The ambient sound that BMTH did kinda sounds like Team Sleep or Crosses. 2 of my favorite bands, and now I'm gonna check BMTHs stuff like that. I learned something today, and didn't get mad at the video, yet anyway, I haven't finished it. Im joking. I've been upset with a few of your videos, but I went back and deleted any mean comments, because I realized I was being childish. So if I've ever offended you or anyone else that watches the channel, I'm genuinely sorry.
I was gonna ask you where you would put LOG, but you've already answered that. They're definitely my favorite Metal band, and I think it's cool that Randy was inspired by Punk. I've heard Metal elitist say they didn't like Randy because of this.
I'll tell you another band that they lumped into the Nu-Metal genre, but I think they're more MetalCore, and they're are underrated, and that band is Kittie. I'm 37 and I was listening to a lot of bands during the late 90s and early 2000s while I was skating, and when I heard Kittie, I was like damn they are hard. They were pretty young too when they made their first album.
The Anthrax aesthetic helped a lot of thrash kids feel comfortable not wearing the “back then” thrash uniform that was comprised of leather and denim. Going from tight ass jeans to board shorts was liberating…………literally, 😂.
I love what you said about PD because I was the EXACT same way. I felt like they were just Australia's answer to AILD until a friend sat me down and showed me their DVD. It completely changed how I felt about not only their music, but also the DIY spirit. You'd always hear other bands talking the DIY lifestyle, but have you ever flown to another continent with no shows booked with just your gear and some clothes? Balls, man.
@@chineseox2954 oh man, if you seen his other vids you'll understand his taste in music. Personally, I don't think he has very good taste in music but I enjoy his vids anyway.
@@johnathanpratt944 my personal fav is SFSGSW and TWNAH. Maybe he doesn't like Dave and his singing; which Dave's voice is the 'acquired taste' part of Megadeth. If it's a political thing, well, sometimes you gotta separate the art from the artist. lol
Fun Fact: Adam D from Killswitch was the guy who first invited Parkway Drive on a world tour, and getting them the exposure that helped bring Parkway Drive up. Also, both bands are absolute gems of human beings. It's hard to be in the same room and not feel good about the world. And both names are contradictions, and that's funny. Parkway cancelled their last tour over the pandemic, but they say they're using the time off to write their next album, and I can't wait for the new stuff, and to see them out here again!
Mhmm and that's how epitaph reached out to them when they were touring the states at taste of chaos, etc I believe. Which is awesome I just love how this laid back band from Aussie has this household name status in today's metal.
Waking the Fallen is definitely Metalcore. It’s a bit more accessible than Sounding the Seventh Trumpet. But the stylistic change didn’t happen until City of Evil. That’s where all the screaming disappeared aside from the wordless intros and transitions, and where the riffs changed.
City of Evil is their best record. I'm so glad they switched. Not a single band sounds like that one. Then I love The Stage. But I prefer their proggier stuff.
@@beyondtheradio I mean, WTF is my favorite, but STST and CoE come close seconds. I'm glad they made CoE, but I wish they could just go back into the ways the used to think. Half of Hail to the King was cool too, I guess.
I agree that avenged sevenfold ain’t metalcore, but their second album “waking the fallen” is straight up metalcore Hell it was my gateway into metalcore and the first time I heard songs with a lot of unclean vocals
They were a melodic heavy metal band at first and then became, metalcore and then became a heavy metal and then back to melodic heavy metal again couldn't really picture them as metalcore👊//.
Agreed. A7X has made Metalcore. But since City of Evil they had essentially been just heavy metal while throwing in different styles of metal into their sound, most recently getting into a prog metal sound.
I feel personally attacked every time he goofs on the scenecore era bands like Prada and Attack Attack. Lol. Also shoutout to A7X’s Waking the Fallen. It’s probably the gateway record for me getting into scream vocals and heavier stuff. Love these vids, Finn. Keep it up.
I want to agree but i've always felt like he's clowning on them in good fun. I clown on them and still listen to old Asking, Prada, From First to Last, etc almost daily. Also same, Waking the Fallen was the album that made me go from liking a handful of songs with harsh vocals to almost exclusively listening to Metalcore / Post-Hardcore + Death sub-genres.
I feel like it's pretty hard to look beyond Avenged, Trivium, Killswitch and As I Lay Dying. Two essentially set the tone for metalcore in the 2000s and became the grandfather's of what the genre would sound like post 2010. The other two morphed into huge bands with legitimate mainstream appeal and grew the genre far beyond its original parameters. It was a huge time for metal so there is obviously going to be a lot of other bands that can claim to have equal influence but that's definitely my take. It felt like those four were so, so big.
@@Spitatra absolutely the same for me. I first heard turn the other way and was so utterly obsessed with the final riff that I looked past the screaming and just listened to it over and over again. Eventually I came to really appreciate what the screaming brought to the table and the rest is history!
@@Grimeyhoob same could have been said of Slayer and Metallica in the 2000s though. I always though the big four was about influence rather than their body of work. A bit like how you'd say Genesis were a seminal prog rock band despite basically being a pop band for decades
@@IFinishedAVideoGame Metallica and Slayer metalcore? On what planet? They tried to do Nu metal - but nu metal is different from metalcore. Name me one Metallica or Slayer record that is metalcore please.
I was a highschooler when A7X, Atreyu, and 18V were starting out and playing small shows. It was awesome. These bands, including OG Jesse Leach KSE, are the saints of metalcore.
Horizons by Parkway was one of the albums that really got me hooked into metalcore and, in my opinion, it still holds up as one of the best metalcore albums of all time.
Agreed but they are more of a soft thrash band with a bit of screaming these days. If you re-listen to their first two albums, the difference is very apparent
Hey Finn I’d love to see an Amity Affliction “how did they get so big.” I reckon it’d be quite an interesting episode take considering their background and where they’ve gone with their music and how the band members each are
15 years ago, these bands were the ones that got me into the genre.. so I can just fully agree with you on everything! For once 😂. The quality of your videos is always so good, you're literaly writing full thesis on all these topics (even when it's rap or other stuff) that's so interesting. Thanks for that!
As an older hardcore kid, my Metallica of metalcore is Unearth... from early demos to The Oncoming storm topping it off. Followed by Poison the Well and Embrace the End.
I would have loved to see Atreyu get some love in this video. Their talent and influence in metal-core is always overlooked. They have been releasing top notch albums for 20 years and have almost 2 million spottily followers. I would consider them more influential as Architects but maybe not quite as relevant in 2021.
Parkway Drive was the band that got me into metalcore. Their image was a big factor for me because they seem like super chill dudes that you’d wanna hang out with. Also i feel their early stuff was heavier than a lot of their peers’ given the fact they didnt have any clean singing like most other metalcore bands of that era
@@nathanglennie actually nah man. Parkway drive toured with all the big bands of metalcore. What jo says holds true, they were heavier and just a hair enough different that it really wasn't till the deathcore days that parkway seemed more accessible by default.
Even though your exclusion of August Burns Red for being “late” to the scene is silly considering you included Architects who started out a year earlier, I still completely agree with your Big Four. Even though they have their controversial front man, As I Lay Dying were definitely more influential than people give them credit for. And though I’m not necessarily a huge Parkway Drive fan, they are definitely an underrated band in the metalcore scene
He mentions ABR were ''late to the party'' in 2005 but PD got into it around 2006-2007 lol...don't get me wrong, I love both, but feel like the year thing is far-fetched.
@@windex23 Both ABR and PD started in 2003. It blows my mind that he disqualified ABR for "starting" in 2005 when PD also had a similar trajectory. And ABR had the same type of different aesthetic going on for them too. JB is still known for his sandals on stage.
fan of the channel but dude i think ur dead wrong saying Megadeth sucks, Dave Mustaine is without a doubt the most influential guitar player in thrash. let's not forget he was the guitar player when Metallica released Kill Em' All. And to say Rust in Peace is anything but a masterpiece is just a lie. Otherwise love the content
That's a fair point. I think what the bands were known for is sort of the bigger point of comparison. Example: BMTH started off with more scene shit, then they evolved into a more mainstream type of shitty, but in my mind they'll always be a shitty scene band. And that's how we remember them.
That's a fair point but Metallica was already Metallica before the Black Album if you know what I mean, while BMTH and A7X became way bigger after dropping metalcore especially A7X.
Your picks are absolutely 100% spot on. I really appreciate you including as I lay dying. They are the band that got me into metalcore. I was obsessed with them as a teenager and were what truly made me a metalcore fan for life. The other band that got me into metalcore was Atreyu. That’s the only other band I may have included in your top 4 but im not sure who I would remove for them. August burns red could have been a solid choice as well.
Screaming was extremely unpopular in the early 2000s, and KSE was the perfect band for getting these old school metal people into more modern metal. They where on guitar hero and stuff, which was kind of mind blowing.
Not sure how true that is. I suppose you mean more hardcore-punk style screaming which influenced metalcore. In the 90s, extreme metal genres like black metal, death metal and melodeath were all at their peak. Even nu-metal had a lot of screaming; Slipknot's Iowa was almost entirely harsh vocals and went straight to number one on the charts (UK) when it released.
Killswitch Engage also was key to helping turn metalcore from its "hardcore punk with metal breakdowns" roots towards the "post-hardcore/screamo + thrash metal" formula that defined it in the 2000s. Bands like Atreyu, Underoath, Bullet for My Valentine, and August Burns Red definitely followed in that vein.
I’ve been on a trivium kick, they cover the bands I was into in the day- Iron Maiden and misfits, and their dual musicianship is second to none. They were guitar Mag darlings in the mid 2000s so I’ve paid attention to them forever. And they have a large music catalog for last 17 yrs or so.
Hey Finn! Can’t WAIT to see that parkway drive video you’re going to make in the near future. They’ve been my absolute favorite metalcore band (not that I don’t enjoy everyone else ALMOST as much) for YEARS!! Can’t wait to see an in-depth break down on them!! I’m holdin” u to it brother!😂🤣
It’s true that Anthrax don’t get enough respect. Among The Living is legit an S tier thrash album. It is up there with Reign in Blood, Master of Puppets, Rust in Peace, Peace Sells. It may not be the best of those albums, but it’s definitely in that league.
I know this is 100% true but i never has been able to really get into them and somehow I feel bad about it. Come on it's Anthrax!!! I think is the vacals, to clean, they lack the raw/roughness of the vocals I like in heavier music.
Anthrax not only did amazing albums. In My opinion is the most consistant band of the Big 4 Quality wise. Think about how Slayer just do Reign In Blood part X with every release (like AC/DC), how Metallica did St. Anger and Lulu and how Megadeth is so shaped by Mustaine's ego that even with such amazing and skilled players over the years like Chris Broderick and Kiko Loureiro still manage to screw every release of the last 15 years (at least)... Now think about Anthrax, the guys KNOW that music ultimately should be fun to listen, Thats why Even if their recent records like worship music or for all kings are not as legendary as Among The Living still are great enjoyable records. Now a days i respect Anthrax more for that.
I know "shorts" seems kinda goofy as a criteria for the Anthrax comparison, but Parkway Drive's straight up "surfer dude bro" vibe is 100% an iconic part of that band. Hell, they even shot a few videos based around that (Karma is a great example). So I totally agree on that.
My mates and i have had this discussion and landed on the same 4 bands in the end. I Killed The Prom Queen was another one for us, we're aussie so their name gets thrown around a lot as they basically put parkway on the map with their split ep/tour together, heaps keen to see this Parkway vid you alluded to Finn! Horizons is the consensus best metalcore album of all time down here in Australia, especially on the east coast
I grew up on PWD and IKTPQ and back in the day they were both equally as big as one another circa 2005. IKTPQ just could not find a permanent singer unfortunately, otherwise they could have been massive. I wish Crafter stayed (and behaved)
I'm with you all the way with this list! Like you said, UNEARTH is a really close contender for me, being that they played with a lot of hardcore bands during their early years (When I toursed with First Blood we did a bunch of shows with them and Hatebreed here in Europe). Awesome work always, Finn. So glad you are making these.
Met them, first Time playing The Showcase Theater in Corona CA.. I could believe that they had even heard of that play.. and were stoked on being able to play there.. Great Dude's
As a german metalcore enthusiast since the early 00s I feel compelled to throw in Heaven Shall Burn. I think they never got as famous internationally but they were and kinda still are huge here in Germany.
@@tuerkwurscht absolutely on your side. Heaven shall burn should be the Slayer of Metalcore. And they never stopped beeing the Slayer of Metalcore not like other Bands who became Rock/Emo/Whatever shit bands...
i always just assume it goes without saying nowadays that Tom Searle was, and still is, the heart and soul of the band, even in his passing. I mean the impact of his life & death still clearly radiate throughout even their newest songs. And I honestly think the other boys in Architects would readily admit that without any shame
@@KhaosKontroller holy hell has got barely anything from Tom on it so idk how that can be part of the discussion. Daybreaker to all our gods makes much more sense. If I'm honest, I truly feel anything past all our gods has been fairly derivative and it really shows how little the rest of the band was an influence on their sound. It was all tom and without him they've paled in comparison
He also didnt mention Jimmy with his part about A7x. Jimmy and Synyster really were the band, so... Suck it up... I mean I really listened the "Tom Trilogy" to death, but his passing has been some time now. Let it rest, let everyone move on. Stop mentioning it and let the dust settle.
The "shorts" thing sounds funny but it's a legit thing. I can't hardly describe it but there really used to be a thing about wearing shorts vs long pants. I don't think people care now or really remember but it was a whole thing.
I liked the side note you made about Avenged Sevenfold by saying they’re comparison is Guns N Roses. The more I think about it, the more truth I find in it haha
Super stoked to see Killswitch get the honor of being on the big four I remember playing this song on guitar hero in like 2008 and being blown away you could sing and scream in the same song, and from there I was hooked My Curse is a god damn banger TO THIS DAY
This is hands down your best video yet! Clear and accurate reasons and I think you got all four on the dot. Killswitch and as I lay dying definitely the Metallica and Megadeth. Can’t wait for your deep dive in to Parkway Drive!!
Man this is a rough list I’m having a hard time with this one Finn. This was my genre. I’d have As I Lay Dying, Killswitch Engage, Trivium and Atreyu as the top 4 most influential during the rise of metalcore. Not mentioning Atreyu is crazy. They’ve done some dad rock stuff but they still release the odd metalcore track
@@Fureth32 no definitely not. Screamo sounded like old school emo (because it literally developed at the same time in the same scene) but with screaming and that’s not what Atreyu sounded like. Atreyu sounded like the rest of the Orange County Metalcore scene
Personally I'd pick August Burns Red instead of Architects. Their loyalty, longevity, humility, love for their fans, etc. have made them so great. Not to mention they haven't had a lineup change since like 2006 or so.
For me the King of Metalcore is As i lay dying. They've never changed their sound but if you listen to their most recent albums they sound better than ever.
I agree with almost every point you made in the video, but I have a bone to pick with what you said about Parkway Drive and how they weren’t reinventing the wheel or pushing any boundaries. to boil down their earlier works to just “chug riffs and breakdowns” I think is a gross understatement. the riffs were catchy, challenging, and intricate with a lot of complex rhythms and super fast tempos. the instrumentation was tight and alternated seamlessly from groovy breakdowns, to blast beats, to fast punk beats and thrash shredding. and on top of that, Winston’s insane vocal tone and lyrical ability that was miles ahead of many other lyricists in the genre. I understand their chill surfer dude vibe was a huge part of their personality as a band, but to say they weren’t “pushing the boundaries of art” or that their music was generic in anyway is pretty false in my opinion. other than that, spot on analysis lol
I recently went back and listened to their whole catalogue, and while they had some super catchy and interesting riffs that made you wanna mosh your brains off and definitely stood out from what other bands were playing at the time, I have to say that technicality was not their main strength. For me it was always the tone and the ambiance they created that always pulled me back for more, especially with songs like Horizons, or the ending of Sleepwaker.
@@kimonkarapetsis8195 no disrespect, but I’m not even sure we’re listening to the same band. yes they’ve got some great mosh parts, but I can name like 10 different riffs off the top of my head (specifically from Killing With a Smile, Horizons, Deep Blue, and Atlas) that are far more technical than those of a good majority of their peers. and one of the only metalcore bands to incorporate guitar solos in most of their songs. as a guitar player myself, Parkway Drive songs tend to have a higher level of difficulty and a lot of the riffs are quite challenging to play. I’d say if anything, they toned it down with their last few albums as they’ve shifted more towards a hard rock and more traditional metal sound.
I agree bro. Parkway is very technical and the band in general is VERY tight. Winstons voice is also one of the best screams in the scene. Whats funny is that i was listening to Parkway for over a year before i knew they were surfer bros. The music was great and thats what started it for me.
I loved this video. I graduated in 2003, and in the next few years after there was just a plethora of music that I loved so much. I found Killswitch and Shadows Fall around the same time, then Unearth and as I lay dying, and it started a very long love affair with similar types of metal. Shout out to Trivuim. The Crusade and Shogun are albums I still go back to often and will probably listen to forever.
Man Shogun is an awesome album, I finally listened to new Trivim album and I think top to bottom they have a great music catalog and the musicianship is insane.
@@SixStringDave_90 Yeah I don't consider them metalcore band either but I am just wondering why Finn said Sounding The Seventh Trumpet is their only metalcore album, pretty much everyone agrees that Waking The Fallen is a metalcore album too
it is, but the band overall, no. i love them, but they're more heavy metal than metalcore, for metalcore i see Trivium, KSE, PWD and AILD beiing more important
Dude I've watched 3 vids on this big four series and you nailed it every time. Every band I was thinking of you listed exactly where I had them. You have some serious knowledge sir.
These video's really help show how trends and culture repeat with each generation. It's never exactly the same twice, but this this ties together some common threads. I like the perspective this gives and it teaches me something about what made the older generations of music cool too.
Hell yes to Killswitch! I don't listen to a ton of metalcore, but KSE are one of my favorite bands, not just in metal but overall. They transcend the genre much like Metallica transcends thrash.
100% agree with the analysis of PWD, I fell in love with their early stuff and after getting more into the metalcore scene and hearing some of the podcasts that PWD was in they are just super nice dudes. Got to see them live multiple times and even high fived Winston while crowdsurfing, just laid back and incredible nice group of guys who offstage put a lot of effort into conservation and other relief efforts. I started listening to them on their 1st full album back in 2005 in 5th grade and have loved everything since. Cant wait for live shows to go see them again, super energy and killer performance, hands down one of the best bands Ive seen live.
Oh yeah. I'd watch that. Except it's KoRn (Slayer?), Slipknot (Metallica, as much as I don't like thinking that), Limp Bizkit (MegaDeth) and probably Linkin Park (odd man out so Anthrax).
@@bigtakeshi RATM is definitely not Nu Metal. Don’t get me wrong, they’re great, but they’re not a part of the genre. Big 4 of Nu Metal are probably Slipknot, Korn, Limp Bizkit and Deftones.
INCREDIBLE VIDEO FINN !!! I’ve been a METALCORE fan for the past 20 years and I agree 100% with everything you said in this video. I think you perfectly summed up the BIG 4 of Metalcore. All 4 bands that you listed are 4 of my all time favourite bands and all deserve to be in this Top 4. As a fan of “The Big 4” thrash bands I thought your comparisons to the “Big 4 metal core bands made perfect sense. This was my favourite video that you’ve done FINN . Please do a video JUST on Killswitch Engage. Their influence on bands and their music legacy is something that I think deserves a single video. Especially their story of losing their frontman and getting bigger after each record. Plus Adam D their guitarist is one of the funniest people I’ve ever seen live. Thanks FINN 👍🏻
Killswitch, Shadows Fall, All That Remains, As I Lay Dying were the head of the pack. Parkway Drive and Architects didn't emerge until later. You could go with Between the Buried and Me as a contender here. I know Lamb of God is straight up metal band, but they were as much a part of that scene as any other band at the time. Even after they started to blow up, I saw LoG play a show at a small reception hall with All Else Failed as co-headliners. Every other band on that bill was a hardcore or metal core band. LoG embraced that community and style of promotion more than most hardcore bands of the scene.
I thought they should have gotten some love here, but they were in my opinion the biggest of the early sound. And my favorite. I tattooed "live love burn die" on myself lol but I think they really only influenced the huge wave that came right after them.
I found ABR in 2009 just after Constellations dropped (shout out to the Meddler music video), and they immediately became my favorite band. To your point of them having a surprising ability to just keep growing, I am surprised that every time I see them, the crowd is bigger and more diverse.
i cant believe i guessed you'd say architects for slayer. the moment you said about how without knowing it every metal band has taken from slayer i thought that sounds exactly like architects for metalcore. really good choice
Parkway drive still and is one of my favorite bands, along with Killswitch… that was my high school and college soundtrack.. those two bands. So thank you for paying respect to them and looking forward to seeing the Parkway Drive Video in the future
"Catchy singing chorus": any Killswitch Engage song. They appeal like anyone since their music is just amazing, especially during the Howard Jones for that era and Jesse’s comeback run.
I saw Killswitch Engage’s video for “Rose of Sharon” in 2004 on MTV 2. That’s what got me into it back when it was more difficult to discover new music outside of the radio and that 2001-2005 alt rock phase.
I’m glad BFMV got some decent consideration. They’re my favorite band. Gravity was definitely not what I wanted from them but all three singles from their upcoming album are awesome.
I'm surprised how accurate some of these guesses are. I remembered when I was a kid and listened to Bullet for My Valentine for the first time on the Need For Speed Most Wanted game! It was absolutely my first step into Metal-core (just as Finn said), but when I listen As I Lay Dying for the first time it blew my mind. They where so good and so heavy! Even if I don't listen them anymore (stopped after all the Tim's shit) I can't deny they where very influential at my first years as a musician. Love this video Finn, nail it as allways!
Sometimes I go back to these videos and the spare bedroom chat makes me laugh every single time 😂. I love this channel, I found it and instantly love the geekyness of 'my' genre
I don't necessarily disagree with your picks, I think they're pretty good if we want to try and fit the exact template of the original Big 4. But I think if we made a Big 4 - as in the 4 biggest, most influential metalcore bands - it would be KsE, Trivium, As I Lay Dying and Bullet for my Valentine, regardless of them not fitting into the same tropes as the original Big 4
Real shit tho, Killswitch, Trivium, All that remains and Bullet were my big four. They were always the first four artist who's music I'd download off limewire/frost wire to put on whatever mp3 I had at the time.
My prediction (in no particular order): Killswitch Engage, August Burns Red, As I Lay Dying (even if Tim sucks they were still huge), and Devil Wears Prada Edit: replace TDWP with Underøath 2nd Edit: if you’re directly matching members of the big 4 to Metalcore bands than I agree with your assessment except killswitch. I’d put either BMTH or A7X in their place because Metallica kind of stopped playing thrash after And Justice For All and both BMTH and A7X stopped playing Metalcore after Sempiternal and Waking the Fallen, respectively, then hit massive success just like Metallica. If we’re going with most popular Metalcore bands that stayed mostly Metalcore then I’m sticking with Killswitch, AILD, ABR and Underøath.
I absolutely loved this list and cannot agree more with your choices. The only thing that kinda bothered me is that you didn't mentioned Asking Alexandria. Say what you want about the band or their members, but, at least here in Brazil, they were the hughiest thing. Like... REALLY bigger than the other ones. I'm not saying you should qualify them as one of the Big 4, cause i don't think that is the case, but you had to mention them imo. "The Final Episode" was fucking everywhere when i was 17 years old. They were more influential than any other Metalcore/screamo bands back in the day. Again... maybe i have this impression cause i'm south american and i know they have a huge fan base here (just check out any of their videos and you will see that like, 50% of the comments are in spanish or brazilian portuguese) but anyways... great content as always, Finn!
Ehhh at least they were on the map pretty heavily. I didn't hear of Architects until maybe 5 years ago now and somehow they made it in the top 4 of influential bands for that era? That's the one that escapes me.
@@user-fj6kk1vo8n If he were talking about metalcore in general, Architects would definitely have a fair claim to the spot of the big 4 seeing how they basically created an entire new wave on their own. However, seeing as he seems to be talking about the 2000s metalcore era, I definitely wouldn't put them there. If anything, Unearth would be a solid pick for me. While not as relatively well known as slayer, they created much of the sound bands like PWD, ABR and even The Ghost Inside would later on utilise in their music. They were quite ahead of their time.
"Megadeth also sucks" My ass. They only wrote one of the best and most beloved albums in thrash metal history, that being Rust In Peace. They're also absolutely amazing live. Dave Mustaine also wrote a few of Metallica's best early songs as well. So right, Megadeth sucks.
Damn I had KSE, AILD, ABR, and PWD as my guesses beforehand. 3/4 is pretty good though, and although I prefer ABR, Architects is definitely a pick I'm happy with.
Glad to see my favorite metal band of the modern era : Parkway Drive! Can't wait to see a video on them from you! I realize you're a busy busy dude so I'll try to be patient on it lol
From your perspective of a "equal" big 4, for me would be: KsE, AILD, CALIBAN and Parkway Drive. KsE, AILD and Parkway Drive were all solid picks, amazing list dude, would be perfect if the pick for most "ripped of"/influencial band was Caliban instead of Architects, you would be surprise with how much every metalcore band ripped of Caliban in any generation (they were one of the pioneers and from KsE/AILD until Architects/The Devil Wears Prada/Breakdown of Sanity they all took something from them). But again amazing list, great video! Ps: KsE is the goat from metalcore
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The ambient sound that BMTH did kinda sounds like Team Sleep or Crosses. 2 of my favorite bands, and now I'm gonna check BMTHs stuff like that. I learned something today, and didn't get mad at the video, yet anyway, I haven't finished it. Im joking. I've been upset with a few of your videos, but I went back and deleted any mean comments, because I realized I was being childish. So if I've ever offended you or anyone else that watches the channel, I'm genuinely sorry.
I was gonna ask you where you would put LOG, but you've already answered that. They're definitely my favorite Metal band, and I think it's cool that Randy was inspired by Punk. I've heard Metal elitist say they didn't like Randy because of this.
I'll tell you another band that they lumped into the Nu-Metal genre, but I think they're more MetalCore, and they're are underrated, and that band is Kittie. I'm 37 and I was listening to a lot of bands during the late 90s and early 2000s while I was skating, and when I heard Kittie, I was like damn they are hard. They were pretty young too when they made their first album.
You may wanna talk about who are “the big 4” from other metal subgenres, like death, melodeath, black, nu metal, and others.
Finn “I am filming this from the spare bedroom at my mother in law’s house” McKenty
🤣
🤣🤣
I thought this was a joke until he literally said it lmao
Finn “I can dish it, but can’t take it” McKenty
What if he’s just moved in with his mother-in-law & he’s in denial about it? 😂
I liked watching this
Btw What would be biggest 4 metalcore bands to you?
Yall should collab
@@codybuckland1379 Finn had Nik on his podcast
Me too! 🤘🏼🔥
Nick, you will never be Finn...curl and weep. I love you btw. 😚
Waking The Fallen is literally one of the best Metalcore albums
Facts I know every song easy as pie
Yessir! Also Ascendancy!
i was genuinely confused when he said sounding the seventh trumpet was their only metalcore album
Literally my exact reaction
@@grimg0r Same! For a moment I got really confused because Waking the fallen is my favourite metalcore album
Waking The Fallen was metalcore!
Yeah for sure... I was thinking that as well. First 2 albums were deffo's metalcore
Truth. And Avenged Sevenfold's best album in my opinion.
Chapter four second heartbeat eternal rest
One of their best albums too
@feargm There are definitely different elements in the album, but metalcore is a big one, imo.
The Anthrax aesthetic helped a lot of thrash kids feel comfortable not wearing the “back then” thrash uniform that was comprised of leather and denim. Going from tight ass jeans to board shorts was liberating…………literally, 😂.
Tank tops and shorts are the Best stage clothes
Scott Ian has a funny story about Lemmy and short shorts/board shorts.
I love what you said about PD because I was the EXACT same way. I felt like they were just Australia's answer to AILD until a friend sat me down and showed me their DVD. It completely changed how I felt about not only their music, but also the DIY spirit. You'd always hear other bands talking the DIY lifestyle, but have you ever flown to another continent with no shows booked with just your gear and some clothes? Balls, man.
Finns hatred of Megadeth always makes me sad but he’s entitled to his opinion. Plus he nails these comparisons every time
When he said Megadeth sucks it kinda hurt my feelings lmao but hey I gotta remind myself they are an acquired taste..
Holy Wars... The Punishment Due ain't an acquired taste, that was straight fire the first time I heard it
A statement like that makes me judge his taste, to be honest.
@@chineseox2954 oh man, if you seen his other vids you'll understand his taste in music. Personally, I don't think he has very good taste in music but I enjoy his vids anyway.
@@johnathanpratt944 my personal fav is SFSGSW and TWNAH. Maybe he doesn't like Dave and his singing; which Dave's voice is the 'acquired taste' part of Megadeth. If it's a political thing, well, sometimes you gotta separate the art from the artist. lol
Fun Fact: Adam D from Killswitch was the guy who first invited Parkway Drive on a world tour, and getting them the exposure that helped bring Parkway Drive up. Also, both bands are absolute gems of human beings. It's hard to be in the same room and not feel good about the world. And both names are contradictions, and that's funny. Parkway cancelled their last tour over the pandemic, but they say they're using the time off to write their next album, and I can't wait for the new stuff, and to see them out here again!
Mhmm and that's how epitaph reached out to them when they were touring the states at taste of chaos, etc I believe. Which is awesome I just love how this laid back band from Aussie has this household name status in today's metal.
OMG the fact of their names! I never noticed
Fun Fact: Adam also produced Killing With A Smile and Horizons!
@@bertdebackercovers indeed
If you like the older vibe, then please check out my band Widow Anchor. We have 3 singles out now! We've been compared to AILD, ATR, KSE and Trivium.
Waking the Fallen is definitely Metalcore. It’s a bit more accessible than Sounding the Seventh Trumpet. But the stylistic change didn’t happen until City of Evil. That’s where all the screaming disappeared aside from the wordless intros and transitions, and where the riffs changed.
'Unholy Confessions' was one of the biggest metalcore anthems in the myspace days.
City of Evil is their best record. I'm so glad they switched. Not a single band sounds like that one. Then I love The Stage. But I prefer their proggier stuff.
@@beyondtheradio I mean, WTF is my favorite, but STST and CoE come close seconds. I'm glad they made CoE, but I wish they could just go back into the ways the used to think. Half of Hail to the King was cool too, I guess.
I was thinking that too
Agreed thank you
I agree that avenged sevenfold ain’t metalcore, but their second album “waking the fallen” is straight up metalcore
Hell it was my gateway into metalcore and the first time I heard songs with a lot of unclean vocals
literally one of the all time best metalcore albums
Similarly, metallic’s more recent albums are hard to consider thrash but their old albums definitely were
They were a melodic heavy metal band at first and then became, metalcore and then became a heavy metal and then back to melodic heavy metal again couldn't really picture them as metalcore👊//.
City Of Evil is their Master Of Puppets
Agreed. A7X has made Metalcore. But since City of Evil they had essentially been just heavy metal while throwing in different styles of metal into their sound, most recently getting into a prog metal sound.
I was the same, I liked Parkway, but after watching their docs, my love for them was instantly amplified.
I feel personally attacked every time he goofs on the scenecore era bands like Prada and Attack Attack. Lol. Also shoutout to A7X’s Waking the Fallen. It’s probably the gateway record for me getting into scream vocals and heavier stuff. Love these vids, Finn. Keep it up.
I want to agree but i've always felt like he's clowning on them in good fun. I clown on them and still listen to old Asking, Prada, From First to Last, etc almost daily.
Also same, Waking the Fallen was the album that made me go from liking a handful of songs with harsh vocals to almost exclusively listening to Metalcore / Post-Hardcore + Death sub-genres.
Im actually shocked ATreyu wasnt mentioned at all they were at the forefront of metalcore when it exploded
Same also bleeding through it’s the legit only band the metal dudes actually accepted
wow I totally forgot about them but you're right. they must have kneecapped their own career
@@bird2049 ya bleeding through was another one, Metal guy a knew back in highschool hated metalcore but actually liked them
LIVE LOVE BURN DIE, haven't thought about them in years!
Irrelevant after 2009 while the other bands weren't
I feel like it's pretty hard to look beyond Avenged, Trivium, Killswitch and As I Lay Dying.
Two essentially set the tone for metalcore in the 2000s and became the grandfather's of what the genre would sound like post 2010.
The other two morphed into huge bands with legitimate mainstream appeal and grew the genre far beyond its original parameters.
It was a huge time for metal so there is obviously going to be a lot of other bands that can claim to have equal influence but that's definitely my take. It felt like those four were so, so big.
Major props to Avenged Sevenfold for being the band that got me into music with screaming.
@@Spitatra absolutely the same for me. I first heard turn the other way and was so utterly obsessed with the final riff that I looked past the screaming and just listened to it over and over again. Eventually I came to really appreciate what the screaming brought to the table and the rest is history!
Trivium and A7X have long left the metalcore scene behind though in terms of their sound and aesthetics
@@Grimeyhoob same could have been said of Slayer and Metallica in the 2000s though. I always though the big four was about influence rather than their body of work.
A bit like how you'd say Genesis were a seminal prog rock band despite basically being a pop band for decades
@@IFinishedAVideoGame Metallica and Slayer metalcore? On what planet?
They tried to do Nu metal - but nu metal is different from metalcore. Name me one Metallica or Slayer record that is metalcore please.
Parkway Drive’s Atlas Album is the extremely underrated. Solid choice on the Anthrax of metalcore!
Love this album, what is your favorite song if you had to name one?
I was a highschooler when A7X, Atreyu, and 18V were starting out and playing small shows. It was awesome. These bands, including OG Jesse Leach KSE, are the saints of metalcore.
Horizons by Parkway was one of the albums that really got me hooked into metalcore and, in my opinion, it still holds up as one of the best metalcore albums of all time.
BFMV has definitely moved away from Butt Rock with their new singles. This new album is trending to be very heavy.
Knives fucking slaps
*"On the count of THREE"*
Knives, Shatter, and Parasite SLAP!
Agreed but they are more of a soft thrash band with a bit of screaming these days. If you re-listen to their first two albums, the difference is very apparent
Really? Interesting. Gotta give em a listen again.
Hey Finn I’d love to see an Amity Affliction “how did they get so big.” I reckon it’d be quite an interesting episode take considering their background and where they’ve gone with their music and how the band members each are
I am so glad you mentioned Parkway Drive
One of my all time faves 🙏🏻
Awesome video Finn
Killswitch getting the love. So happy.
As I Lay Dying made me laugh that they are the Megadeth.
The timing of this video is perfect. I’m actually seeing August Burns Red tonight
I hung out with them after a show we did in Houston like 10 years ago.
Chillest dudes ever.
Is it the tour with Erra? I had never really listened to them before and Erra blew my mind when I saw them last week with ABR. Enjoy!
It is! I’m hella stoked
Have a great show!
How was the show?
I love the amount of thought, work, analysis, and passion you put into these videos. Your effort is appreciated! Keep it up bro.
Thank you!
Well said
15 years ago, these bands were the ones that got me into the genre.. so I can just fully agree with you on everything! For once 😂. The quality of your videos is always so good, you're literaly writing full thesis on all these topics (even when it's rap or other stuff) that's so interesting. Thanks for that!
The first few albums of All That Remains oohhhhhhh yeah buddy that’s my jam
I think if ATR had stuck with that sound, they probably would be one of the Big 4 of Metalcore!
Their first albums were melodeath then melodic metalcore then melodic metal.
Fuck yeah, great music. Still Jam This Darkened Heart, The Fall of Ideals, and Overcome 🤘
“This Calling” is still one of my favorite songs of all time. The drumming on that record is just insane!!
Pre Phil ruled
As an older hardcore kid, my Metallica of metalcore is Unearth... from early demos to The Oncoming storm topping it off. Followed by Poison the Well and Embrace the End.
Finally!! Great Dude's also.. cheers from Southern California..
UNEARTH!!
I would have loved to see Atreyu get some love in this video. Their talent and influence in metal-core is always overlooked. They have been releasing top notch albums for 20 years and have almost 2 million spottily followers. I would consider them more influential as Architects but maybe not quite as relevant in 2021.
ЈЕЕЕС
Parkway Drive was the band that got me into metalcore. Their image was a big factor for me because they seem like super chill dudes that you’d wanna hang out with. Also i feel their early stuff was heavier than a lot of their peers’ given the fact they didnt have any clean singing like most other metalcore bands of that era
If parkway drive was american they’d be the biggest of all these bands
I agree 100 jo. They were considered heavier by most, and that's not a bad thing, it's just different.
@@nathanglennie actually nah man. Parkway drive toured with all the big bands of metalcore. What jo says holds true, they were heavier and just a hair enough different that it really wasn't till the deathcore days that parkway seemed more accessible by default.
killing with a smile had all them brutal breakdowns
I just started listening to parkway drive like 3 months ago. The song vice grip came on... What can I say, I'm a simple man
Even though your exclusion of August Burns Red for being “late” to the scene is silly considering you included Architects who started out a year earlier, I still completely agree with your Big Four. Even though they have their controversial front man, As I Lay Dying were definitely more influential than people give them credit for. And though I’m not necessarily a huge Parkway Drive fan, they are definitely an underrated band in the metalcore scene
Agree. I think august burns red is more influential than architects. And have been consistent with their sound while still growing.
@@georgedelgado2847 yep
He mentions ABR were ''late to the party'' in 2005 but PD got into it around 2006-2007 lol...don't get me wrong, I love both, but feel like the year thing is far-fetched.
@@windex23 Both ABR and PD started in 2003. It blows my mind that he disqualified ABR for "starting" in 2005 when PD also had a similar trajectory. And ABR had the same type of different aesthetic going on for them too. JB is still known for his sandals on stage.
This guy gets it. Totally agree.
PWD’s old material had some of the most brutal riffs and breakdowns. Them headlining at Wacken 2019 was legendary
Agreed
fan of the channel but dude i think ur dead wrong saying Megadeth sucks, Dave Mustaine is without a doubt the most influential guitar player in thrash. let's not forget he was the guitar player when Metallica released Kill Em' All. And to say Rust in Peace is anything but a masterpiece is just a lie. Otherwise love the content
Feels wrong to rule out bands because they don’t play Metalcore anymore. Does Metallica’s 90s era rule them out of being in the big 4 of thrash?
They still returned to thrash, and the largest part of their discography is thrash.
@@KhaosKontroller Bullet recently turned heavy again so there's that
@@DiAbLo577607 bfmv is my favorite band of all time. But even I consider them more metal than metalcore
That's a fair point. I think what the bands were known for is sort of the bigger point of comparison.
Example: BMTH started off with more scene shit, then they evolved into a more mainstream type of shitty, but in my mind they'll always be a shitty scene band. And that's how we remember them.
That's a fair point but Metallica was already Metallica before the Black Album if you know what I mean, while BMTH and A7X became way bigger after dropping metalcore especially A7X.
Personally Parkway Drive’s “Deep Blue” is one of the few albums that I think has zero skips.
true, I think it’s their last album with zero skips
@@underrottensky what you said
Except the production sucks balls.
Deep Blue is one of my all time favorite albums. Couldn't agree more.
and KWAS
My big four would be :
Metallica- Killswitch Engage
Megadeth-As I lay Dying
Slayer-Trivium
Anthrax-All that Remains
I csn totally agree with this list. Maybe replace ATR with BFMV. It could be a toss up. First couple albums were awesome then just bleh.
Your picks are absolutely 100% spot on. I really appreciate you including as I lay dying. They are the band that got me into metalcore. I was obsessed with them as a teenager and were what truly made me a metalcore fan for life. The other band that got me into metalcore was Atreyu. That’s the only other band I may have included in your top 4 but im not sure who I would remove for them. August burns red could have been a solid choice as well.
I'm a Y2K-er, so mine will always be Killswitch, Lamb of God, Shadows Fall and Unearth🤘🤘🗝️🗝️🗝️🗝️🗝️
Lamb of God definitely isn’t Metalcore. Randy Blythe never sings
@@jacobrichards967 overlord
THIS +100000
@@jacobrichards967 Unearth doesn't really sing either...
Wouldn't call Lamb of God metalcore. Just groove metal.
Screaming was extremely unpopular in the early 2000s, and KSE was the perfect band for getting these old school metal people into more modern metal. They where on guitar hero and stuff, which was kind of mind blowing.
Not sure how true that is. I suppose you mean more hardcore-punk style screaming which influenced metalcore. In the 90s, extreme metal genres like black metal, death metal and melodeath were all at their peak. Even nu-metal had a lot of screaming; Slipknot's Iowa was almost entirely harsh vocals and went straight to number one on the charts (UK) when it released.
Killswitch Engage also was key to helping turn metalcore from its "hardcore punk with metal breakdowns" roots towards the "post-hardcore/screamo + thrash metal" formula that defined it in the 2000s. Bands like Atreyu, Underoath, Bullet for My Valentine, and August Burns Red definitely followed in that vein.
Howard Jones is one of the best vocalists of all time
Idk about unpopular. I mean, I guess as unpopular as now, if you mean broader appeal. But plenty of nu-metal bands covered that base quite well.
KSE absolutely got me to appreciate screaming. Soilwork, Arch Enemy, and In Flames came soon after 🤘
I’ve been on a trivium kick, they cover the bands I was into in the day- Iron Maiden and misfits, and their dual musicianship is second to none. They were guitar Mag darlings in the mid 2000s so I’ve paid attention to them forever. And they have a large music catalog for last 17 yrs or so.
Just seen them on April 22nd.
Hey Finn! Can’t WAIT to see that parkway drive video you’re going to make in the near future. They’ve been my absolute favorite metalcore band (not that I don’t enjoy everyone else ALMOST as much) for YEARS!! Can’t wait to see an in-depth break down on them!! I’m holdin” u to it brother!😂🤣
It’s true that Anthrax don’t get enough respect. Among The Living is legit an S tier thrash album. It is up there with Reign in Blood, Master of Puppets, Rust in Peace, Peace Sells. It may not be the best of those albums, but it’s definitely in that league.
I know this is 100% true but i never has been able to really get into them and somehow I feel bad about it. Come on it's Anthrax!!! I think is the vacals, to clean, they lack the raw/roughness of the vocals I like in heavier music.
Among the Living is the best complete thrash album that isn't the first three Metallica records
Anthrax not only did amazing albums. In My opinion is the most consistant band of the Big 4 Quality wise. Think about how Slayer just do Reign In Blood part X with every release (like AC/DC), how Metallica did St. Anger and Lulu and how Megadeth is so shaped by Mustaine's ego that even with such amazing and skilled players over the years like Chris Broderick and Kiko Loureiro still manage to screw every release of the last 15 years (at least)... Now think about Anthrax, the guys KNOW that music ultimately should be fun to listen, Thats why Even if their recent records like worship music or for all kings are not as legendary as Among The Living still are great enjoyable records. Now a days i respect Anthrax more for that.
Not to mention they put on a great show!
I know "shorts" seems kinda goofy as a criteria for the Anthrax comparison, but Parkway Drive's straight up "surfer dude bro" vibe is 100% an iconic part of that band. Hell, they even shot a few videos based around that (Karma is a great example). So I totally agree on that.
How Finn described Avenged Sevenfold at the end as a juiced up prog version of Guns and Roses *chefs kiss* so good.
agreed, nail on the head
When you were picking the “Metallica” I was saying it had better be Killswitch. I cheered. You made my day!
KSE is the pioneers of Metalcore. Their influence is literally every band these days with mixing screaming and singing
My mates and i have had this discussion and landed on the same 4 bands in the end.
I Killed The Prom Queen was another one for us, we're aussie so their name gets thrown around a lot as they basically put parkway on the map with their split ep/tour together, heaps keen to see this Parkway vid you alluded to Finn! Horizons is the consensus best metalcore album of all time down here in Australia, especially on the east coast
IKTPQ!!! Adelaide represent 🤘🏻
Prom Queen!!!!
I grew up on PWD and IKTPQ and back in the day they were both equally as big as one another circa 2005. IKTPQ just could not find a permanent singer unfortunately, otherwise they could have been massive. I wish Crafter stayed (and behaved)
Also killing with a smile is the epitome of metalcore, not horizons...
Would be kinda hard to put in IKTPQ given they haven't released anything since 2014. Are they even together anymore?
I love how you have real logical reasoning behind your picks. The amount of logic you bring to discussing music is refreshing.
that's why he calls it MBA
Yes, this can be beneficial for those with autism
I'm with you all the way with this list! Like you said, UNEARTH is a really close contender for me, being that they played with a lot of hardcore bands during their early years (When I toursed with First Blood we did a bunch of shows with them and Hatebreed here in Europe). Awesome work always, Finn. So glad you are making these.
unearth is tufffff
Met them, first Time playing The Showcase Theater in Corona CA.. I could believe that they had even heard of that play.. and were stoked on being able to play there.. Great Dude's
As a german metalcore enthusiast since the early 00s I feel compelled to throw in Heaven Shall Burn. I think they never got as famous internationally but they were and kinda still are huge here in Germany.
He who says Heaven shall burn, has to (also) say caliban.
@@eqqaia3856 caliban fits as the "slayer" from the big 4 tbh
I have the same thoughts about Heaven Shall Burn.
Heaven Shall Burn should definitely be the Slayer of Metalcore. They did As I Lay Ding songs before As I Lay Dying. But with kind people 👌🏻
@@tuerkwurscht absolutely on your side. Heaven shall burn should be the Slayer of Metalcore. And they never stopped beeing the Slayer of Metalcore not like other Bands who became Rock/Emo/Whatever shit bands...
Disappointed you didn’t mention Tom Searle when talking about Architects. He was arguably more important to the sound of the band than Sam was.
It's why I call their sound from LTLF to Holy Hell the "Tom Trilogy".
i always just assume it goes without saying nowadays that Tom Searle was, and still is, the heart and soul of the band, even in his passing. I mean the impact of his life & death still clearly radiate throughout even their newest songs. And I honestly think the other boys in Architects would readily admit that without any shame
Thanks for watching!
@@KhaosKontroller holy hell has got barely anything from Tom on it so idk how that can be part of the discussion. Daybreaker to all our gods makes much more sense. If I'm honest, I truly feel anything past all our gods has been fairly derivative and it really shows how little the rest of the band was an influence on their sound. It was all tom and without him they've paled in comparison
He also didnt mention Jimmy with his part about A7x. Jimmy and Synyster really were the band, so... Suck it up... I mean I really listened the "Tom Trilogy" to death, but his passing has been some time now. Let it rest, let everyone move on. Stop mentioning it and let the dust settle.
Finn, literally 02:16 into the video:
*E A R T H C R I S I S*
Lol I thought the same shit hahaha
The amount of "waking the fallen was a metalcore staple" on here makes me overjoyed. What the hell Finn.
Thanks for letting me know which At the Gates album was THE banger album 🔥🙏🔥
The "shorts" thing sounds funny but it's a legit thing. I can't hardly describe it but there really used to be a thing about wearing shorts vs long pants. I don't think people care now or really remember but it was a whole thing.
I liked the side note you made about Avenged Sevenfold by saying they’re comparison is Guns N Roses. The more I think about it, the more truth I find in it haha
Super stoked to see Killswitch get the honor of being on the big four
I remember playing this song on guitar hero in like 2008 and being blown away you could sing and scream in the same song, and from there I was hooked
My Curse is a god damn banger TO THIS DAY
The verse riff is ridiculously good
This is hands down your best video yet!
Clear and accurate reasons and I think you got all four on the dot. Killswitch and as I lay dying definitely the Metallica and Megadeth.
Can’t wait for your deep dive in to Parkway Drive!!
Man this is a rough list I’m having a hard time with this one Finn. This was my genre. I’d have As I Lay Dying, Killswitch Engage, Trivium and Atreyu as the top 4 most influential during the rise of metalcore. Not mentioning Atreyu is crazy. They’ve done some dad rock stuff but they still release the odd metalcore track
“The odd metalcore track”
Is why they’re not a part of the list 😂
They have to be a metalcore band and Atreyu is simply not
@@Thomohawk21 I mean their first three records were undoubtedly Metalcore
@@deadSalesman_GD I mean I loved Atreyu but they were pretty much screamo and not metalcore
@@Fureth32 no definitely not. Screamo sounded like old school emo (because it literally developed at the same time in the same scene) but with screaming and that’s not what Atreyu sounded like. Atreyu sounded like the rest of the Orange County Metalcore scene
came to say the same. their most popular albums and success were absolutely metalcore. I'd put them as the Anthrax of metalcore.
This Big 4 sub-genre format is super interesting! Would love to hear your thoughts on the Big 4 of Deathcore, Death Metal, Emo etc. Great vid!
Big 4 of Deathcore is a tricky list to come up with if you are to follow Finn's qualifiers/disqualifiers.
@@LeMichaelJordansPoleRidersSuicide Silence, Whitechapel, Chelsea Grin and Lorna Shore.
Personally I'd pick August Burns Red instead of Architects. Their loyalty, longevity, humility, love for their fans, etc. have made them so great. Not to mention they haven't had a lineup change since like 2006 or so.
couldn't agree more
For me the King of Metalcore is As i lay dying. They've never changed their sound but if you listen to their most recent albums they sound better than ever.
I love that metalcore hater guy whose clips you always play.
When he screams... lol
I need that whole video please does anyone know the title?
I agree with almost every point you made in the video, but I have a bone to pick with what you said about Parkway Drive and how they weren’t reinventing the wheel or pushing any boundaries. to boil down their earlier works to just “chug riffs and breakdowns” I think is a gross understatement. the riffs were catchy, challenging, and intricate with a lot of complex rhythms and super fast tempos. the instrumentation was tight and alternated seamlessly from groovy breakdowns, to blast beats, to fast punk beats and thrash shredding. and on top of that, Winston’s insane vocal tone and lyrical ability that was miles ahead of many other lyricists in the genre. I understand their chill surfer dude vibe was a huge part of their personality as a band, but to say they weren’t “pushing the boundaries of art” or that their music was generic in anyway is pretty false in my opinion. other than that, spot on analysis lol
I recently went back and listened to their whole catalogue, and while they had some super catchy and interesting riffs that made you wanna mosh your brains off and definitely stood out from what other bands were playing at the time, I have to say that technicality was not their main strength. For me it was always the tone and the ambiance they created that always pulled me back for more, especially with songs like Horizons, or the ending of Sleepwaker.
@@kimonkarapetsis8195 no disrespect, but I’m not even sure we’re listening to the same band. yes they’ve got some great mosh parts, but I can name like 10 different riffs off the top of my head (specifically from Killing With a Smile, Horizons, Deep Blue, and Atlas) that are far more technical than those of a good majority of their peers. and one of the only metalcore bands to incorporate guitar solos in most of their songs. as a guitar player myself, Parkway Drive songs tend to have a higher level of difficulty and a lot of the riffs are quite challenging to play. I’d say if anything, they toned it down with their last few albums as they’ve shifted more towards a hard rock and more traditional metal sound.
I agree bro. Parkway is very technical and the band in general is VERY tight. Winstons voice is also one of the best screams in the scene.
Whats funny is that i was listening to Parkway for over a year before i knew they were surfer bros. The music was great and thats what started it for me.
@@fadedidentity fair enough
I loved this video. I graduated in 2003, and in the next few years after there was just a plethora of music that I loved so much. I found Killswitch and Shadows Fall around the same time, then Unearth and as I lay dying, and it started a very long love affair with similar types of metal. Shout out to Trivuim. The Crusade and Shogun are albums I still go back to often and will probably listen to forever.
Man Shogun is an awesome album, I finally listened to new Trivim album and I think top to bottom they have a great music catalog and the musicianship is insane.
@@drscott7359 totally agree. The only album in their whole catalog I don't love from front to back is Silence in the Snow.
My boyfriend loves trivium!
I think that this list is spot on. Metalcore is my favorite genre at the moment
How is A7X's Waking The Fallen not metalcore?
maybe not heavy enough
It is, IMO, but they’re still not a metalcore band. They’ve had more albums that are not metalcore than ones that are.
@@SixStringDave_90 Yeah I don't consider them metalcore band either but I am just wondering why Finn said Sounding The Seventh Trumpet is their only metalcore album, pretty much everyone agrees that Waking The Fallen is a metalcore album too
that record is, def. but everything after? nope.
it is, but the band overall, no. i love them, but they're more heavy metal than metalcore, for metalcore i see Trivium, KSE, PWD and AILD beiing more important
Trivium, As I Lay Dying, Parkway Drive and Killswitch Engage and a 5th one: Architects.
Hell yeah. Trivium was way more influential. Architects isn't a top 4 band. That was a biased pick and a bit undeserving imo.
Replace parkway with all that remains
August burns red stiff.
Dude I've watched 3 vids on this big four series and you nailed it every time. Every band I was thinking of you listed exactly where I had them. You have some serious knowledge sir.
Really like the inclusion of Architects. Didn’t expect for them to make the list but agree!
Agreed. Amazing band in all areas.
These video's really help show how trends and culture repeat with each generation. It's never exactly the same twice, but this this ties together some common threads. I like the perspective this gives and it teaches me something about what made the older generations of music cool too.
Hell yes to Killswitch! I don't listen to a ton of metalcore, but KSE are one of my favorite bands, not just in metal but overall. They transcend the genre much like Metallica transcends thrash.
100% agree with the analysis of PWD, I fell in love with their early stuff and after getting more into the metalcore scene and hearing some of the podcasts that PWD was in they are just super nice dudes. Got to see them live multiple times and even high fived Winston while crowdsurfing, just laid back and incredible nice group of guys who offstage put a lot of effort into conservation and other relief efforts. I started listening to them on their 1st full album back in 2005 in 5th grade and have loved everything since. Cant wait for live shows to go see them again, super energy and killer performance, hands down one of the best bands Ive seen live.
Metallica: Architects
Megadeth: Asking Alexandria
Slayer: August Burns Red
Antrhax: BFMV
Please do the big 4 of Nu-metal next
Oh yeah. I'd watch that. Except it's KoRn (Slayer?), Slipknot (Metallica, as much as I don't like thinking that), Limp Bizkit (MegaDeth) and probably Linkin Park (odd man out so Anthrax).
@@CeeJayThe13th RATM and Deftones have to be on that list! They were pioneers. I'd say Korn, Slipknot, Rage, Deftones.
Korn, Slipknot, Limp Bizkit and Deftones.
@@bigtakeshi RATM is definitely not Nu Metal. Don’t get me wrong, they’re great, but they’re not a part of the genre. Big 4 of Nu Metal are probably Slipknot, Korn, Limp Bizkit and Deftones.
@@CeeJayThe13th Slipknot are definitely Slayer, they're the band heavier than the rest.
My big four of metalcore would be Trivium, As I Lay Dying, The Dillinger Escape Plan and Killswitch Engage.
@Call Me, BLEGH Me, If You Wanna Reach Me zao!
Trivium has never been metalcore
@@GallowayJesse lol
@@jasonlovesmusicreacting882
They are a thrash band with screaming
No hardcore breakdowns = not metalcore
@@GallowayJesse So basically what Lamb Of God does too. Idk man, there’s nothing easier to label them than Metalcore.
INCREDIBLE VIDEO FINN !!!
I’ve been a METALCORE fan for the past 20 years and I agree 100% with everything you said in this video.
I think you perfectly summed up the BIG 4 of Metalcore.
All 4 bands that you listed are 4 of my all time favourite bands and all deserve to be in this Top 4.
As a fan of “The Big 4” thrash bands I thought your comparisons to the “Big 4 metal core bands made perfect sense.
This was my favourite video that you’ve done FINN .
Please do a video JUST on Killswitch Engage.
Their influence on bands and their music legacy is something that I think deserves a single video. Especially their story of losing their frontman and getting bigger after each record. Plus Adam D their guitarist is one of the funniest people I’ve ever seen live.
Thanks FINN 👍🏻
Killswitch, Shadows Fall, All That Remains, As I Lay Dying were the head of the pack. Parkway Drive and Architects didn't emerge until later. You could go with Between the Buried and Me as a contender here. I know Lamb of God is straight up metal band, but they were as much a part of that scene as any other band at the time. Even after they started to blow up, I saw LoG play a show at a small reception hall with All Else Failed as co-headliners. Every other band on that bill was a hardcore or metal core band. LoG embraced that community and style of promotion more than most hardcore bands of the scene.
I thought for sure Atreyu would get some love in this one. Maybe I’m just misremembering how they’re popularity.
Definitely a big influence
Honestly I’d had it kse, as I lay dying, under oath/ or a7x, and finally atreyu or all that remains
It might simply be that they're not super relevant anymore these days. Not to my knowledge at least.
Bro they were fucking huge! U ever see underworld?
I thought they should have gotten some love here, but they were in my opinion the biggest of the early sound. And my favorite. I tattooed "live love burn die" on myself lol but I think they really only influenced the huge wave that came right after them.
I found ABR in 2009 just after Constellations dropped (shout out to the Meddler music video), and they immediately became my favorite band. To your point of them having a surprising ability to just keep growing, I am surprised that every time I see them, the crowd is bigger and more diverse.
agreed, their consistency and longevity is amazing and they're such cool guys
I have always really enjoyed from autumn to ashes and bleeding through. Have so many good memories of many their albums and shows.
i cant believe i guessed you'd say architects for slayer. the moment you said about how without knowing it every metal band has taken from slayer i thought that sounds exactly like architects for metalcore. really good choice
Parkway drive still and is one of my favorite bands, along with Killswitch… that was my high school and college soundtrack.. those two bands. So thank you for paying respect to them and looking forward to seeing the Parkway Drive Video in the future
These are the big 4 no argument.
"Catchy singing chorus": any Killswitch Engage song. They appeal like anyone since their music is just amazing, especially during the Howard Jones for that era and Jesse’s comeback run.
I got on board during the Howard era and those choruses were the best.
@@thebizzle413 Same here, man. There’s just something special about listening to those albums.
Thats debatable
Overrated
I saw Killswitch Engage’s video for “Rose of Sharon” in 2004 on MTV 2. That’s what got me into it back when it was more difficult to discover new music outside of the radio and that 2001-2005 alt rock phase.
I’m glad BFMV got some decent consideration. They’re my favorite band. Gravity was definitely not what I wanted from them but all three singles from their upcoming album are awesome.
they're my favourite band too but I fucking love gravity
Ooh yeah, latest album is brutal!
KSE has always been one of my top 10 bands, period, across all genres.
A Finn McKenty video about metalcore in which Emmure isn't mentioned? No fucking way
We have been blessed!
I'm surprised how accurate some of these guesses are. I remembered when I was a kid and listened to Bullet for My Valentine for the first time on the Need For Speed Most Wanted game! It was absolutely my first step into Metal-core (just as Finn said), but when I listen As I Lay Dying for the first time it blew my mind. They where so good and so heavy! Even if I don't listen them anymore (stopped after all the Tim's shit) I can't deny they where very influential at my first years as a musician. Love this video Finn, nail it as allways!
Sometimes I go back to these videos and the spare bedroom chat makes me laugh every single time 😂. I love this channel, I found it and instantly love the geekyness of 'my' genre
I don't necessarily disagree with your picks, I think they're pretty good if we want to try and fit the exact template of the original Big 4. But I think if we made a Big 4 - as in the 4 biggest, most influential metalcore bands - it would be KsE, Trivium, As I Lay Dying and Bullet for my Valentine, regardless of them not fitting into the same tropes as the original Big 4
A7X was way way bigger and more influential than As I Lay Dying.
Trivium, Avenged Sevenfold, Killswitch Engage, and All that remains were my absolute Shit back in the day.
Real shit tho, Killswitch, Trivium, All that remains and Bullet were my big four. They were always the first four artist who's music I'd download off limewire/frost wire to put on whatever mp3 I had at the time.
My prediction (in no particular order): Killswitch Engage, August Burns Red, As I Lay Dying (even if Tim sucks they were still huge), and Devil Wears Prada
Edit: replace TDWP with Underøath
2nd Edit: if you’re directly matching members of the big 4 to Metalcore bands than I agree with your assessment except killswitch. I’d put either BMTH or A7X in their place because Metallica kind of stopped playing thrash after And Justice For All and both BMTH and A7X stopped playing Metalcore after Sempiternal and Waking the Fallen, respectively, then hit massive success just like Metallica. If we’re going with most popular Metalcore bands that stayed mostly Metalcore then I’m sticking with Killswitch, AILD, ABR and Underøath.
I absolutely loved this list and cannot agree more with your choices.
The only thing that kinda bothered me is that you didn't mentioned Asking Alexandria. Say what you want about the band or their members, but, at least here in Brazil, they were the hughiest thing. Like... REALLY bigger than the other ones. I'm not saying you should qualify them as one of the Big 4, cause i don't think that is the case, but you had to mention them imo. "The Final Episode" was fucking everywhere when i was 17 years old. They were more influential than any other Metalcore/screamo bands back in the day. Again... maybe i have this impression cause i'm south american and i know they have a huge fan base here (just check out any of their videos and you will see that like, 50% of the comments are in spanish or brazilian portuguese) but anyways... great content as always, Finn!
I easily see your point about KSE being the metallica of metalcore. It's just a shame they aren't as commercially popular.
Idk... When I ask people if they listen to hardcore/metal etc, nearly everybody names, "Like Killswitch? they're amazing!"
Ehhh at least they were on the map pretty heavily.
I didn't hear of Architects until maybe 5 years ago now and somehow they made it in the top 4 of influential bands for that era?
That's the one that escapes me.
@@user-fj6kk1vo8n If he were talking about metalcore in general, Architects would definitely have a fair claim to the spot of the big 4 seeing how they basically created an entire new wave on their own. However, seeing as he seems to be talking about the 2000s metalcore era, I definitely wouldn't put them there.
If anything, Unearth would be a solid pick for me. While not as relatively well known as slayer, they created much of the sound bands like PWD, ABR and even The Ghost Inside would later on utilise in their music. They were quite ahead of their time.
"Megadeth also sucks" My ass.
They only wrote one of the best and most beloved albums in thrash metal history, that being Rust In Peace. They're also absolutely amazing live. Dave Mustaine also wrote a few of Metallica's best early songs as well. So right, Megadeth sucks.
Could be the Megadeth/rush effect where people just hate the whole band because of the sound of the singer haha (I love both)
Rust sucks. That album is shit. One good song, the rest should have been tossed on the shit heap.
Totally agree. Megadeth is fantastic. The best of the big 4 for aggression, technicality and songwriting.
0:01 having beef with m shadows is crazy
2 out of 4 of the bands listed here are in my top 5 bands of all time. so pretty stoked about that
Damn I had KSE, AILD, ABR, and PWD as my guesses beforehand. 3/4 is pretty good though, and although I prefer ABR, Architects is definitely a pick I'm happy with.
ABR >>>>>>> architects
I had the same list, but I only would change Architects over Parkway Drive cause I'm not that into them.
Unholy Confessions might be the most famous metalcore song ever.
"The End of Heartache" or "Confined" arguably, probably some others too 😊
That riff is the Smoke On The Water of modern metal.
Tears don't fall have 187 million views
Glad to see my favorite metal band of the modern era : Parkway Drive! Can't wait to see a video on them from you! I realize you're a busy busy dude so I'll try to be patient on it lol
From your perspective of a "equal" big 4, for me would be: KsE, AILD, CALIBAN and Parkway Drive.
KsE, AILD and Parkway Drive were all solid picks, amazing list dude, would be perfect if the pick for most "ripped of"/influencial band was Caliban instead of Architects, you would be surprise with how much every metalcore band ripped of Caliban in any generation (they were one of the pioneers and from KsE/AILD until Architects/The Devil Wears Prada/Breakdown of Sanity they all took something from them). But again amazing list, great video!
Ps: KsE is the goat from metalcore