Debunking The Myth: Counter Steering At Low Speeds
Vložit
- čas přidán 9. 03. 2024
- ❤️ Follow Me On Instagram: / motojitsuclub
🔥 Download My MotoJitsu App (App Store): apps.apple.com/ca/app/motojit...
🔥 Download My MotoJitsu App (Google Play): play.google.com/store/apps/de...
➡️ Join My Channel For Early Access To Videos, Member-Only Live Chats, etc. / @motojitsu
❤️ Subscribe: / motojitsu
🎯 MotoJitsu's Affiliate Links:
💧 20% Off Liquid I.V. Code "MOTOJITSUCLUB" www.liquid-iv.com/collections...
🏍️ 10% Off Chin Mounts Code "MOTOJITSU" chinmounts.com/?ref=motojitsu
👕 Shop On Revzilla: www.revzilla.com/?irclickid=V...
🧰 5% Off BT-Moto Code "MotoJitsu" bt-moto.com/
🧤 My Riding Gloves - Sumo's leeparksdesign.com/?ref=djmk0...
💛 All My Riding Gear: www.motojitsu.com/gear
💙 Support The Channel On Patreon: / motojitsu
💙 Pick Up My Books: www.amazon.com/Greg-Widmar/e/...)
💙 MotoJitsu Merch: fast-eddie-gear.creator-sprin...
🏍️ Riding Courses www.motojitsu.com/courses
📩 Questions? www.motojitsu.com/contact
💯 Ride at your own risk. MotoJitsu® disclaims any liability incurred in connection with the use of the concepts outlined on this channel/app/books/videos, etc. You alone are responsible for your own safety. - Auta a dopravní prostředky
GO TRY THIS OUT FOR YOURSELF!!!! MotoJitsu.com for all my crap
Direct steerers are the flat earthers of the motorcycle world.
maybe they should go on an around the world cruise with the flat earthers 🤣🤣
3:34 he turned without counter steering😂
@@slimfit767watch again. He actually pulls first to initiate the turn
@@slimfit767 Then you dont know what counter steering is. I feel like these videos just complicate things and confuse ppl. Watch "Most People Don't Know How Bikes Work' by veritasium - it doesnt get clearer than that.
So what if the earth is flat, I don't think it matters.
FOR PEOPLE WHO STILL HAVE DOUBT Veritasium (a well known CZcamsr) created an amazing well explained video about counter steering using a bicycle and proves that counter steering is necessary to steer a bicycle. This would apply to a motorcycle as well. Highly recommend watching the video to anyone.
Brilliant example. Riding bicycles as a kid gave me a feeling for counter steering, but I had no idea what I was actually doing until I started riding motorcycles years later.
Twist of the wrist!
I am still surprised when somebody tries, and fails horribly, to argument counter steering doesn't work at low speeds or that there's even an alternative to it at any speed.
I did u-turns for 3 hours yesterday. Ran into random dude that also rides. He was playing with his new drone. Ended up filming me for 20 minutes, and we gonna go ride when rain stops.
The thing that tricks most people into believing that they "just lean" is that the motorcycles are designed in a way that by shifting the weight they will also cause the rider to unknowingly slightly push the handlebar on the side that they want to lean in, thus initiating the steer. however it is very important to realise for people safety that this is very inefficient and could be too slow in emergency situation. Great video.
Mathematically, it is unlikely that "Direct steering" and Counter Steering work at respectively low and high speed. Because that would mean that there is a speed such that both or neither work and whatever input you would make, the bike wouldn't change direction.
phase change is a phenomenon that do exist, where a system's behavior change suddenly after a critical point. well with that being said, it's not the case for bike steering.
That point would be loss of traction
I want that on a shirt "guess what causes a bike to lean....counter steering" got into an epic debate with my partner whos been riding for many years about counter steering. I've only been riding a few months so he thinks i dont know anything. Finally, I sent him one of your video about it and dont talk to me about it until you've watched it. I haven't heard anything back from him on the topic 😅
"Dont talk to me until you watch it" i hope he dumps you and you are alone forever because thats is what you deserve :)
@@bobsacamano5639there is no other steering except counter steering. People who think there is "usual" steering are very inattentive riders.
@bob your 1 and 3 are a contradiction...
At that point I stopped reading!
One thing I learned in my life. If I learn to do something and it works, I just keep doing it. If I can improve it, I'll do it. And if someone tries to get me into a debate, to convince me that the way I am doing it is wrong, just because he says so, I would not get involved.
So, that dude has different opinions about countersteering. OK. You used it, practice it, and see that it works. Then use it, practice further, and let your partner believe what he wants. Don't waste your time and energy trying to convince him you're right. But, if the way you steer works, don't let him impose his opinion and methods on you. Let him talk. We have a saying about this kind of things: "The dogs are barking, the carriage is passing"...
@1zanglang my partner is the one who kept pushing the topic. I sent the video and told him to watch it and get back to me. I'm a pretty easygoing individual who's willing to just let things go if it doesn't directly affect my or my children's safety.
This is a great explanation, but it's weird to me that anyone needs this explained. Was I the only one who rode a bicycle as a kid?
The problem is that just feeling it isn't enough. Some people do it instinctively but since they don't really understand the dynamics at play they can't take it further and test the limits of how this works, so then end up not using it properly when needed.
I have ridden bicycle a lot, like really a lot, but just after passing my motorcycle licence and having 1 week break, my brain somehow thought it can just turn at runabout, because my speed was slow and I was not planning to lean a bike. I got a bit into trouble, but there were no other traffic, so all went fine.
While keeping equilibrium and stuff transfer directly to a degree, but brains sometimes do weird stuff and do not transfer all skills directly. The feel how much to push to lean, what the lean angle is acceptable, all of that is different on a motorcycle. It's like using a clutch. At first it's very hard, but then you get used to it. Then you go to a petrol car instead of diesel and clutch becomes hard again. Of course, after a lot of kilometers, one can very quickly change cars and adjust to clutch. But it took quite a lot of practice despite already having learned the skill! The same is here. Bicycle and motorcycle uses the same principles, but it requires quite a different handling.
Counter steering is what we were doing the moment Dad ditched the training wheels on our bicycles. Understanding that and how to consciously manage it, is what we're doing (practicing)now to become better riders. Great video as always. Hoo-yah!
I've always understood the concept of counter steering, but I see it in action better in this video than I've ever seen it in any other video... Nice.
10:25 For me, this is the most accurate way to explain WHAT is Counter Steering!! Period.
Now blow their minds even further by showing that you can make a turn even tighter by counter steering. Yes, while you're leaned into a sweeping turn, you can counter steer again and make the turn sharper. Counter steering is also how you get out of a cornering lean too. It always works. It even works at duck-walking speeds.
Direct steering only works when duck walking, and that keeps the bike upright, which also means your turning radius is like 500 feet wide, and if you waddle too hard, you'll still fall over in the opposite direction of the direction you have the wheel turned.
You can turn with out counter steering at slow speed you just have to lean with your weight instead of using the handle bars to lean the bike over. I do it all the time in parking lots. You just have to lean your weight to the direction you want to go and the bike will turn that direction including handlebars without going the other way first. I agree completely about destabilizing but you can steer a bike with out even touching the handlebars which i also do all the time for fun on twisty roads and by leaning im destabilizing the bike and bikes naturally want to stabilize so it will turn in the direction im leaning with out counter steering. Just want to be clear that im not saying counter steering doesnt exist or somthing im just saying its possible to steer a bike by strictly leaning with your weight and not even touching the handlebars.
LOL
And how do you get the bike to lean? You countersteer.
Love the video content showing your verbal commentary. Excellent
After a 30 year break from riding I took the BMW riding school. Lots of good basic training but the counter steer deal got folks tied up in knots, and to be honest I was confused at lecture. I just turn...like I did 30 years ago and the bike follows my input...it's kinda of instinctive to me. I bought a 2013 Moto guzzi for basic training, (its rather bohemian) but just bought a BMW r1250r (2023) and the difference is like driving a Model A ford then jumping into a new BMW M2...I love the bike. Thanks for the video.
Great video bro 👊🏽 I love the “ Figure it out “ one you did a while back about how you had to sell your truck and your dirt bike and got an Uber the same day so you could make money 💰, a great life lesson for anyone…”figure it out “ Awesome 👍🏾
Thanks for your great videos.
Countersteering is also a well known technique for mountain biking (and can be used on any other bike too) and of course works below 15 mph.
its the ONLY way to steer any two wheeled vehicle
@@Salmon-wl7urexactly. Saying it "can be used" implies there is another way to turn. There isn't. Countersteering is the way motorcycles and bicycles turn, not a technique
But on a bicycle I can ride and turn in both directions with no hands because my weight is much greater than the bikes, there is less centrifugal force from the wheels and with the greater comparative mass I have and higher center of gravity I can get the tyre's to lean over and the front wheel will respond to my weight change as if I were counter steering.@@Salmon-wl7ur
Ok. I almost completely agree.
But how do you explain that a motorcycle can be driven without hands on the handlebars just by tilting the body (moving the center of mass) in the desired direction to turn? I imagine that, in addition to counter steering, there must be other ways of turning, even if less efficient. Right?
Nope, wrong. Even if you’re keeping your hands off the bars, using your legs to “lean” will induce a push in the bar in the direction you’re leaning, even if it’s inefficient. And more than likely you’re using the handlebar to stabilize yourself which also pushes the bar in the direction you’re trying to lean. Gyroscopic forces make this exponentially harder to do the faster you’re going; the turning of the wheels creates a force that acts like a bar through the center of the wheel. The faster you’re moving, the longer that bar is. You can ONLY lean the bike by pushing the handlebar in the direction you’re trying to go. Period, end of.
@@ajc-ff5cm I have just checked on my maxi scooter where I can not use legs to induce anything as there is nothing to make force with legs.
If I move my bottom to the right (hands free), moving the center of mass to the right, and creating an unstable condition, the handlebar turns automatically right, seeking for equilibrium and the bike turns right.
It is slow and the trajectory not well controlled, probably due to lack of training, but it turns right without counter steering.
The same to the left... and so on.
This is the law of physics: if the center of mass is outside the equilibrium base, the body will fall when under gravity. Due to the geometry (camber) of the front wheel, the bike will try to recuperate automatically the equilibrium. This is the same reason that explains the counter steering. You induce an unstable dynamic condition by moving the handlebar, but keeping the centre of mass at the same position. Then the bike will seek for equilibrium.
Same law of physics, different way to use it.
For sure at high speeds it is too slow in order to get a correct and sure path and the dynamic momentum ends up canceling the imbalance caused by the displacement of the center of mass.
First of all you don't drive a motorcycle you ride it. Second of all yes you can get the bite to turn just by leaning your upper body or changing the center of Mass on the bike to where the left side or right side of the bike has more mass than the center which forces the bike to lean in that direction depending on the amount of weight and mass you extend and how far out of that weight you extend to the left and right sides of the bike which will determine how far is but still it takes more effort to make a bite turn like this the same turning radius then you would a single finger pushing or pulling depending on which handlebar you are pushing and pulling versus which direction in the end you try to go
Just stop worrying about arguing about such a pointless argument use counter staring and you will realize how much more sense it makes to use that method. Also good luck avoiding a car pulling out in front of you that half-ass stops right in your lane by simply trying to lean your bike with your body especially at higher speeds such as 35 Plus miles an hour without counter steering to Swerve
Do people not remember as a kid riding a bicycle when you leaned your bike you were actually counter-steering ...
Even tho i just watched the FortNine video from a month ago on the same topic : can't have enough videos promoting the truth. Also it's a joy watching a good countersteering video every single time 👍
ps on why it matters to know this: security imo. Those who say "i just lean" are the ones who have a higher probability to crash after they stiffen all up on a scary situation and suddenly all that "leaning" doesn't work anymore, cause they're stiff as a board and don't know the PHYSICS that can make the bike lean even when you can't unconciously countersteer by "leaning" anymore. Those fellas are the ones telling you after their crash that something was wrong with the bike because they just couldn't get it down leaning anymore. Then suddenly it's the "heavy" machine's fault or some other bs, just because their brain wasn't trained to conciously KNOW how to use the vehicles geometry to control it. IMO that's the first and best reason why it's mandatory to KNOW how it works: so you can apply KNOWLEDGE in a tight situation, when your FEELINGS don't work anymore.
Counter steering works even from a stop. If you start out with counter steering input, the bike will lean itself over immediately. It lets you do really tight turns from a stop.
My right turns from a stop always went wide. I’d straighten out and l could not figure out why since “direct steering is supposed to work under 15 mph.” It doesn’t. You have to turn right from at the stop and then push right as you go. That was my learning in my first season.
If you're trying to do a sharp left turn from a dead stop here are the steps.
1. Right foot weight on right foot Peg. And have thr bike lean left by a pretty good bit..again..PURPOSEFUL right foot weight.
2. Full turn lock on handlebars to the left.
3. Rev thr throttle to 25 percent ish and hold it there ( for thr first 5 attempts do NOT lower your throttle percentage until you have completed the turn and are going in the direction opposite to wherever you were facing when you were parked.
4. Friction zone...find that precise point in which the bike barely even feels like it's nudging forward and keep it barely barely a nanometer before that Mark
Now the trick is keeping that throttle amount the same and force trying to keep that full turn lock going as your bike is leaned while slowly letting out the clutch
You will count to either 2 1/2 or four full seconds from the exact moment you begin moving to the moment you have completed the full U-turn as far as the amount of speed or slowness of letting out your clutch
For your bike this may be an experimentation exercise as far as the amount of time or how slowly you let out that clutch versus maintaining that exact throttle speed and trying to keep a full turn lock going to keep The Balancing Act of keeping proper lean angle but not falling over completely and falling off the bike
Do not feel bad if it takes you to and a half or three widths of parking spaces starting off the first 8 to 10 times you do this in practice in an empty parking lot
Eventually you'll start picking up on your body and the math of it and you'll start learning either a little more lean angle to do all the same figures or you're leaning angles fine and you have to adjust other figures such as being a little more slow in releasing the the clutch or perhaps only more throttle speed or less throttle speed as far as keeping the throttle speed the same or may be starting off at a slightly lower percentage of throttle speed
It took me a little bit to learn the correct formula for my cb500x as I'm 5 ft 9 and I'm not your normal very strong 6-ft plus tall size guy
But after a good 15 20 times of practice I finally got to the point to where I can do a U-turn dead stop within most consistently between 18 ft and 15 ft
How about a good week later I was able to do it within 12 ft but that's hard I'm not going to lie at least in my opinion for me
When obtaining a MC drivers license in sweden, there is a slow (not ”slow” as in most parkinglot vids on the tube- but really slow….)speed test that has a maximum speed of 4 mph, optimum 3mph (5 kph). Steep turns, no rear brake- all clutch control and balance.
When doing Sharp turns at that kind of speed, it really helps to think about the rake and lean the bike to the right direction- knees firmly against the tank.
Excellent commentary and demonstration of steering a bike , what I’ve never really heard much about is adding more counter steering to increase the lean / decrease the radius of the turn. Can we please have a comment / video on that 😃
I would be interested in this too. @motojitsu has discussed on other vids that if you keep pushing lean angle will keep on increasing until it falls over. However, what about when you have reached your ideal lean angle - do you just hold the handle bars with neutral pressure? Do you just counter act any force/pushback coming from the the steering? What about returning the bike to standing? Counter steer or just remove all force on the bars? Would be great to have a video about all of this.
If you achieved a certain lean angle at any speed using counter steering (or however actually), letting go and not changing speed will keep you at the same lean angle, as no extra inputs are happening and all variables are not changing really. You push until you achieve a certain lean, then let go. In practice this is less linear that it sounds as at some point you go from a forced steering position to the wheel actually falling in place. Don't think of this as a single action but hundreds of small inputs happening every second. You are pushing and the wheel is constantly setting into place, constantly.
If you keep the pressure the bike will keep leaning, with a faster press achieving a quicker result which will eventually end with both you and your bike on the ground very likely.
To remove lean angle and straighten the bike you do the opposite, counter steer the other way. Also accelerating will prompt the bike to stand up, that's why you need to lean more to have the same turning radius at faster speeds, within reason as there's a lean limit.
The clearest demonstration of the effect I have seen. Very, very good. Thank you.
I never understood why people say that counter steering doesn’t work below 15 mph. Why would they say wrong things that are so easy to test?
That’s what is good in your channel, you test it and show it so there’s no doubt.
It works but at such slow speeds its not necessary
@@slimfit767it's the only way to turn so it is necessary. If you don't countersteer you're going straight
@@bobsacamano5639the bike still countersteers to get to that lean
Great video mate, that explains it well. I only just discovered your channel. As a recently qualified instructor with an already established CZcams channel, I've thought about making videos like this. But you've got it all sorted already!
Glad to see you've made a video on this. I've had riders argue with me on this before, saying I'm wrong. And it's always baffled me how this was ever a myth since it's so easily disproved 🤣
my instructor mentioned your channel as a great source to watch, hear a lot of the same tips and phrases
Best video I’ve seen on counter-steering. Thank you.
Semper Fi! No wonder I’m able to learn so well from you!
My first bike, in 7th grade, was a BMW R68. I learned to counter steer on that bike. In 9th grade I took over the payments on a Kawasaki KZ1300, that bike did not adhere to the norms of counter steering at, or under, parking lot speeds, anything above that, yeah, you counter steered it. I laughed the first time I rode it, wanted to turn left out of the driveway, so I pushed left, the bike went right, haha. That bike did weigh 700 lbs though.
keep practicing
instagram.com/motojitsuclub/
Good to see this in practice, Ive always thought of it as pushing down rather than straight ahead. I guess its because I expect the bike to lean over hence moving downwards into the corner. Anyway it works for me in my head.
Thanks for this, now I can visually explain this to my friends :D
Thanks you made me understand counter steering and now I have started experimenting with it.
Thank you for the $2.64
I am a new rider I ain't especially young and you made me understand how to countersteer and I realized that I didn't understand the basis . Hope to use it at my driving school next week I am aiming to buy a low cc (125) to start learning.(You only need 6 hours of driving when you have a two years old driving licence in France to ride up to 125cc) I think that I am going to invest in classes to be safe. I am also going to practice drills as much as I can in parking lot, thanks to you.
glad to hear it!
The reason for this video is to avoid a situation I had. I had passed my riding licence only recently in UK (this was 9 years ago). I had a week of non-riding and I went for a ride. At the first runabout my brain malfunctioned, because I was not taught that counter-steering is the only way! I was going slow and not planning to do any leaning. I tried to turn my handle bars, but it was making my bike to turn the wrong direction, I started to panic. Luckily there were no cars and enough space, I managed to exit the runabout. At the next runabout, after this, I intuitively knew what to try and it worked. And that's how I learned that counter steering is the only way.
For people who had been riding many years, this information probably useless as they will do it automatically no matter what, but for new riders like me 9 years ago, knowing this would have been useful.
I have been riding for 3 days. Sometimes, in between my practice session while turning (slow) I'd feel my body moving away from the direction of my turn, i was confused. But now i understand that it was trying to counter steer and i was just forcing the handle
I found this out while playing around. I was like 😮,that's not what I was shown. Playing around supper slow trying to simulate crawling traffic.
I am glad I am on the right track.
Thanks for clearing that up for us👍🤙🇨🇦😊
Playing around is my practice. It's just practice sounds like a choir. Playing sou ds li,e fun😊
The simplest of things are often the most difficult for us to get our head around apparently. Lol. Great demonstration.
I never liked the term counter steering. Push/pull makes more sense- if you want to go right you push on the right bar, you can also pull on the left at the same time, to get it to lean quicker and harder, when you want to straighten out push on the left, pull on right same time. Also helps to apply pressure on the inside footpeg ( peg side your making the turn)
Good Demo!
My husband tried to explain this to me and I didn't understand, this is a great visual thanks!
No worries buddy, in two weeks from now you will have to another push and pull to lean and turn video...🤣🤣Ah, in the end, keeps the bank account rolling, that's the most important thing!😂😂😂Have a good one Greg!
Let's see you ride a unicycle. Mr. Perfect! Great video I appreciate what you do and what you did thank you!!
if you haven't already can you do a video on the counter steering on slaloms. The pushing and pulling pressure on weaving fast?
People who disagree need to go out and try it.
Hi Greg, As future beginner, on moto school we learned to steer only body steering. Street exam in 2 weeks. I watch all videos of yours and others, about counter steering. But, is missing something. As you say: "...take out lean is proportional with acceleration... fast or slow". But how you take out leaning to be straight ? Maybe you can make an video about that, as i can't find anywhere. Regards.
You take out lean to be straight by not pushing on the handlebar anymore.
The best video for counter steering.Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
I'm going out to do this for my next upload. Because I did a video countersteering on a bicycle right before I got my motorbike to prove to myself that the technique works. So I'm going to go out and see how slowly I can putt along on my 125cc because even I've had numbskulls in my comments saying it only works at speed. Maybe I'll even go and do it on gravel
Nice one with turning with the mirror 👍
You are so helpful man 🎉🎉🎉
Honestly, I do not understand these "direct steerers" and their stubbornness to accept such a simple concept as counter steering. If you ever rode a bicycle, you used counter steering. Simply, as Greg and many others said, there is no other way. Why are we still even talking about this?
You actually can direct steer by pulling incredibly slow at slower speed
I feel like an idiot. Granted I just got a bike, but even riding dirt bikes growing up I never knew this was happening. I always just "leaned." I've been struggling so hard with cornering smoothly, and seeing it presented like this.... I feel like a jackass.... but in all seriousness thank you 😂
Think it works easier just using one hand, read it in Lee parks book, that way I think it’s easier for the bars to turn in the direction you want to go after steering
How well do this work for mini circuits? those cones exercises
Greetings the UK. The channel is excellent. Great explanation
‼️ Sir I think this is the one ‼️
Why why why
Has it never been shown like this.
🙏❤️ Love from Scotland ❤️🙏
Back on a BMW again? Is this the best bike since sliced bread; this week?
Counter steering is magical once you become aware of push right to go right... push left to go left. I'm 66 years old and toss my old 1970 Electra Glide around with ease
My biggest part is getting past my brain just do things unclear how doing. If i think too much do worse. My brain hears counter thinks opposite ie keeping bike in comtrol in wind or not leaning in much. Thinking about in car if rear end sliding out turning wheel in opposite direction of turn unless rotated too much.
You can’t argue with the laws of physics
It does work!!!
Awsome vid as usual sir. My gf was watching in disbelief as she is not a motorcyclist. Which leads to one question, as I could not technically explain to her. After initial counter steer or tip in. How is angle increased, or how do you turn more sharply (decrease circle radius) while leaning? Is "right to go right" pressure applied, to turn more sharply?
I've been riding for some years, and understand basic countersteering. But, couldn't logically explain what the steps are.
angle is increased the same way it is initiated.
🙏❤️ Love from Scotland 🙏❤️
Be interesting to see how much the tire profile contributes to that lean?
F9 has a video where he put tires without rounded edges. It's also about counter steering. Yes, tires do matter. But at the same time, no one would ever put tires without sides rounded on a motorcycle anyway outside experiments.
This is exactly physics, Newton first law of motion, a body in motion stays in motion. When pushing left turns the bike right for an instant, however you still want to move forwards therefore the force shifts the motion of the bike to the left and the wheel falls into place (or something like that), but I understand it perfectly. It does seem counterintuitive but anyone who knows how to ride a bicycle knows how to counter steer.
100% 🙌🤘
It will always work down to just above 0 mph, it's just that at slow speeds, humans are more reactive, and counter the counter steering effect, by shifting around or leaning the bike. But with a perfectly rigid rider perfectly balancing, the counter steering will always be present, because physics.
Absolutely, if you keep your body straight and turn forcefully on a slow bike while turning, your body will try to lean in the other direction
Great video as always Greg. Just a question - Is it a push or pull? By the looks - it looks like a Pull . Answer please. As a beginner rider have learned a lot from your videos. Thanks for all your hard work. Keep it up.
Whether you push, pull, or both is a matter of personal preference and possibly how much pressure you need to apply when changing directions quickly. The common explanation is to push forward on the right-hand grip to make the bike lean to the right. You can also achieve the same thing by pulling back on the left-hand grip. So, what you are actually doing is turning the bars slightly in the opposite direction to the way you want the bike to lean. I hope this helps.
Bruce hatcher is correct ... and I'll add once you start becoming more familiar and comfortable with Basics then as you start challenging yourself to complete the motojitsu courses you will find that if you more dedicate your right hand to the throttle control only and your left hand to doing all the steering be it pull to go right or push left to go left you might find it more intuitive to have more control over the bike using just your left hand for steering this way when you're having to do tight turns such as hardcore tight u-turns then your right hand only has to think about throttle control and your left hand does the clutch and steering
Ohhh, so you can pull left instead of pushing right. That fixes my problem, cause when i push right, my hand accidentally turns on the gas😅
And pulling left helped me with right u turns. Damn I have been dropping my scrambler 400 doing u turns. The dreaded right u turns..!😅
Great video, you would think everyone got it now, but let's see ;)
What about body positioning once you’ve engaged the counter steer? Do you lean in or stay more upright? Am a beginner rider
No need to worry about body position for a beginner rider. Just stay neutral and push forward in the direction you want to go and focus on the basics, vision, throttle control, brakes and counter steering. Get into more in person courses once you have a few thousand miles MotoJitsu.com/courses
0:24 In the slow motion clips, you can see the bars turn left, the bike lean right, THEN the bars turn right. Interesting. The bars follow the lean post counter steer.
The front wheel always turns in the direction the bike is falling. Given trail, it can't do otherwise.
Castor effect of trail (as he mentions in the video). Like castors on shopping cart, they follow the direction of travel. See Lee Parks book "Total Control" pg 25 (steering chapter)
People are terminally stubborn in their ignorance
I'm a little confused here... Are you saying we counter-steer at low walking speed? I just turn the handle bars in the direction I want to go.
5:50, here if I stop maintaining the pressure the bike straightens up, am I making a correct observation or it works some other way?
You are correct as long as your bike maintains enough total speed in the end across the span of so many seconds
If you are doing the push left to go left deal and you're doing sub 5 mph, you better be ready to gently tap that throttle to keep yourself upright depending on the lean angle in which you end up at...
thanks @@motoryzen
@@talilkr5238 nods humbly...*
I also meant to include thinking about whether or not you're turning left against AKA going up a hill or going downhill and think about your body position on the bike a little bit as you may have to lean into the turn or you may have to counterbalance into the turn if you're going at such a slow speed. With enough Lane ankle you may need to counterbalance and be upright with your foot forcefully held on either the left or right Peg depending on which direction you're trying to go to keep the bike from fully falling over at those slow speeds
I can promise you that much from plenty of experience doing the blue belt drill of motojitsu only doing 4 and 5 mph on purpose
@@motoryzen wow, that's amazing to learn. I just started riding. Thank you for your insight.
Almost zero speed, making a u-turn in a residential street:
So you’re against the right side of the street and parked by the curb. If you get on the bike and want to make a u-turn at low speeds, you would push right/pull left and make a left, tight turn. That’s about the only example I can think of that goes against this example.
Basically like if you were standing alongside your bike and walked it to make a u-turn.
It works
Was this ever a myth?
No. But some people think it is. If you’ve ever tried explaining it you’ll get disbelief occasionally.
5:34 your pulling you are pulling!!!
That's just the bike destabilizing and him putting his hands above it
Facepalms
NO..he is NOT..pulling...contrary to what you want to believe or what your eyes may think you're seeing he is not pulling get on a bicycle or a motorcycle and prove it for yourself and you will see that unfortunately your comment is wrong
I've been writing for many years now and I can tell you from enough experience and that is that situation he was pushing with his right hand even though he was gripping the arm of the mirror
If the bike is going fast enough to stay up on its on, you can counter steer.
Stupid question. But do you also lean in the direction your turning? Newbie question
You can and sometimes you inevitably do depending on your speed
It is knocking the gyroscopes off balance to get into the new state. Initiation.
Real question here, isnt all steering done with a motorcycle countersteer? Unless ya dismounted the bike n r pushn it around ur garage...
Will this work on a crusier like a breakout? Im about to buy a 2023 breakout as my first bike. Am i making a mistake?
Works on any bike, at any speed.
I don’t think that’s a good choice for a first bike, mainly because of the weight and the torque. A 300-500cc motorcycle is usually best imo for people who have never ridden a motorcycle before. If you’re still going to buy it i suggest having crash bars installed asap and to spend the first few days exclusively practicing low speed manoeuvres to get comfortable with the weight and torque of the bike
@@juanmejiagomez5514 I've ridden 500cc dirt bikes and I'm 6ft 2 so I don't want a small bike. I'm going to take the harley class before buying the bike. I love the breakout been saving for a long time. I pretty sure I can handle it.
Thattaboy Andrew, ask for advice because you dont know shit, then ignore it!
Have fun and good luck...
@@iliketurtles4463I've worked to hard and saved for to long not to buy the bike I want. It's like buying a station wagon because you think a camaro is too fast.
Are you pushing the bar down towards the ground in the direction you want to go? Sorry I’m just trying to make sure I understand because turning still makes me nervous.
No, down does nothing
But then you direct steer after the pointless little swerve
The bite naturally goes in the direction that you have enough lean angle involving
With all due respect, it seems a bit needlessly confusing describing a left turn as 'you push right'/ If you want to turn left, then you turn the handle bars to the left, same with the right. No different than a bicycle. Counter-steering is something that happens spontaneously and only for an instant before the turn even gets made.
Not sure what planet you're on but had you paid attention he pushed right and he went right if you saw him pushing on the right handlebar. If you saw him pushing away from himself on the left handle bar then he's going to go left
@@motoryzen I was commenting on what he said (and has said many times while attempting to describe counter-steering) not what he did.
Hello sir How can you turn the bike on High speed? I've struggle this kind of situation and unable to dodge unexpected potholes in fast pace I'm confuse should i counter steering or not? Let me know your thoughts btw I'm using aggressive position sportsbike
Godbless all Believe Jesus as your saviour and as your Lord God.
the same way he explains in this video, the faster you are going the more stable the bike is, the harder you have to push the bar to destabilize the bike.
To directly answer your question, yes you just have to put a little more Force effort into the counter steering beginning. And you damn well better begin to lean in the direction you're trying to Swerve towards to avoid whatever object the very instant you start counter steering otherwise you're going to hide side right off the bike
It's never been a myth.
Other popular youtubers such as Jerry the motorman state that countersteering is not needed below 15 mph and thus there are different opinions, which Greg is referring to as a myth
@@adjbob56 needed vs working are two different things; it's not needed, but it still works.
@adjbob56 no Jerry Paladino has never stated that counter steering is applicable regardless of the speed I'm not sure where you think you've heard that nonsense but no Jerry Paladino has never said that
I've watched enough of his content to know better
@@motoryzen You misquoted me. Please compare what you wrote, and what I wrote. Complete opposite.
CZcams frowns on links inserted to comments, so please search for Jerry P's video with title -> If you ride, you need to know this!
15 seconds into that video Jerry P. says "I always say at low speeds, 15 mph or less, you are turning the handlebars in the direction you want to go"
THAT is the core issue of "myth" that Greg is referring to in this video.
I have a lot of respect for both Greg and Jerry - however the Jerry video I am referring to is a chaotic mess of info. One moment he is talking about "handlebar steering" without countersteering, and the next moment he is saying you actually are countersteering but may not notice it... and goes back and forth.
My personal opinion, as a 68 year old dude who has had a motorcycle license for over 50 years, is that countersteering "always works" as Greg demonstrates in the current video. And at higher speeds it is essentially MANDATORY to get the bike to lean, and then turn.
And although countersteering "works" at speeds below 15, no argument, the main focus (as Jerry P often says) is that you have GOT to get the motorcycle to lean. If you are going really slow, you can shove the bike around. Unlike 45 mph, you can shove the bike under you to make it lean - so there are a variety of slow speed ways to MAKE IT LEAN and you don't have to consciously countersteer to make it lean. Yes countersteering "works" at slow speeds. Especially if you do a RAPID steering input, the bike initiates a lean the opposite direction (countersteer). At very low speeds, a SLOW input can provide a different result. I recently did parking lot drills with a bicycle (and my 750 Honda) and forced the leans using various methods - and as Greg says getting out there and practicing is the key to competency. I rode for 25 years before I even heard the word Countersteering from Keith Code - we do it by instinct after the training wheels come off the bicycle.
OMG, thanks for explaining how to steer a bike . Sadly people keep asking you the dumbest questions in the world. At least you did make it into good content ;)
Yes it is possible to turn your bike while in motion while only leaning and keeping it straight As far as the front tire precisely 100% parallel to the bike but it is far more difficult as Ryan from the CZcams channel for 9 has demonstrated already in a pretty recent video
Honestly it is difficult to the point of asininity to do it that way as in the real world you are not going to be able to Swerve to avoid Jack crap at local highway speeds are faster
Just use some common sense and practice proper counter steering and swerving
I understand counter steering works when a bike is in a straight position?
So you talked as if you were making a statement to say you understand how counter string works but then you ask the question so which is it?
Are you asking a question or making a statement? Make up your mind
And counter steering Works whether you're going straight on whether you're in the middle of a turn
@@motoryzen it is a question, as there is a question mark
At 6 mph, you can clearly see that you flick the bars slightly away to make the bike lean, but you then turn them hard in the direction of the turn to actually make the turn. 🤷♂️
10:56 you say exactly this. At 50 mph, I push left to go right and keep pushing left all the way through the turn. At parking lot speeds, you have to turn the bars into the turn. Perhaps it's a difference in what we consider counter steering. I think I'm more confused now. Still love your videos, bro.
the bikes steering geometry turns the bars into the direction of the turn automatically if you aren't fighting the bars.
If you want a scientific explanation then is true, C.S. Is working at any speed, but in real life things are a bit complicated and you need a better explanation. At. very low speed, that’s when the handlebar will turn itself in the direction where you want to go, C.S. will lose momentum and will turn in steering. Speed will keep the handlebar still and C.S. momentum and you can crash the bike when you keep C.S. If you want to test it, go 1st gear, let the bike run itself and use hands full open on the handlebar, you can feel how handlebar will be pushed to the direction of the turn until will hit the fuel tank, if you want to lean the bike, then let the handlebar go more close to fuel tank. At. high speed ofc. handlebar will be pushed and you can lean the bike very easy. In this video you can see at 6mph how C.S. momentum is lost fast and handlebar is starting to be close to fuel tank so that is steering, you can let the handlebar to go itself on that direction on that speed.
Is the act of instigating counter steering at slower speeds more difficult? Yes but that doesn't mean it goes away
Look facts don't care about anyone's feelings about this this is a proven fact of physics regardless if it's a bicycle or a motorcycle. If you are going straight whether it's 1 mph or 100 mph depending on the amount of force you put on either of the handlebars be at pulling or pushing will instigate counter steering to lean the bike to go certain direction
Now if you are trying to turn left and you're going one or two miles an hour and you turn that handlebar to point that tire left depending on whether or not you're on an incline of any kind be it perpendicular to the incline or parallel to it will determine your chances of high side going down falling off the bike
AND THEN DRIVES IN AN UNSAFE MANNER BETWEEN VEHICLES LIKE YOUR ABOVE THE LAW.... WOW
I still see direct steering
instagram.com/motojitsuclub/
This whole counter steering thing is dumb. There are two, not one, things going on with the handle bars. The first is steering, but the second which is just as important, is balance. So when you are riding a bike you are constantly doing both. Little steering moves to the left and right keep the bike upright or leans it as desired for a turn, then turning the bar "follows" the turn if you will. But you can still be making balance adjustments to the bar even in a turn. If you are leaned into the turn too far for example, you actually turn further into the turn to right the bike. But talking about it too much is silly, it has to be learned by doing, just like walking or swimming. If you have to think about it, you are riding beyond your level. It should be completely subconscious, like walking.
This is also why it is possible to slide out of a turn just when you are trying to quickly straighten out. There needs to be just a little bit more traction into the turn left over to right the bike. If there isn't, the "counter steer" required to exit the turn can push you over the traction limit of the tires. And once they start to slide, especially the front tire, it takes some tricky riding to get back out of the lean. Most people can't do it, not even really good riders.
"If you are leaned into the turn too far for example, you actually turn further into the turn to right the bike." When you push the high bar, the bike falls up, so it turns in that direction. Just as it always does. There is no mystery here. Only counter steering.
Facts don't care about anyone's feelings on this.. if the bike is going forward regardless of the speed and you turn the wheel to the right while going forward the bike will eventually Begin to Fall aka lean opposite direction and naturally self-correct this is just as applicable to a bicycle and this has never changed since the invention of the bicycle that contains a front steering assembly that lets you turn the direction in which the wheel points versus the line of the bikes body
I think these idiots meant when they "push" the handlebars meant "push forward" as opposed to "pushing down". That's the only way I can think of.
How is it considered a counter steering while the head is going in the direction of lean I don't believe counter steering in low speeds i tired it also it doesn't work for me
Counter steering is not steering. Counter steering is to create lean angle. One it's created the wheel must be turned into the direction you want to go. However, if you want even more lean angle while already leaned, you still counter steer again to lean even more.
It's called counter steering because you are turning the direction of the tire at first in the opposite direction of where you want to go in order to create the lean angle necessary for the bikes geometry and centrifugal force to begin turning in the correct direction.