Knife Defense is BS | ft.
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- čas přidán 4. 01. 2023
- Today we will be discussing how functional is wrestling against a knife attack with Icy Mike from @hard2hurt.
What would you do differently in a knife attack situation if you can't run? Let us know in the comment section below!
Don't forget to support both of channel if you like the video by hitting that like and subscribe button!
Thank you guys and I will see you next week!
#selfdefense #martialarts #wrestling
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Glad to see the red rubber training Glock I made Mike made it in the video!
I have been in two altercations involving a knife and got cut once. Embarrassingly they actually led with the knife! I made a grab at the hand, grabbed the fuggin blade( I grimace thinking about it) and got a nice slice on all four fingers and the base of the thumb. I then dragged them down and punched them until they stopped and someone else took the knife. The other one was a utility knife and I bear hug-body slammed him and threw the knife away when he dropped it right away. I’m on the never say never or always side. Train everything but sort of train the likely more than the unlikely. Be safe
My instructor said the best knife disarm is beating the person unconscious so they drop the knife.
Get ahold of the clothes on the knife hand and poke the nearest eye. He has to see you to attack you. Stay long and detached.
Where tf you live??
@@daxisperry7644 best knife defense is running from the guy with the knife
@@homelessman3483 Unless you can't.
I've trained with two of the three guys Mike was referring to, am also an instructor in the same knife defense program as Mike, though he's likely way better at it than me. I don't say that to brag. I say that to add that the ones I trained with didn't even like their own program they created. Eli Knight, who also teaches knife defense, says that knife defense is voodoo science. People scoff at combat sports (I was one of those people) but my question is, if you can't fight one on one with someone roughly your size, experience level, and who you kinda know, in an environment that is optimized for that sport, in clothing made for that sport, and you have the advantage of knowing when the fight is going to happen, what the crap makes you think you will be able to fight someone who is likely bigger than you, and the first indication that he wants to fight is that he stuck a knife in your face.
This. 100%. It’s funny to hear the self defence dude say “oh well in a cage an MMA guy will beat me, but if I faced a threat on the street I’d survive”. Wait, so you couldn’t defeat a single attacker in a safe environment, yet you think you would survive a weapon/multiple attacker scenario, which is so much harder? How? I know very few fields of expertise where being bad in the easier part doesn’t mean that you’re gonna suck absolute ass in the hard parts. Great comment!
The only rule of knife club is, don't be in knife club. ;-)
What is the name of the knife defence program?
@@donkeyslayer8370 edge of reality
How many criminals train 2 1/2 hours a day, 6 days a week?
I like how Kevin's style switches between Kali, Wrestling, BJJ, and Judo depending on his position. If he's farther away on offense, his attacks are Kali-like. If he's mid to close range, he goes Wrestling/Judo. When on the ground, he goes BJJ.
That's what Bruce Lee taught us for a long time. 😊
I love Icy Mike's pragmatism.
indeed, and Kevin's charisma
You could see Kevins thought process being shaped through out this video when he connects the dots to prioritising position and not the knife. This is great advice for situational awareness.
Great job everyone.
I love how at the end the knife disarm actually worked and you were both just standing there kinda shocked for a second.
then you woke up in heaven
Icy Mike is a GREAT investigative instructor! I laughed when Mike pulled a pistol... The look on Kev's face! LOL
Hahaha 😂
Real knife attacks add another layer, where you may not even be aware that the assailant has a knife, even if it's in their hand! I really like how Mike didn't even draw the knife until very late into the first scenario.
what I've learned from this, assuming lots of people are right handed, it's always a good idea to lock the arm so the attacker isn't even able to draw. I'm not saying that is the go to strategy, just something to keep in mind.
Sometimes you cant see the knife even if its in their hand. That's the truth! Especially when it's dark.
@@Dontbustthecrust - Mike recently posted a video about the apple river stabbing. No one saw the knife come out. I didn't either! I had to rewind the video and look carefully! The dude was just standing there, pulled the knife out of his pocket but his arm low and the hand next to the pocket. The moment one of the younger guys moved towards the knife wielder, he got stuck once in the ribs and bled out.
In another (in)famous video from Australia, two groups of young men were arguing and posturing. One of them was holding a pair of scissors and one on the other group was doing some Bruce Lee shit, moving forward and backward quickly, when a big tall guy started walking menacingly towards the man with the scissors, like a movie character ... only to get jabbed once in the neck. _Once._ He dropped to the floor 15 seconds later in an expanding pool of his own blood and never got back up.
Personally, the knife defense strategy I'm using right now is this: I live in a small town in rural Greece where I know most families, have no enemies, and criminality is ultra low 😛
@@AlkisGD yep. I'm employing the same strategy in Colorado and it seems to be working well.
I love videos that try to take an honest look at knife situations lol it's especially great when two people are just having fun with the idea. I remember the one thing I was always taught, especially if you have time to identify someone wielding an outside influence (pokey/cutty), stick to the basics of maintain distance and watch for an opportunity. Granted, if you're already in a scuffle, you guys clearly showed how that can be an issue. The sad part is just accepting that there probably isn't a sure-fire way to handle a person wielding a knife with malicious intent. Like my grandpa always said though, "Never start a fight or resort to outside influence in one, but if the other person does... There's no such thing as a fair fight for your life."
Edit was because of poor typing lol
Loved the sewing machine comment, the better I get with spears the more I'm defaulting to a sort of 'angry sewing needle' attack and I can't get that name out of my head now.
We need a whole tailor-based martial arts style.
The "prison sewing machine" technique is a pretty common name for when somebody walls by, out of the blue gets a collar tie, and then needles you 20 times with a shiv into your gut. Incredibly hard to stop when you aren't aware of the knife or even the attack until they're already pulling you into the knife by the back of your neck.
The embroidery school of patterns...sounds scary as hell 🤣
interesting to see this after USDC. 6 fighters, 24 knife attack sessions, but only one fighter emerged alive in one session.
This was a perfectly taught and explained way to defend against a knife. It’s great that you emphasized that even with this knowledge there’s still a decent chance you’ll get caught once or twice.
It sounds funny, but everytime I watch something on "Knife Defense" I get curious about what would be the opinion of ex-prisioners on the subject. Specially those who served their sentences on very dangerous prisions, controlled by gangs - a common thing in my country, Brazil. You know, they are probably the guys with most experience with having to defend themselves against actual knife attacks, from people who want to kill them. I know it is a different reality, but it would be an interesting point of view.
acho q nesse caso, a defesa seria logo um ataque, quem ataca primeiro ganha, mas entendo seu ponto, seria interessante saber se esses caras ja passaram por tal situação.
Well brazil has bjj, karate, and capoeira. I'm sure that comes up just as often.
Sir there are only two way for saving your life without wound in a knife attack. First one, you have to not be in same picture with a knife man (or if subject is weapon, any weapon guy) because as they say in stage "if a gun appear in first stage, it always blow up in second stage". Second, never let him draw his knife (or weapon). With action or with words. Other moves have various risks. If all things gone wrong keep your distance, use always a barier (between you and danger) and a shield (as a desk, chair or a hand bag etc.) can be good advices. As bonus learn from others mistakes (I have a much :)) and choose your comrades or friends wisely
You should read "Put them down, take them out", a no nonsense book on knife "fighting" (or how to effectively stab someone, and how to try not to get stabbed by someone), written by a guy who was in Folsom Prison for awhile.
@@williamraley2142 couldn't find that book on Amazon.
May I ask for a link to where I can find that book?
The only way to test your technique is to spar and I love this.
I have had an assailant tried to stab me twice in my life. I am a retired teacher and both times were young adults in their late teens the first time I used an Aikido type wrist lock disarm that worked because I got a desk between the two of us, the second time I did not disarm the knife I controlled the arm holding the knife and executed a take down, then pinned the student using techniques I learned from my Taiji teacher. Neither is “supposed” to work both were effective because they were organic, intuitive reactions.
The way Mike explains things is so spot on.
I think it's wise to tell people to expect to be cut. You're preparing them mentally, that if they do get cut, that it's "ok" and to keep fighting through it. Don't let cuts stop you from fighting.
Great video! Some real functional tips from Icy Mike and a lot of fun sparring footage.
Glad you enjoyed it!
I’ve seen about every real life knife fight video since the internet began and I don’t recall ever seeing them grapple during.
good one. usually when i teach knife defense i start with teaching how to attack with a knife, so the practice can be more real. the second thing i usually deal with is the mental phase, not defense against knife, but attack against the knife attack\user.
i really loved the position emphasize, really good point, tyvm.
Great stuff as usual guys, keep ‘em coming
Great video guys
Excellent vid, Kevin. You're crazy quick on the ground.
Thank you!! 🙏🏼🙏🏼
I agree! And Kevin you are one of the best martial artists I’ve seen when it comes to both athleticism and the ability to flow through styles and techniques. The way you moved between FMA, BJJ, and Wing Chun was pretty amazing.
@@turbopowergtit wouldnt reach to wrestling,bjj and wing chun,,,if kevin intends it😊😊😊
What an amazing realistic look at being mugged by a knife wielding attacker and how it may be handled. Both of you are so highly trained and it's still hard to defend against an attacker. Opens one's eyes to the (semi) reality of the situation. I better get back to the dojo and train!
Great skills demonstrated there ! . You are 2 guys we want to see more of so please consider safety goggles like the basketball players use. Accidents can happen..We used them for knife defense or we use fencing helmets...Keep up the great content.
Great stuff guys. Like a science lab for fighting.
Thank you!
Thanks for having Icey Mike on your show.
Good Knife “thinking”!
Most knife workers just like to argue AND it NEEDS to be a process of opening the mind to possibilities and STATES of Mind…
At first, as a way to approach it…
Then games.
Also research NEEDS to be done on-
What WAS the result of many knife assaults…
Great video, thanks you for staying clear of BS.
Subscribed.
brilliant! Thank you
This is one of the best "knife defense" videos I've seen. You guys covered everything someone thinking about "knife defense" really should know so they can make better decisions on how they train for such situations. Thank you!
Also if you're ever in the Seattle area and want to play around with Sumo wrestling, we'd love to have you over. :)
This topic is always fascinated me! Was fun to watch Y'all test it out.
Thanks for holding the camera! Haha
@@KevinLeeVlog haha no problem 🤜💥🤛
@@KevinLeeVlogso basically there Isn't a guarantee in knife defense no matter what you do the outcome could be in your favor or not?
yeah couuld watch 3x this much probably at least
@@johnjune2999 what they don't cover is potential additional factors (can't count on them is why), like, being able to find a shield (clothing, chair, pan, doorway, book, etc.), or counter-weapon (bottle, pen, pan, etc.)
This tracks pretty accurately to what happened to me when I had an improvised knife pulled on me (I didn't actually see what it was, but I saw the grip and I saw metal and I knew where that was going).
I actually abandoned knife defense completely with the hope of just blasting through to a dominant position and it worked luckily (I'm not a traditional martial arts guy but I did jiujitsu and wrestled a bit so I resorted to what I knew). I got behind them while we were standing, dragged them to the ground, got mount, and basically laid on the arm holding the edge weapon until they lost it flailing around.
Kudos to you. When it counted, you were able to rise to the occasion and survive. Who cares which martial art you did or didn't study. And, like another commenter said, "I feel like I need so much more training." Point is, you can never have enough.
First love your content. Im an Army Vet and we trained knife defense didn't even think about how to train in a different way this is an excellent video
Love the concepts. Something I teach myself. I don't love the idea of once the victim is stabbed, the game is over. Keep fighting!
Best knife demo I’ve seen. Outstanding and realistic
I don't know how many people I've shown the "slap the knife out of his hand" technique. I'm now embarrassed. When I was 16, I had a man kicking my '68 Mustang in a Quick Stop parking lot and I was a brown belt at the time. I moved forward and the man's partner pulled a knife on me, so I put my hands up and backed away and watched the dude put a good sized dent in my car. Better my car than putting a a few sharp dents in me.
This demonstration was excellent, have you done similar videos for flashlights and likely carry combinations?
Good content Men, logical and real.
This was a great, common sense approach. Thanks, guys.
Remember the knife is a distraction, the ‘person’ is the threat. Too much wrestling for the weapon.
I was looking for self defense videos that are no bs, and my search has come to an end
At 74, I"ve never been in a fight. So, I'm very grateful for this. And if I was to get slightly behind an assailant, I would do everything to secure a choke hold.
Maybe yes. Maybe no; but that is what I'd aim for.
Thanks for this enlightening instruction.
It's never too late bro 😊
Whenever I'm in a knife defense situation, I just do a backflip, snap the bad guy's neck, and save the day. ;-)
I love how Gabriel Varga just runs across the screen at one point.
00:18 LoL
Someone who never watched these guys and only knows Gabriel varga from his fighting career would think this is a very random world champ appearance lol
Kevin is a Mensch. Just a straight-up good guy
Position first... Absolutely loved this video. 👍👍
The last comment about urgency is a good one. I sometimes think that the judo newaza framework where you have to address getting pinned and you maybe have only a few seconds to make something happen is better for self defense than the bjj more relax and flow framework. One is working for sprints and the other is more distance running. I think it also leads to more injury, but that's a different discussion.
Now do it again and go in with the mindset of a Kali practitioner offensively with the blade and then defending against the blade. This is what would be interesting as it will show if FMAs blade work is practical in the modern era.
Would like to then see Wing Chun style used to defend the blade. Again interesting to see and being high level in FMA, Kali,BJJ etc Kevin is the man to attempt this and out realistic videos out on this subject.
Fantastic
That's the beauty of training with a knife. It forces you to up all your attributes. Like you said, you wouldn't have been that tired if the knife wasn't there. Great vid guys, Thanks.
Knife defense is BS.....until you're attacked with a knife.
Love the disarm @8:42!
@KevinLeeVlog do you consider low kicks in Wing Chun a valid response to knife attacks? I've practiced those with a specific focus on disrupting attacker forward movement, balance, and focus, mostly to create time and space to do other things - like run, get a barrier between you and the attacker, or deploy a wepon IF it offers an advantage over the attacker. Is that valid, in your view?
Instructive and hilarious at the same time!
Haha. Thank you!
@@KevinLeeVlog Even better on the second viewing
great video guys!
Very good video thank you very much 🙏🙏💪💪💪💪
This a very good video!
I can't provide the link, but I've actually seen a video of a knife attack where the attacker switches hands. It was a woman sitting in the back seat of a taxi/uber and stabbing the driver. He managed to control one of her wrists and she switches to the other hand to keep stabbing. Maybe someone else knows the name of this video. Anyway, just wanted to input this.
We have a thing in hapkido that's somewhat similar to 5:36, but we use our knee to pin the arm holding the knife to the ground while we disarm. We also will practice live with practice knives occasionally, kinda wish we did it more, but there's only so much time and a lot of other stuff.
Awesome stuff
Best knife defense video I’ve seen ;-)
this is superb. probably should be the first thing all martial arts instructors watch
6:40 I liked HARD TO HURTS control methods. Laying the attacker on top of his weapon. That was good
Great video
Great work on this vid.
I'm curious if you feel like your Wing Chun was applicable or helpful? It seems to me like there's a bit of chi sao with the knife going on.
That’s the point. They have to break out of the system and techniques to find what’s best for them. The fundamentals of Wing Chun definitely has some great things to add to knife defense for sure.
Would you please give us more information on the study of 170 knife attacks?
"I know it's fun to say" is crazy 😅
0:17 A WILD GABRIEL VARGA APPEARS
Hahahaha 🤣🤣🤣
For a second I thought you wrote Viagra 😂
Yoo kev can you show some kickboxing sparring footage between you and mike?? That would be awesome to see!
And that highly realistic display looks like. I thing I’ve ever seen in any seminar, demo or movie.
I’ve been in one blade defense incident, a much smaller guy tried to singer me with a screwdriver, I grabbed it on the way out of the first stab, with my gun side hand, left, I didn’t even notice that he had grabbed my shirt with his other hand.
We fought for control over the screwdriver while it was still in my stomach for about half a second, it felt like hours, and I kicked his testicles as hard as my 6’1” 245 lbs would let me, he hit the ground and I zapped him with my taser using my non gun hand, right.
About then my partner dove in and we secured him.
I never let go of the shaft of the screwdriver until I was in the hospital.
trying to trap the hand is very dangerous and tricky. I never see anyone mention that the further down the arm, the faster it moves, i.e., the hand moves faster than the elbow, the elbow moves faster than the shoulder. gain control further up the arm and then use that to gain control of the hand.
11:15 very good, especially with the follow up example.
This is the single greatest, most efficient video overview on knife defense I've ever seen, including all the content Mike had already produced. @hard2hurt, it's too bad it won't appear on your own channel!
He's made all of those points in many of his own videos, but this here is like a quick and dirty best of version, I suppose.
@@jamielondon6436 that's exactly what I mean
I love this channel! I just wish you would show more Kata! 😜
Mike is a brilliant instructor, regardless what his wife says about his intelligence! 😊
I love that Gabriel Varga is just casually running in the background at the start hahahaha
What about cutting what you can see and get to. Fingers, forearms, legs, etc. It seems that when you're determined to do a particular attact to a particular part of the body you miss what's available.
My question is, if the focus is on position, how does on achieve that under constant pressure of thrusting? I kept trying to see if there were possibilities of creating traumatic injury to slow down the conscious mind during the attack. Obviously, when Kevin had the armbar, breaking the arm would have made the weapon useless, or at the very least diminished Mike's ability to attack. Also, having just watched Kevin and and Sifu Fong's video on Chi Sao, I didn't see any "feel" that led to positioning, and I wonder if that is something that can't really be demonstrated on the You Tube platform? Mike said he was hypocritical on the point of getting cut, but at one early point of the video, Kevin was getting cuts/stabs on Mike, using a reverse grip, or was I seeing that incorrectly? I agree with Mike disarms are difficult, but in Kali training I have often seen injury first, then disarm, and damaging the hand is a form of disarm, maybe one of the simpler ones, and yes, I understand the opponent might not feel the pain for a number of reasons, but a baton strike to the fingers (if you have a baton, which I think Mike did a dislike video on the collapsing one, which I employed successfully doing security work in the 70"s, early 8o's, so I have a experience disagreement with him there) could break the fingers, disabling the opponent's ability to hold the knife. The video is helpful, but also created questions in my mind.
Is wrestling is the best to defend against a knife attack? It not, what do you think works the best?
Well looks like jujutsu is. As soon as you went full bjj, as bloody weird it is to pull guard against a knife, you removed the knife and submitted mike. No wonder, since old jujutsu (even aikido) is basically just grappling with weapons. Perhaps Graeco-Roman (ie. French wrestling) has origins in something similar.
It would be funny video for you to try out all these old jujutsu stuff specifically addressing knife-attacks. Maybe there’s something there with all the shihonage’s and kotegaeshi’s and whatnot, combined with bjj? Unlikely, but might be fun video.
Please please use some aikido-shit to throw Mike across the room, I swear I watch that video on a loop for a week.
Hmmm ... I'd probably go to the body.
no. the real answer is ameri-do-te
Burton Richardson has an awesome pressure tested course on knife defense for the street. I've seen videos of bad guy switching knife to other hand (just saying). I think on the street bad guy isn't necessarily going to be a high level wrestler. Probably pulls the knife because he can't fight you fair to begin with.
Maybe in training adding trying to cancel the initial grab with the free hand (shirt grab, single neck tie) and also practicing from him grabbing you. Also maybe playing with a little tapi-tapi at times to see where it might fit in with the controls/wrestling. Your CSW skills are 👌
@@coolworms7297 I need to ask Master Ken for his knife defense techniques!
Man, I really hope Kevin Lee never decides to start doing knife attacks. There would be not stopping him.
12:01 that was a sweet dap up 😂
Edged weapons and improvised weapons like a lock in a sock almost always start with the weapon in the rear hand and the lead hand grabbing or striking.
Burt Richardson’s Knife Defense instructional shows at least two instances of real knife attacks caught on video where the attacker is fast, vicious, “untrained” AND they switch hands once the person defending tries immobilizing the primary arm.
I think that video study that keeps getting referenced where experts cite that no one ever switches hands comes from solely Prison knife attacks. I think it’s at the very least flawed logic to say that people don’t switch hands and cherry pick a “study” that confirms that when there is apparent evidence to the contrary. Other than that, I love both these content creators and really enjoy all their collabs! 🙌🏽🙏🏽👏🏽😴
Fiore in the old Italian fighting manuals teaches all the blocks and disarms you need to deal with a knife attack… there’s one sentence in it though that most people seem to miss… he says ‘These techniques can work but they work a lot better when you have got your armour on.’ Excellent advice… If you think you might have to fight someone with a knife, wear some armour…then if the disarm doesn’t work the first time you can try again!😂
Can you put some links for soft training knives. I can't find any good training knives that you can go full force with ! thanks!
this was great.
Thank you!!
7:38 Kevin just knew he f*cked up that takedown. 😂
was this recorded before or after '6 Martial Arts Experts Locked with a Knife Attacker!' from Martial Arts Journey with Rokas?
Like the sense of humor
I've not done knife defense but I'd imagine the best way is to stay close to the target and try keep control of the hand or arm they have the knife in but doesn't stop you getting hurt though
That was the best
Have you thought about mmmmm I don’t know adding palm strikes and slaps?
Been in a few fights that ended with a knife drawn thanks to Chiraq. Got cut up bad, have more than a few scars that needed massive stitches; one required a blood transfusion.
The only winning rule in a street fight that turns to a knife fight is who lives. So if you can, run. Run like a slasher from a horror movie just showed up. Because your situation just turned into one, when they swing they don't second guess they will charge you and only want you dead.
Street cred doesn't mean jack if you are dead.
What about pushkicks for knife defense
What's that study you refer to about people not switching hands?
9:16 Bro went for the jewels.
Lot of good information here and quite a different philosophy because the other thing I've always had in mind was control the weapon at all cost if you can get ahold of that hand maybe slap it block at the first time grab at the elbow and then the hand and then grab that wrist and don't let them do anything with that weapon control that. I see the importance of positioning in this whole mess and don't let that weapon fascination get you in the wrong place for too long the second he showed that knee you fall that hand goes to the mat and you're out of there. I think everybody should limp around a little bit just enough to go to the doctor and get a prescription for an Americans with disabilities act rated came. That extra reach is always the best thing going for a knife attack. I've heard you can throw tables chairs anything you can to get space between you control that position and if you were throwing tables with one hand and hit him with a cane with the other it might be enough.
It's an elaboration of everything you have to learn in when you first start training with weapons: The other guys weapon is never your target
Share knowledge :)
As someone who a long time ago drunk the Kool-Aid on Krav Maga knife defense I really appreciate this video!
Gotta say that the krav I learned in Israel was so much different from the stuff we learned in U-town. Mostly knife defense was discouraged (run away or make distance was encouraged)and/or strikes to the head and front kicks to the body were preferred over grappling because grappling leads to rolling on the hard surface of the street and that hurts. My eastern-european pals who, in the Wild East, deal with knife-shit all the time also focus on punching and kicking the living shit out of a knife holder over wrestling. Not saying the grappling doesnt work but dont count kicks and punches out either. But yeah....no disarmements, arm-locks, wrist-locks, etc or the other static shit we learned. Learned that the hard way with shock-knives in Israel. (and i do still think the knife THREATS defenses were pretty okay. When someone wants your wallet or phone or whatever and they are not stabbing yet...which is way more common than someone wanting to stab you to death for no reason.)
Nice