Feb. 1: Why I don't Hinge Cut Trees when doing TSI | Dream Farm w/ Bill Winke
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- čas přidán 2. 02. 2024
- I don't hinge cut when I am doing TSI work on my farm. There is a time and place for hinge cutting but I don't see it as a long-term solution in my case. In my situation, I want the tree on the ground dead. In this episode, I talk about why I don't hinge cut and the tradeoffs involved.
Never understood hinge cutting, seems like a way to ask the universe for a barber chair to happen to ya. Love the great content you’re putting out here. -Northern Alberta, Canada
Thanks for the comment Colton. The biggest reason people do it is to have instant cover. The tree keeps growing sideways along the ground. Myself, I just want that tree gone and something else growing in its place, but do understand why people do it. Have a great day.
Hopefully we get to see some drone footage of the area once it's all done.. before and after would be pretty cool to see.
always enjoy your vids
Something to consider. Using the chain brake anytime your out of the cut could save a costly mistake. I just recently was recommended this and have been trying to make it a habit. Becomes pretty natural to engage it with a push of the wrist when the cut is complete. Good job out there and stay safe. Enjoy the all the uploads!
I don't think that this can be stressed enough. Especially on that rugged and uneven terrain. Only one slip away from a bad accident.
Always somebody running there mouth about how much they know. This isn't a saw vid.
@@Owl4909 lol how is that running his mouth, he just gave a pointer on chainsaw safety and im sure Bill would appreciate that. chillax man
@zacharykurtz2149 I'm guessing Bill knows how a brake works on his saw , if the chain stops as it should leave the brake out of gear. Duhhhh
@@Owl4909Thank God there are experts like you to protect us peasants from ourselves.
Making steady progress in that section guys!!
Yes, we will be done in about two weeks - my current estimate.
@@bill-winke awesome stuff, excited to see! Any other cutting on the docket for this Feb/March?
Hinge cuts are also real useful if you want to create a travel corridor or path way for the deer to use. Path of least resistance
Path of least resistance? A tree standing straight up is easier to navigate than one that’s laying over.
I just got done doing some habitat improvement on my property with my chainsaw. Im sure mine went faster though, i run an Echo saw. Haha. I hope that kid understands how blessed he is to learn from someone like you. He stands to learn alot! Thanks for the video
MollyDogg, I just bought an Echo a couple days ago and it is a bit smaller than the Stihl Farm Boss saws we are running, but compared to the Stihls, that Echo is several steps down the ladder. I tell you what, Carsen can cut some trees down! He has gotten really good at it. We have about two more weeks left and by then I would bet he can drop a tree exactly where he wants it under a very wide range of conditions - and fast.
2 days of this and it’ll beat any gym workout
Oh man, I have never been stiffer than this other than maybe the start of two-a-days in high school football.
Bill, thank you for the content. Would you be willing to make a short clip showing how to quickly identify the different tree species?
Or do you have one you posted in the prior years.
Thank you.
Dalton, I don't have one posted. I am good on all the medium sized trees, but it can be tough for me on the saplings before they really start to display their bark patterns. I try to avoid cutting a lot of those unless I am sure as some of the small ones we cut have been little oaks. There are apps that you can get that allow you to take a photo of the bark and the app will tell you what the tree is. That is probably the very best starting point for you. Good luck.
Man id love to come help you guys. I thoroughly love doing that kind of work. Noce job guys
Carson needs a sharper chain lol he wore me out just watching
Do you always kill the stump? Why not let it stump sprout? Last year was my first year doing a large habitat project on my hunting area. The stump sprouts the deer like the best never made it over 2 feet tall. Elm was their favorite by far. I’m killing the stumps they didn’t touch this year. More work but now that I know I’ll only leave the desirable ones this year.
Chris, your plan is a good one. I actually did an episode on this topic, in general terms. Here is the link: czcams.com/video/Uw_0N3l9mEs/video.html We have been cutting a bunch of elm too and I have not been killing those stumps. Some of the others will resprout too, and like you, I plan to come back later and quickly walk this with a clearing saw and squirt bottle of Garlon to kill off the stuff that the deer aren't eating. Good input. Have a great day.
Hinge cutting is for winter Browse to help deer survive winter conditions. It provides more food for the deer, especially Maple.
Some hinge cut trees are recut over 30 years.
You usually leave more wood and break it over making it more likely to survive.
If the tree is cut off at ground level three top should be good that year. By the following year the stump sprout can be browsed if it was killed. I made a mess hinge cutting last year. Too many in one place. I did see the results you’re talking about but the ones I cut and let sprout back are getting browsed. Either way works, I just get carried away hinging 😅
I’ve been cutting my firewood in the wintertime for years cutting green trees then cutting and splitting the wood to dry until fall and I can tell you from experience what you’re doing is still providing browse even though you cut the tree completely off cause when I cut a tree trunk up for firewood but leave the top there are deer tracks around those top piles and browsing on them truthfully sometimes they seem to go for that more than my corn feeders
Agree. They are eating the twigs and buds right now. Have a great day.
I noticed a lot this winter about deer bedding. They like to bed by threes that are all the way on the ground, laying parallel with the hill.
Interesting input. I appreciate it and hope you have a great day.
Off topic, but do you like those Oregon helmets? Sorry for leading the comments a stay but i was considering buying one of those, but dont know anyone whos tried them out.
Yes. I like them. Not sure if they are better than some other brands but I "looged" a lot of hours in them and would buy one again.
I use a 8' push pole to cut down trees. With that and a wedge, I can drop them much easier putting them in the direction I want unless they are really leaning.
Thanks again for the content. Its great to see this in real time. Your chainsaw work is a little scary. Be careful. Use the brake when your walking around and watch the material on the ground around your feet.
Hi Bill, what do you think about cutting in lowland (swampy) where the trees aren't that big say less then 6' in diameter, will I get regeneration? I was thinking of trying to manipulate the trails for better stand locations. It's going to be a bit of a challenge to find the trails. Thanks for sharing.
What brand is your chainsaw helmet?
Those are Oregon brand.
How do you like that brand? I know the question is off topic but I was considering that brand.
HI Bill and Jordon, any insights into why you are choosing to cut with chainsaw to bring the trees down versus hack and squirt the unwanted timber? Is it what is required by the NRCS or your cost-sharing source?
No, Harry, it is just my personal preference. I talk about that in more detail in my most recent video. I understand the upside of hack and squirt, but dropping the trees has an upside too and that is what I have done since 1995. I want them on the ground for a a few reasons. If interested, please check out this video: czcams.com/video/CXcv-n_wKR8/video.html
Hey Bill, what are your thoughts as to hinge cutting a tree to get that “taller” cover, and then ALSO TREATING the hinge stump to kill the new growth?
Killing two birds with one stone!
That was a good hinge cut, it’s a trade off for food and cover, you open up behind it for regen plus you provide side cover and food from the top of the tree which holds the most nutrients for the deer. It’s not a one and only habitat method, but part of the whole. Imho.
Hinge cuts only work if they get enough sunlight, so in a stand of bigger trees it won’t work unless you drop the bigger trees first and allow a good amount of sunlight in, much like any food plot needs. For me it’s a natural food plot area for deer.
Agree. We focus on finding spots where we can cut a lot of trees and then move on to the next area like that. It makes very little difference to cut a tree here and a tree there because not enough sunlight makes it to the ground. That is how we have been approaching it. When we find a patch of "junk" trees, we cut it really hard to make the biggest opening we can.
What do you do about leaf litter? Should you burn it or blow it off. Can’t imagine removing a tree does anything when there is a solid blanket of leaves covering the ground
Water is now available for sprouts. Deciduous leaves will decompose get pushed through by sprouts. Some tree species will root sucker. Now if you have 50 years of thick mat of evergreen needles, you made a great point!
Obviously you don’t, but do you think that flush cutting trees creates too much of a mess on the ground to impact 1) deer travel 2) property value?
I've been on park land near a trail & they like to cut that way. It was ridiculous on how many they barbor-poled. They certainly weren't foresters or arborists in any sense of the word. But at least they didn't try it on some of the larger growth timber.😮
It sure does make a mess. Have a great day Joseph.
Whats the reason for cutting the cedars? Deer love them. Ive found so many sheds under cedar trees
I touched it last year in this video: czcams.com/video/KvxVAfFBWx8/video.html Some cedars are fine, but they can take over the hardwoods if you don't control them. We are leaving pockets of cedars as we go. Also, when they are mature like these on this farm, nothing really uses the area underneath except coyotes. The deer like openings in patches of younger cedar - not this dense mature cedar. I will dedicate another episode to this subject.
Don’t think these are comments that bill had mentioned in the video lol
Hack and squirt hardwoods and cut cedars would seem a lot more efficient? Fire in the future. Fan for years.🦌👍🏻🦌
Fire for sure. I just uploaded another episode about why I don't Hack & Squirt.
Do u make trails so no dead ends
What’s your thoughts on the hack and squirt method?
That is in the next episode. Please check that out tomorrow.
As long as the cambium layer doesn’t snap or crack the tree will survive. The goal is ground food browse and side cover.
Makes sense. Thanks.
Curious where you got that helmet. Looks better than the orange one I use. Can you post a link ? Safety first.
Amazon or tractor supply have them on line Nic. Hope your post season projects are going well!!
Are you hauling off the cut trees?
Nope. There are literally thousands of them by the time we are done. They are not very big, in most cases, and only useful for firewood or maybe some craft woodworking. Too much work to get them out.
What are squirting on the stumps to kill them?
Garlon 3 mixed 1:1 with water.
Not a fan of hinge cutting either. Found the storms we have blow enough down for them to feed on tops. We have plenty of natural bedding already. Property next to us was logged pretty hard 150 acres worth. Luckily aloud to hunt it besides the landowner. Been focusing on fruit and oak trees we have. Been thinning around the white oaks that are crowed from spruce. Plus few small woods plots of clover and oats/ winter rye in fall. Seems to be going well. Got my first mature buck this fall in the first week on our family land this year. Hard work pays off
Nice antler I would of been looking for the other side after that 😂
Are you going to leave the trees lay?
He's leaving them I'm almost certain. Will breakndown over time being in contact with ground
Leaving walnuts for timber harvest value?
Correct They are very high dollar trees when they get age and size.
You should be spraying stumps with Tordon so the roots do not re-sprout
We have been using Garlon 3, but sometimes letting the stump respout is not a bad thing as the deer will eat that new growth every year.
will u be removing all the wood u cut down?
No, that would take literally years of daily work. This is a big project - lots of trees.
Please guys be careful remove the debris away from your feet for an escape route in case the tree does something out of the norm deer hunting fun but if you don't come home to your loved ones what good is it thank you for your content
I'm pretty sure Bill was born before men started turning into wimps. Lol com in man
What happened to code of silence as a sponsor?
Not on Dream Farm series. Only on the Bowhunting series. Thanks for the support.
TSI is TSI. The foundation is improving the stand for marketable timber, at least as I understand the purpose of TSI. Hinge cutting runs counter to TSI in many respects. Even if you hinge cut a lot and get sunshine to the forest floor, you are hinge cutting preferred browse to create cover, canalize movement, and provide a food source. A hinge cut without clearing enough trees for the sun to reach the floor is sub-optimal to say the least. At least that's my understanding. Hoping to do some significant hinge cutting on my 7 acre homestead in an effort to draw deer bedding closer.
Yes! TIMBER stand improvement for marketable forest products. TSI is one of the most misused terms on hunting channels (except this one).
I don't think there are government programs for hinge cutting.
@@alexpinnow6509 Just shows you don’t need the government in order to make things better! Lol
@@jrwstl02 I certainly don't disagree. A benefit of getting them in the mix is cost share though. Maybe doesn't make sense on 2 acres but when there are HUNDREDS of acres that can certainly help. Different ways to skin the cat; most people do hinge cut with way too much canopy above though from what I've seen..
Have you ever tried fertilizer around the drip line of oak trees to make them sweeter?
There was a study done on that and it's not true. Craig Harper has discussed it
@alexpinnow6509 there's some truth to it just maybe not in the area he tested soil type.
I have never tried it. I have heard of people doing it, but I am not sure if you can make the deer come to one specific oak tree when literally thousands of them are dropping acorns.
Hinge cutting provides side cover,and woody browse. I’m a big fan with proven results.
Agree. Proven results here as well. Well planned hinge cutting is a top management practice! Indiscriminate hinge cut areas can be a long term detriment. In this video Bill is talking TSI, which I agree would not include hinge cuts. Bill demonstrates how that can be applied toward improving the value of the timber stand for wildlife, particularly deer.
husqvarna is better.
Echo
HydroAX 😂
Alot of waisted cash and resources just to kill a few sets of big horns. Waisted natural resources gor no real reason other than bragging tight of a big set of antlers. That red cedar has real value and yes even those little one's. So much waisted labor and time across the country for no real reason. Oak trees have little value to anything acorns or a short lived benefit on a good year. I am not a keypad worror i make a living doing land restoration. To do just for deer is of no value to the system unless burned you fidnt change makeup of Forest you have to get leaf litter of for sun to soil contact. Leafs make about the best natural mulch to stop the growth of understory plants
Oak has little value? ......think it's very different than where I am. Oak was used almost exclusively in timber frame building as it has some great qualities for that
@@tbishop6726 as a log delivered to a mill or for acorns ya has very little value now leaving the saw mill that different. 50 cents a bf to red cedars 1.00 bf. In every state oak is worth more for firewood than delivered to a sawmill. A 5 foot cedar pole 2 inches on small end brings 3.00 and 8 foot 4 inch pole will easy bring 8.00. I have had people in Ohio pay trucking from okla just to get because few there will cut. I make a living logging and won't take a major pay cut to cut oak for more than firewood
@@Andrew-sanders it's different here... quality logs of oak is worth more than firewood. Only way it's close to timber value is if you are selling in tiny bundles to the cidiots nearby camping areas
@@tbishop6726 at 100 for a face cord oak would have to bring 1.00 bf at landing to be equal in price ya those little bundles bring top dollor at 7.00 a bundle would be 300 a face cord. I have a the country wide market report on timber setting here for last week and nowhere did oak red or white brings that
@Andrew-sanders Big antlers are worth a lot to some of us. Just to see a 5 yr old or older buck is more valuable to me than a bit of timber or a hand full of cash.