I'm Concerned about One Card Combos
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- čas přidán 19. 06. 2024
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0:00 Analyzing French Nationals Finals
9:04 Discussion - Hry
There are quite a few SE players at my locals and it's crazy how often you see someone get handtrapped 3 or 4 times and then scoop after they see the normal SE Ash. Had a guy the other day stare at his opponent like how Jesse Kotton stares at his opponents after getting shiftered. It's one thing for a 1 card combo to generate a lot of advantage, but it's another thing for that same combo to generate that advantage AND give tons of followup. It's just silly and it looks like we're gonna be in a similar situation with the fiendsmith stuff once INFO comes out.
Reality Check , is Snake-Eyes Ash and the board it generates all that powerful ? All the Snake-Eyes have literally zero protection and so the noobs run a zillion hand traps to protect them so the other noobs can't play around it. I laugh with all that. I'd rather be afraid of Majespecters. They all can't be targeted or destroyed... Oh and they easily beat Snake-Eyes unless Snake-Eyes get too lucky. But of course noobs can't think outside of the box they just copy whatever deck list won some major tournament and play with that Hahahahaha you disgust me all of you noobs.
noo the funny comment got deleted i wanted to screenshot it
@@Oloistogamersloungeeistepisogl so true, everyone playing a million hand traps is a scrub noob, including the ycs winners. If only they had a winner gigachad like you taking majespecters to a top 8 finish in your 7 persons local to show them how it's done.
@@Oloistogamersloungeeistepisoglwho tf? Bro istg your shit, like I already know you are if you actually talking about majespecters. Just be quiet g Mai.
@@Oloistogamersloungeeistepisogl That is the dumbest shit I’ve ever read in my life.
I like a lot of 1 card combo decks, small engines are fun.
But the problem is that these 1 card combo decks are not ending on a Drident or Widow Anchor and then the rest of their hand has to carry them.
Snake-Eyes does absolutely everything, 1 card starter, nearly every starter is also an extender, tons of follow-up, no 1 card board breaker can put enough of a dent into their end board, nearly impossible to OTK and Ash alone is a full OTK on any other deck.
The power gained for the commitment is so disproportionate that any 2 card combo deck like Dino, Swordsoul or even Unchained look silly by comparison.
As a Dino player I felt this in my soul. Every time I begin to draw 5, it comes with the caveat that every card in my deck is not a streamlined, minmaxxed, and in-archetype package. It's just a good pile of synergistic 1.5/2 card themed combos that require alot of deck space and resource management and at times a lack of follow-up.
@@UncleJrueForTue When Ash doesn’t kill Snake-Eye Ash fully.
But an Ash kills your Misc summon or Animadorned eff and hence making any baby in hand and useless, it feels real bad knowing that SE is more rewarded anyways even if both of you pop off :p
@@kroffen7 So real
Another problem I have with SE is how stupidly pushed their effects are: Why does oak add/ss back from banishment? No other SE cards works with the banishment zone. Why does flamberge triggers if sent from hand? No SE card works by discarding cards. Why does wanted returns from banishment? It totally nullifies what should've been the drawback of using original's GY effect. And what more can be said about poplar at this point...
It feels like all those effects were deliberately added to the cards to reduce drastically the amount of counterplay possible. Which is baffling when so many other cards have strict but understandable restriction on them.
They are def pushed but flamberge triggers from hand due to diabellestar who was made to work with them.
Konami: We have to keep some of these cards banned like Pot of Greed because they are way too overpowered. No Mystic Mine either, we need it fair an balanced.
Also Konami: haaaaaa Snake Eye goes brrrrrrrrrrr
@@milehighgambler to be fair pot of greed is a really bad example to push your point here; pot of greed being legal only means every deck plays pot of greed + whatever they were already playing, meaning snake eyes is still the best deck
@@lemlem35 if you play snake eyes just say that bro
@@milehighgamblerexcept, he makes a valid point
Master Duel June Banlist:
Banned
-None
Limited
-Oak
-Temple
Semi
-Flamberge
You forgot limit Subversion and Kurikara
No gonna lie the oak hit seems real
After some people play 2 in the ranked
@@chicabubr7094and they are getting fire king lol
If they generous they'll also semi the poplar 😂, like not a lot of people play 2 anyway.
Semi Flamberge he says when everyone plays 1 or 2 anyways Hahahahaha and limited Oak that everyone plays 1 Hahahahaha and the way you wrote this I can assume you are not trolling. Yet you are getting so many likes by saying the weaker cards of the archtype should get limited... I guess proves what kind of noobs I am dealing here with.
I'm so glad you mentioned Limit One. I enjoyed that festival last year, and now it's just spoiled because of the one card combos in SE. What made it fun last time was that you didn't know what kind of combo you can pull off, but SE just kills that theme.
I agree last year, like 30 decks where playable, I played Orcust personally
Can't wait for 0 card combos where it just has to be in your deck to use.
“If you control no cards, you can special summon this from your deck.
@callmeosho7792 ain't gonna lie, people complained about kashtira format last year but it was the best yugioh had been since before TOSS format with the most diversity. For once it felt like an interactive game where decks could really shine and play in unique ways. Shame Konami killed that in under a year.
yacine656 did it 😂
Charmers has that but no one uses them.
@@jeanpitre5789 Kash format was still bad because Ariseheart just like Colossus was gatekeeeping every rogue deck. The best format recently (to me a modern TOSS) has been AgOv format, while PoTe (and to a lesser extend DaBL) was very interesting before Ishizu shufflers/millers ruined everything.
The final is a good example of why 15+ handtraps are too much
This argument never made any sense. In a non one-card-starter deck, what would those handtraps be? Extenders that if drawn alone also do nothing, and don't provide the defense that HT's at least do? Only difference is aesthetically you bricked on useless archetype cards rather non-engine
@@ak47dragunov In a Deck with Multiple 2 Card Combos it would mean you draw the second one of your 2 card combo way more often. Raidraptor for example comboes with basically any 2 birds, so every bird is starter/extender.
Your argument only works if Extenders do not provide any value if not drawn with the right starter card. But thats not how extenders work, so your argument is nonsense
@@heinzpeterson In Snake Eye almost all of the starters also function as extenders, and you have a plethora of them, so no, your counter doesn't make any sense. Again, the parallel scenario to what happened in the video to a non 1-card deck would be just swap one of the HTs for an archetypal extender that does nothing on its own.
9-12 I’ve tested is the correct ratio
@@ak47dragunovit can be alternative starters, ngl pulling a hand full of hand traps imo isn’t interesting, I never go above like 8-11
The issue with hyper consistent one card combos is that it homogenizes the game. The line you'll end up seeing will be broadly the same each time its executed, and its not satisfying to play out because it becomes "did they resolve it?" If so you lose, if not you win.
See that's what game designers have to actively fight against meta/comp players want flow chart games
@@michaelkeha No one wants flow chart game, even " meta player ". It's just that it's the unfortunate best way to win a game.
There will always be a meta, the job of the game designers is to make it fun.
@@zeneck7387 Bullshit on even meta players a bunch of strung out pill bunnies and zombies need flow charts to function they lack the lateral thinking skills to play any other way and game designers job is to actively break metas preferably often enough that people finally learn the secret of all the best of the best in every game and every sport that playing the meta only leaves you painfully average the best break it they are always ahead of it and their legacy defines what the cult of mediocrity slavishly follows
The meta for yugioh has not changed much since 5ds era
Very much the same sorta combo deck strats just faster and faster
@@zeneck7387 No the job of the designs is to break metas often and hard enough that hopefully the lesson will finally get into the heads of the pill bunnies and grind zombies that make up the meta player base which is playing the meta in any card game or any sport is not how you become the best it's not even how you become good it's how you shackle yourself to the cult of mediocrity and fight over the scraps
Also yes meta players want flow chart gameplay it's the only thing most of them can comprehend
I think one card combos should be in decks that require a lot of engine to work. Like Earth Machine. You basically sacrifice versatility in answers for consistency. The problem is a lot of one card combos just don't require much space to work
the thing is that earth machine ends on nothing, and these 1 card combos ends on everything
I used to play earth machine, and then one day some sided system down against me 😅
These days they can end on like, one thing, but yeah, the other engines do way more with fewer cards as well@@SkyllerSY
@@O6i System down? Locals I suppose? Cause the hate is real...
My grain of salt here are Pend decks, at least those who play like actual Pendulums (Just ignore the Wakaushi incident...)
Cards need to also stop having graveyard effects or “when removed from the field” effects because that’s just more combo that, in some cases, is exactly what the deck wants.
When I don't play 12+ handtraps, I feel like I am waiting to be victimised going 2nd because the 1-card combo decks are so strong and they can be backed up by 2, 3 or 4 handtraps most times they go first. The current meta forces players to build their decks in this manner if they want to have even a half chance when they lose the die roll.
Yeah there’s no east answer here. Either I run my deck so that I don’t brick all the time and get FTK every other game, or I load up on hand traps and draw enough to stop them but then me and my opponent play uno for 2 turns until I either draw enough of my engine or they draw their 1 card starter.
Ive been having no problem going for no handtraps and use power spells instead. Its all about knowing how to Break boards
@@cheryltunt6934or play a different format, dont give into they ignorant spam
Something I have been saying since the beginning, ban Original Sinful Spoils. Disconnecting Snake-Eyes from the Diabellestar engine significantly hits their starter consistency, while also reducing their ceiling as you eliminate the synchro line. Snake-Eye Ash becomes the only 1 card starter, and the deck has to rely 2 card starters, reducing the amount of non-engine it can play as it needs to play more searchers like Where Arf Thou? to get to their 2 card combo. It would make the deck much more reasonable to deal with.
And also ass which I don’t think they want. Not defending it, I don’t like the deck, but they’re probably not gonna do that
But…my T.G.s 🥲
I feel like its less "one card combos are too strong" and more "a single cards doing too much on its own are too strong".
I do not mind strong combo endboards when my opponent actually had to commit his entire hand to their strong combo.
I do mind strong combo endboards when its a single card creating the entire setup.
I do not mind my opponent using 3 backrow cards like karma canon or Ice dragons prison to stop my turn.
I do mind if my opponent stops my entire turn with just a single Dimensional barrier.
I do not mind my opponent using their hand to break my field and set up their own.
I do mind my opponent clearing my entire field with just a single evenly matched.
I do not mind my opponent stopping most of my turn with 3 handtraps.
I do mind my opponent straight up turnskipping me with a shifter.
This is not to say that i dont want good cards to exist. I just descibed 4 scenarios that are very bad for me, but i dont see as problematic.
I think that i disagree
I don't think that end boards being made by a single card is a problem
For example I don't think circular was a problem when the deck made a heatsoul and a trishula as a end board with follow
But with the firewall suport made it a heatsoul, a spell negate,a effect veiler, trishula
@@chicabubr7094 circular was a problem at every scenary, a FAIR one card combo to this day would probably be Invoked with normal summon aliester and that was strong for a good chunk of time and only asked to be banned not because it was broken but to actually no be a good option every meta 3 years ago, speedroid terrortop was also fine even tho it rotted on banlist for a long time
@@danielhertz1984 that's not being fair. It's just being far to weak or are you gonna say that invoked is a good deck post-POTE
Are those not essentially the same or am I missing something? The one card combos don’t use your entire hand, you generate a ton of advantage off the single card. So one card combos being too strong is the same as one card doing too much on its own, no?
@@Gestalt81 not necessarily
A single card doing to much apply to a one card combo but not necessarily
Let use the opposite of a combo card in the example "super poly"
It's a card that make a body that draw a card while dealing with two cards for the opponent while also being impossible to respond
One card combos should not be the ENTIRE board, but still enough that if you're forced to end on one you won't lose on the spot. That's incredibly difficult in a game with so many blowout cards and two-sided floodgates that can be abused to be one way or only active during the opponent's turn.
The main reason people play THIS many hand traps(to the point of literally BRICKING on them), is to avoid losing instantly to those annoying one card end boards to begin with. So either an opponent counters your hand traps and sets up a board anyway(defeating the purpose), or both sides keep ending their turn because they only drew ONE one card starter and it gets stuffed, leaving them passing multiple turns in a row because neither side can play anything because they don't get to set up. But as long as generic hand traps do enough that it's worth the risk of bricking on them, people are going to persist in running them.
And it's not like you can't direct your hand trap lineup to support your deck either, there are instances where you can turn a level 1 hand trap into a Link-1 in order to facilitate certain plays, or use a tuner hand trap to just Synchro into something that extends your hand in different directions. If anything that's part of the problem, since Board Breakers are more efficient at dealing with established boards than hand traps are with disrupting them in progress, but people are so terrified of letting a board get established they'd rather run more hand traps that synergize less with their deck, even if it means bricking more often than running a smaller board breaker package they actually NEED to be consistent with their higher investment play lines. Even decks that come with their OWN hand traps would still rather use the generic ones at higher counter(which is necessary when they can't be easily searched), which makes games play out as a sackfest of sorts.
Rather than explore the kind of utility synergistic and even ARCHETYPAL hand traps provide, instead the FEAR of one card combos just stifles peoples' willingness to express their skill in favor of running as many "safe" disruptions as possible with as compact an engine as possible to get to the kind of consistency running that many potential bricks requires. While this is even more apparent in formats that make use of Maxx "C", that's just a symptom of the ACTUAL problem that every top deck is getting closer and closer to being a micro engine paired off with as many generic disruptions as possible to ward off other micro engines.
I don’t think this type of gameplay is necessarily the result of 1 card combos. While 1 card combos are probably too strong, I don’t think it causes the 15+ handtrap meta. Rather, the problem is how small engines are getting. If your deck is optimally played with a 20 card engine, even if it doesn’t have strong 1 card combos, you’ll still end up playing 15+ handtraps because you have the space and there’s very few better things to be playing.
You know, i was hoping with smth like White Woods we were moving away from 1 card combos that do everything you could ever want, but then i remember Fiendsmith is also in INFO
For what looks to be an archetype that will have a major impact(getting early branded vibes). I sure hope so.
White woods is very well designed though. It’s splashable but gets bonuses if you’re sending its own archetypal s/t’s to grave. Few 1 card combos, the endboards aren’t insane, and the deck has redundancies built in. Excited to see what it does.
@@Exisist5151 And that is only right out of the gate. I can only imagine, what support will look like and how it will integrate with others from the Lore.
@@Exisist5151that's exactly what my comment implied tho
I LIKE white woods
I dont like Fiendsmith
@@MiyaoMeow588 I wasn’t disagreeing, I was saying it as a modifier. Fiendsmith is poorly designed but White woods is extremely well designed. So I think the net trend is in the right direction?
Man I love when decks have 14 copies of their 1 card combo.
In the rogue decks the freedom to search your ‘correct’ interactions and not the obvious only choice is a freedom that comes at the cost of the deck just not being able to put up either the resistance or the force that’s necessary to defeat the bigger meta contenders.
Sid Meier once said that a game is a series of interesting choices. By that measure, modern yugioh might as well not be a game at all because you have 1 singular choice and 1 choice only,
EVERY
SINGLE
TIME!
I miss when the normal summon was super important, and once you committed that you were vulnerable to interaction hitting a chokepoint. Back when "one card starter" meant a single high impact normal summon and not "you can open with five of these and just play through everything".
Player 1: Normal Summon starter
Player 2: Hand Trap
Player 2: OTK opponent
The normal summon resource dont matter when most decks can operate without even normal summoning
Special summon decks can do 20 summons each turn.
They will not outright ban Snake-eyes since they are like Branded, the main multi set archetype that has a set that either introduces a new archetype from their story or supports older released archetypes.
The last banlist only pushed out all the Synchro decks like Mannadium or Superheavy Samurai out of the meta, as they lost their key cards of Baronne and Savage, with now only Tenpai left as one of the other options against Diabelstarr engine decks.
Best you can hope for in the next banlist is limit Wanted, Diabellstar and Ash to 1 since they are the main contributers to the Fire format.
bro mannadium and superheavy samurai meta?
There's no reason to touch Diabellstar at all. Ban Original Sinful Spoils and either limit or semi-limit SE Ash so that you actually have to tech in more cards to kickstart their engine.
Found the master duel player lol. TCG actually bans cards, so its a very real possibility that snake eyes recieves a noticiable ban at some point
@@saniblues-5013 True, but hitting Diabellstar and SE ASH to 1 is much more in line on OCG philosophy of going after consistency cards. Banning OSS just kills off the Diabellstar package on Fire decks, which is already in decline thanks to the introduction of Fiendsmith. Also, there will be more Diabellstar support and it may still revolve around Snake Eyes, soo I would not count on OSS being banned just yet.
@@indescrepit9973
No it doesn't.
And when they do they ban things that fuck over people who DON'T play the meta stuff.
You may have missed that not only do one card combos force you to play a bunch of hand traps, they also LET you play a bunch of hand traps because of your own combo’s consistency.
That's why the best counter to snake-eyes is snake-eyes
1 card combos are the reasons why handtraps run rampant and why you’re forced to run a million of them. It’s depressing.
wrong, even decks that don't have 1 card combos run handtraps it just makes it easier, just look at drytron they still run 12+ handtraps yet doesn't have a single 1 card combo
And because of handtraps they started to made one card combos who end up in 3 boss monsters instead of just a Dante or singular shadoll fusion.
@@justawarlord 🧢 drytron has like 6 nonengine space max
The only reason decks can still have any bit of consistency while playing so many hand traps is one card combos. I've been saying for years that one card combos are a problem but everyone called me a yugiboomer. I love that all my "terrible" takes from the past several years have only proven to be correct as time goes on.
The problem is how good the one card combos are. Imo it's good that you can always do something with only 1 card, but you shouldn't be able to do stuff like summon Red Supernova Dragon + set Red Zone with 1 card.
The difference between something like Aleister one card combos and snake eye is night and day though.
@@dudono1744 talking about how good 1 card combos are, uses the worst, least competitive example ever, that also isn't good.
Amazing.
@@dudono1744 Supernova + Red Zone is a mega mid board. RDA is a good example of one card combos done right.
skill issue yugiboomer
IMO one-cards are fine as long as they aren’t also extenders that essentially blank a handtrap.
Something like TOSS format Orcust, where you had one-cards like Arma Knight / Mathmetician / Recycler, and still ended on a very strong board for the time, still didn’t feel oppressive. As the opponent, depending on your hand, you could try and stop the one-card and hope for the best, or try and hit a lower-impact but harder-to-play-through chokepoint further down the line. There was skill in anticipating how the gamestate would change depending on where you interacted. With Snake Eye, it’s often just a question of whether you have more engine than the opponent has handtraps - it’s rare that you have to adjust to interactions in unique ways, as you usually either have a way to push to something resembling full combo or end up passing on very little with a bunch of handtraps of your own.
I wouldnt mind 1 card combos that much, if you actually had to play a ton of engine for those combos to work. Having space for 20 non engine while also having 1 card combos that end on everything is just super toxic
not only the onecard combos are the problem, links are also part of the problem, you can take 2 negated bodies, link and keep playing
As opposed to immediately forfeiting because you *WILL* die otherwise?
This is perhaps one of the biggest reasons why I'm such a fan of Vaalmonica because while they aren't in the top tiers they are at least rogue relying on just two card combos but are relative to each other so you can branch into your standard plays. White Woods to is quite similar in regards to having a bunch of two card combos that kind of bridge into each other. Not to mention these decks by nature want to run less non-engine to ensure that they consistently go to their gameplan which is another design benefit.
Imagine a meta where every deck is at most only running 7-10 handtraps, I would like that.
Too bad White Woods shuts off all use of Pendulum Scales with a walking floodgate and Calamity Locks with Centur-Ion cards, meaning run 20 hand traps or White Woods will kill you on sight.
I play the diabellstar version of the deck because I thought you play her and sling her spell and traps towards the enemy and control the game. Snake eyes only for paying her cost to stay on field. It is super fun (no bonfire , no snake eye but with 3 poplar). It is one of the most engaging and fun decks I have played. But without the snake eye, the deck is mid at best. Because she is the only piece that is present at the board, you rarely can go into extra deck or do crazy combos, which is fine, but we need better spells for her. Unfortunately I see wanted/original being limited/banned and this without any support is pretty much the death of my spellcaster commander vibe deck. Very fun. I lose more than I win but man absolute worth it. Buz yes I do agree, the cards without snake eyes are fair. I splashed 1x oak, 1x ash and 1x flamberge just to have access to my extra deck.
I ultimately need to go to a locals and spend some time around yugioh in person to make the ultimate decision if I’d like to return to this TCG or if I’d like to pickup MTG.
I was last playing about a decade ago and I was running all different frog decks. Usually Frog Monarch or Lancer. I loved summoning Obelisk. Favorite thing to do.
But now that I want to return and I watch gameplay I feel overwhelmed with how much the game is about not letting your opponent play. I don’t feel like duel master is allowing me to learn the game.
My heart still loves the content and I’ve enjoyed your perspective and videos as I chew on what do. I look forward to attending a locals in the near future.
Well, I hope you don't make the mistake most people starting MTG make(I was one of them): Do not pick up standard! Huge waste of money as Commander, Modern, and Pioneer(in that order) are by far the most played and best use of your money formats.
@@UncleJrueForTue MTG Sucks to begin with. Start with that. And nothing else to say. If people keep making broken decks that end the game in turn 4 or 5 and CAN'T be countered then the whole game sucks. Idc if there are many formats I should be able to counter EVERY deck in EVERY format like I can do in Yu-Gi-Oh! but in MTG I can't. In Yu-Gi-Oh! I can counter everything. Noobs who think they can beat me cause they play Snake-Eyes are a joke. But in MTG either I play meta or I lose. Then the game is not worth playing. Needless to say also the cards are A LOT more expensive than the cards in Yu-Gi-Oh! and fucking Wizards is even worse than Komaney so yea no worth. Also they don't have an online platform to play MTG online. MTG Arena costs a lot of money I heard. How hard is it to make a program that you can play MTG online for free duh.
We need more decks that have completely different combo lines and end board depending on your starting hand. I play the new Shining Sarc deck, and it's fun that you can either do a big Gandora play if you open it + Ebony DM with Shining Sarc (to end on a fusion + spell negate), or do a simple Ties play (to end on a spell, monster, and targeting negate).
There's a fair number of decks like that, but they go completely under the radar because they aren't competitive. It's practically impossible to design a competitive yugioh archetype that doesn't have powerful one card combos and doesn't go through linear combos now. Decks are just so crazy efficient and streamlined, that there's no other way for them to be competitive. Yugioh archetypes have hit critical mass on powercreep. Barring the insane stuff like Ishizu-Tearlaments.
A lot of decks are like that actually, they just get brushed off as bad. It's in my opinion the correct direction for modernized plays but they never get a chance to shine
@@spyro2002glad someone gets it
So more kashtira lol. If I draw Kash tear or the normal spell opening I'm dropping a second ira plus using a level 7 Kaiju to go into either a level 10 synchro, or 7xyz depending on what I mill
@@quint2568 I don't mean like that, where you end on slightly different or better boards. I'm talking about decks where most or all of your combo _and_ end board are different.
A lot of players in LATAM have stopped taking part in Ygo tournaments, and have moved into other games (Digimon, PTCG, OPTCG). I guess this is just a sympthom caused by something that began when the got the January '24 banlist.
As someone who quit YGO and went to OPTCG (and am extremely glad I did that) I can tell you that it's probably not a simple banlist reaction, but a general dissatisfaction with YGO and what it has become: Diceroll roulette -> 1 card combo + handtrap roulette -> repeat and even if you win said roulettes you won nothing in terms of prizing.
Am not from LATAM though so can only speak for myself and my friends, none of us are probably ever going back to YGO.
@@Lessonius I'm from there though (There's even a YCS on my country in 4 months), and I'm sure is a symptom of a lot of stuff: Decks costing more than the minimum monthly wage, one card combos, handtrap go-fish minigame and in general just poor gameplay experience. Unlike in USA or Canada we just can't really afford to sunk any more cost on a card game.
N12015 is right, in my case i left the game before that banlist, since Tear format i've seen locals die and prices get high, i know high prices are nothing strange to YGO but what happens is that no one will pay more than the minimum wage just to MAYBE play, you can just move on to another TCG and know for sure you can get your money's worth and more important you can PLAY. On the other hand, tournament prices rarely pay off, if ever so... why even bother? MTG locals do this thing where they give you store credit if you do well, maybe that could be a solution to get more people back into playing BUT that doesn't fix the gameplay itself and at the end of the day that's why i left but that's just a matter of preference on my part. MTG lets me play "Dinomorphia" for less money, no floodgates and without risking someone raging at me because of my deck choice. I like to believe that YGO can be "fixed" if Konami puts alternate formats on the spotligh and develops them but idk
@@isaiahaldhafera9752 If I had to guess is because rogue gets overly punished by handtrap spam. It was only expensive to play meta, but you could play suboptimal, but now the gap is just too large due to all the disruption going around so you don't get to play period. And btw, I was talking about minimum wage in my country who is around 600 USD (double the average), still less than a Snake-eye set and kinda like a Tear set.
The game has always been in a not fun place. First it was biggest beater, then it went into weaker effect monsters, then it went into more combo, then it became more efficient combo, then hand traps, then one-card combos. The game being stuffed with feel bad cards like Dark Hole and Harpie’s Feather duster, Confiscate, Delinquent Duo, Change of Heart, etcetera to break hard established boards was also bad with bans being more of a reaction than anything. It’s just the way the game.
It's funny how people complain about Lab when it doesn't let them play but no one talks about one card combo decks and how can they use +15 hand traps. People only likes the game when their one card combo works and summons 3 negates + handtraps + 4 cards in hand + summon even more in opponents turn. Konami needs to diverse the game a little bit more.
Exactly!
And lab isn't even that good. A hand trap can easily screw them over and if you run backrow removal like you should anyways it's even less of a problem. I'll admit it is bull to go against if they run dimension since you auto lose if you play an archetype that relies on fusions, synchros, or xyz mainly to get their lines.
I like the taste of the glue with sparkles.
When might be the first Link 0 coming? Or a Starter that just materializes out of the deck?
Phantom of Yubel, Vicious Astroloud, Ritual Beast Ulti-Nochiudrago
As long as you don't commit to normal summon, things like Unexpected Dai (Loci / White Duston for Fiendsmith) or Origin works like it
Close example would be the lvl 5 charmer companions, mainly "Awakening of the possessed: Nefarious Archfiend" for Selene shenanigans (But you need to commit first, I know)
A one card combo I can think of that is fair is cyberdark horizon. It can start up your entire process fir cyberdark end dragon which is a disgustingly powerful card, but its not an instant win. You still need a good hand to pull it off and it takes over half your avaliable monsters to summon. If it gets outed then you cant just bring it back with one card (monster reborn aside ofc) and it has big weaknesses to handle. Theres a combo with a buster blader card that stops your opponent from accessing the extra deck but that is incredibly hard to do and *will* always take 2 turns minimum unless your opponent mills it from your deck to be equipped. Cyberdark has no fancy costless omni-negates and while powerful, the boss monsters are stoppable.
Hey Joshua, how do you feel about players just not going for game. For example, I could have an empty board or one face up defense monster that is beatable with no effect and the opponent could have game with the monsters they have on the field when comparing the total damage they can cause to my life points. Instead of going into battle phase and ending the game, it feels like so many players are either bming or just not aware that they don't need to try to do a 10 card combo of removing and special summoning and syncho, xyz, link summoning, all these extra steps just to end the game. I find it pretty annoying for the most part, but how do you feel about it and why do you think players do that?
skill issues
This happens very often in MD. People over extend for absolutely no reason, and in a few cases I have been able to punish them by using Nibiru, if they had just attacked they would have won. Literal skill issue. Is understandable if they want to have a negate to avoid losing to something like a bystial on the battle phase, but it happens even when you are at zero cards, also it happens most often with Kashtira, a deck famous for not having negates.
The problem is not one card combo, many deck has one card combo. Synchron is one card combo who ends on negates endboard.
The problem exist when that one card combo also doubles as extender.
Did you see that Snake Eye vs 4 handtraps video? It really shows how broken SE is when every card can be a starter and extender.
Also Synchron needs a lot of specific cards in deck. Which can be bricks, but also limit space for non-engine, so you can't play 20 handtraps.
Synchron has a few powerful one-card combos, but is still fair since there's a noticable trade-off
personally i dont feel relief when i dont see original into ash because in my experience it's usually been into hydrant which i know isnt as powerful, but if they got that far and i didnt interrupt it's already too late let's be honest
im going to face the same board but backed by backrow
A deck of several small engine systems and 15+ hand traps is not healthy.(like snake eye,you can add Fire King, kashtira,which are not independent from the main Snake Eye engine because they can facilitate your combo and resist hand traps). Those decks with big engines will be hard to survive in future because you have to take many trash in your deck and you can only take less hand traps,such as Branded,all of trash cards you put in your deck is just to find Branded Fusion 😂
13:17 yes, and it was rescue ace hydrant that they summoned instead which might be even worse to play against. I also want original sinful spoils - snake eye to get banned as I think that would be more fun than limiting/banning all the snake eye cards. Also probably takes away the need to limit Wanted which hurts new potential Diabellstar archtypes like White Woods. Limit 1 festival just felt like a complete solitaire fest as all the hand traps and board breakers were also limited.
i really wish they never printed the snake eye stuff (or at least remove poplar/princess/flameberge etc. diabbelstar should've been fire king support !)
One deck i like playing wirh is using original sinful spoils to summon rhe lvl 1 fire Evolzar and ending on ultimate conductor tyrano, the rank 6 Evo with the Hot red dragon negate, and possibly a lagia or dolka.
One-card combos have been a thing for many decks, but snake-eyes (and mathmech) have many one-card combos that still lead to the full exact same combo even if one or several of the other one-card combos get stopped.
This is literally becoming solitaire
Yugioh should strive to become balatro instead
My favourite kind of solitaire is when 2 players stop each other early in the game and neither get to fully play. Well known solitaire experience
The 3 states of Yugioh: solitaire, 52 card pickup(pile decks), or waiting to UNO out.
Its currently go fish
People have been saying this for like 10 years lmao
Good tutorials. Keep going with these videos
Love your discussion, BUT we have to first look at "Why" from Konami perspective!! We have plenty of FAIR non-1CardCombo archetypes but nobody cares because to our surprise...... it's WEAK and we dont appreciate fair card design, we cant lower Power Level anyway. If we want non-negation board and still being "Meta" we have to deal with +8 cards resource. The latest card design aims at shifting a bit away from Ash, Imperm perspective is our latest Tenpai with unaffected field => so as we play more Ghost Ogre (And we still hate it because of its non-interaction...) . There's no actual perfect solution right now 😅 I hate how i turns out and Konami's way of card design, but just enjoy what we have for now I guess
The point about the relief you feel when Sinful Spoils doesn’t summon Ash is so true. I like the card design on those (minus Wanted getting to search AND draw in the same turn), but with SE it’s just too much.
1card combos are fine.
1card combo that ends on a full 10card board with 5 cards in hand 2 handrips, full recovery is too much.
Because no matter what happens if one thing goes through nothing mattered what u interrupted.
1 card combo into 2negates and maybe 3 cards on field that do something but ni recovery is fine imo like older meta decks
it's kind of hard to prevent 1 card combos at this point but say we could reel them in. How strong should a 1 card combo be to not end up in the current "open a hand trap or lose" situation?
Genuinely some of the best games i've had in MD recently have been because I've been playing Rescue Ace Diabellstar, and I've had a lot of opponents stick through the games as well. I like to think the opponents are enjoying the breath of fresh air as well and having a lot more points of interaction and decision making instead of just waiting to see the Ash. I've got no real evidence for this other than far fewer early concessions, but i'unno. Seems to be the case.
“Best we can do is semi-limit Oak”
I think the main cause of needing all those hand traps are turn 1 unbreakable boards or floodgates that don’t let you play.
Letting SE go through their entire combo and ending on a 2/3 mat apo, princess in grave, ip into sp and maybe a set imperm is simply too much for almost every deck, not considering perfect hands.
The issue here is that there the end boards are too strong in general, with too many interruptions your opponent has to face.
I think that Konami should rethink about the overall card design and the direction they want their game to go: a SE endboard without apo or without an omega handloop is manageable even with just a couple of board breakers, and I’m taking SE just as an example, but that extends to things like puppet lock, secret village, the upcoming gimmick puppet, the pre-baronne-ban mannadium endboard and so on..
Agreed on the limit 1 festival. It was just a headache.
One card combos are fine, but only if the engine is big enough so you cant play 15 hand traps or the enboard is not oppressive enough
next is the consistency of the one card combo which is not the most important but also not an irrelevant point.
On the topic of SE - I hope they dont hit Original or the Diabelstar line too much, cause they clearly want to connect her to other decks, maybe not as extensive as Visas but they want to do more as we see somewhat with GoblinBiker and White Woods. For SE the issue is one poplar and one Flamberge are kinda enough, but if they lose one of them, idk how much they can still ball - not the biggest expert on the deck tbh. - but I think this has to be the angle, cause the advantage both create is absolutely insane and is the problem.
Josh mentioned it at the later half as well, the card advantage being generated by just normal summon SE Ash and its not Ash - "Ash is just a Stratos" but then its Poplar who goes plus X and Flamberge later for plus Y. Maybe you guys in the comments have some good ideas?
Alternatively unbann Ishizu Tear and no one will play Snake Eye anyway ^^
1 card combos are cool when they have lower ceiling that gets backed up by non engine. The issue rn is that 1 card combos are doing everything (like at least Mathmech it was just OTK).
Mathmech only otk? are you high? Mathmech ends on one S/T negate, one omni, and one pop + handloop. All of them you can't really interact with in most main decks.
Just like everything else in Yugioh, not all 1 card combos are created equally. Normal Aliester is a joke compared to what your normal summon is expected to lead into these days.
I've been thinking a lot about that clip at 8:15. Does that drytron nova even win the game there cause otherwise if they attack over hita or let it live snake eyes wins turn 3 regardless of what they top deck.
Even so if the opponent needs that much non engine disruption and their own one card starter to have a chance against snake eyes is insane.
I think 1 card combos are fine if the ceiling is low. The problem is 1 Card combos that generate 6 interruptions with tons of follow up.
I play a small snake-eye engine with volcanic (2 ash, 1 oak, 1 poplar, 1 birch , 2 OSS , 1 flamberge , 1 SE diabel , 1 field ) and it's insane the amount of ressources it gives me with only 10 cards
Holy crap I’m not the only one who’s been feeling this way as of late.
this reminds me the blue eyes mirror nationals
Where can we watch this event?
I can’t find links anywhere
konamifr replay on twitch
If they happen to not ban Flamberge and only semi-limit Ash when they do address the deck, I'll probably pick up "pure" Snake-Eye as a fun deck. It may be/continue to be meta, but its still got neat lines that I think look cool as hell
I think consistently vs 1 card combo is a problem. Some decks can 1 card combo to full board but the versatility/consitency should be reduce to make sure they can’t just do that 1 card combo every time.
Like brandead fusion for example, 1 spell and you can make your play, but its very vulnerable to most ht so many players is fine with it(except puppet lock) because you still have to work with other cards/engine, and what you stop affected ALOT to stop a 1 card combo so it won’t be sth like snake.eyes when you drop another engine to full combo again too ez.
Other example I think its raidraptor, the deck is very consistency, you also have 1 card, 1.5 cards combo with it. But the number of archtypes draw in this deck + hand trap is a lot stop it doing the same combo everytime. So raidraptor deck can’t just play it every time because if that deck got stopped by ht in 1 card combo style you are dead. most of the time they have to do combo with 2 cards to play around ht.They really have to commit a lots to play around ht and they have to make sure to manage their extra deck because the deck is lack of outside non-archtypes cards to support the 1 card combo.
Other examples like red resonator(1 card combo, harder to play around ht) we have 1 card combo, but it should have pay-off(sth like in deck, ability to play around) and the consistency so not every cards in a deck is a stater + engine.
That's the thing, it really all goes back to how yugioh be built. One card combos were created because handtraps was too strong because huge combos were too strong and these are to some degree all streamlined and clear cut interactions and i don't know if konami want to fix this.
And i forgot about how links enable this to the nth degree
@@duduvec5971 Maybe removing links from the game? Seriously, they just don't fit YGO's gameplay.
@N12015 Once a Summoning method is introduced into the game, it can be curtailed but is never removed from the game other than by rebooting the entire game (Speed Duel, Rush Duel, Dungeon Dice Monsters, Capsule Monster Colosseum).
This is why I love playing Branded with my only hand traps being 2 Bystials and 1 Tri-Brigade Merc.
That’s it. 40 cards. I literally have time to eat my food while my opponent plays their combo game 1 😂 It’s amazing. I can just watch them set up and then when I go, it’s time to break the board.
I’m ngl to you, if I see either bonfire or diabel activated and I have less than 3 handtraps in my hand / they have called or cross I scoop. I don’t even bother seeing if they’re playing snake eyes or not
Decks do too much turn 1 -> handtraps need to exist -> decks need to be resilient to disruptions -> decks do too much turn 1 -> we need more handtraps
How long can we keep this cycle until it implodes on itself?
Probably for a little while longer before the bubble bursts that forces yugioh into an actual reboot not a half hearted one like Rush
@@michaelkehaRush Duel is a take every card away from everyone, burn them, and rewrite the rules from scratch complete hard reboot. Are you thinking of Duel Links/Speed Duels?
@@autobotstarscream765 I consider it half hearted because it's kept in the OCG and duel links they haven't actually committed to it properly
@@michaelkeha You mean your actual problem is that they don't release and support physical Rush Duel product in gaijin territory because they hate us? Yeah, that's pretty much how everyone feels right now.
@@autobotstarscream765 it's why I consider it a half hearted reboot since only one territory got it and the rest of the world is still playing the normal game not much of a reboot if you don't release it to everyone else and you keep printing and supporting the other game anyway
Where can I find that Twitter clip lmao
When I play against Snake Eyes, it feels like one card does everything the deck needs it to do including grabbing another one card that does everything. Turn two comes around and if you don’t have the right tech in hand, you’re just waffling and anything you do just starts them again but on your turn.
you address it at 11:40 but I dont think 1 card combos is necessarily the problem. I think the problem is how linear those 1 card combos are while always filtering through the same general pool of cards. I think if decks were more varied in HOW they combo, then this issue wouldnt be so bad. The issue is that every 1 card combo uses for example, OSS, therefore if OSS gets inturrupted or you're not able to get to OSS you basically just lose. Thats not exactly true about OSS, it's just an example to demonstrate my point.
I don't agree, because if 1 card can go into multiple combos, no matter which combo you WANT to play, if it gets stopped it gets stopped and if it doesn't then you have even more differently lines to navigate to a win. Still the same problem.
@11wildy63 if the lines weren't so linear then the cost of having so many combos you can do would be the amount of bricks you need to run. If you only have 5-6 1 card snake eye combos for example but you have 5-6 1 card branded combos too, that means you have to run the snake-eye bricks AND the Branded bricks. Not to say playing those decks together is possible, just using them as an example
I only uses Wanted, Diabelle and OSS for my infernoble deck.
Ban anima would be an interesting hit. Finish what was started on the last banlist.
And release a link 1 who asks for light / dark lvl 1... I feel bad for BE and Skull servant already without Linkuriboh
Fine, I'll put salamangreat almiraj in my extra deck.
@@Ragnarok540 Isn't as efficient, Poplar is the one that is used for link, not Ash, and remember, must be a normal summon
IMO, dragonlink was and still is the perfect combo deck in terms of where yugioh should be, flexible in its engine to allow it to constantly adapt and allow for deck building talent to show, it has 1 card combos but they end on very little, mostly a couple interupts and follow up, but you can continue to invest into that endboard to make it bigger at the cost of resources so there are decision trees in how far you want to push depending on what your playing against. Also it has no hard bricks, hard bricks suck to play, soft bricks also suck to open but the fact theyre still playable makes them fine. and no 1 card in the deck (minus chaos space) generates too much advantage to not consider whether to interupt it or hold.
Ofcourse varients of dlink like halqcross aren't what im talking about but theres a reason it was meta for like 4 years (still playable now) and yet had very few complaints laid against it
Pachinkomoney hates Dragon Link with the burning passion of 1,000 suns and is constantly banhammering it out of existence.
What if they limit every hand trap to 1? It might actually force people to play. Otherwise its either start with 1 card combo, or use an entire hand of hand traps to disrupt your opponent until you pull your 1 card combo........
That’s why marincess and saladmangreat are decent decks. They can play a lot of handtraps and set up decent boards while adding back the starter. If you get ur field cracked u can play still
Ban flamberge or field spell, thats a start. Maybe even ban oak
Banning Oak would only delay the inevitable
I feel like the problem is not completely in one card combos, but in the fact that cards can still carry on those combos despite being interrupted. Making it so that a single card can demand 2 or even 3 interruptions before it is truly stopped from working, which is insane and tend to make games way more boring cause everyone is then demanded to run insane amount of interruptions against decks that have even a "few one card combo" cards.
I also have an issue with a lot of toxic traps
THANK YOU, I’ve been saying this. SE Ash is the problem card. Wanted is fine for other decks like Infernoid, Noble Knights, Boxers, etc.
Ash might get hit to 1 next list, but that card needs to go eventually.
My guy josh going bald af sheesh
That comb over in a windy day lol
This comment was out of pocket... 😂
Hey, but ashened gets a freaking continuos trap to fuse and pyro lock...
Lorcana added it's FIRST search card in the set that released last week, and it searches for another Madrigal card (from Encanto) to place on top of your deck. The thing is, there are MANY Madrigal cards that came from this set and in draft format youre not bound by mana color so it feels the most genuine searching for a card based on the situation you need to overcome rather than searching for one thing and one thing only.
Thats the problem with modern yugioh. The newer meta relevant decks aren't creative or skillful. You really have no choice on your actions and all effects do one linear thing. Sure, you can search ANY level 1 fire monster with Ash, but you will never EVER add anything else but poplar. Sure, you could add ANY fire dragon with paidra, but you'll only ever add chundra. Theres NO skill expression or problem solving. Its literally like memorizing the answers for a test rather than actually studying the content to understand how to arrive at the answers.
i was having that issue with voiceless voice. The deck looks cool but it doesn't feel like I'm playing it. Feels like it just plays itself with all the effects those cards have slapped on them
5:24 nice
And Aluber always searches Fusion.
There were plenty of turns for both players to win. I think snake eye is a balancer deck meaning it conforms the format
Give 3 different effects to every single card of an archtype and they're broken? Crazy
Honestly the issue isn't the hand traps, they're fine. This is like old Yu-Gi-Oh where you have traps to stop your opponent's plays. The issue is, unlike with old Yu-Gi-Oh, if you do not have enough traps, the game is pretty much over. That makes it so that the games are kind of back and forth but only until one player resolves an effect and then it's GG. This also means you can't play more strategically with your disruptions since you have to negate certain stuff.
I dont think 1 card starters are much of a probelm until a deck has multiple different 1 card starters where it becomes an issue
We need more one card combo decks
I feel the problem isn't the one card combo here, at least not entirely. I play Centur-ion Horus, Centur-ion can start with the terrain, Emblema, Primera or Trudea. If Primera is stunned after her effect, she cannot be special summoned for the rest of the turn. If Emblema is used, and the card still on the board, you cannot do anything other than a Centurion Extra deck monster. Yes we play Calamity and yes this card should be banned. But the reason we play this is because going to another card like Cristal Wing or Blazar is considered "bad" because it's only one negate.
SE should have had a lock like this, either "you can only summon fire monsters until the end of the turn" so that a Omega/Dis Pater auto win combo T1 or a Zealantis ban field trigger Promethean trigger Phoenix you lose well play gg could'nt be made. It's a fire deck that plays way to many non fire powerful cards. I don't know, it's really not healthy. Prices are like so dumb right now. SP is still so high priced.
For me the real problem is the number of effect every SE/SS cards have, with so little/none restrictions, and the power of those effects. Like Flamberge can send any cards the player wants to the backrow and next turn it will be his card + can summon two monsters from the graveyard if he touches the gy by any way. It's not like when only destroyed, it works when they link, it works when it's in the backrow, it works everytime. this is just so dumb, the cards re-summoned can also use their effects, the spells are way too strong, the fact they printed a Bonfire is ridiculous considering it was not a limited card on release when a Reinforcement of the Army has been limited for so long. We know Konami does this because stonks high prices high chased cards, shortprints.
So now they are at a state where either they hard hit SE but take the risk of seeing player leave the game because after spending an entire salary in their deck they cannot play it, or do little hit by little hit and we will see this format for 6 months again. Also this fucking extra deck is way too toxic. Ending on a board with Apo 3, Flamberge, Ip to SP, Promethean Princess on GY, Raging Phoeniw on GY. Raigeki it and the board is even stronger. Also the monster reborn from Promethean is just way too much.
I feel bullied by this deck.
I want a card that make Neos spacian and Hero work together damn it
I know this video isn't meant to be a meme, but the thumbnail and title really makes it seem like a meme.
I think its a problem because decks have too much room for all these hand traps rather than needing archtype cards for a deck to function
Would baku the beast ninja be the first poplar?!? 🤔
Aka why i still play dinos at my locals
We love 2 card combos
Because two and a half card combos are so fun. Lol
Can I keep my Soul Resonator?
Snake eyes is unironically the reason I picked up runick fiendsmith magical musketeer. I literally searched every card that can banish and I invested all of it into hate. Now with the latest support for galaxy im hating even more by running ftks for it bc I swear our handtraps do jack to them, but they do everything even to other meta decks.
Activate circular sending sigma. Response?
I surrender.
D.D Crow
@@Liliana_the_ghost_cat Addition, Alembert gets Ash'd then normal summon Diameter...
13:09 is fckin real. Thats when you realize that stupid snake-eyes archetype was a mistakes.
I don't believe for one second that the regular winners are there because they are skilled. I think they've learned how to stack their shuffles, which is why they win far more consistently than they should.