'I'm so tired of this rule': Denmark rant against VAR decisions in Germany loss
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- čas přidán 29. 06. 2024
- The Denmark manager, Kasper Hjulmand, took aim at football’s 'ridiculous' handball rules after they were beaten 2-0 by Germany in a controversial, storm-ravaged last-16 tie.
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Denmark had been well in the game against Germany and thought they had taken the lead when Joachim Andersen converted a chance three minutes after half-time. But the goal was disallowed by VAR for a fractional offside and, almost immediately afterwards, Andersen was penalised for a harsh handball picked up by the video officials.'I have the photo here, it was one centimetre', he said of the offside call. 'In terms of statistics and date it doesn’t make sense. This is not how we are supposed to be using VAR. It’s one centimetre'. Hjulmand continued: 'I’m so tired of the ridiculous handball rules. We cannot require our defenders to run with arms like this [flat to their side], it’s not natural'
Denmark’s Hjulmand attacks ‘ridiculous handball rules’ after defeat by Germany ► www.theguardian.com/football/...
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#Denmark #Germany #Euro2024 #Handball #VAR #DenmarkGermany - Sport
Denmark’s Hjulmand attacks ‘ridiculous handball rules’ after defeat by Germany ► www.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jun/30/denmarks-hjulmand-attacks-ridiculous-handball-rules-after-defeat-by-germany
I am Danish, but that does not influence my opinion.
Over 90 minutes, Germany was the better team and deserved to advance. Under the current rules, the decisions were correct.
Offside:
When video technology is used, there is a margin of error regarding how the images are composed and the sequence in which the ball is released by the teammate. If the result from VAR is too close to this margin of error, VAR cannot, in my opinion, make an objective decision. According to Hjulmand, who has information from experts, the margin of error is 3-4 cm, which means VAR should accept a margin of error of, for example, 5-6 cm - anything else would lie in uncertainty.
Handball rules:
The current handball rules state that players should not try to hide their hands. As long as the hands are in a natural position, it should count in the defender's favor. Andersen had no chance to move his hand when it was kicked from such a short distance.
For me, it's not about the decisions in the match, but what should happen going forward.
I agree that under the current rules the decisions were correct. Under the old rules Denmark would have been up 1-0 and Germany would not have gotten a penalty. Under the old rules Bellingham would also have been sent off today for his constant dives.
The issue is that none of these moves could by any chance have been recognized by a human and indeed only were detected by machine. That's not the VAR we want to question every scene by millimeter accuracy
Imagine we give 5-6 cm tolerance, then there would be discussion about 7-8 cm. It doesn‘t change the fact that there has to be a clear cut, which is not always favorable
Yes that's true
@@aXudar let’s imagine 20 cm for a second. What about 21 cm? The discussion wouldn’t change. A random coin toss is no adequate comparison …
Nagelsmann wouldn’t be saying “it’s fair and the rules are the rules” if the roles were reversed.
Did your crystal ball tell you that?
So wouldnt the danes if the roles were reversed💀
You must be his wife.😂
Yes he would. Because rules are rules. Accepting the rules is the normal thing to do, crying about having broken the rules and therefore losing just makes you a particularly sore loser
Probably not, but that doesn't mean he's wrong. The breadth of the offsides rule is ridiculous and the handballs rules are ridiculous as well.
Everyone is complaining that the rules are applied too precisely. 😂
It’s because football is not a computer game
Use common sense and not robotic precision
@@sanmateoflights Yeah let's let referees guess and ban even contact lenses.🤦♂🤦♂🤦♂ Hating tools that allows referees do their job better doesn't make you true football fan. I have respect for sportsmanship and all sweat players leave on the pitch. Wanna decisions as "robotic precise" and equal for both sides as possible. Games where referee can miss 3 meters offside and just say "sorry missed that" don"t have much "sense" for me.
The issue is not that the rules of VAR are too precise. The issue is that we are operating within a margin that is very close to the error margin concerning how the images are composed and when the ball is played by the teammate. If we allow VAR to operate too close to the known error margin, we accept that VAR makes potentially incorrect decisions - which contradicts the reason why VAR was invented.
The thing is Sport is getting tooo Technical
Qatar 2022 FWC was the best World Cup ever.
as someone not really into football i find it hilarious how you can complain about decisions like these, i do prefer technical decisions made with accuracy instead of a human who may misjudge a decision. It may have only been a few centimeters, but it was still a off.
You said it yourself. This issue is what differentiates the ones who have actually played a lot and at a level and those who have opinions but couldn't do 5 with a balloon on a string
@@farmorfire7752😂😂😂😂
you are not into football so you can never understand why this shouldnt be a thing
@@ChaseRiver2 the only thing i see is people who are emotional about this but with no valid reason just like you. "you wouldnt understand" is not a valid argument.
"I'm so tired of the rules when the decisions are against us."
He doesn't mention the goal which was disallowed for Germany though...actually 2 goals.
But that was meters of overstepping, here we are talking about 1 cm, that is a clear difference…
The hand ball is completely a different story from the offside rule. There’s nothing a player can do when the ball is hit at that pace from so close to the opposing player. No way that’s a penalty for me! The player can’t possibly get out the way of that cross.
Both of those goals were offside by a massive margin. Denmarks was "offside" by about half a toenail
People misunderstand the first goal that was cancelled. Another player illegally screened a defender so he couldn’t do his job. It wasn’t shown in the first replay, just way later.
@@nori633mate offside is offside, even if it's 1mm
Handball was utter disgrace
No it was not. Those are the rules and I have seen soft penalties like that been given on multiple occasions in every european league competition and UCL.
@@MrSheduurit was a disgrace. The guy kicked the ball at his hand. Not sure if you were even watching.
It's not was. The new handball rule is a disgrace that forces defenders to run around with their arms strapped behind their backs. The entire VAR system is. Back in the day Denmark would have been up 1-0 and no penalty to Germany.
@@Jose-sy1jeit would be 1-1 since germanys goal was overruled by var
@@swagkachu3784 This completely ignores the fact that teams play different tactics based on different scores and that chance therefore would not have happened. And I don't remember any Germany goal that would have stood
Why are players allowed to use hands to grab & pull at players? never understood that
offside is offside, 1 cm , 5 cm oder 50 cm, doesn`t matter
his point about the maring of uncertainty is valid though
What is the margin of error? When was the ball played? It's ridiculous
So what about the Lampard goal in 2010 which was 100 cm in the goal but judged no goal lol?
That’s totally fine or??🤔
Is there a real image or should I trust those 1986 graphics are accurate?
@@mortenchristoffersen6548 there is a chip in the ball which can determine to the millisecond in which moment the ball was played. I think the margin of error is less then a cm.
Too bad Denmark, yeah maybe you can lobby for VAR interpretations to change but I'm not concerned that a strong contender was eliminated from the Euros. Andersen, Vestergaard, Hojberg, Delaney are all victims to be had. And the attack is tepid at best, this is not the Denmark of the Laudrups. Carry on.
Even if there is a 4-5 cm uncertainty, if the attacker was closer according to the noisy measurement process, it means that in a purely statistical sense the probability of offside is higher than the probability of onside. And that's a rule that I can live with.
There is an alternative: offside should only be awarded if the probability of offside is greater than 95%. This would depend on the measurement uncertainty. If the uncertainty is high, there would be fewer offsides awarded.
Offside is something I just don’t have sympathy for the managers with. It’s either offside or it’s not, doesn’t matter if it’s a toe or a whole body. Everyone is playing the same game. Managers wouldn’t be so quick to complain if the opposition has a goal ruled out in similar fashion.
as he said, the offside graphics are not 100% accurate. They are within a span of 3-4cm, there's no way to say with a straight face that it's an obvious offside because that graphic shows 1cm offside.
@@ABC-ip6jq it's the most advanced technology we can use right now. if we add human input to review the decision we can't draw the line on what's offside or not anymore
Bruh ...you will understand...once your playing for your nation and your goal is offsided by 1 cm and after that got hand ball right after 2 mins .. which ofc it wasn't even an handball .
@@wakanda573 Offside is offside. The technology is extremely accurate and the handball rules exist, they are bad, but not the fault of the ref.
@@ABC-ip6jq You would not say the same about the Goal Line Technology, would you?
Michael Oliver is the worst referee in Europe .
1:40 - it feels like the 80s with that hairstyle. He looks like part of the band.
2:16 His accent is like Gus1thego's
The match was net even. What is he talking about?
Yes it was, sure after the goal Germany got more big chances which is normal consider Denmark is chasing a result and has to change fokus on attack which open you up in the defence
@@danielpetersen4877the better team won in the end
@@BulaRotMGwhy didn’t they just win then through normal means if they are so much better? They might have, we will just never know.
@@BulaRotMG maybe they did, but why did they need help then
@@ToTheNines87368 they were the better team though? Did u not watch?
VAR has an error margin much larger than 1cm, which is why you cannot call a 1cm offside, end of story
Dont mention the VAR.
😂 from a German
Such a small margin in an offside - VAR cant be sure if it really was offside = NO OFFSIDE! Those VAR handballs are ruining this great game!
The offside decision is fine. There will always be some arbitrary cut-off point, and here unfortunately, it was very close to being onside. The handball, though, is unfair. Even though it may be a correct decision under the current rules, the rules should be changed.
Subtitles are a little off
Is the offside call for denmark fair ? Yes, there is no such thing as “attackers advantage” when the job of var and refereeing in general is to bring order and fairness to a game
For the penalty call is it the right decision ? I more so think that michael oliver choose the “easy” option per say because at the end of the day he can just say that there is contact with the hand
what's the use of measuring until centimeter while offside in football..
That video should be the base for changing FIFA's rules.
Yeah, new rule - Denmark have to win, because they can't deal with defeats! 🤮
New rule, if my team loses let's change the rules so that I win
@@netuseristThe offside is ok even though it's super close because an offside is just a fact. You are either onside or not (even it's by a few millimeters). But the hand ball rule is going out of hand (pun intended). In that case, why not training the strikers to kick the ball aiming at the defenders hands, instead of just bothering aiming at the goal. There are probably 6-7 defenders in the small rectangle. Each have a pair of hand. So, that's 14 hands to shoot at, instead of 1 goal. That or having the all defense standing with their hands locked being their back. Do you really want to see that in football ?
@@rustyspygoat4089 My comment was about the hand ball rule. Football is going to end up being super weird to watch. With defenders with their hands locked behind their back ?
@@_el.guapo_ maybe you are a newbie to football, but news flash!!!! defenders have been doing that for the last 3 decades...
He's absolutely right
the offside goal is just ridiculous and laughable , i do not have a problem with the handball decision in my opinion
Rules, or not rules, one thing is clear for me (and not only): I’m out of watching football forever! Will still (as far as I can) play it with friends.
Danish coach don’t accept home advantage exists
terrible officiating in the euros. Var is being used to alter the essence of football. If nobody in that stadium saw an offside is because it was not an offside! No one saw it coming!!! No one
offside rule should be like this:
offside if: the receiver is offside when the ball is being hit an hes also offside when he receives.
onside if: the receiver is onside when he receives the ball.
very easy. the current rule supports lazy defenders and ruins football with VAR
Dudes are not wrong.
Ridiculous handball decision
Did he say soccer? Awesome!
The centimeter offside and microscopic handballs are horrendous rules
They are not using common sense
Just use VAR for clear and obvious errors instead of centimeters and minor brushes with the hand
Use VAR but stop using this ridiculous over precision
Football is not a computer game
Anyone who saw this game knows that Denmark were robbed. If this happened to Germany 🇩🇪 or the holier than though England 🏴 then what?
Robbed by what? A 2-1 loss? Give me a break... Arguing on technicalities is the hallmark of a petty looser.
Of course the Germans think it was fair. All I have to say is that was a real loser way to win. I wouldn’t be celebrating if I was a German.
That's VAR for you and the way teams win. Argentina were awarded 5 dodgy penalties at the World Cup that would never have been penalties prior to VAR. For everyone it's like that and I don't like it either
Celebrating all day. Denmark was weak and germany couldve scored 4 goals
We scored 4 goals of which only 2 were counted. Denmark still scored only 1 goal in the whole match, that rightfully wasn’t counted (because it was offside and rules are rules and apply to everyone equally)
@@swagkachu3784 Denmark is better, and Germany got their hands held so they could stay in because Germany is hosting the games. They will be out soon enough.
can see the animation for the offside is wrong. the German player is much futher back when the play happen. So much the buy-in of the Var
The decision is not made based on the animation. The decision is made based on the raw data from the 42VAR cameras and from the AI interpretation of the images.
I don't care if Denmark lost, as I root for Germany (since Sweden didn't qualify), but VAR has effectively ruined football.
What a bunch of sore losers
These are the modern rules the younger generation wanted. VAR looks at trivial (often meaningless) things to award dubious penalties. Goals are annulled bc a player wears shoe size 12 insteas of 10. Football has gotten so bad.
It's all rigged , who even watches this BS
Disgraceful! Especially the handball ruling!
Bad ref
How dare you score against Germany, the host country?
here we go: OFFSIDE + PENALTY :)
VAR decisions ... hey ref, here ... take this phone and listen ... or else ...
offside = 1cm ... I wonder how did they evaluate the 1cm ... they never could when they themselves state that magin for error is 5cm ...
penalty ... guy was running with hands in natural position ... he aimed his hand from less than 1 meter ...
I agree totally with the Danish coach!!!
What a cry baby, so embarrassing... have some self esteem dude. Germany was the better team, it was offside and it was a hands.
English officials🙄
What is the margin of error on these computer stills? Why is it always the British refs?
The ref was atrocious. I reckon this was his last match this tournament.
The referee whistled according to the rules.
It wasn't the ref's fault. He didn't make the calls. It was due to VAR and he is forced to make those calls.
Its crazy how everyone is ranting about the 1cm offside decision but what happened when Japan scored a goal where the ball was out of pitch vs Geemany in 2022 WC (it was barely in as per the graphics later shown by fifa)?
totally agree - we always have these decisions and have to live with it...
To have a toe/ one centimetre in office doesn’t give a significant advantage. Future rules should be based on something more.
Regarding the current handball rules, they are just ridiculous. There should be signs that it was done on purpose. In this case he would have to react faster than a F1 driver to move his hand.
what is the real advantage being in front / in a scale of a toe nail or a kneecap? yes the tech makes it possible... but simple nobody real ask for this
The handball was criminal.
Denmark is ridiculous for complaining….the rules applies to all so he wants it to increase it multiple centimeters then people going to complain about that too, and the hand ball was handlball….should we then start making excuses for everything …next time Denmark play better football…period.
Thanks to VAR, football is fairer
Im so tired that people det angry about the rules, only if they feel that they have a disadvantage. All rules are the same for every country and player, you can use these rules clever.
1) moan before the tournament and not after, 2) offside is a fact, even if it only 1mm, the offensive player just have to be aware and stay 2cm behind, 3)handball is difficult when you don't want to open the Door for Manipulation. So you need rules which are not open for Interpretation, because every referee could come to and different opinion. Now that the Balls has a sensor it helps understanding what happend ( handball and for offside). they know exactly when the ball was touched. so Once again. If you want a Game that Can't be Manipulated deliberatly or undeliberatedly you need Clear rules and facts. In Football is more and more Money involved, so there should be room for injustices.
Your statement about the ball and offside is unfortunately misleading, so I'll share my comment again:
In the video, Hjulmand states that according to statistics, the margin of error is 3-4 cm, which I assume to be the average since the margin varies from situation to situation.
The chip in the ball can indeed indicate when the ball is passed. However, the data from the chip needs to synchronize with the video footage. Even a small discrepancy in the timing between the ball's data and the video footage can introduce an error margin.
Achieving an error margin of less than one centimeter would require extremely precise technology, given the many variables involved.
Conclusion: When the offside is within the margin of error, VAR don't know if a player is offside or not.
Currently, there are no clear rules on who should benefit from the error margin. This leaves the decision to the referee, which theoretically means there is no definitive answer to who gains the advantage.
@@aXudar Im happy when a computer makes maybe minimal errors and its the same for every team, humans make much bigger errors and not the same for each team. So I would always would choose the computer, also computers dont accept presents. It is the best we can do at the moment to keep it as fair as possible.
@@frankjerke - VAR is a combination of technology and human interaction. Decisions regarding VAR are not made solely by technology but are a collaborative process between advanced technology and qualified referees.
For example, in offside situations, VAR referees use advanced software to place the lines that determine the decision regarding the call. However, it is the referees who decide where the lines should be placed based on their assessment of the situation and the best available camera angles. This requires significant human interaction and judgment.
Therefore, it is humans who analyze the available video footage and use the technology to help make an accurate decision.
It is thus a misconception to believe that decisions are solely made by a computer or technology. :)
@@aXudar More Computer less Room for Interpretation. Anyway Both Teams have the Same Computer / Software so its fair. For sure more fair then years ago and it is going in the Right direction
offside is offside, 1 meter, 1 centimeter or 1 millimeter, it doesnt matter
The margin of error in VAR technology means that he could be onside. The margin of error is 3-4cm, which means that an offside decision of 3-4cm, as judged by VAR, could potentially be incorrect.
VAR cannot guarantee that he is offside when the decision falls within the margin of error.
No!
In tennis is another world, this applied to football is ridiculous! Less goals is exciting or a kind of technical evolution??
Cry more😂😂
Corrupt referee
No, just a bad rule for handball.
@@numchacar Source?
@@numchacar Sure, that is why Schlotterbeck's goal did not count. Stop lying to yourself.
Football is trash 👎
Just do away with the offside rule.
He doesn't mention Germanys first goal that was disallowed.
The handball was crystal clear! You could see in the replay that he kept following the ball with his hand.
He knew this, that's why he had such a concerned face.
Denmark was lucky vs Serbia. Could have been a penalty and another handball.
So if you want to win, be better. Don't blame the rules.
Especially when you're so one sided and subjective!
Qatar 2022 FWC was the best World Cup ever.
You guys couldn't win a single game against anyone. Just go home.
The rules only apply some times to some teams. Euro refrees decide results!!!⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️⚽️