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Scholars of the South Tigris - Just Played!
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- čas přidán 1. 02. 2023
- We just played Scholars of the South Tigris, and we have some initial thoughts on its weight, and just how satisfying it is to play. And as always, we'll give you an idea of who we think this game is for, and who it might not be for. Does this second in their new trilogy differentiate itself? Let's find out!
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You guys did a fantastic job with this first video. You hit all the key mechanical beats. Thanks so much for the kind words!
Sam! Thanks so much for watching it. I think you really knocked this one out of the park. I played it again with Emily tonight--had a great time, and then a fascinating conversation about "weight of games" while comparing this with Wayfarers. The theme and the mechanisms in Scholars just sing in a way I haven't seen in many other heavier games. Thanks again for making yet another great game!
@@meeple That's really cool to hear. I'm pleased that you are having a great time with this game, and that the mechanics come together as a cohesive whole for you.
@@sammacdonald337looks great!
Thanks for the video. Pumped to see it land on KS in March.
You mentioned Shem a couple times, but please make sure you give Sam his flowers too. This is a team effort between Shem and Sam in the design.
That’s good to point out, thank you
Glad to see this comment. I came to point it out too.
This is going to be an instant back for me. Love all their games for different reasons. Including the Circadian's line. I had heard from Shem that Scholars came first in design and they pulled Wayfarers from this. I can see how that was done.
Really?! That's interesting to hear. The color manipulation of the dice in this game is so satisfying and crunchy, I can imagine why they wanted to slot this second in the trilogy. Can't wait to see what they have next.
I love how fast this goes from "you take the cards over here, move them over here, and then bring them down here" to "this is the heaviest, brain-burniest game of them all!" Looking forward to more content on this one.
Yeah the theme makes it seem simple but then you get into the mechanics of HOW and it gets wild!
Insta back for me. I have to say, Garphill Games has become my favorite publisher. I think the only game I don't have is Raiders of Sythia and Shipwrights of the North Sea. I even went ahead and got Circadian's first light as I backed the recent Kickstarter despite my distaste for the art. The gameplay is fantastic.
Interestingly enough to hear that Paladins is the heavier game of the West Kingdom series. I actually had trouble grasping Viscounts but after several plays though, it has been a joy. Paladins I got right away. Wayfarers is kind of up there for me in weight. Scholars definitely looks a bit heavier. So looking forward to this campaign.
Yeah, they're killing it game after game. And let's not forget about one of my favorite (and heaviest) roll & writes, Hadrian's Wall! 😁
As someone who playtested this game I can say that it's very easy to grasp and it gets even easier after a game or two. The actions are really interesting and the decisions are really crunchy. All in all a very fun experience and there are more strategies than it seems on the first few plays of it.
I already played wayfarers 10 times and I can't wait to get this game to the table. Also looking forward to testing inventor soon I hope.
The colour melding reminds me of Vindication but with dice
I mentioned the same thing to Ryan. I think that’s the only other game I can recall with color merging like this, but a very different game of course.
Great video! I like the look of this game on the table and it sounds like it isn't that heavy in mechanisms but very heavy in thinking through the tactics & strategy. I love games that don't base their complexity in just adding more mechanisms, so this sounds like good brain-melting fun👍
The way you summed it up is on the money. Smooth play, but thinky as heck!
I can't wait for this one, looks like it will top Wayfarers for me. Garphill just keeps making games that are just perfect for me.
I like Wayfarers quite a bit, but yeah, this one will almost certainly top it for me.
I was already looking for to this game, but your coverage of the game has ramped up that excitement. I love the West Kingdom games and Wayfarers may be better. Thank you for this video. I’ll be backing this on day 1.
I love that their theme seems to come through a lot more with the South Tigris series than the West Kingdom games.
The theme in this one really comes through, as the core concept is built around the theme through and through.
So good. This game plays well from solo all the way to 4p. It also gets much faster with a few plays under your belt. Not uncommon for 4p games to take two hours and 2p games to take an hour. Solo is also VERY GOOD!
Good to hear! I'll be playing it again tonight hopefully, so I'll see if I can shave off some playtime--not that I minded it at all with this one. 😁
Stoked for this game. Great coverage! Looking forward to Round One
Looking forward to this. I love Wayfarers so much, that I think I have to get this just for that reason alone. Thanks guys!
Hope you enjoy it!
I love simple turns with lots of depth. How’s the rules overhead? Are there any rules that might be hard to remember?
I don't think so. As long as players don't get ahead of themselves, it should be pretty error-free I think.
We loved Wayfarers so much, we can’t wait until this comes out! Looks SO very good. Thanks for the video!
this looks great i love the idea of translating the scrolls that's really cool.
It's really fun, and the theme of what you're doing really can be felt.
@@meeple I just wish Garphil would slow down and let me appreciate one brilliant game at a time. I'm only still playing Wayfarers ;)
@@noobsandnerds6978 Ha! That's fair.
Visually speaking, this one looks less intimidating than wayfarers (although wayfarers looked very pretty). The theme is awesome. If it’s brain burning and streamlined I’m excited, if it’s brain burning AND complicated, might have to wait and see what the 3rd in the series is lol
I think you'll dig it. To me that's exactly how to put it. It's a little brain-burning, but structurally not complicated (less so on that front than Wayfarers).
Looking forward to this game so much!!!!
Rightfully so.
Ooh damn excited by this one! Cheers guys!
Thanks!
We've bought this as a challenge to work up to, because we are only really just getting into the more complicated games, but you mentioned that previous Garphil games might have prepared you for this game. We'll be getting Wayfarer's at the same time, which of the other Garphil Games would you recommend we look at to help build our knowledge and capability to be able to play these when they arrive?
Thanks for a great overview. I have to say, my tastes are moving toward lighter games these days, but it’s so unusual to find a truly new way of doing dice manipulation with so many games with that mechanic out there. Decisions, decisions! 😊
My tastes are like a roller coaster - I loving light games one day, and then a heavier game like this comes along. I'm all over the place.
@@meeple Haha! It’s often for me what I have the energy for. The beauty of the hobby is that there’s an amazing choice out there - something for every mood or occasion. 😀
There was a point towards the start where I thought that they were saying the game had a shared infrastructure element, and that made me think we were really cooking with gas. But I think that was just a misunderstanding on my part (sadly). I loved Wayfarers, so I'm very excited for this game.
Hey Simon, now you have me wondering exactly what you're referencing. There is indeed a shared infrastructure at the bottom of the main board, which is where a fair amount of the interaction happens. We didn't get into it thoroughly as this was just our initial impressions, but when a player hires a translator, that translator may immediately be slotted in across the bottom of the board (for a cost). Not only does that player mark that card and get an immediate bonus of some kind (wide variety), but then ALL players may enlist that translator when translating a scroll. Each time a player does so, that translator card accumulates a gold, and the original player must be paid a silver. And once the card has enough gold (the amount printed on the board above the slot), then the original player who hired them gets to retire the translator to below their player board--enhancing their personal actions.
I hope that all made sense. Is that the kind of infrastructure you were wondering about?
@@meeple yep, that is exactly the type of thing I was referencing. Thanks for elaborating on it!
Looks like the lads have done it again.
It'll be a sad day when Garphill games lose their spark, luckily that day looks to be a way off. Can't wait to get a hold of this.
It's pretty amazing that they've been able to offer such a wide variety of experiences, yet have so much familiar elements from game to game.
Very interesting game (as usual). A question: How much language-dependant (but the rulebook ofc) is it? There seems not to be much text and mainly icons on the board and the cards.. is it actually language independant? I'm asking because I will need to decide wether Im going to back it and play it sooner or wait for the localized version...What would you say? Ty for the answer 🙂
Hi. Do you have to roll the dice?? or you place the dice as shown in the card? thanks
You roll the dice the moment you draw them out of your bag. There’s is a ton of dice manipulation though. Also, there are many actions for which the pip value is less important, or irrelevant all together.
@@meeple thanks! Oh I’ll pass on this as I don’t like rolling dice at all. And it’s a way of limiting buying new games, as there are so many great ones. It’s a rule a created for me and I works! As one can’t own every single game.
Looking forward to this!!
As you should. I've played a number more times now, and I'm loving each play.
I vote for a round one! 😁
Well, with the votes all tallied (and it was just yours), a Round One it is! Coming soonish. Thanks for watching.
I wish garphill would revisit the first two entries of the North Sea games. It wasn’t until raiders that they found themselves so I wish they would revisit and update those first two games with everything they have leanred so they fall in line with the rest of the series
I’ve heard that they might be doing just that
Which first play did you enjoy more Scholars or Wayfarers?
For me, it took a couple plays of Wayfarers to enjoy it as much as I do. With Scholars it was more immediate, and think it's because the complexity comes more from the crunchy decisions, where Wayfarers is more about digesting the structural mechanisms.
@@meeple Thanks so much for the detailed response
How would you rank Scholars, Wayfarers and Viscounts for 2 players by this first impression? And, have you played Viscounts with both expansions? They seem to add a lot of things to both give more variety and strategies, but few have compared and talked about Viscounts with those included. For me, Wayfarers is tight but really rewarding, but I like the Viscounts board presence, that’s why I wonder how it held up 🤓
This game is excellent at 2p. I would rate this as my favorite 2p of the 3 you mentioned followed by Viscounts and then Wayfarers. This game offers some very cool player interactions and shines at all counts but holds up so well at 2p.
Viscounts I think is better with more players but this played great at 2.
Great discussion guys. Don't know if you have played Skymines, but Question: Is this as heavy as Syymines?
When does this game come out? Can't seem to find a kickstarter or anything
Garphill will be running a Kickstarter campaign starting on March 7th.
scrolls need more art / theme. I get they are scoring based, but this game needs some theme. (at first glance)
I had that same thought while I was editing the video, and seeing the photo of them out of the context of actually playing the game. But they feel less so while playing. Fair point though I think.
Would you recommend this for solo gamers?
None of us have played the solo, but Jeremy (our resident solo expert) looked at the rules and related components, and felt that it looked to have a compelling solo experience (at least at first glance).
Best sense of the game by faaaaaar yet! Thanks. Sounds like way more brain burnery than Ark Nova? Works well at 2 player?
Very good at 2p and after a game or two you can play in an hour or so.
It’s brain-burning in a different way. Trying to make sure you always have the right color combinations you need can be very thinky.
Can I request a Round One for this please? 😁
Sounds kinda like a heavier Fresco - and better 😊
I think I see the connection your making, but they feel like very different games to me (although it's been a LONG time since I played Fresco). This game is super crunchy though, so if you're looking for that, this might be your ticket.
For sure :) it was kind of a joke for the coloring reason - but Wayfarers and Scholars with Expansion are two of my favorites of all time, so this is looking 🎉🎉🎉
First! I still need to play Wayfarer’s….
Don't give in to the FOMO my man
Yes, play Wayfarers!
Agreed. FOMO is a dangerous monster in our hobby, and at times we even feel like we feed that beast (not our goal though). I always say, try to get a chance to play a game, even online, before you make a purchase decision.
Although anything from Garphil is almost certain back for me…just taking me a while to get to play all of them :p
Paladins is lighter than Wayfarers and Scholars?
Those three are all pretty heavy ones from Garphill, but I would say that in terms of weight, it's very slightly a progression: Paladins < Wayfarers < Scholars (based on my limited experience).
Update your Kickstarter?
Thanks, guys!
Hope you enjoy!
Mmmmm...burnt brain! 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
I wonder if it’s intentional that they’re calling one of the languages “Chinese”, when no such language exists. It would be like if they called it “Indian” instead of Sanskrit, or “Jewish” instead of Hebrew. Same goes for “Persian” as well. Should it not be called Farsi? Should “Chinese” not be called Mandarin?
Mandarin was not a spoken language at the time. It was a different dialect of Chinese. And the Persian language they spoke we now refer to as middle Persian, but we have abbreviated it for simplicity.
This looks like another winner from Sam and Shem (it may even fit on our table!). My only concern is that it is not very friendly for people with colour blindness.
They actually address this in the rulebook with a guide to the icons and dice.
I think having the actual language symbols on the scroll cards as art would be a really nice touch…as those cards are now, they’re bland and boring
Oh, that is a solid idea!