Beginner’s Guide to Recording Flamenco and Classical Guitar - An Extremely Non-Technical Discussion
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- čas přidán 29. 06. 2024
- Do you want to learn how to record yourself playing guitar? Having recorded more than 1500 guitar videos, I thought I’d share some of the stuff I’ve learned over the years about how to record nylon string guitars. The first section deals with what to think about when recording in mono (one microphone), and the second half of the video looks at some relatively simple stereo techniques (two microphones) including XY, spaced pair, and AB.
Huge thanks to the folks at Soyuz Microphones for providing some truly kick-ass mics.
0:00 Introduction
0:55 Put On Your Headphones!
1:56 Where To Record
2:09 Placement
2:43 What Mics To Use
4:22 Proximity Effect
11:53 Stereo XY
16:56 Stereo Spaced Pair
20:18 Changing Capsule to Omnidirectional
21:16 Stereo AB With Stereo Bar
23:01 Conclusion
This is so far the best video that I have been encounter in this matter. I love how everything is explained practically without getting buried in technical stuff.
Thanks for sharing your experience. A complete and comprehensive course of recodring classic guitar. 🤩
I trust a person that says 'I don't know what I'm talking about.'
Great video. Thanks.
Very helpful, Kai, especially the part about one-mic and the space-out setups. Will try it for recording my non-flamenco EP. BIG SMILE!
I really dig this channel! I’ve always appreciated your playing, presentation, and advice. Thank you!
Got a pair of Km 184 arriving soon and this video is gold. Thank you very much
Advice from the expert!! I've been waiting for this 🙏🏼🙏🏼 Thanks Kai!
I learned more from this video than all the previous classical guitar recording videos I've watched combined. Thank you!
Excellent, very well presented, thanks for sharing your wealth of knowledge on this topic.
Fantastic video! I did a few videos for Guitar Salon 4 years ago and working with you was a great experience. When the pandemic hit, I started my own CZcams channel and started recording myself. It's been quite the learning curve but I just upgraded to a matched pair of Rode NT5's and this video was extremely helpful. Doing some practice takes today and then my official recording tomorrow. Thanks for all the great advice!!!
Excellent info! Thank you!
Really well explained video. Thank you!
Thanks so much Kai! Not a lot of info on recording flameno, let alone classical guitar. Very helpful.
Thanks, quite useful info!
Yes, how did you know that I needed & was looking for this, gracias
Lot’s of questions answered here plus questions I didn’t know I would have. Excellent.
Thank you very much for sharing your experience. Very valuable information
This is excellent, thank you!
Great video. Thank you so much!
Thanks a lot for this video! 🙌
You are absoulotely gorgeous teacher!!! Just Thank u❤🌷
Hi Kai and Tara. Tell us more about Granada. Welcome back.
I'm literally stunned about how good this video is, instantly subbed, shared to a guitarist discord server, and tomorrow I'll try to apply some of the advices!
Thanks Alessandro - so glad it's actually helpful! Have fun recording :)
I had no idea you were the guitar salon guy, I love that channel that and the solar flamenco channel are my most viewed channels for sure. Also I am subscribed to your Flamenco Explained website, it's a great platform and has helped me tremendously, thank you for all that you do
Thanks Bradley - So glad you’re liking the Flamenco Explained site!
wow!!! finally I learned something. Thanx!!!
So glad we could help (finally)!
Cheers,
Kai
Thank You Very Usefull.
Thank you guitar Mark Ruffalo, this was a very helpful video
Small membrane condensers are the gold standard for classical and chamber music spot miking. Smaller capules have better bass response (counterintuitively) and tend to be less coloured. If you can afford schöps or dsp, good for you, but any modern cardioid design will work great and just touch up with eq in post. Good luck!
thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you!
Thank you
Hello Kai. Great video. Very useful information. And thanks for posting it, as well as all your other videos. One request:
Could you please, please, describe how the signal is processed?... So many videos talk about mic placement, sound reflection etc. But through what interface are you recording? How are the levels set? Any EQ, compression etc.
That sort of information I cant find anywhere. Thanks again.
super!!!
Thank you for the lesson, the guitar sound we're hearing in this video, is it directly from the mic, unmixed? I wish you could do a tutorial on mixing also, GSI videos sound so epic
Hey - the sound is directly from the mic, but of course I always mix some. Mixing can be anything from just adjusting the levels and the balance between the mics to adding processing like reverb and compression. In this case I did almost nothing to the guitar mics, though I almost always use a plugin called Auto Align (made by Sound Radix) to get the phase and time alignment right between the various mics. For a performance (as opposed to a demonstration like this one) I might then add some reverb and compression, and I always add a limiter to the final mix to get the levels a bit higher for the final video. I don't use EQ very often on guitars, as I prefer to get the sound I want through mic placement. After the mics and mic placement, the reverb usually most affects the sound. The GSI videos also have the benefit of being recorded in a great-sounding space.
Cheers,
Kai
@@FlamencoExplained thank you so much for such a detailed answer, I really appreciate it. I’m a huge fan of yours and the GSI videos too.
Very inspiring, actually this is what I am working on right now... :-) How did you know? Thx a lot.
Just had a feeling :)
Hi Kai, recording newbie here. I really appreciate the well explained tutorial.
What are your mics plugged into?
For this video I was using a Sound Devices MixPre 6. The mic pres and interface are important, of course, but I'd argue that good mics area waaay more important place to start.
Cheers,
Kai
Miss u kai❤❤❤
Great Kai, very informative. Question, do you hard pan each signal L and R. For your stereo sounds?
Generally no, but sometimes I do. I usually listen and see what sounds best.
Cheers,
Kai
One thing you missed here is the stereo Mic over the shoulders setup (110 degree stereo). This allows to capture the classic guitar from the view point of what the player hears without headphones. This creates more issues with phasing of course, but I have done a few trials and it simply sounds like nothing out there. I moved up to use a 4 mic setup ( 2 x/y stereo in the front of the player and 2 110 degree apart over the shoulders of the player). You only need 3 mics to do this ( X/Y in the front and one figure 8 over the shoulders, but the full stereo of 4 is simply nothing like I ever head.
I haven't played with that one very much. I generally prefer what I hear out in front of the guitar to what the player hears, but maybe I'll try that combination one of these days and see what happens :)
Hi and thank you for all you have done for me through the years. could you tell me what DAW you perfer or do you use a recording device. Thanks again
Hey David - I was a Pro Tools guy for over 20 years. I still love Pro Tools, but really dislike the parent company, so about six months ago I switched to Reaper and I'm pretty happy so far (since I no longer run a commercial studio I don't have to worry too much about compatibility anymore). The recorder I use a lot for location sessions is a Sound Devices MixPre, which I'm very happy with.
Cheers,
Kai
Hi! Great video. In XY configuration, how do you deal with the fact that the mic pointing towards the bridge is always a lot louder than the one pointing at the neck? Do you have different gain settings on the preamps while recording or do you fix it afterwards? I notice that in the video, the guitar sounds in the center with you XY pair. How did you do ? (if you remember). Thanks a lot. Eric
Hey Eric - it’s generally not as big a difference as you might think, but you can adjust as needed either when tracking or in the mix. If your preamps allow for small enough adjustment it’s probably easier to set them when tracking, but if not it’s no big deal to adjust after.
Thank you!
i was wondering if you could recommend a specific guitar (or a budget range) for good quality recordings.
i play 20+ years, i have mics&preamps. but my concert guitars were always the type to sell for 50$ on 2nd hand market..
will a better guitar make a significant difference?
Will make a big difference. Classical or flamenco or hybrid?
Thanks - useful stuff! I've only got an SM58, which I tend to take the grille off for recording guitar. I find the signal is so weak coming into my DAW. Turning the gain up on my audio interface just results in distortion. I think I do need to invest in a condenser mic within the near future. I'm concerned this will be too good and pick up all the signals from my noisy upstairs neighbour!
Lots of great recordings have been made with an SM58 (or SM57)! If you have a really inexpensive interface I can see how the preamps might add noise as you crank, but you should be able to get enough signal to a 58 that you're not adding too much noise with most modern interfaces. I'd play with getting a bit closer to the mic - that'll both get you a stronger signal (so you need less from the pre) and also a stronger signal compared to the noisy neighbors. Just make sure you're not too close to the soundhole so it doesn't get too boomy!
Cheers,
Kai
@@FlamencoExplained Thanks Kai - I think I'm being too obsessed with the signal being as strong as possible without it clipping. I've got a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 audio interface and, while I can't compare to any others I think the preamps are quite good. I'll try moving closer to the mic. I think I need to experiment finding a comfortable seating position to record in where I'm not worried about whacking the mic while playing! Got a piece of music I want to record this weekend, so looking forward to giving this a go!
@@samuelconnolly347 I've heard really good things about the Scarlett interfaces, so I suspect you have plenty of clean gain for an SM58. But yeah, no need to obsess about getting the gain as hot as possible, as there's just really no need for a super hot signal. I'll pretty much always err on the side of being a bit low rather than risk clipping.
Hello Kai! Great content, thanks! Are the Soyuz 013 the FET or tube versions?
Those are the FET versions.
Cheers,
Kai
Great video! I love Soyuz 013s. Two questions: 1) Have you ever used the Coles 4038s? I've been told that many of the classic guitar recordings where done with those mics 2) Could you consider putting the mics and mic pres used on the GSI videos somewhere in the description? I'm always curious about that when I watch those videos. I was especially interested when I caught a glimpse of an r44 in a video recently.
Hey Peter - I've used the Coles, but not enough that I'm super familiar with them. They're often used for classical recording, and you're right that they've been used on a lot of good guitar records. For most of the GSI vids from about 2015 to 2020 I used a pair of km84's and an AEA 44CE (from 2010 to about 2015 it was just the pair of km84's). I stopped doing the GSI vids in the beginning of 2020, so that's not my call anymore to add the mics used. Last I heard they were using the Warm Audio km4 clone and a ribbon (I cant remember which, but not the AEA).
Cheers,
Kai
@@FlamencoExplained How do you feel about KM 184s, and both those and the KM 84s against the Soyuz 013s? Had a tough time deciding between the KM 184s and the Soyuz 013s.
@@jones786 There's something very special about the original km84. The km184 is a very good mic too, but I'd go for the Soyuz, especially since you can get the other capsules for them. Great mics!
Question: Hi Kai. What kind of device is your microphone connected to that returns the music to your headphones? Audio interface, mixer, recorder, or mixer-recorder? I would like everything next to me when I record, so that I don't have to get up and go to that device. I don't want to use a PC either, but rather just have some simple recorder that has phantom power and that will feed me back the sound through my headphones. Thanks in advance.
What I use for sessions like this is a Sound Devices MixPre 6. Though it also functions as an interface, I use it as a field recorder. It's tiny compared to the interface-plus-computer rig I used to use, and I'm not really making any compromises. The whole Sound Devices line is great, but so are lots of the Zoom recorders and there are lots of field recorders that will let you do what you're talking about without using a computer/interface.
Cheers,
Kai
@@FlamencoExplained Thanks, Kai! I just happened to be looking at the same recorder the other day. It seems to meet my needs. I appreciate your reply. And again, I really have enjoyed your book.
👍
I'm not a professional. The most I hope to do is record myself for CZcams so my grand kids can see me play. What would be your advice for recording with an iPhone and free apps?
The biggest issue with using your phone is that you're probably putting the mic where the camera needs to be rather than where the mic sounds best. So either play around with finding a good compromise spot for the phone so that it sounds good, or consider getting an external microphone for the phone. Almost any external mic you get will make a big difference, but if you can get one with a cable (rather than attaching directly to the phone) then you can play with putting the mic in the best sounding spot.
Have you messed around with a NOS mic configuration?
cuando dijo palmas se me bugeo la cabeza
What about a classical guitar, one mic, and the relationship to howling feedback from a combo amp position> Please?
Well - feedback is about the sound from the amp getting back into the microphone - so now the amplified sound gets amplified, etc... and it all happens over and over so fast you wind up with a howl. So you need to position your amp or monitor in a way that the sound doesn't get back to the mic. Knowing your microphone's polar patterns really helps here, as that will help you understand what part of the mic rejects sound best, which helps you determine where to place monitors/amps. Does that help?
Cheers,
Kai
@@FlamencoExplained Yes , indeed thankyou, I'm off to give it a try! Have a cool day!
What kind of guitar is that? It sounds and looks beautiful.
That’s a Stephen Hill model 2A flamenco guitar
Do you ever use compression on classical or flamenco guitars? If so, how?
Short answer is yes, but not too much. If I use a compressor it's as much or more for the character/sound it gives me as it is for actual compression. The basic "rule" is that for classical you really don't want to ever hear the compression, though I'd say it's more acceptable in flamenco. As a final touch I'll often use a peak limiter (as transparent as possible) for stray peaks to get the levels up.
Going by what you hear instead of doing what you read online is the best advice I would say... I remember reading about using a SM7 on death metal grunt vocals everywhere, so we rented that mic, did a blind test with 10 other mics of various types and costs, rated them all (blind) and it turned out we liked the SM7 almost the least, and a 60 dollar mic actually was ranked number 3 on our list. Not saying the SM7 is a bad mic but it didn't fit this particular singer. Different singers/instruments need different mics.
Yep - and lots of times an SM57 will do the job better than anything else in the studio.
How to get rid of white noise, hiss, air noise?
You can use software in mastering stage. For example products made by Izotope.
Does anybody know which manufacturer made Kai's guitar, please?
That guitar was made by Stephen Hill, in La Herradura, Granada, Spain.
Cheers,
Kai
So with a stereo X/Y like that found on a zoom h5, I should be recording in stereo too in audacity?
Yep. And the Zoom makes it easy by giving you a perfect X/Y you can’t mess up. Don’t remember if it will let you record mono with just one of the built in mics, but if so I’d try both to hear the difference.
@@FlamencoExplained Thanks for the info. I used to have a spruce top that just sounded amazing when being recorded. Now my more expensive luthier double top cedar guitar has this boomy bass when recording. It's kind of annoying because the "in the room" feel sounds balanced. Going to try and apply some of your ideas to solve this.
@@blahdiblah2169 That actually makes sense. A "bigger" or "warmer" guitar will often sound boomier up close, while a "faster" guitar will generally mic nicely a bit closer (cedar generally being warmer and spruce faster). The further you get from the source the more early reflections you get - in other words you hear the room more, and that's generally not such a good thing in a less than ideal acoustic space (why you get the boomy bass). So a big sounding cedar guitar can be more of a challenge to record. I'd suggest playing with where you are in the room and also where the mics are in relation to the guitar.
@@FlamencoExplained I like you idea of live placement. Having a monitor through headphones. I reckon with this and the other knowledge you provided I should be good now. Hopefully, and if not I might use my cheaper Yamaha for recording and then spend time in post production to improve the timbre.
15:50 well that's totally wrong...
wat mic are you using?
I'm using a Soyuz 013 FET with a cardioid capsule for the first half of the video, and a pair of them for the second half - first with the cardioid capsules and then with the omni capsules for the AB setup.
Cheers,
Kai
@@FlamencoExplained gracias! and i want you to do various mic test
Russian microphones are really great
My friend, need more volume. Thankyou.
Blablablablabla........😓
Say something useful
I'm assuming that, due to sanctions imposed on Russia after their invasion of Ukraine, it is not possible to buy the Soyuz microphones from the manufacturer in Russia?
I can’t speak for the company, but the mics seem to still be for sale all over the place.
The best tutorial i've watched, very informative thnks