutive size and the accomplishments of the man. I held the sabre of a young Royal Navy Lieutenant (George Thorp), who was killed in action at the Battle of Santa Cruz de Tenerife where Nelson lost his arm and it was so small it felt like a toy but what sights it must have seen. Remarkable individuals of a different age!
Stuffing the French sounds like quite an achievement. We still have statues and buildings commemorating the time that we and the French stuffed the English.
+IT'S TIME TO STOP who are you refering to with your "we"?
TOME Julien America. I'm not proud of my country so don't turn this into an America bashing thread. Thank you.
IT'S TIME TO STOP
I won't, as I'm French and quite proud of what happened during the war of Independance
+IT'S TIME TO STOP Why you aren't proud?
Ezzolino da Romano I'm proud of the revolution and the world wars but the way things are going now is shameful. Pointless wars. Roads in disrepair. No decent jobs. I could go on. The leadership has done us in.
Oh no. Just been recommended this.
@Republic Of Texas just more of the timing is all. Nothing against statues of anyone.
The fact Nelson's statue looks at a models if every ship in his fleet is such a nice touch, heart warming even.
Sadly, it's "wrong" nowadays to honor war heroes. Here in Brazil, people now love to bash on the Duke of Caxias for winning the war against Paraguai. Brazil didn't even start the war, how come it was a wrong thing winning it?
+Thiago Monteiro They're probably complaining about the number of Paraguayans who died in the war.
+Haliaetus well I guess we need to start shaming WW2 veterans, then. Do you realize how many Germans and Japanese were killed? [end sarcasm]
+Thiago Monteiro Because, "violence isn't the answer."
Silly.
Political correctness is a disease that is still spreading fast.
Henry Rasia Yeah, it is a pretty silly sentiment.
“Its stupid to judge people from the past by the standards of today” -this guy
That's actually reasonable and I would've never thought about that. If anyone from today's age was born in the past, when so many horrible things were considered normal, I'm pretty sure they would've also lived by those standards. I believe that it is very unrealistic and selfish to think otherwise.
@@eduardopuccini definitely
"Can we just admire someone for what they did for their country?"
Year 2020: Nope.
"Can we just admire someone for what they did for their country?"
What about what they did *to other countries* ?
@@pavarottiaardvark3431 Were is slavery most common today?
@@phillav11
"Who cares about other countries?"
Well fuck, you've accidentally highlighted the central problem.
Apparently asking people to care about people different from themselves is a step too far.
@@pavarottiaardvark3431 I think he meant who cares about other countries in the context of putting up statues. Why would the British want a statue of someone that has nothing to do with their country.
@@Tempiere What Imperialist did for the empire in other countries has EVERYTHING to do with our country.
"Why cant we just celebrate the fact that someones done something really great?"
"Its stupid to judge people from the past by the standards of today"
NAILED IT LINDY
What if someone doesn’t do something really great. What if they donate to charity with money they got from selling slaves.
@@tomm5663 They still donated to charity didn't them? By our standards, it's repulsive and inhumane, but in his time it was just another regular enterprise, and considering that, he could have used his money with literally anything else.
Rafael Balsan bro the fact that slavery was common doesn’t make it all ok. Should people really be forced to walk past a statue of a murderous slaver on their commute? I imagine you might have some objections to a giant bronze statue of mao or Stalin outside your window, despite their historical significance.
@@tomm5663 I'm not saying it's ok, I'm saying it was just regular, it wasn't exalted as something good but you wouldn't immediately understand it as something bad at the time. And also, nobody is forced to walk past that statue, and if anyone feels so deeply attacked by an object of history they should, honestly, buckle up. I am not Russian or Chinese, so I would indeed be unhappy with those statues, but I would petition for them to be removed or not build, not go there and destroy it like a barbarian fueled by mob mentality. History isn't pretty, and the past mustn't be forgotten, be it good or bad.
Rafael Balsan petition for it to be removed? But that’s history right there. It may not be pretty, and you may not like it, but you should buckle up and deal with it because real history doesn’t care what you think.
I think stuffing the french deserves at least a statue or an award of high repute named after you, I would be very proud of my achievements if they created the Nej D award of stuffing the french.
Mexican Army stuffed the French on Cinco De Mayo. Ole!
@@psychocuda
Hahahaha I knew there was something I liked about Mexicans.
Thank you youtube for recommending this to me in 2020, people need to realise what is being said here
I thought that recommendation was fitting.
Nah, let's just act as a mob motivated only by knee-jerk outrage. It'll be fine
Or maybe we should remove monuments that cause unnecessary pain to people that see them. If somebody was a slave owner and made their fortune from the suffering of thousands of innocents then they shouldn't be venorated...even if they gave some of their ill-gained profits to charitable endeavors and scholarships.
@@Jopp211 thoughts on a statue of Thomas Jefferson?
@@Jopp211 if statue causes you pain, then you should rethink your life. And read 1984
“It’s stupid to judge people of the past by the standards of today.”
That is absolutely correct.
no it is not. People and their innate morals stay exactly the same - society is the thing that changes and twists peoples morals. In reactionary societies like Ancient Greece and Athens specifically you had people like Socrates who was as moral as any individual today. He bypassed thousands of years of evolution by not defending himself at the trial but rather trying to spread his message, knowing he would die so doing it. Karl Marx had ideas of eutopia and every class, race, creed or gender living in harmony - that was centuries ago. What is stupid to judge people by is their character vs their environment. People like Marx and Socrates were able to bypass society and think critically and differently - maybe not everything they say is right and maybe things could be better, they were as moral if not more moral than us. That’s a stupid quote from an argument thoroughly unconvincing.
@@gerardbuttigieg Jesus spoke badly of Jews.
Rokuro first of all I didn’t say anything about Jesus, that was the other guy. Second of all, that’s simply not true - Jesus was a jew himself and his morals were based on principle not on any religion
Slavery has *always* been wrong. Fuck your postmodern moral relativism.
@@gerardbuttigieg According to Xenophon and Plato, Socrates did not think that slavery was always unjust. For example, at Memorabilia 4.2.15, Socrates and Euthydemus have the following exchange:
"Now suppose a man who has been elected general enslaves an unjust and hostile city, shall we say that he acts unjustly?"
"Oh no!"
"We shall say that his actions are just, shall we not?"
“Certainly.”
He's right even if it's against the current zeitgeist , if there is a problematic monument or artifact put it in its context like the anti-semitic carvings on some medieval churches don't remove them add something that explains the thinking behind them and why we think differently now like the Germans have done .
Except that isn't what the Germans did. The Germans under massive Allied and Soviet oversight destroyed almost everything that glorified naziism. They also had a massive policy of denazification through education which specifically explained how nationalism and antisemitism (and other forms of prejudice) in Germany lead to war and genocide.
I still think they should be taken down, depending on the severity of what they did. If we want to put them into context they should be in a museum rather than paraded Infront of the people they ruined. Ain't right.
@@smithmiddleton8893 That is what the Germans did to the medieval sculpture of grotesque caricatures of Jews that were part of the structure of some chUrches .
@@henrywebster5130 statues are not paraded though are they most of time the anonymous sculptures dotted round our towns and cities are unnoticed and unremarked upon .
@@iroscoe Harley anonymous with big plaques under them though are they, and whether people notice them shouldn't matter. I could slyly be sticking my finger up at someone but whether they noticed or not I still called them a cunt
Spot on Sir! I was quite happy to see you posting a video today. This week hasn't been kind to people I like first Bowie, then Alan Rickman, and to top it off Skallagrim gets hit by a car. Thankfully Lindybeige is still going strong!
I remember I once said something a bit racist-sounding on Twitter and now I can't find it or delete it. It was meant in jest but I fear it wasn't as obvious as I thought it was - am I now precluded from being a statue? Even if I stand very still?
+FrankyBabes Unless popular culture suddenly swings in your favour, yeah, no statues for you.
+Lord of midgets Sounds like you've got your own axe to grind there buddy but cool cool
+FrankyBabes If youre not planning to go into politics then dont worry. If you desire a position of power, then that tweet will be found, taken out of context and presented in a newspaper with the worst picture of you they can find.
+FrankyBabes
www.thestar.com/news/federal-election/2015/08/18/liberal-party-mum-on-calgary-candidates-twitter-outbursts.html
I think such tweets shouldn't be deleted. It helps separate the chaff from the wheat.
+FrankyBabes
You're too white to have a statue in future Britain.
At least Nelson is to high to be pulled down by a mob
Don't tell the modern Commies tearing these statues down about Nelson's Pillar in Dublin.
@@scottlancaster2865 without statues people are less likely to learn too
"It's stupid to judge the people of the past, by the standards of today."
Except a lot of those standards were present then too. People just ignored them. Morality has existed for some time and people who did horrible shit 100% lived in a context where it was wrong. For example, the Founding Fathers overwhelmingly knew slavery was wrong. They just didn't give a fuck. Same with Confederates. Why should we have Confederate statues? Traitors in every sense of the word as well as agents of evil.
@@s0515033 Those are the standards of today. Fairly wrong if you read the sources, but they're current nonetheless.
@@CvnDqnrU The standards of today are the standards of yesterday. Yesterday we just ignored them. People were fully aware of morality and knew right from wrong then, too.
@@s0515033 Not if they're your ideological standards.
So why give a statue to them?
Funny thing, for Polish people (like me) Napoleon was a hero because of his restoration (brief, but still) of the Polish Kingdom. We have him in our national anthem. For Brits he's pretty much a supervillan.
It's kinda ironic that he's blaming Napoleon for "declaring war" left and right, considering that, if I remember correctly, it was Great Britain that declared the war to France every time.
Napoleon is quite respected in the Czech Republic as well. Not exactly as hero or villan, but as one of the history greats. Something like Alexand the Great.
Elador1000 Look, I highly respect Napoleon as an administrator and a tactician . But he WAS declaring war left and right 😂 and he was pretty good at it to begin with. It's what he spent the vast majority of his time doing, until he stupidly and needlessly went to war with Russia. He wanted to dominate continental Europe, to upset the Great Game. Yeah, Britain wouldn't like that I imagine 🤷♂️
All right, here we go. From the time Napoleone was in power:
1803 - Britain declared war on France, joined by Russia and HRE
war of the 4th coalition - 1806, Prussia declared war on France, joining the forces with powers of a 3. coalition.
I can't find who declared a war of the 5th coalition, but it started by Austria's troops crossing to Munich.
1813 - Sweden with the UK declared war against France and started the war of 6th coalition. So did Prussia and Austria.
1815 - Hundred days war started by the powers of Viena Congress declaring war to France, calling Napoleon outlaw
From what I know, only major wars (I am not gonna count small German and Italien states, I am not sure about them), declared by Napoleon was against Russia (after it broke it's treaty about the continental system) and on Portugal.
Not to mention the starting situation, in which basically whole Europe declared war on France.
Most of the European powers (if not all) declared war on Napoleon or France more often than did he on them.
Also, the Great Game? Was he trying to influence the conflict between Russia and UK 30 years before it even started? A balance of power I guess?
Here's the map of it if u want qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-9732d0ed8aa18796f023cd8e7e70e183.webp
You could also make the argument that it was France and Britain that started the Second World War by declaring war on Germany in 1939. That argument would be ridiculous because the reason they declared war on Germany was because the militaristic and provocative expansions of a revolutionary autocracy was a clear and present threat to their own or their allies sovereignty and well being.
The British had no ambitions on the Continent and no desire to conquer France, they declared war on France because the French kept annexing neighbouring countries and threatening their allies and their ability to trade. It's not fair to say the British were the aggressors when the French were the ones taking all the territories and enacting a Europe wide hegemony, and the British were just protecting their interests, by trying to stop them from doing that.
He stuffed the French
Haha
+Nicholas Pantazopoulos Ron Jeremy stuffed quite a few french in his day, where's his statue?
+Nicholas Pantazopoulos I am not French and I am offended. :)
I am just kidding mate
+sarp kalay Maybe Stihius is also kidding, by the acquaintance of being "stuffed" and being "butthurt?"
CZcams's algorithm is tryna tell us something.
No mortal's perfect. That's kinda the idea. Doesn't detract from their positive achievements.
The problem is that this idea is at times used to avoid the fact that some people are celebrated specifically because of actions which others from that point in the past and this present would consider scandalous.
@@erikthomsen4768 that's true. & so is the other extreme used at times. Association. Did someone do something objectively good? Well because they also did something objectively bad let us now associate the good thing/s they did with negativity because 'I' deem them to be worse person than they are good.
Nuance. Moderation in everything, even including moderation.
Balance c:
Lindey, they took down the statue of Cecil John Rhodes at the University of Cape Town, a university in South Africa, that he founded.
My opinion is that one can't whitewash history, and ignoring it or trying to remove the parts you don't like is close-minded and ignorant. You don't need to bring honour to those you disagree with, but you can at least respect their achievements that landed them their own statue.
+Tiaan De Swardt If you're a South African and still in the country, I'm sorry for you man. What happens when you give the oppressed the power to oppress is an interesting experiment, but seeing it unfold in SA is saddening.
Dylan Greene Yeah it is. Zuma is getting more dictatorial by the day. He shuffels ministers around based on their loyalty, no matter the effect that it has on the rest of the country.
I'm hoping that things will get better and I sincerely think that they will if the DA is in power.
This aged well
And yet most people in this comment section ignores the moral part.
“Making a statue of yourself is un-British.”
Me, an American: “Ferb, I know what we’re gonna do today.”
This video needs to be spread more now than ever....
why because racist statues? why do you think rhodes had all that money? exploitation. If the reason the shoplifter could put out the fire is because he had buckets of childrens' blood then we probably wouldn't celebrate that. Rhodes wasn't a hero.
@Aussie Bob not even a communist just ok with black people but whatever all the same to your racist thickhead
One of the few Lindybeige videos that I have pretty solidly, and wholeheartedly disagreed with. Especially after the events that have been happening here in Bristol, and the country starting to really consider if it is such a good idea to have statues of frankly repulsive people, who by today’s standard are no role model at all.
@@benjaminmortiboys3789 They didn't get the statues for being slave traders or anything unacceptable by modern western society but rather for the good things that they did for the country or for the place that their statue was built in.
Lego Yoda and that’s all well and good. But if someone donates to charity with the money they got from selling people into slavery, I’d say that we’d have to reconsider their glorious position.
Reminds me of 2005, the 200th aniversary of the battle of Austerlitz (as well as Trafalgar). Despite everything Napoleon had done for France (even if we remove all the wars, most of them being self-defence...), at the time the medias portrayed him as an horrible person since he re-established slavery (that was part of a peace agreement if I'm right, the other european countries didn't want such ideas to spread... bad for their business if their slaves realise that if they were at the colony next door they'd be free men). So, the french government sent NO ONE to the yearly reenactment of the battle of Austerlitz.
While they sent some ships to the commemoration of Trafalgar.
Disgusting traitors, the same that are offended because La Marseillaise (the French anthem) has some "bloody" lyrics...
Duke of Lorraine Napoleon was portrayed as Hitler before Hitler came along. I’d say that his global reputation couldn’t be better.
@@kelamullah1999
That may have been the portrayal but Napoleon was no 'Hitler before Hitler'. I think it's an unfair portrayal.
Whereas Hitler pursued a policy of genocidal nationalism and of 'cleansing' what he considered unsavoury elements in Europe, Napoleon saw himself in the old mould; as a 'Man of History' akin to Caesar or Alexander (who were flawed men, but are largely remembered in a positive light). He was highly cultured and respectful of European culture, developing a close friendship with Goethe, for example, whereas Hitler's cultural obsession didn't move much beyond Germanic works.
If Napoleon had consolidated his power in 1812 when his empire was at its largest extent then it's safe to say Europe would be a much better place today. Instead he invaded Russia.
i don't know much about how napoleon was or wasn't portrayed as, but what i know for sure is that judging him 200 years later because he did this or that is unfair and not very smart. you have no idea why he took a particular decision. you don't have the context.
in an other video lindy rants about napoleon supposedly butchering soldiers that had surrendered, maybe he had a good reason ? yeah sometimes there is such a thing ! , moments later he explains how a local muslim warlord went and butchered civilians because they were coptic christians. i don't know, maybe the guys napoleon got executed were also the same type of people ?
the fact is : we don't know shit about the details of history, even awful events can have a rationale explanation. it may be awful too, but it also can be necessary.
Two main points from this video:
1. Lord Nelson stuffed the French
2. And Lady Hamilton
I love how this was said 4 years ago yet it's so applicable to today.
"It is stupid to judge people of the past by standards of today." People should understand that
If you're analyzing them for historical interest, sure. But if you want to raise a statue in their honor then I think you should. Time doesn't erase all the bad things you've done.
That works for someone like Nelson who had an affair or two.
For slavers like Colston... not so much. Even by the standards of the day slavery was not simply accepted and normal. It being accepted by those in power is not proof that it was widely accepted. And if it was so accepted there wouldn't have been a successful abolitionist movement.
Slavery has *always* been wrong. Fuck your postmodern moral relativism.
Interesting though. Although being french I feel like this statue would look better without a head ;)
+TheGameLecturer
Too lazy to google it... but are there any Napoleon statues in France?
+Sólyom Csaba yes
+Sólyom Csaba a lot actually
Damn right. I move that we make a statue of LindyBeige for saying ''stuffed the french'' in the most satisfying way possible.
This video is suddenly very very relevant
I say, leave the statues be. Indeed, let there be MORE statues, not less.
The French are still there, unstuffed.
A lot of statues aren't old though. They are new and expressly venerate war criminals, traitors, and people who did terrible things. IN the US, we have statues created in the 70s to venerate Confederate traitors. Nothing worth venerating there.
Statues are not history. History should be preserved, but we should not make statues to honor horrible people.
@@s0515033 We're all good and bad people. You can't just go destroying a culture you don't like because your marxist professor told you a historic figure was homophobic. Also no one goes to the statues to venerate them, they're just reminders of history and beautiful decorations unless they're progressive abstract art.
@@CvnDqnrU "We're all good and bad people, therefore statues to Hitler are okay. I mean, the guy loved dogs and was a vegetarian, so it's okay!"
:)
That line of argument is brain-dead.
@@s0515033 The moment you mentioned Hitler you lost. That line of argument is brain-dead.
Also only you think that way, you want to destroy a city because you believe people were evil. You're doing more evil than good, but think you're good.
Stuff the french. :D
got a tumbs up from me immediately after hearing that
What’s the difference between stuffing the french and stuffing the allies?
Let's make statues of Napoleon in the whole of Europe
I think the only people who'd like him in any way are the French, since he was trying to conquer all the rest.
LordVader1094 not really. some of the constitutions of Europe are based on the Code Napoleon and most of constitutions of Europe since Napoleon was based on the Code Napoleon. Most people in Europe don't hate Napoleon except the British
+Narednik Lobanja -- He's even mentioned in ðe Polish National Anþem.
Rainbow Bubbles he liberated poland for the first time since the great divide, it is normal he is mentioned
+LordVader1094 I'm a Dane and I absolutely love Napoleon.
Most people dont care about statues- they dont look at them, often dont know who it depicts and what its supposed to commemorate. Tearing down statues is a symbolic gesture, it shows who is in charge and who gets humiliated.
having the statue up in the first place shows who has power. tearing them down is symbolic, but it's an assertion that those in power ought not be so powerful anymore
@@hharvey6492 The people in power are the Neo-marxists pushing critical theory in universities, big corporations who are sponsoring BLM as well as the politicians and media cheering on the rioters. All those holding power are on the same side as the iconoclasts. You want to be a rebel? Just stand in front of a Columbus statue with a sign saying "Im proud of my European heritage". Now thats standing up to the people in power. The trade-off being beaten to a pulp by Antifa, losing your job and being doxxed.
@@anarcho-boulangistllamaent2023 lmao ur kidding right? oh no ur actually crazy. fair enough lol
@@hharvey6492"You´re crazy"...said the Anarchist.
@@TargunYssboern People get humiliated when you tell them their history is deeply problematic and only consists of a bunch of racists, sexists etc. murdering and raping innocent people. At least I would feel humiliated if someone told me that. But thats just coming from someone with an ounce of self-respect.
When you couldn't build and reach any achievements that is worth for a monument. You demolished a historical monument instead.
A good example of someone who is glorified today despite their personal wrongdoings is Steve Jobs. He was a terrible father and generally mean guy, but he is the face of the smartphone so he's revered like a saint.
+PipBoy 3100 If they erect a statue of Jobs, I will burn it to the ground.
+PipBoy 3100 And a thief to boot. Tablets and Mp3 players and smartphones were around for a long time. Apple just waited till the tech improved so it could be smaller, tweaked the UI, and passed them off as their own inventions.
CapnHolic and? The fact that he got so many people hooked on his products is impressive all by itself.
Almost fell off my chair at "Horse... Git on Horse"
As a french, I'd be offended if 1) I was the sort to be offended and 2) I didn't utterly agreed with what you're saying.
It's interesting that this video has popped up in the 10th of June 2020 just as the UK is starting to tear down its statues and revert to year zero.
There is no reverse. They're simply destroying stuff. Mind viruses are a powerful thing.
@Jude M Those who are under the influence of the mind virus are people, just like ourselves. I think it's possible to help them heal / regain some sense, instead of fighting against them. It's a shame that it's come to such a huge divide / hatred... But to be fair, it might be hellishly hard to change things for the better, cause even if you try to do good as much as possible, there are still forces / people who are instigating more and more hatred and sickness on the other side... Lady Luck help us all.
@Jude M Yep. But who will we target. Our enemy is difficult to define
What statues were torn down?
@@abzalamangos2049 You are kidding, right?
2:29 you're welcome
I asked this in a collage class, why must we tear down people of history......I got no answer.
To make ourselves look good in the present. That's the underlying motivation; attacking the past is nothing more than virtue signaling for increased social standing.
***** when I went to collage problematic was not a word
Consider yourself lucky.
Now now, lets not get ideologically problematic . . one day if we tear down everything our enemies have built society will be perfect, or so says the modern sjw fringe . . .and ISIS too come to think of it
+theygone Because tearing makes for sloppy collages. Use scissors.
We need to keep the statue, it's not about if he was a racist or not, it's about how he served the country and the difference he made in British history. It's the 21st century we should be looking forward not backwards.
Exactly I’m waiting for Afghanistan y to o erect a statue praising Osama binladen
@@dreadpiraterobertsii4420 The iconoclastic muslims don't erect statues of people afaik
Books Lift My Screen I know my point is one mans hero is another mans devil so don’t be surprised when a controversial figure garners controversy
Florian Berisha well I admire your equal stance on both issues
Florian Berisha that’s a fair takeaway
In the Netherlands, statues of our heroes like Michiel the Ruyter and Jan Pieterszoon coen are being vandalised with paint. The Dutch have a glorious past, but you get shamed for even mentioning them because of their connection with the slave trade. In 1672 we fought off the English, French and Germans in the most devestating war The Netherlands has ever known. Are they heroes? No, during that period the Dutch had a lot of slaves. So no everything else they did doesn't matter. In that mindset the Italians have to tear down statues of Julius Ceasar and Octavian August for building an empire on slaves. It makes me really sad to think that heroes who literally saved our country from being an English province can't be appreciated anymore. Quite sickening.
5:05
''you rescued a burning building'' -Lindy 2016
Answer to any argument: "he stuffed the French!" xD
People in 2020 really need to listen to what is said in this video.
His points are fair, sure. But no one is saying take down Nelson for having an affair. No one said scandals matter. The only statues being called to be taken down is the rich slavers and colonialists responsible for the deaths of thousands.
@@UKTheOmegaPyro Oh, Nelson wasn't an imperialist? Furthermore he didn't kill anyone?
@@barry3648 that isn't what I said. I'm fine with a Nelson statue.
@@UKTheOmegaPyro I agree your point is valid regarding the difference in degree of moral failing between an affair and facilitating slavery, yet he meets the criteria you set for his statue to be removed.
I was attempting to point out the hypocrisy in this.
@@barry3648 The criteria i set for the statue removal is that their bad outweighs their good. For instance the statue of Colston in Bristol. Yes he built some charitable stuff, and hospitals, but he was also responsible for the deaths of thousands.
Nelson stopped the french navy but he also had an affair. Not comparable, Nelson is fine to have.
This is relevant more now than ever
Interesting watching this after watching all the statues get torn down
All the statues got torn down? when did that happen?-
Tom Smith In the US, President’s and soldiers who owned slaves or fought to free the slaves and supported racial equality are being destroyed cause of “racism”
What was Lord Nelson's position on transgender islamic furries? I can't endorse anybody as a hero unless they are pro transgender islamic furry.
He wouldn't have to have one for long, the fundamentalists would probably track them down and do unpleasant things to them.
I don't know about his stance on transgender but his last words were "Kiss me Hardy
CZcams algorithm has a weird sense of humour
_“Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right."_
- George Orwell, 1984
Reported Winston ! the Ministry of Love will be paying you a visit very soon.
"McEnery and Penn having been elected governor and lieutenant-governor by the white people, were duly installed by this overthrow of carpetbag government, ousting the usurpers, Governor Kellogg (white) and Lieutenant-Governor Antoine (colored). United States troops took over the state government and reinstated the usurpers but the national election of November 1876 recognized white supremacy in the South and gave us our state."
Yup lets keep statues like that up because thats what history really needs monuments that glorify racists.
@@Youboremenow The thing is what fascist fuckheads like you dont get is that there exist peaceful processes to get those removed if the majority wants it removed and put in a museum. But you dont, you want your will forced upon others and then hide behind a false Morality. Sincerely you can all get fucked neo-marxist Zealots.
@@Youboremenow Is that an extract form the sequel of 1984, 1985 ?
@@SwitosVideo www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/08/when-local-officials-want-to-tear-down-confederate-monuments-but-cant/537351/
Go fuck yourself and learn the facts instead of larping like the uninformed shithead you are.
Interesting time for this to be recommended.
Trafalgar was always such a fascinating piece for me. I remember the first time reading and taking a look at the charts of the battle taking place and absolutely cracking up at the HMS Africa and their path into the battle. I can't help but to playfully imaging the captain saying: "Excuse me! So sorry! 'scue me! Coming through. Pardon me. So sorry. Ah! Nelson, I made it!"
i'm happy that i'm subscribed to Lindybeige and am getting this recommended now
4 years later and this pops up in my recommended
I live in New Orleans. We've had a statue of the Civil War hero Robert E. Lee standing near the French Quarter for years now. It's part of our local culture, and "Lee's Circle" is a landmark in our city. Not to mention, a damn good-looking statue and roundabout (it's within eyeshot of the WWII Museum, for those of you who have visited New Orleans). Lee fought to protect our state, and even released his slaves before the war to prove that the Civil War was about defense of Southern ideals.
Now, whether or not you agree with the principles of the Civil War (I myself don't like that many American deaths), you need to acknowledge that what he did and what he stood for is a part of the Louisianian heritage and should be honored.
However, our current mayor is about to leave office, and he wanted to have a "legacy" left behind, so he decided (after the Charleston shooting and subsequent banishment of the Confederate Naval Ensign) to rally for the monument's removal. The majority of New Orleanians think it should stay, even the African Americans of which he claims to speak on behalf. There was no popular vote: it went straight to a district vote within City Council. No municipal or state popular vote, he just strongarmed the local politicians to vote "yes" since their votes are publicly shown and many knew how riled-up the media would be to find out that someone voted "no" (there are even some cases, such as my representative, where a politician was vehemently against the act, yet when the vote came about they voted "yes" since they knew everyone else would vote "yes" and didn't want to risk losing their position).
So now they're taking down our statue just because of political correctness...there's a lawsuit for some historical society but it won't go anywhere. A dying shame...thanks for bringing this broad issue to world attention, though. Hopefully, if enough of you read this comment, we might be able to convince our politicians otherwise. I myself will tie myself to the statue but that won't do much.
The South was right at the point of contention. There is no doubt that the US was constituted of sovereign states, and the civil war really damaged the constitution. Every cloud has a silver lining however. Ending slavery was a good thing at least
@chris younts I agree with you 100%, I was a reactionary idiot 4 years ago who fell for internet propaganda. My apologies.
can you make a video about medieval hairstyles and how they tied their hair
I remember this vid being quite relevant a couple years ago, but now seems almost prophetic.
One builds civilisation
The other destroys them
Go figure which one I’m referring to
I have one untainted hero remaining that hasn’t been crucified in the court of public opinion or been hiding some horrible secret.
Mr. Rogers; don’t let me down God Damn it.
I get so angry when people complain about Columbus Day for this exact reason. Sure he did some terrible things but he also 'discovered' America. I use quotes on discover because sure there were people already there, and some Vikings go there first but it wasn't until Columbus that the Europe knew anything about it
Pretty sure the Vikings were European.
Rodrigo Ugarte wasn't until Columbus that the greater part of Europe* yeah they found it, but they didn't tell anyone
DrMrProfJacob What about the Book of the Icelanders?
+DrMrProfJacob Columbus didn't get very much right. He didn't set out to discover anything but a shorter route to the east and he failed to do that. He thought he had landed in the east but again he was wrong. He was wrong about that because he was also wrong about the size of the earth and know little or nothing about of the land he was trying to get to. And of course his treatment of the natives he encountered was completely wrong. He did seem to successfully command a ship but lots of people have done that including Edward Teach and Captain Stubbing.
+cgm778 wow, the Columbus hate is real. None of these things change the fact that no one was coming over to America up until Columbus. And then there were colonies, and then there were states. I don't knew about you, but I really enjoy living here.
Relevant now
And this video from 4 years ago ladies and gentlemen is one of the many reasons why Lindybeige has over a million subscribers!
Just a thought, what about the other way around, what if someone would use their exess wealth to donate to cause X and get a statue for it, just to cover questionable / unjust way of attaining said wealth in the first place, or "buy a better image of themselves" for the history books or for descendants?
He/she donated to cause X nonetheless and the statue for it is justified as if it is "for it" as in because of donating, then that's what he/she's done...
Well, there's always a grey area. Perhaps we should then add a plaque to the statue so that people can remember that history properly.
@@tomc.5704 Perfection
That's called pandering. Political parties and companies are already doing things similar to this all the time.
This video essentially became a statue on CZcams.
And at just the right time too.
Uploaded in 2016, yet has so much relevance today in 2020.
I wonder what LindyBeige is thinking now
I would hope he feels the same.
probably thinking of a way to blame Napoleon lmao
“Oh fuck a bunch of racists have latched on to my video as an excuse to keep up confederate war monuments”