Why F1's Future Engines are a Win for Fans AND Teams
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- čas přidán 27. 05. 2024
- Will F1's 2026 engines bring back the screaming V10 engine noise? With the MGU-H being scrapped and newer fuels being brought in, the future of F1's engines could mean a much louder noise at the track yet again, whilst keeping the benefits of the hybrid era. Matt Kew takes a look at what the rule changes mean for F1, why people want the noise back, and whether or not the changes will actually bring the noise or not.
0:00 F1's Sound Dilemma
0:49 2014's Engine Mistakes
2:17 Reasons for New Engines
3:27 Engine Changes for 2026
4:31 Why V10s Won't Return
#f1 #engine #formula1
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The V6 now is not so bad as it was in 2014. But it will never compare to the V10, even the V8 sounded good.
It was shit in 2014 and is still shit now in 2022, nothing will ever come close to V12 V10 and V8 engines.
@@davidmorton2630 v8 was just whiney sounding I.m.o
The 2014 engines sounded like asthmatic overweight pugs. I agree they are slightly better now.
The V8 is just loud and high pitched. They rev too high too sound as intresting
@@rockzs74r V8s didn't actually rev higher than V10s.
If you ever heard the V12 or V10 live, you’re lucky. I miss that days.
I was lucky to be at the 2002 hungarian gp. I was really young back then (11 yo) but i will never forget when the first engine fired up.
Even the v8 sounds good now 😂
One of the greatest sounds I ever heard was a grid full of V-10s at the USGP at IMS. The front/starting straight at IMS had the garages on one side and huge/tall grandstands on the other and the sound just echoed. In all my years of going to all types of auto races that was the only time I wore earplugs.
Noise is literally wasted energy. Inneficiency. Lack of technology to transform one energy source to another in an efficient manner. Noise is the reflection of a society's barbaric and primitive technology. It's literally wasted resources.
Lewis stopped mid interview when Alonso was driving his 2006 Renault V10… “That is the sweetest sound…” that v10 sounds makes so many people happy
The loud engine noise is a 'trademark' of F1. You cannot simply just ignore that.
Trademark... almost literally. Have you ever seen any ad with the sounds of current cars? Me neither...
@@caparroz1923 lmao, even the 2021 official level On points max and Hamilton final cinematic video has the v10 sound, proving that everyone still wants to hear the iconic sound and that the current sound is just wasn't that appealing
Until F1 E Kicks in at some day 😂👌
I would argue that loudness isn’t so much the trade mark as it is the higher pitch produced by an higher revving engine. It can be 10x louder and still sound as shit as it does
At this point, I'd rather see a spec V-10 engine for all teams, that screams at 20,000 RPM than I would want to see what the manufacturers want. Screw them, they've ruined the sport with their "wet fart sounding" engines. Then, it'd all be just up to the teams to build the fastest chassis they can while staying within the rules box. That would bring back the sound, the competitiveness and be way more interesting.
F1 made their biggest mistake when they decided to start traveling all around the world. The best tracks are the classic European ones and for some unknown reason (apparently), no one knows how to build a track anymore (I'm looking at you Tilke).
F1 went to the hybrid V-6 cars to appease the zealots. The amount of jet fuel burned to get the teams, the cars and all the equipment around the world to all these new locations, dwarfs their old emissions levels, but no one seems to notice that.
Stay in Europe, truck to races, bring back the V-10's that have essentially zero impact on the environment and watch your fans grow!
“We forget how loud they really were”?!?
That loudness is what we want BACK!
"You forget how loud they really were" if u hear those engines. its impossible to forget, thats why people wanted to hear those engine roars. They love it
F1 doing exactly what Blizzard did for World of Warcraft fans. The fans wanted something and the devs just replied with "you think you do, but you don't". (fast forward) they ultimately did do what the fans wanted and it was a massive success.
Braun and F1 are shooting themselves in the foot if they ignore this. The fans truly want that sound, it's visceral.
i really hoped with the new regs they would allow more freedom in engine design. different cylinder configurations and number of cylinders. i wouldve loved to see a porsche flat 6 show up or a renault v10.
Absolutely ! That would be great. But it would be a nightmare to balance. If we were to authorize several configurations, live V6TH, V10 atmo, V8TH, flat 6, etc... It would require a ton of rules to make sure every engine has a similar potential. Each would have its own cylinder size limit, its own rev limit, and other technical limitations. But after all, it's already the case.
@@hugolouessard3914 If GT cars can race each other with different engine configuration, I think it's a matter of time for the FIA to let it happen, though they might end up with teams running the same-ish engine layout like in the Cosworth DFV days
Then what's the point of budget cuts for fair racing?
Stop your daydreams and accept the fact that it will specced
@@everydaydose7779 you do realise theres a seperate budget cap for engine development right? and new manufacturers gets a bonus to it. theyre practically redeveloping the v6 engines they currently use anyway due to the changes in how fuel flow are regulated and how high the engines will rev, its not gonna be a case of the current engines with a new hybrid system.
if they wanted to ive no doubt they could take the technology from the current v6s and adjust it to whatever specification is required.
the aston martin valkyrie was an inline 3 built by cosworth which was scaled up to a v12. they could adopt the same idea for building whichever configuration theyre going for. we are talking about the top level of motorsport
Not gonna happen. Lol. Accept the reality that manufactures are going more and more electric because its what the buying customers wants. Merc, Renault, Audi.
I remember the V10s and I think now that fully sustainable fuel is a thing, the V8s, V10 or maybe even V12s deserve a comeback.
Engine development has to remain relevant to real life applications if F1 wants to keep and gain more engine manufacturers
Penny Reeperbahn
@@victoirclochard Die Jungs von Ferrari sind mir heilig.
@@domestosteron5298 Binotto, diesen Ausdruck kann ich durchaus nicht ab
As he said in the video you can kiss goodbye to ever engine manufacturer if they deside to runa v10 or v12.
I went to the 1992 Adelaide Grand Prix when I was 10 with my dad. The atmosphere was electric. The first car I saw was a Ferrari V12 driven by Jean Alesi. I didn’t have earplugs at the time and the sound was both magical and terrifying. Apparently that v12 engine was actually the weak point of the car, but it sounded amazing. We went every following year until the last one in 1995.
Cap, people over 23 dont exist
@@PerfectlyTrendy44 wtf does cap mean
@@MrBrandonLau nvm, ig you are over 23💀
I was lucky enough to see the turbo cars at Adelaide in 1986. It was terrifying. And I was 19 at the time. Those cars were completely bonkers. 1200+hp in a 550kg car with still quite rudimentary aero, those drivers had massive balls.
Even though the NA cars that came later were louder and revved much higher I still think those 1980s turbo cars sound the best. Certainly the meanest anyway.
@@woopimagpie BMW in bennenton was around 1400 HP in qualifying power to weight ratio of around 3 HP per kilo
Bugatti Veyron I don't even know it's 1 HP per kilogram. You're right they were beasts Gerhard Berger reported wheel spin at 350 KMPH and that was backed up by his fellow teammates.
I don't know if they even hit 350 KMPH today and if they do they certainly aren't spinning wheels at the speed
I happened to be a marshal at the usgp in Austin tx. They did some demo laps in two 2013 McLarens F1 cars with V8 and keys system. We also had some historic F1 cars from the 75-85 where no where near as bad as the V10 in terms of noise but where still loud enough that you could feel them as they went by.
V10 was the best!
Kers? You wrote keys
@@lRedKill3r bjjjobkknj9bb9jihhjj
I was at COTA too and it was cool to hear the 2013 McLarens, even if they weren't being driven flat out.
I was behind our grandstand in the shade when I heard something familiar...
I was also there! And hearing those! man it gave me one of the biggest smiles I ever had in my life. Always had doubts that I would ever hear that but apparently I did!
V12s on tv as a kid, hooked me on the sport. V10s at the track took it to another level. Not just the scream as the cars flew down the Hangar Straight at Silverstone, but the aggressive downshifts in slow corners like Club, where you felt like you were caught in a battlefield crossfire of artillery salvos as the sonorous bangs went down into the track and reverberated off the banks. I used to run from my car to the track on tyre test days, as the F1 cars sounded like fighter jets on wheels. I haven’t been to a Grand Prix since hearing hybrids in 2014.
Cars should sound fast. Formula One, sort it out!
Well said my brother !!
I had the privilege of hearing the v10s and v8s in person.
That is the most thrilling, sensory overload moments I have ever had.
What a disappointment when I first heard the cars on TV at FP1 at the 2014 Australia GP..... Have not really watched F1 with any sort of emotion or excitement since.
Imagine seeing/hearing fighter jets that sound like a drone 😂😂 who the fuck wants to hear that. I remember growing up next to an airbase, the sound of those jets and the boom when going supersonic was the best thing ever lol
@@robertyny092 Exactly! We're heading to a silent future. Makes sense on the sustainability front but...
I went to the USGP in 2004 and the two things I will always remember: How fast those cars could stop and the unbelievably loud howling scream of the V10.
Absolutely... the braking power is always overlooked. Makes the driver want to face plant on every 3 - 5g corner.
V10 with synthetic fuel sounds a better idea 💡
No manufacturers would put money into it though as it wouldn't contribute anything they could pull from and put in their road car programs. It would just be a money sink.
From your lips to God's ears
V10 just isn't good enough to compete, more mass, more heat, more fuel, a V6, v4(an actual v4 not a flat/boxer) is superior.
Bigger engines are long gone, this is the peak of performance, and anything bigger than a v6 is wasting far too much energy for it to be competitive
@@fewik8567 quit beating around the bush and just advocate for single cylinder F1 already. What’s next, steam?
@@NitrousFox well, Formula E already exists.
My favorite is the V10. Absolutely amazing sound!
Fantastic summary of the issues of these heavy, dull Power Units. But loudness isn’t the only problem. Pitch is another big one.
That's why the RPM increase will help too
@@DanielGyimesi It's not that simple I'm afraid.
@@Hello_there_obi it's not that simple, true, but increased rpm does help. Engines in general have higher pitch at high rpm compared to low rpm, granted it is not the biggest factor behind how high pitched it sounds, but it is a factor nonetheless.
The word I think explains it is “timbre.” That’s what gives 4, 5, 6, 8, 10, etc. cylinder engines each their own characteristic sounds. There’s some kind of mathematical/musical aspect to engines that tickle our brains, and some cylinder counts/arrangements more than others, for whatever reason.
the old turbo engines also sounded great despite not having much of a high pitch sound
v10 and v12 was something else in person, it's like a jet fighter flying 5 feet off the ground exciting
We need those iconic super high-revving sounds to come back!
I saw V10 cars at Silverstone in 2004. It wasn't painful, it was a beautiful sensory experience. You could feel the vibrations in your body, especially the downshifts it was like beating your chest with your fist. It evoked far far more emotion and awe than when I saw the V6 cars there again in 2015 and 2018.
Edit - there is CZcams channel that has dubbed trackside footage of the 2022 Ferrari at Imola with V12 and V10 sounds. Strangely, it actually makes it look faster, imo.
I agree, went to Malaysia in 2004 and got a chance to go to the F1 (entrance to the race only for 25€). The moment the engines were started, I got goosebumps. The race was boring but the sound was amazing!
@@inverted_real_it_y What an amazing circuit that was as well. You're very fortunate. Would love to see Sepang back one day.
@@inverted_real_it_y Yes I can roger that went in 1994 to Belgium Francochamps and the moment the first engine fired up goose bumps all over. Never ever had that with any other motor sport.
First time I heard a V10 live was at the US GP at Indy, and when my wife and I were arriving outside the venue, the first free practice was starting, and the sound literally was like it was coming out of the heavens as the cars exited the last turn onto the straight. The symphony of sound was like nothing I’d ever experienced.
I think he means in the pit lane and what not, it's painful for the people directly working with the cars
Removing the MGU-H will not change anything in regards to exhaust sound. It's simply a generator/motor connected to the shaft of the turbo and does not interfere with the exhaust, instead It's the exhaust turbine in the turbo that interferes with the exhaust and muffles the sound, and that's still going to be there in the new power units. Let's hope they will run their engines closer to 15k though :)
Less exhaust energy is being captured though so it could be a bit louder
It's what I've been trying to say all the time. By far biggest difference(compared to the NA V8s of 2013-) was not the number of cylinders, the lower revs or the hybrid generators, but the turbos. Turbos are notorious for muffling exhaust sound in just about every application.
They won't .
Higher revs kill efficiency and reliability. Nobody there wants that.
If the turbo is generating enough inlet manifold pressure (boost), they will open a valve that bypasses the turbo, and let out most of the wonderful noise
the fuel flow is actually being decreased in 2026 this video has it wrong
Seeing seb’s Red 5 FW14B in person, at Silverstone this year. Genuinely brought a tear to my eye
I was at Becketts, what a noise
I can relate !
I was lucky and privileged enough to have been a marshal at the 1992 South African GP.
During one of the practice sessions Nigel Mansell spun out, in this very car, at what was then Nashua corner. The car landed up facing the wrong direction with the back wheels in the gravel and the front wheels still on the track. His practice over as he stalled the car.
Unlike today, there was no SC for such incidents, only yellow flags.
Cutting the long story short, Mansell asked me to get into the car and steer it as it was being pulled in reverse by a recovery vehicle. All the while the other cars were still going around the track at virtually full speed.
What was mind boggling and surreal was sitting in the car facing the other cars coming up towards me at ridiculous speeds and taking the corner 4 or 5 meters in front of me. I got a front row seat at eye level with the other drivers and witness the speed that these machines carry around corners, it's insane stuff, seems almost impossible.
I will never forget that moment, the sight, the smell, the thunderous noise and the vibration I felt from the other cars while sitting in this legend of a car, with Mansell overseeing everything.
So yes, every time I see that car I always feel nostalgic.
The screaming V12, V10 and V8 engines are such a signature thing of F1 that they're hard to forget
I totally miss that wail from those V10s, when they pushed over 20k rpm. those days!!
V10 by far the best!
The V10s never hit over 20k rpm actually. However the V8s did back in 2006.
@@minecraftveteran7410 yeah, I think the V10's got to 16?
@@Bryan-jd7os It was probably around 19 or more. But I don't remember anymore so...
@@minecraftveteran7410 awesome
As someone who’s only been into f1 for like 4-5 years now, I honestly kinda like the sound of the v6, but I understand the scream/sound of the v10 and v12 engines. Just videos alone they sound amazing I can only imagine hearing them in person
I grew up in the V10 era and honestly the hybrids don't sound anywhere near as bad as people claim, especially not nowadays. That being said i think this is a move in the right direction. F1 shouldn't be noisy for the sake of being noisy, but if you can make it more spectacular for the fans AND more appealing for car manufacturers this can only be a good thing.
I've seen many people complain about how the new regulations will make everything even worse, but the people who complain the most get the most attention. That doesn't make their opinions anymore valid or correct.
@@kennedyshotfirst2534 the hybrid whirr will be alot louder in 2026 because the battery will be twice as powerful. the cars will sound like demons, like the porsche 919.
@@gherbo1609 Are they really gonna sound that much better? Good.
@@kennedyshotfirst2534 without the mgu-h you can think of an engine sounds similar to the 80's turbo engines, with a more open and screamy sound
@@luizansounds I don't know what they sounded like in the turbo era. I'm gonna watch some old onboards to know what to expect.
what is not heard very often is a comparison with the 1500cc turbo cars of the 1980's - which were also quieter than the 3000cc normally apsirated cars, but popped and banged very loudly into corners.
They also tended to explode randomly and keep things interesting 😆
@@patrickcannady2066 Ha ha yes. I'm in the crowd somewhere for this clip czcams.com/video/vWpZw2h4-jQ/video.html
I heard them up close in Detroit 1986. They were extremely loud and angry sounding, nothing like on TV.
oldschool turbos with big wastegates are outrageously loud and aggressive, no sure what you're talking about
@@lanesplitter8723 So I would have been between Stowe and Club on the Silverstone Raceway. As the cars accelerated out of Stowe corner the Turbo cars were way quieter than the NA cars - until they lifted off for Club corner at which point the popping and banging of the turbo cars was ear shattering.
At the end of the day, F1 is show for spectators. A HUGE part of the experience is/was the sound. The sound from a single v10 excites almost all people more than a full grid of v6s. F1 lost a huge part of the spectacle in 2014.
From the very beginning, F1 has not just been a show for spectators
@@discbrakefan f1 100 percent doesn't exist without the spectators. What f1 started as, is very very different to what it is now, as is the world in which it exists. What's your point?
@@deanjdk F1 also doesn’t exist without the manufacturers and teams. And they aren’t purely there for milking money from spectators.
@@discbrakefan yea but the original point was, f1 is literally only a thing because of spectators. What it was in the beginning is completely different to what it is now. A group of blokes can build a few chassis and put whatever engines in them and go racing with nobody watching and call it whatever they like. The point is, that f1, as a sustainable model, exists 100 percent because people will watch it and that benefits marketing (along with other benefits such as technology r&d etc) . Manufacturers see racing as "win on Sunday, sell on Monday". If people arnt spectating, they dont bother.
The current hybrid era (2014-2026) has the most high performance engines ever in terms of performance and efficiency. But they are so expensive and there is no correlation with road cars, so we can't see them often. But the new 2026 engine regulations are so restricted on what you can do and not that probably they'll be quite similar to the others, and it would not be good to see. At least all the teams are in f1 for communicating their brands, solutions and performances...
But a V10 is in correlation with road cars?
@@vivolimo1137 it could be, with less emissions and more sostuinable fuels. Or with and hydrogen system
@@vivolimo1137 A V8 is.
I beg your pardon....Ferrari did put out a production car with an F1 derived hybrid drive......if my memory is correct it was either the La Ferrari or the F1.....
@@vivolimo1137 Yes, BMW made a V10 M5 and V10 M6.
I watched the 2012 and 2013 silverstone gp trackside when I was 13 and 14. I can tell you now it was not painful, it was amazing
tbf you were still young
The v8 noise was to weed out the weak fans
@@theracingban that would mean more sensitive ears, if I was fine without ear plugs then others it wasn’t fine for can put them in and be ok
@@alexdummer9172 as a kid you don't mind the sound but as you get older it's start getting a little too much not to say the cars don't sound amazing they do ofcoarse but I could see why someone wouldn't like 8clyinders revving at 18krpm
@@theracingban there is a variety of ear defender solutions which help limit the intensity of the noice whilst still allowing you to enjoy it, much better to please the large number of people who don’t need that and to help supply those that do need it
I remember going to F1 races when i was a child in 1993 and 1996. Hungaroring and A1 Ring (now Red bull Ring). We were not even close to the track when we already could hear this incredible noise. Now i go to air shows for this experience 😂
Straight five wouldn’t be a bad idea smaller engine, Rev it to 14,15k it would sound quite good
The original plan for 2014 was a switch to turbocharged inline 4s but it was vetoed by Ferrari because the engine wouldn’t be able to be a stressed member, requiring a space frame
@@theocousins6386 thank God for ferrari doing something right once in a full moon
@@tosehoed123 The expression is once in a blue moon. Once a full moon would be doing something right once a month.
Having heard the V6 and V8 cars, the V6 don’t even necessarily have to be louder (although that would be nice), they just need better tone which a turbocharged engine can have
It's precisely the turbo that is killing the exhaust note. Turbochargers are extremely efficient mufflers.
@@lLpars Of course I agree and I’d 100% want no more turbochargers, I was just saying as far as turbocharged cars go I’ve heard much better turbo race cars in my life than the F1 cars, so if they have to keep the turbos I think it would have the potential to sound much better
I went to Montreal in 2004 and Budapest last year. The sensory experience was vastly different. I really prefer the higher reving engines. I love hearing the high pitched engines screaming when they were at the opposite side of the track.
The engines now are not so bad this year, but good to see them dropping the MGU-H.
For me, the thing that makes the most difference is the weight of the cars now. You can see how lazy they are in the corners compared to even 6 years ago where they were ~100kg lighter. Lighter cars make a hell of a difference. Faster acceleration and later braking. Good for the fans.
I don't get why they insist on using heavy ass hybrid engines. Either go back to NA or supercharge a V8.
Because OEMs need to at least make it appear like the tech is relevant
Didn't they say that the electric motor is gonna deliver about 50% of the power? I don't know if they will make the engines work much harder becuase they also said that the engines are going to deliver about 500 hp instead of the current 800hp...
Yep. 350kW for the new electric system, up from 120kW. 350kW ~= 450HP. And the ICE will only get 70kg of fuel for a race.
I won’t be surprised if the new ICEs are quieter.
current engines actually make about 1000
The main problem is the fact the battery capacity will remain the same with one less method of regenerating energy (MGU-H will be gone). It will be impossible for these new gen car to be anywhere near the current pace of F1 I’m not okay with that.
Nothing winds me up more than SkySports dub the V8 on the intro 😤😤
I thought I was the only one that hates that😂
I must be one off the few 80s babies who isn’t that fussy about less engine noise( for one you hear the grandstands far more) …… I’m far more interested in can the cars overtake and race in the dry ( normally yes) and in the full wet weathers ( increasing no) fixing that would make me far more happy!
Same here. The only things I want from the new engines are for them to be lighter and a lot more powerful. Seems we'll be lucky just to shed a bit of weight by the look of things. Overall disappointed.
Me too I do miss the noise no doubt, but if the cars can race closer and can overtake without ers & DRS I would rather have that tbh.
i'd have to agree with that. what's the point of having beautiful sounds but ugly races.
so balancing between the two things is the key.
Tbh i kinda glad that i started watching f1 in 2020 (trust me i'm not a dts fans) so i don't really mind about the v6 sound
The v6 sound is great and if it wasn’t in the same sport as the old v10’s and v8’s people would probably find it an iconic sounding engine.. as you said, I’d rather have better racing than louder engines
The V6 “isn’t that bad”
But only once the wastegates open.
My favourite engine era is the v12 era, still sounded like an engine off throttle, but was loud and revvy. Plus they had manual boxes which gave it an added factor. I’m confident that even with a turbo these V6’s can do similar
The removal of the MGU-H would do little to improve the sound I suspect? The MGU-H was driven off the shaft from the same turbine that spools the compressor so you still have the muffling egfect from the turbo in the 2026 engine. The only difference is that the wastegates will now spend more time open than they do currently where the keep them closed for the MGU-H to charge the battery. That's a big efficiency lost for the charging. I also not sure the combustion engines will be working harder to maintain the 1000bhp given the MGU-K is to be more powerful in 2026. The ICE will work harder in terms of fuel consumption but probably produces relatively less power than it currently does if the stick to 1000bhp
It's true that the removal of MGU-H will result in a louder engine sound, but we must remember that the turbocharger still recovers energy from the exhausted gases. So, the sound itself won't return to NA levels...
Turbo engines can sound good though. Just the MGU-H neuters even that. He described how the MGU-H makes power inaccurately. What it actually does is is turn the turbo into an electrical generator when at full boost and when it's not at full boost, it is kept spun up by the electrical motor inside the turbo to prevent turbo lag. Basically, the turbo never changes rpm and there isn't much need for big blow off valves that make turbos sound good. The 2026 regs will make turbos sound how they should again, and will have the added benefit of being harder for the drivers to go as fast as easily.
Also, the way the MGU-H works is inherently why no road car will ever need it. It's only effective when under full throttle at full boost, and that isn't what a road car is designed to do, nor will it be legal. Plus the added benefit of no turbo lag is unnecessary in a road car, because throttle response simply isn't what a efficient road car needs to have. That's only for racing purposes.
@@ChefofWar33 they can’t ever sound good because most of the sound that these NA cars made came from the intake and not from the exhaust. The high pitch scream cannot be reproduced without natural aspiration.
@@ChefofWar33 the direction where rules are going is still efficiency, that's why I think engineers will find a way to use every Joule of energy recovered from the turbo. This means, for me, that blow off valves will be there but won't be used for as much time as possible: if you think about it, nowadays there is a Wastegate, but how often is it used during a lap?
@@AlessioLabbe The wastegate is not used much because the MGU-H acts like a wastegate by limiting the turbo rpm by adding the load to charge the battery. Probably is only really used when MGU-H is failing or pressure us too high. Hopefully the new design will be more like the indycar engine with more power.
Whats often over looked is we used to be able to hear the car's traction levels and also hear an engine going bad way before it lets go. Miss those days
I don't care how they do it, i just want that sound again...:')
Remember hearing the v10 at Imola as a child and will never forget that noise. Shame it’s never coming back
Ngl, I know they don't compare to the old engines but the TH v6 sound has grown on me.
The cars do sound way better now than in 2014 so it can only improve from now on
Let’s see
I see their point in the hybrid tech with the V6 engines... But I don't go to an F1 race to be impressed with how quiet and efficient the engines are. I go to an F1 race to hear the scream of 20,000 RPM in a V10 and watch the best drivers in the world go neck and neck. Man, hearing the V10s in person was to this day one of the most insane sensory moments of my life. You could literally feel the cars drive by lol.
I’ll never forget hearing and feeling in my chest the McLaren M8D being revved. A 7-Litre V8 monster Can Am. It’s hard for any video to do it justice, the emotion and feeling it gives you in real life.
It’s strange seeing race cars in a museum. They all have a distinct sound and aggression yet they sit there silent on display.
Make F1 engines and exhaust notes great again
Hybrid v10s would be nice. If they aren't going to go back to v10s, they should start a smaller series where people race v10s in sprint races with slicks. Sub-elite or retired drivers could participate.
V10 by F1, is my favorite song.
Typically a V6 engine can sound really good. The main reason it sounds horrible in the F1 car is because they restrict many things in the engine like the V angle, the number of turbos.
I think they should just give designer more freedom to do their hybrid engine since we have a budget cap in place now, just use cap as the limiter for their power unit development.
Turbos kill exhaust sound. The eye-piercing screaming effect will not come back even if the revs go up, because turbochargers are by nature an extremely efficient muffler.
I started watching F1 in 2020 so I sadly didn't get to hear the beautiful sounds of the V12 and V10 cars that everyone else in F1 community knows and love. I hope 2026 engines can bring back the loudness of these cars!
There are plenty of videos on CZcams on past eras including the V10'S
There's Boss GP, look it up
If you're lucky, they're racing on a circuit not too far from you
I went on a 3 hour drive to TT Assen, it wasn't just the F1 cars but also different racing series the whole day, there was food, markets and stuff, it was a great day for me
I got to hear the Toro Rosso STR1 V10 fly by past along with other V8s, it was awesome
It’s a win for optics. Teams don’t want it, fans CERTAINLY don’t want it
Went to Miami GP this year. My first in person F1 experience. I only needed my ear plugs for the Porsche races. Still had a great time.
When the V8's or V10's come back I'll actually go to a race
The turbo will still be muffling the exhaust even without mgu-h, although the waste gate will be open more often.
Got the chance to hear the last of the V10s back in 2005 at Sepang. Those were the days.
I live near Monza and during the Grand Prix you could clearly hear the cars during the whole weekend zooming on the track from kilometers away, even with the windows shut.
Since they switched to the V6 Hybrid I have to say its been much much quieter. You can now sort of hear the cars, but you need to pay attention.
I kinda miss hearing the zooming sound for the whole weekend
Seen Through Glass did a piece on alternative fuels recently. The company he worked with now supports an entire racing series, it would be cool if F1 did this and brought back v8/10/12s
What I’m most interested in is how the teams will get around the turbo lag without the MGU-H. It’s gonna be very interesting to see which manufacturer comes out on top
ever heard about a blow off valve/waste gate?
Definitely more antilag sounds, cars are probably gonna sound mean off throttle
Would be cool if the blown diffuser comes back.
@@eco_logic Blow-off valves neutralize manifold air pressure when the throttle is closed and wastegates divert exhaust gases away from the turbine to control boost pressure. Neither of them really have any effect on turbo lag in the same way things like an anti-lag system, twin-scroll turbos, hybrid turbos, and variable geometry turbos do.
@@DesuchanSugoi the blow off lowers the back pressure in the manifold letting the turbo spin freely ready for the next pressure build up instead of unnecessary slowing down the freely spinning turbo to a useless stand still.
I'm honestly not bothered with the sound, as long we get good racing I couldn't careless but personally wasn't a fan of the a screaming V10 and V8. Give me a DFV any day.
True. They sound great on flybys and revs
But during a whole GP its just overkill
The drivers has to endure that hearing loss
@@everydaydose7779 Drivers are the most vocal about wanting the old screaming engines back
I've been lucky enough to hear and see a V10 McLaren F1 car up close, there is nothing like it. The V10 can exist again.
Very well made video 👏
Much as I’d love some noisy V8 back, my REALISTIC hope is that future cars at least don’t sound worse than what they do now.
We’ve improved them a large amount compared to to those very early hybrids; and much as we prefer full ICUs these machines DO have their own unique sound - which is also striking a decent balance between entertaining and allowing us to actually hear driver & team comms!
It's what I always say when this subject is brought up. We will never again have screaming F1s because never again will we have naturally aspirated engines. F1's main goal nowdays is push for efficiency, and turbochargers drastically increase efficiency of ICEs. Unfortunately they are also extremely efficient exhaust mufflers.
F1 using the mgu-h is definitely not a make or break barrier to entry for engine manufacturers. Audi and porsche both worked with garrett in the early 2000s to spearhead the development of the e-turbo for use in lemans. It's all politics. Ferrari has used garrett since 2014 as their turbo supplier in f1 and much of the work on the audi porsche projects went into the development of that turbo. An f1 engine program is very expensive, mgu-h or not. Anyone complaining about the mgu-h just doesn't want to play ball. The tech drastically improves the efficiency of the engine and is one of the few areas f1 can actually have a trickle down technology. Moving away from mgu-h tech is stupid.
I remember the 2000 and 2001 french grand prix, I went there as a spectator.
The noise, the vibrations... My whole body shook. The sound was diabolical.
You never really get a feel on TV or on the best audio system. The first passage is always a surprise, everyone looks at each other in disbelief. It distorts the air like a black hole bends space time. The whole ground shakes. It's like a thunder, ears are saturated, the speed is neck breaking.
You can tell me how much today's sound is better than 2014, still, it's absolute zero compared to what it used to be. I quit watching F1 in 2014, I was bored with Vettel, Schumi just had his accident, and the sound was gone. F1 was dead to me, until 2015-2016 when I picked it back up.
F1 now is cool. Alot of drama, exceptionnal drivers, and overall a good show. 2021 felt like the good old F1 I fell in love with. But still. The sound is missing. It's missing atrociously.
I remember asking myself back in the 2000's, "how long is this F1 gonna last for ? What is it going to be like in 20 years ?" I was fully aware I was living a golden era of some sort.
So I’m pretty sure that the new engines are supposed to make less power not more with more focus on the mgu k power output
They failed even harder by not allowing Andretti to join. The 2014 rules were a fucking pointless waste of time, money, and resources.
They can say what they want, but everytime I watch one of the old races I think "Holy shit, that sound was so beautiful". It kinda like taking away crowd screaming after scoring goal in football.
The best winning sound is to bring back the 3.0L naturally aspirated V10's!
I just want them to race well, the sound is way down the list for me
Casual.
@@papafoundry5537 if you watch f1 for the noise, then just watch nascar or hillclimb or rally instead. those have epic car sounds and the racing is fully neglected so it would be perfect for you
@@papafoundry5537 you’re not a fan of racing you’re a fan of engines lmao
@@papafoundry5537 foolish comment
You are a little cat not to say something else
Maybe F1 can also bring back refueling with standardized equipment so cars can get lighter and smaller. Plus there is an extra strategical aspect to make races more interesting
Meaning that 95% of all overtakes will happen in pits. F1 was super boring in refuelling days.
Funny, just heard a Crowdstrike ad on satellite radio today that played racing sounds from everything other than the modern era F1 car. LOL, glad I’m not the only one who catches that as well.
In the entire history of F1, nothing quite compares to the screaming V-10 era. I love low rumbling roar of the early days, but those V-10's were a symphony of power and glory.
I will never get over it for me F1 sound is a big miss.
Yeah, although it wasn't as good as the V12 and way less than the godlike screaming V10, the V8 of 2006-2013 was very good. When 2014 started, it was shoking !!! The sound was so awful... Thankfully they made it better with a few adjustments.
If you compare a 2014 turbo hybrid engine with a 2022 one, they have improved a lot ! I really hope that in 2026, they'll be much better.
@@hugolouessard3914 the 2018-2020 mercedes and honda onboards sound great imo, if you stop the comparisons with the v10s, which ofcourse were incredible.
For me, the most important part of the appeal of being an F1 fan is getting to learn about all the interesting technical details of the cars. F1 is about technical innovation, performance, and precision engineering. Moving back to an older, simpler engine design because it's louder feels totally antithetical to that. (To be clear, I know that's not what they're doing in 2026, I'm responding to the part close to the end where he raised the idea of just going back to v10s just with the new sustainable fuel.)
I feel the same about the innovation being one of the best parts of the sport but i can’t help but feel that f1 is more interested in being similar to road cars than going fast. So it innovation is a secondary focus either way I’d rather get to hear a roaring v10 than a vaccum cleaner
@@ripmrkrabs6581 I mean, I guess I get it at some level. I don't have the nostalgia factor as I didn't get into F1 until after 2014. When I heard a comparison of the different engine sounds over the years for the first time, I honestly didn't get it at all, because you couldn't really hear the relative volume of the different sounds in the video I watched and the older ones just sounded more high-pitched and whiney to me. But as I've heard more of the older engine sound I'm starting to understand the appeal. I just personally don't think that the sound should be a significant deciding factor in the design of the engine regulations.
I wanna see the 2002 Ferrari in person so bad. Definitely a bucket list item if I get the opportunity.
I've witnessed a lot of racing over the last forty years, V8 & V10 F1 cars, indy cars,drag racing, 2 stroke GP bikes etc etc but 2 engines stand out above the others (top fuel engines excepted) and they are the V16 1500cc BRM for it's blood curdling howl but for volume nothing came close to the 1960's MV Agusta 500cc triple, that thing was insanely loud even when it was on the far side of the circuit at Goodwood.
For various reasons, V6's (and inline3's) inherently produce a less pleasant sound than other configurations. For a 90 degree, direct injected, turbocharged V6 to sound pleasant, it has to to rev really high, in my personal opinion. And even so, it can struggle against an inline 4 or an inline 5.
Manufacturers are using inline 4's. Ok then. Let's give them a low displacement, turbocharged, high revving inline 4. We can chase efficiency in other ways. A cap on peak BHP, limiting the capacity of the fuel tank even further, limiting the weight of the PU, etc. However, allow teams to flow as much fuel as they want, and rev the engines to higher RPM's.
Inline 6s can sound beautiful though. Ever heard a 2JZ Supra ripping through the gears? It's amazing.
@@ChefofWar33 Inline 6's usually sound really good. The problem is that not a lot of OEM's prefer them.
BMW will dominate with inline 6.
2 litre v8 turbo hybrid
Well done, simple video.
0:42 thank you for mentioning this! 😅
You hit the nail in head, the fact that they have to throw in the sound of a v8 or v10 in the advertisement says it all.
2026 will still be V6 turbos? With substainable fuel the engine should be NA V8s again
This video taking about the mgu-h muffler is deleted and the engine will sound more but the turbo is still there
manufacturers will want to rev up the engines more than they are to maximise performance. i assume they will sound a tad bit better but not quite like the "f1 sound".
@@lmaomoofeq2505 if that’s the case, it’s a step forward towards what the fans want. Not a big one, but something…
@@sandalogaming6766 agreed
The fans are the consumers. Without us there is no F1. The V12s are awesome. When you hear one you never forget it. Brawn is just sucking up to the manufacturers.
I'm not sold on the idea that the 2026 rules will be louder or rev higher. Or the cars be more spectacular.
The fuel flow is being reduced by roughly 1/3. That means roughly 1/3 less air flow. And the exhaust still goes through a turbine. The current PUs are ~800-850hp without the MGUK, the new ones will be about 550hp.
Also, the current PUs do run at times with wastegates open, such as in overtaking mode.
The fuel flow is being measured in MJ/h for 2026, but it still has the same constraints - the fuel flow varies in proportion with rpm to 10,500rpm, after which it is constant. So expect the engine operating range to be very similar to today's.
The MGUK has been increased in size, but the battery remains the same capacity. Deployment per lap is unlimited, which means that it is constrained by how much can be recovered per lap. Braking won't be enough to get the maximum amount of recovery, so that means they will have to generate by lifting and coasting, or by burning fuel to drive the MGUK.
Theoretically the PU will have a maximum power of 1,000hp, but it looks unlikely that would be achieved for very long during a lap, certainly not the same amount as the current PU.
The 2026 PU is to be the same minimum weight as the current PU, so little weight saving, or at all, for the car. Which is one of the big problems with the current cars.
The power levels and energy flows of the 2026 rules are very similar to mid 2010s LMP1. Very much designed around getting Porsche and Audi.
Couldn’t agree more with this
How anyone can’t see the engines about to be a lot less powerful with potential turbo lag I don’t know but they’re drinking the video Kool aid smh
You’re gonna have 800+ kg cars being powered by 550hp engines for the most part which will be so so slow
@@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1 Part of th e"excitement" is supposed to be the turbo lag, but I'm sure the 470hp electric motor will compensate for that. And Mostly that is what the electric motor will do.
@@waynec3563 And the issue with the MGU-K as well is we currently at 1/3 levels for what they’re asking for 2026 with a limited deployment time and we struggle already with 1 lap charging etc due to there not being enough brake zones to recoup energy
I don’t know how they think we are gonna anything close to the 470HP they think they can get consistently
@@RANDOMZBOSSMAN1 Current deployment from the battery at full MGUK power is 33s. For 2026 it will be 25s (assuming the full allowance can be recovered over the lap).
And that deployment will last only 11s before the battery is empty and needs recharging.
The V6s of today don’t sound bad at all, they’ve got their own character, they bellow and howl, the V8s and V10s roar and scream. It’s the nostalgia factor that makes people go starry-eyed at the V10s and V8s. I think they’ve struck a great balance here, they’ve succeeded in getting Audi on board, so we now have 5 power unit makers and even in recent years, the noise has improved from 2014.
But if I had to pick one style of engine in the 2000s for noise alone, I’d have to say it’s the V8s. The V10 is too high-pitched screamy for me, not enough roar, the V8s have that perfect balance between a scream and a roar.
I have no nostalgia for v8s or v10s since I started watching during the 2016 season and I still think current V6s sound way worse than them. At least it's gotten better since the horrible 2014 engines
Ah yes, who doesn't love the high pitched noise of a electric motor spooling up.
*Jetsons noises*
You missed one huge point, the MGU-K will be making more hybrid energy than ever before in F1... So I doubt these will be louder, plus there is still the turbo... What I do expect, is maybe a slightly more raw sound. But on a serious point, these engines are still loud, over a race they still leave punters at their exposure limits...
Back in 2011,My parents were at a hotel somewhere in the city during the Singapore GP and they could hear the screaming V8s of those f1 cars and me personally I want the v8 to come back but with sustainable fuel,turbo and some hybrid system
What these engines have going for themselves is that they're astounding. They have the displacement of an ordinary car and yet produce close to 800 bhp.
They had more power per cc in the 1980s though. BMW had approx 1400bhp from a 1.5l. even in lowest race spec they had about 1000bhp.
That was astonishing power for the car at the time that had no traction control, a manual gearbox etc. 1000bhp of today is far too easy for the aero and chassis. The cars only get exciting in the wet.
@@jonathanbowen3640 Yes but the BMW was capable of doing so for two laps, if they were lucky. These engines, unless they're Ferrari branded can last for race, sprint races, quali and practice sessions. All while consuming a third of the fuel of older ICEs in the sport.
Also the cars of today have no traction control either, the main reason apart from tires that you could see the cars sliding was turbo lag, which limited the peak power of the car in a small area around the redline.
@@TheZanzaroni that's what I mentioned the 1000bhp of race spec. Which is still higher than the larger engines of today.
I'm not sure I agree that oversteer was caused only by turbo lag. There were other similarly powerful NA (albeit larger) engines they would slide around a lot more that today at various eras of the sport.
I never said that the cars of today have traction control. Only that the cars of that era did not. Current F1 cars don't even need traction control. There is so much mechanical and aero grip. In the dry at least.
The main point is sure the engines are obviously more economica, efficient etc but they are not more exciting or impressive.in fact they have gone backwards. Almost No one cares about efficiency or fuel type etc. They are not actually any more powerful than they were almost 50years ago. That a staggering almost half a century.. Plus the cars are heavier now. So power to weight has gone down!! Safer sure. But better tracks would have sorted much of that.
The reality of F1 cars of today is that they are not cutting edge they are not particularly high performance given what they should be capable of and this is due to regulations and weird management. Really what they should be is multiple thousands of horsepower no driver aids. Rwd. Then every race would be like a wet race. Drivers struggling, drifting spinning. Cars always visibly on the limit. Perfect. Get the drivers working the car properly and make driving more complex.
I'm not impressed by these power untis at all from an aesthetic, technical or philosophical point of view. They dont sound good, the cars crucially all have the same spec so they all sound the same also! You can go and buy a road car with similar power an off the shelf Ferrari sf90 is more powerful than an F1 car and comes with decent mpg, low emissions normal fuel, perfectly reliable for a few hundred thousand £or$.
@@jonathanbowen3640 You already mentioned the counter arguments to your points. The lack of seeing cars visibly on the limit is caused, apart from turbo lag, from the increased mechanical, aero compared to 50 years ago.
You also have to think about having such powerful engines, means. It is true that the SF90 has similar *peak* performance to an F1 car, but its engine, especially the hybrid components are not up to spec to the workload of a race car. Comparing fuel consumption of a road/race car is also something that requires a lot of guessing, at best.
Having engines with 2000-3000+HP also compromises the sport itself, in the simplest form, they will be more expensive in the long run to produce/replace and I don't see Haas wanting to buy another engine every 2 weekends. Then, as you said from a safety POV the cars will need to be much much better and I don't see how a better track can stop a car going at 350+ km/h safely, unless the runoff is comparable to Paul Ricard's. This along with the fact that the engine will be much larger will increase the cars' size and weight even more and hurt the racing even more.
That is before mentioning that there will be little to no interest from an engine manufacturer for the development of a powertrain that has little to no commercial value. The technology F1 currently employs is on the limit of (current, as always) possibility and some of it may, some day actually find itself in some other field.
It is nice to be able to go to a GP and not need heavy duty ear protection. The cars still sound impressive as hell just not so loud that you can't hear the person next to you
For me the problem is they all sound the same as each other. They are essentially all running the same engine configuration. They all look too similar also. Like watching a film where all the characters have the same personalities. Not intriguing.
'A win for Fans' is a massive overstatement.
Last Saturday I was in Imola for the Finali Mondiali Ferrari.
Customer F1 were running for two times. There was also a recent V6 (don't know the year) and....the emotional side was ridiculous compared to the other F1s (v12, v10,v8)
We want noise !!!
I actually prefer the sound of the current hybrid engine compared to the pre-hybrid era engines. Especially the low growl of the Honda. Also, I think it's kind of a pity that the mgu-h didn't turn out the way we hoped...
Also, I fully agree with Brawn that just having a sustainable fuel in an old engine is not enough. Even if a fuel is sustainable, we still need efficiency because it equal mileage for consumer cars...
No we don't. Combustion engine cars are rapidly going away.
This illusion that F1 has some amazing tech transfer to consumer cars need to end.
I bet you like the new M3
What would be really efficient would be not racing at all.
Efficiency really isn't exciting.
"At the end of the day F1's message is clear" Yeah their message is F%@# The Fans...
Poor baby… “they don’t sound like they did before the hybrid engines” -you
The engine sound is irrelevant because the sound doesn’t win races. Get over it, princess…
@@LilSebastian_ Irrelvant to you maybe not everyone else. The sport only exists because of fans. Go watch Formula E
Can always muffle the noise in pits etc, like volume selector also effects performance. And when DRS the screaming goes V8 kevel. F1 needs some loudness like 2005-2010 era.
Yes let the teams choose either V8/10/12 engines, running synthetic fuels, and small capacitor hybrid units for instant torque…
The v6 doesn’t sound too bad. I’d like there to be a bit more variety though. Maybe they could let them run a couple of different designs. One of my favorite things about watching the Goodwood Festival of Speed every year is the amazing variety of engines making the run up the hill.
What ever happens to F1 would greatly affect the future of ICE, F1 cannot exist without the sound of their engine, going electric would just make it Formula E
Formula E1
In the long run, ICE don't have a future.
You can't beat the 3.5 litre motors. The RS V10 3.5 Renault was the bomb. R.I.P. the sounds of the V8s, V10s and the Ferrari V12s
The ICE part of the 2026 engine is only going to be c550bhp, a step down from now (with the balance made up for by increasing battery size). Even with the removal of the mguh, i cant see it making a big difference.
i started watching f1 in 2011, i miss the v8s, but at the same time i want the cars to be the absolute pinacle of performance, like they were in 2020, but idk why no one thought abt hybrid v8s and v10s, that would probably be a better idea
size + weight. They would have gone smaller (v4) if teams didn't want the engine as a structural component. V6 is about the sweet spot.