What If The Taiping Rebellion Defeated The Qing?
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- čas přidán 10. 04. 2023
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#possiblehistory #ph #taiping #qing #victorian #alternatehistory
The Taiping rebellion was a wild story. A Chinese Christian theocratic absolute monarchy that revolted against the Qing dynasty under the leadership of the self-proclaimed brother of Jesus Christ. Yes, you heard that right. The Taiping rebellion controlled significant portions of China during the war, most importantly the historical Chinese capital of Nanjing, and desired to take control of all of China and convert the Han to their version of Christianity. But thanks to supply issues, desertion, and internal issues the Taiping never managed to destroy the Qing, and were eventually destroyed after the most deadly civil war in history.
But what if they did, and the Taiping Heavenly Kingdom actually managed to destroy the Qing state during the Taiping Rebellion.
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Everytime he says "Xing" I die a little bit more inside
Literally unwatchable
i think hes trying to pronounce it in the cantonese romanization where it kinda reads "tsing"
i think it's better than some people who pronounce it as "king"
@@yuyang588 I pronounce it that way 😂
I always pronounced it as “Ching”
The taiping rebellion is one of the weirdest religious conflicts/civil wars.
Also among the deadliest and further impacted the Qing Manchus further into the inability to stem the tide of defeat by modernized nations of lesser territorial size and wider reach. Spurned a further number of related allied and distant rebellions and coincided with another Opium (Arrow) War.
@@shinsenshogun900 Over 30 M dead
@@YaBoiBaxter2024 Hell, you can probably make an argument that the current PRC's tight control of Abrahamic/monotheistic faiths as a result of the LAST time it gained a majority foothold in China.
@@bloc5422 brother of Jesus*
The most deadly civil war in history I'm pretty sure it's the second most deadly war in all of history only behind WW2
Never let Adolf Hitler fail art class, and never let the self-proclaim brother of Jesus Christ fail his exams four times in a row.
Time travel to 19xx, give Hitler a laptop, tell him how to use AI drawing
@@user-LandChad Problem: No internet
🤣🤣🤣 you are right!
@@IdioticCakeGive him Nasa laptop so he can run the AI offline.
@@bill5627 problem: still no internet because of satellite
A) Hong Xiuquan was not Catholic but far more theologically influenced by Evangelicals who were his main interaction with Christianity.
B) the Taiping were more complicated socially than you make out, with strong minority presences in it dramatically reshaping events.
he did say "his version of Catholicism"
I can imagine that Christianity (whether through the Europeans with their missionaries or the Taiping themselves) would gain more weight as it would in China. It could possibly fuse with Confucianism and other native philosophies.
I think the Chinese-Malaysian community is the closest approximation for this, considering that Charismatic Christianity, Folk Religion, Buddhism, Taoism, Ancestor Worship, Confucianism and general traditional Chinese rites and culture have all elements of that society, some more syncretic than others, but more often than not, in the open and in public society.
Or a bastardized violent denomination of Christianity, for Hong hated failing to pass the exams based on studying the ancient and recent state-sponsored Confucian classics. Would be a blend of Folk Chinese and Christian faiths and little Warring States Philosophies (retaining Legalism and the Art of Warism)
@@shinsenshogun900 oof
Cope more soyboy
@@michakoniecpolski5677 ????
One thing that wasn't touched on was the effects on the Chinese diaspora. There would probably be far more Chinese migrating to Southeast Asia, Polynesia, the Americas, and anywhere British indentured servitude exists (e.g. Caribbean)
In some cases this would reshape demographics (think Fiji or guyana), and in others might cause greater xenophobic reactions (like San Francisco and Vancouver) but overall the global Chinese diaspora would at least be double what it is in our own world
Would Taiping create more hatred toward the Chinese?
@@nathanseper8738 Jesus is not my weak Chinese brother
Refugees from the Red Turban rebellion and Taiping rebellion basically made Hong Kong, Shanghai and to a lesser extent San Francisco
@@williamkarbala5718 These cities are built on drugs
@@nathanseper8738 why? Taiping is more western than Qing...
I would say that the Qing would be carved up alot earlier as the Europeans would take advantage of the crisis to either: make new colonies or ally themselves with the early warlords.
This has already happened in the actual warlord era with foreigners trading weapons and industry to the local Generals.
That would be Double-plus Ungood. We've always been allied to Eastasia.
Would you see Britain controlling a whole chunk of China and not just Hong Kong and some other concessions?
@@nathanseper8738 No, he doesn't have a lot of drugs, and that's a problem
I think new colonies for European in China would be like taking control/lease of important cities along trade route and not controlling huge land areas in China (Like in our timeline during warlord era). As constant war between many warlords rendered most Chinese territory hostile for foreigners.
There's an unpopular opinion about warlord era in China. The wars & alliance between many warlords is a war about unifying China, they just disagree to which regime shall ruling it.
Qing is pronounced Ching. not Xing
Yup.
If he's reading any Chinese places or names in the future:
A word starting with "Q" is pronounced "Ch" like the Ch in Change.
A word starting with "X" is pronounced like "Sh" like the Sh in Ship.
A word starting with "Zh" is pronounced like "J" in Jack.
I Thought It Ws Quing?
Qing Qong
I thought it was Q-wing
Isn't "q" more something between "ts" and "tsh" while "ch" is a sort of thicker "tsh"?
For Japan, the internal problems might be resolved sooner and more swiftly. Both the Shogunate and the Emperor would not want to go the same way as China, which would be seen to be both internal weakness, lack of tech and foreign religions encroaching in Asia. Remember, that when Russia would look east if unsuccessful in the west or vice versa. Again we have one of the most important events, The Congress of Berlin 1878. This caused the Czar to abandon the Three Emperors' Alliance and in this timeline, pushing Bismarck towards a British Alliance.
As an alternative, we could have Leopold, Prince of Hohenzollern becoming King of Spain, which was a cause of the Franco-Prussia war in 1870. This would give Germany access to Spanish colonies and possibly invigorating them with a German place in the sun. Britain would see this as helping Germany and keeping France out of Chinese markets as well as pushing France into its Russian alliance.
A theocratic Christian monarchy in China would definitely be interesting to see.
@乾隆18th century hegemons wha?
@@user-qq1ul1he7b 有病？
Since the Russo-Japanese War never happened, this shall greatly reduce the chances of any revolution in the Russian Empire in 1900-1910s.
A Russian Empire that developed steadily during that era would tremendously affect the balance of power in Europe.
The Russo-Japanese War is also the reason the Russian Empire shifted its focus from the Far East to the Balkans, which could lead us to an unimaginable WWI scenario.
Will Russia reduce its investment in European affairs because it focuses on consolidating its territories in the Far East?
Or will it have greater ambitions for Europe because of its strong economic strength?
Russia was interested in keeping peace in Europe because the only unachieved goal was Tsargrad. Besides, with Manchuria Russia will finally have a warm water port in Port Arthur and thus will focus on developing and settling the far East
With the Russo-Japanese war never happening, Russia would be even more unprepared for ww1 since they would never reform their army as they did irl, with the war being more destructive for them a revolution could still happen, though I do think it would happen somewhat later
While the massive success in the east would be a great leap forward in the stability of the nation, this would lead to the Russians not modernising their army, and suffering an incredible defeat very early on in the 1st World War, possibly even swinging the balance of the war to the Central Power's side, and the collapse of the state maybe 5 or 10 years later. Russia was doomed from the start.
Yes they would keep ambitions over Balkans. First off all Russia won't be satisfied with port in Manchuria as there was only one railroad between Moscow and Far East. Secondly if revolution not happen, monarchists would stay in power, and ideas of Panslavism ( Slavic brotherhood with Russia as elder brother) were pretty popular among them.
@@alexzero3736 Thank Germany for communism
Oh! It seems pretty interesting! Here's an idea: What if Henry V lived and consolidated his conquest of france
More important, Henry VI didn't have 'issues'
What if John Lackland stayed alive and Louis the Lion remained King of France?
That is extremely interesting!!!
😊 keep on that way! You’re amazing!!
What if the HRE was able to create a hereditary monarchy like France? (Ottonian or Hohenstaufen) Thus being able to gradually subdue the nobles under Imperial control. Unifying Germany much earlier (and potentially Italy as well if it's the Hohenstaufens)
Actually it was hereditary for Habsburgs, the real problem was second part - subduing. Major states like Bavaria and Prussia were firmly against it, even Bohemia was disloyal at times.
@@alexzero3736 Well, that started in 1440. By then it was too late to meaningfully centralize, hence why Frederick III focused more on Austria than the whole HRE. One of the big blows was the Great Interregnum, which gave time for the German nobles to become much more independent (this power was increased via the Golden Bull of 1356) as well as for the Guelphs to crush the Ghibellines in Italy.
I'm talking about if the hereditary policy was able to be permanently followed during the "centralized" period (962-1250). One POD is that Emperor Henry VI's Ebreichsplan succeeds in being passed for some reason.
Honestly the fact this actually happened made me think some stuff from the hoi4 mod kaiserredux could happen
His form of Catholicism??? Umm, the leader of the rebellion learned of Christianity from Protestant missionaries, not Catholics.
Small correction the Taipings were technically Protestant not catholic
I always thought it was funny that my Chinese grandparents were Catholic since before they came to the United States. Sorta helped out when they moved here and lived in a Italian Catholic neighborhood in the early 50s.
1850s or the 1950s? Either way, cool of them to avoid these nasty turbulent times
@@shinsenshogun900 1930's, then sorta wandered for awhile until they could settle the US legally in the 50s
I also have Chinese Catholic grandparents (originally from Macau) and they also settled in an Italian neighborhood here in Canada lol
What if the Kaiser wasn't abdicated after WW1 but Germany became a constitutional monarchy with a Hohenzollern as head of state?
In that case it was more likely that his son, Wilhelm III, would become the new Kaiser.
@@Razor2000 That's what I think aswell that's why I said a Hohenzollern un general. Wilhelm the second as continuing Kaiser would be unimaginable. My guess would be that he would suffer a similar faith to the russian emporer in that. The risk of a civil war was highly inflated back then but I think with him still in charge it might aswell could've escalated.
So yeah his son would be the only rational choice. But since he was huge fan of NS party this would also make the whole scenario really interesting.
I'm sorry for my English man. It's 12 o'clock am and I can't sleep nor articulate right now I hope my thoughts get across well enough.
Have a wonderful day my friend.
Would have probably been better.
@@Meftu Or it would've caused the outbreak of soviet style civil war. Thats why I think this scenario is so interesting.
You should do a video on the An Lushan rebellion as that was also a wacky one for China too.
Decisive Tang Victory intensifies
@@shinsenshogun900 😂😂😂
More of a sad situation, considering that he was friends with the Tang emperor at the time, but because said emperor was already in his 70s and the court hated him, he had to rebel before the court will have him executed
@@yeeyee5057 Especially as the Confucian bureaucracy also played a part with corruption and tyranny of the like.
I guess you can say the Heavenly Kingdom was not so Heavenly 😅
Quintessential foreign trader experience (try not to feel sacrilegious gone wrong gone hellishly violent)
I was playing a Vic3 game today and the Taiping won. Cool to see this come out on the same day
And Victoria 2 HFM mod
*VIDEO SUGGESTION:*
What if The Qing Dynasty never fell?
Peerage dominated Parliamentary Constitutional Monarchy imminent
Sun Yat Sen could be a great PM if the Manchus are admittedly lenient to their Han subjects
only if he learns to pronounce qing properly
@@BBarNavi this
I think the likelihood of China staying splintered is very low, or at least the TaiPing will be able to control a large swathe of previous Qing controlled territories, while yes, there will be warlords, but that would be TaiPing's first priority which is to unify China.
Based on what I read about Chinese history, the Han, Jin, Sui, Tang, Song, Ming, Qing, and even Republic of China history, the Chinese seems to always be able to form a big fking state within months of a new regime. And the number one priority of the new regime will always be fking up the warlords or at least cooperate with them like giving them a certain amount of autonomy as long as they recognise the new regime and directed their forces outwards against any external threats or enemies of the new regime.
So ya, i think unlike the scenario that you see, a Chinese Christian theocratic is actually not that far fetch for a Chinese historical context, I think when the European powers want to carve out China, someone similar to the Ataturk of Turkey would emerge, it might not only be one, it can easily be up to a dozen of them given China's population.
Isn't this the history of China, our craftsmen?
@@user-cg2tw8pw7j Im so sorry, but which one are you referring to? the video or my comment
Just saying Qing is pronounced something like Cheeng or Tseeng in Mandarin, or Ching in English, not Ksing. Looking it up on forvo is always a good idea if you want to find and listen to native pronunciations
Well he's not a native. I never understand this sentiment. My country has like six different names in other languages and everybody is butchering any of the 100s of words that we exported into the world ... and nobody gives a shit.
I think hes trying to say tseeng, but sorta failing and it sounds like ksing
Ok, how about what if the Song Dynasty industrialized?
The wandering path does not lend itself to limitless expansion.
I think the taiping would probably maintain a small powerbase around nanjing.
What map editor thong do you use?
I feel like similar to our world Britain might still be allied with Japan and perhaps in this time line Britain would be more open to giving Japan a stronger position in Asia seeing as it's already too weak to keep such position itself. The issue becomes now what is Japans main goal? Would it be domination of Asia, or will it be control over China mainly at first.
China and Korea
7:28 Manchuria may also fall under some Qing remnant and be a Russia protectorate.
No, Russia had a clear aim of taking Manchuria for itself and settling it
Wonder if you could review the world of the Kaiserreich mod and if you find it an interesting or realistic scenario
also a scenario which I think would be interesting: What if napoleon made concessions to austria in 1813 and the austrian empire joined france again after frances defeat in russia
You should make a video about Japan if it gotten more land in the Pacific after ww1 and what japan would look like during ww2 with those added lands
can you make an actual taiping victory video, where for the sake of the scenario the heavenly kingdom doesn't fall?
Okay, I didn't any mention of the crimean war or the Russo-japanese war, which if I'm not mistaken, were pretty important to proving russian military weakness. Wouldn't they seem as great or even greater a threat than Germany by Britain in this timeline due to their massive degree of influence across eurasia, and a lack of proof of their military imcompetence?
No, because Germany sent a communist spy
Unrealistic idea: what if Prussia and Austria compromised and let Bavaria unite Germany?
One interesting question to ask here, though, is would the Russian Civil War still happen? If Russia plays its cards well, getting Manchuria under their thumb in the 1860s might give them the boost they need to where the german invasion is either halted or, at least, is not so devastating as to cause a civil war to happen in the first place. Not to mention that Great Britain and France are now stronger too, so there is a chance that Germany eventually sees itself forced to move troops from the eastern front to the west, just to be able to match the Allies in numbers, or, alternatively, mobilize a bigger army, which then weakens German industrial output, since you need to get workers from somewhere, etc. And this is just one of many divergence points that could lead to an earlier end of WW1. What if, for example, a stronger Great Britain now has the troops left over to make significant progress into Turkey through the Levant? If such an offensive was significant enough to where the Middle Powers need to dedicate more troops there to stop the British, this, too, shifts the power dynamics. Or maybe the more powerful Entente weakens Germany enough to where Romania doesn't suffer total collapse upon declaring war, an event which potentially increased the duration of WW1 by a year (Germany almost collapsed in the winter of 1917, because there just wasn't enough food to go around; Without all the lifestock and grain captured in Romania a year prior, stocks would have been even smaller by then). This, and many other points in WW1, could potentially have prevented a Russian Civil War from happening; and even if it did, who is to say the Soviets still win? The ripple effect of any altered WW1 has a pretty massive impact on any potential Russian Civil War.
I think a cool alt hist would be what if the eureka rebellion succeeded
I got a drinking game idea: Everytime he mispronounces "Qing", you take one shot
Im not suicidal
I love your work friend but please could you reupload this with the proper pronunciation of Qing? It's impossible to watch what is otherwise great content, sorry.
This sounds like a really fun HOI4 scenario
The warlord era lasted from around 1917-1927. Just 10 years. It took two more decades for a strong state, the PRC to emerge. A Qing collapse in 1860 is unlikely to see China still fragmented by WWI. Most likely one warlord will emerge dominant and declare a new dynasty by the 1880s. China is extremely unlikely to be a republic at this time. It is entirely possible China by WWI would be centralized and rapidly industrializing. This new dynasty would likely take advantage of the Russian Civil War to recover lost territories that our timeline warlord era China couldn’t hope to do.
Idea: What if Justinian I the Great manage to restore the Rome Empire?
Can you do what if livonian order survived?
This sounds really interesting and plausible and plausible. I think this could delay or eliminate the scramble for Africa at least till after World War II, it will take a lot of effort for countries to get into China. Or alternatively Germany could try harder for Africa if they get left out in China.
As for interesting what ifs, I saw Sweden winning the great northern war. In comments in other videos, For another good one, what about the Albany Plan of Union in the mid 1700s going into effect? How does this alternate United States develop?
Champ Clark pushed for an all volunteer army in World War I. You did the United States entirely neutral, what if Clark wins the presidency. That almost happened, Wilson nearly backed out of the 1912 convention. While he wasn't perfect he was less racist than Wilson and would have done some things differently, yet most obutterflies don't come until that all volunteer army. In fact, you could have Tammany Hall not back him, and William Jennings Bryan support him instead early in the convention.
Could you make a vedio on "What if Gustavus Adolphus the Great never died?" with other words, what would happen i Gustavus Adolphus didn't die att Lützen and Crowned himself as the new Protistant Emperor of the HRE and then marched on Rome!
A warlord era before the liberalization of Dr.Sun would just make it like a 2nd three kingdoms period just with European influence.
Another opportunity for a Yuan Shu to rise, like Yuan Shikai forming the Second Zhong Dynasty
Wait a minute....
RYUKYU ISLANDS NEVER WERE CHINESE WTF 😒
This would be a godly hoi4 mod.
The idea of a divided China is interesting, as that is almost the exact situation Britain faced in India. India was more or less a recently collapsed "empire" divided into small kingdoms.
A warlord would probably make himself emperor.
Taiping was definitely not a Catholic movement. It was more like a weird form of Protestantism.
Actually had the Taiping win in a game of mine recently, they've been pretty mild internationally
I think there's the possibility that the British could have sought a source of manpower far closer to China to help enforce and defend their interests there - Japan. They're in the middle of the Meiji Restoration and hiring foreign experts - known as O-yatoi Gaikokujin - to teach their specialized knowledge and skills to assist in the modernization of the country. The British could take advantage of this, offering experts in return for hiring Japanese sepoys/mercenaries to serve under British command in China, much like the Gurkhas of Nepal, and these soldiers would in turn gain training and experience in modern weapons and warfare that they could bring back to Japan after their terms of service expire.
Honestly i don't think it's fair to have russia fall to revolution when they werent't discredited as a great power from the russo japanese war that was kust butterfly effected out of reality
Yes, but they would have been discredited on the onset of WW1, with their army having no reforms as they had never had a reason to. This would possibly lead to a complete collapse and then capitulation of the Russian Empire, as the Central Power's forces were focused on defeating the Russians first. A fast defeat and a harsh peace deal would be more than enough to collapse the already floundering Russian Empire.
This is one downside to alternative histories: they become projected far beyond what can be reasonably assumed.
Cool
idk why but "mr. britain i don't feel so good" was way too funny
My favourite dynasties of all time are The Ming, The Traditional Version of The Qing Dynasty aka The Qing Dynasty and The Modern Version of The Qing Dynasty aka The Republic of China 🇹🇼. And I am a Malaysian Chinese who was born on 8th December 1997 in Brunei 🇧🇳. I am a Pentecostal and Charismatic Christian
Should definitely do one with the Boxer Rebellion.
The bloodiest war in history
It wasn't the bloodiest war in history. That would be WW2
@@marysartr that's just incorrect my dude. It's top 5 but not the bloodiest one
@@kingced741 First of all, the Boxer rebellion didn't take that many lives. Maybe you mean Taiping? And Taiping was #2 behind WW2.
Boxer rebellion had a casualty number of around 100,000, ww2 had a casualty number or between 50,000,000 and 56,000,000
I think what the impact would be in Morden day is Asia would be generally a bit stronger than Europe, and the world would be a lot less Eurocentric due to the decline of Europe and the rise of japan, and then later, hopefully, the rise and unification of China, whether under communism, capitalism, or corporatism.
Instead of the qing dying early to the Taiping the century of humilliatin should have been avoided, remained neutral on WW1 china defeated the xinhai (delayed until the 1940's) centraling around the empire and joined germany, invading the Soviet union the easy way using their ultra-high manpower reserves and more advanced army to crish them (the japanese would easily get crushed) but eventually the qing, considered victorious even if Germany is destroyed they beat everyone and seized korea, sakhalin, hokiaido, the kurils, Hawaii, all japanese and anerican pacific holdings, french indochina, and settling the india-pakistani dispute by seizing all of the himalayas (French Raj, Nepal, Bhutan) and would eventually reform into the first constitutional empire! They would have a bigger industry, more population, and way more territory than modern china 🇨🇳 HAIL TO THE TRUE QING!
Scenario suggestion: what if Mexico won against the US?
What if Sweden won the great northern war.
👍
Hong Xiuquan was a convert to Baptist Protestantism, not Catholicism. And in English, the closest pronunciation of Qing is CHING. Also just BTW, there was not nation state of Vietnam at that time so the map is somewhat inaccurate to the South of China.
He said at 2:08 that the heavenly king was catholic when in actuality he was protestant.
interesting
Quick side-note, are those islands that the Qing control north of Taiwan the Ryukyu archipelago? Weren't they controlled by the Japanese by then?
They had been annexed in 1879.
So there was time for the British to throw their own influence over the Ryukyu domain. Especially if they had their eyes set on the islands. And in this timeline, they would’ve had influence/control over Taiwan.
While Japan themselves only began spreading their influence in the region in 1974, right after the Taiwan expedition. Which wouldn’t occur due to the British in this timeline.
@@imnotasiberianspy3895 Considering they where vassalised by a daimyo during the 17th century, I doubt Britain could do a lot without also escalating the situation in some way.
You can do a what if the son of the Czar returned to Russia in the 30' and start another civil war?
Vladimir III?
@@YaBoiBaxter2024 no i mean Aleksej Nikolaevič Romanov
i mean All Romanovs nicholas ii branch are died
but the kirill branch is important
@@andreacheri3495 Oh ok
@@briankaroll57 I mean if the son had survived and escaped perhaps to the UK or France, to then return to Russia and avenge the family
Here's an idea:
What if Prince Louis VIII of France succeeded in taking the throne of England during the First Barons' War?
Point of divergence is King John dying at a later point, preventing the mass defection of the barons to his son.
It would be cheaper for London to choose one or more of the rum states as protectorates and help them to put the region in order... A smaller, but still unified China would much probably rise again, sponsored by UK in some way to keep the other powers away of it... We must remember that it happened a lot of times in Chinese history with the Middle Kingdom coming back always...
"great game"
This just looks like the Heartland thesis taking shape lol.
A bit disappointed you didn't cover Pingnan Guo in Yunnan and Seikanron debate in Japan as a factor here
What if Harald hardrada became eastern Roman Emperor instead of becoming King of Norway
What if Harald hardrada qonquerd England in 1066
What if the Anglo Saxens won the battle of Hastings
I managed 50 seconds before I realised that you were going to spend the rest of the video mispronouncing "Qing".
Disappointing, please do your research.
Pronounced Tjing not xing, nice video though.
Here's something to note: with no Russo-Japanese war, there are significantly less tensions for the communists to co-opt and likely no Russian revolution since the idea of Russian power was never shattered.
A better world
NVM it collapses
Why is the Philippiness blue?
Lore of What If The Taiping Rebellion Defeated The Qing momentum 100
ur map is wrong, japan already controlled the northern island, while russia controlled sakhalin and outer manchuria. The overall border with the russian empire is also wrong around central asia and afghanistan didnt have it's panhandle, it only appeared after russia expanded into the southern portions of central asia.
The typing rebellion failed due to illiteracy
Too many people were typing, too few were able to read...
I don't agree rural China in XIXth century was much closer to Africa than Britain. I still think colonization would be possible with successor states centred around larger cities
Comment for the algorithm
The most unlikely thing in this, is the rather lazy idea of Russia and Britain allying them self before ww1. With Russia alot bigger, they become the mainland European Giant that needs to be contained. Also you forgot the Crimean War and the effect of bigger Russia and more eastern focus on that theater.
What if the foreign troops dismembered Qing empire after the opium war?
im not so convinced that the Taiping wouldn't be able to unify China although the heavenly king was certainly mad his cousin seems to have been reasonably switched on and the Taiping were actively working towards modernizing China in many ways. If they won those modernization efforts would have massively boosted their strength. Not to mention that Britain would almost certainly rather support the Taiping than see China fully collapse and all it would really need to do to prop them up would be sell them some western steam ships allowing them to control all the major water ways. he who controls the water ways controls the food controls China at that time.
Idea: what if the us, instead of just some moderate socdem reforms, went communist around the late 1930's? I doubt their ww2 involvement would change much, though they would probably aid the soviets more. The real stuff would start on the cold war. Would there be a american-soviet split or would they ally to destroy the british & french colonial empires?
They did align to destroy the British and French colonial empires, so why would that change?
20 to 60 million people died. Although the the Qing were not deposed and China was not a colony, China was a virtual colony in that its foreign policy and many of its economic policy were virtually controlled by western powers afterwards
12:40 Does this mean Japan would never be recognised as on similar footing with the west?
What if Japan didn’t open trade with the US
first and hi
Hello possible history I have a question why in your what if the soviet union won the cold War why do you use a picture of the United Kingdom 🇬🇧 with ireland 🇮🇪 in the thumbnail even though ireland was independent when the cold War was happening and no I'm not asking you to change the thumbnail no not at all I just want to know why that's all if you see this comment could you leave a reply please
Probably forgot to remove Ireland
@@Aahmpower ok
I belive the Feudatories would try making a comeback
If it's true, we might have country of Tibet, Yunnan, Guangxi, Xinjiang, and else.
What if France was divided up after the Napoleonic Wars and every single nation got a piece that would be interesting because of Austria Prussia and Russia in the coming decades with their Wars
I like it
Like 4 zone of influence in nord there a coloni of UK est Is german and belgian, sud si iltalian and spanish
Spain would likely gain Rosellò, Italy(Milan/Saboy) would gain back Corsica and the French Alps, Prussia would likely get Alsace and Lorraine, the Netherlands may take Calais or most of Belgium, and Britain may end up getting Normandy or Brittany
epik
What if Harald Hardrada conquered England in 1066?
it would’ve fallen to William at the same time, but even easier lol
A more interesting timeline is, of course, where William is defeated and killed at Hastings by Harold Godwinson.
Would the Boxer Rebellion still happen in this alternate timeline?
I imagaine anti-warlord and anti-european movements would coalesce and converge on a uprising similar to the Boxers by the 1870s-1890s.
Mr Turner: “Dinkleburg!”