[Viewer's Request] The Polar Express vs NKP 765 (Trainz)

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  • čas přidán 27. 03. 2019
  • We note our regular viewer, Tony, who supporting our channel almost since the beginning mentioned about the Polar Express and NKP 765 serval times, so we adjusted his request a little to show him two of his most favorite steam locomotives in one video. ( ==we didn't pause the game when the race start because of a strange glitch which would make the train stalling== )
    A race between the fantasy world and the reality, which train is gonna win the race? The train with dreams or the engine with fame? ((( ALL ABOARD!! )))
    Thank you for watching! : )
    (The Polar Express is a product of K&L Trainz, The NKP 765 is a built-in locomotive of Trainz: T.A.N.E)
  • Auta a dopravní prostředky

Komentáře • 256

  • @LegendRails
    @LegendRails Před 5 lety +82

    YESSSSS!!! THE POLAR EXPRESS!!!

    • @kylahill1803
      @kylahill1803 Před 4 lety +2

      M

    • @nofeargaming9403
      @nofeargaming9403 Před 4 lety +1

      TonyGames Junior The polar express engine #1225 was actually the Nickle Plate Road #765

    • @FranzFerdinandVIII
      @FranzFerdinandVIII Před 4 lety +4

      Actually it was loosely based off Pere marquette 1225 (an operational Berk)

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety +1

      The NKP 765 is getting closer to Polar Express (Pere Marquette)

    • @delonallen9516
      @delonallen9516 Před 3 lety

      Record

  • @LaZeRJET
    @LaZeRJET Před 4 lety +8

    wow not bad looks like a Fun Little Race

  • @bennytheadventurekidbtak2346

    Poler express: WEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!! Nickel plate road 765: COME HERE BABY!!!

    • @FranzFerdinandVIII
      @FranzFerdinandVIII Před 4 lety +4

      Are you saying that Nickel Plate 765 gave birth to the Polar Express?

    • @CCXmas
      @CCXmas Před 2 lety +1

      @@FranzFerdinandVIII why is there 1225 on the polar express

  • @TheBroughamGamer
    @TheBroughamGamer Před 5 lety +45

    The Polar Express is one fun engine to play around with. I once got it up to 340 mph XD.

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +12

      In the fantasy world, even a cat can hit 156 mph. :P Btw, I think this is the highlight of this video : 09:34 : )

    • @TheBroughamGamer
      @TheBroughamGamer Před 5 lety +4

      @@Jones3DModelingClub so true. The only one I never believed was a Shay going 200. It was weird.

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +4

      @@TheBroughamGamer lol

    • @TheBroughamGamer
      @TheBroughamGamer Před 5 lety +3

      @@Jones3DModelingClub i like 11:02 when they are almost evenly matched.

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +2

      @@TheBroughamGamer You spoiled the game! :P Anyway, it shows that Auran and K&L Trainz's config of Berkshires is similar.

  • @KLTrainz
    @KLTrainz Před 4 lety +15

    You'll notice the "regulator 100" on the NKP berk was blinking yellow, that means the engine was slipping. When you're in cab mode and you throw the throttle wide open, you're almost guaranteed to have a wheel slip until you back off and gradually work it up. You got lucky with the Polar Express engine lol

  • @mightymanntor8333
    @mightymanntor8333 Před 4 lety +16

    notice how 765 slowed down, it lots boiler presser. while the polar express has 221 psi the 765 had 56 psi

  • @amfan_17presentations87
    @amfan_17presentations87 Před 4 lety +15

    In reality, Berkshires can top out at 70mph. But I guess anything is possible in Trainz.

    • @andrewtheberkshireengine4385
      @andrewtheberkshireengine4385 Před 2 lety +1

      Nkp 765 runs in 70-80mph google said it
      And in 1225's service run his top speed is 55mph but in full speed 70mph

  • @jam22401ify
    @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +9

    Wow look how fast the 1225 is going

  • @Kleman09
    @Kleman09 Před 4 lety +7

    This is cool! 765's bell doesnt swing though. Its clapper is operated by air, controlled by a valve in the cab. Both engines have Lima's famed "shot gun" exhaust.

    • @FranzFerdinandVIII
      @FranzFerdinandVIII Před 4 lety +1

      So the exhaust fumes are just rounds of ammo?

    • @Kleman09
      @Kleman09 Před 4 lety +1

      @@FranzFerdinandVIII no. Shot gun exhaust means that the engine's sharp exhaust sounds like a shot gun firing off, especially when working hard.

    • @FranzFerdinandVIII
      @FranzFerdinandVIII Před 4 lety +1

      thx for the info @@Kleman09.

    • @LegoCreator3801
      @LegoCreator3801 Před 2 lety

      And fact they are both Berkshires

  • @shyanneharper106
    @shyanneharper106 Před 4 lety +11

    i love the polar express.

    • @jam22401ify
      @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +2

      YES!!!!! The pere marquette is ahead now awesome !!!!

    • @jam22401ify
      @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +2

      The polar Express is the best and fastest locomotive did you know that 765 is catching up !

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety +1

      Me too!! 🚂🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃🚃

    • @JACESOFFICIAL
      @JACESOFFICIAL Před 3 lety +1

      memory of peremarquette 1225 1941-2021

    • @robintheslavewr1513
      @robintheslavewr1513 Před 3 lety

      @@JACESOFFICIAL 1225 isn't going anywhere

  • @jam22401ify
    @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +6

    Oh dear 765 is getting close

  • @ReverieMoonlight_
    @ReverieMoonlight_ Před 5 lety +34

    9:48 765 be like: *_GEIT BAICK HEIRE BOIH_*

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety +2

      *GET BACK HEREFORDSHIRE*

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety

      Frickert Express: **GEIT BAICK HEIRE BOIJ**

  • @jam22401ify
    @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +4

    Awesome the polar Express is really gast

    • @jam22401ify
      @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +1

      Dude ! That train is going about a mile

  • @SKY_MORPHEDITS
    @SKY_MORPHEDITS Před 4 lety +30

    The polar Express is so ridiculously fast

    • @thunderbird1921
      @thunderbird1921 Před 4 lety +7

      Of course, it's a magical train!

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety +1

      @@thunderbird1921 really? :/

    • @titanic_the_gamer2.087
      @titanic_the_gamer2.087 Před 3 lety +2

      @@thunderbird1921 is that how the polar express derailed and go to the town Xd

    • @Toaster844
      @Toaster844 Před 3 lety +1

      I think I got it to reach 200 mph in the game

    • @CCXmas
      @CCXmas Před 2 lety +1

      @@Toaster844 we need a train faster than that

  • @braydenrailfanner710
    @braydenrailfanner710 Před 3 lety +2

    make polar express vs 844 :3

  • @jam22401ify
    @jam22401ify Před 4 lety +9

    Wow! The polar express is way ahead awesome

  • @SFRY_Government
    @SFRY_Government Před 3 lety +2

    Engineer of 765: cmon henry dont be silly, dont be silly

  • @fernandoqueirozpopovic7024
    @fernandoqueirozpopovic7024 Před 4 lety +14

    *Polar Express theme intensifies*

    • @FranzFerdinandVIII
      @FranzFerdinandVIII Před 4 lety +2

      *09:18* (Polar Express) I'M FREE!!!
      *09:23* (NKP 765) Fall back into my loving rods!
      >>Queue "Benny Hill" by Boots Randolph!

    • @That_Thicc_Cat
      @That_Thicc_Cat Před 3 lety +1

      Honestly if this were a real race, the Polar Express would smoke 765 instantly, or it would just teleport to the finish line lol

    • @fernandoqueirozpopovic7024
      @fernandoqueirozpopovic7024 Před 3 lety +1

      @@That_Thicc_Cat not really because if it could, it could have gotten over the frozen lake with ease so...nah not really

    • @That_Thicc_Cat
      @That_Thicc_Cat Před 3 lety +1

      Fernando Queiroz Popovic It still got over the lake, besides, the engineer was constantly throwing the train back and forth between forward and reverse

    • @fernandoqueirozpopovic7024
      @fernandoqueirozpopovic7024 Před 3 lety +1

      @@That_Thicc_Cat yup and that's not teleporting

  • @user-xc6yp3wx3u
    @user-xc6yp3wx3u Před 4 lety +5

    north pole express

  • @JerzeyBoy
    @JerzeyBoy Před 4 lety +10

    0:05 ALLLL ABOOAAARD!

  • @griggerp
    @griggerp Před 5 lety +5

    Ocemy Pere Marquette 1225 vs Ocemy Nickel Plate Road 765

  • @FranzFerdinandVIII
    @FranzFerdinandVIII Před 4 lety +7

    (26.Dec.2019, 76th comment)
    Whistle on the Polar Express here has a Short E sound (ex. "WHEN"), but in the movie, it has a Short U sound (ex. "UHHH"). Maybe modify the whistle to sound more authentic?

  • @CanadianRRProductions
    @CanadianRRProductions Před 3 lety +2

    Bruh with the bells its a melody

  • @riondoesthings1988
    @riondoesthings1988 Před 4 lety +4

    You should have done pere Marquette vs polar express I mean it does fit more

  • @wolfzillaproductions4563
    @wolfzillaproductions4563 Před 2 lety +1

    NKP 765 isn’t designed to go this fast in real life, but this is Trainz. You can make the locomotives exceed their design limits without breaking the engine. But imagine 765 and the Polar Express going the speed they are in this video. Either engine would make Mallard sweat like mad XDDD

  • @ethanprime8336
    @ethanprime8336 Před 4 lety +16

    The poler express is the fastest of them all!!! :D

  • @FuzionHyperX
    @FuzionHyperX Před 5 lety +6

    I have to admit the quality is amazing

  • @seaboardairlineproductions7185

    what if you
    wanted to go to heaven
    but god said
    Speed: 129 mph

  • @whatsitaboutwithphilcraig6661

    Polar Express wins every time for me , however the 765 carry’s a lot of detail and doesn’t have the Christmas magic to win I’m afraid.

  • @SouthernerFloridain2006
    @SouthernerFloridain2006 Před 4 lety +6

    Holiday season?

  • @avatarthanosthelegendarysu5883

    What is the name train that is next polar Express and where can I download it from

  • @andreeaandre3075
    @andreeaandre3075 Před 4 lety +6

    mallard vs the poler express

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety

      No

    • @JACESOFFICIAL
      @JACESOFFICIAL Před 3 lety

      polar express is fasyter in trainz mallard can only go like 80 mph 1225in trainz aka polar express can go 122-156 mph

    • @windusbindo
      @windusbindo Před 3 lety

      @@JACESOFFICIAL mine is the Wanterburg Express, it can go about 234 MPH

  • @s10ondubs
    @s10ondubs Před 5 lety +11

    Could you do Frisco 4003 2-8-2 light Mikado versus nkp 765

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +3

      Sure! There are a few "Viewer's Request" waiting, I think we can arrange a race for them by next Wednesday. : ) Thank you for watching!

    • @s10ondubs
      @s10ondubs Před 5 lety +4

      Thank you nkp 765 and Frisco 4003 My favorite engines

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +2

      @@s10ondubs You are welcome! : )

    • @s10ondubs
      @s10ondubs Před 5 lety +1

      I forgot to say light mikado and if you can’t find Frisco 4003 not much information about Frisco 4003 on the Internet and I don’t know if there’s a model in train simulator so if you can’t find one look for another Frisco light mikado

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +3

      @@s10ondubs Cool! I think we have the Frisco 1522. We can change the number to 4003, do you think it is ok?

  • @ethanprime8336
    @ethanprime8336 Před 4 lety +11

    I like the poler express the best 😄😄

  • @limsuhui9890
    @limsuhui9890 Před 4 lety +5

    is the polar express fast

    • @JACESOFFICIAL
      @JACESOFFICIAL Před 3 lety

      in reality its not that fast in the movie so fast

  • @rodolfosuastegui9617
    @rodolfosuastegui9617 Před 3 lety +1

    I love polar expréss and coaches

  • @Hockley36
    @Hockley36 Před 4 lety +3

    How did ya get those trains 🚂 in this game

  • @RoccoShade
    @RoccoShade Před 5 lety +12

    What about PM 1225?
    The Polar Express and PM 1225 are basically the same engine

    • @RoccoShade
      @RoccoShade Před 5 lety +2

      And a Berkshire's top speed is 80 mph. [Wikipedia]

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +1

      @@RoccoShade Good question. : ) The same reason why we arranged a Berkshire vs Berkshire video like this one: czcams.com/video/a7e--9zdDH4/video.html They were made by different 3D artist and company and we don't want to reject all suggestion and request from our viewer, especially supportive regular like you.
      By the way, 80 mph was its *design top speed which doesn't mean that it can't run faster than 80 mph, just as the design top speed of PRR T1 and S1 was 100 mph but there were report and witness said that they were operating at 110-140 mph. If you want to see a Streamlined Pacific vs Pacific of PRR vs B&O, we can arrange another race. :- )

    • @TheAuxmark3
      @TheAuxmark3 Před 5 lety +2

      @@Frisco-si2jh the model of the train is based off of pere marquette 1225

    • @James-Railyard
      @James-Railyard Před 5 lety +2

      SteamTrain/planeFan 14 they used the Pere Marquette 1225 engine and blueprints to make the model for the movie.

    • @animal16365
      @animal16365 Před 4 lety +2

      Actually the 1225 has a higher tractive effort than the 765.

  • @ruzicamarkovic3055
    @ruzicamarkovic3055 Před 3 lety +2

    the polar express can go 7000'0000'0000 MILES PER HOUR!

  • @TheAuxmark3
    @TheAuxmark3 Před 5 lety +6

    You vs the guy she tells you not to worry about:

  • @hanzlobenicht6353
    @hanzlobenicht6353 Před 4 lety +8

    DUUUUUUUUDE!!!! YOU HAVE WRONG COATCHES!!! YOU NEED HEAWY weight PULLMAN'S (12 wheels for car) and Polar express have different end cars. But video is interesting.

  • @rashadeeadams1040
    @rashadeeadams1040 Před 2 lety +2

    The NPK 765 was a little bit late so of course the express would be in the lead

  • @officersplatoongamerdude2014

    Can u do more Australian steam engines?

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +1

      Yes, we didn't forget our promise. But there are some requests queuing, we can arrange a race before next Wednesday. :-)

    • @ericwood7019
      @ericwood7019 Před 3 lety +1

      @@Jones3DModelingClub Sorry, I thought you'd be more able to get a notification from me if I mentioned your name. But anyways, if you're still taking requests today like I saw earlier, how about the 1225 and the 765 double-heading those Polar Express coaches? Even if you do, the 1225 would have to lead the double-header because there's no knuckle coupler or air hose on it's front end. It would be very interesting to see the 765 joining the 1225 for the trip to the North Pole like the 1225 did with the 765 for the trip to Huntington, West Virginia in 1991. What do you think?

  • @suraishwaryade1080
    @suraishwaryade1080 Před 5 lety +17

    Polar express is the best
    Like Everest

  • @bweldon13
    @bweldon13 Před 4 lety +3

    I still like 765 better

  • @lividuke
    @lividuke Před 4 lety +2

    What route was this on?

  • @ethan3396
    @ethan3396 Před 2 lety +1

    me when driving a train after someone shoots me for no reason

  • @avatarthanosthelegendarysu5883

    Where can i get the NKP

  • @paulacreelyandMartin
    @paulacreelyandMartin Před 4 lety +3

    I like the polar express

  • @Robloxzanevideogamekid_Offical

    Entry level is it going with2020

  • @godzillakingofthemonsters54

    Please do a race between the union pacific 844 and the polar express.

  • @tymoser3257
    @tymoser3257 Před 5 lety +8

    Why did you slow down them765

  • @Larynx_the_Changeling

    Gordon must be jealous.
    1225: "Polar Express coming through!"

  • @mohamadnasrah
    @mohamadnasrah Před rokem +1

    and Actually NKP 765 exist in real life while polar express sometimes exist as train toy.
    while polar express Seems to be the fastest train but i think not really...
    So i think its a tie

  • @mlptf
    @mlptf Před rokem

    It's magic fantasy vs the real world!
    I like that!

  • @robintheslavewr1513
    @robintheslavewr1513 Před 4 lety +2

    Actually the polar Express whistle is a baldwin roundtop 3 chime not a step top like k&l trains did

  • @ryantimm9748
    @ryantimm9748 Před 4 lety +2

    Is the polar express whistle a fictional CG whistle or is it sampled from a different locomotive?

    • @asmodai2025
      @asmodai2025 Před 7 měsíci

      I may be 3 years late but whatever :þ. The Polar Express’s whistle is sampled from another engine (I can not remember the name of it, but it was featured in one of the Back to the Future movies and used in the Polar Express as a reference since the director also directed the Back to the Future movies).

  • @animal16365
    @animal16365 Před 4 lety +2

    The NKP 765 bell doesnt move

  • @ryantimm9748
    @ryantimm9748 Před 4 lety +1

    And why does it take so long for NKP 765 to gain speed while the polar Express speeds up from a stop so quickly.

  • @_illnamethisprofilelater_

    Which version of trainz did you play on

  • @JonahgamerTV
    @JonahgamerTV Před 2 lety

    Please do PM 1225 vs Polar Express next!

  • @Mrfrenchy6883
    @Mrfrenchy6883 Před 5 lety +7

    Prr j1 vs wm j1

  • @gopis2791
    @gopis2791 Před rokem

    Why? Polar express at the
    Beginning so fast? My brain:
    Polar express is a bullet train.

  • @ericwood2062
    @ericwood2062 Před 6 měsíci

    If you stilltake requests like earlier, how about the 1225 and 765 forming a double-header like 1991 and 2009, only with these Polar Express coaches all together in one line behind both engines running double-headed? If you can't give the 765 it's Polar Express logo or the 1225 it's front coupling, that's okay, I was just bringing up an interesting idea, as if the 765 joined the 1225 on those Polar Express runs.

  • @navinthegamer6826
    @navinthegamer6826 Před 10 měsíci

    I did not know the 1225 is part of the K&L trainz.

  • @yugoball5530
    @yugoball5530 Před 2 lety

    The kid whith his head sticked out from the coach:THIS IS FUN WEREEEEEEEEEEEEEEERREEEEEEEEEEEEEE

  • @khangphantuan7912
    @khangphantuan7912 Před 4 lety +2

    What game

  • @user-ht1fn1bv5c
    @user-ht1fn1bv5c Před 6 měsíci

    Cool

  • @Dontavioso
    @Dontavioso Před 2 lety +1

    i wonder how fast the polar express would be with streamlining

  • @ReverieMoonlight_
    @ReverieMoonlight_ Před 5 lety +4

    Wait- dont you have the K&L NKP Berkshire? Also, the Auran NKP berkshire isnt built in. Its an In-Game Purchase.

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety

      When we record this video, we haven't bought the NKP Berkshire from K&L Trainz yet. Thank you for watching! : )

  • @iki492
    @iki492 Před 5 dny

    nkp 765 and the polar express races while escaping the blast.(SODOR FALLOUT)

  • @SupremeRacer-fk8dv
    @SupremeRacer-fk8dv Před 5 lety +2

    That's just sad....not even an NKP S2 class Berkshire can keep up with the Pol Ex.

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +1

      Cmon don't be sad, it''s just a game. :P

    • @SupremeRacer-fk8dv
      @SupremeRacer-fk8dv Před 5 lety +1

      @@Jones3DModelingClub but I was expecting 765 to win....or at least keep up with an engine with the same wheel arrangement as the 765

    • @Jones3DModelingClub
      @Jones3DModelingClub  Před 5 lety +1

      @@SupremeRacer-fk8dv It was a good game for the 765 since she almost caught the Pol Ex --- 11:02 : )

    • @alanfaulkner5266
      @alanfaulkner5266 Před 5 lety +1

      @@SupremeRacer-fk8dv i think the 765 would've done better had the boiler pressures been the same or closer 220 psi vs 55 psi isn't really a competition

    • @LegendRails
      @LegendRails Před 5 lety

      @@SupremeRacer-fk8dv Jones have this video of the NKP #765 vs Pere Marquette #1223, The Pere Marquette #1223 it's really slow and the 765 is really fast.

  • @hmtechgaming5541
    @hmtechgaming5541 Před 4 lety +2

    Is It Game ?

  • @Isaiahstetson
    @Isaiahstetson Před 3 lety +1

    Plz tell me how to get these trains in trainz

  • @mohamadnasrah
    @mohamadnasrah Před rokem +1

    next do polar express vs end of the line tf2 train pls

  • @milunka6
    @milunka6 Před 3 lety

    What route is that

  • @kalpanarani6940
    @kalpanarani6940 Před 2 měsíci

    i did not know that nkp 765 was catching up

  • @Mnrr6131
    @Mnrr6131 Před 4 lety

    Yeah it’s a little obvious the polar express gathers speed quickly

  • @mestherheredia628
    @mestherheredia628 Před 4 lety +3

    Yes polar express wins

  • @CosmoIdeon204
    @CosmoIdeon204 Před 2 lety

    How did you get the polar express????

  • @OldIronVideo
    @OldIronVideo Před 2 lety

    Could you do 3713 vs 3254

  • @keokileong5970
    @keokileong5970 Před rokem

    What is my what is favorite toys in the entire world?😂😂

  • @atikaelomkafih8105
    @atikaelomkafih8105 Před 2 lety +1

    Wooooooooooooooo !!!!!!!! The Polar Express

  • @queakerswashere2828
    @queakerswashere2828 Před rokem +1

    Doesn't the nkp has that kind of bell?😬

  • @pembertonhobbs7047
    @pembertonhobbs7047 Před 9 měsíci

    A train I don’t want to crash.

  • @ethan3396
    @ethan3396 Před 2 lety +1

    what is this game called

  • @holtzman1378
    @holtzman1378 Před 3 lety

    we need the polar express vs union pacific challenger

  • @pipepro_gamer9558
    @pipepro_gamer9558 Před rokem

    Wich Game is that?

  • @the_gp9_802
    @the_gp9_802 Před 4 lety +2

    NKP 765 vs 587

  • @melried903
    @melried903 Před 2 lety

    BIT DID YOU SEE THE NICKAL PLATE ROAD HOW IT WAS CATCHING UP TO THE POLAR EXPRESS

  • @AllenIssac-jv5hf
    @AllenIssac-jv5hf Před rokem

    How does the polar express start off like a bullet train

  • @benijang780
    @benijang780 Před 3 lety +2

    Polar ekspres vs prr t1 and prr s1

  • @hmtechgaming5541
    @hmtechgaming5541 Před 4 lety +2

    if it is game please send me the download link of this game

  • @nathanmoorman951
    @nathanmoorman951 Před 2 lety

    Do polar express vs Pennsylvania s1 loco

  • @andrewtheberkshireengine4385

    7:47 765's wheels tho

  • @nathanmoorman951
    @nathanmoorman951 Před 2 lety

    Polar express vs NEO big one

  • @amirhill3783
    @amirhill3783 Před 2 lety

    YESSSSS!!!!!! POLAR EXPRESS YOU GO GIRL!!!!!!

  • @ruzicamarkovic3055
    @ruzicamarkovic3055 Před 3 lety +1

    765 Can only like go 300 miles per hour

  • @jackhollandcsxnsandawvrfan3800

    I have the polar Express I did a speed test and without cars it hit 150 mph. That cant be right. . .

    • @journeythroughtherails5294
      @journeythroughtherails5294 Před 4 lety

      Jack Holland CSX, NS, and AWVR fan That’s Becuase They weren’t pulling any Coaches and they are heaveier