The pagan Emperor Julian (the apostate) criticizes Alexandrian Christians for abandoning Paganism
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- čas přidán 28. 05. 2024
- Alexandria during the later 4th Century was an intolerant place with paganism under heavy attack by Christians climaxing in 391CE with the destruction of the large temple of Serapis (the Serapeum). Julian, the last pagan Emperor several decades earlier had condemned the Alexandrians for adopting Christianity and leaving the pagan beliefs. The video discusses the change the city went through to the end of paganism.
Movie clips are from Agora released 2009
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CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction
02:38 The Growing Intolerance In Alexandria
07:14 Intolerance of the Christain Patriarchs
11:24 The Christian monks and the Parabalani
12:37 The attack on the Serapeum
13:38 The murder of the pagan philospher Hypatia
14:31 Julian on Christianity
17:37 Julian castigates the Alexandrian Christians
25:58 The Islamic conquest of Alexandria
Images used
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Julius Kronberg, Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons
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Constantine Plakidas, CC BY-SA 4.0
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Ted, CC BY-SA 2.0
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Institute for the Study of the Ancient World, CC BY 2.0
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I am a Huge Fan of your content. You cover the fall of the glorious Graeco-Roman Civilisation to these vile cults, beautifully. I and many others couldn't possibly thank you enough.
Thank you Vineet. Stick around there's plenty more content in the pipeline :)
When you strip away all the bullshit about love and acceptance from Christianity, it really is just a mental illness almost. It's like a co dependent abusive relationship between a man and woman for instance.. "I only hit you because I love you!". And she justifies it, "He really is a great guy and he loves me. He just gets carried away. He's going to change.".
God makes us, but makes us sinners. No matter what we are feeble fucked up sinners falling short of God's glory. Yet he loves us. So much he comes to earth as a Jewish man and speaks a handful of metaphors about being a door and meek will inherit the earth... And this is all God says. God. Then gets killed.
Now everything God said before in the old testament changes. God changed his mind. Jesus never said anything like that, but that's Christian doctrine now. New covenant.
God makes us this way. Exterminated us to the brink of extinction for being that way. We are all damned because of what eve and Adam did, which he knew in advance they would do, and we must live in worship of this being for his abundant love. No matter what happens in life, good bad or catastrophic, it's God's plan. Because he loves us.
Or, is it all we have to do is believe the story of Jesus, that will get us to heaven, right Christians? Oh how convenient. God makes this plane of existence, as a testing ground... Then another "divine" realm for only the people who passed the rest. And the test was, did you live in sin or not? Some test.. Especially when you design the test subjects, out of love, as sinners inheritly.
And the test according to new Christians is just a faith in a story. Do you believe Jesus was god and died for your sins? Then you're in. So the test that determines where you will be for eternity is how naive you are. How little evidence you need for something.
It's all one giant manipulative mess. And this appeals to people somehow. They want to be submissive to some bizarre god who had the dumbest plan ever for spreading his presence on earth.. Wtf what a twisted mindset.
Just believing you're a sinner and that constant guilt.. It changed us. The once proud and noble European spirit was completely dulled by this Abrahamic mental illness from Israel.
Religions are created by local populations naturally arising from that groups inherit traits. After hundreds of millenia of evolution arises behaviors, traditions, culture, unique to that people.
Adopting someone else's religion is like taking someone else's medicine. It was designed for a completely different person.
How did we go from worshipping nature in sacred groves, believing in the divine connection between man and woman, to getting together once a week in a building and throwing money into a pot to listen to someone else explain to us what God is. Because apparently God only chooses certain people to teach us about him. Only preachers are capable of interpreting the Bible correctly and we need to go see him once a week.
It's just all so stupid. I'm not a pagan, I don't worship saturn or Thor and I don't think we need to go back to slaughtering animals at altars either.
But I do admire certain aspects of paganism. Mainly the view of nature and natural law, the idea that man and woman are incomplete but when they come together they are whole.
The Christian doctrine seems to make people think they are separate from nature. Better than nature. In fact, it's here simply to serve us.
It's just a coincidence we have so much in common with so many animals. Not evolution that we have the same organs as most other animals. The same method of producing energy. God just has no creativity.
I am a huge fan of emperor Julian since I am 17 years old and it's awesome to finally see good content about him on youtube. For me, roman empire faced an early kind of bolchevism and people who tried to prevent that disaster deserve all our respect.
Thx for the watch! I'll be producing more on Julian in doing months!
Google Bolshevism
One should see Julian's letters to Alexandria for what they are in essence- state propaganda to counter the new Christian propaganda re-shaping Hellene society and civilization.
I agree. Julian is quite a tragic figure. He was wise and virtuous, and did his best to restore the Empire, but so much damage had already been done. It's interesting to think about what might have happened if he had not died so soon.
@julianshepherd2038 You are so kind, but saying christianity is an antic prequel of bolshevism is an idea of Oswald Spengler. Maybe you should write a book to explain he was wrong :o)
As a fellow admirer of Julian's works, I congratulate you for your video and definitely will check the rest of the content. Also, you've got yourself a new subscriber. Well done!
Awesome, thanks for the sub! Hoping to do one on Julian's death shortly.
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361 Will be looking forward to it!
To say that I dislike those fanatical priestly types would be the understatement of the year. And "the black-robe tribe" will be my way of referring to them.
Egypt in the 4th and 5th Centuries had more than its fair share of these chaps I'm afraid. Thx for watching!
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361 And they are still around in different forms! XD
I swear there should be a pagan revival !
Thank you so much for videos like these. I’ve always wanted to know more about the ancient world and your channel has helped. The amount of rich detail you put in your videos in amazing. Again, thank you so much.
Glad you liked them! Appreciate you watching!
As always the best,thank you for the video.
My pleasure! Thanks for watching!
So glad to have found you
Thank you!Another video next week. Just finishing it off!
I am always studying religious history in this time. I am enthralled, and your videos are amazing. Though my undergrad work was in anthropology, I spent little time in school studying this time period. These videos are fairly well sourced considering the medium and seem to offer a fair and concise representation of history. But never failing to add anecdotal accounts for my entertainment as well as education!
Thx you my friend! Glad the videos are proving interesting. Appreciate the feedback!
Ave Divus Julianus!
24:18 Based Julian. 😅
Great job! I love your movies and learning a lot from them, thank you!
Thx Nathan! Working on the next one as I type!
I just found your channel, I love it so far, but I am curious as to what inspired you to study Lord Julian the Philosopher?
Glad you like the videos Tyler! Any philosopher Emperor is the height of coolnesss I would say. Always admired Julian and of course Marcus Aurelius, Hadrian, the Antonines etc. Julian was the last pagan ruler so he is of course very special!
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361 are you Pagan yourself?
Just finished listening to Justin Pollard's Rise And Fall Of Alexandria right here on the 'Tube. Excellent book!
Can’t say I’ve read that one. It’s on my ‘to be read’ list!
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361 Check out the audiobook, it's intensely habit forming lol. I finished it in two days.
@@Gorboduc Im a little 'old school' - prefer books! - but this might be an excuse to try out Audible. Thanks for flagging that up
Thank you..
You're welcome!
Absolutely remarkable video. I thank you for the use of primary sources!
Appreciate the comment! Thx! Will be doing more on Alexandrian Pagan/Christian relations in future.
The Perfidious Censors of The Rabbinate won't even allow insignificant me to so much as type "yehud".
Your channel is incredible man!
Thank you so much 😀 More videos coming up!
Excellect content as always.
Many thx!
St Athanasius truly was one of the most remarkable figures of the Constantinian era since, in the words of famously acerbic Edward Gibbon, this "Archbishop of Alexandria was patient of labour, jealous of fame, careless of safety; and although his mind was tainted by the contagion of fanaticism, Athanasius displayed a superiority of character and abilities which would have qualified him, far better than the degenerate sons of Constantine, for the government of a great monarchy". High praise indeed.
He certainly had character to last so long and was very popular with the Alexandrian Christians. Talking of Athanasius would love to do a video on his views on Arians. I'll put that on the to-do list!
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361 His earlier work 'Against the Heathen' is truly quite fascinating.
No, the Jewish Law was meant to be obeyed by the Jews. Where do you get the idea that Christians abandoned this in order to make more converts from the Pagans? In the Book of Acts it is described how the Apostles argued and came to agree that Jesus was the fulfillment of the law and that it was no longer necessary for non-Jews to follow it. They came to see it was faith in Jesus Christ that brought salvation, not obeying the Jewish Law. This was about three centuries before the events on your tape played out. If your assertion is your own opinion then you should say it as such and not make it sound as if it is simply a matter of history. Otherwise, l find your work interesting in illuminating a turbulent period seldom played out in film or print. I also detect a strong bias in who you quote and how you tell the story. Yet, how can one defend bigotry, intolerance, vandalism, and even murder? I can't.
Great video❤
Thx for watching!
👍👍👍Excelent video, Excelent channel!!
Appreciate you watching :)
The Most sad time in spiritual history
Unfortunate that Julian never managed to show his potential. He met a warrior's end though - perhaps that's the way he would have liked to go out. Appreciate the watch!
A sad time if you were part of the ruling Pagan elite classes. Social movements (back then- socio-religious) don't come out of nowhere.
@@juniorjames7076 lol ruling pagan elite class , most people were not Christian until it became zealous and demonized the local religions and philosophies by spreading fear saying they will go to hell for eternity because they worshipped the gods, that was the Christian social movement , sounds like an ignorant insecure and narcissistic religion , it is a sad part of history in the western world, the philosophies and religions were developing but Christianity stopped it
A very interesting video; thank you for posting. Dogmatism has been a pernicious force throughout history; being perhaps the worst affliction of mankind.
Appreciate you watching! I'll be doing more on the Emperor Julian in the coming months. Regarding dogma, quite so. There was a huge divide between Arian and 'Catholic' Christians at the time not to mention the numerous other Christian 'heresies'.
I look forward to learning more about this topic - do you have any references you'd recommend?@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361
Awsome
Thanks for watching!
no links available...
Why was there no mention of how Stoic philosophy and Logos theology and philosophy from the pagans and how it influenced and guided the Christians? Did Julian did not know about this?
What if any stoic influence - great subject for a future video actually. That's got me thinking! Thx.
If only these fanatic monks had been present in Egypt during the islamic invasion, Egypt may had never been conquered by muslims
John of Nikiu, the seventh century bishop, is worth reading regarding the Muslim conquest of Egypt
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361 Thank you. I have already read some brief quotes from him after watching your video. Do you know of more sources on th Islamic conquest of the middle east, both muslim and non-muslim? I read the third tome of Edward Gibbons decline and fall of the roman empire. He covers this, but briefly
@@humanistlaicist2226 Hi, You could try Al-Baladhuri - he's one of the best Arab sources on the early Arab conquests although no idea why it's this expensive
www.amazon.co.uk/History-Arab-Invasions-Translation-al-Baladhuris-ebook/dp/B0BCKV8G4H/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2NDYUWZTYIQGL&keywords=al-baladhuri&qid=1687973677&sprefix=al-baladhuri%2Caps%2C86&sr=8-1
www.amazon.co.uk/Anni-Mundi-6095-6305-D-602-813-Theophanes/dp/0812278429/ref=sr_1_1?crid=PSSRK5ENJLI3&keywords=chronicle+of+theophanes&qid=1687974205&sprefix=chronicle+of+theophanes%2Caps%2C76&sr=8-1
While it's nice(or could have been nice) to get a big budget movie set in late antiquity, and it's true that Agora is good and well made, with a captivating story, calling it factually based is a bit absurd. Bishops didn't run the city, nor did a mob destroy the library of Alexandria, nor did Hypatia discover heliocentrism. The movie seems to be based on a narrative of Carl Sagan from his episode on Hypatia, rather than any original sources from the period.
The Sarapaeum or at least part of it was demolished on the order of the emperor because it was being used as a rebel stronghold. It was basically civil war in the streets and a stand off had resulted. The whole incident was begun by some neo-platonists assaulting or killing someone.
Thx for the comment Christus. Agora was a reasonably large budget movie although modest by blockbuster standards and with a good set of actors and good sets. It's factually based - however being a movie (rather than a documentary) - there is I suppose a necessary and large amount of artistic licence to keep the entertainment level up. That said Cyril the bishop of Alexandria and other high level clergy (Eusebius for instance with Constantine) had been having an inordinate amount of power for some time. The secular authorities could (and did ) little too to stop bands of roving Christian monks destroying pagan temples in Egypt. Yes it's true the Serapeum was ordered to be destroyed by the intolerant and quite zealous emperor Theodosius. However its also true that many other temples had already been destroyed before this by the Christian authorities with Cyril and his predecessor Theophilus being heavily anti-pagan being complicit in these activities
"Hellenic culture"? By that time, wasn't it Roman culture?
Partly although the eastern Mediterranean was always heavily Greek in character, culture and customs and even during the Roman period. So much so that the Byzantine Empire switched to Greek from Latin early on
Scripture never told them to be rioters.
But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters.
Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.
I'm guessing the Alexandrian Christians would point to the clear instruction from the biblical god in Exodus 22:20 which would trump Peter.
@@FlaviusClaudiusJulianus361
God, in setting up a theocracy in Israel gives them certain laws as to how to deal with evildoers. A physical earthly kingdom.
Which kingdom did not exist during Julian’s reign. Who, though a pagan, ought to have been respected, as Christ taught us to respect Caesar in those things pertaining to Caesar. Whose laws and customs ought to have been respected inasmuch as they did not force us to sin. Which he didn’t. I guess Christians have done more harm to the cause of Christ than any pagan emperor could.
Black robs, destruction, hatred? Sounds very familiar.
Afraid so! Some things don't change. Thx for watching.
¡Viva CRISTO REY!