The Line Revenge Dramas Shouldn't Cross
Vložit
- čas přidán 23. 03. 2024
- Marry My Husband isn't really a revenge drama. Ji-won is trapped in a time slip and knows only one way to save herself - fate swapping. It's very convenient that her targets get progressively more evil and she can tell herself that it's fair punishment. This essay explores whether Ji-won and Ji-hyuk became the real villains of the story.
#marrymyhusband
► PODCAST 🤘
☆ Dramas Over Flowers:
open.spotify.com/show/5ifjyru...
► NEWSLETTER 👀
☆ A weekly one on drama theories that don't become videos:
paroma.substack.com/
► SOCIALS:
☆ Instagram: / thedramanotes
☆ Twitter: / thedramanotes - Zábava
One can't think of morality of revege in kdramas without the ultimate example: The Penthouse. It's fascinating that Su Ryeon's revenge takes place in three evolving stages (corresponding to each season): 1. make villains admit their wrong 2. put them in prison 3. go for blood. and it's only because people fail her that she is forced to evolve her approach, first the villains don't repent or face retrubution, in contrast they become more successful and kill more of her loved ones and then because the justice system let them out of prison. my point is throughout the revenge (also aided by handsome caring man), she never lost her morality and the only trigger she pulled was to save everyone. even so, she felt like her soul was darknened by her revenge, which brought us to that horrible finale. i consider her the perfect example of revenge heroine: intelligence, being 5 steps ahead, being tough but never cruel and having morals that protect the innocent people. she never crossed the line, and there's an argument to be made that maybe she should have, she would be justified
I love this. 🙌 Yes, Su Ryeon is one of the best heroes of this genre.
@@TheDramaNotes one of a kind. also, you've convinced me to watch Marry My Husband, I'm on ep 5 already! i thought i'd be more predictable and formulaic, but it's susprisingly fresh
The writing is really tight for most of the show. If you ever read the webtoon you can see where the screenwriters improved the story. I'm glad I didn't scare you away from the show! 😄
This a very important take that a lot of dramas are missing. However, one aspect to consider is that the main character knew what the "villains" were capable of. One of the comments under your video makes a good point about not forgetting the emotional abuse Su min inflicted on the main character. And she is also capable of physically harming the main character which was shown multiple times in the last few episodes. So, the choices the villains made time and time again were not out of not having any other options but rather out of very sinister intentions against the main character.
Hello! Okay this will be a bit of a read. 😄 I think the drama did a good job of laying out the villains' motives and moral compass. What they didn't dwell on was the morality of the heroes' actions. So in this video I focused on whether or not Jiwon and Jihyuk's actions made them heroes and not really on whether Sumin and Minhwan were villain enough. They were, you're right. But tracking JW and JH's actions you see them pushing Sumin and MH towards the worst choice. And if they seem like they're disengaging or not walking down that path, JWxJH force them down it using JH's considerable wealth and power. I loved the first 10ish episodes the best, where Jiwon mostly just stepped out of MH and Sumin's way and let them make the worst choice on their own. In later episodes, she actively intervenes to manipulate them into making the worst choices. I'm completely disregarding the truck of doom plot here because it's irrelevant. Jiwon didn't decide to ramp up Operation Kill Sumin in response to the truck, OKS was always the end game. And Jiwon chose to enforce it to save herself and Juran - which is a choice I can understand - but that does mean that she's not doing this "for revenge" she's just doing it cause it's the only way to save herself. So the final half renders all choices by Sumin and MH null. Even if they were sitting quietly in a room the entire time, Jiwon's actions wouldn't have changed. In my view, Jiwon's actions are defensible (survival) but not heroic, and she was definitely morally compromised by the end.
@@TheDramaNotes enjoyed reading your response! 😂
Your point definitely makes sense to me! The main characters definitely compromised their morality by the end.
Paroma, this is so artistic! 😍
The quality of your videos just gets better and better! And I love this perspective on Ji-won 👏🏼
Thank you 🥰🥰🥰 I hope I'll get faster with the editing cause this took too many all nighters. Too many. 😅
I don't usually watch revenge dramas, but I did this one mainly because I noticed that same actor was in the previous drama I had watched ("Mr. Queen")... I only started watching kdramas recently and picking a new show has been kind of random for me. I think a revenge drama is only fun if the audience sides with the revenge taker, regardless of the grey morality issue (the morality issue did come up for me a few times in this show too). I agree the writers should have cut down on the protagonists' "brute force" approaches (well put) and instead relied on the villains' actual tendencies. In the end, though, I didn't fault the main character in her actions nor saw her as villainness (though good acting helped with this a lot). They did include a few scenes of self-reflection, and while I initially thought Su-min seemingly didn't deserve the fate, the more of her backstory we found out, the more I think she was as bad as the villain husband. She systematically gaslit the protagonist to destroy her self-esteem over and over again, which is long-term emotional abuse. I also hated that gloating scene at the wedding but for another reason. Gloat AFTER once everything works out! I'm actually surprised I liked this drama as much as I did.
MMH was genuinely improved by the drama writers compared to the source material. They had thought of and addressed a lot of logical loopholes and at least hinted at moral complexity. I find Ji-won's characterization as a righteous avenger super enjoyable (personal revenge dramas are a huge fav with me) but completely bewildering since revenge was always secondary to saving herself in the second timeline. 😄 I do 100% agree that the gloating scene's biggest failing was counting her chickens too early. 🤣 Anywho this drama was a lot of fun to watch which is pretty much why I ended up making a second video on it. Thank you for watching this btw!
Edit: You're the only person I've come across who started this drama because of the male lead. 😄 Good for Na In-woo.
The weirdest case for me recently has been that of 'Revenge of Others'. I absolutely loved the drama till Episode 11, but the last episode just really disappointed me in multiple ways. Not only was there a rushed ending, the actual perpetrator who the FL was after throughout the series basically gets forgiven easily (using DID in a very non-realistic, excuse-like way - esp with how the FL helps him 'snap' out of his other personality with a few cliche lines?) And then, instead of him being put through a trial, the main antagonist accidentally gets killed/fatally wounded by the ML - and the ML just gets away with that?? I love me some awesome revenge dramas but these things definitely make you wonder where the line should be drawn. ^-^
Jeez. Yes. It bothers me that these dramas set up some really excellent and complex stories and then are unable to break out of the habit of giving us extremely cliched endings. Which tend not to be satisfying 9/10 times. 🙈
You're wrong about the ending in "My Name." Her partner/lover does try to convince her to go with him and start a new life together and give up her revenge plans, but she won't do it until she kills the man who killed her father. But in the end, she ends up getting her lover killed. It's very sad. If she'd been able to give up her obsession with revenge and choose to put her life first--and the life of the man she loved--imagine what a satisfying life she might have led. But in the end, she ends up alone.
In my opinion for every cases revenge could not change the system like in the glory the bullying can again make victims like main character
So I have a question what would you do if that was you in that situation. Sumin was always a terrible friend to her from the beginning, whereas min didn't show his bad side until after they were married. Also the bed where he said what he said was after sumin killed her husband and was on the run. Ji-yuk did what he did because he failed to protect her in their first life and knowing what he knew, about them at ji-woon funeral he didn't care. Also he thought he was still going to die, remember he never tried to switch his fate. I'll be honest if it was me I would do the same thing because they kept pursuing her. She tried to leave min, and she tried to stop being friends with sumin but they couldn't leave her alone especially sumin, she said she wanted to take everything from her since they were young just because her father loved her while sumin mom resented her after the affair.
Halo! In short, I would do exactly what Jiwon did. I would save myself and my friend in the only way the rules of time travel allows me. But I wouldn't call it revenge. Cause my survival is my motivator here. When we take revenge for something someone did, we automatically try to think of proportional justice. If someone slapped me in public one day, I wouldn't go and stab them in their sleep. I would plot a way to humiliate them in an equally harsh or slightly harsher way.
It's important to keep in mind that Jiwon's plot (imma gonna call it Operation Kill Sumin) wasn't hatched to punish Sumin. From episode 1 it was the only way to rescue herself from a really bad fate. Jiwon was saving herself and Sumin was happily available to use in her plan.
So being a self aware human, I wouldn't believe that I was bringing righteous justice to the shitty people in my life. I would think, hey, it's lucky that my one escape plan involves making my traitorous bestie miserable, and yes she'll probably die too, but I don't care cause I hate her.
I no longer have a moral high ground when I think like this.
I concede to your point about Jihyuk. I know he had good reason to bend his powers to help Jiwon, which is why I only complained about his dialogues in the video and not really his morality. It's Jiwon whose morality matters in this drama cause she's the protagonist driving the action.
First I just want to say I'm bad with expressing myself correctly in text so if my comment came off as mean or rude in any way I'm sorry because I didn't mean it that way. I get the point you were making better now with your comment, and I totally agree and get what you meant with the whole revenge part. I also enjoyed your episode and I honestly hope you can make it really big here. You are someone it seems who can actually look at both sides when someone has a different opinion and be respectful with your response unlike a lot of people on here. I wish the best, and thank you for the response.
I need to explain my points more clearly in these videos. 😅 I'm still learning how to arrange my arguments. Thank you for giving me an opportunity to explain myself better. Also, you weren't rude or mean at all. I enjoyed your points!
I disagree with your statement about does Sumin deserve that amount of punishment in 2013. Sumin since 14yr old has tortured Ji Won. Sumin devoted her entire life hurting Ji Won till the very ending her death . So Ji Won should only take revenge up to 2013 and still accept her death in 2023 NO lol
I humbly accept your disagreement. 🙌 But did I really argue that Jiwon should accept her own death in the video?
i was thinking the exact same thing, just in a less analysed way, great content, keep it up, want to watch more of such videos , gonna subscribe, btw are you indian, if yes then love from another indian sis
I AM an Indian. Hello hello! 😄 Thank you for subscribing!
you made me see this drama from a very different but justifiable perspective...
Really glad I could do that! 😊
Wonderful analysis 🎉🎉
Thank you so much for watching! ☺️
I didn't feel bad for sumin or the husband because of the way they treated ji won neither one tried to change and take accountability
Question what are your thoughts on the show remarriage and desires it's a revenge show
I haven't watched it yet! It's high on my list though along with World of the Married.
Perfect ending line! 👏👏👏
Thank you thank you. *bows dramatically*
it ISSSS what a perfect burn!
Sorry for my long comment haha and i forget to add: i love when the revenge is until the end, i can understand a little bit dilemma with romance, to be happy but if it's not a romance drama but revenge drama i want revenge until the end, in My name, yes i enjoy the romance too and i would prefer he didn't die but the revenge action in the end was so satisfying to watch, it would be frustrated if she stops.
But i don't like revenge for ego not justice for example: Itaewon Class, the hero attacks the evil father's business not for justice but for ego, he was so naive dreamer idealist not realist person specially in business and life and i hate it specially in business, he made people with realist vision bad people, he wasn't likeable for me and it wasn't for justice revenge because he attacks the evil father and not the son the one who killed his dad!
He forget the son and attack the evil dad's business lol.
In this drama i love just the 1rst love character, love the scene when she said can't you stop and just be happy, in this drama i would prefer he chases success with his restaurant and collect evidence to put the son in jail and the evil dad to kneel down would be good too but not like this drama did.
The evil dad is a good realist business, if he did business with really bad method i would understand it and the hero will do with other method but the hero in Itaewon class choose evil bad method to attack the evil dad's business and he did it to win for his ego, the hero is villain, child villain to just want to win for his ego like the villain dad and i hate it and i gave up the drama because of the hero, not the villain.
In Iris, it was also frustrated, i hate the moment when the hero did nothing, is looking for peace or nothing when he's alone with the other girl, there is no romance between them, he still love his lover but did nothing at certain point to have his lover again or for revenge, the hero was so frustrated, do something!!!
Thank you for the long comment. 😄 I agree that the revenge in Itaewon Class wasn't satisfying because of the unsound motives. I remember it for the fun characters now, not so much for the plot, which was quite messy.
@@TheDramaNotes yes i agree
The scene that bothered me the most from the morality perspective was Jiwon & Jihyuk showing up at Minhwan's funeral. Completely unnecessary and gratuitously cruel to his mother (no matter how bad her behavior, she lost her son). It made me actively dislike them after I'd been wholeheartedly rooting for them in the early episodes
It's like once they established Ji-won and Ji-hyuk as the good guys, nothing they did could be wrong any more. 🙈 Very frustrating especially cause they were so likeable before.
Hum i don't agree, what jiwon said to minhwan in her head at his funeral was necessary, she has remorse, she didn't want him to die, she loved him once and she wasn't just here to enjoy like villain
@@newjeansfan238 Thank you.
Minhwan was literally an abusive man that would not let her leave. I have zero remorse for that man. His mother was equally cruel to her on her death bed in the previous life. The fact she did not throw a party, throw things at his photo, or laugh in his mother’s face at the funeral is honestly much nicer than he deserved. Any morality that extends grace to that behavior, especially for someone that wasn’t even trying to be redeemed, is… 😕
I love Marry my husband, jiwon has little remorse but yes because sumin et minhwan didn't change she has less remorse but i love it, i like revenge and play god doesn't bother me because it's changing fate and they are evil, didn't change and Jiwon didn't really murder sumin or minhwan, if she did that, she will be evil like Vincenzo but i like good protagonist or protagonist like Vincenzo.
In others kdramas, there are character who kill people to play god but they are villain, or are villain even if they don't think that, i have an example: in Sketch, the girl protagonist can see the future by drawing it, there is an antagonist who has same power but kill people, in Marry my husband the future is known and can't change, in Sketch, the future can be changed.
If you didn't see Sketch, i recommend it to you, it can be a good essay, i remember one character who his wife was killed kill the wife of the protagonist because the antogonist manipulate him etc, Bi Rain plays the protagonist.
Could you do an essay to how to write a good villain?
For me, a satisfying good villain is one who can't change like Sumin, Yeojin, Cheon seojin, joo dan tae etc not like in Mouse, it was frustrated for me, you have remorse in it from the villain/good guy but i don't like it, not good villain.
And i love revenge until the end, i can understand a little bit dilemma with romance, to be happy but if it's not a romance drama but revenge drama i want revenge until the end, in My name, yes i enjoy the romance too and i would prefer he didn't die but the revenge action in the end was so satisfying to watch, it would be frustrated if she stops.
But i don't like revenge for ego not justice for example: Itaewon Class, the hero attacks the evil father's business not for justice but for ego, he was so naive dreamer idealist not realist person specially in business and life and i hate it specially in business, he made people with realist vision bad people, he wasn't likeable for me and it wasn't for justice revenge because he attacks the evil father and not the son the one who killed his dad!
He forget the son and attack the evil dad's business lol.
In this drama i love just the 1rst love character, love the scene when she said can't you stop and just be happy, in this drama i would prefer he chases success with his restaurant and collect evidence to put the son in jail and the evil dad to kneel down would be good too but not like this drama did.
The evil dad is a good realist business, if he did business with really bad method i would understand it and the hero will do with other method but the hero in Itaewon class choose evil bad method to attack the evil dad's business and he did it to win for his ego, the hero is villain, child villain to just want to win for his ego like the villain dad and i hate it and i gave up the drama because of the hero, not the villain.
In Iris, it was also frustrated, i hate the moment when the hero did nothing, is looking for peace or nothing when he's alone with the other girl, there is no romance between them, he still love his lover but did nothing at certain point to have his lover again or for revenge, the hero was so frustrated, do something!!!
Thank you for recommending Sketch! I've been thinking of watching it.
BtW, you are very much like Ambika Mod.
I had to look her up and she seems very cool. 😄
Yep
That's why I absolutely hate Korean revenge dramas. Because it is not a hero against a villain. It is like a villain against a villain. They all think that they are Robbin Hood.
It works in some dramas, I think, where the characters are morally complex and willing to examine their own motives, but it does seem like dramaland has a dearth of sincere goodness in heroes now. 😪
Hi ❤
Hi 👋☺️