The Train crash, the Children and the Mysterious Woman in Black - Charfield Disaster
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- čas přidán 12. 10. 2023
- In today's video, we take a look at the Charfield Disaster and the mystery of the two unknown children and the woman in black
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Honestly, I couldn't have picked a better day to upload this video
😱
Very apropos.
Oh thats right you all are northern hemisphere lol
eerie…counteracts being the 60th anniversary of a rail line saving two cities because running alongside a raging conflagration causing a fire break that stopped the fire from spreading north/northwest
Friday the 13th… …IN SPOOKTOBER!
Did nobody ever think of noting the number plate of the limousine? Even back then, there would have been records. A truly sad case..
Possibly, but a "limousine" suggests a quite wealthy person, maybe even in the peerage or related to royalty. For a long time the British press would help cover up anything unusual to do with such people; lots of examples since the late C19th of that.
This has become one of my favorite British railway disasters primarily for the mystery of it. I'll never forget a podcast describing the mail train crew storming into the signalbox demanding to know why the distant was off and the signalman about to assert that that was impossible by pointing to his repeater only for his blood to run cold as it showed Clear despite the levers being set to Danger.
The most convincing speculation I've heard regarding the signals is that a piece of cargo may have fallen out of the GWR goods train while it was shunting. It was noted by the investigators that the signal wires were bent in the wreck and the distant signal jammed to the point that the wires needed to be cut and completely redone. It's not impossible that a poorly secured barrel or beam might have fallen onto the signal wire as the goods was ambling into the siding forcing the signal up.
That said, there's also debate over the severity of the fog. The mail crew claimed visibility was down to about 60 yards, but the signalman saw his spotting point 150 yards away.
There's just so many unknowns surrounding this story. Did two children really board the mail train at Leeds as a porter claimed? There's no record of it beyond his testimony. And what of the local policeman who claimed to know the lady in black's chauffeur only to die before he could tell his story?
The sadly now defunct Steel Wheels podcast did a fantastic episode on this disaster, which is where most of this info comes from. A highly recommended 2 hours.
"I'll never forget a podcast describing the mail train crew storming into the signalbox demanding to know why the distant was off and the signalman about to assert that that was impossible by pointing to his repeater only for his blood to run cold as it showed Clear despite the levers being set to Danger."
*BALONEY!!* I suggest you ignore the podcast fantasy, and read the report of the official inquiry (link below). Evidence given showed that 1) Signalman Button saw that the repeater was showing WRONG (not clear!) well BEFORE the driver came up to the signalbox; and 2) that investigation by two senior members of railway staff proved that the reason the repeater was showing wrong was that wreckage from the trains had fallen on the signal wire, pulling the signal partly out of position.
www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/MoT_Charfield1928.pdf
You know what i think caused the accident? I think the fireman saw the wrong signal, or was looking on the wrong side. Given that he was inexperienced, I think that it would be more likely than the idea of mechanical failure or sabotage.
Yeah and other light sources in such weather and darkness can sometimes create an illusion especially if you are expecting a select few colours.
I mean the signal could of also showed green when he looked, then changed to red as he started firing again. Still, was always trained on steamers that BOTH crew ID signals
@@mazzar35 They know the signal didn't show green so whatever he claimed he saw otherwise was likely something other than the signal.
he lied…there was no way to not see the signal given they’re on one side: one on the other side would be red. so unless he was looking backwards and saw the opposite track’s clear signal he lied
It does seem possible that the fireman saw a different green signal immediately before or after the distant signal, thought the driver said he was looking out as well and he knew the line better. But similar accidents happened in fog at Gidea Park in 1949 and Dagenham in 1958 where drivers misjudged their locations by one or two signals and ran into the back of other trains. The countryside in those days was very dark (no street lights, and it was 5 am) so it seems unlikely that there were any non-signal green lights visible.
This might be the creepiest story I’ve heard all day. You never fail to creep us out with this.
Rest in peace to those poor people.
J.A.B. Hamilton when researching his excellent book on British 20th century railway accidents in 1968 went to Charfield and interviewed the people who'd worked on the clearance and burial. Due to the fire, very little was left of some of the bodies, little more than a shoe or a piece of bone. Their view was that the identification of some of these fragments as possibly being two children was speculative. It seems highly unlikely that nobody nationally would miss them. There were two children seen on the train earlier, but they survived. The obvious and natural explanation for the woman in black would be that she was a relative of one of the actual victims. Hamilton's book in general is particularly insightful about the human factor in the accidents and what could lead people to make innocent mistakes which unluckily sometimes had fearful consequences. Both he and Adrian Vaughan many years later mentioned that highly experienced railwaymen sometimes see what they expect to see (e.g. signal aspects) rather than what is actually there.
Thank you for this - I couldn't remember the author's name, wanted to mention the book. If I remember rightly, he suggested that Allington could possibly have fallen asleep for a few moments, and not seen the signals; the GWR guard said the mail was still under full steam when it passed his van, having no chance of reducing speed in the distance available. Rolt states that waggon debris was found on the signal wires, pulling them 'clear' but that, once removed, they returned to 'danger' of their own volition. Again, from memory, doesn't Hamilton suggest that Allington had been drinking heavily prior to the incident?
As for the children, well, who knows? The mystery still keeps cropping up, either in the papers or here on youtube. And, I imagine, will continue to do so. Whoever lies in that grave at Charfield, may they rest in peace
@@JohnDavies-cn3ro Yes, there's multiple possible explanations for Aldington missing the signal. It may have been a brief sleep, or "micro-sleep" due to shift work, or he may have underestimated train speed (no speedometers then), misjudged his location in the mist and seen the wrong green signal (also happened at Gidea Park 1949 and Dagenham East 1957), or simply remembered wrongly after the shock of the collision. However, I don't think there was any suggestion that he'd been drinking. Hamilton certainly mentions the driver in the 1907 Shrewsbury crash as having a poor record and being "fond of his pints" and almost certainly he fell asleep; he then mentioned Aldington's good record as a contrast. A fascinating difference between authors is their different views on blame; Hamilton thought Aldington maybe more culpable than Caudle at Ais Gill 1913, but Nock and Rolt disagree (so do I) as Caudle kept no lookout over several miles on a clear night.
@@JohnDavies-cn3ro Sorry, I made an error in my previous reply. I looked back at Hamilton and he did indeed describe Aldington as "a corpulent man who was fond of his pints". However he was contrasting his excellent record with that of driver Martin at Shrewsbury who had a string of minor offences to his name.
As this used to live close to that and saw photos and notices about it in the village hall, I was wondering if you would cover it. Didn't expect it to be part of spooky month
I actually have read about it in my Railways' Strangest Tales book in a chapter titled "Mystery Children" which also recounts the same incident!
Great Work! Special thanks for the sketches at 1:07, 1:28 and 3:07! It helped a lot to understand the situation!
please do a video on
the porters steam loco
the Japanese class d5,
how do gear trains work
something on saddle bolier and side tanks (like the big boxes) tank engines
double ended diesel trains
what to do if the train stalls
one talking about the different types of steam funnles and there uses,
a video on steam locomotive combination breaks (steam and vacuum brakes)
a short video on how a Armstrong turn table works
why are some trains wagion tops (the stream lining thing to boilers)
railway terms abd slang
one on the meaning of flag and lantern colors like green on rear engine means theres another one coming soon,
different train pilots on the front (and on back ive seen some)
the different types of cut offs/reversers/Johnson bar
some are a big lever, some are a big valve wheel, and ive also seen some that are like rods, one exsample is train sim world 3 and im not sure where to find the other reverser
Perhaps the fireman was color blind?
Sounds like the flying kipper story and looks like it too
My, this is a very mysterious rail disaster. And while I like the timing of this video, it is ironic that October 13th, 1928 was a Saturday. But here is something else, when October 2028 comes around, it will the 100th Anniversary of the Charfield Disaster and October 13th, 2028 falls on a Friday.
the engineer claiming that it was green contradicts his own words: he wasn’t able to see it, it’s why he asked his fireman to lookout for it. the fireman blew it and didn’t admit to not seeing the signal, if he had done what he was supposed to they would’ve stopped and the while event avoided entirely 🙄
This reminds me of the boys in the tower. A mystery involving two young boys
Imagine if this was a story in "Railway Series"-book!.. :D
It has a hint of the Flying Kipper and Fish episodes about it! Poor Henry
Train of thought can you please talk about dost hybrid train 2018- today phillipines
The guy had time to save his wife and few woman but let his sister for last? I wanna know the family history of thosev two?
I used to live in Charfield (opposite the railway line intrestingly enough), its probably the only claim to fame the village has if im to be honest, as its just a generic village overrun by 1960s+ housing estates
ill bet it was friday the 13th when this accident occurred
nope it was a saturday
this could totally be such a great horror movie
What music did you use for this video?
Hi There Again it is Mr Cannadine T. Boxill-Harris, I have another interesting idea for most of you Class 313, Class 314 and that also is including those interesting Class 315 Fans out there, rather than scrapping most of those Class 313's Class 314's including the Class 315's maybe you guys can convert them and including the refurbishment into those Leyland 680 Engine, Volvo B10M Engine, Cummins M11 Engine, Gardner 6LXC Engine, Gardner 6LXB, Engine, Gardner 8LXB Engine, Class 313's, Class 314's and the Class 315's and convert all of them into a 2 Carriages and Three Carriages of the Class 313's, Class 314's and that is including those Class 315's for most of us Class 314's and the Class 315's Diesel Train Fans Please Are you still going to do this interesting type of Project
for all of us out there Pretty Please?
If you’re doing a Halloween video I’ll watch it no matter what
Damn this is great
Why on Earth did they release the good train when the other good train was not leaving?
The LMS train, on an LMS line, had priority over the GWR train; the LMS driver, needing water, should have notified the box man who could then have released the GWR train (which had a faster engine) and allowed it to proceed. But, tragically, that didn't happen.
Spooky
Wow
The Children we can only speculate what actually happened to let themselves board the train.
This video is kinda good
What kind of gas was used for carriage lighting?
Pintsch gas, distilled from Naptha, ususally stored in a high pressure cylinder under the carriage. Ruptured cylinders responsible for many train fires in the U.S. and Britain up to then.
could be water gas, coalgas, etc.
Your narrative fails to mention one important factor, which rather upsets the theories of some people further down this thread. Driver Aldington didn't just ask his 'inexperienced' fireman to look out for that distant signal. He crossed the cab to look for himself, and both men (so they swore) saw a green light. Whether they actually did we'll never know, but the element of doubt was enough to get Aldingtom acquitted at his manslaughter trial. It's all very well to assert confidently that they were lying, but before we do we should consider the following.
(a) Though both men admitted they'd missed the following outer home and home signals, they continued to insist they'd seen the distant at green.
(b) In the shock of the immediate aftermath of the collision, how likely is it that Aldington would have concocted a story and calculatedly gone to challenge the signalman to make his lie more convincing?
(c) Aldington must have made a favourable impression on the jury at his trial.
Second
First!
15th