No hooty singing heard here. Singers of this era sang with true vowels and clarity of tone which requires far less effort in order to project the sound. Thorborg is a wonderful example of a naturally dark voice that still sang with a full sound which rang clear like a bell in all parts of the voice. It's as if people in the opera business today are intimidated by this natural, unprocessed sound.
No. It's that proper singing is deader than a doornail and has been for decades. There are virtually no teachers capable of properly training voices now, and then there is the lovely phenomenon of 'singers' screaming roles two Fachs above themselves for a few years, until they've wrecked their instruments beyond repair. Read 'The Last Prima Donnas' for the best one-volume explanation.
A CONTRALTO POWERHOUSE!!! a Wagnerian mezzo of the Golden Age, alongside of Flagstad and Melchior, with whom she appeared constantly. No small wonder. The voice all but jumps out of my headphones! Thanks for sharing!
What I love about this track is that it is not a pedantic singing lesson. It is a perfectly characterized portrait of Erda: hieratic, mysterious, and filled with the melancholy of millennia. The voice is the means to a dramatic end, not the end itself; and that's as it should be, especially in Wagner.
Whatever beuatiful a mezzo-soprano is, it will never possess the contralto qualities so much needed to embody the image of Erda and this becomes especially clear when I hear the performance of Kerstin Thorborg. The shape, the line she provided to the "Erda's warning" is so perfect, the inside substance is so rich and majestic like the Earth.
Thank you for posting. I'm a RING fanatic and the small but extremely important Erda warning is always key to my full enjoyment of Rheingold. This lady was wonderful!!! I agree with previous observations that the role requires a true contralto to fully embody the qualities required in the dramaturgy. Currently there is a great Erda, the Polish contralto Ewa Podles. It is a shame the MET does not do more with her. There is a youtube clip with her singing this warning.
There are a lot of really great singers in the business today who just don't book work. Unfortunately, with the way that the market is, a director would rather book a thin singer with an ok voice than a singer with an amazing voice and big body. Not saying that is always the case, but it does cut the talent pool down.
That would be less evil, if in paralel they studio-recorded the same operas with the radio-look singers. And sometimes they should stage it with a dream team too. Shame they don't. Irreparable loss...
Mezzos TODAY are LUDICROUS as compared to the MAGNIFICENT THORBORG who SANG WITH BRILLIANCE unlike the HOOTY, COVERED, THROATY Mezzos today who BELIEVE that opening the MOUTH to a CAVERNOUS position will INCREASE VOLUME. The frequencies of the vibrations heard represents the Art of Singing during the Golden Era rather than the idiocy of what is heard in all the opera houses today.
@musikenergy Of course the Almighty has given gifts to singers. It is they for whom compassion is given because the impresarios, conductors and vocal instructors are accoustically challenged Please listen to Anita Cerquetti - Conchita Supervia and Nezhdanova for enjoyment of the "Art" of Singing - just for starters
How true. Paul Hume, eminent critic pointed this out in 1973. The problem is that the conductors, impresarios and voice teachers are acoustically challenged.
@musikenergy Awards do not impress. The singers of the Golden Era surpass all on the operatic stage. Suggest reading Paul Hume's article 1973 on the decline of singing then. It continues.
great voice and great singing, but she was not a contralto. she was a dramatic Mezzo. her passaggio shows it clearly. Rheingold Erda is written in a vocal range which quite every female voice can sing. the color of the voice doesn't say if you are a soprano or a contralto. It are the passaggios and where the power of the voice is the biggest.
contraltissima You also don’t hear the huge timbre change going into the the chest register that you often get from a real contralto. It seems unique to the voice type, but the contralto voice just often doesn’t have that uniform sound through the registers that everyone seems to look for nowadays. They hear a singer like Ewa Podles and think that she is pushing down low, when that just simply isn’t the case. The contralto really is the female equivalent of the bass voice in this respect.
Yes, but Cecilia Bartoli is widely considered to be a soprano and, either way, could never sing Wagner. Horne is retired. DiDonato, while amazing, is a smaller mezzo. The biggest Mezzos right now are Dolora Zajick, Olga Borodina, and Stephanie Blythe. Meredith Arwady is a contralto to follow. I saw her when she was at AVA - Big Contralto!
@MrSkylark1 This back and forth is just silly. I won't respond again, but I choose to enjoy the gifts God gives singers then and now. His ability to bless people with grand gifting has not changed, and I appreciate the likes of them all.
@MrSkylark1 I know this, because I do this for a living and teach it professionally. But she is a contralto and you insinuating that she's a mezzo, but she's not. The sound of a contralto is totally different from a Mezzo's. Different timbre. That's why she sounds so magnificent in the role. But don't knock Mezzos. Cecila, Horne, even DiDonato who just won a grammy. They're out there. Just got to search for them.
😂😂😂😂 Cecila? Joyce? Horrible constricted voices with NO sound you compare with Thorberg???!!! My, you seem to be as deaf as a mole. And if you teach you are one of those who are responsible for the bad singing of today.
No hooty singing heard here. Singers of this era sang with true vowels and clarity of tone which requires far less effort in order to project the sound. Thorborg is a wonderful example of a naturally dark voice that still sang with a full sound which rang clear like a bell in all parts of the voice. It's as if people in the opera business today are intimidated by this natural, unprocessed sound.
No. It's that proper singing is deader than a doornail and has been for decades. There are virtually no teachers capable of properly training voices now, and then there is the lovely phenomenon of 'singers' screaming roles two Fachs above themselves for a few years, until they've wrecked their instruments beyond repair. Read 'The Last Prima Donnas' for the best one-volume explanation.
A CONTRALTO POWERHOUSE!!! a Wagnerian mezzo of the Golden Age, alongside of Flagstad and Melchior, with whom she appeared constantly. No small wonder. The voice all but jumps out of my headphones! Thanks for sharing!
Now, this is a REAL VOICE with proper technique!!!!!!!
Indeed!!!
What I love about this track is that it is not a pedantic singing lesson. It is a perfectly characterized portrait of Erda: hieratic, mysterious, and filled with the melancholy of millennia. The voice is the means to a dramatic end, not the end itself; and that's as it should be, especially in Wagner.
Who is this criminally underrated goddess and why have I only just stumbled across her?
I would also recommend Schumann-Heink, which had even a bigger and heavier voice: czcams.com/video/jOe3oAZJqCA/video.html
@@jiso5232 already heard it. A fine rendition by any measure, but...Thorborg just has a prettier voice.
Criminally underrated? She was a legend! She just happened to be born in 1896!
@@SilfredoSerrano
She should still be famous now. Just like Einstein, Napoleon or Aristotle
@@jiso5232 Neither 'bigger' nor 'heavier.' Schumann-Heink was of course great, as was Thorborg.
Wow! Wow! Wow! What a great singer!
Whatever beuatiful a mezzo-soprano is, it will never possess the contralto qualities so much needed to embody the image of Erda and this becomes especially clear when I hear the performance of Kerstin Thorborg. The shape, the line she provided to the "Erda's warning" is so perfect, the inside substance is so rich and majestic like the Earth.
Her vocal line and spin are perfection.
Finally Erda not a comlete bore!!!!!!!! WHy can they not get the tempis right now-adays???What a great singer!!!
The best Erda!!!
¡Ésta sí!!Una verdadera contralto para este papel!!Nada de graves entubados,de garganta y a la fuerza!Grande y hermosa voz de Kerstin!Gracias.
Pretty amazing. Especially when you consider that this is an older recording. I wonder what it would have been like in person...
It is live, she had a wonderfully expressive voice of great power and tone.
Magnificent.
Thank you for posting. I'm a RING fanatic and the small but extremely important Erda warning is always key to my full enjoyment of Rheingold. This lady was wonderful!!! I agree with previous observations that the role requires a true contralto to fully embody the qualities required in the dramaturgy. Currently there is a great Erda, the Polish contralto Ewa Podles. It is a shame the MET does not do more with her. There is a youtube clip with her singing this warning.
Podles is hooty and hollow like a watercan. Horrible singing. The Met is right not to hire her.
@@vitabella6481 I must agree, she's past her prime...but find the clip that I'm referring to. She was great.
the met has been a light voice casino since well... 1989....
Podles is one of the worst non-singers ever to wobble and shriek her way to a 'career.' And that REALLY says a lot now.
@musikenergy i agree .. she is very contalto. her voices is awesome!
@menergy
No, Thorborg KNEW how to sing. The vocal category has nothing to do with how well a
singer projects the voicer
The best!!!!!!!♥️
This is not Thorborg - it's Erda!
nicely put!
magnifica .
Perfection !
IMMORTAL!
WOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!
She was the alto Flagstad the same as when the soprano Flagstad was at her prime. What a golden Wagner age that must have been !
can you imagine going to the theatre to find those 2 voices on stage in the same night?
@@williamadolphe7921 It happened.
There are a lot of really great singers in the business today who just don't book work. Unfortunately, with the way that the market is, a director would rather book a thin singer with an ok voice than a singer with an amazing voice and big body. Not saying that is always the case, but it does cut the talent pool down.
That would be less evil, if in paralel they studio-recorded the same operas with the radio-look singers. And sometimes they should stage it with a dream team too. Shame they don't. Irreparable loss...
Thorborg was really good! Are there any full recordings of her in this role, either in Das Rheingold or Siegfried?
@MrSkylark1 I couldn't have said it better myself! Thank you.
Awesome.
Mezzos TODAY are LUDICROUS as compared to the MAGNIFICENT THORBORG
who SANG WITH BRILLIANCE unlike the HOOTY, COVERED, THROATY Mezzos today who BELIEVE that opening the MOUTH to a CAVERNOUS position will INCREASE VOLUME. The frequencies of the vibrations heard represents the Art of Singing during the Golden Era rather than the idiocy of what is heard in all the opera houses today.
Your act doesn't change much.......you who has many names.
@musikenergy
Of course the Almighty has given gifts to singers. It is they for whom compassion is given because the impresarios, conductors and vocal instructors are accoustically challenged Please listen to Anita Cerquetti - Conchita Supervia and Nezhdanova for enjoyment of the "Art" of Singing - just for starters
@MrSkylark1 She was a contralto, that's why. :-)
How true. Paul Hume, eminent critic pointed this out in 1973. The problem is that the conductors, impresarios and voice teachers are acoustically challenged.
@MrNeilsy i don't think they are intimidated, i think that no one wants to take or give the time to cultivate this sound.
Where can I find her recordings, please?
Thanks a lot, I'll check them out!
@musikenergy
Awards do not impress. The singers of the Golden Era surpass all on the operatic stage. Suggest reading Paul Hume's article 1973 on the decline of singing then. It continues.
Says a bunch of old farts
@@baritonebynight says the deaf, brainwashed young idiot.
great voice and great singing, but she was not a contralto. she was a dramatic Mezzo. her passaggio shows it clearly. Rheingold Erda is written in a vocal range which quite every female voice can sing. the color of the voice doesn't say if you are a soprano or a contralto. It are the passaggios and where the power of the voice is the biggest.
contraltissima
You also don’t hear the huge timbre change going into the the chest register that you often get from a real contralto.
It seems unique to the voice type, but the contralto voice just often doesn’t have that uniform sound through the registers that everyone seems to look for nowadays. They hear a singer like Ewa Podles and think that she is pushing down low, when that just simply isn’t the case.
The contralto really is the female equivalent of the bass voice in this respect.
Words of wisdom.
Yes, but Cecilia Bartoli is widely considered to be a soprano and, either way, could never sing Wagner. Horne is retired. DiDonato, while amazing, is a smaller mezzo. The biggest Mezzos right now are Dolora Zajick, Olga Borodina, and Stephanie Blythe. Meredith Arwady is a contralto to follow. I saw her when she was at AVA - Big Contralto!
@MrSkylark1 This back and forth is just silly. I won't respond again, but I choose to enjoy the gifts God gives singers then and now. His ability to bless people with grand gifting has not changed, and I appreciate the likes of them all.
@MrSkylark1 I know this, because I do this for a living and teach it professionally. But she is a contralto and you insinuating that she's a mezzo, but she's not. The sound of a contralto is totally different from a Mezzo's. Different timbre. That's why she sounds so magnificent in the role. But don't knock Mezzos. Cecila, Horne, even DiDonato who just won a grammy. They're out there. Just got to search for them.
😂😂😂😂 Cecila? Joyce? Horrible constricted voices with NO sound you compare with Thorberg???!!! My, you seem to be as deaf as a mole. And if you teach you are one of those who are responsible for the bad singing of today.
Pas du tout une voix de contralto.
Une mezzo!
amazing
but this is not a contralto