The CEO of PROTON answers YOUR questions! Drive, Linux support, Photos, features, and a lot more!
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- čas přidán 22. 05. 2024
- Andy Yen, the CEO of Proton (Mail, Drive, VPN, Pass...) answered a lot of the questions you, the community, asked, in an interview that covers basically everything!
He discusses security, privacy, the origins of Proton, how they operate, Linux support, future projects, products and features, quantum computing, passkeys, and more!
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#vpn #privacy #proton #onlinesecurity #protonmail
Timecodes:
00:00 Intro
01:16 How did Proton start?
03:24 Why start with email?
06:03 What is Proton's business model?
08:34 Why set up in Switzerland?
11:33 What data do you have on customers?
14:39 How is encryption important?
18:20 Do you always need to use a VPN?
20:47 Why focus on building an ecosystem?
24:55 Is an Office Suite planned?
26:29 What differentiates Proton from competitors?
30:26 Is Proton a viable alternative to big tech services?
33:31 Why expand to more products instead of finishing existing ones?
37:19 Does the general public care about privacy?
38:45 What's next for Proton services?
40:08 What are the plans for native Linux clients?
46:03 Will ProtonVPN offer dedicated IPs to everyone?
47:46 What's the environmental impact of Proton?
49:27 Proton on F-Droid, without Google Play notifications?
52:03 Why are code repos all separated and hard to find?
53:12 Why are addresses ending in ".me" ?
54:57 When will all apps reach feature parity?
56:24 Will SMTP relay be supported?
57:47 Will Proton focus more on businesses in the future?
59:50 Why put all your eggs in one basket with just Proton services?
01:01:00 Will Proton support passkeys?
01:03:21 Does E2E matter is the recipient isn't using it?
01:04:49 Will Proton disable port forwarding in VPN?
01:06:41 Is encryption enough to make email private?
01:09:06 What protects users from a change in Proton's code licensing?
01:11:14 How does Proton protect its infrastructure?
01:13:14 Impacts of Quantum Computing on privacy and security?
01:14:24 What's the future of Proton Bridge?
01:16:25 When will Proton photos be a thing?
01:17:17 Plans for Proton Notes?
01:18:20 Will VPN support the Apple TV?
01:21:12 Support the channel - Věda a technologie
Too many CEO's and other executives know nothing about the tech. So nice to see that the CEO of Proton actually understands the subject matter of his company.
The biggest success of Proton really does seem to be it's ability to remain private and avoid public funding and venture capital. The minute a project, group, or service starts to go public is the minute stuff starts to degrade. I cannot think, at the top of my head, a company that has been able to sustainably innovate, or do something different, when venture capital is in the mix. Super cool to see Yen point this out.
It definitely is a solid advantage !
That's why I think Worker and Consumer cooperatives are better than corporations.
Abusive capitalist greed corrupts absolutely.
it's also why anyone with good sense doesn't trust Proton. It's impossible to believe that money and the political influence it buys doesn't threaten to undermine or even have created such a 'safe alternative'.
That said, for free email I still think proton is the best option. But i just wouldn't trust them if i was doing anything important or of interest to powerful people and governments. I'm not that interesting though, and probably no one reading this is, so it's fine.
Why did you use ‘public’ there? Venture capital is everything but public lmao
What also needs to be said: Andy Yen is a very, very likeable person! It's a pleasure to listen to him and his story. Thank you for taking the time. Very nice interview, thanks also to Nick!
An Office suite from Proton sounds something gonna change about the world. Even Microsoft will pay Proton for not making one
YES! Or at least, one that could be easily integrated.
Based on Libre Office (as example)
libre office exists, and it´s open source
I doubt Microsoft will care. Libre Office and others have nothing on Microsoft Office. It's unfortunate that their product is so dominant and doesn't have any real competitors, but for the time being, it is what it is. I cannot imagine that Proton will magically close the gap if/when they release their version of an office suite.
@@Shocker99 - I would disagree with your statement in part. Agreed for large corporations - MS 365 with sharepoint and things like PowerAutomate etc is a no brainer. However, for small and medium sized businesses - Proton could be a viable alternative. That is a significant part of the market for a Microsoft. This would be a bigger threat for Google Workspaces. Proton products and services are continuing to grow. As they do - they will become more attractive to that market space.
It was ProtonMail that got me into security and actively thinking about it.
Now i use anything that is encrypted if it allows it.
it was microsoft that made me work towards privacy and security.. and stability. Got tired of being pushed back by ms so i moved to linux and i opened pandoras box. Now my network is as safe as it can be for normal use.
Such a nice interview! Fact: It's the first CEO I ever heard saying that they will be breach.
I think it's a healthy attitude. It's like asking a restaurant how the deal with pests. If they deny ever having pest they do and they are not dealing with it. If they bring up pest control contracts or different solutions they are likely running a clean place.
My experience with Proton is excellent. Great customer service when we have issues. Very good for small businesses.
What kind of issues have you had and are they a recurring experience?
@@thathappyrat I have their visionary product and I have to say that I have had no issues with them, and I also host multiple email domains with them. If anything does happen to arise, support is always extremely fast to respond, even to general questions.
I had a small problem with joining different mail adresses and in two days it was resolved.
One of the more watchable/listenable hour + videos I've seen in recent years and one of the most informative interviews for that matter. Andy seems like a pleasant and pretty open individual (for a CEO!). Well done, Nic.
Wow, thank you!
Very cool! honestly, the "not backed by VC" was something I did not know and it was enough to single handedly convince me
I enjoyed the interview: the clarity that Andy has on every topic, the honesty in his answers. That's really likeable
Excellent interview! Very happy and appreciative of it. Thank you for your down-to-Earth style and energy!
Thanks for the kind words!
Great interview! I’ve been using proton mail for years and it’s great to see you ask all these questions being answered by Andy himself.
used for years myself and its a good service.
Great interview from yourself and Andy, thank you for take the time to do this. As a proton user it’s great to get better understanding of the decisions they’re making.
+1 for an office suite and a separate notes app. Oh and better calendar integration!
I genuinely appreciate how passionate Mister Andy Yen seems about community and security, and the depth at which he answered each question 🙂 It was really insightful watching this video and hearing his thoughts and responses. Cheers to a good future this year for Proton and all of the endeavors of the CEO!
I love the interviews Proton is doing explaining everything. This was a great video.
You've got a great talent for always posting videos exactly when I need them! I'm looking into email clients? 1-2 weeks later you made a vid about email Clients. Now I've been looking into proton for the last few days, and you post a video on proton. Keep up the great work!
i do love the insistence of Andy Yen that we should help contribute and shape proton. Very refreshing that this is somethign clearly built with the users in top of mind not for the technologists first.
Thank you for interview! I started with the free tier, gradually importing mails, calendars, from several accounts, and just recently upgraded to the higher tier and could not be happier. I've found their services dependable and the scope of features (and quality) really impressive. I did not really expected it to work out so well.
you never fail to help and entertain me with your content!
Glad you liked it!
Refreshing to see a guy in cloud services come off as so no-BS.
56:24 I actually switched to the Business plan for this feature alone, haha!
The CEO looks like such a nice and likeable person. Was really nice to listen to him
Here's a minor point that might interest a few people: At 1:03:21 in this video, the question comes up "Does end-to-end encryption matter if the recipient doesn't have an encrypted solution?".
The discussion for that describes what benefits there are when a Proton user is exchanging emails with someone who is not a Proton user, but that isn't quite the same topic as what the question asked. While doing some testing today, I sent a message from my main Proton email to an account I have on another email provider. I was surprised to see that Proton noticed that the destination email address had a PGP key, and it automatically PGP-signed and encrypted the email sent to that non-Proton account.
Now I know how hard it can be to setup PGP on most accounts, but if someone *DOES* go through the trouble of doing that then they have an "encrypted solution" even though their account is not provided by Proton. I do realize that most people won't go through the pain of setting up a PGP key, but at least Proton does do the right thing for the people who go through that.
GREAT interview. I've used Proton stuff for many years and the clear integrity from this company has always been evident. Company culture starts at the top and Andy Yen is a great leader in that regard.
Nice interview ! Thanks. He seems to be a good guy too. And I understand more clearly why it's complicated to bring Linux support (although I'm still waiting for it ! For the Drive app at least).
proud to be swiss. love to see that swiss privacy gets some love
it's a known honeypot lol
I'm already using it, better than Gmail anyday. If I have to choose between the two, proton would come out on top.
i use hotmail, gmail and proton. I have one aol account and maybe one or 2 more.. as well.. the aol account was mostly for fun but its there and working.
If the mail app is not a 100% Thunderbird replacement, bridge will be needed. Since Thunderbird is open source, why not collaborate with Thunderbird team to incorporate encryption to it, so in case of dropping bridge because of a Proton mail app (that won't be enough for everyone), we could have some open source alternative?
Excellent in-depth interview! I admire the culture of Proton and the direction it's heading. Super glad to hear Proton has an answer to Quantum computers' ability to break current encryption techniques!
Great interview. I am paid user for the last 2 years and I like to see they are delivering a lot in the last 6-12 months. If the ProtonDrive get similar user experience to iCloud and we get a stable clients for ProtonMail and ProtonDrive for Windows and MacOS I will probably move my whole family to Proton ... Thanks for the interview, I had a great time watching Andy talking about the challenges and the plans in dept.
Would love to see some kind of office suite in the ecosystem, in fact I would be satisfied to see some basic markdown editing functionality
Thanks Nick. Superb interview. Please do more of these types of interviews with real security leading companies. Valuable insights when can hear from the leadership.
I've been a customer for years and have used their products a lot, most recently ProtonPass (which was a lot better than the cumbersome solution I used before that). Nothing but praise, even as a Linux user!
Been a happy paying customer of Proton for quite some time now and this video has given me a whole new level of appreciation for them.
nice interview! it's very informative, I am happy to see that the CEO is a person who actually cares about privacy and not just a rich dude trying do anything to extract as much money from users as possible without actually careing for what users want
Andy is pretty cool guy! I like his train on thought for the most of the stuff.
However, as a Linux user who pays for the most expensive plan I would argue on the point that there's less audience for native Proton Drive app for Linux. It can be a survivorship bias (see wiki for the term). In reality Linux users are ones who care about privacy more than inhabitants of other platforms. So, maybe there's not much demand for PDrive among Linux users because there's no native app?
Yeah, there's rclone available with PDrive beta support and it is actually working, but noting can compete with native client when it comes to terabytes of data with multiple (more than 5) devices that need to be in sync, which is my case.
It would be great if Andy sees this comment and reacts to it in the follow up video 🙂
Thanks for the interview!
I’m a Proton customer. I love Proton. I want to convert to a family plan, but it’s a large price leap to make. Is in the plans.
What a great interview, Andy is very down to earth and pragmatic. Have been a happy subscriber of Proton for some time, and am in it for the long haul now.
I just recently got the proton visionary plan and I love how the business features are also attached. I run a startup company so it helps just having the business features as well
I used them free for year, I have been paid for about 2 now. Love it
what a super cool CEO, loved him and this video thx
Thanks very much for an informative piece - as an early adopter of Proton, I've always been pleased with its development model, and I now use VPN and Pass as well as Mail. I'm happy to pay for a service that meets my needs, as opposed to the wishes of corporate investors.
That was very informative, I honestly wasn't entirely sure what Proton was about completely, but now I feel I understand it much better.
Nick and Andy, thank you both for the excellent conversation!! It really was excellent, even refreshing in the sense that you rarely get such open and transparent answers from most Tech CEO's. On a personal note, this interview sold me on Proton Mail, I'll switch to their platform ASAP.
We need a *Proton Keyboard* for phones
I've been pretty happy y with open board on f droid
This, I don't know of a single keyboard for iOS that respects privacy
@@conatusprinciple4115 hmmm...iOS started out so well but is now just another big tech data mining company with excellent security and very poor privacy...much like google and Microsoft. Aosp and open source is the last hope IMHO.
here is a privacy tip.
use as much foss and different software makers as possible.
if proton goes rogue one day, you are in trouble.
dont put all your eggs in one basket
Hey Nick, really great interview! Thank you and thanks to Andy Yen too of course :)
I pay for proton and enjoy its benefits. I do wish that Proton would integrate only office or nextcloud in their services so that I can operate in the Proton services like I do at work with MS 365.
Thanks Nick for this video, it was super interesting.
Tbh the ProtonNotes would be helpful to live in itself outside ProtonPass.
Thanks for the interview!
Merci beaucoup pour cette l'entrevue, c'est bon de savoir qu'il y a des compagnies qui ont vraiment à coeur la sécurité et respectent la vie privée.
This channel just keeps getting better!!!
My problem with Proton is they're actually able to provide IP and device information (like they've done for the swiss govt when asked). Keeping that data long enough to where you can hand it over, or even logging it in the first place to the point you can hand it over is the exact opposite of privacy.
Hey Nick, great video as always appreciate you gave Andy the room to speak as I know it can be tempting to be active when discussing a topic you're knowledgeable and passionate about, but I always prefer when the interviewees are really given that space to speak.
Andy seemed like a very knowledgeable and genuine guy with his finger on the communities pulse. Fair play to him for doing the interview.
My biggest concern with proton is they will become a victim of their own sucess and if they create an ecosystem that truly rivals that of the big tech giants will be at risk of a change of leadership or a life changing acquisition offer turning them into what they're trying to destroy.
For features my personal list is:
All apps on F-Droid, a separate notes app with a robust import feature (just clone Google keep, I just can't ditch it atm) and small, but please roll out material themed icons on android. Proton apps stick out like a sore thumb atm!
Did I miss the part where he answered what data they have access to? Just said under Swiss law they aren't compelled to... That doesn't sound like the "none" I was looking for 😬😬
I love listening to Andy and his take, I've always found him transparent, he isn't your usual gung-ho CEO. Sadly I've found some of the products such as Proton Drive not as reliable as others, so I'd rather they spent resources on reliability and having similar experiences across apps/platforms
Great interview! what a nice CEO, im pretty proud to be a proton customers since 2 years. :)
Great Questions! Thanks for making this happen.
Excellent video
Thanks :)
Great video, I really enjoy the explainations and honesty. I am glad to be a proton customer and can't wait for the new features to come out. Continue your good work!
Great interview. Thank you both.
He's a strong CEO, very tough, very determined, he protects our data with his blood
All the questions I wanted to ask were awnsered
Nice!
Shout out to Nick for being a gracious and interesting host. Love your channel.
Awesome interview! This made me think about paying the the subscription of Proton services, really nice company and with a nice CEO.
Please don't ever drop support for Bridge (at least keep the cli), even if desktop apps are coming. I'm using Thunderbird exactly because of missing features in the Web UI, and there will always be differences in the set of supported features. IMAP is a good API as long as it's just used locally between the bridge and the mail client.
Great interview btw.
I second this!
I don't think they intend to, most mail services strive to accommodate third party clients, and the bridge is the only way ProtonMail can achieve that because of how it's built.
Id appreciate them making bridge more os agnostic while at it. Runnung it on non debian or arch distro is a cause for a headache as it, among other issues, fails to find keys
As a current, paying Proton Mail & VPN user, I would LOVE to have a streamlined all in one app on my Steam Deck(Arch Linux). Something that's easy to navigate with a controller, and focuses on features relevant to mobile gaming/computing. VPN, browser, cloud storage, etc.
It is a very informative discussion. I used Proton VPN through the Native Linux client ( .deb file ) and I worked good 👍. Proton policies are impressive.
Great interview! This confirmed me that Proton is one of the best suites of software out there.
Great video. Thanks both.
We love Andy!
I was very happy with Proton mail and proton vpn even before the CEO interview. Now I'm pretty jazzed about it and happy to support it with a subscription.
51:18 Element literally does this. No separate version of the app is needed. You get to choose which notification backend to use in the settings whether it's ntfy, play services, or running in the background. Obviously the last one uses more battery, but ntfy isn't any different from play services like what he seems to think. I think what happened is he tested ntfy battery usage while play services were already running and deduced that it uses more batter when it doesn't (because it doesn't collect your data in the background).
This was really great dude, thanks for doing this interview, gives me more confidence in Proton. Glad to hear Andy said they are slow because they have to be careful, I fully respect that. I often go back and forth between Windows and Arch simply because I get annoyed having to always edit or manipulate some config file in Arch in order to make it just work. This is a huge headache for me.
One of the worst issues right now from a user experience perspective on laptops is that the fucking laptop scrolling speed is neckbreaking on most laptops with the latest version of Gnome on Wayland.
This is an utter disaster for the Linux space in terms of noobs getting into Linux. On Arch I can make it buttery smooth for myself, but most people wont waste their time if even the most basic of functions don't work properly on the most popular distros etc.
I really wish Linux would get their shit together as a whole, it's doing the space a disservice, and I definitely don't blame Proton for their not being apps on Linux as of yet.
Let me echo many comments. Mr. Yen is a very pleasant and strategic thinking CEO and leader. Loved listening to him talk about Proton. As a customer - I am increasing the level of my paid subscription. So far - after two years using Proton - it has been flawless. Just got an email today that the Proton Mail app is our in beta for Mac OS and Windows and will be out for Linux early next year. Their product and services is constantly being improved. If they do an office suite - yikes - that will shake up the market.
Great information, thanks Nick!
Phenomenal video! Such a good interview
Wow! I didn't know you had a peertube channel! Awesome!
I can post there from Lemmy as a forum!
Very intresting interview!
Thanks for it!
It'd be cool for them to pledge to support rclone for proton drive. I feel like a pretty technical person, but I haven't been able to get rclone mount working with proton drive yet :(.
A proton drive gui for Linux makes sense too, esp for people with proton family plans, but it'd be neat to have first-class rclone support
Very informative.
big fan of their proton mail app and their VPN too is pretty good!
The ceo is a legend. His answers are excellent.
Great interview!! I liked specialy that you made him some very interesting questions despite them being a bit unconfortable 👍
Although Proton doesn't care about Linux, i did end up getting Visionary and am very happy with it. This video was influential in that decision, so I thank you.
Thank you for the support! I hope you’ll have a good experience with Proton, I really like their services
hope fedora and debian is gonna be a priority
Great interview!
AMAZING!
Really great interview
38:30 One of the main issues I had with ProtonMail back when I briefly tried it out was that IIRC I couldn't use my usual email clients since that'd kinda defeat the purpose. Also was kinda concerned about trusting another centralized platform and the company behind it.
that's the reason I stopped using it honestly. The client can't keep email's locally and since I live in a developing country where internet access is not constant (not even in my uni!), it simply failed as a mail service to me.
That was very nice and in depth.
Great interview.
Awesome interview. I really think they should look deeper into the Flatpak technology for Linux. Its come a long way can even do network stacks and access to your file directory systems and they can build to one standard and make it awesome
Great interview
I've been a proton premium subscriber for a few years now, I've been very happy with them. I am now a linux only user too fyi.
1:13:30 - Quantum Computing
There is a Quantum Net in developement paralell to the InterNet,
Maybe you sould explore new email protocols for that net, since a transition is inevitable.
Nick, you are amazing.
Proton sounds promising.
Should have joined the question list :( I'll be more alert next time.
Quesions:
1. I understand the need to create a trusted VPN service, still would you consider splitting Proton.VPN to a new companey with a new name?
I ask, because currently you might update the VPNService at the expense of the EMail Service - Split Loyelty between EMail focused users and VPN focused users.
2. How do you feel about team-play between companies?
I imagine no company can stand alone, delivery companies, hw manufacuterers and support for the hw any company is using ...
So, I just feel the sceme of other companies tied with Proton is segnificant and worth talking about.
How do you handle a state with no good partners? or parteners alligned to your service ideals, You can't always build the company you want to use.
3. When a new company brings to market new tech, do you feel the authorities responsible for gaurding the community's wellfare should be responsible for fast adaptation of that tech? or is it the responsibility of the new company to standarties and assist the authorities that inforce the standards?
Question for anyone actively using Proton: A few years ago when I tried Proton, they did not have the ability to search through email content, other than the email title. This was a deal breaker for me, but I do understand the reasoning behind it. However they said they're working on a solution to this. Has this changed? Does the web app allow for searching email content?
It's a feature they've since added. They give an explanation on how they work around their encryption to allow it to happen on their site. They basically create an index in your browser when you open the web application
It's bot a ug and play solution but it is one.
@@playtester6635 Thank you!
I wished they had a "custom Thunderbird" where you only need to put in your account info in and you have everything... Installing the mailbridge and then set up thunderbird to it is still a bummer...
That's what I'd like to see, too. I don't really see the need for the bridge, instead it may be a better way to cooperation with Thunderbird. that would also eliminate the need for their own desktop-client.
I'm fine with Bridge. It gives the user choice on what client he can use. But i's way too limited. There's no bridge for caldav/carddav/any way to mount the drive/any bridge solution for android at all is a bit of a bummer
The bridge is very easy ro set up. It does most of it for you. It takes like 4 or 5 clicks tops and you set and forget
32:41 That feature would have been nice when I first switched, lol. It didn't exist yet so I just used the desktop mail bridge to add ProtonMail and GMail both to my desktop email client, and then just dragged folders and messages from GMail over to ProtonMail and waited for them all to sync, 😛
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a CEO of a company get grilled as much as Andy does about his company. At least none that come to mind right off the top of my head. This is like the third or fourth interview that I have watched this guy seems to love the hot seat, but I absolutely love proton and love the leadership that company is under and the community aspect of the company where the community is the boss I also love Andy and his honesty especially the part of the interview where he says I’m going to be honest because I’m a scientist and I can’t help it. That one cracked me up.