How To Tram Your CNC Router without expensive tools Shapeoko
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2024
- In this video we will discuss tramming, and how to adjust it on your hobby cnc router. We will start by making a free tool, and go through the steps to make any necessary corrections.
1 2 3 Blocks: amzn.to/3vKGs6W
Surfacing Bit: amzn.to/3tG2nu1
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Super simple. Thanks for posting it.
Just found your channel. Going to tram my machine this weekend. Thank you so much!
Awesome. Thank you. Good luck!
I really appreciate your videos, they really help thanks Chris!
always a pleasure watching your video tutorials man!
Thank you for the video! Very helpful!
Thank you for doing this video. I have been having issues since I got the dang machine and now i believe I'm ready to fix it.
Thanks for showing folks how to tram.
That said, a piece of 1/4 inch rod bent into a lazy Z shape works just fine.
Yup there’s lots of ways to do it.
Thank you for this cool tutorial on tramming.I am finally going to get around to tramming my shapeoko.
Wow - that's a much easier thing to get than the tram tools. Thank you for also showing which way you moved the rails and which screws to undo. I just surfaced mine so I need to do this!
You kept this extremely simple. Thank bro!
Thank you
Bro, you made this soooo simple. The process seems so intimidating to be honest but after seeing this I feel like I can do it. Keep pushing content!!!
Awesome video, love making something grow other stuff we have lying around, great idea and very helpful setting up shaepoko
I gotta do something with all of the scraps I refuse to throw away!
Thanks for posting this Chris, perfect timing I just assembled my Shapeoko 3 XXL after it sitting in the box for 10 months and getting ready to fine tune it. Cheers !
Awesome. Good luck with everything!
Thanks for posting theses videos! Very helpful to us "newbies".
You’re welcome. Thanks for watching!
Awesome. Thanks buddy. Once again you knock the ball out of the park.
Thank you!
I've looked at about ten different videos on how to do this with my shapeoko. Your video is by FAR the most easy to understand and well produced. Thanks!!!!
Glad to hear it. Thank you!
This was very cool! TY!
Who would dislike this video? 🤔 It’s simple and very informative. Well done man.
I’ve come to learn that you could be handing out free 1 dollar bills, and someone would complain that it wasn’t a 5.
They wanted to watch the gat simulator
@@brendanhowe5415 hahah
I’m a late comer to your channel but I for sure will have a popcorn night and check out all the other videos.
It’s just amazing what is available to make you smarter.
Thanks again
Thanks for watching
Really helpful ❤
Good to hear. Thanks
This is really good! I do the same thing on my shaper and it makes a huge difference in cope and stick doors.
Thanks 🙏
Very nice. I trammed the router holder on my machine with 123 blocks. Like the way you used the wood to check the table.
That was a small metal surface plate.
thanks Chris!
You’re welcome!
Very helpful !
Great video THANKS!
Thank you!
Good stuff!
Genius. My X-Carve needs a good tramming after the new z-axis install. This seems easy enough without spending $100 for a tool.
Simple and direct! No need to buy an expensive tool with two dial indicators, and to be fair, this is probably more accurate! Thanx mate! 👍
I’ve had good luck with this method. Thanks for watching!
@@ChrisPowellFSD Just finished dialing in my machine... Bit of a challenge on a 1200x1200 surface, and I think the key is to be patient. Trammed three times, and surfaced 4 times, but it's 100% level now with just those 'fluffy' marks between the cuts, as on yours. So glad I found your CZcams post! Cheers mate! 👍
Great job.... seriously I never got even close!! Especially without removing that damn front plate multiple times..... I had to buy a supply of m5 bolts for the spindle mount because I stripped several working on a tram left to right and went through a mile of tin foil tramming front to back.
Your a tramoligist my friend!!
Just lucky haha. Some of the hardware definitely leaves something to desire. I think some of these are single use screws.
Hey, Stephen Hall from Tube Ritual - I've been dreading tramming my machine, but this method is so much easier than what I've seen. I'll be doing this in the next few days. Great vid Chris!
Awesome. It works pretty well. What machine do you have?
@@ChrisPowellFSD I have a machine from PDJ called a Pilot Pro 2626. Not widely known, but they are built more like an Avid CNC.
They look interesting. I’m trying to figure out what my next one will be. Considering a cnc4newbie. I want something that can handle a half sheet of plywood.
Chris Powell I want something larger as well. Like a 4x8 Avid, but I don’t have the space for it yet ;) I’ve also used a Laguna Swift 4x4 and that’s a good machine. Those are super heavy, so it would be nicer to stick with a kit machine.
Never toss or recycle old dull-broken bits! I make tooling pins out of my old bits. Come in handy for tiling large jobs.
Thanks
Never did this but I’m going too now!!!!
I hadn’t done it for the first year I was need my machine. It definitely improved my cut quality. I should have done it sooner.
Chris....if your old router bit that's inserted in the router isn't perfectly 90 degrees to your piece of pine, that will affect the other side of the pine and make it look out of alignment.
That is correct, but it won’t have any effect on what we’re doing here. Each bit is fixed, and the circle you’re making with the bit will always be parallel to the face of the bit that’s in your router.
Thanks for the video... I'm about a 1/16th off from my front to back. I've done exactly like you but I can only get about a 1/32" movement, and that's really putting some weight behind it. I also tried loosening all eight bolts (the two pivots) but still no movement. I think I can get it if really put a lot of weight on my two clamps, but it's requiring A LOT of pressure (I'm around 200lbs and it's requiring most of it). I just wanted to get your thoughts before I do that. I don't want to bend or break anything. I have a pretty flat torsion box and no leveling feet just pink foam sub-base. BTW, from the day I assembled, I had a hell of a time aligning my bolts. There's like zero play! Even when I loosen them, they're very tight in the holes (shocked I didn't strip them). Thanks
I’ve heard this before. Some machines do seem to be a little tighter than others. You can file out the holes a little to get some adjustment. I know it’s a pain, but that’s about the only thing I can think to do, provides everything else is square.
So this will adjust the router to be perfectly perpendicular to the most likely off-square cnc bed? I would think it would be better to square the router off to a piece of glass or a level spanning across both of your Y rails then re-surface the spoilboard after to match?
Do you got any insight on how to adjust the xcarve machines
Hello Chris,thanks for the video. I love your enclosure for the Shapeoko, would you share the dimensions and or design with us?
Thanks, George
Thanks. I just used a 4x4 sheet of plywood for the bottom, out some 12” long 4x4 legs on it, and used mdf for the top. It actually overhangs the plywood base so the inside is a full 4x4’. I built the whole top box, and cut the door out of it. I wish I had done a video on it, but it was before I was doing stuff like this.
@@ChrisPowellFSD How high is the actual cabinet inside dimension?
Thumbs up.
Question would it benefit to put a level bubble on the tool? And could you cnc a zero block out?
That would only indicate if the whole machine was level.
@@ChrisPowellFSD okay. Got it. Thanks for the reply
Great video, many thanks, one question, or comment, does the bit that is fixed in the router have to be perfectly square, cos if not it will throw everything out?
No both can be crooked. By spinning it, you’re creating a circle. The face of that circle is parallel to the face of the bit you insert into your router.
Chris Powell ah, yes I see it now. Why not tram to the x and y rails? Before surfacing ?
I can’t think of any method of doing that that would be easier than just surfacing the wasteboard.
Hey chris, so do i surface my wasteboard before i do this and then surface again after i tram it?
Yes. Surface, tram, surface again if you made any adjustments.
Just saved me $100
Chris, I've been working on tramming a few days now. I've trammed, flattened, and retrammed. I still see and barely feel ridges going from front to back (like this IIIIII). I think that's the X axis (spindle) that needs adjustment. I used my 1-2-3 blocks, machinist square, and digital calipers and got it PERFECT. However, with my tramming tool, just like yours, it's rubbing on the left and about .80 mm high on the right. What should I do? I assume the tramming tool is more accurate than the 1-2-3 blocks in this situation, correct? What do you recommend? Thanks
The problem with the 123 block is it really has to sit on the ridges to give you an accurate measurement. The tram tool is a more accurate way of measuring it.
@@ChrisPowellFSD Thanks!
Tramming on the X axis can be done with eccentrics as they are inside the rails.
I only have eccentrics one the bottom of the plates for any of the axis. I’m not aware that they ever put them on the top also. Sounds like it would be very difficult to set up and keep them properly tensioned.
@@ChrisPowellFSD It should have read Z axis but effects X tram.
The only eccentrics I have are on the bottom v wheels. There’s no way to adjust tram with them.
chris, what did you use for a square block?
It’s just a precision ground surface plate I had laying around. A 123 block would be the easiest thing to find if you don’t have something like that.
I loosened the side screws but could not get the bar to rotate even the slightest.
I need to make a new wasteboard with threaded inserts and complete the tramming. Which should i do first make the wasteboard and install, then tram to the new wasteboard? Tram to the old/ original wasteboard
Never really been a fan of the threaded inserts, but you should just be able to cut them in the supplemental wasteboard, insert the threaded inserts, flip it over, secure it to the wasteboard, then surface the supplemental. Then tram, and surface again if you make any adjustments.
@@ChrisPowellFSD thanks bud. Keep putting out great content!
Well when I move the y axsis then put the screws back in the screws put it back to where it began. Leaving the screws in a bit all but one I wasn’t able to even adjust it. Ugh.
Try loosening all 4 on each side.
Chris I have a question. I have a xxl and I found the other day that when it is jogged all the way forward it touches the left front frame bracket but does not come in contact with the right front bracket. I have checked that the frame is square from corner to corner and it is. So I am wondering if at some point that the belt on that sid e has skipped a tooth or two and that is causing this to be that way. Any Ideas Thanks Jeff Peters
I don’t think it would matter if the belt skipped a tooth because it’s a stepper motor. It homes off the switch in the back right. When it’s all the way back, does it touch on the right and not the left. Sounds like something is out of square.
@@ChrisPowellFSD Chris when I pull it back the right rear side touches the up right but the left rear does not about the same as the front space. Does you unit touch both sides moved all the way forward and back word
Yes, it is. I used a carpenters square to make sure my frame was square. I found it difficult to accurately measure from corner to corner because all I had was a tape measure. Have you done any tests to see if you’re cutting square? You can cut a square with a fine point bit, and measure from side to side and corner to corner on that.
@@ChrisPowellFSD Chris yesterday I created a file to cut out a 4 inch square using ,625 end mil to check to see if it cut it out square, So I am happy to say that it was square all the way around. So I assume that that means the gantry is square to the side rails. Have you ever just pulled your gantry all the way forward to see if it touches both front up rights.?
I still see tool marks or undulations on your spoil board...is this normal or should the tramming have fixed this? I've noticed these on my workpieces after face milling and was trying to figure out how to get rid of those marks. All videos I see on youtube seem to show these marks. People just say that something must not be exactly square or plumb, and they just sand it off the wood pieces. Others say it is tooling marks that are going to be there regardless. What I see are undulations or wavy marks with not only visible ridges where the tool runs, but I can feel them as well. Maybe only 1/32 or 1/64 inch, but they are there. Any suggestions?
They’re most likely not enough to worry about.
Just for clarification you recommend surfacing before and after trimming correct?
Yes
How do you make the two pins parallel?
You don’t have to.
Hey Chris do you have the setup info to put in carbide for the surfacing bit?
You just put it in as an endmil. All you should need is the diameter.
@@ChrisPowellFSD gotcha, ordered it yesterday didn’t know if it would have the feeds/speeds listed when it got here
@@SpwnDragn for surfacing a wasteboard, I run it as fast as I can. 200ipm is no problem for it. I make really light passes. .01” usually.
@@ChrisPowellFSD hey Chris sorry to keep bothering you, on the part where you use the clamp to til forward backward, if I’m at the front and I pull down to get the gauge to 0, the minute I let go it goes off 0, when I go to the center of the wasteboard and tilt forward I can get it to 0 and it will stay at 0 but then when I move it forward (towards me) it’ll go off 0
Hey Chris, I paused it at 2:07 and something caught my eye. Did you make sure the bits you put in the wood are at exactly 90 degrees to the board? It looked kind of crooked which made me realize how important that has to be when I recreate this.
Thought the same thing. Freehand drilling, no way that hole was square. But, a great idea overall, just need a bit more precision.
It actually isn’t important at all. Each bit could be at a a crazy angle, and it wouldn’t matter because the circle that you create will always be perpendicular to the z axis.
how about a resurfacing of the waste board?
czcams.com/video/LPfZarPPdT8/video.html
How do you properly tram if the waste board isn't perfectly flat? I assume flattening with a machine that isn't properly trammed would cause it to be out of whack?
You flatten first. Even if the tram is off, you’re still making the whole wasteboard parallel to the face of the bit and that’s what’s important. That gives you a surface to tram from.
@@ChrisPowellFSD Appreciate the answer. I will run my flattening operation first and then tram.
Thanks for showing this! Is there a way to get an email to you? I am new and have questions? Thanks
Chris@fullsteamdesigns.com
@@ChrisPowellFSD Thank you so much, my email is ppets.mac@gmail.com as well, and Randy Freeman is my name btw!
The only problem I have with this idea is that you should have used a drill press for the holes. If you didn't drill straight down, then the device would already be out of line.
That’s incorrect. I’m pretty sure I explained why in the video. The plane created by spinning the tool will always be perpendicular to the shaft in the collet. It doesn’t matter if everything is drilled perfectly square or not.
@@ChrisPowellFSD I actually had the same question, I didn't hear it in the video, but i'm at work (dont tell). But once I read your comment, closed my eyes and visualized it, I agree. Very nice!!! Think I'll do the same thing, but use my cheap Harbor Freight Dial indicator.
Ok, question, I understand what all you did, BUT how does one know the problem doesn’t lie in the wasteboard vs the router/gantry? 🤔🤔
Assuming you squared your machine properly, the wasteboard should be very close to level in the machine.
I paused at 0:28 just to say that if you can tram the stock Z-Axis of the Shapeoko correctly then you are some kind of Yoda Jedi Trammoligist. I can honestly say I hate the factory Z enough that I sold a very elusive and valuable piece of my vape mod collection just to upgrade to the HDZ...
Gepetto?
My x axis has 5mm drop over 1200mm 🤣🤪 not sure how to fix
See if you can loosen your rails and adjust them up or down.
at 1:00 What happen if drill not 90 degree.
Couldn't you use the 123 blocks in the Y direction as well? It will show you when you are parallel
You can, but I still recommend checking it with the tool we made after setting it with the 123 blocks. The length of the tool makes it more accurate. Mine is about 10” long from point to point, so we’re measuring about 20” with that, vs 3” with a 123 block.
Q: Just trying to wrap my head around this, not trying to challenge your design, as I'm about to tram my CNC, but one aspect of your tool is gnawing away at me. It looks like you assumed that the holes you drilled were perfectly parallel with one another (eg: both were drilled at exactly the same angle thru the wood (90 degrees?). In other words, if the holes are not perfectly parallel, wouldn't that throw off your calibration once the "arm" is mounted in the router? e.g.: if one hole is at 90 degrees but the other is skewed slightly at 89.7 degrees? Again, just trying to learn and understand this approach before diving in to it on my CNC.
They don’t actually have to be parallel or perfectly 90 degrees. The imaginary plane created by spinning it will always be parallel to the face of the bit in the router. One could be 45 degrees and it wouldn’t matter. It’s the plane created by spinning it that you’re after.
Think you mean perpendicular.
If you’re referring to where I said “The face if the bit is always going to be parallel to the circle it creates”, I meant parallel. You have 2 circles that are parallel with one another.
Chris Powell Nope, 26 seconds in you said the bit is parallel to the waste board. That’s what I was referring to.
The face of the bit is parallel to the waste board.
It’s not “parallel to“, its “perpendicular to“.
The face of the bit is parallel to the surface of the waste board.
Technically the face is parallel, it's a flat surfacing bit. The shaft would be perpendicular.