Voynich manuscript: script and language
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- čas přidán 28. 06. 2024
- An informal talk about the script and language of the mysterious 15th century Voynich manuscript, given by Professor Stephen Bax of the University of Bedfordshire, UK, on 10th April 2014.
Professor, I just wanted to say that what you're doing is amazing, and I hope you have a breakthrough soon!
I can feel your academic excitement, professor. :) it seems a very challenging interdisciplinary research! (cannot imagine if it is sumerian though... maybe a conlang?)
I also agree, it cannot be a hoax. but I imagine it is work of one or group of eccentric people that were obsessed with oriental esoteric knowledge and want to promote it in western sphere. however maybe to avoid church, they encoded it that weird scripts (which is influenced by the medieval latin letters, and middle east scripts).
I've spent a lot of time staring at these pages trying to find patterns and nuances. For instance while there appears to be no punctuation, there are definite capital letters. One of my favourite pages is f58v, where there is a huge amount of repetition, as if it's saying 'xyz with 123', 'xyz with 124' 'xyz1 plus 123' etc. I definitely buy into the idea that this is related to arabic medicine, which was way ahead of European medicine, we were using Avicenna for centuries.
Anywhere online we can share ideas about what we see? Forum, telegram chat, etc?
I keep seeing "gollag" over and over again in varying forms. One letter added or taken away but the gollag thing is rampant in certain parts. Other parts it's absent, which would indeed suggest multiple writers.
@@legitbeans9078 how ? can you explain
@@poopiecon1489 There are sections of the ms where what I interpret as "gollag" repeats over and over. Where as in other sections it does not appear very often. A strange inconsistency, and does not appear to correspond to just being about a different topic.
@@legitbeans9078 can it be a ritual chant?
Herr Doktor Bax, I am not a language's student, but I really enjoy History and Languages studies as a hobby. I found very interesting your lecture, and would like to wish good luck on your research. Some people may think that is a hoax, but if you stay trapped on it and discover in the end it as a "waste of time", think that at least you developed or enhanced ways of decoding an unknow language.
Well it can't be a hoax the carbon dating proves its from the 14-1500's. So I can't see how it would be a waste of time thereafter definitely thubfa to learn historically from it at a minimum
49:33 that 'star'.. Looks similar to petroglyphs and ancient symbols the Center circle is Mars - the spokes are Venus... you might look at the thunderbold project "Symbols from an ancient sky" for more background.
Thanks. I'll look at it.
Professor Bax. This is fascinating. regarding the mansions of the moon. In Arabic there is Manaazil Al Qamar ( Houses of the moon).
The moon (dwells) in each one once through it's 28 days cycle. The word " moon" was mentioned in the Qura'an 27 times and the word crescent once.
Thanks for your ideas.
Language with prefix "n": what about irish (gaeilge)? With all the mutation at the start of words, e.g. such as in "Dún na nGall"
Notice the capital "G" in "nGall" as opposed to the "n" which is small.
you see it also in the manuscript.
Just saying. I have no background in linguistics.
But when you spoke about the (supposed) letter "n" at the start of words (59:50), I immediately thought of Irish.
Has anybody picked this up and continued on this? It's fascinating.
My left ear is so intrigued by this
astrology and ayurvedhic concepts are well known in southernpart of india..it will help u a lot sir..i am not talking about language but the concepts ...sometimes ayurvedic medicines will prescribed along with astrological time
A little addition on my previous comments, f68r could also be the planet Venus because in Jyotisha-astrology Venus 'dominates' the House of Taurus. So the arrow from the center towards the Pleiades may well represent that domination. Btw, f69v would be the planet Saturn and the beams from the center would represent the years that Saturn takes to complete a circle around the Sun. Another thing I came across is that in Jyotisha-astrology the star Spica is refered to as the 'Chitra', so if anything in the astrology-section is identified sounding like 'Chitra' it would likely be the star Spica. Btw, in Jyotisha, Aldebaran is called 'Rohini'. Also in Vedic beliefs there are 5 elements and not the traditional 4 as we know. These would be Fire, Water, Earth, Air and the fifth one is Ether...
The medium used, i.e., the quill pens also played a role in how words were written. Using a quill pen that leaks means you link letters together more often.
As always awesome progress and very informative!
I have to disagree on the progress part!
At least there is progress! If not a lot of it.
PuririNd I agree that we are taking small steps, but maybe better to be slow and sure than make exaggerated claims...?
This person was quite knowledgeable since many of the elements of the book span different lands, theologies, and ancient teachings. And it would take many travels, fluency of several languages, and a lifetime dedication to this type of work to produce this book. Because the carbon dating shows that the paper is all the same age, I'm going to guess that the author created this book as a compilation of his life's work, probably to sell or pass over before his death. He purchased expensive paper and took a year or two putting this all together. It's quite a feat and it's exquisite.
Pls forward my comment to mr. Bax, YT doesn't allow me to do so.
16:37 looks like star leafs from The land before time
Hi, I am very interested in your work and have been following the Voynich decoding for a long time. You mention an issolate language in your presentation just after you were stumped with the letter N before a word. Well... I am Irish, and placing an N before a word makes it plural... the irish worn Óg (young) becomes na nÓg (of the young). Celtic was a very widespread language and might possibly be worth looking at the grammar and syntax of how the celts structured text. just a thought, but that N before a word for me shouts out celtic based
I am sorry to say that, but Stephen Bax passed away on the 22nd November 2017.
so sorry to hear that. R.I. P Stephen, I hope someone will continue his work.
Interesting. I've seen similar medieval human figures in the past, just can't point out the source, however I don't think the manuscript is a hoax. It has that medieval-style "childish" theme to it. In the manuscript I see some oriental-looking pottery-like artifacts, next to the plants. Another one is the symbolic women in the manuscript. It is possible those women depict the "vital energy" of the plant, flowing inside the plant (and how alive/mature the plants are).
The same vital energy is used to depict the pollen, page 141/209 (archive.org): That page is almost like a flow chart: the women in the upper picture look like they are weak and in the lower picture they all are standing (growth process of a plant?) The top of the page show some "pipes" mixing two plant seeds. So there might be some different artistic styles, depicting change in time/space even on the same page.
Good job !
'Andronicus' mentioned that he had lost his notebook, his 'book-of-notes or something such as his journal... he has an affinity to nature of plants & seeds, possibly healing herbs, and is something of a star-traveler...perhaps he takes part in the seeding & setting-up the botany upon planets?!
thank you my left ear really enjoyed that
This is amazing, have you managed to translate anymore of it? :) I'm subbing to your channel in case you make anymore breakthroughs. :)
Thanks - but it will be slow work! Give us ten years....
Stephen Bax I would give you 20 years if needed haha. How are you proggresing?
@@Annathroy he died in 2017, sorry.
We don't need to look to other languages to find reduplication. Here's a triple word example in English:
" If I had had had as an example word for triple reduplication, then ...... etc "
Not only words, but also groups of symbols, used many many times per line and without much varrying.
It could be another language, it could be English written with a hand broken badly by a blind person,
Could be "apple apple apple apple"
First time it means "apple", second time it means "pizza", 3rd time the 2 "p"s turn into an "u" and make "jump" 4th time it means "jammy"
It could be encrypted in any way there is, could be any word from any language, could be a combined word from two languages, could be a word that is written one way but when you read it it has an entirely different meaning.
It can get as complicated as one can possibly imagine or it can be as simple as randomly drawn, without any meaning, by a really bored person.
We can't know.
Even after we manage to find a way to get to understand what it means, it will only mean what makes sense in our language, with the way we currently think.
We won't ever know the original meaning of this, maybe we get lucky and it matches, maybe we are wrong, we can't know unless magically all the dead appear as ghosts knowing to speak English and the original writer says "Oi! You found my poetry book!"
Some fifteen to twenty years ago there has been a computer aided pattern search on the old roman chant repertoire done by Max Haas. The main problem in these days was to look after something of which they initially didn't know anything at all.
Just looking at bits and pieces. 19:00 is a sort of change wallet at the time used on markets for change, similar to one used in UK on buses which is much more complicated. Below, leafs are animal skin used for shoes before it is finished called opanak in slavic.
At lotus leaf, look at 3. or 4. word, I am writing by memory, it is written clokoch, k i cc, l is cyrilic lambda, o is o, there is extra P for coding, cc o ch. Klokoch is not a tree in that area as google shows but lotus leaf, I heard it many times from my father,
So text is coded so that only gnostic "doctors", protected trade, can read it. Contains name of the plant, its use and a prayer associated with it. Today present in sort of whispering, lost its real origin. Text is coded loosly so if one knows more then 50% of the content, subject, then it makes sense. But, as for the purpose of Amoarisa it is irrelevant, just a decoy. Despot Djuradj was one of the richest rulers in the area, had silver and gold mines, done by Germans, Sasi, so money was no problem. He was also collecting old manuscripts that were not burned by crusaders in time of Barbarosa when gnostics were condemned.
Professor Bax, I've got a theorie about The "N" in "TAWRN" that it may be helpful.
Being a french with arabic origins I'm pretty comfortable using arabic language,here is what I think: the "N" would most likely refers to "UN", the Nunation
from the exact arabic form "TAWR(UN)". Now, considering the variation and the flexibility of arabic phrases according to the context (which is always correct nowadays), the "UN" could be "AN" or even "IN",which bring me to my main idea;
"N" written on its own may be "IN" "إِنْ" (If), or "AN" "أَنْ" (That, for)
I believe that the writer used Nunation as single words.
Thank you. Yes, i have considered 'nunation', and it is not impossible. One problem is that other aspects of the language do not seem to be like Arabic. Also, why would it be the INDEFINITE article = 'a bull' - which is what the nunation means in Arabic? These give me doubts. But yes, it could be... we need to look at it more closely. Thanks again.
Mandrarola... There are only 6 variations?
That's quite good compared to other pages where it seems like only the same word/group of letters are used.
I would love to study the manuscript too. I have done a PhD in materials science at Cambridge but I have always been fascinated by history and language. could you please let me know professor if there's anyway I could help
Thanks - maybe look at the blog at stephenbax.net for more ideas.
Hey stephen,
in hebrew the character נ - "NUN" - N, Is used a lot as a prefix to words - Like
נחשב
נערץ
נלחץ
part of the build - נפעל.
Or maybe it's the Hebrew character "ש" which means mainly : "That", that is used a lot in Hebrew as a word prefix.
Example :"משהו שלא" , "הם ראו שמשהו"
Reminds the weird 9 character mentioned, which looks very much like the character "و" - Waw in Arabic.
Professor Bax, thanks for your dilligent work. I wonder, if this is a book about herbs, why go to such length to encode the text rather than write it clearly in a known script and a widespread language ?
In my view it is written in a lesser known language, perhaps in a script designed for that language and now lost.
+Stephen Bax I think, that if there was a completely developed alphabet for any languange in the XV. century, there would be much more other text in this script. I am leaning towards it being a hoax. Nevertheless, keep up the good work, profeessor, you may crack the code in the end!
I'm afraid you may be right about the hoax, since nothing really new has been said in over 12 months...
In terms of Voynich scholarship, 12 months is a drop in the ocean! If we make any progress in 12 years I will be happy!
See Sukhwant Singh's video that says this manuscript is written in the Landa language.
I bet ya somebody like Edgar Cayce would be able to tell you who wrote that and what it was for. Any akashic record reader might be able to tell you also. Even a regressive hypnotist like Dolores Cannon might be able to tap into a universal consciousness that knows. Just throwing an idea out there. Might be ridiculous.
I have a strong belief that this is written by an Armenian in old-Turkish. They are the ones who have a deep knowledge of ancient natural remedies
Are there any forums or online chats where we can share ideas about this??
Try searching for "The Voynich Ninja".
The reason Centaurea is missing a letter in the other paragraph could also be because it's another form, such as object, subject, or definitive form such as in Icelandic.
Can I get a copy of the manuscript as a word document? Thanks
@
Voynich manuscript belonged to a Roma person who originated from Sindh region of Pakistan. This is a Sindhi Mahajan's book written in landa khojki scripts
What if the centerpoint on f68r is not the moon or the sun, but the star Spica...??? Spica was often used as a solid reference point in ancient Vedic-astrology (Jyotisha)...
Ancient Vedic-astrology has 4 'houses' and uses Siderean zodiac signs. The sun & moon are listed as 'planets' of which there are 'good' planets and 'bad' planets. The Hindu-god which presumely 'ate' the Sun also has a role in ancient Vedic-astrology. Some zodiac signs are only linked in conjunction with certain planets. Some planet-cycles around the Sun would also be depicted (Saturn).
As for the linguistic aspects, it looks as if some glyphs resemble glyphs of we also find in both Khudabadi-script and Mahajani-script. Both of these scripts are known Landa-type scripts. The sounds these glyphs may represent in these scripts may be very well the same as in Khudabadi or Mahajani. It may also be advisory to check a possible word-identification with existing languages in the same region like Sindhi, Punjabi, Khojki and Gujarathi. Cross-checking with a suspected 'mother-language' like Sanskrit would also be advisory.
I'm not really studied on this enough to really add anything, but I agree with this approach. It seems the most logical by far, especially the theory about N. If you think about how English would be in abjad, a single letter for R could easily represent re-, -er, and or. A real train wreck right? N is pretty easy to combine with consonants (like N' before a word) and this language could have very complicated declension and other grammar rules that limit the number of words required to express an idea. A perfect recipe for repetition and overall disaster in trying to translate it. Even worse when you add a bunch of transliterated words.
Markworth Thanks.
Anyone notice nearly all paragraphs, or first word on the page, starts with the same 3-4 characters? Is this not extremely unlikely in natural language?
I'm almost convinced that 68r shows the house of Taurus, but then I realize there are 8 houses on that diagram.🤔🤔 🤔 How do we explain that?
Stephen, there is one thing that you are saying that I do agree with. The mss. is written in a lesser known language. Perhaps in an old Karelian or Ingrian dialect, the Voynich Manuscript authors wrote from around the Marble Caves of Ruskeala north of Sortavala in the Republic of Karelia. The mss has a map of Sortavala. Much of the text is a list of Finno-Uralic names. The mss. seems to center around midwifery. Similar implements the gravid women are depicted holding have been found in Sofporog. Last pages feature surnames begun with a star and followed by first names. Baltic Finns have a tradition of banya or spa, and Finnish women have traditionally given birth in the sauna.
With respect, I do not believe your background in Arabic will help you with this. In fact, it might get in the way. voynichbirths.blogspot.com
Has anyone ever wondered how would we react if we managed to decode the manuscript? What if it's nothing extraordinary (i.e. not revealing to us anything that we didn't already know)?
I guess it would just be a triumphant victory in decoding, and it would surely be talked about for decades, if not for centuries to come (even if nothing special is written in it).
Yes, I'm going to guess it's nothing more than remedies, using plants, water, maybe potions, and astrology. I think we can all see that, but somehow hope it's something more.
If anything, the take away from cracking it would be the discovery of a new language.
@@Mcoogie I forgot this exists
47:34 I read it "mandraghola". It's not an "L", but a "H".
oh ...one of those left ear friendly videos,
On the map in the top right hand corner there are two buildings with names against them; one with 3 spires and another with a single tower. Both have a text caption against them. One looks like a medieval Gothic tower of a Northern Italian city and the other an abbey/cathedral. I don't know if someone has identified them. I don't know medieval italian Gothic buildings. I could guess that the tower looks like the one in Bologna and the spires look like the Basilica di Sant'Andrea, but these are really wild guesses. The spires could represent a building further away as the drawing is further away. You really need an expert on this architecture and the buildings of that period to try to identify them. Does anyone know one?
+Jake Cross Thanks - yes, a lot of people have discussed those interesting buildings. See my blog: stephenbax.net/?p=1211
There seem to be 2 schools of thought here.
1) The Voynich contains a known or unknown language in what is an unknown script.
2) The Voynich contains a cipher.
I was in camp (1) initially and now are firmly in camp (2)
There seem to be potential concerns with both hypotheses.
For (1) and this is my reason for rejecting it the manuscript appears to originate from Northern Italy given numerous details on the map; which Nick Pelling and I have studied in detail, and also in terms of imagery in the manuscript and what I understand to be commonalities with characters used in 15th Century Italian ciphers.
For (2) numerous Mathematicians and cryptographers have tried to solve the cipher for over a century and failed.
I wonder if the reason Mathematicians have failed is because they have approach the cipher in the very pure way that a Mathematician does. I am not trying to denigrate Mathematicians(I am one.), but I think the purpose of this cipher is different from the kind Mathematicians deal with. This is a personal cipher rather than one used in communication and therefore does not necessarily always conform to the rigorous and precise rules of a cipher. When I use the term "Personal cipher" I mean a cipher designed not to be read by others, but rather just oneself; this makes for much more scope for flexibility in the interpretation of the cipher and allows for the breaking of the conventional rules of a cipher. All this is easy to say and I like everyone else have not (yet?) solved the cipher. However I believe I have analysed the map more thoroughly than anyone else has and identified many more specific locations than anyone else and also possibly the very point of origin of the manuscript and author, although I am reticent to divulge those here or anywhere else yet as it might give me a competitive advantage in cracking the manuscript and I am on the hunt for something in the somewhat obscure author's handwriting. Anyway that's my attempt at self-justification.
Some questions and comments from someone who deals with manuscripts from a very different time and place.
First, a big question: Can the other ostensible names on f68r (the chart allegedly showing Taurus and Aldebaran) be associated with stars, asterisms, or lunar mansions? If yes, then that should be a big key to deciphering other letters in the script. If no, then you're left with a disheartening anomaly: a chart, evidently influenced by Arabic astrology, that shows Taurus and Aldebaran in one corner, but nothing else that can be associated with any other names from Arabic astrology. This would have to make one reconsider whether the chart really depicts Taurus and Aldebaran in the first place.
Now some comments. The lecture was fascinating and your approach to decipherment certainly sounds promising, but there are some implausible consequences to your findings that must at least be aired. (This is not to deny that other theories, such as the thesis that the book is simply a hoax, are implausible too.) If you are right, then the text was written in an unenciphered natural language; the problem is simply that we don't know the underlying language and the script is (apparently) unique. But wouldn't that be exceedingly bizarre? Probably a one-of-a-kind situation, actually. Of course there are other texts written in unknown languages and unfamiliar scripts, but they weren't produced in fifteenth-century Europe and accompanied by illustrations of Genoese castles (with unexceptional parchment and pigments). They tend to be much more ancient and come down to us virtually decontextualized. Compounding the weirdness is the fact that the manuscript baffled experts as early as the seventeenth century. In other words, the information necessary for unlocking the text was lost centuries ago, not long, in fact, after the text itself was put to parchment. All this, combined with the smooth ductus--the copyist(s) seem(s) to have had lots of practice with this script before writing the VM--makes me think that the text was written by and for occultists, and that other texts must have been written in the same script, but, for whatever reason, were all destroyed by the end of the Middle Ages. Someone was deliberately trying to be obscure.
Two other features of the script have to be accounted for. First, the peculiar distribution of signs. Perhaps, if this really is an unenciphered script representing a natural language, the same sound is represented by more than one sign depending on its position in a word. Second, the apparent lack of diacritical marks seems noteworthy too: it makes me suspect that the script was developed precisely for this kind of manuscript; in other words, it was not some older script that had to be adapted to new purposes. Or it's a cipher.
Thanks for an informed and interesting response. If you want to add it to my blog at stephenbax.net you will get some good feedback from a range of people!
In my mind, If someone wants to get ahead of decoding this mystery, He must be well taught in Hebrew and Arabic/Persian and Latin.
Makes the most sense.
My thoughts exactly. It seems like it's influenced by all those those languages, so having knowledge in all of them would be steps ahead in cracking it.
The main problem is how he knows all knowledge. About stars even back then there were no telescopes
i'm french so excuse my poor english... your videos are very interesting but i think one element is missing to you... i have a big feeling that lot of the signs in the words of VM are not directly letters... i discovered, November 2012, that spaces between the words are in many pages dictated by the lines of the draft at the verso, so many length of the words may be false too... As you, i'm still searching the truth on VM and i've a blog EchapFr.wordpress.com... the fact is that draft at verso as a big influence on the signs on recto... i don't know whether it's mixed (char add to draw) or composed (chars between draw) , delayed (a group of signs correspond to an only char, eg chor-> A) or artistic/scientific disposition (to use numbers, or nodes or colors)... but this fact may change all your interpretation and your manner to find words... expecting one day we will find the end word of this story...
Merci! Yes, I do agree that many aspects of the script are still uncertain, and I'm interested in your views on the spacing. I'll have a look at your blog. Thanks
Stephen Bax ok, don't fear to ask details, i've lot of time for this subject... thank you to listen me.
Itu bahasa gundik burem sultan sulaiman Ottoman (1500) 🇹🇷 untuk menghindari kelicikan saingannya karena dia lihai meracik herbal. Adapun yang diterjemahkan dalam video ini sudah benar, tapi yang lainnyatidak akan bisa diterjemahkanwalau pakai komputer, karena ejaannya dibolak balik sedemikian rupa dari ejaan Arab turki. Ini bukti bahwa para ilmuwan bisa dipermainkan oleh seorang gundik raja (karena itu hanya untuk pribadi/bukan dibukukan untuk umum seperti halnya para ilmuwan).
Do those plant drawings resemble any of the actual known plant species, any botanists out there?
See the full discussion of this at: stephenbax.net/?page_id=419
Looks like a Book of Shadows
43:58 oddish!
yes, very oddish!
Stephen Bax
(Oddish is a pokémon)
Stephan Bax you seem like your the one whose going to decode the book and isn't gonna pull forward some crazy hoax of what some people imagine it to be. Best of luck to you.
the castle is a Italian castle!! The ramparts. Italian castles were the original ones that used the "dove tail" type tops! the same ones as seen in the book!
Roy Hemion .Italian castles are ful of stolen and robed things from Cathars-medieval heretics from Southern France,Northern Italy,the Balkans.by the way,Italy is home of medieval Inquisition and Vatican
I know....and am sure of it...but the design is know to originate in Italy....as far as I know.
Makedon LOL Things stolen and robbed from Cathars, which Cathars stole and robbed from the Holy Land....
If this author is a traveller ( and it's quite likely he is) unfortunately distinguishing an Italian building in his drawings doesn't provide information that will help crack the code. 🫤
@@Mcoogie this is true.
You should've turned off surround on the microphone.
16:45 - is it really only "koar" or a longer word?
Five people, three opinions: www.voynich.nu/q01/f006v_tr.txt
koar.y.sar.
koar!y!sar.
koar!y.sar.
I prefer the last and I'm reading [EVA "y" like "en"]: koaren.sar
Maybe it's not any natural language. Maybe it's a really old (oldest?) a posteriori conlang which was created by someone who was lucky enough to be educated in many languages. Maybe every single word will prove to be its own etymological nightmare. I'm not saying that I think this is the case, but it's an interesting thought, I think.
Hi i amit jain from india and iam solve voynic manuscript and i am make a video 3 September
you should be check the tamil old language because the this book i have i see that some Hindu horoscope more then 75 % match and the mention the green leaves most see of the tamilnadu
Have you watched Amy Michelle Mosier's series on CZcams? She took an interest in this about 2 years ago, possibly because she has backgrounds in both botany and Slavic languages. That made her an ideal candidate to decide this book! She has made so much sense of what appears at a first glance to be a hoax. Please check it out. I think the book should be hers ! Haha. Her CZcams account is AZstarwatcher.
Pleiades: al- Thurayyà (Soraya). The first Lunar Mansion☆used in India and China☆ the Geomancy is related to Fengshui.☆anticlockwise is the standard NH astrological chart☆ plan2 , very slow, Malay..
English has reduplications too, that that, had had, et cetera.
the guys who wrote the book were from difrent parts of the world simbolized by the plants
sorry for my speling
Each Following letter in the word jump more or less than the last
Need to know the order of the alpha beta originally proposed
Need to know the language
Size Jump order
Jump starting point
Last letters might jump back to the first
57:50 if you look at the work of Azbo, you will see that he correctly decoded this word in to Arabic "alosano" or you can search for ot نبات اللسان which os Carduus in English.
You should really look at this...
czcams.com/video/0DAzGH_am2U/video.html
I am Arabic speaker and what this gentleman showed makes more sense and findings are actually easily proven (name of plants and animals in arabic).
Atlanticobr, video #58 says the book was left by a visiting alien. I would believe that they do have some of the same materials as found here on earth. May have even gotten some of the materials for the book while here. The language is no known language or code that we know of. Some of the drawings are of plants not known here. Drawings of galaxies not known at that time by us. Drawings of other things not known by us at the time or even now..It all looks alien to me. If it looks alien then maybe it is alien. But I 'm just going by what Atlanticobr says, the Alien from Andromeda.
Just because we don't understand the script, it doesn't mean it was done by aliens.
Exactly!
Pagan Arabs used to worship a star called Ash-shi-raالشِّعْرَى , known to us as Sirius. could that be the one you looking for?
How is it decided definitively that the script is written left-to-right? It could be other way as well...
By analysis of the handwriting. In places the letters overlap so we can see that the one on the left was written before the one on the right.
If you can't tell the difference, you haven't been looking.
Voynich bought a chest full of books and this manuscript. Is it possible that vellum was found and used at a much later date ?
I do not subscribe to this theory ie: it is a forgery by Voynich himself.
It took me three years to try and decipher some of the perculiar symbols and came to the conclusion that the manuscript is by different people and different languages.
Persian is found in the ' cosmological ' part of the manuscript.
In short, this illusive manuscript seems to have been copied by people who used their own form of interpretation of what certain words meant to them.
I've thought that perhaps the author spoke several languages and mixed his spoken word, and perhaps even his writing. If he was a traveller, this is quite possible.
I believe this book is copied from an older ancient Greek book to another language. I am not speaking very good English but I believe I can help you. I have something important for you. Sent me your email
Professor take a look at this link czcams.com/video/PoNm65v1thU/video.html , and look into the Roma , in the eastern Country called Romania , there are a few elders that still speak a language that is not written anywhere , and they say its from their ancestors ... maybe you guys are looking in the wrong place , while the answer was right under your noses , theres another thing you guys are doing wrong , you assume everything is English based , but there are things that the Eastern countries did as well , and their pronunciation and alphabet is a bit different than the english one.... you will never be able to decipher this with the limited alphabet of the english language , try a different alphabet ... ( i apologise for my grammar mistakes , english is not my first language)....
It could be an old form of Turkish. But I guess the author is Armenian. The letterforms look like Armenian. Plus Armenians have ancient knowledge of natural remedies.
I think well of the late Prof. Bax, but he has made many basic errors. I won't speak about linguistic errors, but I notice that he continually gives a wrong and very late attribution of some idea or conclusion. In some cases, the plant identifications - as for RIcinis communis - have been agreed for decades, and are no new discovery. The same is true for other things which he thinks are 'new insights' because the people repeating them on their website - being greedy for credit - omit mention of their own sources. In other cases, it is simply because Bax is a novice: for example, when he talks about the Pleiades and Taurus... those ideas had been around for years before be came on the scene. The same is true for what he imagines is some brilliant new idea by Marco Ponzi. In fact, there has been discussion of the lunar mansions for years. At the very least since 2010 when I explained their importance foeastern time-keeping, calendars and navigation. Euro-centric Voynicheros imagine the lunar mansions have something to do with magic, but as any Islamic person knows, they were part of the pre-Islamic calendar's divisions, and also the months of the lunar-based agricultural year. Nothing to do with magic at all. I have often spoken of them in connection with the pre- and non-Ptolemaic means for gridding the heavens. Bax continually makes the mistake of crediting the most recent re-presentation, or re-discovery of some very well known idea in connection with the manuscript. I think well of the late Prof. Bax, and don't believed he deserved the rough handling he got: but he was little too ready to accept whatever his nearest advisors told him, and overly enthusiastic about a voynich.nu... which is one Voynicheros website with one Voynichero's agenda and theory deciding how information will be angled and what will be included or omitted.
Taurus was killed by Moses 3500 years ago, and entered Fish. People believed in Taurus God.Moses destroyed Taurus. Al=star(god),Al,el,yl ar,ra.His son is due dy El,Ili(Ylliria,Illyria,Iliria,elas,ilios)Dy ili,dy eli.dielli,dios.Sun,the son of star,the son of God,Sun=Zeus,deus. Two Ili,eli,Ali,Ar Ra.Eloh Alah.they all mean star,but pagan title of god.Yllirian,Illyria,iliria,el al ar,alban,arban...Al debor,al=de(deus)-bor. bor=snow=white=white star=bright star=bardhyl,barll(white)star..De bor=god(star) snow.bardh ylli if bar dylis then make Sun.All Albanian,.Ma means more,maie=top,maior=tops ma=more, mauntain,math,mat,make,max. base word is Ma=More Albanian.I think Semitic languages were created later by their religion books without vowels, and perhaps read them right to left.So we have bardylis,then Gentius used flowers to cure soldiers.I believe we have to let aside other languages and try north Albanian dialect,and all dialects,,but Albanian language is not isolated , created most of white peoples language . Pellazgien=white people.was treated as isolated.It is just preserved by Albanians,others took other forms but words did not change mutch..en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bardyllis