Roban Bell 429 Helicopter Self Destructs In The Air - Torque Tube Spline Failure
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- After inspecting the wreckage and the mechanics to determine what happened, I saw that the spline on the front of the torque tube was completely missing... it backed out while in flight. No torque tube spline = no power going to the tail rotor.
Now that a few days has passed since that horrific crash, I'm going to address a comment that has been parroted way too many times. Yes, I do indeed know how to do an autorotation as I've had to do it 3 times in the past few years. Once was with my 1/7 size AIRWOLF model and twice with a smaller 600 size heli.
I was attempting to auto the 429 down, despite what it may or may not have looked like. I was trying to first get it stabilized, and then get it lower to a decent and more manageable altitude to start an autorotation. My mindset is to get a higher elevation at first to give myself time to think and make a plan for action. I had NO idea it was going to break apart in the air like it did. None of the other helis I have that had a tail issue and spun ever tore itself apart like the 429 did.
Back in November of 2022, the tail pitch slider on a 600 size heli I have came apart in the air. It spun quite a bit, A LOT more than my 429 did. I was able to bring it down safely with ZERO damage. I THOUGHT I would have been able to do the same thing with the 429. Again, I had no idea it was going to tear itself apart the way it did. Hell, my much heavier AIRWOLF model didn't even do that when it spun out of control back in October of 2021. Everyone that saw that video was stunned I was able to save that heli and with ZERO damage.
Sooooo with THAT said, save all that, "You should have" - "You could have" - "Why didn't you..." noise, because quite frankly it's getting old. 😎 👍The heli is toast and it is what it is.
Autos a a descent maneuver not an ascent maneuver right?
The internet has no chill. Sorry for your loss. I'm a long time RC pilot myself and know that you cant save them all. All part of the hobby. I hope your next project goes better for you. Good luck.
Everyone is the expert right ? F1 drivers crash all the time and they are the pinnacle of the sport , shit happens , build it better faster and stronger and ignore all the top guns ✌
@@mattcan69 that is apples and oranges comparison. I think the takeaway and learning lesson for everyone that watches is this - 1. Knowledge and skill of the autorotation could have prevented the level of damage - not the failure itself. 2. Keeping a keen eye and ear while flying around is paramount in this hobby. If something doesn’t look right, sound right feel right or smell right - get to the ground ASAP.
To reiterate - autorotation should be a base skill perfected in the learning process. If not perfected - practiced enough to comfortability.
Well said my friend, sadly the internet is full of those kind of people, i have seen your videos and you know what your doing, sorry for the loss of your Heli, it was a beautiful model flown brilliantly.
"Time remaining 2-minutes." is a bit of salt in the wound.
I’m sorry for laughing.
You're clearly an experienced pilot. Don't let any of the comments weigh in you. I'm very sorry that the heli malfunctioned (way beyond anything that you could do). This video is helping to remind everyone that sometimes things just happen. I hope you're going to continue to make videos of more flights. Thanks for all that you do. 👍
I love how all of the experts who watched this video can tell you what you should have done. It's obvious you're not a first-timer. I'll offer my condolences, and let it go at that. Thanks for sharing your video of the flight, and of the unfortunate failure. It's a reminder that sometimes, bad stuff happens.
well, a lot of us have been doing helis a lonnnnnng time. For me since the mid 90's. so some of these comments are spot on... not all, but some.
You can hear it going right there at the end but as fast as that went south i doubt you could have done any more than you did so sorry for your loss look like a really sweet bird. Your flight skills are exceptional and i wish you the best of luck on future projects.
Sorry for your loss. I haven’t flown for several years, but up until that point, I was flying old school nitro planes since the 80’s. Their is a time tested saying that flying R/C, they have an expiration date.
While you were flying, I appreciate the actual scale flying. That takes a lot of concentration to make it smooth and easy looking.
Build another and get it flying.
Aside of the malfunction, I wanted to say that this is the type of helicopter flying I’ve always wanted to see in remote control. You are very talented! Also one of my favorite fuselage styles. I went to a RC meet and the RC pilots would just do vertical 200 feet and then vertical down inches from the ground. Then repeat for 8 minutes or so. While likely challenging it’s not realistic of helicopter flight. Your flying really fed my aviation soul. Thank You. Dan
Outstanding flying with the 429! Control component failure with full power. Torque and rotation tore it apart, physics at its worst. It hurt to watch it fail, nothing you could have done on this one in hindsight. I feel your pain and thanks for sharing.
Dude, I can't imagine the rage you must've felt. You handled this REALLY well. I would have gone on a rampage. I'm sorry you lost your ship.
all you had to do was hit throttle hold
@@carlos64030 Better to try then to do nothing at all.
I was going to say the exact thing. Gobs of time to hit throttle hold.
Sorry for the loss of that beautiful heli. It's easy for everyone to say You should have done this and that. Things just happens so damned fast. I would probably have froze, not beliving my eyes.
Na, when you practice, you protect your investments.
That’s heartbreaking. This is the main thing that keeps me from getting into this fascinating hobby. It hurts my soul to see that helicopter all broken.
Sorry for your loss, this should never happen! I had a similar thing happen to my Roban Cobra. The spline wound out but luckily couldn't wind out completely, so I still had tail but the tube was binding hard. I now use strong loctite on the splines before I assemble the heli.
I've had tail rotor failures a few times over the last 36 years, some with favourable outcomes and some not so much.
I feel your pain brother. 🇦🇺
If only you had a full 10 seconds to pull the switch and auto down like we normally do...
What a shame., it was a nice bird .
My LAST heli was a 60 size electric Hughes 500E totally scaled out similar to the actual one I flew. Full cockpit/ pilots/lights/painted crammed with the latest greatest. All I ever did was low/slow scale work. Then MY DAY came. All normal, 5t hover and then lost the tail. Before I could attempt anything it was beating itself to death. A $2 metal clevis soldered and with a rubber retaining band failed. After 20+ years in all things rc that was my last helicopter. I now fly pov quadcopters when I have that itch to sling blades around.....
Very nice build, sorry for the malfunction of the torque tube.
I don't know why I keep messing with RC airplanes. No matter how good you get, something is always going splat! Sorry for your loss dude.
I’m so sorry about that mishap, it happens so quick all the time when a malfunction appears outta nowhere’s and the end results are this. You’ll be back don’t worry your not ending your RC Helicopter flying on this mishap!👍
So sorry about that! Sounded like the tail let go. Might check the torque tube ends to see if you can tell if it was the tube or the gears.
This is also one of those times when it might have been a different outcome if you were more comfortable with autorotations. It was pretty stable and lots of height to get a fighting chance at it.
The spline is completely missing from the front of the torque tube. The spline backed out and lost power to the tail rotor. I tried to slowly bring the heli down but it was too unstable and broke apart. Those blades are too lightweight and won't maintain any momentum to autorotate a heavy heli down.
@@carlos64030plus you kind of need the tail rotor to do auto rotation
Ouch!! That sucks for sure. You could hear the shaft slipping in that last turn. As I have flown and crashed my own heli in the past, I can say it takes quite a bit of skill to fly like you do. Loss of control happens quick without tail rotor function and there wasn't much you could do except cut power and hope for the best. Things happen quick when you're the one with the controls.
Man that Hurt me watching and it wasn't even mine.
I am soooo! sorry for your loss.
I'm a fixed wing flyer and contrary to all the other experts out there, You had no way out to save that bird.
Like pulling the pin on a grenade, It was going to go, just a matter of when.
No doubt you are a Good pilot. that was a smooth and steady flight for a whirly bird. until the SHTF. (you made it look easy)
These are hard words. but loses are part of the price we pay to play, Some Worse Than Others, and you certainly got $#!ted on that deal.
I have myself returned many stick built planes to "Kit Form". (100's of hours in labor)
The pain we feel seeing our money, labor, time and effort shattered to bits is heartbreaking.
Rest Easy my brother, pick up the pieces and continue with your journey and enjoy the good times that our hobby does give us.
Be glad you were outside at the controls and not IN it.
Damn. I assume no survivors? Least you had the CVR...
Joking of course! I've toasted more than a few (briefly) airborne vehicles of various types, and it indeed does suck losing something you've put a lot of effort (and money) into. I do truly feel for your loss.
I prefer watching helicopters than drone/quads as they look awesome in the air. Takes skill to fly like you can.
Sorry about your loss Carlos. It does not help I know, but what cause the tail tube to snap. If you listen to the sound at 4:16 something started to sound strange. At 4:20 it escalated to periodic RPM drops. 4:23 the tail tube broke. And after that the heli starts spinning of course. Could well be something in the tail transmission, gears or bearings, failed causing the RPM drops and made the tail tube snap. This is our hobby, mishaps included. (I do recognize the terrible sound of lost tail drive from own experience, not fun at all)
Thanks, Bo. I'm pretty sure the spline working it's way out of the torque tube would have caused vibration while in flight. Think about it... the spline backing out from the torque tube made the whole fixed drive line grow longer. SOMETHING had to give, and that something was eventually the metal tail boom, but the torque tube spline unscrewing is the ultimate cause.
@carlos64030 I personally have no expierence with Roban ( Dol fly Align, Henseleit and Vario) Wpuld ypu think that spline construction is a weak part the way Roban did it, or just bad luck? I totalled my Henseleit due to a failure in the tail drive train... too many little parts to determine what failed first... Know the feeling!
Hitting throttle hold and doing an auto would have saved this heli, or at least been a lot less damage. I had to do an auto in mine for the same reason and it wasn’t nearly as bad, broken skid mounts and some slight fiberglass repair.
I'm just curious why you didn't get out of the throttle before it destroyed itself
Lmfao that crash was hilarious especially with how the main rotor self destructed 😂
Wow. That was kind of unbelievable.
No throttle hold and auto rotate?
Sorry for the loss brother. Lost a few and "could of", "should of done" many things. I guess you could have hung it from the ceiling and you would still have her, but that is no fun. Beautiful bird. Look forward to seeing your next one...
That's why you must know autoration.
Dude I feel your pain, the same thing happened to me a month ago, In mid Flight with my Trex500 helicopter, The Throttle stick FELL OFF my transmitter! it kind of felt like doing 55 mph on the highway and your brake pedal comes off...lol I was about the same altitude as you were. by the time I realized what happened the heli slammed into the ground..! The wreck was just as bad as yours, but I did manage to rebuild it and get it flying again.😊
Sorry for your loss! Learn to autorotate first before going up with your new one (you know you'll want to!). There was lots of time for a safe autorotation.
Autorotate doesn’t save you from a tail failure. That would have done nothing
what a idiotic comment. I guess you can tell the people dead from this same type of crash the same thing.. get out of here with that mate
Autorotation would have solved the problem immediately
@@ohgodwhat1 he knows nothing about helicopters, excuse him LOL
That dude flies like that probably knows more about piloting an RC helicopter than you do. I'm sure he knows. I wish you had been there to save it for him....
That is just a beautiful heli sorry about the crash!
Amazing piloting, Dude! You could hear the torque tube spline assembly beginning to squeal at the moment the tail rotor lost power. I'd like to hear some Monday morning Quarterback explain how you do an autorotation with a seized tail rotor and the aircraft already going into a fatal spin and after it began shedding parts. I'm no aeronautical engineer and certainly no rotary wing expert but when the body of the aircraft is rotating, drag is gonna overcome lift and with no x-axis control because of the seized tail rotor, the ground is gonna get real big, real fast. Scale applies to everything except altitude... that can be just as limiting as any other factor. 50ft from the ground is 50 ft from the ground whether your aircraft is full-sized or a scale model. There's more surface to grab air and regain control on the full-size chopper, etc, etc. Besides, 50 ft is about 5 times the height of a Bell 429 and about 50 times as high as your model. Gravity knows no scale so you get a full impact.
Its really easy to tell everyone how to do something after the fact. Analysis is important and that's why you did and are doing what the cause of the accident was... just like the NTSB would do. Lot's of people will have opinions, but only YOU will know the real reason you deliberately flew your aircraft into the ground. WAIT! Strike that last part. YOU will know the FACTS of the incident and that's all that matters. Why did that tube fail? What will prevent that in the future? You will know.
I assume you will build and fly again. Your mastery of the flight controls and the thrill of the chopper performing so well before the unintentional disassembly inflight had me on the edge of my seat (mainly because of the title of the video). Hearing that metal on metal shreik just before the terminal left climb was gut-wrenching. I could envision all the hours building, testing, and flying that beautiful model Bell as it started shedding parts. I know it doesn't help, but you did a great job.
My condolences on this setback. Your next project will be even better because of this. Good luck!
Amen... pushing into ff can be an option but there's so much torque on the head good luck with that. That helis catastrophic failure, I would argue, was beyond any pilot's ability to recover.
WOW!! Sorry for your loss.
All these experts saying you shouldve done this and that.Not realizing if you could've,you would've.That hurt me,sorry for the loss my friend,this hobby shows no mercy at times.
dam man so sorry for loss of aircaft
Some real nice flying before that. That hurts my souls seeing that.. only thing worse is when real people are in it.
Looks like a great place to fly..even got a railroad crossing there
Thats a shame! Not the first Roban that has had a problem, unfortunately.
You have to immediately kill the engine to stop the torque from its spinning immediately
Is it supposed to make that chuffing sound on spool up? Perhaps that was a sign that the torque tube was about to fail?
What a beautiful helicopter! So sad it was destroyed.
I’m willing to bet that the scaled down pilot in the heli had heard ENOUGH of that constant ‘nag’ “60 feet, 125 feet, 4 minutes remaining…” probably thought the cyclic was her neck and just wanted to throttle her!😉
Thank you for sharing this heart breaking crash and the aftermath video.
What a sad sight, such a nice heli. I won't go into what might or might not have been done after the failure (enough people have done that). I do cringe at the close range, eye-level flying seen around the 01:20 mark. I've been flying two helis (a small 450 T-rex and a hefty 13-lb MinAir gasser) since 2005 and frankly, I don't dare flying that close to myself. That said, here's hoping that you get back into the air soon and return to enjoying this wonderful hobby.
I am sorry for your loss, and I mean that in a sincerest way, I too lost an RC except I know mine wasn't as expensive as yours, and the end result looked like a real helicopter crash
Who else was screaming throttle hold dump collective, throttle hold dump collective,
throttle hold dump collective,
throttle hold dump collective,
Sorry for the loss 😢
Yea! You were well into the Auto Disassembly program there...
So sad Carlos...
It self distructed because it was tired of listening to your transmitter!🤣
Around 4:12 you can hear a mechanical failure beginning. Hindsight is 20/20 but if you would have landed right there you kay have heen able to save it.
Have you rebuilt a new kit since?
I know there is alot of time, building, and dedication that goes into a machine like this. Im sorry man. I hope you build a bigger badder chopper the next time around. Never give up! 🚁💨💯
Mate that was "totally unbelievable"
Looks unbelievable.
Rory-Not Gail: RIP, Pilot...
A Sickening feeling..ALL IN SLOW-motion…..for a LONG time.
Throttle hold is your friend in most oh shit situations.
It's a pity. These things are delicate and fragile. The thing about modelers is they're used to and accept failures. Those who can't do that get out, like me. Doesn't stop me from admiring them though, at an emotional and financial distance. Sorry for your loss, it was lovely while it was in one piece.
That sucks! That was a cool chopper!
And then you experience that pain deep inside where no one else can see. DAMN that is sad to see a beautiful model destruct and a pilot sad... Sorry.... "Time remaining two minutes"... Kill that woman...
You were flying it pretty hard. That distance call out along with this makes it clear you need to explore other hobbies.
🤣 🤣 🤣
No, he needs to hot the simulator and talk with other pilots so he has an idea of how to resolve flight anomalies.
The unplanned mid-flight rapid-disassembly sucks for sure.
I was looking at the wreckage on the ground and, considering all the new Reg's the FAA is putting in place for our Hobie, the passive aggressive part of me would have been looking for the number for the NTSB, and let them figure it out....
Just kidding of course. Good that that you found the cause. Too bad she didn't hold together long enough for for you to get the chance to Auto-Rotate.
Going to rebuld? or use for parts. Either way, keep the blue side up!
I have the Airwolf 800 from Roban and I heard this is a problem with the Roban models that's why I plan on panning mine
Did the RC N.T.S.B. visit the crash site? Sorry, I know how much time and effort go into our different hobbies. While we don't enjoy failures, they do teach us to learn and overcome. Loved the verbal feedback from the controller. Didn't even know that was possible. Onward and upward!
*Sadly, there were no survivors.*
Should hit throttle Hold immediately?
my question is why after the first few pirouttes did you not hit throttle hold and at least try to auto? Did you just freeze up or did you even have throttle hold setup yet? Im sorry you lost a nice scale bird but we've all been there who have flown helis.
I feel for you. I lost one in a pond.
Since this incident, I have seen conversations on pinning the torque tube regarding Roban models. Do you have any videos on how to do that or can you point a concerned pilot to an instructional video or forum?
The last pass by the camera the general mechanical sound is different and oscillating. Something is already going south.
I sure hope there were no tiny people in that tiny helicopter.
What happened to the little pilot?
Something starting to fail at around 4:15 What am I hearing?
I feel sorry for your loss. I know, when you have lost the tail rotor, climbing first is the right first step. Then shut off the motor, load the disc to an overspeed, (yes, you need altitude to do this) and autorotate the model. This is not what they know from lightweight 3D helis. You had bad luck twice, the main rotor disssambled while climbing. No one would have saved this.
It needs a switch to blow the rotor and deploy a parachute?
Anything would have been better that what you got.
Nice try to save it, though.
Poor design or defective part or error in construction. Which was it?
Un, Freakin', believable.
Too bad you hadn't mastered the autorotation technique enough to save it. 😔
JUST KIDDING!!!! 😂
Well, it looked awesome flying.. Very realistic.
Will back to the store for a new one
Did Roban acknowledge the defect and help you out ?
Didn't know it was even possible to auto rotate with no working tail rotor(assuming the tail rotor was the problem) . I don't get how you can auto rotate without having any control over forward momentum. Sorry about your chopper. Thing was beautiful.
You can’t as far as I’m aware, these people saying autorotate when we saw the tail rotor fail are simpletons. We’ve all seen videos of real helicopters spinning in with no control after a tail rotor failure, do you think those pilots wouldn’t have been trying to autorotate if it was possible?
@@johnfisher7143 What should he have done differently to save it?
@@Logan4661 nothing, once you lose the tail rotor you’ve lost the ability to stop the helicopter spinning around the axis of the main rotor. At that point the helicopter is uncontrollable and will crash.
@@johnfisher7143 What is the purpose of the tail rotor?
@@Logan4661 it counteracts the torque being produced around the axis of the main rotor so the helicopter doesn’t spin as soon as it lifts off and allows the pilot to point the helicopter right and left by application of the foot operated anti torque pedals. Basically if you didn’t have a tail rotor the helicopter would just spin uncontrollably around the main rotor.
Did the pilot survive,????
@carlos64030 looked like a tail rotor failure, in the RC world could you turn off the engine and autorotate like a real one? Gotta catch it quick though! All the best, what a lovely model.
From the way it was spinning, looks like you lost the tail rotor
Ouch....everything was fine then I heard tail prop come off...wtf
Sorry to see this keep .... learn from it and move on.
Nice flying
S...t sometimes happen. But why You waited so long for click Hold and try autorotation ? I know is easy to say now. But training this situations in RC flight SIM will precentage in fiuture. I'm sorry for Your's loss.
I'm waiting for the NTSB report to come out on this before I talk $hit
@@jordancoleman2402 good for you
Mercy flights is in s oregon with this same helicopter. Are you in medford oregon? I was raised there
Ignore all the armchair experts, unless they were in control of the heli instead of you, they do not know what was happening. Sorry for the crash, it sucks to crash, but unlike the critics, it happens to the best of us.
You sure did a good job of flying while you had it.
There where signs something was wrong . 1:54 you could hear the main gear make that noise before it stripped.
7k$ heli down the drain?
That will buff right out!
Autorotation! Spin almost stops and you regain some control. You could have landed it with minor damages. That happened to me too at our club and I saved 90% of the hely
Devastating crash. Wait, you can't autorotate if it's doing in a pirouette right? Newbie here.
IS THAT UNBELIEVABLE ?
8 seconds before the destruction I hear "2S6....tracking....." (combat pilot humor)
losing power to the tail rotor is not going to crash you in a real helicopter if done right. Tail rotor spins 6x faster than the main rotor, reduce power (will stop the spin), auto to the ground.
I’m so sorry!
I’m really sorry about this. Was flying so nice as well. ☹️ no words😢
So sorry buddy
Your could hear its noise output change 15 seconds before the spinning occurred