It would be interesting to see them change direction to produce reasonably priced and detailed beginner models to help them climb out of the rut they’re in. Instead of pushing the high end really expensive stuff.
THIS is what the Railroad range should be like! Definitely agree this is among the best diesels in the RR range. I have an original Lima 20 (Waterman black) which is by far one of the best Lima locos they ever produced. Very smooth runner and heavy too. The upgrades on this are very nice! You should check out their RR 67 which is a Lima loco too... But it also has a diecast chassis, central motor and working lights!!
As the Class 20s sometimes run in pairs, the price of this model means you're not going to break the bank if you want a pair of them. Great video Sam 👍
Does anybody else enjoy Sam's videos but don't own any model trains or have any intention of getting any? I always find them an enjoyable and satisfying watch but I can't put my finger on why.
Yes, me! I stumbled on Sam's videos when I was looking up Stephenson's Rocket for my dad. I love how genuine, fresh and honest his presentation is, and how enthusiastic he is for his hobby. All through covid, and some pretty dark political times, it's somehow been quite soothing to watch Sam talk so passionately about a purely creative hobby. I'm not the slightest bit interested in the Class 20, but time spent with Sam just cheers me up a bit. 🙂
I don’t have many models, and whilst I’m happy with the decent amount I’ve got, I don’t even have space for a layout. I just watch Sam’s Trains to look at details on locomotives, and to see whether he thinks any particular models are worth buying.
I wonder if this is the route Hornby should be going - not trying to be all things to all enthusiasts, but taking a good hard look at their range and picking out models that are decent, could have some enhancements done to them, and then selling them for a reasonable price. Not aiming for the niche that is the high value, perfect copy models, which is now well and truly saturated with other companies, but doing a good model that runs well and for a good price from their back catalogue - things that would appeal to a lot of people from the casual modeller and the family who might like a model railway but can't afford the silly prices?
Hornby have been just massively confused with where they sit in the market. For me, I recall the days of beatties, Hornby being the affordable and entry level models. Most of their range is redos from this period now 😂 but this price and quality very much is Hornbys niche, I'm hoping this is a sign that the new management have gone back to their roots and they imo will do well to focus here. This price even makes me want to buy new and I've long been a 2nd hand advocate.
This is what the hobby needs. Get people buying locos at sensible prices. The vast majority of the hobbyists aren’t rivet counters or care about sprung buffers. Go retro and call the range Lima again. Clear distinction then from the Hornby range
I obtained some replacement wheels without traction tyres from Peter's Spares and swapped them. It is still capable of hauling a decent sized train and has proper all wheel pick up. A very worthwhile improvement.
Wow! That really does seem to be the new benchmark for what Railroad Plus should be. Ideal for youngsters. Cheap enough and robust enough, yet still enough detail to please. Great mechanism too. Please Hornby, make more like this. Make your company suitable for children once more. Right model for the right price.
Well, I am disappointed that I did not see any barrels on the layout, but I did see wheeled trash cans or as you call them wheelie bins, lol. I do think you may have been a star to a star and a half harsh on Hornby but then you would have had to put an asterisk next to the name in your logbook to denote, "for the price". You did however through Hornby a bone overall so once again you're on point. I also think that locos like this are very necessary if the next generations are to pick up the hobby mantle. Just think of this loco in a starter set in time for Christmas, hum. Great review and video, Jersey Bill
Theres a starter set called the “Freightmaster” with this Class 20 in it, along with a few decent wagons and coaches, that was released somewhat recently. RRP £170 but can be found elsewhere for much cheaper. A great little set really, and definitely something Hornby should focus more on. They have always been the kings of the Train Set and this has always been a key way of getting new people, especially children, into the Hobby.
haha sorry about the lack of barrels... I actually sold all of the ones I made without keeping any for myself haha! I agree, models like this are super important for the hobby! Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Good morning mukka, This is... finally... a great development from the Margate team. I have a few of the Lima 20s but a couple of them are suffering from the cancerous mazak rot and I am occasionally doing work on the metal frames to keep them serviceable. I could buy a couple of these new ones and simply change the bodies over thus refurbishing my older units. Appears to be cost effective. 🤔 Cheers from Oz. Gaz 😊
The railroad class 20 might honestly be my favourite Hornby Railroad model (definitely my favourite railroad diesel)! The nice livery really helps this model look good and honestly I’m thinking I might buy one of these, from a distance it’s hard to tell the difference between this and the more expensive Class 20s!!
Just think, Sam. One day (soon, I hope) you’ll be able to buy an HO/OO-scale model with an actual, but small, diesel engine in it, and you would put real diesel fuel in the tank with an eensie-tiny funnel, and it would be controlled by a tiny robot in the cab that looks like a railroad engineer. Then, to control it, you give the robot an eensie-tiny timetable and switch-list! 😆🤣😝 It would be like real railroading back in the 50s and 60s, but writ small! Very small!
Couldn't agree with you more regarding the Lima class 20s. Superb models! I run mine as a u they can haul pretty much any train I throw at it. Mine had the marker discs included, untouched from when they were first made in the 1980s. PLEASE Hornby, make more such RR+ models like this. I think I'd have found a way to give it a "C"! PS: I rode behind one in the early 1990s when BR ran them in pairs hauling "The Jolly Fisherman" from Derby/Nottingham to Skegness during the summer.
I do give Hornsby credit for this loco, I got mine for a steal at £50 at great electric last year and has been perfect ever since. especially for my first time with dcc
You can also exchange the bodyshell for an original Lima version. I did this with 2 x Ltd Lima bodies - so had good body shells with the DCC capability of the Hornby version. Such a simple upgrade for little money.
If Hornby releases these in early BR green I'll be getting a couple for sure! The detail is good enough, especially for the price. I already have a couple of Lima ones that I've repainted and upgraded a bit. But a factory finished pair of these would be awesome. Thanks for the video.
Hi Sam, A brilliant review, I had two class 20s about 45 years ago. One was a Wren and the other was a Lima. I decided to go for ‘O’ gauge and purely on detail I sold Wren and kept the Lima, and it still runs today and I have also DCC chipped it. I did go for the BR Green and after you review Sam I might just even go for this Hornby one to double head them. Regards from Ron 👍😃✔️🚂
Hi Sam, nice video 👍🏻I purchased one of these several months ago, I agree the upgrades hornby have done a fine job and mine too has the wobble, it’s to see a loco that doesn’t cost a fortune and will help with people on a low budget.
This is definitely what Hornby should do much more of. A higher sales volume of locos like this would help them no end. The shouty professional modelers who want to pay £400 wouldn’t like it but they could go elsewhere and leave us cost-conscious folk to build their fleets around Railroad products. Great job, Hornby!
I have bought the Class 73 in the Railroad + livery and I'm blown away by it. The model had a HM7000 chip inside which I took out and put into my Lord Nelson. If you deduct the price for the decoder, which is about 55£ at the retailers, the loco costs about 50 quid which I think it astonishing. It looks fantastic, has etched plates I fitted and upgraded to NEM couplings. I have to say it runs very well. Five pole motor assembly I believe. I had no idea the 20 has a different mechanism. I think it looks great. I like the BR Blue a lot. I have the old Hornby Dublo Class 20 which I restored I love it. But this, if I find it for a decent price I'll grab one. Cheep, but cheerful, upgraded and painted to a high standard. Love it. I wish that you do more RR + stuff. I think models like this are helping Hornby a lot financially, as it's well priced and well built and it looks attractive.
The Lima Class 20 wasn't too bad, yes it was ridiculously fast! One thing that I find very apparent is the wrong buffers fitted, they should be large Oleos. Lima seemed to release the 20 with more accurate sized ones but occasionally small ones which is a bit weird, they did the same with a few models.
The square chassis slots for the axles is probably a good thing as it will lower the axle friction, which might help with such a heavy loco with an old 3 pole motor
This sort of locomotive at this price point is what we need more of. I would say though that Hornby have an annoying habit of releasing RailRoad models in very niche liveries - this being LORAM branded is a case in point. If they released it in say BR green, BR blue and maybe Railfreight red stripe they would sell like hot cakes - the few who really want a one-off livery are much more likely to be happy to modify or repaint to get it.
Seems like an ideal candidate for boxing up into a train set, track, controller, siding and 3/4 cheap wagons and you’ve potentially got a reliable set that won’t completely disillusion a younger modeller looking to enter the hobby in the traditional train set way.
I really would like Hornby to bring back the school class, or the LMS compound into the railroad plus range Sam. If they did, I would buy one for sure. Cheers Jasper & Willow
If the industry wants to bring people into the hobby, it's stuff like this we need, not yet more super-detailed models with long pre-order dates and huge price tags. The joy of getting something affordable, but nice, out of the box. Yes, to save money there's the used market - but anything I get from eBay or a fair I fully expect to have to fix. We need ready to run new models like this, especially for newer hobbyists.
A competent range of railroad plus rolling stock and locos would likely stimulated the market for young train enthusiasts (and more importantly, their parents). This, in turn, would bring many future model enthusiasts, as they mature, to the high end of the market. As a kid I was rough on my train sets and buying insanely expensive but highly detailed models would've been a complete and utter waste of money. So well done Hornby.
Hi Sam how are you? I’ve been watching your channel for some time and want to say your videos have been so helpful. I’m planning to build a proper layout back home in the states and add some new locos to my small collection. Watching your videos has helped me to look for locos I’d want to get and what I wouldn’t want to get. As for this diesel mabye one day I might snag one if I can. Can’t wait to see what you look at next have a good day God bless
Great review Sam. Class 20 is one of my favorite diesels, would very much like to have one someday… Shame you don’t have a dummy 20 for a nose-to-nose configuration. Class 20 is probably the closest thing Britain made resembling modern American diesels lol.
I swapped my class 40 traction tire wheels for regular wheels added a second motor hands down one of the best haulers behind my railroad tender and loco drive 9f
I have waiting for something like this! I believe it should ne a 10 for performance, even though it has wheel tyre, I am tempted to buy this, I am very glad Hornby did this to show they want to make better model trains
If I recall aright, the class 20 (or D8000 class in those far-off days!) was an excellent addition to the Hornby-Dublo range at much the same time as the prototypes came into service in the late 50s (?). Some of these engines have lasted very well indeed - I think BR got their money's worth with these!
Excellent value - shows what can be done! As others have commented, this is perhaps the sort of thing Hornby need to concentrate on (as well as their lovely little industrial steam and diesel locos, of course).
As a total class 20 fan (I have 3 early Bachmann models), I'd never really considered the Hornby RR/ex Lima version, but this is a revelation! The underframe is basic, and the headcode boxes look a bit crude, but it's a big improvement on the Lima 20. If Hornby make a green one, I'd definitely consider it. Maybe they should concentrate on mid- range models like this, rather than cheap Beatles tat, and leave the top-of-the-line stuff to other manufacturers.
Truly don’t understand why they aren’t doing this more. I suppose they always have the argument that someone threw out old moldings. Anyways, maybe they should split in to tiers - 1. Playtrains (cheaper) 2. Railroad (this should be the standard, as per this model you’re reviewed) (mid range price, nothing more than 150/200) 3. Finescale (this is where the smoke generator, or highly detailed models sit) I haven’t bought a ‘new’ Hornby model in years and this would bring me back. Also maybe they can consider manufacturing in uk again.
[Continued],HH-660,as they were high hoods,yard or transfer service engines! Basically,English Electric bet on a proven type design,and the longevity speaks for itself! Excellent review! Thank you 😇 😊!
I think this would be a great entry for younger kids who want model trains. Decent detail, ease of access for the poor unfortunate parents who'd have to try and figure out just what the kid broke, and all for a decent price.
The reliability and longevity of the Lima design is almost on par with the Athearn blue box mechanism from the same era. Those models were built like tanks, well designed and were extremely reliable to the point that they ended up being copied by many other manufacturers right up to today. If you look in any $300 plastic American diesel model today, you can see the influence of that classic drive.
Good to see a good review for a Hornby product. I picked up a used bachmann 20 with 21pin socket earlier this year for about this price though.. suits me better personally. My common complaint with Hornby is that they like these garish or one off liveries.. again, a personal thing was Sam likes liveries the brighter the better! I know it's BR blue but the white sticker places it much more modern I think
Hi Sam I am a fan of the RailRoad range and if you add a TXS decoder you could have sound for under £150 which is great value . I would like to see basic lighting added . Cheers Kev
Awesome video sam! Yeah, this is the kind of loco that makes the railroad range seem like high end models! My friend had a class 20 by lima in br grey livery, and it had a proper 5 pole motor in it, with a mechanism like this one, not ringfield/pancake motor! Great video as always sam :)
I have the Hornby class 20 freight set on its way because I tried buying this and couldn't find one anywhere. Fortunately the train set had been reduced quite a bit and still quite a bit cheaper than the Bachmann. Would definitely love to see a new range of railroad and I'm sure they would be popular if they don't rip the new generation off
A good review of a nice model. Yes, the hobby does need reasonably detailed models at reasonable prices. It does prompt one thought, though. I wonder how this one compares with the original Hornby Class 20...? Aside from the couplings, that is!
A perfect example of how Hornby can rerelease decades old tooling and still have it be decent! Small updates like NEM pockets and a diecast chassis, as well as the enhanced livery, all for a stunning price. Image if they gave this treatment to the GNR N2 or SR Q1, they would sell out quickly.
I've a stable of Hornby Dublo two rail steam locomotive, tinplate coaches, the whole nine yards and they are not renowned for having a wealth of detail, unlike most current models, this is the first "modern" Class 20 that I've seen that would fit in in BR Green. Think I might be treating myself, though not going DCC as that doesn't mix well with the old horseshoe magnet engine, or so I'm told.
I really like the ex Lima 20. The all wheel pickup, NEM pockets and wire handrails make it a decent upgrade in my humble opinion. Lima varied the position of the headlights depending which model was produced but unfortunately this one has the headlights at both ends in the wrong place. Lima put the big OLEO buffers on all but the pilot scheme variants of these so I don't know why this one has those tiny buffers. I've got a few of these 🙈
I got one of these with TTS sound, and while it runs. I was sadly not impressed with it's lack of pulling power, and lack of ability to crawl due to the Decoder clip. (Run fine with a blank plug) Ended up having to add lead weights and BullFrog Snot in order for it to pull a decent length of train around my clubs layout. Since bought myself a Bachmann version 20 class and have never looked back.
If Hornby continues on this path - entry level like this, mid-range, and then a high-end show piece line, they could really create something that other companies should shoot for. As for the non-driven bogie, keep in mind that every added £1 in manufacturing would be around £4 added at the point of sale ...
Limas 20 was always a good model, let down only really at the time by its lack of pickups. Its good to see Hornby have addressed that, though a pity they kept the traction tyres. Its also a shame they decided to use the old undersized buffers when they have the correct buffers which fit perfectly and look much better from the ex-lima class 47, an old detailing trick back in the day.
This model of the class 20 diesel locomotive from the Hornby Railroad plus range is 1 of the better budget model which I have seen in my entire life. It is reasonably priced and modernized to better standards. Too bad the model does have all wheel drive and proper bearings on its axles but these are just small nitpicks. Still, it is a pretty good budget model from Hornby Sam.
10:20 - I don't agree about the etched nameplate being there. That should be a vinyl decal on the prototypes or else it'd block access to the doors! From the photos I could find on Google, the Loram logo appears to be a decal on the real things.
Great review Sam of a great little loco by Hornby (I can't believe I'm saying that) I hope Hornby have changed and continue to produce quality at a sensible price! maybe a new manager has been appointed? God bless you both
You should get a second one Move the Driven Wheels from one to the other, gain all wheel drive Yes, that will require a bit of wiring It would also make for a great video
Good to see that a budget model has been given a budget price to match. Hornby really need to be consistent with their different ranges though. Whilst this 20 is apparently "Railroad Plus" which is a kind-of pointless extra tier that just muddies the water... yet Hornby frequently bring back their 155 which is an awful model originally designed by the old incarnation of Dapol... and that gets a full Railways box which makes it seem like a modern model.
Need to look at getting a class 20 for my collection at some point, most likely I’m going to get 2 and couple them Back to back, when it comes to getting the model though I’m most likely going to get the bachmann ones and may look at getting them both with sound as the 20 have that unique chopper noise that gains them their nickname.
You should review the Rivarossi Heisler locomotive. It is an unusual and interesting American loco used for logging railroads. They look quite interesting while running.
Doesn't the dog logo indicate it's a Scottish depot allocation? It'll be interesting to see if Hornby increases the rrp for this loco - I wouldn't put it pass them!
You’ve got a literal ghost train. Or it could be an alien train. Speaking of sci fi, I know a class 20 was uses as an armoured Russian train in one of the James Bond films.
Waterman's 20188, in Goldeneye, filmed at Nene Valley. There is amateur footage on YT of the tank crash and explosion sequence! The loco is starring at the Bluebell diesel gala in Sept. 6-8th, if you wish to see it..
Watching the video, great review, was watching as you reversed onto the freight, not sure if am right or not, I thought that the wheels under the cab wasn't moving when crawling.
When you mention the mechanism, you said that it has 4 driven axles, whereas it only has 2 driven axles, .This can lead to some confusion among people watching this video. It's a shame that it doesn't have 4 axle drive,. I wonder if using something like Micro crystal clear would improve the look of the headlights,.
Lights should be a basic required for a loco these days, even a railroad one…but…why don’t Hornby develop lighting kits, sell a kit, maybe a tool kit separately as well to make small changes to models to add lighting. Use a motor or board that allowed easy adaption and then people can make their railroad models better while developing their skills in the hobby!
What does this black sign with the silver-coloured dog on it actaully mean? Pickups on wheels with traction tires are not wasted because at least in curves the flanges touch the rails, as well as when turnouts let the loco follow a curvature.
Very Illuminating! Just for completeness, have you got a 2-rail version of the oldest - tha Hornby Dublo class 20? I had one and it was very heavy, powerful and reliable. Detail felt quite good - back in the 1960s ...
Excellent and perhaps H could integrate ex Lima best practices into their own Railroad tooling a tad more. Pity no exterior lights in a slightest basic form. How typical OO. Lima H0 did have them as the cost is negligible. The disc head code argument is null in this matter. So why oh why planet OO. They can easily be applied by DIY of course. But on the whole, this lovely loco is right on the money. The meshing of the gears is a bit concerning though. Questionable how long they will actually last. That wasn't Lima's strongest point either. A well good review once again Sam. Cheerio.
This would look so much better with a bit of 3D printed underframe detail to fill the spaces alongside the bogies. Be interesting to compare with the much older Hornby Dublo Class 20 which in the day was seen as a revolutionary upgrade in detail standard but a poor choice of model to launch.
Do you get the same model in the freightmaster starter set, just painted differently? Or did horby use a lesser motor/mechanism etc? I never thought i would see the day when buying a railroad plus loco from the retailers is cheaper than a Warhammer 40k combat patrol 😆. I really hope Hornby manage to turn things around financially, because they can produce some good products when they want to.
My birthday is next Tuesday, I'm going out to Durand Union Station and do some train spotting and look at the train layout over there. I was thinking, how'd you feel about 3D printing a locomotive for my Robertville Central Railroad as a birthday present to me? I'd be happy to mail you a concept.
Sam, if they did this more often, they wouldn’t be in the terrible state they are today. I genuinely believe that.
I think so too - they need more like this!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
It would be interesting to see them change direction to produce reasonably priced and detailed beginner models to help them climb out of the rut they’re in. Instead of pushing the high end really expensive stuff.
@@Deuce_and_a_half You are 100% correct there.
It’s either “charge a lot for a rubbish model” or “charge a little for a decent one”
THIS is what the Railroad range should be like! Definitely agree this is among the best diesels in the RR range. I have an original Lima 20 (Waterman black) which is by far one of the best Lima locos they ever produced. Very smooth runner and heavy too. The upgrades on this are very nice! You should check out their RR 67 which is a Lima loco too... But it also has a diecast chassis, central motor and working lights!!
At that price, I agree it's vfm...
Thanks Timber - yeah I do think this is one of Lima's best for sure!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Yep, I have a couple of Lima 20s, and they are fabulous. This RR+ is a worthy successor.
Was once told the twenties were paired oñ Skegness route with mk 2 coàçhes
i also have a lima 20 (20187 in BRT Livery) and it is by far my best investment, runs like a dream dispite being pre owned and its age
As the Class 20s sometimes run in pairs, the price of this model means you're not going to break the bank if you want a pair of them.
Great video Sam 👍
Yeah absolutely - and the running in pairs means pulling power isn't massively important either!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I have seen two pulling the Royal Train at Aberystwyth.
I saw two pulling a nuclear flask up the WCML south of Warrington.
Does anybody else enjoy Sam's videos but don't own any model trains or have any intention of getting any? I always find them an enjoyable and satisfying watch but I can't put my finger on why.
Yes, me! I stumbled on Sam's videos when I was looking up Stephenson's Rocket for my dad. I love how genuine, fresh and honest his presentation is, and how enthusiastic he is for his hobby. All through covid, and some pretty dark political times, it's somehow been quite soothing to watch Sam talk so passionately about a purely creative hobby. I'm not the slightest bit interested in the Class 20, but time spent with Sam just cheers me up a bit. 🙂
And me. I've no model railway but enjoy these videos. Thanks Sam.
I don’t have many models, and whilst I’m happy with the decent amount I’ve got, I don’t even have space for a layout. I just watch Sam’s Trains to look at details on locomotives, and to see whether he thinks any particular models are worth buying.
Yes I do pack mine away put it in loft but in old house made in to flat and some one took it all
I get it. I was watching someone else talk about his custom thomas characters before i got back into model railroading
I wonder if this is the route Hornby should be going - not trying to be all things to all enthusiasts, but taking a good hard look at their range and picking out models that are decent, could have some enhancements done to them, and then selling them for a reasonable price. Not aiming for the niche that is the high value, perfect copy models, which is now well and truly saturated with other companies, but doing a good model that runs well and for a good price from their back catalogue - things that would appeal to a lot of people from the casual modeller and the family who might like a model railway but can't afford the silly prices?
I think so too - they should be trying to trim the fat in every aspect of their business, model range included!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Hornby have been just massively confused with where they sit in the market. For me, I recall the days of beatties, Hornby being the affordable and entry level models. Most of their range is redos from this period now 😂 but this price and quality very much is Hornbys niche, I'm hoping this is a sign that the new management have gone back to their roots and they imo will do well to focus here. This price even makes me want to buy new and I've long been a 2nd hand advocate.
@@theenigmaticst7572 l purchased a new black 5 loco with a lighted lamps new details etc by Hornby. Very good model excellent quality.
Ps, also worth the money
This is what the hobby needs. Get people buying locos at sensible prices. The vast majority of the hobbyists aren’t rivet counters or care about sprung buffers.
Go retro and call the range Lima again. Clear distinction then from the Hornby range
Oh, that is a really good idea. Make these as a revitalised "Lima" brand. What a great idea. You should write to hornby with that idea.
I obtained some replacement wheels without traction tyres from Peter's Spares and swapped them. It is still capable of hauling a decent sized train and has proper all wheel pick up. A very worthwhile improvement.
Wow! That really does seem to be the new benchmark for what Railroad Plus should be.
Ideal for youngsters. Cheap enough and robust enough, yet still enough detail to please. Great mechanism too.
Please Hornby, make more like this. Make your company suitable for children once more. Right model for the right price.
Very much agree. This can appeal to a much larger cliental. More of this sort of product could save Hornby.
I think so too - they should bring it back... and should've tooled more like it, hopefully it's not too late for them!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Blimey! A modern model that’s not falling to bits and works!
Well… it *is* 40 years old… they didn’t fall to bits and tended to work back then.
Sam,a couple of US prototypes of the same era! 1) Fairbanks-Morse H20-44; 2) Alco HH-1000,or H
This is exactly the sort of engine I would be interested in buying. It looks like a Class 20 amd goes around the track decently, that's all I want.
Well, I am disappointed that I did not see any barrels on the layout, but I did see wheeled trash cans or as you call them wheelie bins, lol. I do think you may have been a star to a star and a half harsh on Hornby but then you would have had to put an asterisk next to the name in your logbook to denote, "for the price". You did however through Hornby a bone overall so once again you're on point. I also think that locos like this are very necessary if the next generations are to pick up the hobby mantle. Just think of this loco in a starter set in time for Christmas, hum. Great review and video, Jersey Bill
Theres a starter set called the “Freightmaster” with this Class 20 in it, along with a few decent wagons and coaches, that was released somewhat recently. RRP £170 but can be found elsewhere for much cheaper. A great little set really, and definitely something Hornby should focus more on. They have always been the kings of the Train Set and this has always been a key way of getting new people, especially children, into the Hobby.
haha sorry about the lack of barrels... I actually sold all of the ones I made without keeping any for myself haha! I agree, models like this are super important for the hobby!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Good morning mukka,
This is... finally... a great development from the Margate team. I have a few of the Lima 20s but a couple of them are suffering from the cancerous mazak rot and I am occasionally doing work on the metal frames to keep them serviceable. I could buy a couple of these new ones and simply change the bodies over thus refurbishing my older units. Appears to be cost effective.
🤔
Cheers from Oz.
Gaz 😊
The railroad class 20 might honestly be my favourite Hornby Railroad model (definitely my favourite railroad diesel)! The nice livery really helps this model look good and honestly I’m thinking I might buy one of these, from a distance it’s hard to tell the difference between this and the more expensive Class 20s!!
I think it is mine too - brilliant bit of kit for the money!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Yes. If they release one in BR Blue without the Loram logo, or in green with SYP, I will definitely by a couple.
Just think, Sam. One day (soon, I hope) you’ll be able to buy an HO/OO-scale model with an actual, but small, diesel engine in it, and you would put real diesel fuel in the tank with an eensie-tiny funnel, and it would be controlled by a tiny robot in the cab that looks like a railroad engineer. Then, to control it, you give the robot an eensie-tiny timetable and switch-list! 😆🤣😝 It would be like real railroading back in the 50s and 60s, but writ small! Very small!
Couldn't agree with you more regarding the Lima class 20s. Superb models! I run mine as a u they can haul pretty much any train I throw at it. Mine had the marker discs included, untouched from when they were first made in the 1980s.
PLEASE Hornby, make more such RR+ models like this.
I think I'd have found a way to give it a "C"!
PS: I rode behind one in the early 1990s when BR ran them in pairs hauling "The Jolly Fisherman" from Derby/Nottingham to Skegness during the summer.
I do give Hornsby credit for this loco, I got mine for a steal at £50 at great electric last year and has been perfect ever since. especially for my first time with dcc
You can also exchange the bodyshell for an original Lima version. I did this with 2 x Ltd Lima bodies - so had good body shells with the DCC capability of the Hornby version. Such a simple upgrade for little money.
If Hornby releases these in early BR green I'll be getting a couple for sure!
The detail is good enough, especially for the price.
I already have a couple of Lima ones that I've repainted and upgraded a bit.
But a factory finished pair of these would be awesome. Thanks for the video.
At 04:35 the instructions show fitting headcode discs, but on the diagram the open disc is shown upside down! 😂😂😂
LORAM originated in Minneapolis, Minnesota.
Hi Sam, A brilliant review, I had two class 20s about 45 years ago. One was a Wren and the other was a Lima. I decided to go for ‘O’ gauge and purely on detail I sold Wren and kept the Lima, and it still runs today and I have also DCC chipped it. I did go for the BR Green and after you review Sam I might just even go for this Hornby one to double head them. Regards from Ron 👍😃✔️🚂
You need two if them, mate, they never look right on their own...
Saw plenty working singly early in their life but yes they look good nose to nose in pairs
Sure - they mainly ran in twos - I didn't need two to review the model though!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
Better driving position cab forward.
It's reassuringly pleasing to see struggling Hornby do something this nice for such a reasonable price.
I got one of these second hand a few years ago and it is a fantastic model!
Awesome! Yeah very good isn't it?
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I saw the IE "Small GM" in the background :P
Hi Sam, nice video 👍🏻I purchased one of these several months ago, I agree the upgrades hornby have done a fine job and mine too has the wobble, it’s to see a loco that doesn’t cost a fortune and will help with people on a low budget.
I think so too - amazing what difference a small number of upgrades can make!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
This is definitely what Hornby should do much more of. A higher sales volume of locos like this would help them no end. The shouty professional modelers who want to pay £400 wouldn’t like it but they could go elsewhere and leave us cost-conscious folk to build their fleets around Railroad products. Great job, Hornby!
I have bought the Class 73 in the Railroad + livery and I'm blown away by it. The model had a HM7000 chip inside which I took out and put into my Lord Nelson. If you deduct the price for the decoder, which is about 55£ at the retailers, the loco costs about 50 quid which I think it astonishing. It looks fantastic, has etched plates I fitted and upgraded to NEM couplings. I have to say it runs very well. Five pole motor assembly I believe. I had no idea the 20 has a different mechanism. I think it looks great. I like the BR Blue a lot. I have the old Hornby Dublo Class 20 which I restored I love it. But this, if I find it for a decent price I'll grab one. Cheep, but cheerful, upgraded and painted to a high standard. Love it. I wish that you do more RR + stuff. I think models like this are helping Hornby a lot financially, as it's well priced and well built and it looks attractive.
The Lima Class 20 wasn't too bad, yes it was ridiculously fast! One thing that I find very apparent is the wrong buffers fitted, they should be large Oleos. Lima seemed to release the 20 with more accurate sized ones but occasionally small ones which is a bit weird, they did the same with a few models.
Yeah even at the time it was good - these upgrades make it even better though!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I think my 2 Limas have the big buffers.
The square chassis slots for the axles is probably a good thing as it will lower the axle friction, which might help with such a heavy loco with an old 3 pole motor
This sort of locomotive at this price point is what we need more of. I would say though that Hornby have an annoying habit of releasing RailRoad models in very niche liveries - this being LORAM branded is a case in point. If they released it in say BR green, BR blue and maybe Railfreight red stripe they would sell like hot cakes - the few who really want a one-off livery are much more likely to be happy to modify or repaint to get it.
Seems like an ideal candidate for boxing up into a train set, track, controller, siding and 3/4 cheap wagons and you’ve potentially got a reliable set that won’t completely disillusion a younger modeller looking to enter the hobby in the traditional train set way.
I really would like Hornby to bring back the school class, or the LMS compound into the railroad plus range Sam. If they did, I would buy one for sure.
Cheers Jasper & Willow
Yeah the 4-4-0s would be lovely to see back too!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
If the industry wants to bring people into the hobby, it's stuff like this we need, not yet more super-detailed models with long pre-order dates and huge price tags. The joy of getting something affordable, but nice, out of the box. Yes, to save money there's the used market - but anything I get from eBay or a fair I fully expect to have to fix. We need ready to run new models like this, especially for newer hobbyists.
A competent range of railroad plus rolling stock and locos would likely stimulated the market for young train enthusiasts (and more importantly, their parents). This, in turn, would bring many future model enthusiasts, as they mature, to the high end of the market.
As a kid I was rough on my train sets and buying insanely expensive but highly detailed models would've been a complete and utter waste of money. So well done Hornby.
I've fitted a TXS decoder to this model and although its tight for room it sounds great.
I was literally just on the hornby website shopping for one of these lol
haha awesome!
Did you buy it?
@@Gatherleymodeller. no its to expensive
@@Train.guy. fair
Hi Sam how are you? I’ve been watching your channel for some time and want to say your videos have been so helpful. I’m planning to build a proper layout back home in the states and add some new locos to my small collection. Watching your videos has helped me to look for locos I’d want to get and what I wouldn’t want to get. As for this diesel mabye one day I might snag one if I can. Can’t wait to see what you look at next have a good day God bless
Great review Sam. Class 20 is one of my favorite diesels, would very much like to have one someday…
Shame you don’t have a dummy 20 for a nose-to-nose configuration. Class 20 is probably the closest thing Britain made resembling modern American diesels lol.
I swapped my class 40 traction tire wheels for regular wheels added a second motor hands down one of the best haulers behind my railroad tender and loco drive 9f
Ahh fantastic - very worthy upgrades!!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
I have waiting for something like this! I believe it should ne a 10 for performance, even though it has wheel tyre, I am tempted to buy this, I am very glad Hornby did this to show they want to make better model trains
If I recall aright, the class 20 (or D8000 class in those far-off days!) was an excellent addition to the Hornby-Dublo range at much the same time as the prototypes came into service in the late 50s (?). Some of these engines have lasted very well indeed - I think BR got their money's worth with these!
Excellent value - shows what can be done! As others have commented, this is perhaps the sort of thing Hornby need to concentrate on (as well as their lovely little industrial steam and diesel locos, of course).
I agree - amazing value for the money! More like this would definitely help them I think!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
As a total class 20 fan (I have 3 early Bachmann models), I'd never really considered the Hornby RR/ex Lima version, but this is a revelation! The underframe is basic, and the headcode boxes look a bit crude, but it's a big improvement on the Lima 20. If Hornby make a green one, I'd definitely consider it. Maybe they should concentrate on mid- range models like this, rather than cheap Beatles tat, and leave the top-of-the-line stuff to other manufacturers.
Truly don’t understand why they aren’t doing this more. I suppose they always have the argument that someone threw out old moldings. Anyways, maybe they should split in to tiers -
1. Playtrains (cheaper)
2. Railroad (this should be the standard, as per this model you’re reviewed) (mid range price, nothing more than 150/200)
3. Finescale (this is where the smoke generator, or highly detailed models sit)
I haven’t bought a ‘new’ Hornby model in years and this would bring me back. Also maybe they can consider manufacturing in uk again.
Alright ratings Sam and good review video by the way 32:14
[Continued],HH-660,as they were high hoods,yard or transfer service engines! Basically,English Electric bet on a proven type design,and the longevity speaks for itself! Excellent review! Thank you 😇 😊!
I have just bought a railroad P2 and I find it really quite good. Love the railroad range.
I think this would be a great entry for younger kids who want model trains. Decent detail, ease of access for the poor unfortunate parents who'd have to try and figure out just what the kid broke, and all for a decent price.
The reliability and longevity of the Lima design is almost on par with the Athearn blue box mechanism from the same era. Those models were built like tanks, well designed and were extremely reliable to the point that they ended up being copied by many other manufacturers right up to today. If you look in any $300 plastic American diesel model today, you can see the influence of that classic drive.
Good to see a good review for a Hornby product. I picked up a used bachmann 20 with 21pin socket earlier this year for about this price though.. suits me better personally. My common complaint with Hornby is that they like these garish or one off liveries.. again, a personal thing was Sam likes liveries the brighter the better! I know it's BR blue but the white sticker places it much more modern I think
Hi Sam
I am a fan of the RailRoad range and if you add a TXS decoder you could have sound for under £150 which is great value .
I would like to see basic lighting added .
Cheers Kev
Awesome video sam! Yeah, this is the kind of loco that makes the railroad range seem like high end models! My friend had a class 20 by lima in br grey livery, and it had a proper 5 pole motor in it, with a mechanism like this one, not ringfield/pancake motor! Great video as always sam :)
Was that me??
@@Gatherleymodeller. perhaps
I have the Hornby class 20 freight set on its way because I tried buying this and couldn't find one anywhere. Fortunately the train set had been reduced quite a bit and still quite a bit cheaper than the Bachmann. Would definitely love to see a new range of railroad and I'm sure they would be popular if they don't rip the new generation off
A good review of a nice model. Yes, the hobby does need reasonably detailed models at reasonable prices. It does prompt one thought, though. I wonder how this one compares with the original Hornby Class 20...? Aside from the couplings, that is!
A perfect example of how Hornby can rerelease decades old tooling and still have it be decent! Small updates like NEM pockets and a diecast chassis, as well as the enhanced livery, all for a stunning price. Image if they gave this treatment to the GNR N2 or SR Q1, they would sell out quickly.
I've a stable of Hornby Dublo two rail steam locomotive, tinplate coaches, the whole nine yards and they are not renowned for having a wealth of detail, unlike most current models, this is the first "modern" Class 20 that I've seen that would fit in in BR Green. Think I might be treating myself, though not going DCC as that doesn't mix well with the old horseshoe magnet engine, or so I'm told.
I really like the ex Lima 20. The all wheel pickup, NEM pockets and wire handrails make it a decent upgrade in my humble opinion. Lima varied the position of the headlights depending which model was produced but unfortunately this one has the headlights at both ends in the wrong place. Lima put the big OLEO buffers on all but the pilot scheme variants of these so I don't know why this one has those tiny buffers. I've got a few of these 🙈
I got one of these with TTS sound, and while it runs.
I was sadly not impressed with it's lack of pulling power, and lack of ability to crawl due to the Decoder clip. (Run fine with a blank plug)
Ended up having to add lead weights and BullFrog Snot in order for it to pull a decent length of train around my clubs layout.
Since bought myself a Bachmann version 20 class and have never looked back.
If Hornby continues on this path - entry level like this, mid-range, and then a high-end show piece line, they could really create something that other companies should shoot for. As for the non-driven bogie, keep in mind that every added £1 in manufacturing would be around £4 added at the point of sale ...
Limas 20 was always a good model, let down only really at the time by its lack of pickups. Its good to see Hornby have addressed that, though a pity they kept the traction tyres. Its also a shame they decided to use the old undersized buffers when they have the correct buffers which fit perfectly and look much better from the ex-lima class 47, an old detailing trick back in the day.
It’s superb that class 20. I wacked a hm7000 sound decoder in, and there’s plenty of room for the speaker 👍 bargain. So heavy as well.
If there was consistent quality at a fair price across the range Hornby would have a future. A nice value 20. Cheers Sam
This model of the class 20 diesel locomotive from the Hornby Railroad plus range is 1 of the better budget model which I have seen in my entire life. It is reasonably priced and modernized to better standards. Too bad the model does have all wheel drive and proper bearings on its axles but these are just small nitpicks. Still, it is a pretty good budget model from Hornby Sam.
10:20 - I don't agree about the etched nameplate being there. That should be a vinyl decal on the prototypes or else it'd block access to the doors! From the photos I could find on Google, the Loram logo appears to be a decal on the real things.
The Loram sign is only a vinyl. If it was a plate the side doors wouldn’t open!
You think there should be an etched plate for something that's a vinyl sticker in real life? Interesting...
So for about £60 for the loco and £60 for a HM7000 decoder, you have a DCC Sound Loco for about £130! Insane!
Great review Sam of a great little loco by Hornby (I can't believe I'm saying that) I hope Hornby have changed and continue to produce quality at a sensible price! maybe a new manager has been appointed? God bless you both
Awesome Sam
Like the snot holding the motor in situ.
Perhaps Sam could put the railroad range (and other cheap ranges) in a different ranking board, also X2 powered boogies is worth an extra £10.
You should get a second one
Move the Driven Wheels from one to the other, gain all wheel drive
Yes, that will require a bit of wiring
It would also make for a great video
Between Bachmann and Hornby, maybe the Class 20 just has good luck!
21:16 I didn't know it came with a ghost Sam. Hornby should have mentioned that in there product listing. Lol
Cheers Jasper & Willow
Apparently it can "crawl out of the box", so clearly there is something creepy going on 🙂
haha I agree - very spooky!
Thanks for watching - Sam :)
My favourite Diesel.
I had a Lima one and it ran like a dream.
Not a fan of the big white logo on the side though.
Good to see that a budget model has been given a budget price to match. Hornby really need to be consistent with their different ranges though. Whilst this 20 is apparently "Railroad Plus" which is a kind-of pointless extra tier that just muddies the water... yet Hornby frequently bring back their 155 which is an awful model originally designed by the old incarnation of Dapol... and that gets a full Railways box which makes it seem like a modern model.
I like the intro music much better on this video
Need to look at getting a class 20 for my collection at some point, most likely I’m going to get 2 and couple them Back to back, when it comes to getting the model though I’m most likely going to get the bachmann ones and may look at getting them both with sound as the 20 have that unique chopper noise that gains them their nickname.
You should review the Rivarossi Heisler locomotive. It is an unusual and interesting American loco used for logging railroads. They look quite interesting while running.
Doesn't the dog logo indicate it's a Scottish depot allocation? It'll be interesting to see if Hornby increases the rrp for this loco - I wouldn't put it pass them!
Sam the LORAM was never a plate in real life so that’s why it’s not etched
Wish I’d seen this model I’ve just spent an arm and a leg on a Bachman Harry Needle 20 😢
I love Class 20''s and this is great for the price !
When DCC fitted you may be able to tweak max speed etc to more desirable levels.
You’ve got a literal ghost train. Or it could be an alien train. Speaking of sci fi, I know a class 20 was uses as an armoured Russian train in one of the James Bond films.
Waterman's 20188, in Goldeneye, filmed at Nene Valley. There is amateur footage on YT of the tank crash and explosion sequence! The loco is starring at the Bluebell diesel gala in Sept. 6-8th, if you wish to see it..
@@vickielawless Cool. Thanks for jogging my memory. I knew it was a Pierce Brosnan movie. Nice that this movie star class 20 is up and running.
Watching the video, great review, was watching as you reversed onto the freight, not sure if am right or not, I thought that the wheels under the cab wasn't moving when crawling.
When you mention the mechanism, you said that it has 4 driven axles, whereas it only has 2 driven axles, .This can lead to some confusion among people watching this video. It's a shame that it doesn't have 4 axle drive,. I wonder if using something like Micro crystal clear would improve the look of the headlights,.
Lights should be a basic required for a loco these days, even a railroad one…but…why don’t Hornby develop lighting kits, sell a kit, maybe a tool kit separately as well to make small changes to models to add lighting. Use a motor or board that allowed easy adaption and then people can make their railroad models better while developing their skills in the hobby!
I'm not really a big fan of diesels Sam, but great review.
Cheers Jasper & Willow
No worries - thanks for looking anyway!
this is the step in the right direction that you should take Hornby
What does this black sign with the silver-coloured dog on it actaully mean?
Pickups on wheels with traction tires are not wasted because at least in curves the flanges touch the rails, as well as when turnouts let the loco follow a curvature.
Very Illuminating! Just for completeness, have you got a 2-rail version of the oldest - tha Hornby Dublo class 20? I had one and it was very heavy, powerful and reliable. Detail felt quite good - back in the 1960s ...
Hopefully that Loram sticker is easy to peel off.
Excellent and perhaps H could integrate ex Lima best practices into their own Railroad tooling a tad more. Pity no exterior lights in a slightest basic form. How typical OO. Lima H0 did have them as the cost is negligible. The disc head code argument is null in this matter. So why oh why planet OO. They can easily be applied by DIY of course. But on the whole, this lovely loco is right on the money. The meshing of the gears is a bit concerning though. Questionable how long they will actually last. That wasn't Lima's strongest point either. A well good review once again Sam. Cheerio.
This would look so much better with a bit of 3D printed underframe detail to fill the spaces alongside the bogies. Be interesting to compare with the much older Hornby Dublo Class 20 which in the day was seen as a revolutionary upgrade in detail standard but a poor choice of model to launch.
Do you get the same model in the freightmaster starter set, just painted differently? Or did horby use a lesser motor/mechanism etc?
I never thought i would see the day when buying a railroad plus loco from the retailers is cheaper than a Warhammer 40k combat patrol 😆. I really hope Hornby manage to turn things around financially, because they can produce some good products when they want to.
My birthday is next Tuesday, I'm going out to Durand Union Station and do some train spotting and look at the train layout over there. I was thinking, how'd you feel about 3D printing a locomotive for my Robertville Central Railroad as a birthday present to me? I'd be happy to mail you a concept.