LBC's marathon Israel and Palestine debate | Cross Question
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- čas přidán 16. 10. 2023
- As the war wages on between Israel and Hamas since the latter's terror attacks on October 7th, with strikes over Gaza and Tel Aviv, Iain Dale and his Cross Question panel get heated over what the different outcomes of this war could be, if the Palestinian and Israeli human cost is justified, and if Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu can ever really 'eradicate Hamas.'
Our Cross Question panel from left to right: Benedict Spence (Journalist, The Telegraph), Zoe Williams (Columnist, The Guardian), Wendy Chamberlain (Liberal Democrat MP for North East Fife), Dame Andrea Leadsom (Conservative MP for South Northamptonshire).
Listen to the full show on Global Player: l-bc.co/ListenNow
#IainDale #Gaza #Israel #LBC
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You march for the oppressed, You dont march for the oppressors.
You march for Hezbollah and not for Hamas? Is that what you say?
@@wolfgangpreier9160 You march for the half the population that is neither...but innocent children.
@@wolfgangpreier9160
The plight of the Palestinian people and Hamas are two different things.
@roisinmalone3015 Palestinians voted Hamas into power. They knew what the Hamas agenda was and they signed up for it.
@@sotohc96the vote was 17 years ago and now 52% of the population are under 18, it's clear that everything in gaza is stopped because of the continuous oppression and the illegal blockade made by israel
It's Israel's actions that are being criticised, it's nothing to do with their religion. We are asked to condemn Russians war crimes but turned a blind eye to Israel's.
So we punish the Jews who are elsewhere and are not Israelites. We also seem to think that all Israelite agree with their government, which is untrue. The current government has been and is still being criticized. It's like saying that all Palestinians support Hamas' attack, which is just as patently untrue.
As for the Israeli government, the writing was on the wall. This is a government that has been trying to have less oversight on itself. This was a right-wing, militant government that was just waiting for an opportunity to get its way, and saturday's attack was just such an opportunity. These guys were never going to be reasonable and proportionate.
What war crimes have the Jews done. Yet you do not point out that which hamas does not the willfully ignorant palestines
Did you criticize Ukraine for dropping bombs on the Donbas region since 2014?
@@tomsawyer4321Nah, not if Russia (the bigger, colonial country) attacked or attempted to invade (it did, and has, btw) previous to that point. Whoever cast the first stone and all that
They have to make it about religion as one Jewish celebrity is recorded saying * oh we use the anti semite card to close criticism down* anyone who does not serve Israeli interests are silenced in that way . Branded and outcast !
"If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing."
Malcolm X
Guardians Moto!!!!!!!!!!!!!
❤
That’s exactly what they are doing
Big gib Ledsom, banging on. Is she aware when Israeli Jews 18 years of age refuse to enlist and join the killing machine of the IDF, Nentanyahu imprisons them. 🤔🙄🤮
How true and the establishment's have always made it so no matter their politics or where the are .
Worst off all they write the history.
Dale is just unqualified to be dealing with such important debates
Uncontrollably biased
It might please you to learn his qualifications in this area are exactly the same as yours.
You’re right, as he lacks imagination and is very blinkered in his responses.
@@themaskedman221Yea but he gets paid to be a mouthpiece for apartheid
The male Diane abbott
How can society move forward when you have people like Iain Dale refused to accept the truth???
How can western societies move forward while under constant attack from jihadis?
I'm a big fan of ostracism.... Though in his case I'd find it hard to feel sympathy if someone escalated beyond that
What is the truth?
And if u see on X platform many video that answer about the kills on 7/10 which mostly hamas killed israel soldier at their base. They attack israel soldier house which israel soldier also doing so from last 17years. Hamas is palestine soldier same like israel idf. U also can see the confension of ex soldier army, israel exgeneral son who reveal the story for what is happen there.
The truth is Israel is ethnically cleansing the area if Hamas was set up in Israel Israel would not be bombing its citizens
Really silly of Iain to mock that caller at 11:00 for not trusting the Americans and British…. Like BRUH we know who helped make this problem….
Facts
Yes, in the same segment he brushed off her point, saying that there are three other members of the permanent security council aside from the US and UK - none of which have used their unilateral veto since the 60's to deny every proposal for a two state solution against the entire rest of the worlds endorsement. That responsibility rests solely with the US.
Not silly at all, it's outright disgusting and he owes her an apology.
You don't have to hate the UK or the US to not trust them, when the UK has a demonstrable history of doing what the US tells it to, and the US has a demonstrable history of throwing its weight (and veto) around to shield Israel from justice.
Saying she hates the Americans was disgusting.
The Americans had nothing to do with making this "problem." If you want to cast blame, blame the Ancient Romans and the Ottoman Empire, as well as the Germans, about whom in this context the less said the better.
Iain Dale telling the caller that she hates her country and hates America because she criticised our approach to middle eastern conflict is asinine and insulting. I didn't agree with the caller, but that's not a reason to make such a ludicrous accusation.
You are right Dale let himself down .
I like how every conversation is like ‘ok let’s all just forget about the last 74 years first, and now let’s debate from the attack on Oct 7th onwards’
Exactly!!!! And I’m a 73 yr old Australian who has been reading for the last 48 years the atrocities carried out by the Israeli people/military….. I’m not anti Semitic nor pro Arab but I can read and retain information!!!
Ok let's go through 74 years. In 1967 Muslim countries declared a war on Israel which Israel won in 6 days and just like with every single war in the history, the victorious country took the land. Can we talk about the attacks on Oct 7 now?
That's the agenda bias for you.
@@Biohazard1999did you know that according to international law that was agreed after WWll, keeping land by conquest was deemed ilegal. And even more ilegal was to kick out families leaving in those lands to put your people.
Yes, it's a basic propaganda technique.
I know you're on thin ice when you question Israel's actions in any way, but nevertheless, I can't agree with the fellow who called in to say the attack on Israel was unprovoked. I'm in my mid-50s, and Israel has had its boot on the neck of the Palestinians for my entire life, and even after all the agreements, they're _still_ letting Jewish settlers steal what little land has been left to them.
Let me frame it another way. I'm the descendant of people dispossessed in the Highland Clearances. I know the name of the man I'm descended from who lost his land; I even have a copy of a letter he sent here asking for marginal land. I know what town he was from. Without too much trouble, I could probably even find the plot of land that had been his. But if I just pulled up stakes, flew to Scotland, found that land, and started building a house there and claimed it was "mine", we all know what would happen to me. I'd be arrested, charged, spend some time in jail, and be on the next flight out afterward. Now that's with knowing the man and the land, and a span of less than two hundred years.
But the Romans exiled the Hebrews _two _*_thousand_* years ago, and the Palestinians are also Semites who lived there then and have lived there ever since. Israel was imposed on them, based on stories from long ago and a wish for what was. But the Palestinians didn't visit the Holocaust on the Jews; the Germans did. Why wasn't an "Israel" created out of some of their territory? Odds are, we'd have a safe, stable Jewish homeland in the middle of Europe that would probably be a member of NATO today. Instead, we have this thorn in the side of the Middle East, an open sore that will never heal, and could potentially end the world. And worst of all, the Jewish people there are in danger of becoming what they beheld. "Never again" should mean _everyone;_ not just them.
Very well put squire.... Just to add a couple of things.
From a religious perspectives, the land was inhabited by the caananites... So the Jews cannot claim it is only theirs... through time people have always lived there... Regardless of the names given over time. The Palestinian people therefore have always been indiginious to the lands..
From a more political perspective... This has to be considered in light of the British empire..esp post ww1.. . They wanted a colony to use as the passageway from India back to the UK... The zionist wanted their own land and so we're able to achieve this objective with the explicit help from Britain once the ottoman empire was defeated... Both parties got what they wanted... But from 2 different perspectives religious and political...
This is less about religion, as the native Jews lived in peace for centuries... Its the Jews coming from the west and places like Russia who are the radical ones that essentially want all of the land...
Very well said, sir.
Yup..absolutely correct..
Excellent summary!
@@arfanul-haq7682Indigenous there was people here earlier than the Caananites so who's land is it really his story not real history 🤔
It's laughable for me to hear people say that Israel doesn't receive the same support as Palestinians
crazy
They are receiving unlimited arms from the west.
The reason people aren't holding pro-Israel marches is 1) because Israel are the aggressors and 2) they receive an unreasonable level of support from our government anyway.
They are referring to popular support and that is an absolutely disgusting argument to make. On top of supporting Israel these Western powers ignore the will of their own populace.
WHAT HUNDRED YEARS IS THAT WOMAN TALKING ABOUT. EVERYTHING STARTED IN 1948....1948....1948 BY STATING THAT OT IS A HUNDRED YEARS WAR IS A BIG LIE. THESE ARE EUROPEANS, NOT SEMITE!
Iain Dale is totally out of touch. But then again...he's quite safe in UK 🇬🇧
Iain was very disrespectful to that caller, being critical of how your country operates on the international stage isn't hating your own country, Britain and America often get it wrong and make matters worse in the long run, the track record is there for all to see so what's wrong with saying they shouldn't stick their oar in and leave it to someone else?.
Iain was harsh on the callet at 10/11 minutes. That lady wasnt saying she hates the UK or US. She just made a point that maybe its time to let the UN have a go where others have failed
Dale is a hack.
He routinely has a go at the Oxford English Dictionary.
Hate according to him is - not having confidence certain people are capable of making proper judgments.
Honestly I only come to laugh at him and the wobbleville program he presents.
Is Iain liberal or conservative
@@brianhotaling5849Conservative definitely. Hes bias always come out.
It’s the first time I have listened to him, and the last.
Agree - whenever any bit of truth is discussed, others who don't want it to come out will shut them down by saying they are antisemitic, or they hate their own country. It is an overused tactic when an argument can't be made opposing a comment.
Dale is rude and assumptious . Telling the caller she hates her country and the USA??? Gammon .
Yeah I thought exactly the same.
Saying that the woman caller must hate USA AND UK reminded me of Trumpspeak.....
"they're ruining our country because they hate America... perhaps hating the most ever, people don't know that... it's so sad".
But he was right, the callee was talking lefty nonsense, just like the doddering woman on the left of this panel.
@@davidgreen6490
Meanwhile you are here regurgitating typical Gammon tropes. Look! One can love their country and still criticise it when it is acting like a “useful idiot” to a the actions of of a known bully.
@@martinb1659 What are gammon tropes? And where have I been regurgitating them?
👏 well done for one of the most one sided bias debates ive seen so far. I thought a debate was supposed to be people with different opinions arguing their point. This is more of a coffee morning for warmongers.
Wow, Ian was quite a “C U Next Tuesday” to that caller when she merely pointed out that America has an incredible bias towards Israel and Britain will only follow americas lead. Just because she understands the dynamic at play doesn’t mean she hates either of those countries. The Israel Palestine discussion always makes people sound like morons and Ian has joined the party
USA under Biden is far left, the squad etc, pro palestine.
The people of Palestine had no choice when the UN and English carved up where they lived and gave over 50% of where they lived to the new state of Israel
Factually inaccurate. After WWII the jewish people accepted the UN offer and the Palestinians people starred a war with the help of surrounding Arab State. At that time the Palestinian objective was to throw the jews into the sea and their goal has never changed.
This is a war for Israelis survival.
You mean the British.
@@curt3494He doesn't understand the difference between 'the English' and 'the British' - as you correctly point out. But, don't correct these people - their ignorance is an important indicator as to who you're dealing with.
There was no UN at that time.
these people didn't cause this mess ! CLAIRE@@alastairbarkley6572
It is so unhelpful to view marches for Palestine as wholly antisemetic. No one is marching for Isreal because Isreal is seen as the oppressor in this conflict.
That's purely demographics. It's the idealistic youth that have the time and desire to spend their time marching. The rest of us have jobs.
@@jlpowell51or.. Maybe... Just maybe they feel a moral duty to protest against clear injustice and want the zionist state to see it is barbaric what they are doing....
But anyway, you carry on with your 'job'...
@@arfanul-haq7682 One wonders why some injustices are clearer than others. We can tell your stance, since you've used "zionist" as if it is a slur, as if the Jewish people don't deserve a nation of their own. That's exactly the belief that caused this mess.
Speak for yourself. People are not marching for Israel because they are afraid of being attacked by Palestinian supporters, who broadly consist either of bloodthirsty muslim fanatics or bloodthirsty anti-West communists.
Beyond terror and begging for aid, what have the Palestinians ever offered humanity? NOTHING.
Israel itself was literally formed as a result of a UN resolution in 1948. Yet, they sit there pretending like that can't think of examples of significant UN involvement in geopolitics.
Easy China and Russia the UN are pathetic and need disbanding
If someone tells Iain I'm going to rob your house please can you leave. Would that justify robbing his house?
I love how they have an expert on Palestine to make accurate comparisons. The willful ignorance is astounding.
This panel is an absolute shambles
Well we know who's they support so they won't invite the one who knows the story of what happens in Palestinian
That lady does not have a clue. Any research lady? Do you know the difference between Hamas and Palestinian citizens? Do you have a vague clue? Out of interest do you have children? How would you react if your child was beheaded in front of you? Would you be justified in supporting those who beheaded your child? Would you watch your husband tortured and murdered? And justify Gamas in doing it? There is a fundamental difference between Hamas and Gaza. Learn it before commenting further.
@@BooliVanMtuliThere isn't a plan, just revenge!
The British have a very bad track record.
It is grossly unfair to call people who disagree with Israel anti-semitic. And if people aren't coming out to support them, it's because what Israel is doing is wrong.
The biggest problem is Israilies(not the Jews)give their children the notion that they are better than rest of us like super humen the chozen ones?
Yet they work in the interest of Jew-haters. This is the time Israel needs support, so we should support it. We'll criticise later, when everything calms down
No. They're not out on the streets cos they get assaulted by the people calling for their death.
It is way too easy to sling the word anti-semitic to deflect.
This is the time Palestinians need support. Their the ones with no food, water, electricity and 1000 dead kids. This statement is not anti semitic @@davidcooks2379
Dear Mr Dale the British created the situation decades ago. Dale and Ledsham both ignore the Palestinian deaths prior to Hamas atrocious attack. They have been oppressed for decades. Oh the irony and hypocrisy of British politicians Amaritsa comes to mind. Burning alive EOKA fighters in Cyprus. Bombing Serbia wasn't deemed religious it was deemed bombing a Nation of oppression. No indiscretion of Israel has been mentioned they behave like this all started on October 7th 2023.
Moronic comment about hating America and being a sel-hating British person - the lady calling was making a obvious reference to the fact that the USA (and the UK) have consistently vetoed UN resolutions condemning Israel for its crimes.
So all these people are just ignoring the fact
that occupation creates sympathy for the Palestinians..and that’s why lots of people went to the streets. Its not always antisemitism
The problem you've got there though is extremists join in
Hamas are responsible for 1,000s of Israel & Palestinian death over the years. Hamas is like a cancer causing suffering and death to innocent Jews & Palestinians alike. Until the rule of Hamas is totally defeated the wars & deaths will never end. Only then can the peoples of both sides come together to negotiate a lasting peace. A united nation that can spend it´s money on Universities, Sciences, infrastructure etc., instead of bullets & bombs. As a peaceful, United State, they could stand tall and proud amongst all the other countries in the world.
Yes, they're ignoring it because it's inconvenient.
It fits their agenda to paint all criticism of Israel or support for Palestine as antisemitism.
"We may all be facing a future as Palestinians." - Jeff Halper, cofounder of ICAHD Israeli Committee Against House Demolitions and author of "War Against the People." - Global Pacification Industry
I've never seen protests about the treatment of the Armenians in Turkey, selective outrage as usual.
Commanding one million civilians (40% of whom are children) to move from one half of a city, to the other, on threat of bombing, is actually a war crime
Do you have a better suggestion?, lets hear it genius.
Enter face to face war why they are afraid
They shouldn't have had that many children. They are weaponising children to get your sympathy
We didn't get that much warning in the blitz.
Completely, where are they supposed to go given there’s no fuel, water, or electricity for 5 days. Also, presumably Hamas fighters will not simply stay behind and wait for the bombs to come?
Why doesn’t anyone say that Jewish have been also participated on Saturday and so many are all over the World supporting Palestine and condemning the ISREALI government
Because they know the whole story
Exactly! A lot of Jews condemn Israel for what they are doing to the Palestinian people. This has nothing to do with antisemitism, but people objecting to the slaughter of innocent people
This is a really lightweight panel and Iain is particularly inept
His show is basically loose women but with newspaper editors.
Marching for Palestine is purely about compassion. My family are Jewish and I fully support the compassion for those under siege, on both sides.
it just looks strange when you have marches for palestine, the day after Hamas commits a massacre against Israeli civillians...if you have marches for palestine, why not have both flags side by side? and there are only marches for palestinians when israel is responsable...nothing when hamas murders it's own people, nothing for PLO's pay for slay program...
but if you say it's about compassion, then all the best to you
You're Jewish marching for the pogrom? Lol. Okay, Ahmed.
How is it compassion to march for a terrorist state
100% both faction are wrong. Its not about sides, its about humanity. I pray for peace for everyone especially all innocent people. 🙏🙏🙏🙏
100% both faction are wrong. Its not about sides, its about humanity. I pray for peace for everyone especially all innocent people. 🙏🙏🙏🙏
I have watched Israelis standing on a hillside cheering as the Israeli air force has attacked Palestinian buildings. This was some years ago now but to see them laughing and cheering, drinking champagne also is when i thought differently towards Israel.
So what was happening in Gaza on that Saturday? When they were dragging hostages around .
@@donnaecroyd2473 Well i don't see why you're upset that the people of Gaza may have celebrated the let say 308 Israelis being killed in conflict since 2008. By your rhetoric i can only imagine how much partying you're suggesting needs to be done on the Israelis side for the 6407 Palestinians killed in that same period. That's like more than 20 times the amount, not taking into consideration land mass. The place must be one giant concert and i'm sure you're invited
Cool story, Bro. I bet you were there watching the 'Jewish looking people' on that rooftop, cheering 9/11 as well.
All disagreements/criticism of the Israeli government actions cannot be Anti-Semitic
I think the notion that Jews can’t be criticised is fast fading. None of our countries and cultures are above criticism.
Global Pacification Industry
Imagine people coming from foreign lands, taking over your lands, having you imprisoned and controlled within tight open spaces, then acting astonished that they get attacked.
After losing their lands to the Romans, the Jews suffered far worse than Palestinians - and for 2000 yrs!
Instead of fighting the Jews, the Palestinians should be asking them for useful tips on how to survive......the Jews are masters of survival - as Gaza is only beginning to find out.
Imagine.
It is not lost to the world that most countries that are backing Israel have their own indigenous issues and sit on land taken by force in recent history.
Taking what land? Palestine has never been a state.
Yeah but the thing is them fighting back is killing inncoent israelies?
Iain Dale shouldnt be runnign these, far too bias towards Israel.
100% agree with you
Agreet
Imagine if the world called out israel for invading Palestinian land for the last 70 years or is that too close to admitting the fault of the Balfour declaration.
Saying that you dont trust American or the British governments to deal with making peace (which history shows theyre terrible at) isnt saying that you hate the countries, what a ridiculous thing to say Iain
Even Biden used the post-9/11 wars as a caution to Israel today. So the President of agrees with the caller but not Dale.
Israel has had gaza under a land, sea and air blockade since '06. Gaza is the worlds largest open air prison
Then why was there 16.000 work visas issued to Palestinian workers to enter Israel? You are disingenuous and a lefty trope
You really should do your homework.
Clearly, we look at things quite differently.
First, in gaza, there were Jewish settlements up to that year but they were evacuated by the Israeli government so the Palestinians could thrive on tgeir own, and then they were given the freedom to have an election (hamas was elected). So if Israeli government controls gaza, it is considered an occupation, but when it moves out it's a blocade?
Second, Palestinians in gaza can and do pass the border daily to go to work or receive medical treatment (there is a security check in the border). The blockade started only after the recent horrors (makes sense, bet you wouldn't give free passage to someone whose government is repeatedly trying to slaughter you).
Third, people seem to forget Egypt also has a border with gaza but doesn't let them in, and nobody seems to criticize that.
I am making this comparison because as I said earlier both Israel and Egypt have the right to maintain their borders.
To sum up, there are things that the Israeli government should be held accountable for, but considering Israel is being constantly bombarded by gaza, and terror attacks being committed all year round,
You surely can understand why it is so wary of completely opening its borders to gaza.
Wow bro that's the most antisemitic thing I've heard in a long time
Israel has no responsibility to open its border in any way to a regime that is funded by other arab states to be a genocidal force against israel. Egypt has the same policy for very similar reasons.
I would love to see the Lady in pink live like a caged animal in Gaza for a minute and still say I don't see how Israel is committing any War crimes or crimes against humanity.
Thank you Zoe Williams for not being a corporate media talking head.
No she's just an unhinged lefty
"They need a Mandela figure"! Is that to resist apartheid, Ian? 😳
They need a Super Super Super Mandela. Because the whole western world esp Superpower US will be againts him!
And Mandela actually said that Isreal is an apartheid state. Lol
Yasser Arafat was that figure. The difference between israel and SA is that the whites in south africa knew they took the land. The zionists think they have a right due to their religion. They are delusional.
Sadly no one in this panel is talking about the real problems of this conflict, the annexation & occupation of Palestinian land by Israel & the Gaza blockade since 2016 literally rendering Gaza to an open prison. These are issues which need to tackled . A Palestinian state as per 1967 borders .
I have never felt as gaslit in my life as I do with the current media coverage of this "conflict" (and I use that lightly). How is there no one on that panel saying that war crimes absolutely have been committed and that the loss of life in Israel on Saturday pales in comparison to the death toll of Palestinians. It makes me sick.
OR that's not a conflict but a brutal cruel criminal occupation that started all over Palestine in 1967 and as a siege of Gaza 2014 hence not a today's event and that Hamas like it or not is defending the territory of its people; occupied brutalised populations have right under international law to defend themselves; WHEN IS israel going to abide by international law?
Global Pacification Industry
There is no equivalence... Hamas intentionally targets civilians. Israel accepts collateral damage because hamas commits war crimes by hiding amongst a civilian population.
@@francescaviceconti3770in 1967 a coalition of Arab countries attacked Israel. They lost land. Israel gave most of it back. If you start a war and loose it, you can't cry over lost territories.
@@francescaviceconti3770to call for Israel to abide by international law, Hamas would have to be a signatory to the ICC. But they will never do that. Because as soon as they do, their entire leadership will be charged.
Any opinion Dale doesn't like he attacks with a blatant straw man or non sequitur. He's full of it!
you can count on Iain for not knowing that Israel has bombed the way out for Gazans (the Rafah border with Egypt).
I hate my own government,big fkn deal.
yet once again they dont talk about the occupation and crimes which are commited daily by Israel. oh well
We have reached such a state that people can't even find common grounds on basic human decency anymore.
When Israeli people have protest and I’ve seen this in the news… in America in particular they have had sit in protests at the senate wearing t-shirts stating “NOT IN OUR NAME”.
Even they feel that their government are doing wrong.
If it wasn’t for Britain’s double dealing we wouldn’t be in this situation. I am praying for the people in Palestine. My heart also hurts for the victims of the massacre done by Hamas. This is so sad. Where is the humanity without taking sides.
Elephant in the Room alert: Israeli's voted for Netanyahu and his government, so maybe ask why they have not managed to achieve peace.
@@Harlin67 this goes back a long way. Humanity is dying. We are all becoming insensitive to death. I feel so hurt.
@Bgazader if the Palestinians had accepted the UN land split 75 years ago the world would have been a very different place. Such a shame.
@@Harlin67Elephant in the room alert: Arab colonizers literally voted in a government of terrorists.
Sit down.
Britain did what had to be done in order to weaken the nazis. One of the Palestinian leaders at the time was Hitlers ally.
She is absolutely right about, "British will do what the Americans tell them to do"
Yawn
There has been a distinct lack of sympathy for the Palestinians for 60yrs
They keep spreading the lie and propaganda that babies were beheaded. Even israel admitted it's not true.
Why did the Palestinians and Arabic countries not accept the two state solution established on 1948?
@@-Neutron-Star Because they won't accept any "peace plan" that includes the existence of Israel in any way, shape, or form. To me, sounds like the attitude of a whole system that doesn't WANT peace... I wonder what the 'end-game' looks like for residents of Gaza after they finally accept the fact that Israel isn't going to "disappear" as they demand.
@thehealinggame They're among the biggest recipients of international aid in the world... the notion that they don't get sympathy is absurd.
Why do we always hear that the attack was unprovoked? Isn,t decades of oppression with impunity provocation enough?
What about centuries/decades of decimation of Jews in the middle east? Eg Baghdad in the 1800s
decades do you even know math
They should have listened to Nelson Mandela who said Israel should give back the land they have stolen from the Palestinians.
Gaza was being controlled by Egypt and WB under Jordan for close to 20 years! Why?
How is Nelson Mandela a authority figure on Isreal and Palastine? This argument is mornic.
It’s like everyone misses the elephant in the room…it’s Isreal that’s at the core of everything that’s gone on…it’s Isreal that’s committing war crimes
Here in Melbourne Australia the protesters sign said: Jews in solidarity, Palestinian will be free, holding up the Palestinian Flag. If all of you at table can find peace within your self for humanity, you will find better answers than continue to divide between left or right wing. People are being slaughtered, and you all trying to work out who is to blame. Find Aid for “all”stop talking about it.
4 on 1. Fair fight.
Ian dale is class A TW&T simple!
Dale is unqualified to deal with anything, let alone this.😂😂😂
Iain Dale, can't handle the truth
What truth would that be?
I didn't hear any discussion about illegal settlements
what illegal settlements. the jews have been there for thoousands of years.
Thank you for having a balanced approach to this crisis. However calling what happened on October 7 appauling in light of years of bombing against Iraqis by western nations on a false claim of WMD's. Proves that Arab deaths are not considered as atrocious as other deaths. Btw the Palestinian people are a sematic people.
Oh this is so evident as to be almost laughable at this point. The Palestinian civilian death toll has already outstripped the number killed in the Hamas attack. But apparently that's not relevant because they were "accidents." Very convenient.
Do you think what happened on Oct 7th was appauling?
@@fin1131 I think the death of any soul is the death of all of humanity. But I do have my doubts about how a rag tag resistance group like Hamas was allowed to breach the most secure borders in the world? It makes me think of so many other false flag operations. You and I are pawns in the games of the Elite. They create the conditions that lead to our division. Then they sit back and enjoy the blood shed all the while making money.
Palestinian have the right to defend themselves against oppression victory to Palestinian ❤
The wilful ignorance of what Israel has been doing to palestine for the last 70 years is astounding.
It's defending itself from rockets being fired at it all the time....what you think if any country in the world did this there would be no retaliation?
@@foreignwarren7361 be honest with yourself for once and ask why Palestine shot rockets in the first place
@foreignwarren7361 there's that willful ignorance. 70 years of oppression, settlement, and bombing and you're surprised that it radicalised people.
@@automaticcaptions because they agreed to a two state solution and then attacked Israel the following day and lost the war, now they behave like New Zealanders bitter over losing the rugby world cup....🤣
It was literally put in their Charter, why Hamas attacks Isreal with Rockets. They want the complete irradication of are Isreali's within the holy land.
Iain: a bit of impartiality in your role as LBC spokesperson would not go amiss. As opposed to eye-rolling and dissing those who do not subscribe to your pro-Israeli agenda.
Andrea Ledsom should be ashamed of herself, wicked woman.
Tories don't know the meaning of the word.
Hold on - the Tory MP just said that no one has accused Israel of committing war crimes. Well, cutting off water, food, power and stopping all medical supplies does constitute a war crime. According to Internal Law...
It is a war crime but they cant see that.Israel has commited numerous war crimes but no one is going to account them for it.Blair Bush commited war crimes too.But its ok when Usa Uk and israel commit war crimes.
Israel doesn't provide all the water to Gaza, therefor can't cut off "all the water".
Israel committing war crime is nothing new
Israel has been accused of war crimes (namely collective punishment, disregard for civilian casualties and use of banned chemical weapons) but it will take the ICC years to rule one way or the other and it'll probably never go to court anyway because it will be blocked by members of the security council (like the US) just like every other time Israel has been accused of war crimes.
What is without a doubt is that the UN (the body for ensuring countries follow international law through their ICJ wing) has determined Israel has broken international laws of forced transfer.
It's worth noting that international law was relatively recently changed so that other governments who support a state in breaking international law (as the UK has done by saying Israel has a right to issue an evacuation order) is also complicit and legally shares exactly the same responsibility as the country actually breaking the law. Tory MP Crispin Blunt has threatened to prosecute the UK government for its stance.
I'm not sure the panel's names, but the last speaker was deyond wise and very realistic. And then when all else fails, the rest of the panel call people anti-semitic.
I felt sorry for that woman. She was the only one speaking the truth and they all ganged up on her
The problem is that there has been a blatant show of apartheid within the area! Israel has been treating the Palestinians as second and third class citizens for years. Sadly, continued treatment over the decades results in animosity against the oppressor. Please be aware that this is not an antisemitic statement...it relates to the Israeli Government. This makes it easy for a radical group such as HAMAS to capture support from a downtrodden People.
Why are we forgetting what Israel has been doing to Palestinian for last 75 years..
Because it's inconvenient to the desired narrative.
What a terrible conversation all round, with a prize chump in the chair.
There is a tonne of evidence that war crimes have been committed by Israel.
Whether a judiciary admits the evidence is another question.
Whether any judgment leads to any penalty or enforcement is also another big question.
The barriers to justice are enormous which in itself indicates a broken system
WAIT, isn't Ireland/Northern Ireland exactly that?? A two state solution??
Indeed, and if England took more land for years then cut off power, electricity and water due to a devastating ira retaliation there would not be peace now.
Israel has no right to war crimes😢
No water for how many days?????
I just saw news of a Japanese doctor who works in Gaza saying there has been no water!!!!!! How many days can people live without drinking water ???
This is crazy!!!
Palestinian people are not Hamas!!!!!
Please end this war forever. No wars just love
Czechoslovakia in 1938. Germany, Japan, Korea and Vietnam had governments imposed after WW2. The Soviet Union imposed itself on Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, Czechoslovakia and Poland. The US imposed governments in Panama, Grenada, Iraq and Afghanistan. NATO in Yugoslavia, Russia in Georgia. The list is great, perhaps endless.
@14:31 “ you cannot impose something “ !!!!!!!! Which is what has been happening for 75 yrs ! Duh !
Iane Dale seems to be an Israeli supporter.🙏
He should stand up.for what is right✅💯
Does he know that the 75 years of israels brutal occupation has caused brutal aggression and apartheid🙏💯
10:50 Iain Dale, there was no call for such emotive language, no call at all!
Talking about Israel not getting the support it deserves ... yeah, first of all, both the US and the UK have expressed unconditional support for Israel. 2 "super powers" that do not even question Israel's response. What support do the Palestinian citizens (not the terrorist operation Hamas, but the overwhelming amount of Palestinians who do not support Hamas) have?
If Israel would've treated the conflict like it is in effect under attack of a terrorist organization and preserve innocent lives, I'm pretty sure they would have the world's backing. Answering crimes with war crimes however is a very low blow and that is what is being condemned by the international community. So many extra, innocent lives are now lost and this only pours fuel in the conflict.
The world public wants to know the truth.✍️
Has the panel a heart for humanity.🌝
Have they got the guts to say
the truth🙏
@10:40 the eye roll from Iain dale says it all really !
I think he was looking for his brain.
@@T_J_ rumour has it he’s still looking !
Jes Dale, they IRA didn’t stop because they thought they could not win militarily. They always new that they could never beat the British Army, that’s just ludicrous. They reason why they entered into meaningful peace talks was because they believed that the means to a non-violent process was, at that time, a possible way to achieve their goals.
I emigrated from UK 26 years ago.
Although I love having a visit to SE London, it's amazing how pathetically weak it has become, nothing but apologies for everything.
In British media seems like the right of different opinions & views is not allow ..😂😂😂
Hamas are responsible for 1,000s of Israel & Palestinian death over the years. Hamas is like a cancer causing suffering and death to innocent Jews & Palestinians alike. Until the rule of Hamas is totally defeated the wars & deaths will never end. Only then can the peoples of both sides come together to negotiate a lasting peace. A united nation that can spend it´s money on Universities, Sciences, infrastructure etc., instead of bullets & bombs. As a peaceful, United State, they could stand tall and proud amongst all the other countries in the world.
Global Pacification Industry
Do the panellists not understand the difference between anti-Zionism, i.e. criticizing the actions of Israel's government and anti-Semitism, the hatred of jews?
Maybe Iain Dale's History lesson didn't mention that from the 1800s the UK, and Europe have feverishly looked for a place outside of Europe for the Jews to live. 1917's Balfour Declaration and the defeat of the Ottoman Empire, the UK decided as always to divide up someone else's country/ home to suit their needs. To add insult to injury, and again as per normal, the 2 groups can't get along with each other. Well done!!! To call someone antisemitic to have opposing view on Israel is amounting to be a WAR CRIME. There is no real answer to this problem!!! Peace!
This is why context is always important.
The host dismissing the last caller is part of the problem
Opposing views need to be discussed and understood not dismissed with the disdain he showed
Poor show
‘Once this is all done’ and there are no palestinians there will be peace. Too bad this path costs the legitimacy of the rules based international order.
One thing listening to this vomitous discussion reminds everyone that the British have learned nothing and internalized no responsibility for the disasters which are the consequences of their imperialist misadventures.
I’d love to hear the voice of a single colonized person presented in these matters. But there never will be invited and if they were their words, however correct, would be dismissed out of hand.
“Because you hate your own country” ….honestly, is that really his response?
When was this debate filmed ?
Gawd, that woman! who is she? so infuriating to have people on a discussion panel who constantly interrupt with huff and puffs or interjects when others are speaking. Either chose panel members better LBC or make sure you have a pep talk pre show.
I really wish Iain would bring the IEA on to tell me how to feel about Israel-Palestine 😮💨
Reminds me of when most of the Western world was on the wrong side of history with apartheid South Africa, including 'great' leaders like Thatcher. The bias is too engrained I'm afraid.
In Russia we've had all the money and no boycott, but still ended up in tyranny. Yes, it is partially our fault--we citizens were not able to prevent it, of course. But it was not because of boycott, or lack of money!
back in the 70s nobody could see peace in ireland... but now there is.
When Mr Spence said anti semtsim isn't like straight up racism but is instead is pravisiv this is a license for Jewish people to do want they want without being held accountable
Seems like 4 to 1 picking a fight, not getting answers
In fact… those two who denied the existence of war crimes should be fired. Not for their support of a “preferred side”, but because they both know the literal definition of what are war crimes, what Israel described and did, and blatantly denied it on screen as journalists.
Omg fire them both they keep coming up with bad faith positions. We don’t need journalists so blatantly biased in any part of the world today
The reality is. The two state solution can't work if one side doesn't want to. And one side definitely doesn't want to.