Dreaded AFM DOD Lifter Failure Explained
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- čas přidán 22. 12. 2023
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My 2010 siverado has AFM with 233000 miles and is still holding up. The key for me was that I changed the oil more than twice as often as recommended. Yes, it's more money but still cheaper than the downtime and cost of repairs.
You are exactly right high quality 0W-20 and good filter.
What oil change interval did you use?
@M4sterT3ch let me just say it's less than half of what the manufacturer recommends, which is 7500. No way I'm going that long with AFM.
@user-yq4hn8hf9q Yea, definitely not. 5000 max is all I'd ever do. 3000 to 5000 is a good place to be.
Every time I see something about GM's AFM it reminds me of the V8-6-4 Cadillacs came with in 1981. The computer would deactivate rocker arms and injectors to reduce the engine to 6 or 4 cylinders depending on load. I rode in one with barely 5K miles and it would hunt between modes noticably sometimes. They were only put in passenger models 1 model year
Engineers are usually very intelligent, however they have bosses that may be listening to EPA who has demanded this new and unimpressive idea that making a V8 into a V4 should automatically give better mpg even though the V4 configuration will be working harder to move the truck down the road. Which is why the new turbo I4 doesn’t get any better mpg than the 5.3L V8.
I have a friend that is a Chrysler enthusiast and an oil engineer, he said if you don't run the oil recommended by the manufacturer that it will cause those lifters to fail because they don't function properly if the oil is too heavy. This made me wonder how many people go to oil change places that use bulk oil and not the actual weight recommended by the manufacturer.
When it rains it pours 😢
Bulk oil does come in all the weights. It's up to the monkey at the jiffy lube to choose the correct weight.
@@M4sterT3ch I’ve read and heard too many stories of mistakes made at oil change franchises and even dealerships. In gonna continue to do my own as long as I’m able so I know the oil and filter are correct and everything is done right
@@Gracies_vlogs Yup, that's the best method. Ensure it's done correctly.
Chevy, Dodge, Ford, doesn't matter... All these AFM systems are garbage. Buy Japanese. Only 1s downgrading cylinders, making equal power, less problems, and no DOD/AFM/CDOD (Cylinder Deactivation On Demand). Good show sir. Really glad the wifey is doing "better", and you are making headway. Hustle on!!!
I deleted my AFM with a RANGE plug n play in the data port. My 2017 Chey Silverado 5.3 gets better fuel milage and now does not have a transmission shudder caused by the engine & trans computers fighting over shift and speed points because of lack of power. I also changed to 5w30 full synthetic oil and got rid of the sewing machine noise under the hood. Thanks for the videos Merry Christmas and Happy New Year
Only way to go, but it was too late for my 2010 Silverado, had to go with the new engine, but it has been deleted since, 185000 out of it... and yes you're right full synthetic Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5w30 from now on in everything...
@@lynch6642 I've used Quaker State 10w30 full synthetic since 1988 in all my trucks after 500 break in miles on factory oil and never had any problems. Couldn't get any 10w30 QS last change so had to go with 5w30.
The plug in device did not delete afm. Just turned it off in the ecm. Only way to delete it is replace cam and lifters then disable it with hp tuners
@@joem4746 I know this is not a true delete but it is the terminology i used
Disable is the correct terminology
I plugged in a Range device which plugs into the diagnostic port. Just tricks computer into in my case leaving it in 6 cylinder mode all the time. I even had what I thought was torque converter shudder but stopped that also. No change in fuel mileage. Runs great and you can remove at anytime and goes back to factory settings. Several friends have used this and they have great results also
Thanks for breaking this problem down to explain it thoroughly
Been reading quite a bit about MDS in chrysler hemi and AFM inn GM engines, what I found is that the mileage is not that much different when it gets activated because the ECM makes the cylinders working get more air and fuel to compensate the cylinders shut down. It also said that the weak springs can;t keep the lifter in contact with the cam and starts slapping the cam which breaks the bearings in the rollers. Wrong oil or lack of changes also contribute to failures. I would rather have flat tappet setup and use zinc oil on every oil change.
Disabling DOD activation in the PCM can eliminate oil consumption and spark plug fouling that occurs on the DOD cylinders when running in 4 cylinder mode. I do PCM programming and have disabled it on hundreds of local trucks. I recently bought a used 2013 GMC Sierra with 75K miles on it and before I ever drove it odd the dealer's not I programmed DOD out of the PCM. Also with the 6 speed transmissions, the TCM calibration slips the torque converter lock up clutch 20 rpm in 8 cylinder mode and 40 rpm in 4 cylinder mode when TCC lockup is commanded so you are wearing out the clutch lining more when DOD is active. TCC lockup clutch failure is the #1 problem with the 6L80/90 transmissions.
I have a 13 with DOD with 75k miles. What did you do to reprogram it?
Had a 06 Chevy Impala SS with the 5.3 that had DOD. At 30K it started using oil and fouling plugs 1 and 7. The Chevy dealership found a TSB on it that gave some suggestions but towards the end it suggested changing the heads due to "nicked" valve stems. If you had a Silverado or Sierra pick up they would warranty the repair. But no warranty applied to a passenger car, such as the Impala, or the Buick that used that very same engine.
@drewspangler3370 I use a product called HP Tuners. It is a cable that plugs into the OBD2 Port and software that runs on a laptop that allows editing the calibration in the vehicle ECM.
Thanks Kenny. Merry Christmas ‼️
I remember those! They made my ears pop when I'd hear them!! Nice video
Darn good information. Thank you sir. Sorry your heat is out. Try to keep warm. Merry Christmas and New Year
Great video Kenny. Its a racket from the car companies. They don't care about the customer, they just care about making money.
I really enjoy your show. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
The strange thing about the Chrysler Hemi is that MDS (multi cylinder displacement) was introduced in 05 and the lifter issues didn't start until 2009 when they added variable cam timing. The engine hp also went up about 50 hp and maybe the cams had higher lift putting more stress on the lifters causing them to fail. I don't know.
MDS is multiple displacement system
The lifter issue with Hemi's has nothing to do with MDS. In fact, there are just as many lifter failures on manual trans cars (so no MDS). Mine was an auto but the 4 lifters that failed were not MDS lifters.
Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Hello Kenny, sorry to hear about your heat pump. You did an incredible job of explaining this system. Poor design, definitely, lack of oil changes doesn't help, using the wrong weight of oil isn't wise.
Gr8. A free bucket
Excellent video.
Great. !
Thanks Kenny for the explaination. I have wonder just how they did this.Merry Christmas to you and yours.ck,wisc.
Good evening Mr Kenny just wanted to wish y'all a very Merry Christmas 🎄
2007 for most 5.3's from my understanding for the first year of DoD.
Glad I have the 4.8 V8 vortec. No AFM. Same Block just different Stroke and Pistons and no AFM parts.
Had a 2013 GM 5.3 and one of those lifters failed with only 16K I got rid of that truck soon after Lemon lots of issues. DOD is engine killers
This is why I switched to Ford F150 with 5.0 and love it! Great power and good fuel economy 👍
ford has it since 2021. let the problems begin!!
@@jonpeterson4085
They don’t use pushrods so maybe it will be more reliable
CDJR utilizes a system called Multi Displacement System (MDS) on their vehicles. 👍
I believe Cadillac was the first manufacturer that used cylinder delete technology back in about 1980 or so. It too was a miserable failure. I'm not sure how they accomplished the cylinder delete. I do remember talking to guys who told me it didn't work well.
You are 100% correct on that being a very poor design. Did the engineers think they were solving the compression resistance that has to be overcome with the deactivated cylinders? Reminds me of the new low-tension piston rings that (I'm guessing) are suppose to increase gas mileage by reducing the friction between the rings & the cylinder walls.
The energy that it takes to compress the air is mostly regained when the compressed air helps force the pistons back down.
It looks like the bean counters got a little too carried away
Cam damage occurs when they fail in the stuck down position, the lifter is free balling up and down, breaks the basket they run in and the lifter turns and it chews up the cam. On the Chryslers its rarely the lifter that fails. The Chrysler failures is oiling issues , usually around cylinder 3 (the modulated cylinders are 1,4,6,7 on both manufacturers), not an MDS cylinder. The part that fails is the roller on the tip. This will chew up the cam. I have done the deletes, reprograms, and the OE repair on all of these engines.
Luckily I got 250k out of mine before it started the intermittent tick and miss fire. So I'm fixing my 97 Chevy and not worry about it anymore. scoggins n dickey has a non AFM cam and lifter kit for the GM
Yup, that lifter looks EXACTLY like the one i pulled out of my buddy's 07 sierra. he wasnt the greatest with preventative maintenance 😆. My 08 sierra has this system. I immediately bought a superchips programmer and turned off the AFM. I bought the truck KNOWING that it had an excellent history for oil changes. I change the oil every 4500 miles with full synthetic and have not had an issue yet. I put a little over 30,000 miles on the truck since i've owned it.
I disabled mine with a tuner and change my oil every 3k with full synthetic to keep the internals as clean as possible in hopes of prolonging the engine. If it ever cuts loose, I will delete it physically and electronically with the tuner. Might accidentally slide a nice cam in while im there. 😂😂😂😂 Strange thing is, ever since I did the delete, my truck keeps running rich because it thinks I'm running a high ethanol blend. I have a bi directional scan tool so i have to keep resetting the alcohol content in the fuel. I upgrade my tumer to a HPtuner so I can also delete the flex fuel BS. Gm used a virtual sensor to figure out fuel content. Once i delete the flex fuel crap, I am going to reprogram the air fuel ratio to run off a wide band sensor. I can't wait to get everything squared away. This truck was my fathers who passed 2 yrs ago. I gave up a much higher value Toyota with less miles to make sure my mom had a reliable comfortable vehicle that she could drive and to keep the truck in the family. Its only ever been registered to my dad and I. I hope to someday, register it to my son who was named after my father.
At 10:07
Oh No, Train of Thought Derailment in Progress! 😁
Thanks for the Video. Interesting.
Mike in San Diego. 🌞🎸🚀🖖
Ken I have a 07 Suburban with DOD and no VVT. 96k miles. Still running good on synthetic oil. Oil changed often with filter. Replaced tinny filter below the sender when I replaced the sending unit at about 75k. Also went into the pan and replaced the oil pickup tube o ring. It was flat and hard. Idle oil pressure hot is 20 psi at idle. 40 psi cold at idle. No lifter noise, yet. I think it will go 200k.
I've owned a 2011 5.3 with 321k miles and a 2015 5.3 with 260k miles all have zero problems with AFM still in place
👍👍
Interesting video but I'll never see one of those lifters personally, won't buy a vehicle with that stuff and I won't work on other folks vehicles any more. Keep the goo stuff coming.
Ive seen alot of GM lifter roller failure on pickups
I have a 2013 GMC Sierra with 5.3 liter. I deleted my AFM by software disable in the ECU. I reset the mileage counter when I did this. I have noticed no change in mileage as recorded by the trucks computer.
My son has a 2007 with afm. He has a dongle to plug in that cancels activation.
i bought one of the 2013's and already had a 2000 same motor. 2000 needed alot of work has all kinds of random misfire issues, this one only had problems when i over filled the tank, replaced the two problem children the charcoal filter and the engine egr or what ever connected to the charcoal filer, the low power mode issue was gone, still has rich fuel on both banks, but from the original owner having it for 68k miles at 16.8mpg i got it up to 17.1 before i over filled the tank and it has remained there with no delete, but i drive like a grandpa or a formula1 driver as turd herd requires when my cruise control fails to keep me out of stupid people trying to crash with me. i do alot of coasting and try to keep my foot off the brakes. my 2000 got better gas mileage at 17.4 same motor, only thing different is the new obama requirements, which was designed to meet the law that auto makers had to try and meet the requirements, not actually meet them because it wasn't possible for them to do so with trucks...idc i'm driving a truck to do work with, not haul my sorry butt to retail shopping and work and schools, like every one else. 16' car trailer is on 1-3 times a week going 30-120 miles round trip. box is for holding tools and some work materials from dirt/rock/mulch to machine parts 3-5 times a week
So glad we have the Federal Government watching out for us and forcing the auto industry to come up with all these new and costly (but ineffective) ways to reduce gas consumption. NOT! It's good to have efficient and clean running vehicles, but not at the expense of mechanical reliability.
Same old crap all the time about how BAD it is to have the Federal Gubamint trying to make your life better by reducing air pollution. Like the big corporations will do that if we just wait for it. Well try this on for size: Corporations ARE governments. They're just not responsible to you like the Federal, State, & local governments are supposed to be.
Think about it. Do Corporations have parents or founding documents? Do they have a brain or a Chief Executive Officer?
value lifter oil manifold bolts tourque, and the screen hopefully helps prevent a stuck lifter , the screen will cause oil starving as it get clogged and lose bolts will cause low oil pressure at the oil towers going to the AFM/DOD lifters , 18 FT pounds. New oil pressure sensors screen and tourque check and defiantly tune it out .
Hi Kenny, I have a 2009 G8 GT- I bought it new at the dealer you worked at in NY. It's got these lifters,is it safe to just have a tuner "shut it off" or do I have to worry about them falling apart and ruining the motor? I had a tick and adding a little Marvel Mys oil made it go away,but I'm leary of the lifters.
There's a reason those GM engines hold 8 quarts of oil and those AFM lifters won't last when dry.
So which scanner will do the AFM delete?
Poor design..Merry Christmas to you and your family..
I have a 2014 GMC Sierra with the 5.3 and have a tune that shuts that stuff off and it stays in 8 cylinder mode 24/7. Hopefully I never have to replace the cam/lifters but if I do, that crap isn't going back in. I get an average of 17 mpg around town and I've got as good as 21 on the open road so why bother with AFM....
Thanks for the education; those DODs are DOA😆
Try as they might, GM just can't seem to fix this issue.
What is that work table you’re using? I’d love something like that for random projects
All that technology to save so little gas. Get that heat working, hope a warranty came with that house you just bought.
Tripping over dollars to save pennies. 😂
Never did see the programmer that you used to disable the afm you said you were going to list in the description
I added it to the description for the video. Thanks for pointing that out, and for watching! 🔧
cold ?? how cold do you get in January, central Nebr we get -40+ with out the wind chill.
He says this while the big garage door is open??
The point isn't to actually get better fuel economy the point is to please their government overlords,, and that was the only point..
GM takes a bulletproof engine and adds all that crap to it for a claimed one and a half MPG highway ???
It's all about CAFE standards and not getting reamed by the government over them...
What would happen if you used a non DOD Cam and ls7 lifters and did NOT plug the oil holes in the block and just reused the stock valley tray. Kinda a pain to drop the pan and block the bypass and relocate the oil sending unit.
The "emergency" electric heaters aren't working either?
GM has known about this problem for years but as far as I know has refused to either fix it or offer a button to shut the system off. All for an extra .5 mpg fuel advantage to please the government.
I'll take my old 305 any time 19 mpg hwy 4bbl stick
That 305 is a good engine. When those secondaries open up the fun begins! Miss that old Caprice that had one in it.
It didn't work out over 40 years ago with the Cadillac V8-6-4, so why would it work out now?
The Problem is with the Badge on the front of the vehicle. Look for a Blue Oval next time 😂
The problem is with the blue oval!
You must be joking. I and my whole family used to bleed Ford blue. Then the super duties came along. The first ones were pretty solid but hard to work on. But then you started seeing trash like the 6.0 and the 5.4 3 valve. Too bad because they were very solid capable trucks otherwise. Honestly I think the big 3 are all trash now for various reasons.
@@gatesj777 The Coyote replaced the 3 valve tritons years ago and they are pretty solid.
I have to wonder why GM hasn't recalled the afm and the auto transmission shutter problem? Does anyone have a recommendation for a programmer for a Silverado 1500 6.2l 4x4 8speed automatic transmission??
Call around your local mechanics, that's what I did and he charged me $25
Find someone with HP Tuners and have them turn off TCC lockup in gears 1-5 and and speeds below 55 mph.
Recalls cost the manufacturers a lot of money. Lawsuits basically have to pile up before they decide that it makes more financial sense to institute a recall of the defect. Once upon a time they may have done it for good customer relations, but good luck finding that mindset nowadays!
Dude close the garage door!
For all you commenters saying this is the governments fault need to know the laws don’t tell the manufacturers how to do it. The manufacturers engineers design this stuff and the success or failure might be due to the regulatory hurdles being just to difficult or the engineers aren’t qualified or the accounting managers demand cheap or the marketing department says do it cheap by cutting money spent on durability and the board of directors say max profit now and the hell with the customer. All I’m saying is let’s not let the entire industry off the hook for the super expensive low quality stuff that’s being made today by blaming it on the gov’ment
your exhaust is blowing white smoke
One cause is oil changes not done on time and using the wrong grade oil.Jasper does sell them with the AFM delete already done with their 5.3 remans with afm,comes with a Diablo tuner
I will stay with old school all this new crap is just that crap in my opinion.
yep agreed. stuipedist lifter out there. gm wont cover it . at 100 bucks per and need 8 of them. your pushin big money for there mistake.i use a plug in. i leave it. works great. thats right no change in mpg.. if your in flat land maybe worth it. but in hill or mt areas not good. iam in mt area so worthless to me. on n off on n off.. so glad i got the plug in mod for it. works awsome no more on n off less worry
You can blame the government for the lifters and variable valve timing. These know-it-alls with no engineering or mechanical background passed the legislation which forced the automakers to develop and implement these insane, complex and costly technologies all in the name of fuel efficiency. Politicians should stick to politics.
Engineers should also come up with better designs. Reliability should always be factored into the equation.
Most people have a leadfoot
AFM is the biggest friggen joke that GM ever designed! The sad part is that GM has never fixed it and refused to take ownership of the oil consumption! GM started this design in about 2005 on a few vehicles but went full time on the 07.5 silverados. I have the o7.5 and my son has the 07. 07 is a way better truck! We did what you're talking about, Kenny and bought the adapter so as not to switch back and forth from 4 to 8 cylinders. We did it about ten years ago. There is absolutely no difference in the mileage. It's just too bad that GM refuses to take ownership of their mistake. The sad part of it all is too much government interference and therefore all car makers have this or a similar design. They all are a joke!! Can we just go back to the 70's when they actually built a truck that you could use as a truck?!
4.8 does not have DOD
$.8 usually comes with the basic work truck , Thats what I have bought in the past .
It’s just a piss poor design that is prone to fail from the factory!!! My ‘07 Silverado has a 5.3 afm engine. Even tho I have a blocker on it to keep it in V8 mode, I still feel like I’m driving a time bomb, just waiting for it to fly apart!!! To rid the engine of all that scrap would cost around $4,000!!! Redicioulas!!!! General Motors should be made to replace all these junk engines for free.
EXCELLENT video explanation, But better yet, DON'T buy any (G)arbage (M)otors, Problem solved!
Definitely a bad design.
over engineered for no reason.
Why not just turn off injectors. Let the valves continue to move. Never understood why they had to have special lifters.
The most likely reason is the air that is being compressed in the deactivated cylinders. If the valves allow air to enter & be compressed, it is causing a load that the engine has to overcome - kind of defeats the purpose of only deactivating the spark & fuel only.
I never understood it either. Of course you have the compression cycle using torque but it seems like it would be offset by the combustion cycle. Yes, of course I know there’s no combustion taking place but the compressed air would be pushing down on the piston as it goes back down. I wonder if it’s somehow to prevent wear on the rings or something. Or would it suck fuel away from the cylinders next to it maybe?
You should replace the heat pump with a propane fired furnace.
Dude, you need to get at least a cheap tripod for your phone. Very annoying to watch you struggle one handed through a phone camera bouncing around in you other hand
I dont like the way the mfrs try to cram this afm crap down peoples throats. When you buy a car, you should have a choice as to whether you want it or not. One of the reasons I just wont be buying a new car, and just stick with my old car.
Really fricken annoying watching you rooting around one handed , frustration plus
sorry brother
Now I'd seen a video on this very subject. And it was implied that putting the shifter in manual and selecting 6, the engine runs in V8 mode. No tuner needed.
🧐The dod switching from off to on back and forth hundreds of times eventually wears them out. Just like any switch will wear out eventually. Engine manufacturers forced epa standards...🫡☃️🔧❄️