Vic DiCara on Using the Tropical in Vedic Astrology
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- čas přidán 2. 07. 2024
- An interview with Vic DiCara where we talked about his use of the tropical zodiac in Vedic astrology, and some of the debates and controversies surrounding the historical usage of the sidereal zodiac in the Indian tradition.
This interview was recorded at the United Astrology Conference on May 28, 2018.
For more information about Vic check out his website:
www.vicdicara.com
And his CZcams channel:
/ vicdicarasastrology
#UAC2018 #astrologers #VedicAstrology
Two of today's greatest astrology teachers!!
Vic is awesome and his channel is brilliant
Wow! I didn't realise it was such a big conference! Chris, your intelligence is revealed in the way you listen so attentively to what Vic needs to communicate!
So happy to see these two on the screen together. :)
Vic DiCara’s video translation of the Baghawatam makes my heart sing. I watch it on YT. :)
At around 1:40, Vic is referring to the San Francisco Bay Area astrologer, Jessica Lanyadoo
Yoooooo! So glad I found this video. My two favorite teachers.
Lots of respect for Vic n Chris.
This just came up in my feed and it’s marvellous! I love both of these astrologers and have learnt so much from both.
Two really brilliant guys! Great to have come across this.
I just love Vic❤❤
Great! Thanks for sharing ali this Chris!
Great video, thanks.
Cool interview!
Yes, more Vic DiCara!
Hey Vic on the pod!!
Vic ! ✨🌸🙏🙌😄
Ty
Ah my favourite men!
OMG VIC YOU JUST BLEW MY MIND AT 10:03!
Yup you blew our minds too blondie blue Eyed ARYAN!!!!Yup your comments scrrenshot which you deleted has been circulated in almost every Uni History dept.
❤ vic
He brings in Varahamihira who knows about the equinoxes shifting against the stars but then defines the nakshatra pada and signs aligning in his astrological text Brihat Samhita. In BPHS too we see clear evidence that they are using sidereal when looking at Shad Bala calculations, yet for things like calendar usage as seen in Parshara's Vishnu Purana it is solar based. One can make many arguments from the old texts, so it would be good if Vic clarified that these are all his opinions and not fact by any means whatsoever.
He is a joke who spurts out BLANKET statements and cherrypicks definition of rasi and nakshatra then ties in Hipparchus'S precession theory to prove that solstices and equinoxes are shifting and therefore he Zodiac needs to be changed and reformed like Babylonians, Indians and even Chinese had no clue abou this. The Tropical Bhachakra that he shotguns in every argument;was used by INDIANS to measure time. That doesn't mean that Tropical MUST be used for NATAL HOROSCOPY. Because erecting horoscopes;As Vic Claims is not Indian per se. He doesn't provide any timelines and Archeological proof of when the equinoxes were discovered and did the knowledge of equinoxes coincide with the Zodiac changes? Indians knew and were using Precession before Greeks figured out ho to create TOILETS for SANITARY PURPOSES. From Sage Garga to Bhaskara 1 to Bhaskara 2 all of these have calculated precession.
Yip. He also conveniently ignores any attempts at discourse that easily and clearly blow his main thesis out of the water as well, such as what you bring up here. If we only look at the written historical record available it is pretty much agreed upon that Babylonians devleoped the zodiac, they were using sidereal, and they were the best predictive astrologers of their time well before the Greeks had any clue of how all this worked. I don't think anybody who has looked at the history could argue against this and to not take this into account is absurd. If we also take into account that trade and contact of India at the time period was very common and India/Vedic culture extended well up to Babylonian territory in this day and age it is not much of a leap to understand that they likely entertained similar knowledge - even though writing was not big on the Indian "To-do" list, which was favored by the Greeks, who as you point out, were far less developed culturally at this time - barbarians even according to some accounts.
That is the current standing based on the evidence that Zodiac traveled from Babylonia to India. However, some compelling evidence have emerged in the recent years that it may be an intermingling exchanges/ideas of Babylonians, Egyptians and Indians and the meeting point might have been Babylonian where the blueprint was finally laid off, like in today's technology transfer through a consortium of Universities akin to Russel 20 or Ivy League or some tie up of that sort. I think Greeks messed it up by interpreting with the Arab translations of Sanskrit and a lot of Astronomical treatises were lost/burnt/plundered.
And you know what, this Vic dude was live just the other day and I pinched him with those questions online live and all that he could come up with is this : Indians were preservationist and regarded 108 as sacred etc. and made a mistake of adopting sidereal zodiac. And when I further inquired how did this happen: Again standard Shani way of thinking : It doesn't matter because the Surya Siddhanta and Puranas define blalalalabla. He took off that live video yesterday, I think he was too embarrassed.
Yes the current evidence suggest Babylonian origin, but it is pretty evident that a lot of ancient cultures had some interchange, particularly those you reference here, though I have not seen much direct transmission evidence on any side of these debates. What is the recent evidence you are talking about here?
As for Vic, you said it right there - shani brain. Debilitated in fact ( in sidereal of course).
Frank Vazquez and TheDarshanProject are you the same users?
Concerning tropical calculations, atleast there is plenty of evidence in the Agamas :Summer months like Sukra and Suci, Madhava and Madhu etc..(which of course Vic wouldn't care to mention because it doesen't fit his bone of contention)was a calendar based on equinoxes and solstices which was DYNAMIC and NOT STATIC because they had knowledge of precession. I hope VIC comprehends this.
Indians/Vedic/Indic call whatever you like, were neck deep into sacred geometry(Yantras etc) which is present on newly unearthed cunieform tablets(from Ghaggar Hakra in Indian Harayana state that predates Mohenjo daro by atleast a couple of thousand years : Check this out, this is a huge Archeological finding which predates Indus Valley Civilization to atleast 5000 BC ) and this has Astronomical inferences that predates Babylonian and Egyptian usage of Geometry(Caution : Up until now; could be subject to change). There were Buddhists teaching in ancient Egypt and babylonia and present day North est Pakistan and Afghansitan was a melting pot for Information exchange because there were Universities in those regions(Bactria) where scholars met and discussed ideas. This is uncontested. We have to wait until Scientists and Geologists interpret the cuneiform tablets completely : BTW some of the cuneiforms even in Indus Valley seals also depict PRECISION and this is 2000BC). I certainly don't buy a linearunidirectional transfer of knowledge.
Love this man's approach to astrology and how he conveys symbolism. As for the tropical vedic, he puts out his argument in a very eloquent and convincing way...yet.... unfortunatly he missed the whole picture. Sidereal zodiac surely works and becomes very clear with certain charts with asc on the cusp in first few degrees where most of planets change the houses in more cases than not I find it a bit arrogant to pursue such endeavor with so much righteousness. IF he was a bit more humble about it, it would be a different flavor. He would still be missing the point but it would be a different taste. His openness would shine forth and bring him to more open conclusions.. Like this feels more like a teenager rebelling... That's the point I completly don't resonate with. He is bringing a new facade into vedic astrology and missleading people in the same time unfortunatly...
Have you even watched Vic's videos? He's literally one of the most softest, gentlest individuals honestly asking for valid critics and reasons to debunk his theories. Yet he's gotten some of the nastiest, snarkiest comments from sidereelists I've ever seen.
He's not being arrogant nor righteous. His videos are incredibly humble compared to the asshat tone of many stuck-up sidereelists trying to "debunk" him without engaging in his honest arguments at all.
As for sidereel "surely working," perhaps you should research the literature on the subject. Let me copy this from another commentor on this very same video.
"Consider the following:
If you apply a statistical analysis to which zodiacal system works best the results greater favor the Tropical system. I have posted these results (see below) several times on Quora.
Not once, has a Vedic astrologer stepped forward to provide a strong counter argument. Here it is again:
In the latest issue of the British Quarterly, Correlation (Vol. 31, 2) we find results of a research project conducted by Finnish Mathematician, Kyosti Tarvainen, PhD entitled: "Chart Rulers work in the Gauquelins’ Data".
Here are two direct quotes from his report:
“We can also compare the tropical and sidereal zodiacs. As in the case of houses, the smaller the p-values, the better the used zodiac seems to work.”
“The corresponding p-value for the tropical zodiac is 0.0005, and 0.2 for the sidereal zodiac. Hence, this is a strong indication in favour of the tropical zodiac.”
For those of you who are not familiar with statistics, in order to show that a factor might be relevant or statistically significant, you want a p-value of 0.05 or less. As a rule, a value of 0.01 (one chance in a hundred) or even lower is rather impressive.
Notice how LOW the p-value is for the Tropical zodiac as compared to the unimpressive 0.2 p-value for the sidereal. The results are very obvious.""
Vedic astrology is unfortunately taken less seriously by academics, while western is simply because their basic calculations are correct. Worst of all, almost no sidereelists I've genuinely looked to for answers to these questions can tackle these issues. Many just mumble out some generic, new-agey wishy-washy nonsense of everyone being right somehow, when the statistical results say otherwise. It's a sad reflection of the dark age of astrology that we're in.
Is he really that righteous? I take Vic to be a humble teacher.
@@Yehu12311 I don't doubt that tropical stands out in that sense :) There is a reason for that(if it does) and my claim was not around that topic.
And as for the research...nothing is said there on the other hand...no hypothesis, no paramters taken into account, just fancy words without the scientific context...
ahhh not this guy. please no more tropical stuffing in vedic astrology, it doesn't work and is getting old. get over it vic. give us something different.
Pat shut up. It does work. Get over it
@@anthonyb.7836 Even Ptolemy'S disciple got over the tropical zodiac. When will you wake up goofball!!!!
Thor Varuna goof ball? How old r u? 10? And so what about ptolemy, sidereal zodiac has been proven wrong & illogical a million times. Idk y ppl are getting butt hurt about it. Get over it
@@anthonyb.7836 I have challenged Vic a multitude of times on his faulty 'INTERPRETATION'. And finally we have given him a warning if he misrepresents anything ascertaining to indian history with a legal case. I will do the same with you. If you want a scholarly debate, we can have a skype session.
Thor Varuna really? get a life its not that serious