Tesla Vision’s Scary Update for Full Self Driving will BLOW YOUR MIND
Vložit
- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- Tesla's Full Self Driving software is undergoing a major update with Tesla Vision. Tesla's Autopilot will no longer be using the radar sensor, and Tesla's new patent has allowed its AI and machine learning capabilities to take over and be safer and more powerful than a human. Elon Musk states that Tesla Vision will be absolutely mind blowing, and the new software is beginning to roll out to Tesla owners.
#Tesla #ElonMusk #TeslaVision
Website: themarketisope...
Patreon: / themarketisopen
Twitter: / themarketisopen
E ln(musk) T-Shirt: www.amazon.com...
Disclaimer: We are not financial advisers, and nothing on this channel is meant to be financial advice. The ideas expressed on this channel are purely opinions and should not be regarded as objective information. Nothing on this channel is a recommendation to buy or sell securities. Do not assume that facts and numbers in any video are accurate. Always do your own due diligence.
What do you think about Tesla's move to drop Radar, and how much longer do you think before Tesla Vision is better than a human? Be sure to check out our other videos:
Tesla Giga Press will CRUSH: czcams.com/video/YZoVEauHDt4/video.html
The Frightening Economics of the Tesla Model Y: czcams.com/video/aArRQKj7EB0/video.html
Have a look at our website themarketisopen.com
It's not a big surprise. Neither Lidar nor Radar is needed for FSD.
Radar & Lidar fail due to their weak (absent) ability to classify object properties which is critical to FSD. Cameras compensate for their weak ranging, velocity, & ambient abilities through combinatorial analysis of extremely high frame rate, high resolution, information that allows for accurate determination of object relative distance, speed, & azimuth, in addition to classification, providing superhuman results in all road conditions.
I will purchase full fsd when I buy my Tesla as I learnt a long time ago not to bet against Elon.
I have Y with FSD . Last winter I drove from Oregon to California I-5 near mount Shasta in heavy rain and fog with 5-10 yards max front visibility. Can you please explain how would cameras see through the fog what’s in front of the vehicle?
Note: Winning the closed, pre-defined, course DARPA Challenge with Lidar set Google on the wrong tech path. That hard won "success" blinded them (& all but Tesla) to more fortuitous methods demanded by "city streets" driving.
This is the best explanation I have seen for the removal of radar and transition to Tesla vision. Thank you for this video. You gained a new subscriber!
I am scheduled to take delivery of a new M3 this week and like many others, I have been terribly stressed about the recent decision by Tesla to remove the radar. I have been searching daily trying to find out all the information I can on the subject. This is by far the best piece I have seen or read. It has completely alleviated my concerns. I hope others in my shoes will see this. Your presentation was clear, concise and loaded with pertinent information. Well done! Thank you so much.
Same. Jus ordered a 3 but turned it into a y and I had the same concerns you did. This video has made me not even think about it. For a second there I was looking around for used model 3s to see if I could get one with radar lol.
Oh and congrats on your 3. I have to wait 9 weeks.
Congratulations & welcome to the Tesla family! Please come back & let us know how the handoff went & some of your experiences with (FSD) Beta! So I bought in at 3K & I’m still waiting for the (OTA) update, Tesla recently reached out to me to inform me that I needed a new drive computer, because the original drive computer wasn’t capable of full self driving & so they sent out their mobile unit to install it, it took about an hour & a half and everything went fine, so I am eagerly waiting for the (OTA) update to the new computer & I certainly hope it’s soon, as I’ve been waiting a long time for this feature to be added to its core capability! So I have the Tesla Model 3, dual motor, long range configuration of the (M3) & it’s very impressive, great performance, I did have some minor issues at the handoff, however, nothing major & certainly nothing the service center could not correct & they did! So my experience so far has been excellent & together with their network of SuperChargers & their (OTA) updates & their mobile service, I think Tesla is positioned to be the dominant player in the EV space for sometime to come! So again Good good luck on your new Tesla, hope your experience is similar to mine & I’ll be looking forward to seeing an update of your experience as I am looking forward to the OTA update on the (FSD) & I can’t wait to experience it in real time!😎
What calmed your nerves? For me it was awareness of ultrasonic sensors and their increased range use.
Same! I pick up my model 3 LR Saturday and I was stressing so much
I knew tesla had to remove radar from FSD, when the radar failed due to ice buildup on the front bumper, and FSD could not continue driving. I (with no radar) took over driving with no problem!
They added a heating element for radar when the model Y's [and eventually 3s] started rolling out last year.... i guess they dropped that now, but wouldn't be surprised if they have it in the higher end cars. The fact that they are leaving radar in place for the X and S tells me they plan to continue utilizing radar, but likely update to better technology [ESA radar]. Maybe retrofits in the future?? I don't forsee true FSD getting government approval without the redundancy beyond cameras, at a minimum.
@@CamelToeHo lol, they are dumping radar, it is left in the S and X only because those cars are lower volume and cost more, so they don't want to hit higher paying customers with the current vision which hasn't matched the full feature set of the radar version yet. Releasing vision early on the 3 and Y was purely a chip shortage decision. The main radar suppliers aren't fulfilling orders. BMW is telling customers if they want certain models now, they have to wait months to buy or give up adaptive cruise control. Tesla's vision was close enough to being ready, musk pushed it early so they wouldn't have to stockpile cars in parking lots waiting for radar modules to be delivered. Tesla couldn't sell the cars without acc like other car companies, tesla's features are required to be in all cars, they made the choice long ago that they would only sell cars with all hardware and would just paywall features if a buyer didn't want them at the time of sale.
@@_PatrickO i like how, unlike Elon, at least ur honest that the only reason this half-baked vision only system was released early was cuz of a chip shortages, not that it was actually ready for wide release lol.. Government regulators will never allow real FSD without backup sensor redundancy. Tesla knows this - hence their hw3 computer is split so if one fails the other picks right up. Not having a backup sensors when vision is impaired isn't going to be approved for level 5. Doesn't matter if u can't drive solely on radar. The car is supposed to perform better than human, not just barely as good lol.
@@CamelToeHo Cute, but some other car companies are saying even less. You only know BMW can't sell cars with ACC if you try to buy from a dealer. They never announced anything. Some companies are announcing stuff, some are not. For some certain models get disclosure, some do not.
You seem confused, because the current functionality of vision is extremely good, while it wasn't completely par to th system with radar in all areas, it is perfectly acceptable for a short period of time. The system with radar has much more maturity. In the end, vision will eliminate the false positives that people hate from radar and will catch stationary objects that radar could not. All the crashes that people went nuts over involving stationary objects is going to be solved by tesla first, no other car company is going to have that.
I have FSD on 2 cars and all I have to say is "Don't bet against Elon".
Me too. But I am a little skeptical about ever seeing true FSD.
@@thefish5861 True fsd means the company takes liability, so just being capable isn't the only hurdle. Tesla may not remove the requirement to pay attention even if they have fully working level 5 for years. They may just require looking forward via eye monitoring. I have comma ai's openpilot and it does eye monitoring. Openpilot works so well on interstates, I have driven for hours getting the fsd experience. If you naturally look forward enough, you never get a nag in any way. It is an amazing experience. You feel like a passenger from the driver's seat. The added benefit of it sounding an alarm if you did fall sleep is something the government should have mandated a decade ago. Tesla being slow to adopt eye tracking is their one big mistake. They should have added that years ago.
@@_PatrickO I am already very happy with the normal intelligent auto pilot in my cars. I can drive for many miles on divided highways without doing much of anything, other than pay attention, and hit the turn signal when I want to pass somebody. I’m not even that sure I want my car to drive me to Home Depot with no role on my part.
@@thefish5861 And be ready to hit the accelerator when the car phantom brakes too avoid getting rear ended...
@@carlgeorgtsigakis498 Correct.
Given FSD progress, Berlin, Texas, Shanghai2, mega casting, 4680 structural batter packs, Compact car, Cybertruck, Semi and not forgetting energy business, world domination is almost inevitable.
Drop the "almost" and we have a deal. This man was not born in South Africa, but was dropped here from another far more advanced Galaxy. They just took pity of us when they realized that we were building machines that were killing us in many different ways, same story with how we got Trump. But Obama and Biden, also dropped from another malignant galaxy to destroy us all. They beam to us many personalities all the time. I am serious. Look at Biden very closely and immediately you know that he is not human, I mean his lips are not coordinated with what comes out of his mouth, that is not a human trait. Do you know Al Gore? And Bill Gates? Also Whoopy Goldberg, look at her last name and you will know that she is a German from the former Eastern block. Michael Smith? Look at his belly, it is the German beer that got him that way. Got to go.
i love to learn about nerdy stuff like this. great work!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Nice video, thanks!
Thanks Dave, I appreciate that!
The man, the myth, the legend!
I took delivery of a Model 3 yesterday. I've been trying to learn as much as I can about the car and autopilot and FSD, which I am considering purchasing. I've been a bit dismayed because a lot of the Tesla commenters and complaining about the lack of liar and reliance on cameras----I keep hearing it said Tesla is going "backwards," and that is disconcerting. This explanation gives the OTHER side and thank you for that. You earned my sub!
It always cracks me up when people think they are smarter than Elon and his team of the absolute smartest engineers on the planet.
Lee, that is not true. The "smartest" engineers are working at Koenigsegg
@@stennordenmalm1735 Yes but I doubt they are the ones second guessing Tesla's decisions. I suppose I should have said some of the smartest engineers and I would be willing to bet that the engineers working at Koenigsegg would agree.
The self driving will be better than human ability just by the fact it has more eyes on the road , with 360 degree cover , no brainer 👍👏👏
What about dynamic road conditions, road blocks, re routes, long delays where the battery can run out?
@@asdfmosin agreed in the future shit will still happen , road blocks etc will be sent over the air instantly new routes would be entered to include charge points if need be , I travel the uk a good deal at night when most of road closures happen updates to our google maps inform us , dynamic roads been on many that fit that nicely manual driving will be the back up , personally track mode for fast a to b manually should always be available , u can try and take the rs4 from a man but it will always be in him ,👍🤪
"...which sort of went under the radar" the phrasing👌
Wow, this is truly enlightening. Thanks so much. Like the short video too.
As of end of April 2021, I have Model Y with FSD purchase. I did this to secure my driving future.
Two human eyes provide enough information to safely drive a car. More cameras, and a system that doesn't ever get bored or distracted is inevitably going to outperform a human driver in the not too distant future. Radar doesn't add much to this picture really. Sure, it could see into that bank of fog, but it's not good enough on its own to let you drive safely through it. If you still need vision, there's little point in having Radar.
Personally, I'd love FSD when I buy my first Tesla. As I get older, FSD will be take the strain when I no longer feel like driving myself.
Excellent work!
I have been driving with Tesla's FSD/Autopilot for 7 years and I am very happy with it.
What I am missing in this discussion are the problems around overtaking, when the lane you would need to use might have oncoming traffic in it, in the city or on countryside roads.
You need a forward camera (or two) on the driver-side to be able to "peek" around the car you are going to overtake.
Tesla has only two proper forward facing cameras mounted in the middle of the car, meaning the car would have to move a full meter more into the opposing lane to be able to see oncoming traffic.
How many of you have not attempted to overtake and then had to abort and throw the car back into your old lane?
My bet is that overtaking using FSD will be made illegal in most countries without a side mounted, forward facing camera.
BTW my ex father in law lost an eye in his teens, and have, like millions of other one-eyed drivers managed to drive his entire grown-up life. Stereo-vision is nice, but not needed for driving a car apparently.
We bought FSD on our model Y, a major reason to switch to a Tesla. Waiting for the robo network to make it an appreciating asset.
You realize that will never happen?
@@JayDee917 You realize that doesn't matter? Having a fully capable level 5 system, even if they make the driver look forward via eye monitoring is a massive game changer and quality of life improvement. Eye monitoring can change the interval of looking forward based on the type of road, so it can adjust in a way where a driver naturally looking forward satisfies the system so you never get a single nag or have to touch the wheel. Comma AI does it with openpilot and the eye monitoring is a game changer.
@@_PatrickO your reply is completely irrelevant. The guy said he was “waiting for the robo network” which just like your comment implies, will never happen. Also, it’s not a level 5 system if you have to pay attention to the road.
With Tesla vision, it will never be level 5, when all I takes is some mud splashed over the camera to make it inoperable. It will always require some one in the driver seat paying attention to take over at a moments notice.
Sorry Elon lied to you if you bought FSD because you thought the “robo network” was going to happen.
Awesome video. Lots of effort have been put into this video. Thank you.
A fantastic report with detailed technical information. Thank you very much for this.
I have FSD on my 2019 Tesla. I will not miss radar. It never helped with bad weather driving. Weather is an issue because more often than not cameras become blinded and FSD will not work. To me true FSD is about 10 years away.
It's as if Elon has a 'cheat sheet' on all the challenges facing business in the future. Amazing how he innovates with the precision of a neurosurgeon.
Excellent reporting- timely, accurate, and thorough! Thanks for the difficult research gathering!
I really dislike the FUD the radar removal caused, the media acted as if it was a catastrophic mistake for no reason.
Good analogy. Tesla has the right approach. Tesla is the only company after true FSD other companies they are after short cuts. I don’t know when but Tesla will get there. Every day passing Tesla is a day closer to solve the vision problem in FSD. At the end of the day it doesn’t matter how long it takes one day Tesla will solve it.
My man Tesla lied about theid fsd capabilities and got exposed recently, this is just it's way to smoke screen from it
Thank you, great explanations. Surely, the intent was always to mimic the best that humans could do and not create an instrument only driving system.
5 forward facing cameras? I can find only 3. They are in the mirror mount and cannot see the 2nd car in front - but radar can! (I have a Model 3 with radar and a new model Y without radar) Also, radar can detect speed changes quicker than vision. I want radar - at least for forward collision avoidance.
Great video 👍 Helped me understand the logic behind the 3 technologies
As an optometrist I can vouch for the ability of a two Eye vision system to outperform a one night vision system and determining depth perception or our appreciation about close we are to objects
I think that Tesla self drive is already ahead of the average human driver and that Tesla Vision will proved to be equal or superior the the best human drivers by next year
We drive in all kinds of weather in Montana, so I'm looking forward to experienced real-world AI with level 5 FSD when visibility is bad.
If a person can drive in bad visibility than I would think a level 5 FSD would be just fine.
No, if visibility is so bad, nobody should drive anywhere.
@@okjhum should not count on radar in those conditions. Could slam into stopped object.
@@fritzstauff Should have stopped myself, before slam. :-)
Great video. It rekindles my conviction in Tesla. I have FSD and it currently needs a lot of improvement, but am optimistic it will do so (free) in the near future!
I trust Elon.
Great job breaking down the Lidar weak spots!
tbh i feel like it would have been better to release the vision update before the announcement of removing radar. then there would be less people being able to complain and less confusion.
I think that's what we have for existing Tesla owners who have the radar hardware in their cars. But it's almost like a completely new piece of software that they need to be more cautious about.
Almost every single thing about these changes makes me want to cancel my order that is supposed to be ready in 2 weeks. I don't want to be spied on. I don't want the promise of features later. I don't want reduced speeds. I don't want removed radar. What I don't like the most is that all of this happened after I ordered my car and we all found out via the internet and not by Tesla.
@@acerockollaa Good riddance, just moves the rest of us closer to getting the finest tech available! Please see the above comment about keeping "transitioning" current owners cautious. ICYMI: Radar & Lidar fail due to their weak (absent) ability to classify object properties which is critical to FSD. Cameras compensate for their weak ranging, velocity, & ambient abilities through combinatorial analysis of extremely high frame rate, high resolution, information that allows for accurate determination of object relative distance, speed, & azimuth, in addition to classification, providing superhuman results in all road conditions.
@@Crunch_dGH Wow 👏 that was a Public Service announcement!!
@@MorganMadej Thx?!! 🤗
Yes I'm fully behind FSD's Vision ONLY and would buy it.
You used two dirty words "Consumer Reports" Those clowns really take themselves seriously but they are just a clickbait comedy act.
Skilfully phrased 👍👍👍
@@tafl-9198 Thank you.
Excellent overview of this topic!
I'd like to see a road race between all the systems!
That would make a great reality TV show.
Isn't that what the DARPA challenges of a few years ago all about? Maybe time for another
The best FSD explanation up to date. Wish Tesla uses this video as the standard PR for user and investors
yes full self vision is the right way to go.
Great job. Very detailed breakdown. I'm going to have to subscribe now.
The best explanation of Tesla Vision and the removal of radar that I have heard! Great Job!
Excellent explainer about FSD and the various sensor technologies! FSD needs to be far far better than a human in order to succeed because a person causing a crash is not newsworthy, but a self driven crash will be on the news for weeks.
Great explanation of competing thoughts on autonomous driving systems
As a previous serial Tesla owner I must say I love their tech, but I still hate the cars. Thanks for a great explanation.
A better comparison then chess is the game of GO. Which is far more complex and the world champion was beaten by an AI system developed in the UK.
Yeah that was also DeepMind's AlphaZero. AlphaGo -> AlphaZero -> MuZero
It's interesting for chess though, seems to have brought new ways of playing to the game
the point was how quickly AI taught itself to completely destroy the worlds best (human coded software) chess computer. He was referencing the speed at which AI self-learns, not the complexity of the game. Lee Sedol losing to AlphaGo is of course impressive. But that AlphaGo has now been humiliated by their new AI system, which taught itself to play GO just from being given the rules- nothing else. And it beat AlphaGo like 100 to 0 while it was simultaneously beating thousands of human GO players around the world. This was a matter of minutes/hours after being given the rules of the game. So, yeah. AI gets faster at being faster, smarter at being smarter exponentially, ad infinitum.
I have fsd went on a 550 mile journey and it was a true pleasure with navigate on autopilot
The Soviet rocket launching development was as this describes. When the cost of the rockets became too expensive, this failed. They dropped out of Luna launches.
Driving is freedom.
'This is the way.' - Mando
13:26
When Tesla vision can tell whether other drivers are distracted or about to turn, based on their hand position on the wheel, direction of their gaze and general demeanor, then Tesla vision will be as good or better than a very aware human driver. Sure Tesla vision is already better than a third of the idiots out there driving while texting, phoning, Skype-ing or just not paying attention, but those same idiot are detectable by other humans and we learn to avoid them. When Tesla vision can do the same, it will be ready for the real world.
Not sure I agree that Tesla will remove driver monitoring, they have a pretty advanced air bag system that detects the height, age and movements of every passenger, calculating the best deployment for the air bags.
I don't see the issue with removing radar - if it is too rainy or foggy for the vision system, it is too poor visibility for driving. Not only for the car one is in, but all other vehicles on the road. Limit to 75 mph - speed limit is 70 most places - so not really an issue except in places like Montana. And will be increased when safe. The decisions seem sensible to me. Safety first!
you made a wrong statement about competitors not having data like Tesla has from its cars. Mobileye supplies its technology to multiple big manufacturers and so it too potentially has access to large amounts of data
Monileye does not have the same amount of data as tesla by a mile.
Great video. This should help clear up some FUD.
People complaining as if they know better than the company they trusted buying the car to begin with. 🙄🙄
this was very educational.. in theory this goes hand in hand with augmented reality as AI will be able to distinguish in real time. and yes I'm patiently waiting for the cybertruck
Cost to consumer of FSD, subscription or paid in full up front, needs to come WAY DOWN.
A chauffeur would cost way more, but I think if the Tesla Taxi Network could absorb a lot of the cost. Tesla still trying to fund the Mars base and global internet coverage.
I totally agree. At the end of the day we have been paying for the development of fsd its advertised as full self driving but until its realised its just a gimic. We paid 6k for it wen he said it would be feature complete end of 2019. Then he changed his definition of feature complete. End up selling the car and you loose the not so full self driving option and now must pay 14k
Not right
"...needs to come WAY DOWN." for who? Maybe for you. Others may choose to pay more to enjoy the latest tech innovation. The first Tesla buyers paid a big premium for the sports car. Why? Why not? It's their choice, their life, and everyone benefits when Elon plows the income back into Tesla. This is how new tech works.
@@1voluntaryist for the masses of buyers of affordable EV Teslas that will continue to allow the company to grow. There would be no Tesla now, if their future at the time depended on the first Roadster.
@@Burba222 I wonder what size/population of an area defines where Robo Taxi matters much?
I purchased FSD and the HW3.0 upgrade for my early built 2018 Model 3. Can’t wait to have this!
I have 100% confidence in Tesla eventually marketing FSD. I purchased a 2020 Model-Y LR w/FSD and have a 3 motor Cybertruck w/FSD on order. Tesla FSD is definately arriving in the near future.
Very good video.. Lots of work put to make these videos
If Tesla weren't so expensive here in Australia they'd be selling like hotcakes. Australia has always been a technology grabbing nation but the cost here is astronomical. Instead of being 52 grand of our money (approx conversion of 40 USD), a Model 3 is closer to 78, the Model Y is 82, Model X is 157 due to shipping costs & luxury vehicle tax. The costs are beyond most people. I select long-range because Australia is huge & requires the longer ranged vehicle for any touring.
Yep, good move by Tesla to eliminate the lidar/radar to simplify the system. It may only be slightly beneficial if trying to drive in dense fog, and perhaps they can add it back as an additional feature in several years, but it doesn't seem necessary right now.
What I'm most curious to find out about Full Self Driving vehicles is how comfortable of a ride they provide. Is there a way to switch from a comfort mode to a sport mode, where acceleration is faster? I presume not yet, but that might be a nice feature.
“This is the way”
Yup I own a Model 3 long range with full FSD
I dunno if the radar logic is completely sound. There may be use cases in inclement weather where the camera system would be able to drive if it was able to detect distances from the car ahead of it.
Imagine just going straight on a highway in snow. Following the car in front closely would be pretty helpful with radar and a camera that is somewhat obstructed
Well there's still ultrasonic sensors, that are fairly short range, so technically the car can still detect some level of objects nearby. But with radar only, you don't know if you're following a car or a tree or a garbage can, or a piece of plastic blowing in the wind. If you mistake a car for a tree that's bad news. With vision you can tell right away.
@@TMIOTesla that’s a fair point but I’m not saying to go full radar. I think there can be some redundancy and help radar could provide in inclement weather.
Nevertheless, there may be times when it’s just not safe to drive autonomously or with humans, as is the case now
isnt radar only for detecting vehicles in front? vision has always been used for determining lane lines right?
Yes it's always been a forward facing radar only. And yeah only vision (camera) can see lane lines.
Interesting vid. My biggest concern about the removal of radar is not as much the AP or FSD impact, but in respect to automatic emergency braking (AEB) in inclement weather. I think the capability of Tesla Vision in this instance will be severely reduced where light transmission is difficult such as through fog, heavy rain, etc. This is when I would likely need AEB the most. On another car, this saved me from 2 significant accidents in bad visibility. Not sure how well a vision only system would have fared. Since I couldn't see the vehicle, I doubt the cameras would have.
Up until about 6 months ago, tesla was talking about a new "4d radar" system they would be utilizing. Now there's chip shortages and suddenly radar is no longer needed? Weird... The content starting around the 10 minute mark regarding adverse weather has been repeated many times but frankly I think it is just wrong. Speaking from personal experience, there have been numerous occasions in which I was on the highway and a torrential downpour began, leaving my vision out the windshield to virtually nothing. Somehow, despite me not being able to see the road at all, AP stayed engaged the entire time and got me home safely! The system w/ radar support worked despite me not being able to clearly see out the windshield... Hmmmm. Should I have pulled over? Yeah, maybe. Were there plenty of other folks also driving in this horrible weather? Yes, most certainly. How many of those cars had the safety of radar protecting them from plowing into a vehicle ahead? Probably less than half, if that. A vision-only system would never keep AP engaged in this scenario and wouldn't even allow u to use ACC - essentially ruining the best feature of the car. I certainly won't be bricking my working model 3 w/ radar until they have demonstrated this can operate as safely as the radar systems in ALL conditions. Radar being able to 'see' the car in front of the car in front of me [even when I can't see it] not only used to be a big selling point for teslas amazing safety abilities, but also has been demonstrated in real world scenarios to see and predicts a crash before u realize what is happening. Thus far, the results for vision-only show its not even close to the current system at night or adverse weather [doesnt even need to be raining- merely water spray from adjacent vehicle tires is enough to disable AP vision-only at this point, which is pretty pathetic].
I did not purchase FSD with my Cybertruck reservation. Basic autopilot will be enough for me, and I do not feel I could afford it. I will consider he subscription possibly.
Excellent piece. This is by far the most comprehensive, well researched, and expertly assembled "tutorial" on the who, what, where, when, and why of FSD. Subscribed, and impressed.
The quality of your work is incredible. Nailed the significance of iterative design, Elon's reasons for using it, in a way I think many people will comprehend fully for the first time. Love the reference and example of the starship hops- perfect illustration of the speed and benefits to iteration, using an example that was almost wholly reported as "failures" by reason-by-analogy mainstream reporters.
I found myself rolling my eyes at so many self described Tesla geeks on CZcams over the last week as they jumped to conclusions about the decision to drop radar. Thank you for clarifying the situation so well. Elon doesn't drop fundamentally important components from anything, unless he has a superior alternative. Come on, People. Did you really think you had a better grasp of the system than Elon?! You should all be b*tch slapping yourselves
It’s not “just lidar” vs vision. Waymo has lidar and vision and radar vs Tesla’s vision only system. Vision only FSD is a pipe dream for the foreseeable future. There are no long range sensors on the side. How can it ever make an unprotected left turn into high speed traffic? It can’t. And what happens when you get snow or ice on the only camera covering one side? It’s insane. It’s not “just lidar” vs vision.
I have the FSD package. Eagerly waiting, but 100% understand needing to get it right.
Picking up my M3 in 3 days.
well one thing if driverless vehicles can run about without human control it will allow people to drive without licences, just like in the beginning of vehicles being on the road , my father never sat a driving test in Scotland . licence didn't exist
Hopefully they get it perfected before I get my Model 3
A draw is not a loss. Google's chess ai is better because it can find a solution where nobody wins or loses. When it comes to cars, slowing down or stopping will often lead to a better result than attempting to continue in the hopes of being right. Something most humans unfortunately don't know how to do. 🤣
But a loss is a loss. it lost 28 times, and did not WIN once! no idea what your point is with respect to AI. Are you saying you have found the "weakness" in AI? your example is faulty
I mean i think it has potential. I'm still skeptical to how it will perform in snowy weather. I think its going to struggle way "earlier" than a human driver who is used to driving in real winter weather would.
I have a 2018 M3 with FSD package, now I am wondering will the ultra sonics need upgraded? What else will need upgraded and will there be a further cost to get what I paid for....
One criticism of removing radar is that performance is degraded under inclement conditions: rain, snow, etc. My SUV has modern speed keeping and following features. Recently, while making an all day drive, it cut off during several heavy downpours reverting to manual. This was entirely appropriate given the rain intensity. Having radar would not have helped. In fact, the vehicle receives software updates and this behavior triggers faster than when purchased. So if radar is not needed for ordinary driving and not helpful in bad weather, then Tesla makes a good point to drop it. By concentrating on camera AI, it can more quickly perfect self driving.
The color shift in your video kept my attention.
Thank you
Just a question. If there were widespread adoption of Lidar and radar is there a point at which vehicles emitting similar wavelengths will confuse one another’s sensors?
the signal of the waves that go out are specific to the radar/lidar that it leaves from. think of it like a phone, its not like your neighbors cell phone will upset your phones ability to make / receive phone calls
Radar yes has already been documented especially in close proximity. Lidar no but has plenty of other issues.
@@othayolo I figured there’s a certain dedicated portion of the EM spectrum but if usage gets high enough, every car on the road, does we start tripping over each other? Vision doesn’t have that limit.
Dr Knowitall made a video about that.
@@okjhum yeah but he’s a know it all
I would like the radar to remain even if it isn't a part of computer vision. Think of the 100 car pileups in a snowstorm that could be avoided.
The system is BETTER without it. Removing radar gets rid of a bunch of useless "noise" that VISION doesn't need or want
A computer is just a faster "us"? Our "Computer" can do 30 to 60 separate "tasks" every second - thinking, breathing, pumping blood, itching, the thought of scratching that itch (the action will take too long). So while our big brains are busy, your laptop or pad computing device, when active, will do a MILLION things in a second just sitting. Today's computers can knock out a billion or a trillion things per second. In ONE second, computers do more "tasks" than we do in our LIFETIMES. 1 computer Second = 100 human years. Every inch of every road trip in a Tesla would take 300 human years to perceive and respond.
when the truck comes i want it in my truck , before everyone gets one, Musk , put up first with it
Good information, have M3 LR FSD
What they are missing is that humans have several more layers of visual processing. We form a persistent 3D model of the world around us and the road for miles ahead, we understand human behavior and pick up on subtle clues when a driver is likely to shift in our lane etc. There are like 7 levels of processing in a safe human driver. AI in self-driving cars are just getting to the 3rd level. I have a Model S with autopilot and it's very far from a human, even for basic lane following. I can easily extrapolate when a lane divider mask is missing ahead of me, or where there's none. I no trouble driving on an unmarked suburban street or on a dirt road and infer the lanes from the distances of the vague edges of the dirt vs vegetation. The autopilot gives up and screams at me to take over a if lane divider is not visible for 30-50 feet, or if it can't see beyond a very moderate hilltop.
I have the FSD package. I am in Canada and the FSD Beta has not arrived here yet. Enhanced auto-pilot is a LONG way from being what I would call "safe". I think radar confuses the cameras. I agree with Elon and I think the camera system will work much better. More eyes and quicker decision-making will make it far better than a human driver. Tesla already has billions of user driving miles data to work with. I think it will learn very, very quickly.
3rd comment ! Thanks for your hard work and analysis
Thank you!
Wow how easy would driver monitoring be to defeat, a piece of sticky tape or nail varnish or even chewing gum on the little internal camera and their goes this little spy cam!
He knows what he's doing. Future Tesla Model 3 or Model Y owner.
I live near a 4-way stop intersection. There are about 3 serious injury accidents per year and several more minor accidents that may total a vehicle but non serious injuries. I sat and counted 200 cars arriving at the intersection and noted that only 7 of the 200 vehicles came to a complete stop. Two of the complete stop incidents involved 2 vehicles approaching the intersection at the same time. That seems to be the reason those 4 vehicles actually came to a stop. Only 3 other vehicles came to a stop, well, maybe because there was pedestrian crossing the street in one case and a stop sign and the stop ahead is clearly marked on the street. 3 vehicles did not even slow down while approaching the intersection completely disregarding the stop sign. One of those vehicles was likely speeding (don't know for sure without a radar gun). Another it was obvious he was on his cell phone talking. Don't know about the 3rd one, just kept on cruising on through the intersection without even slowing down. the remaining 190 vehicles did slow down to various rates, but in no way came to a stop, most not even close to a stop. Three of those vehicles were local police cars. The police station is just one block away from the intersection. I will concede that most of the 190 vehicles slowed down at least aware and at least mildly cautious before deciding to run the stop signs. This was about 5 pm to 6 pm on a Wednesday. Maybe people were really in a hurry to get home after work.
I don't have a Tesla, but I do follow updates and the FSD news concerning Tesla. So here is a timeframe of just a bit over 1 hour that at this neighborhood intersection had 3 crossings with no obvious regard for the stop sign that might have a high probability of causing an accident. FSD would have required the car to stop (as far as I know). Another 190 were somewhat cautious but didn't stop. Last year there were two accidents right in front of my house that involved 3 vehicles being totaled. One was an Hyundai that accelerated out of a liquor store parking lot a half block down from my house and totaled my parked Suburban which was moved exactly 11 feet forward from the rear end by the completely demolished Hyundai and two young ladies, both still on there cell phones before the crash (as noted by a witness). The witness told me they were both on their cell phones and were angry and yelling at whomever each was talking to. He said it appeared they hit full throttle leaving the parking lot and he heard what sounded like a cannon firing off right afterward. The young ladies were at least okay, and still seemed angry with whomever they were talking to on their phones. I don't think a Tesla on FSD would have had such an issue. Another incident was similar. A guy drove out of the store parking lot, was intoxicated, accelerating a wide turn, but instead of hitting a vehicle I had parked at the curb he drove over the curb onto the grass easement and sidewalk just missing my car in the driveway and smashed into a tree in my neighbors yard. He was okay, but his car was totaled. I don't think a Tesla gets angry nor does it drink alcohol or take drugs (at least to the best of my knowledge).
The point is, even if autonomous driving with FSD is not perfect yet, I would bet that statistically there would be less accidents and injuries in a Tesla using current FSD than the average current statistics. The Tesla's aren't going to get emotional, they won't get intoxicated, and won't fall victims to distractions as many humans do. The more FSD vehicles on the road, the less human drivers on the road, the faster the statistics for accidents will fall. Pedestrians, passengers and pets will be safer than they are now.
A bit off topic but I remember a story some years ago when a traffic officer in South Africa pulled over a motorist who hadn't come to a complete stop at a stop sign. Traffic Officer "Sir, that sign says S-T-O-P, stop; not P-A-W-S, pause!
Driver monitoring cameras feel very 1984 and invasive. Especially knowing that if anything happens that footage will end up in police or Insurance hands.
No radar? What’s the plan in heavy snow or heavy rain? And for whatever the headlights DO NOT see at night?
The problem isn’t fsd on-it’s own, it’s integrating one type of software with 1.7 billion minds of the worlds drivers and their driving styles and their predicted behaviours.
It's literally what people do. Some information doesn't need to spelled out anymore, like how people can guesstimate how far and how fast something is moving, I would like to see extra cameras further forward on the body somewhere for creeping forward. The ability to see around objects is great and cameras can't do that. If it's not radar I don't know how you can do that. Also driver monitoring isn't going anywhere until it backfires on them. They want it so people stop blaming them for their own lack of attention.
Tesla Vision has still long way to go! This is interesting new article from few days ago - "Researchers from Georgia Tech and Ben-Gurion University of the Negev have used a cheap projector to trick Tesla's Autopilot system".
Basically, they used a cheap projector to project a man on the road in front of Tesla, and the car stopped - because there is no lidar (or now even radar), and the neural network tells the car that the human is on the road :D - or they project a stop sign on a tree next to the road...
Since portable projectors are super cheap, I can’t wait for the prank videos, where people stop tesla.
looking forward to joining the robotaxi network and monetizing income with that~!
To bad Texas law for not selling cars from the factory said Gas cars. It would of been a loop hole.