What Happened with Suicide Squad and What's Next for Rocksteady?
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- čas přidán 29. 08. 2024
- A new Bloomberg article and leaked info shed some light into what went wrong with Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League, the future of the game and what lies ahead for Rocksteady Studios
SOURCES:
- Bloomberg: Behind ‘Suicide Squad,’ the Year’s Biggest Video-Game Flop by Jason Schreier www.bloomberg....
- Miller Ross x.com/mmmmmmmm...
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Damn. So Sefton Hill really made his team make all these bad choices, only to leave them in order to avoid backlash. That’s insanely two faced
Pun intended?
This made me realise that since he wrote the AK story aswell, which he said during that time was the last Arkham related project,only to make this piece of shit canon is a bitch slap to every fan
@@Mrjohnny164 yes
Dude walked into the studio, took a massive shit on the floor that took from 2016 to 2022 to finish, then walked out.
Perhaps we treated them too harshly.
Everyone seems to forget... Paul Dini wrote the story for Arkham Asylum and Arkham City while Sefton Hill wrote the story for Arkham Knight. Lying the entire time during every press interview, "We PROMISE it's NOT Jason Todd, we made a new Villain from the ground up. Pinky Swear." Sun Tzu was a villain from the ground up. As soon as i heard the words, "Old man..." I knew I had been had.
Except you're forgetting that Sefton Hill and Paul Crocker also wrote Arkham City and were the ones who wrote the entire third act of that game. Paul Dini only wrote the first two acts of Arkham City and guided the overall story.
@@alexanderpabon2933exactly. Sefton Hill may have behaved like an absolute coward and shitty person regarding SS, but he is definitely not bottom of the barrel in my opinion.
@@seregagerassimov4864 I mean, the Arkham City third act pretty much ruined a lot of stuff from me and AA and AC have same real problem of character use like Bane, so I wasn't surprised of how dreadful KTJL was with that.
@@mikhaelgribkov4117what did it ruin iyo? Thing is I doubt they didn’t have a draft of what Paul Dini left behind for the third act of the game. The game literally foreshadows jokers in the very beginning
YOU KNOW IT'S BAD WHEN BATMAN ARKHAM VIDEOS BREAKS CHARACTER
🤣
True😅
ITS A DIFFERENT WORLD NOWADAYS FR
The world needs something more, something worse... to defend her. She needs a new myth, a legend more powerful than he can be right now. A legend that can only rise from the ashes of BatmanArkhamVideos.
When did they though. Everything they said was according to someone and factual
You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain 💀
This quote works on so many levels 😅
Or you leave and form your own studio free of out of touch publishers
I’m sick, I was on Sefton Hill’s side with this one thinking he was forced by higher ups to make this game…this is the type of ending to movies that makes my stomach turn finding out it was him all along
He just made a bad game its not that serious lol
@@inshal6420 He made a very bad game then left his studio to deal with the fallout. Nothing wrong with being disgusted by that kind of scumminess.
Perhaps it's because he didn't like being forced to work on a life service game and he intentionally destroyed it and left...
For teaching the higher ups not to follow the lame trends....
In the article he was definitely forced by WB to do a Suicide Squad live service game, but he and Jamie Walker definitely wanted to do a multiplayer game. But it is def Hill's fault for the wacky story and the delulu ideas, and it really isn't a good look for him that he didn't even tell the employees they were doing that project
@@TerranToro we don’t know why he left. Look the fans jumped to conclusions before with the “OG ROCKSTEADY LEFT” memes. It could have been a bunch of reasons.
And here I thought Sefton Hill left due to “creative differences “ and with WB micromanaging everything and forcing them to make the game live service. But finding out he was the one who made all these bad decisions just makes it seem like he is a coward because he wanted to leave the studio to avoid the backlash when he knew this game was gonna crash and burn.
You know that this is a scapegoat situation right? One man, even in his role, cannot screw up the development of a game that much. WB execs bear most if not all of the blame
@@Tearintime true WB is also to blame but he was the one responsible for how the story turned out and for making the game a shooter rather than hand to hand. He had complete creative control over those decisions and willfully chose those ideas to be implemented in the game so he is rightfully to blame on that regard.
Yeah, if this is true then I've lost all respect for the man. This suggests that the team left at Rocksteady were just following his misguided vision and are now taking all the flak for it. I'm sure it wasn't just Sefton but he shares at least some of the blame here.
@@Tearintime That's what I'm thinking. This reeks of the studio execs covering their butts, imo. I don't buy it. If he was responsible for all this nonsense, then left before the game was finished, why didn't the dev team (who were allegedly confounded by all these dumb ideas) not attempt to right the ship after he left? Studio interference seems like the only answer to me. Which suggests that was the case all along. I don't buy that they'd swoop in and enforce all the dumb ideas if they hadn't already been pushing all along, themselves. Seems weird that they'd be hands off up until Sefton Hill left and then suddenly start micromanaging to keep his crappy vision. Sounds like a load of crap to me.
@@SpiderboyN2JesusBy the time Sefton left, the game was already almost done in development. Heck, it was originally going to come out last year before it was delayed again. If they had tried to better the game after Sefton left, the game wouldn't have come out this year.
Getting a gender swapped Mr. Freeze over Killer Frost who is a Suicide Squad member in the comics is such a dumb idea...
(I also have never heard about Lawless)
I thought we'd finally hear the voice behind the mask with this title
I would literally pay money to hear this channels voice/ see their face 😭
@@TEEEEVthat sounds a lil bit parasocial
@@ineedit1772 not at all, I probably shouldn’t have said “literally” since I’m exaggerating, that’s just my habit. But I am a little curious
Same
noot noot
I like how we are just getting spoilers for characters, DLC, story, etc and no one cares🤣
Who would care 🤷🏾♂️the story ain’t good and the joker was mid and judging by that leaked Mrs. Freeze character she doesn’t look good either
Its funny how they thought they'll go beyond season 4 and yet as i predicted. Its not going that far
It was leaked a long time ago
@@nemesisprime4501 “with Miller Ross suggesting season 5 might be folded into season 4” LMAOO even they literally wanna wrap this shit show up and move on ASAP 😂😭
The biggest issue is they're leaning in to characters that no one knows about, let alone cares for. There's an Earth in the Multiverse where the characters are gender swapped, but unless they use DC lore to explain this, it's pointless.
I miss Kevin Conroy.
Apparently he recorded lines for Batman in future seasons before his passing.
It needs new Batman voice actor
We all do.
Kevin did not know about his character death, remember
Kevin only cares about him and batman
Hes a voice actor, he was tricked
If he was alive he would be pissed
Who doesn't?
As much as I respect Sefton’s decision to keep the return of the JL a surprise for later seasons, I think that having at least some of the members of the JL come back towards the end of the game and having more obvious hints would have been a better decision and would have mitigated fan backlash and probably encourage speculation.
You would have to be incredibly stupid to think they would keep the JL dead. There was no need for hints.
Or ppl could have been more patient and optimistic and less aggressive, disrespectful and hostile
@@Tribrid-zv3nq Okay? People have been waiting for something out of the Arkhamverse for a while, like a Superman game, or a new Batman game focused on the bat family, or even Batman Beyond, just to get Suicide Squad Kill the Justice League. I think its understandable people would be mad at a game where 1 - We dont really care about the protagonists all that much, 2 - The justice league is RIGHT THERE, and their introduction is them being folded and killed by low class villains, and 3 - The way they killed Batman (even though its pretty obvious he's a clone, and there was no way they could predict Kevin's death).
I do agree a lot of fans over reacted and were unnecessarily hostile, but theres justification for all the frustration.
@@Tribrid-zv3nq No screw that game , after disrespecting our favorite hero's by urinating on them , it's like spitting at the audiences faces
Its a terrible prank that took to long to get to the punchline
But maybe they had enought time to do that but insteas they dragged it out 4 month. I remember telltale game that brought each episode every month out..
So they left as soon as they knew this was going to damage the legacy. Kind of a dick move ngl...
But im glad the League are alive and that they'll release the rest if the seasons soon. Tempting on getting the game one day but I don't wanna waste £100.00
No, it’s more like they saw the writing on the wall
you can buy it for 30 already
@@sytherwusky They saw the writing on the wall from Sefton Hill's own decisions. His choices led to this.
@@Kpengie Crunch is not a triumph of the workforce, but a failure of the management
It's discounted heavily on many platforms, especially on epic games if ur on pc. Cuz who knows when they shut it down entirely and it gets delisted. Although they said there would be an offline update, I'm not sure about it now, they really gave up on the game
So you mean to tell me Sefton Hill wrote this pile of garbage we got? WOW!
The main issue is the live service game design
@@1Chasgand how it’s literally just a trash looter shooter with DC slapped over it
All 5 main Arkham Knight writers were the main writers of this game. Hill was a co-director before he left and left the rest of it all to Rasmus Hoejengaard who you see in the official videos before the game's launch
He abandoned ship so that no one will bash him.
@@joelanthonylim6792They made a big piece of garbage.
Lmao, so Sefton Hill is a coward who jumped ship when he realised his incompetence would mean he’d have to face the backlash.
I feel silly for praising him while giving sht to the developers
@@TEEEEVthat is exactly what im saying to dozens of people since the beginning
its not a legit article, its bullshit fed to a Journo to deflect blame.
@@TEEEEV he still deserves praise for his work on the Arkham Trilogy. Unfortunately creators having a fall from grace after years of success isn’t an uncommon thing.
@@TEEEEVbut that doesn’t mean the developers shouldn’t get shi neither, cause even if you wanna get rid of the story element for SS the game is still disrespectful, and trash.
So wait Sefton Hill was the villain the whole time
"Not always! Well, sometimes! Confusing, isn't it? If I were you, I know I'd want to know what the hell is going on, if I were you."
yup, he's the real brainiac
There is way too much blame though for Sefton Hill in this article and no mentions of Sweet Baby, that doesn’t seem like a coincidence fr
@@beastlygamer21 who the fuck is sweet baby 🤣🤣
@@DeeboFromHIa Boogeyman basement dwellers created to blame for anything they don't like in video games.
You know it’s bad when Batman Arkham Videos makes a vid talking about this game’s downfall 💀 that’s honestly tough
Batman and the justice league did not die tho, and this whole hate campaign was beyond unneccesary? Did you watch the video? 💀
@@Mr.Vagabond bro where or when in this comment did i talk about the justice league or Batman the projection is crazy 💀🤦🏽♂️
@@Mr.Vagabond copium is crazy i did watch the video it’s just funny that a guy who mainly makes videos about playing games made a video about why the game fell off
Sefton Hill wanting to make a weaponized vehicle component for the game is hilarious you really can't take the Batmobile outta the guy
Bro really said “most people hated the batmobile in Arkham knight and said it was overused…. LETS DO IT AGAIN PEOPLE”
@@ineedit1772 after reading the report and seeing the devs pleading with him to hint that the JL was alive but he ignored them...dude is more delulu than I thought
Always can count on you to cut out the bs and get to the point.
that is right, this channel never wasted our time.
@@Arkhamnature We all likely began watching BAV for various riddler questions we had
@@Raphentei Ah, you too must have come from Riddle locations in Arkham City
@@camron147 we all know Arkham City Riddles are the hardest.
@@Arkhamnature I’d actually say knights are. I can do most of cities by memory but night I only get like 20 by the end of the game.
The main thing I think is best to take away from this is that it doesn’t look like anyone’s gonna get laid off. This year’s been brutal enough for game devs, at least there’s less concern they’ll lose their jobs over others’ mistakes.
That's a nice note.
That is very nice. I hope it eventually leads to Rocksteady making a Superman game series, since they apparently want a single player, but that is VERY wishful thinking lmao)).
The series really was on a downward spiral the moment Paul Dini decided not to return. We need someone like him to step in and remind them of when they’re getting too ambitious.
Paul Dini didn't decide not to return. Sefton didn't call him for when they did Arkham Knight. If anything, Paul Dini was waiting to be hired for Arkham Knight.
Paul Dini would only be able to contribute and offer advices on the script. Not be the one to region them in on the game's ambition. If you were talking about the story, then IDK if it's the ambition was the issue. I don't think he'd be brought or would agree to write a game where the story is mainly a framework for the live-service multiplayer model.
@@Samuel152 Yeah, apparently, WB wanted to employ in-house. It might've been because it's cheaper.
Apparently, Arkham Origins had several writers. Maybe if they're still available, try calling them?
I liked the writing a lot in that game. Sure, the Black Mask/Joker twist was annoying due to milking the clown, but on its own there's a lot of great beats and character development for Bruce.
@@leithaziz2716 I see where you're coming from regarding the twist being annoying, but I think it falls in line, because the entirety of Batman Arkham games are built on the relationship between Batman and Joker, it's the core of all games.
This could of been great if it wasn’t live service and the story wrapped up in one sitting and was melee combat focused
I agree with bro above me like real bad
why did u change ur entire comment after people already liked it 😹
The OG comment was better
Dude, get over it. The game is good. Just let the game be live service, let developers do whatever they want. You don’t have to like it, just don’t whine about it
@@Mr.Drew70 The game is canned, so we did get over it. No, it's not good. Doing whatever they want doesn't equal good. And finally, we're paying 70 dollars for it, so if it's shit, you better believe it's gonna be criticized to oblivion.
"You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villian"
Sefton Hill really took that to heart. I feel so sorry for the developers who just wanted to make a fun Suicide Squad/Justice League story...
This game is like a class example on the dangers of chasing trends. Aside from the live service, can you imagine a game which just came out in 2024 taking inspiration from a movie that came out in 2018?
They took inspiration from infinity war and endgame. How much more trend chaser can you get?
2016. And it's absolute garbage at that. And they already had a good Suicide Squad movie in their own universe.
So this entire time we were defending sefton hill, when it was largely his ideas, and he hopped ship when he saw it wasn’t going well?
He also wrote AK story which i dont like at all,so im not surprised that this game story is shit
@@memiaszzinternetu6513and who wrote the others?
@@Snaaake_Beater Paul Dini wrote AA and AC,WB wrote AO
@@memiaszzinternetu6513 Arkham Origins had the best Story NGL
Allegedly.
I'm not alieving any fault on Sefton Hill's part but this article is just damage control for WB Games and Warner Bros in general. The writer is Jason Schrierwho's a hack and his source is David Haddad, the PRESIDENT of Warner Bros. Interactive Entertainment--Hill's and Walker's former exec boss. David Haddad basically just laid all the blame for the studio's failures to his own exec bosses in London on Hill and Walker. Despite coming out with an amicable letter upon Hill's and Walker's departure in 2022, 2 years later Haddad is saving his ass by only blaming their leadership. Now THAT's pretty two-faced.
Weirdly suspicious how this article painted Sefton Hill as the sole responsible for this absolute atrocity of a story.
Tbc, the concept wasn't all bad, but the execution was beyond terrible, and i'm not talking just about the live service aspects.
This game needed, at the very least, a fully developed CQC combat and gadget systems for each squad member, without so much focus on simply achieving bigger numbers.
The concept of being inspired by infinity war and endgame is what ruin it. DC again see marvel do something and want to do it there way like the movies. You are right on some of the points you brought up. It's just everything from story, gameplay, characters. Just so many things are bad with this game.
@@elporkster thats not true. Your mind fabricated/concocted that cuz ppl like you think DC is copying Marvel to be successful cuz like nobody can think on their own without eyeing Marvel's work
I don't think it paints Sefton as the role responsible person. WB seems to be painted as culpable too. As well as a general "toxic positivity" culture that didn't leave room for criticism, apparently.
The concept would be ultimately better if the people who wanted to take down the JL were along the names of Darksied. Now that would make sense, because realistically Arkham Batman on his own can use a weapon disruptor and fear takedown (kill) those original 4 clowns. The other leaguers are overkill, as a true Arkham Flash can kill them in a heartbeat and they wouldn’t even know that it happened. Truly a missed opportunity considering they had plenty of time to develop and implement a character like Darksied. The battles and story we would have gotten… The comeback of the league at the end… Missed opportunity.
Because the article's source is David Haddad, the president of WB Interactive who is basically shifting blame from himself to his former employees Hill and Walker. Nobody in this comment section actually read the article, just watched the video and trusted the narrative.
2:07 I still want to know who asked for Mrs Freeze and Zoe Lawton.
I don’t know sweet baby inc 🤷🏾♂️ mfs really looked at 2 characters who are side characters (assuming mrs freeze is nora) and said “lets make the 2 characters no one cares to play as and make them playable people will love it”
yeah, imagine having an array of characters, incluinding JL members to play with and have instead this kind of crap
@@ineedit1772 FOR GOD SAKE, PEOPLE WERE DOING MRS FREEZE FOR DECADE IF NOT MORE. Shit, Gotham Girls made by BTAS, has played with idea of Mrs Freeze. Sweet Baby Inc is just some random company. Like, is it just hard to believe that the same people who wasted Ra's and hyper fixated on Joker and Freeze just do a stupid writing decision?
@@mikhaelgribkov4117It always has to be culture war related for them
Nobody asked for this game either
Obvious scape goat situation and hit piece. The core problem with this game is that it’s live service, even the story issues can still be traced back to that. It’s a game which was supposed to have a long life cycle so the story is incomplete and unsatisfying. It being a live service game was still a WB decision
Diss track coming up
MEET THE HILLS
Demigah?
You know it’s serious when Batman Arkham Videos makes a video about it
Honestly, I am not at all shocked. Sefton already lost a lot of my trust with his choices on both story and game design for Arkham Knight, and from the start I was extremely skeptical of SSKTJL in large part because of how Arkham Knight turned out. My suspicion is that after City he got a bit too full of himself, and that bled into him both deciding he was a writer and him making some questionable design choices.
Even in City there's a lot of delulu and character waste with Ra's and Hugo, it's just people ignored it and with KTJL the flaws of writing which existed since Asylum just got more brazen.
*EVEN IF* the JL comes back…. Ya still took out Robin & Wonder Woman…..
Oh yeah! I'm still pissed about Robin, However, from my point of view there might be a chance he could be alive or could have survived but Completely injured cuz We only saw his mask and no dead body.
@@M64bros with all the goofy pg-13 type deaths in this game like the game over deaths and the superman death I highly doubt he’s alive they probably just didn’t want to show the body on screen
Kevin Conroy will always be the true voice of batman and i'm glad we're gonna get our justice league back. I hope they come up with a way for Wonder Woman and Superman
They should do a reboot of the Arkham Series, because it wouldn't feel right if Kevin Conroy's Batman was replaced with a different voice actor.
@@davidchittick6783 bruv did you watch the video?
@@Tribrid-zv3nq I did, I'm just saying that they need to have a plan for what their gonna do with the franchise & universe since Conroy has passed away.
@@davidchittick6783 Rodger Craig is pretty much the next voice of batman. I mean he voiced him in Arkham Origins
Makes wonder how WB got Conroy on board but not Newbern/Daly and Eisenberg
Surely this guy, who's literally the God of Arkham games, must be thinking like wtf has happened to the Arkham series
Surely you totally not toxic fans are okay with people liking this game
Why must he think like you?
@@Tribrid-zv3nqIts over, you can literally stop.
@@Mr.Drew70I’m okay with people liking this game I’m just not okay with the game i payed for to be live service trash then when i call it trash people tell me i should have lowered my expectations on a live service game also not okay with fans telling me I can’t critique the story cuz its not complete yet like yeah i can the first episode was trash
@@ineedit1772
Too bad developers can make games whatever they want them to be. If it’s live service and so be it it’s not your call. Just let live service games exist. And Let developers do whatever they want with them.
seeing as Sefton Hill apparently had a big part in what Suicide Squad ended up being (if that's even true) and that current studio leaders wanna bring another game back to it's Arkham roots gives me the tiniest smidgen of hope that they can seriously make a comeback... it could be false hope but still.
if this doesn’t teach them a lesson bankruptcy is the only thing that will
@@madhatter2744didn’t they say that they have other project that is single player game coming up?
This single player game better be Batman related. I doubt it’ll be a new IP cause of the 200 m lost. They have to make a game that will hit hopefully it’s like a red hood game in the Arkham verse
@@marvelgod1807 At least it a new start for Rocksteady.
Of course it’s true
Check out DC Fandome 2020 where Suicide Squad game was first revealed
He literally presented it
3:48 a Superman game would be nice. Hard, but nice
Hell, I would like a proper Arkham Knight Red Hood game rated M.
@@CanyonALynn That's actually a great idea
@@CanyonALynnwe need that I need that 😭
I would've loved if Rocksteady moved on to giving Superman the Arkham treatment in terms of offering a groundbreaking title that blew all the character's pior gaming efforts out of the water after they were done with Batman.
@@CanyonALynn I would love any sort of more immediate sequel to Arkham Knight (as in not a future Batman Beyond title, though I'd love to see that too) whether it's a Batfamily or Red Hood game. The latter could be a more grounded storyline focusing on Gotham's underworld and Red Hood forming his own anti-crime empire, similar to the story concept by Game Den.
Nah I'm not buying that this was all written by Sefton. The tone of the story is too inconsistent. Some of the writing was actually well thought out. Other times it would just be downright hateful / disrespectful to fans in a sense. There were probably several figure heads above him that forced them to add in all the bad dialogue. Think about it, the sheer amount of Batman hate and ridicule in some of the lines sound exactly like they came from people who actually hate Batman in real life. Not saying B.A.V is wrong I just don't buy the article
The article is also paywalled, which itself is a joke since Schreier is a hack journalist, and this video only highlights certain parts that supports the narrative that Hill and Walker are to blame. No mention of David Haddad, a WB executive, as the article's source. Just damage control.
After playing Arkham Knight I can totally believe Hill was a major reason for the game turning out the way it did
It leaves a bitter taste in my mouth that fans jumped on the bandwagon of blaming everyone *but* Hill and Walker for the way the game came out, and in fact praising them for ditching a dead studio when they (allegedly) were the very ones responsible for making the game so bad. And they didn't even have the balls to show up and promote it during the insider video series, they really just threw everyone else under the bus and said, "polish a turd we're out of here". That's unbelievably shitty. There are so many hardworking innocent devs who deserved an apology from fan backlash before, but (if this is true) now even twofold.
I was one of those people but after this... Damn also there red flags like a dev leaving and not wanting her name to be a associated with the game in anyway shape or form and the Dev who passed not agreeing with the decisions leading to the stress that led to him taking his own life. Then with the recent reports he clearly wasnt the only one.
The irony is that you're jumping on another bandwagon over a hit piece/damage control article whose source is David Haddad, the president of WB Interactive. This executive is just saving his ass to the higher ups in WB. Maybe Hill is to blame as well but don't play into WB's hands.
So basically order 66 in real life 😭
“Wait a minute this whole operation was your idea.”
Actually, the live service idea was Rocksteady's, not warner
source : forbes
I hope with the newer seasons they can turn the game around. Maybe give deathstroke a combat approach instead if giving him guns
If they gave captain boomerang, king shark, and supposedly katana the person who only uses a sword is also gonna be mainly using guns what makes you think they’ll let deathstroke be an exception
I think it’s not unreasonable that Sefton Hill could have a hand in bad ideas for the game, but it sure is convenient that ALL the problems apparently are from two people no longer at the company.
With this revelation, I assume that means Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League is not as bad as people claim. It was just the casualty of big business.
If this is true, Sefton Hill destroyed the studio and jumped ship. The idea of not including hints that the super heroes were coming back is insane. The backlash is likely the main reason the game sunk.
It's so stupid that WB made Rocksteady work on Suicide Squad, so Monteral could make Gotham Knights. The whole thing should've been switched. Rocksteady had the experience and the perfect universe to make a game like GK, they basically already started it with Arkham Knight's new gameplay mechanics, like the characters and vehicles, they even started a similar narrative with the DLC's.
Montreal would then continue the SS game, and it would be it's own universe and it would be much better received. As the Arkhamverse was story-heavy and grounded, so this live-service way of storytelling, and all the multiverse plotlines just don't match what Rocksteady already had built. WB just wanted it's own Destiny, but chose a studio that had no experience with creating such a game.
Well too be fair, both games kinda sucked I mean I personally only played like one hour of Gotham Knight before uninstalling and getting a refund. They should have focus on that Arkham beyond game we seen rumors about years ago.
@@Faded.VisualsI personally liked Gotham Knights. Its nowhere near as good as the Arkham games, but it's good and you can play with a friend. The combat is also not bad and the open world activities and crimes are well made, better than Spider-Man 2 crimes to me.
I agree, but I don't think Arkhamverse is grounded in any form. Even if we exclude Suicide Squad from canon, Superman exists, Flash exists, GL exists, etc. etc. etc.
Even what was happening in Arkham Asylum is def not grounded.
@@seregagerassimov4864What they mean by grounded is that the games don't involve super sci-fi, multiverse, time-travel, all of that kind of stuff and just because a more serious-based story that focused on Batman saving Gotham.
Nah, GK being under WB Montreal is why character use isn't as atrocious, if anything they just needed them use original Batman system and not try to be AC Origins.
I said this on twitter/X but it’s messed up that hill made these decisions and let his people get harassed one even committed suicide and did not help them but also in my opinion the devs have my respect because this could have much worse and they still made a fun game if they better and less lazy leaders this game would have been great
Damn Sefton was the issue. What a mess he became
The Justice League never should have stayed dead at launch.They should have had them come back before the story was over at launch.
Sefton Hill basically doomed the game from the start and ditched it before it came out.
Sefton Hill should not have replaced Paul Dini as the writter. Some ppl are just better story tellers. Even in arkham knight the story was a bit shaky with weird blood disease thing.
Not sure why they are shifting the blame onto one person here. The team made an objectively bad repetitive game here regardless of the story. clearly majority of the talent left the studio. There are also 12 credited writers who contributed to this awful story not to mention sbi involvement in the “sensitivity reading process” At least some people have their head screwed on and can see that it’s a bit weird how they are shifting all responsibility onto Sefton hill ?😂 I don’t think he’s not to blame however you can’t just point the finger at one person. I assume some kind of fallout happened behind the scenes, hence why he’s no longer there and now they are throwing him under the bus.
Well said mate
The rumour that the “majority of the talent left” started because the two founders left. Now it comes out that they were responsible for this.
But yeah we should wait till more stuff comes out before jumping to conclusions. Something definitely happened behind the scenes.
@@inshal6420 what do u mean rumour when the founders left? they are not the ones at the computer making the game what “talent” do they possess ?😂 the Arkham games came out long ago the talented developers who made them clearly moved onto work on other things. they also hired a ton of new staff who were clearly not up to standard as seen in the quality of the final product
@@whatthephilip7446 there’s no report of a mass exit from Rocksteady. People have compared linkedin postings.
Also saying the directors don’t have any talent because they weren’t coding the game is like saying Christopher Nolan isn’t responsible for his movies succeeding because he wasn’t actually holding the camera.
@@inshal6420 wtf is that analogy doesn’t make any sense
Regardless of what Sefton did or didn't do, for all we know this could just be an attempt at damage control, let's not forget that WB had plenty of time and opportunities to look over the game and make some changes before release. This was a collective failure.
Sefton Hill might need to stay away from the writers' room. I love Arkham Knight and I do like its story, but it definitely could've been a lot better. I believe Suicide Squad's story and the game overall could've been really great without the live service element; there's barely any story to tell in subsequent seasons, as we've seen in season 1, and keeping the Justice League's fate a secret at launch has proven to be an astronomical mistake. Whatever Sefton Hill makes at Hundred Star Games will prove if he still has it in him or not, and I hope for all the best to all the people at Rocksteady, and that they manage to make something they're happy with
It was probably a total miscalculation from Sefton Hills part. But I really don't know how you would do that considering people were going to be mad about it... Sometimes you just have a bad day the office i guess. Arkham Knight almost suffered the same fate as Suicide Squad, as the batmobile overly implemented and they had no boss fights. And I agree if he's the one involved with the writing for Arkham Knight and Suicide Squad, he needs to stay away from the writers room.
Also, if Rocksteady is planning on coming back with their original IP or new Batman game, then they got to bring back Paul Dini. I also think the new team at Rocksteady was done a complete disservice when it came to Suicide Squad. The leader left them to pick up all the scraps.
Yeah if Hill knocks it out of the park with Hundred Star he can regain his respect but it could definitely go the way of Glen Schofield and Callisto Protocol
Arkham Knight's story is fine on it's own. But if you look at the Arkham games as a trilogy, as a whole , and what is being set up prior by Paul Dini, Knights story is absolute dog shit and mostly fanservice. Which is fun. But doesnt make for a satisfying conclusion to big plot points that were set up in the pervious games. Hush, Harley, etc all went nowhere in Arkham Knight.
@@Sil3ntKn1ghtthey didn't go nowhere, their conculsion was just different than what they seemed to have.
@@Sil3ntKn1ght I wouldn't be surprised if weaker writing parts in AA and AC are also Sefton's problem.
In other words, it was like the Star Wars sequels trilogy during development. No one could decide on a single concrete vision for the game, for main story content, combat, puzzles, Easter eggs for the DC universe (No Wingert Riddler, we didn't need you showing up, and I mean it this time. A sad day for this Riddler fan.), things to give distinct flavor different from the Arkham games, and a live service model fans would WANT to pay and play with. Hence, the Arkham tributes (all but thrusted down our throats) that fell flat or else felt like they were shitting all over the story of the game trilogy that still holds up to this day.
It's nice to hear about the core ideas for content waves, cutting out the middle man and getting to the "behind the traversal camera" bits we all want. BAV, to hear Sefton Hill is largely responsible for a majority of the problems this game faces (not with gameplay, but most everything else)... I can believe it but, at the same time, I feel really bad for people who actually LIKE this "Screw established lore, let's destroy things together." game not getting the extended content they were promised. Established fans of the Arkham series, and its related media, were let down significantly by having this game take place in the same universe (leads to a whole slew of plot holes and half-assed explanations for AWKWARD relationships across the multiverse)... but first time comers deserved a well-written script; character relationships that developed organically as possible; no overabundance of insufferable man children roaming the streets (Flash, Boomerang, some ARGUS thugs, Penguin, I could go on.); proper handling of our protagonists both in play and in cutscenes. No player (veteran or first-timer) is getting ANY of that, resulting in a very angry, sad, and confused player base.
I think there's also a George Lucas issue during Prequels: an original creator who helped to come up with franchise but dear God were people around them more capable of making this ship work and some deeper issues got glossed over by fans. Arkham series (besides Origin who had different writers) always had issue with how they sacrifice good character writing for epic/cool moment and how Batman feels like automaton while main stories are really series of cameos with poor thought out thematic and narrative weight. For all Knight's issues, it was the one which actually felt that Kevin Conroy was allowed to play character and not his one dimensional version while Kill The Justice League is every Arkham writing problem since Asylum growing 10 times.
I think on paper, the concept of killing the justice league is fantastic. Connecting it to Arkham was a bad idea because we have a connection with that universe’s Batman. Making it live service shooter was the other nail in the coffin. If this was a single player (or maybe even coop with a buddy) Arkham style (but not same universe ofc) story focused game, I think this would have performed very well
And each character could be like the characters in the Arkham games with their own gadgets and movesets (and only Deadshot has a gun). So much missed potential
I agree it's not but they could've been smarter about it instead of the throw away methods that fans can easily pick apart.
The execution is everything, on paper it is a nice twist, could even be in the Arkhamverse with some major changes like having Batman helping you out from the begining,returning from his "death", could have worked, but of course, every game design decision would have to change as well and they should give players Deathstroke from the beginning
Plot twist:
Sefton deliberately sabotaged this game and rocksteady to screw over WB for dooming the game as a live service model in the first place, and then he left before the eventual backlash
So he's a coward.
That's wishful thinking.
This is delusional.
Massive cope.
Rocksteady themselves chose the live service model according to Schreier.
Let me get this straight. The game was originally two completely separate games that were forced together, after years of confused development the head writers ditched the studio knowing the game would fail and WB forced in a bunch pf greedy micro transactions and battlepasses that nobody asked for?
What happened to canceling shit projects and retaining dignity as a game studio and producer?
With how Multiversus turned out, I doubt the next game they make won’t be plagued by bad management from WB.
I'm still anticipating that the final season featuring the resurrected Justice League will end similarly to the JLU finale "Destroyer" where the JL will thank the Suicide Squad with a five minute headstart after things go back to normal.
Unbelievable that Sefton Hill was the man behind this terrible plot for the game. Such a disappointment
Please be Batman beyond, go back to what made you awesome rocksteady
until we get an actual batman game WITH citizens in the streets and actual crimes we dont need a beyond game yet
How about a different hero all together instead of the Spiderman knock off in a batsuit?
No matter how much I love Batman, it's very apparent that he is milked beyond belief.
Superman game or Flash game or other DC hero game is long overdue.
Hearing that incompetence was the primary cause for the game’s failure instead of Sweet Baby gives me more reason to believe that future Rocksteady titles will be better and it’s not an indication of the studio’s future.
It's pretty funny how OP claimed that SBI barely had any influence on the game and what youtubers are saying is pretty much BS, only for said youtubers to shift the blame on SBI once again
Turns out majority of people didn't want to kill the Justice League, those who want that are just loud.
I get it. Each villain from each season would have a reason to bring back the rest of the Justice League. Except for Wonder Woman, who is still dead, which could open the door for a possible successor to the Wonder Woman mantle. This could also open some redemption arc for the Suicide Squad members, with a possible death
Still couldn't ignore the fact that the game had a number of issues that needed to be fixed, & the fact that he left, while the studio is understaffed, only added more problems with the game that should have been fixed. But regardless, if this is where the story is heading then let them finish the game. At least give it an ending before it goes. Better to not leave the story unfinished
Criticism or no criticism, people always forget that 1) the four mainline Arkhamverse games are still up, running, and enjoyable to play, 2) fanon discontinuity is a thing, and 3) Multiverse Theory is a blessing that neatly assists Reason 2. After all, stuff like Batman: The Adventures Continue, supposedly set in the DC Animated Universe, is flawed only if it's NOT deemed an Elseworlds parallel storyline.
If that's the case, then I don't know what future will hold for Hundred Star Games.
What they need to do:
1. Look over the Batman Arkham games before suicide squad, review the games, asses the best parts, look at reviews from the games and listen to the feedback given, implement those reviews/feedback into the games
2. Stick to single base player games, doing an online service is not ideal to what the fans want, Batman Arkham knight reason for success was due to its story, character development, missions, combat system, playing as other characters that actually happens for a plot in the game, the environment, it’s grittiness we all love and adore, it’s dark tone with a hint of jokes time to time with balance, the bat family ofc and surely a lot more aswell. Doing a live service game is a terrible idea and was the downfall at the get go.
3. Make the missions less repetitive and interesting, go back to story base side missions that involve around different elements and activities that make the players want to jump back in and replay. The side missions after the main story were boring.
Lastly, go back to the Batman Arkham roots, this is self explanatory. I honestly don’t know if they’ll deliver but here’s hoping I guess…but I would love to see how they would make other dceu character solo games like green arrow, the flash, superman etc, who knows…
Nobody is reading all of this garbage
@Mr.Drew70 we did but yo furry self nah 😰🤏
@Mr.Drew70 I did, you take the L
@@Mr.Drew70you have a weird gay furry in your pfp, and you think Suicide Squad is a good game. Don't tell other people what is garbage when you have no taste.
@@ConnieCannon-zq2md
What does me being a furry have to do with anything?
Thanks for the emphasis on sefton hill vision, more people should be aware that HE WROTE AND DIRECT THE WHOLE PROJECT
They should delete suicide squad from canon now
100%
Agree
It wasn’t canon to begin with.
@@whatifvegansneverexisted3327 yes it was
@@imed-ha77 disagree
I guess that Sefton Hill’s new studio is going to suck.
There were some hints but im glad the justice league isnt dead.
i know the ppl blaming sweet baby inc for how the story was written r fuming rn 😂
So, everyone is sitting here saying Stefon Hill is a genius and that they can’t wait for his new game studio to get off the ground; when, in reality, he’s the one who made all the horrible decisions tied to the game and then dipped before any back lash could hit him. Real shitty.
This just proves my crazy schizophrenic theory that Sefton didn’t want to make this game and made it bad on purpose as an F you to WB which is based and terrible at the same time
@@ineedit1772if it is true, than yeah. There are better ways to meddle with WB than getting other people in awkward position.
@@ineedit1772No, he simply didn't want to be blamed for his terrible decisions
I wanna play the new Batman Arkham game, but I don’t want it as a VR game.
Is it too late to remake this game completely the way it should of been as an arkham style game and use the voice kevin conroy provided before passing 😭😭
It is too late, sadly.
if this was released as a full game it could've worked better than it has (still would be trash and have some faults) but what killed this game mainly are a few things:
1. the live service aspect. it feels like ages since we get story updates and not much content either. just recycled stuff
2. the story parts are terrible (i mean in season 1)
3. the lack of communication more recently from devs
4. the amount of bugs
5. the deaths- for me its not that they died but more the way they died. it just looked pathetic
6. shop skins are awful and the only ones i would buy are either classic skins or red and black colour pallette for Harley
I will probs just play the season and fight the boss, get the new character test them and then not play the game again until there is new stuff again. i used to play it a bit cus i love Harley but still she doesn't feel like Arkham Harley and the characters feel to similar. i get its a shooting game but the arkham games were fighting games and each character felt different. even tho i believe Harley had some recycled catwoman stuff they still felt slightly different.
if they made it obvious the JL would return i think it wouldve been a better direction but with the questionable story choices, lack of content, lack of communication and awful shop skins im not suprised its not doing too well. if they add some arkham skins that might help them get a bit of money but it wont save this game. this game had potential but the gameplay and story and content is what stopped it.
However at leats we had Knight, City, Asylum and Origins - some of the best games i have ever played in my life.
Isn't Jason Schreier overrated, though? His article seems more focused on blaming Rocksteady Studios than blaming WB Games. This said, Rocksteady Studios has indeed been massively incompetent for the last 8-9 years.
Jason Schreier is literally the first one to call out bs behind CDPR and how Cyberpunk 2077 was a production hell. He knows shit and most people trying to brigade him are mostly grifters.
@@mikhaelgribkov4117 So what? My left nut called out CDPR the first time they delayed the game for "quality assurance". Schreier's a hack journalist with a history of misrepresentation and serving his own personal biases. The article's source is David Haddad, the president of WB Interactive, of course he's helping this exec save his ass with WB by writing yet another hit piece/damage control article.
This really reads like a one-sided scapegoating of Sefton Hill because he no longer works there and not the multiple other people and WB execs involved. He obviouslty bears some responsibility for his role but he can't be the only one.
This is what I'm thinking. It's too clean. "Yeah, he came up with everything you don't like, like boomerang not using a boomerang and killing all the JL. Now that he's gone, we can get back to what made the studio great."
@@tomimpala I trust Jason. Dude leaked multiple details about GTA 6 before its eventual trailer announcement and details of the game. He is as reliable as you can get in games journalism.
@@fluxdr1ve143 No one is saying he isn't reliable but he obviously has a source that is telling just their side of things. The overall narrative is too simplistic and just comes off as blaming one person.
@@lazersoupe The article didn’t blame him entirely. He certainly is responsible for the game’s state partly, but usually executive heads are largely responsible for a game’s state. A la BioWare or CD projekt red. The ground floor devs aren’t the cause for the game’s glaring design flaws and monétisation. Definitely Rocksteady heads and WB.
@@fluxdr1ve143 That just means he's tight with Take Two execs, and is compromised. Like this article? Whose the source? Oh it's David Haddad, the president of WB Interactive who's blaming it all on Hill and Walker two years after their departure. Wow.
So basically sefton hill created this mess and left the studio when he knew game was dumpster fire
Seriously... the story was trash and left right before the blowout, even though he was told the story needed hints of the JL return.
@@CanyonALynn maybe we are treating devs at rocksteady harsh it wasnt their fault. Sefton Hill seems like the real villain to me
No. The game is fine the way it is, just let the game be live service. If you don’t like it then don’t play it. Simple as that
Its the same guy who tried to convince the whole world that Arkham knight is a original character after everyone figured out it was Jason after the first teaser.
@@memiaszzinternetu6513 bro i forgot that lol😂 ah memories from 2014 internet
It should’ve been a teen titans game where you play as all five titans to save the justice league and defeat brainiac
I wonder what went through Rocksteady’s heads that made them think “they’ll love this”
It obvious no one at rocksteady who cared about making a good game had any real say on the decision making of the final product
I wonder what went through your heads when you decided to throw a tantrum over a game
@@ysurfed4648
No dude. It’s obvious you loved to hate on a game all because it’s a live service game. Get over it. Rocksteady put a lot of love and care into this game
@@Mr.Drew70 Hey, I think you missed a spot on Rocksteady's boots there.
@@Mr.Drew70 It’s not a tantrum, it’s a genuine question. I haven’t really thought about this joke of a game since I refunded my copy at launch. There are other actual good games to play out there.
Sounds like WB or someone needed a scapegoat to save face, in the real world messes like this don’t fall on just one man
Making the decision to not tease the League's return really negatively affected how people viewed the game, half of the talk around it before it released was Batman's "death", and you had to actually pay attention to the story to find out that Brainiac's League are likely clones
To be fair, most would ignore it. Like, people ignore that Batman's body was broken by the time Harley shot him and that Batman in other games needed people to save his ass.
i still don't think i can stress enough how almost everything people hate about this game was something they absolutely loved about the 2021 movie, but since now it's happening to characters that they personally know, suddenly they don't like it. god ours is such an incredibly solipsistic species.
I'm sorry to hear this happen. I hope whatever singleplayer game they decide to make will leave a better impression for the new audience. 😕🐵🙏
This whole story is just super upsetting. I still think the game itself isn't even THAT bad, yet it's clear some things definitely went wrong in production.
If it wasn't for the whole live service model and Sefton Hill biting off more than he can chew, the game wouldn't be in it's current state.
I feel bad for all the people at Rocksteady who were saddled with a sloppy and unfinished product and had to roll with all the punches after the heads jumped ship to avoid their own failure.
I do hope they get the chance to finish the other seasons so that we can see the actual ending, though it seems there's very little room for improvement at this point.
I can only wish the people at Rocksteady the best and hope for the best case scenario that their next project will be a much better one, if they get the chance.
The current devs are the real heroes working out the bugs and updates post launch. The people that hate trained them should apologize.
Those idiots never should’ve made that game! We never asked for it! We wanted Arkham Beyond!😠
I have a hard time believing all of this was Seftons doing entirely. I think this is media spin and an attempt to foist the shortcomings onto a scapegoat and a guy who no longer works there as an easy one. This still reeks of board oversight and Warner is a company that can't get out of their own way. I'm sure it's partially true but not entirely.
I agree. Even if it is true, that doesn’t excuse the involvement of Sweet Baby Inc. We may never get a definitive true story, but I’ll say this - the story here is better than the actual Suicide Squad game’s story
@@evilzdeadite I’ve not said anything that hasn’t already been said before. I don’t need to make up anything because it’s not worth my time to do that
@@ajward9112 yeah, said before by people with baseless information and grifters like cyael. Just because other people say it doesnt make it true.
Story aside, it would have been so much better with hand to hand comabt and no live service elements
More proof devs should always stick to what their best at, in this case SSKTJL shoulda been a proper Arkham like game
Besides the hate Sefton is getting now (jeez guys take some chill pills)
If they decide to keep this game canon I can think of 3 new DC games they could make,
1. A Superman game which takes place after this where Superman has to regain the trust of the people.
2. After the events of SS the JL disbanded and Batman & Superman didn’t leave on good terms, which would lead to a World’s Finest game where Batman & Superman has to mend those bridges
3. A Justice League game where the League is forced together again to stop Starro’s invasion
Please try to remain civil if you chose to comment, you guys aren’t 12, no need to call people names
I have a question, will you continue to make content for future seasons or are you done with this game?
Wow I(probably most of us) owe the developers a huge apology. Sefton hill on the other hand…. I hope his new game company fails spectacularly.
This is what happens when fans jump straight to conclusions instead of experiencing the whole story right up until the end.
That is true!!! Partally I blame WB for pushing live service AND i blame fans for scheming, hating, and not even tryna give this game a chance. I personally like this idea!!! I really do.
Honestly instead of this dumpster fire they should have scraped Kill the Justice League and Gotham Knight, and focused on that Batman Arkham Beyond we heard rumors about years ago smh
Respectfully that project was never set in arkhamverse!!!
@@krunalpatel1118exactly. The concept art is telling.
Honestly, the fact that the League would be resurrected was so painfully obvious that I don't think any explicit hints were needed. I get that a lot of players are teenagers, but you have to be quite heavily media-illiterate to think that any comic-book story, especially one so heavily revolving around a multiverse, wouldn't just bring them back eventually.
What were they thinking?? Going up against a veteran who created a wonderful trilogy and fans love it.Of course SSKTJL wouldn't work.
If I was Rocksteady, I would make a Green Arrow game
If a suicide squad game flopped, a fucking green arrow game would plummet to the ground
@@toebeee5168ss flopped bc of different reasons not because suicide squad is lame lol…
@@toebeee5168 not if the story was top notch
@@eccosx that wasn’t what I was saying. I’m saying a suicide squad game isn’t an inherently bad idea and I think people would’ve been excited for it initially, but it was not developed properly. Most people would not care for a green arrow game because A. green arrow is not a renowned character to general audiences and B. What could you really do with a green arrow game to begin with? It would mainly just feel like a retread of the Arkham games most likely. In my opinion, they should be gotten away from making superhero games, clearly Sefton Hill’s original idea, and enjoy a certain level of freedom without being shackled to make ANOTHER superhero game. Lord knows we’ve got far too much superhero media right now.
Nah, Superman needs his own game first.
Really wished we got WB Montréal’s SS game right about now.
1:55 I was hoping for that