🎧 Mixing on HEADPHONES? 🎧 SoundID Reference vs Waves NX Studio
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Mixing on HEADPHONES? - SoundID Reference vs Waves NX Studio
Today we’re taking a look at two excellent plugins to help you make better mixes on your headphones!
Sonarworks Sound ID and Waves NX Studio are designed to overcome the limitations engineers face when mixing on headphones.
But which one is right for you?
I’ll compare features, audio samples and more to help you decide!
Leave me a comment below and let me know what you think. Do you use another of these (or another) headphone plugin? Let me know that too!
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Timestamps
2:15 An important tip on inserting these plugins in Cubase
3:10 Sound ID Reference
3:35 Finding your headphones
7:00 Audio example
9:10 Translation check feature
10:11 Waves NX Studio
12:45 NX Head Tracker
13:45 CLA NX mix room audio
16:35 Nashville Ocean Way mix room
18:02 Which one should you get?
20:10 Using BOTH plugins at the same time
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Some of the gear and plugins I use in the studio:
►►WAVES PLUGINS DEALS with the following link: waves.alzt.net/c/2353421/2868...
CUBASE 12 sweetwater.sjv.io/XxQVe5
STEINBERG LICENCE KEY sweetwater.sjv.io/6bBJNN
DAW CONTROLLER Presonus Faderport 16: sweetwater.sjv.io/5bXnGn
STREAM DECK amzn.to/3OFVHaO
MONOGRAM CC monogramcc.com/shop/
SPEAKER CONTROLLER sweetwater.sjv.io/gbvG75
MICROPHONE sweetwater.sjv.io/b3WVKB
POP FILTER geni.us/8AnqW7A
STUDIO MONITORS:
KALI Audio IN-8 sweetwater.sjv.io/XxQVBM
HEADPHONES:
Verum1 V2 www.verum-audio.com/
Austrian Audio Hi-X65 sweetwater.sjv.io/vno7MN
Beyer Dynamics DT770 sweetwater.sjv.io/LPzQ6O
STUDIO MONITOR CONTROLLER sweetwater.sjv.io/gbvG75
VIDEO FILMING GEAR
Video gear shared in this video
CAMERA geni.us/My8h
CAMERA PRIME LENS geni.us/Pu7i
CAMERA MIC geni.us/zBCdmg
LAVALIER MIC geni.us/DdQTq
CAMERA LIGHT geni.us/2fruo
VIDEO LED LIGHTS geni.us/259YYN
LIGHT STANDS geni.us/ARrDmz3
SOFT BOXED geni.us/L2XAmoq
RGB FLOOR LIGHTS geni.us/KwL7 - Hudba
I use SoundID Reference with my Sennheiser HD600 and I have to say that I wouldn't be able to work without SoundID Reference. This app pluggins are just amazing and now I can mix with way better translation than before. I live in a condo so I can't use speakers by respect for my neighbours :) so this is very useful for me. Very useful video. Great job Chris as usual.
Without the virtual monitoring you can just use equalizerAPO and the free profiles for autoeq
I love this video, I have been using Id and nx at same time but I was a little confused that is it right to enable both of these plugins at same time & you answered my question very well.
Thanks for bringing up that both can be used and that is exactly how by logic I use them and always thought they could be used.....first flat out the frequency response and then apply the room emulation. On my end this is a life saver because I cannot mix any other way than on headphones where I live. Again, thanks for the excellent video!!!
My pleasure! Thanks!
@@mixdownonline hi Chris, is the reply that reads "inbox me on telegram" a real and legit response from you? Thanks
@@correametal Hey Jose, Not at all... That's a Fake account that started to leave comments all around since an hour ago... I removed 50 comments so far... I reported the channel...Sorry about that
@@mixdownonline hey no problem at all and thanks for the fast response. I really appreciate it and I am sorry your channel got attacked by these creeps! There is another audio channel I watch that went through the same thing. Take care and thanks for always bringing great quality content my friend!
Hello! Thank you very much for this great video! I was checking another video that recommends using Sonarworks in the plugin chain but after NX, but here I can see that you recommend doing it the other way around! Now I'm a bit confused..! can you please explain why? Thanks again...
Have both but never thought about using both at the same time. Will definitely try it!
Yes, it might work for you or not, it's worth a try :-)
I'm now much more happy buying today my purple black ATH-M50x LE after watching this. I believe I've made a good choice. I bought them not because of they are the best, but affordable and I knew I can use them with these plugins together to get better results. Thanks Chris, subscribed. 🙂 👍
Great video Chris I have been using wave nx for a while know and love it :-) I am about put the sound ID in next week and i was hoping you could do it the way you do.
You saved me some money with this video! I was about to buy the sonarworks but I already have the NX collection and the sony 7506. After reading the NX manual, The headphone EQ in NX does do what the sonarworks does to the headphones. Heres what it says: "The Headphone EQ section provides EQ correction curves for specific headphone models. These curves are based on precision headphone measurement data provided. The Nx EQ curves are designed to correct model-specific irregularities in the frequency response of the of headphones. This results in a more transparent starting point for monitoring and mixing." Am i understanding that correctly?
Thank you very much for this very interesting test !! You have the perfect approach, very positive and accurate :)
Thank you so much! Glad you liked it!
I also use Waves NX Studio and SoundID Reference at the same time, the result is spectacular.
Great video, thanks!
Glad you like it, and not the only one doing this :-)
I'm trying this and just have a quick question, when out the sound ID reference it lowers the volume to keep some head room once I put the NX studio do I dial the knob up to recover the original volume?
Great video just a question if you use both and put NX after SoundID how to manage the headphone model on NX software. I mean all the correction should already be done form SoundID so no headphone model should be checked.. is it right? and if so wich correction will make NX plugin?
Thanks, this is the best explanation videos so far…. I’m follow you.
Do pro mix engineers use the sound Id reference ? it sounds great but is it really worth mixing through this plugin always ? Nice video
I use AT M20x headphones, Reference provides a nice improvement, as I dont use them for mixing but to hear how it translates the stereo image Waves NX studio wouldnt help me but for mixing it adds a subtle nice feeling, both plugins together sound pretty good!
Anyway, I suggest disabling NX to check the stereo mix and I do not like head tracking, it´s useless and distracting (for me). Thank you Chris.
Boa! Minha escolha é o HD650 como é ou qualquer outro fone com SoundID. A ideia da Waves é interessante, mas não é pra mim 😀
Thank you for the videos man.
Very nice video. I will try first the Sonar works one, and then we'll see.
Though it shows the frequency spectrum as flat, is it using the Fletcher-Munsen curve? Because that's what sounds flat to is. I assume so, but I've never heard it mentioned in relationship to sonatworks.. Also, do they give the option of partially correcting them, like wet/dry mix?
I use the same Senny. Love it, but it never translated that good to other systems until i used the reference plugin. Now it's way better. Didn't know about the NX studio. Going to try that!
Cool thing! Thanks for sharing!
Phil from Sonarworks here. Bro you nailed it. Thanks. Please return the headphones as soon as possible.
Chris, what if you have Neutron 4 ? do these sound references plugins become useful with it in some way ?
Great video. Thanks chris! I’m getting the ID Reference demo today. How much better would you say having Sonarworks custom calibration compared to the stock calibrations makes? I see the numbers, but what about sonically? I’m doing critical mixing. I’m my treated room, these would be for late night mixing in my nyc Apt
Custom calibration would be awesome....for Sonarworks. Because they get to transfer the $$$ from your pocket to theirs.
Any idea when the NX Tracker might go on sale?
Bonjour, quels sont les réglages a faire pour enregistrer à -18db, entre ma carte son, ma guitare, mon clavier midi et micro ?
Je vous remercie d'avance.
I don't have Waves NX Studio. I can see where I would want its room emulation sound of the studio to be switched on in my DAW to affect the mix itself. But the plugin's "EQ HEADPHONES" feature is designed to affect just the way my particular brand and model of headphones are hearing the mix. I would think I would want that feature to be switched so while I can hear its effect, it would not affect the mix's final output in any way. Is that possible to do? If not, how do you handle this issue? (With Sound Reference ID, I have my DAW set so the plugin flattens Sennheiser 650's unique frequency response, but I set it so that its correction to my particular set of headphones doesn't affect the mix itself in any way.)
Hi Chris.
Groovy content, as per!
I was wondering can Sonarworks and Waves NX software be used together? Or is this just overkill??
keep on Rockin'
Alex
Hey Alex, Thanks for watching. I actually answer this question near the end of the video 😉
Great info Chris! Question where do you put the NX plugin on the master channel chain? Thanks😎
I'd put it last. I have a monitor plugin option in Reaper so I've put it there so I can just switch on an off and it won't be printed onto the master when exporting.
@2:30 if you're a Reaper user, use your monitor fx chain as they don't affect what's gonna get bounced.
What's the measured changes in frequency response, latency, etc?
Hey Chris, thanks for your videos.. what do you suggest, open or closed back headphones for mixing
OPEN BACK
Another great vid as per Chris,
As someone who has never mixed in headphones, I appreciate what Sound ID/Waves NX does. However upon investigating these further, I have the weird feeling of 'demoting' my ears if I start using these.
I've just started investigating open-back headphones....crazy I know...but thankfully I have wax free ears [for the most part] and great neighbours that I bribe with a CD or two every birthday/Christmas.
Seriously I think I'll invest in an open-back pair of cans for now. My room and I are the best of friends as we stand [other rooms may vary] Merci mon ami
Thanks for sharing, Lloyd. A good pair of open backs is a good way to go, I'm a big fan of these
Hi Chris, as a bedroom hobbyist with no real experience, would I be better off with the Sonarwork or the Wave plugins to get me closer to a decent mix on my own productions?
Also, I have been fancying the studio monitors Kali LP-6s but I am literally in a bedroom with no real sound treatment. Would I be better off with one of those headphones plugins than with monitors to get more accurate mixes? ( I currently have the MX-50x headphones) Thanks.
If you can' invest a bunch of money in useful hardware or room treatment the NX / SoundID pipeline is a great alternative. My last music video shows this: czcams.com/video/X3CcfjCRCyU/video.html I still have to check if Chris' order of the plugins makes it even easier to mix.
Great information
Embody Immersive or Waves Nx? Is one better?
and after testing these two plug-ins. for me it added confusion and a waste of time in the decisions. I prefer to know perfectly my headphones with their defects and quality. but it is surely an excellent solution for others. test and have fun ! Merci pour vos vidéo Chris toujours très intéressant et agréable bravo !
Nothing wrong to learn your headphones with their defects and quality, I also do this with my Verum1, and HiX65. Merci Daniel pour ton commentaire :-)
Just purchased the 'OneOdio Monitor 60's', and I must say, I'm well impressed. Would be nice for your opinion on them maybe? Nice one Chris 🎶🎧
Never heard of it, I'll check it out, thanks for the suggestion
Do a review on Slate VSX system please.
If I'm mixing in Headphones I am using the dearVR MONITOR from Plugin Alliance. Very simple to use and you can even setup it in Dobly Atmos!
That's pretty cool, I never tried it, I'll have to look into it. Thanks John!
Great video, Chris. One question, though. I notice that you inserted the plug-ins on the Main output, in the controlroom. This means that you still need to remember to turn them off, when using the speakers. Wouldn't it be more logical to place them only on the Phones?
That would work too for sure. On my side, I don't use separated outputs for my headphones, so I just bypass
I'm loving a separate output for headphones going to the Cubase control room monitoring. Game changer. And I put 4 buttons on the X-Touch to switch between 3 speakers and the headphone buss and two buttons to toggle between stereo and mono.
Thanks, Chris!
You're welcome!
Hi Chris - I'm pritty new in here and I'm a big question mark ( : can you make a bit about the input channels - why plugins on input ? and thanks for great videos !
My fav is CLA NX
Same here, the CLA and next the Nasville
The ocean way hr1 is my fave
It's a good one!
I would advise to use Sonarworks and then place waves Nx for the Balance and set the reverb. Sonarworks the CPU usage is 1% while waves NX is 10%
Yep, that's what I do on my side
I'm all for headphone correction like Sonarworks to get a more flat response but I can't mix using any kind of studio or room simulation because it just ads reverb and ambience which messes with the reverb and ambience already used in the track. I mean really, that's all emulations are doing is adding ambience and possibly some crosstalk. Canopener is a good plugin if you just want the crosstalk but no added ambience.
Good point. On these plugins, you can actually bring down the Ambiance to get it more dry.
Interesting: There's a slight difference in the ambience (or stereo width if you will) when SoundId comes second. So Chris is right. Nice learning. Never expected this. I did another test to check which headphones EQing is better. Although the NX delivers an AKG 712 Pro like SoundID does, the SoundID combination is a subtle
brighter (maybe a better ambience or stereo width). Interesting that the EQ model inside of NX is not as good, even when using the Harman model: czcams.com/video/s1aylVCrXjg/video.html Do NX use the EQ maybe after the room creation?
I have the Audio Technica since 2009, but they are the ATH M50, without X, the old model. Reference 4 hasn’t a profile for them, and I don’t know if it is the same profile that the 50X have. I suspect it isn’t, as I don’t like the sound with the compensation. But personally I prefer to use monitors. The results I got with headphones are until now catastrophic, but I am sure it is a matter of practice (just tried a couple of times) and not due to the headphones.
It does take time to know how your headphones sounds like with references and how that translate on other systems. Not made for everyone, and it's way easier to mix on studio monitors for sure :-)
DSonique... Realphones. Cooking with gas!! 😎
I've tried both but the best is the Vsx system...
When you bypass the plugin, I get a different sound, I want to export as it sounds ????
Always BYPASS these plugins, if they are inserted on the Master Bus. If you use the control room in Cubase, you can leave them ON
No one will be able to match its performance with professional quality speakers and acoustic treatment, but Sonarworks is the best solution, especially for home studios on a low budget, and it is more practical
Hey Chris how can you have that many headphones when I don't even have one😊😂. Awesome video and tons of information. With love from lagos, Nigeria.
Lol! Thanks!
Great video as always Chris. I usually use both Sonarwarks and NX plugins, but I would suggest placing the NX plugin before Sonarworks, since sonarworks is just making the headphones flat as a very last step. This way the sonarworks will not affect the actual room simulation done by NX.
Thanks Niclas! Yes, that why I put SoundID before NX, so that Sound ID doesn't affect the NX room sound. By keeping Sound ID first, NX stays with it's natural room sound, only the Headphone sounds flat and not the Room :-)
@@mixdownonline hm it's interesting to examine who is right (if not both of you), whether it's about hearing what the studio sounds like in these headphones, or how the headphones sound in these studios.
I put it after Nx as well but i'll have to try it the other way and see which I prefer
Definitely better with SoundID BEFORE NX. SoundID is applying EQ to the left and right channels discretely, correcting to a flat response. NX is folding together the left/right some and adding reflections to simulate speakers and room. EQing the folded together left and right discretely afterwards can alter phase relationships and skew the realistic listening environment NX is trying to create.
Very informative, thank you! In addition to that, the manual of SoundID Reference says: "Default plugin placement ...
The SoundID Reference DAW plugin should always come last in the chain. By default, the plugin should be placed ... after all the analyzers and metering plugins (including speaker emulation and crossfeed plugins, such as Waves NX and Can Opener)."
I use DSoniq Realphones, works great with my DT 1990 Pro's. 😎
Good to know! I never tried DSoniq Realphones
@@mixdownonline Their latest upgrade has really brought them on. I mainly use the optimised correction setting which smooths out the slightly spikey top end on the DT's makes them less wearing on my ears. 😎
Using SoundID before Waves NX is an interesting choice. I was thinking of using SoundID to calibrate the sound coming out of the Waves NX to my specific headphones. My logic must be flawed 🙃
Sound'S more natural and realistic if SoundID is before NX
@@mixdownonline Ah, alrighty then. Good to know. I will try that next time. By the way, thanks for sharing your headphones mixing system. I greatly appreciate it 👍
I use Slate VSX and i never go wrong with it
Never tried it, looks cool!
What about Acustica Sienna. There is also a free version
Never tried it
After I chose my headphone profile which is the Beyerdynamic 770 pro 80ohm. I think it sounds awful and boxy. Anyone else experiencing the same thing?
Me with 880 pro 250 Ohm
Yeah my 990 pros too
What about Dsoniq realphones ?
Heard of it, but never tried it
Hello Chris...one guick question...!!!
I guess you have never been in these studios in person..or maybe you have...!!!
but do you think that these nx plugins are very close to the real thing...??
i mean does it really sounds like you are in these studios??
in terms of %...whould you say these plugins experience is like 70..80..100% reallistic....???
Sorry for my bad enlgish!!!!!
I've never been to these studios either, but from what I've heard from people being in these studios, it's not 100% the same of course, but pretty realistic. I cannot give you a percentage, since I didn't made the comparaison myself.
@@mixdownonline
i bought one few hours ago!!!
couldn't resist!!!!
Thanks for the reply!!!!!
I thought there was a wet/dry option in sound ID Reference?
Yes there is
@@mixdownonline I thought so I can’t find it
Cool video... For me...Don't really need all that... Something like goodhertzs can opener is a lot cleaner... And translates well without an extra field of reverb going on that's hard to quite good to sound natural...Then....throwing in some good corrective EQ (I'm much prefering tuning to the Harman curve rather than something kind of dead sounding like sonarworks.... Everything just sounds right at the Harman curve... A lot of award-winning producers and mixers use it. Why would you choose to mix the something that just feels kind of flat and off? Why get used to that in order to be able to mix in it? With Harmon everything sounds just about spot on.... Much better Target in my opinion.
I made that video a few years ago. I recently put my hands on CanOpener, I love it, crosstalk fix, and that id it! And funny thing, I also started to look up tuning headphones to the Harman curve using AutoEQ website. I will report on a future video ;-)
@@mixdownonline I'm so sorry about that! I've tried to write "cool" video! My phone 'autocorrected' it into "corn". I did not mean to say that at all! I still like checking out all these monitoring programs... I tried the waves NX for a while but it was just kind of a little fazy strange... Especially with the head tracking. Though that was fun at first
@@mixdownonline Yes same! .. same website! 😎👍
Why no manufacturers of headphones tried to actually do flat sounding headphones ?
Because it is physically imposible when you take into account resonance and phase effects. Not to mention every individual's ear structures and torso vary by a couple of dB in how sound is perceived.
A theoretically fully flat sounding headphone will be grating in the really high frequencies.
Most headphone manufacturers target these days the harman curve.
CLA Nx for me
CLA is definately a good one!
Rookie error! Jumping the gun. Mmm... good song title?
Cheers
Alex
I don't get it, sorry
90% on headphones Audeze lcd 2 c And i use sound Id
Audeze's are greta headphones
most people today listen to music on headphones so makes more sense to mix on headphones
It's more about how does your music translate on most systems in general more than just one particular medium
I use to mix on headphones but always found the translation to other sound systems hit and miss... started mixing on monitors and can see why the PROS mix on monitors, takes Alot of the guess work out!
It takes time and experience to mix as well on headphones than on speakers. If someone knows his headphones very, very well, like Andrew Scheps and his Sony MDR 7506, it's possible for sure, but not made for everyone
good video! is not a Funny thing..what is Flat? ...... if each Room sounds Different??? maybe is just better to know YOUR Headphones!
I use Sound ID, it’s essential. I get the same sound on my headphones and out my speakers……can’t stand waves
Sound ID is great!
Let me provoke another video from you:
1) It's not clear whether or why the Correction plugin should come before or after the Emulation plugin.
2) The third type of plugin (or hardware) needed in the "Mixing on Headphones instead of Studio Monitors" is Crossfeed (such as Goodhertz Can Opener, or SPL /Behringer headphone amps).
Dial in All Three, and then you have a serious monitoring system, that May even "Translate".
So what order would all three go in? And more importantly Why?
A video testing multiple configurations and explanations, pointing to any gotchas and showing the Pros and Cons...much like the video you just did, but expanded and more comprehensive....That's what we need to see!
And I don't think Anyone on CZcams has done it.
What say you Sir?
Slate VSX for me
Never tried Slate VSX, but heard good things
@@mixdownonline I used to use Waves Abbey Road Studio 3 with Sonarworks 4 matched to the headphones I was using (which worked pretty well). What I prefer about the VSX is that the headphones are good quality and give a good neutral response in themselves (so I can still use the Waves Abbey Road Studio plug-in, but without using Sonarworks 4), plus they have matched software for impulse responses for a range of studios and different listening environments. Give them a try - I'd be interested to know what you make of them.
soundID didnt really help my sennheiser at all no difference... nx made a difference though
hd280pro
I'd argue you don't ever want a studio that is completely dead. That would be a horrible experience. You want a balance of dead to handle problem areas and a bit of life to lend a natural aspect to the listening experience.
22 minutes of a guy talking.
Should have called the video "What a lot of headphones I've got". Could have been 10 minutes long.
if you dont measure this it is just a model.....
useless in my opinion...