E36 M50 Manifold Conversion £30 DIY Pipework Setup
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- čas přidán 15. 02. 2018
- As part of my 328 build I am installing the M50 Intake Manifold and want to share the details with anyone thinking of doing the conversion DIY.
All credit for this setup goes to PbFut on Bimmerforums.com Back in 2007 - Thank you
So, just to provide some detail for what I've done here -
Hose Barb: ebay.us/rQyuP1
Take a 12" straight piece, 3 right angles and a "T" piece and get cutting pipe ready to braze.
Straight pipe: amzn.to/3ePLuZn
Tee End: amzn.to/2RXprah
Right Angle Elbow: amzn.to/2Rkgxnb
I did this with the brackets, CCV and IACV all in place - this allowed me to route the pipes on the fly so i could reach everything effectively.
The remainder of the connections between the CCV and the IACV were achieved using rubber hose that I had in the garage already.
Braze all the copper pipes together, adjust your angles accordingly and button everything back up.
The intake air temperature can be moved to the intake rubber boot - simply cut a small round hole and push the sensor into the boot allowing it to sample the temperature of the incoming air. The benefit of this method is it will allow the sensor to be changed later if it fails for any reason.
Thanks for watching!
/ pamogriffiths
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Hi everyone!
I followed this up with another video if you want to see further detail on the install, and brazing the copper pipework:
czcams.com/video/36ll8fVrtE8/video.html
US subscriber here. This is absolutely brilliant, almost wish I could just buy your kit for my manifold swap. Well done man!
Thank you!! I just could not get myself to spend that chunk of change when I knew I could do it for less!
Nice video Pamo ! I really like how you trying to encourage the people to DIY . Probably going to do it by myself in the next month or two and going to record a video with before and after the upgrade (with remap) with a drag test versus stock 328i . Keep the good work !
Sweet vid!
Cheers for that info chap.
Thanks!
Great vid, very informative. My only wish is that you showed assembly of the components on the M50 manifold. Otherwise, spot on.
When I did my conversion I unscrewed the plastic plate that the hoses and sensors mounted to on the underside of the m52 manifold and carefully marked the position on the m50 manifold, using multitool I trimmed all the plastic fins back and cut and drilled out the plastic leaving a perfect shape that can utilise the original gasket on the plastic plate, I also made a resistor plug that measured the same as the acs throttlebody so it can be simulated but deleted so the Abs will still work and fitted the original m52 throttlebody with the m50 intake boot.
Wait... does removing / deleting ASC via unplugging it deactivate ABS?
Keep making 328i videos mate. Your videos are great!
Can you do one on the oil change and other service bits?
Thanks Rick. If you want a video on service stuff then the next time I change the oil I'll get the camera out.
Very nice work. Looking to to do this down the road. Hoping to hear your review after install and test run it. Smart move with the reflash. Can the CCV deleted and and oil separator added? Seems like a good time to add one. Thoughts? One of my favorite channels! Thanks as always
Thank you for watching Mike. I'm learning as well with these things and being an old Honda nut I would have previously always removed any oil feed to the intake. From what I've read though It can cause as many problems as it solves in the BMW. I'm electing to keep the CCV valve - just to install a brand new one as I'm never aiming to make a balls out car. My goals are always improvement with as little sacrifice as possible.
well explained. thank you. I like your attitude.
Thank you
2:52 I got a 97' 323ti and that port is not closed off and does have a vacuum line going there. Its a Europe mainland car.
Thank you for the info on the m50 manifold.
That's interesting... Has it got a secondary air pump system?
Hi Pamo. Great video as always! One quick question tho. What do you use the hose barb for? What do you connect there?
That's for the brake servo vaccum takeoff. It could be done other ways, but this was easy.
Find different style piping the most common fail points in the ccv system are due to condensation mixing with oil vapor that turned back into oil mixed an became yellow gunk or sludge those copper pipes will condensate worse than the oem rubber lines and plastic ccv
Hi Pamo, thanks for the video. Do you recommend the CCV delete or not? I assume not if you kept yours?
I don't on a standard car, it does its job fairly well and without it you can have all sorts of issues with vaccum, oil vapour, oil use etc.
Hey Pamo:) Do you talk about difference in performance in your other video?
My other question is not directly related but if you know please do answer...
Subjective difference between 2.5 and 2.8 engine? Id like substantially more low end torque in my future(?) 2.8. Is it worth it?
And is the low-mid range difference between m50b25 and m52b25 worth mentioning?
Thank you for your time
Good question. I'll be honest and say that I just drove my first almost stock m50b25 a few weeks ago. It was surprisingly close to my 328 low down (bear in mind my 3.15 diff). Up top my 328 has a little more grunt. The m52b25 that was in my 323 was a lesser competitor but not by much. My friends 323 with lightened flywheel, m50 manifold and a miracle 210k mile perfect engine is not to shrug off. There's more potential in the 328 though... The generic map can be tweaked quite a lot.
i cant seem to find a m50tub20 intake sensor, so what did you do with yours i failed to see it in the video
thanks
Mike Foster - I used the M52 one Mike. I drilled a small hole In the air box just behind the air filter next to where the top rad hose is situated. It gets a nice cold feed and done with the right size hole fits nicely. Sugru seals it beautifully...
Can the throttlebody from the M50 be used if it is already on the manifold? or do you need the S52 throttlebody?
Servando Morales as far as I know it can be used but gives little benefit. I've read that it is often sold to recoup some of the cost of the manifold.
Hey thanks for the video. Was wondering what the blue barb that goes into the air intake sensor port is for? I was going to plug mine up and put the m52 sensor in the intake, cheers
It's a connector to allow me to connect vaccum to the charcoal canister solenoid. On the m52 manifold this is below the throttle body. My Intake air sensor is in the air box behind the filter. Most cut a small hole in the rubber intake boot after the maf but before the t/b. I preferred the air box as there is no chance of an intake vaccum leak in that position. If you aren't running the charcoal canister then screw it into where my barb is 👍
@@ManSeeksCivic ah thanks dude. I'm using the little T that comes out of the adapter from the M50 for the charcoal filter line. The T piece that plugs into the main M50 manifold hole. And the secondary air pump nipple for the fuel regulator vacuum. So didn't need any extra ones. Hopefully it all works once it's back together !
Does the m50 manifold from the 520i work? Should i get the m50 throttle body too ? Or is the m52 one fine?
No, the 520/320 manifolds have narrower runners. It has to be from the 2.5l cars I'm afraid. The m52 throttle body works just fine with the gasket modifications.
Hey man, nice setup! I have one question, are you sure the fitment of the copper pipe is 22mm? I messured mine and it is 29 mil?! Greetings from holland
The pipe is bought as 22mm But iirc... It's not exactly 22mm. It's standard copper plumbing pipe size here in the UK. I'll measure it exactly when I'm next at the garage.
@@ManSeeksCivic Thanks for your fast reply, i also want to make it from copper but the max size here in Holland is 28 mm maybe there is a way to fill it up with something?
Hey man, quick question. I can’t find a 22mm copper pipe, should it work with a 3/4?
3/4 is a little thin, 7/8 is equivalent to 22mm.
Hey mate, i am deadly serious i would even pay you 1/2 in advance, how much would you charge to take a stock 328i and you do the swap and get the parts and straight pipe the exhaust, obviously you can make a drink on top, i am also in the uk and would come to you, thank you.
I appreciate your confidence In me Jordan but I'm here to teach you guys how easy this stuff is. Keep watching the channel and ask any questions you need. That's how I can help best.
When you say remapped are you talkin tuned ecu?
Yes. Same thing 👍
question. is that CCV valve that you put on the m50 manifold the one that's offf the m52 manifold? I just ordered a new one and would wish to swap it over to the m50 manifold if that's what you did too. I don't see why not.
Sure is, they use the same valve.
Can you use the ccv seal from your m52 intake
The round grey one - yes 👍
Hey Pamo
Where does your barb fitting connect to?
It "was" screwed into the threaded port underneath the manifold where the m50 intake air temp sensor used to be. It now isn't connected, I was using it to feed vaccum to the charcoal canister - I have since removed the canister and blocked the port.
Never mind it connects to the canister withe the sensor
Any differences between the m50 manifolds from the 320i, 323i, or 325i? Will they all work the same? Thanks
It has to be from the 325 or 525 buddy. Engine code m50b25. The 2litre 320i has smaller runners and the 323i is an m52 - same manifold as 328i.👍
@@ManSeeksCivic Legend! Thanks
Hi please help! I have bought a 328i with an M50 manifold. Not sure how well it's been done but it pulls really well. There's this rattle resonating from beneath the manifold. It's like a lash sound you can hear loudly when I rev the engine. It is there at about 2000 - 3500 rpm. Mechanic can't seem to diagnose it! It's not the vanos or chain.
Thats tough without hearing the engine but you could have noisy injectors, loose lifters or many other top end slackness.
@@ManSeeksCivic thanks for reply! Which is the easiest and cheapest to eliminate of those ?
@@giddyupgazboy1 I'm afraid none of it is easy... You can try different oils for the lifters. Thinner or thicker can have an audible effect but it's tenuous. To fix them you're looking at a top end tear down.
@@ManSeeksCivic update: after wasting weeks and £££ with mechanics on this issue I tried a can of Wynns hydraulic lifter treatment for £9 and the rattle has 90% disappeared! Thanks for you advice
Hey guys, I need a little help with this... I got an E36 with an M50b20 automatic in it. I bought a m52 with a manualtransmission and the whole wiring harness, but it has no throttlebody. My thinking was to make the m50 manifold swap with the parts of my m50. Could I just use the m50 throttlebody with the m50 manifold on the m52 on the m52? I was thinkin if I have both engines I could cheap out on the swap parts :D
That's ideal. The m50 tb is bigger I believe. It would be the best setup.
Okay ty for the quick answer
Can you use the m50 fuel rail or do you must have the m52 rail ?
You're better off with the m50 one. The m52 one fits but has tto be spaced to fit the bolt pickup points on the m50 manifold. Most of us who do the conversion don't buy the m50 rail along with the manifold because of cost and availability.
I got the m50 fuel rail for free included:) lucky me. I assume the injectors are the same dimensions? Straight swap m52 injectors onto the m50 manifold?
@@41956 The injectors are a direct swap, I believe the fuel lines connect slightly differently but don't know the specifics... I've never seen an m50 rail in person.
My starter motor just died today on my 98 323i....! I have a m50 inlet manifold & fuel rail but no brackets... 🤷♂️ Do I bite the bullet & fit it or just refit my m52 manifold? Any idea's?
Why have you not fitted it already, stick it on. Its not hard to go back if you don't like the change - which you will.
@@ManSeeksCivic lol I don't know really, I work a lot so the idea of potentially having my car in bit's for weeks is abit worrying, & it's knowing exactly wot I need to do it, I've had the manifold for a couple years now... Watched your video a few times, but life always throws something shit my way 🤣. I've already got a remapped ecu fitted so it should be ok with the manifold it's just something I've been putting off like the rocker cover gasket 😒 but now the starter's died I suppose I have no choice but to go ball's deep! I have loads of questions to ask you about your stroker but I'll leave that for another time pal
I still got the m52 and Ive removed the ccv junk
Interesting, how have you dealt with the venting gases, do you run a catch can? More info on your setup please, I don't like the ccv but I've read that it's a necessary evil. Thanks.
@@ManSeeksCivic I just used the icv from the m52 on m50 and just let det ccv to air. no modification needed, did it on 2 cars now works gr8.
Some dyno results with four setups: www.btcf.fi/forum/showpost.php?p=3484127&postcount=300
Blue curve is with remapped ecu plus m50 manifold and brown/green curve with m54 intake cam and stock manifold, hope this helps somebody
Can this be done and do a ccv delete
I've read differing things about CCV deletes. Generally I would avoid it unless I was going to turbo. I'm not your guy here.
Why did you flip the idle control valve the opposite way ?
I didn't, it still functions in the same direction.
@@ManSeeksCivic okay perfect, I guess mine looks a little different.
Would it be safe to install my air temp sensor in the intake boot or would you recommend somewhere else?
Great video by the way, I've went directly of your build to do mine 👌
There are a few different designs, they should have an arrow indicating direction - this should point towards the intake plenum. The air temp sensor in the elbow is fine provided its sealed well and doesn't leak at all. Cut a smaller hole than the sensor body diameter so its a tight fit and give it a little rtv to be sure 👍
If it hasn't got an arrow, the thicker bore faces the plenum. HtH.
@@ManSeeksCivic thanks so much mate, you're a star!
what if i use pvc pipe instead of copper?
Pvc wouldn't stand up to oil vapour well. It would slowly degrade, loose its shape and melt.
@@ManSeeksCivic or i could use some hydraulic oil hoses, a copper T pipe and some elbows
As long as the pipes are oil resistant you'll be fine 👍
@@ManSeeksCivic also i do have a question...since i am doing a m50 manifold and m50 throttle body swap on my 328i..i am deleting the asc...what type of intake boot should i use...the m50 rubber ones or silicone elbow with a fitting for the idling hose return line?
Either will work. Personal preference here 👍
I've got an M50 manifold with this noise : czcams.com/video/05rf6PDPHGI/video.html - no idea what it is! ive changed the oil and its back !
You don't have idea what you talking about