I Bought The Cheapest Cummins You Can Buy: Here’s How It Compares To An Expensive One!
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- čas přidán 8. 07. 2024
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2022 Ram 2500 Tradesman vs Big Horn - In this video Andre takes a close look at two new Ram heavy-duty pickup trucks that are affordable, but there is still around $9,000 between them.
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#ram #HD #tradesman - Auta a dopravní prostředky
I bought the Tradesman. I didn't feel like paying $20-40k just for a nice interior. Truthfully, the Tradesman still has a nice interior.
Same, when I retire I really just want a simple 3500 Cummins! C/c 4x4
Agreed…the Tradesman interior (especially the level 2 package) is pretty plush for a base-model truck.
Agreed. Most of those fancy electronics will most likely not work well once the truck gets past 300k miles
Exactly. All those fancy electrical things like the power windows & sunroof etc. are just more expensive things to potentially break. It’s not worth it.
Yes it is!
I'd like to see a head to head comparison between the standard Cummins and the high output. Mpg loops with and without towing, maybe some Ike gauntlets, possibly a drag race to see if the high output can actually put that power to the ground compared to the standard output.
Tradesman has so much power its crazy...anymore youre going to rip apart things...the 6.7 cummins is a beast that has to be tamed to be useful
I own the HO srw. I get 15.3 avg in the Appalachian Mountains of Virginia. If I'm towing 12.5 mpg. On flat ground 18 mpg constantly.
That Tradesman is a great truck! And it's got the perfect screen size.
I agree if all you need is a truck to do truck things, but being the owner of both, I will tell you there are things I miss like fog lights when I drive the mountain passes filled with fog, dual zone climate control (my wife is cold blooded lol), that second jockey box, and power driver seat (wife is short and messes up my seats - nothing worse than manually adjusting daily…)
@@ryanvegas777 You married a lizard, brah.
@@ericcartmansstrengthandpow5960 she takes good care of me, the least I could do is give her her own air when she gives me other things! 😉
In December of 2019, I bought my '19 Ram 2500 4x4 Laramie night edition crew cab with an MSRP of over $70k for $58,500 pre tax! Of course that was pre covid. I lucked out. If I would have waited, I would have been screwed over by pricing, selection, and possibly build quality as factories were getting shut down and then brought back online. Some people will argue that my early 5th gen has a CP4 but I can buy a lot of CP3's with what I saved. And besides, they did a recall and will eventually convert it.
You get lucky I'm 60 for my Big Horn
If that cp4 goes out you wont have saved anything
@@mick2798 It's under warranty! I actually just received my own retrofit kit yesterday from S&S and will apply for reimbursement. I plan to install this weekend. I do want to avoid that pain of a pump going out. Supposedly Chrysler has been reimbursing folks for the kit, I'll find out soon!
At the end of '18 I got a 2018 Ram 3500 Cummins, crew cab, cab and chassis, 4x4, 6 speed manual, tradesman.
It was the only manual left they could find in Texas and that was what I wanted.
$45,799 is what I got it for.
I deleted almost immediately.
I got lucky pre covid and got a 2020 Ram 2500 cummins 4x4 Big horn with level 2 equipment group and night edition for 54,500! I can’t believe the price people are paying for these trucks now! I didn’t realize the deal I got until the prices sky-rocketed. By the way, this was at Glenn’s Freedom in Lexington KY.
I bought a 3500 Tradesman crew cab 4x4 with the 6.4 gas engine last year. Chrome package, Snow Chief package, bed liner and step package, bigger entertainment screen, and floor mats. Bought a takeoff set of Laramie wheels and tires from the dealer, all for $43,500 total, including fees.
I custom ordered it, and had to wait a couple of months to get it.
Any regrets on the 6.4 hemi? I sold my 3500 mega cab diesel and now looking at new 3500's I'm finding it hard to justify the diesel and pay money to remove emissions equipment.
@@chrisc5574 No regrets with the 6.4 hemi, but I really don't tow or haul much.
I just got a 2024 4x4 RAM Tradesman 3500 cummins, crew cab tradesman level 2 with 5th wheel, chrome, cold weather, trailer brake controller, heated trailer towing mirrors, etc, payload of 4121 for $58K
Wow, I Definitely didn’t see $7,000 in upgrades between the tradesman & the Bighorn! I‘m actually kinda surprised.
I was thinking the same thing.
As always Andre.
Great your work.
Greetings from CDMX!
Great comparison video!! Really enjoyed it.
I luv the 6 person seating…..👍
Not very many videos out there comparing to the depth you guys just did on these differences. Everyone always says pick the tradesman and option up, but for the price difference, that big horn is where it’s at!
My 2021 2500 Tradesman Crew Cab 4x4 with the HEMI and off-road package stickers for 47k. Last time I checked, MSRP for the same truck is now 54k. Going for the HEMI gets you over 3000 lb of payload.
A little secret most don't know. I also recently got my second 2500 with a 6.4. Of course it labors more towing heavy, but with the diesel I would have had to pay that upcharge and the upcharge to a 3500 to keep the payload I need for our gooseneck horse trailer. Would also have lost the rear coils which are WAY better day to day driving.
Wow. Price increases are tremendous. I bought a 2021 Tradesman with the Cummins in early 2021. The MSRP was $55,500. I picked it up for $52,300. One year later a 2022 Tradesman is 10k more. Incredible inflation!
That's no joke! I bought my 2019 2500 (crew cab, std box, tradesman lvl 2, 4wd, chrome pkg, towing pkg, snow chief pkg, cummins) in Sep of 2019 for $45K out the door. Yes I timed it almost perfectly for the best incentives, but it's unreal the amount of price increase in just a few years for essentially the same truck. The same thing now MSRP is $64K....it's just nuts
Coming from my 04 ram laramie, i was SHOCKED to see the interior of the tradesman, HUGE upgrade from my laramie tech-wise; sure the tradesman has a cloth bench but that's just a plus for me that live in the arizona hell
It's really easy to option up a Tradesman into the mid 70's and end up with a Laramie w/o leather.
Andre I love those trucks!! You and Alex are full of power there!!!
Awesome truck Alex! Looking forward to your review of your new truck in comparison to your Rebel
This is exactly what I want to see lol. Great work.
I got a leftover 2019 Tradesman 3500, Cummins HO, Aisin, 4WD, crewcab, upgraded touchscreen for $50K two years ago in 2020. Best towing truck I've ever had. And it's way more nicely appointed than a Ford XLT.
I love my 2017 Tradesman 1500. 92k miles and never been in the shop for anything. The only thing I wish I had, living where I do, is a rear window defroster. I wouldn't change anything else about it for what it is. Mine has Bilstein suspension, Rebel wheels, and aftermarket fitted leather seat covers. Its a truck and gets used as a truck off-road and on. I wouldn't spend any extra money on a Big Horn.
I want a new Ram so bad. I don't tow or haul much and when I do it's not heavy. Just a car or truck. So I'm thinking 6.4. my only requirement is mega cab. So I gotta go big horn. A dark red night edition is the most beautiful truck I have seen. Than y'all for the videos
That Tradesman had several upgrades including the screen and the rear sliding window with defroster but no tow package. So not really the base base price it could be cheaper. I have owned several RAM trucks over the years, including the Tradesman, and the first thing I always do is get rid of those Firestone Transforce tires. My dealer usually gives me around $80 a tire for them and I get some nice A/T tires and lower the pressure in them because you don't need 80 psi for normal use and you get a much smoother ride.
Nice truck Alex!!! But i do prefer the non chrome version(of the tradesman)😎
I prefer the Big Horn, mainly because it has that night edition package - more nicely trimmed in my opinion. But the biggest Achilles heel for both these trucks is that you can’t get a HO version with the Aisin transmission!
@B BYou cannot get the HO Cummins with the 2500, it’s only available on the 3500
I’m the only one that drives my truck, so I saved my mirror adjustments to my seat memory settings.
Great rides. The only thing keeping them from perfection is the lack of a full bed.
Excellent trucks! I also have the patriot blue Bighorn "LoneStar" because in Texas but its the same thing. I am towing a fifth wheel rv. so far so good.
I prefer the Tradesman, more budget friendly. 👍👍for the great information video keep’m coming
you can even get the Tradesman with the power wagon package.
62k for a basic model 3/4 ton…
What the hell are these times.
Batshit crazy inflated prices because of idiotic democrats and nonsense politics... But you must know that already Mr. Gribble.... Lol
I'm fine with either truck, but I do love saving a buck or two, Love TFL
LOL @ 3:30 hit the nail right there ... thx for uploading.
I have a pretty loaded 22’ Tradesman. It’s pretty nice for a base model..
it’s has everything i need and no frills.. it’s a truck!
I even have a manual transfer case.. and i prefer it that way..
Cudos to Ram for making an decent affordable American diesel in the Tradesman
Awesome video! That tradesman just reminded me off the tradesman “power wagon” package you could get with the 6.4, do they still offer that? Anyone know
YES they do.
Yep!
For my use as an electrician I wouldn’t even consider buying a diesel over gas since I use my truck more in the city and load up the bed with lots of material. The gas trucks are plenty powerful for what 75% of the owners to do with these especially if it’s srw rather then drw. If you’re towing a lot or do a lot of highway driving I could see it making sense otherwise the diesel emissions systems just clog up or are regenning and cause issues. Many of the fleet trucks in my city F350-550 are moving to gas because the diesel isn’t worth the premium anymore.
I agree with a lot of what you said but to me the diesel is more likely to go to 300k plus
been looking at those same Carhartt seat covers for my tradesman. How do they fit and how do you like them?
They fit really well. Not perfect, there's some small air pockets. They're expensive, but nothing else fits as well. Would 100% recommend them, no regrets
I love the tradesman becauseof the chrome parts
Remember when people paid more for chrome than black plastic?
Diesel is 5.69$ a gallon here, gas is 3.89$. With it being a 1.80$ a gallon difference, I’d love to see you guys do a real world breakdown if the diesel is worth it. I know if you’re towing 20k you’ll need it but for the guy towing a standard 6-10k trailer, is there a break even point on mileage difference?
What’s your Location? Here in upstate NY gas is 4.45 and diesel 5.50
Gas 4.15, diesel is 6 bucks.
Here in Las Vegas gas is $5.25 a gallon and diesel is $5.15 a gallon...
In MO gas is 3.75 and diesel $5.15. Keep in mind though, the hemi prefers midgrade which here right now is a touch over $4 a gallon.
Columbus OH here
the profit margins on these trucks are nuts
What is your proof on that statement?
@@Ken_Koonz There is a reason why the big three killed their cars not their trucks/SUV’s.
@@bobbbobb4663 Show me a source. This sounds like your opinion and speculation.
@@Ken_Koonz No source needed. Count the number of cars available from the big 3 now versus 10 years ago. Now ask, does Ford make more money from a $15,000 Fiesta or a $70,000 F150? Once you have that question answered, then you will know. Good luck.
@@bobbbobb4663 The question of profit margin is the one we come back to. Without a source to validate the difference in profit between trucks and cars, we are stuck with speculation.
Cheaper is a keeper. I own a 2019 ram tradesman classic no frills v 6 been good for my needs have owned other ram 2500 happy with all
I like the tradesman with the chrome. I am old and like deep gloss paint and chrome. I would order it with tow package incl. brake controller, gooseneck package, upfitter switches, and tube steps (chrome). Off the top of my head thats about it. Anything else would be aftermarket.
The big difference in 5 vs 6 passenger configuration is the rear passengers do not get air vents in the 6-passenger configuration. I like the 6-passenger option but hard to give up the rear air vents. especially with Kiddos complaining about being hot in the summer.
actually ram does give you rear vents on both configurations. Ford is the only one that cuts out the rear vents in bench seats.
I have the rear air vents in my 2020 tradesman 6 seat configuration.
Nate, you haven't purchased noise canceling headphones yet? I might even put in one of those limousine windows
Don’t think it was mentioned that the Tradesman comes with a solid bench seat in the back and the Bighorn has the 60/40 split seat in the back. May not matter to some but it was one of several reasons why I went with the Bighorn.
Man I got lucky. I got a 2013 ram 1500 express, all blacked out, with a 4” lift, and 35’s for $23k pre tax. Got it back in 2015. Prices are astronomical now
Ya and the trucks haven't changed all that much have they...at least I dont see what's worth tha much more
I realize I'm in the minority on this but I wish Ram would convert all the shifters to dials. Cleans up the column/console areas and is so easy to use. My 18 had the column, new 22 has the dial. Nice upgrade.
I prefer the column with the manual shift on it, hated the Ram dial on my 6.4 with the gear select on the wheel, awkward to reach with the thumb first just grabbing the column and going through shifts, however Ram moved the manual shift for the 19+ cummins to the steering wheel. So ill stick with ford
When I ordered my ‘15 2wd 6.4 I almost had a stroke watching the price pass $50k. (Still have it. Dealers want me to trade it and offer $30k trade in) If I purchased a new truck now, being a poor old pensioner, I would have that stroke! It has over 100k on the HEMI now. I had an oil analysis done last change and all is well.
Adding all the additional Mopar add ONS should be calculated into the trucks overall price when compared to the tradesman or any other model ram... Then what's the price difference and savings overall?
I would love to know how much you guys paid the dealer to install the 5th wheel prep group on your truck
It's about $1700 on a new build truck. They probably had to add the cost of labor to that.
I installed the 5th wheel stuff to my rambox power wagon myself. It was cheap! I don't recall how much, but less than $200 iirc. The hardest part was finding somewhere that had the frame puck things. Other than that, it was an afternoon of drilling holes in the bed and bolting on some stuff.
At the beginning you said that the truck has pretty good power. My 18 wheeler only has 75 more hp and 400 ftlb of torque. How much does a pickup need
That what I'm wondering
It’s not about need at this point.
All of it 😂
That's a small power rating for a highway truck. Now where the torque is generated makes a ton of difference. 370hp at 2800rpm is only 694lbft. 445hp at 1700rpm is 1374lbft. The Duramax has 445hp@2800 thats only 835lbft. That 75hp is more, but in reality its actually 680lbft more, double the force doing the work. My highway truck pulls 140k gross(B-trains fuel tanks) everyload. It's 500hp/1850lbft.
500hp@1700rpm is 1544lbft
1850lbft@1400rpm is 493hp
1850lbft@1100rpm is 387hp. The truck loses speed on grades, lugs back to peak torque(1100-1400rpm is 1850lbft) The same amount of work is being done. Only difference at 1400rpm it's being done at a slightly faster rate than 1100rpm. Hp is JUST A CALCULATION FOR HOW FAST A GIVEN AMOUNT OF WORK IS DONE. This is why a 410hp 6.4 hemi is rated to tow less than this 370hp Cummins(in DRW 3500) The payload of the 2500s is the limiting factor in tow capacity
@@jnk26 450 hp 1287 ftlb of torque. Standard for a highway truck
I have a 19 2500 Diesel Laramie. Love everything about it EXCEPT the mirrors. Moose mode is fun, but there are way better HD towing mirrors in the class.
My payload is 2121.
MSRP in 2019 was $73k - back when nobody paid MSRP or above.
That payload is real low.
@@elvism684 he only has a 2500 so that's probably what he can put in the bed after driver, passengers and full fuel tank.
I like the blind spot part in moose mode.
Isn’t that quite a bit if you consider only 10 to 15% of the trailer weight transfers?
@@zacd7094Not really.
Just received my new 2500 ram. I was debating between the Big horn and Laramie. Ended up going with the Bighorn but leveled up some of the things I wanted (inside tech, exterior lighting, etc)
Did it come with power folding mirrors?
@@sirocco454 2 options it didn't come with that I wish/thought it would. Power folding mirrors and LED interior lighting. Neither a huge deal to me though, just a minor annoyance.
8ft bed matters
Nice truck Alex
Mirrors that fold out was on my 2500 03
Ive never found paying the huge markup for all the bells and whistles worth it in my experience. Some stuff is nice to have sure but not for 20-30k, not unless your practically living in your truck
I like that they have column mount shifter , the knob turned me off enough to not get a new ram. I actually stepped backwards and bought a 1998.5 2500 quad cab 2wd with 172k miles because I needed back in a Cummins powered Ram , but if I were in the market for new the Tradesman is almost perfect ... it needs heated seats ....
Why get a diesel if you aren’t towing? It needs a block heater for cold, has a lot more emissions stuff, expensive oil changes, smaller payload. Why not get a gas if all you’re towing is a small motorcycle trailer or something like that
Big Horn all the way Andre. I would have oped for the H.O. diesel and Aisin transmission and the Gooseneck/5th wheel towing package from the factory and the rear window defogger. Other than that you guys did a pretty good job on your Big Horn.
You can’t get a HO on a 2500 series.
@@MrPW339 That’s why I didn’t buy a Ram this last time, could have bought a SRW and would have been ok but ended up with a 3500 HD GMC. Ram couldn’t beat GM’s price.
I wish I could find a tradesman. A lot of dealers aren’t ordering them.
We have 2 here at crossroads dodge in VA. $63,000
@@nbankxworld8614 can you get the towing mirrors on the trade men
Then order one ?
@@Husky1run I think you can order them with tow mirrors but the 2 trucks there have regular mirrors. They were trying to get me to trade my 2020 F250 xlt in on one but it had way less options than my truck.
@@Husky1run yes
I bought a 2021 ram 4500 crew cab tradesman 84 CA 4x4 cummins diesel with a cm deluxe tradesman for $80k 😭😱. Never imagined I'd ever buy an 80k truck especially a tradesman. Has the bigger screen at least. I call it "the tank". Getting 16mpg after break in. Was getting 13mpg new. Weighs approximately 12k pounds.
When I got my 2500 in 2016, the brake controller was standard.
Alex can buy whatever he wants. If he keeps it clean and does all the maintenance he will have better resale than a 1500. Edit: race Andres truck vs Alex's Ram? Just because!
Have a 19 limited MAGAcab and with i had the front middle seat instead of console and also wish it didn't have a sunroof that i don't use
It's funny to me when he says the diesel is an $10k upgrade and people think fuel efficiency. $10k could buy you a lot of regular gasoline and you could still pull 15k lbs or so in a 3/4 ton gasser and not deal with selective catalyst reduction, exhaust gas recirculation, diesel particulate filter issues.
People will argue that you get that back when you sell it…and yeah sure…you might, or you could not pay it in the fist place.
Hey guys. Love everything you do. My daughter bought a 2020 Ram 2500 Laramie 6.7 Cummins. That being said, now that you guys have one, can you find an answer to the def capacity conspiracy?? Many, many people say and she has noticed fill discrepancies. If its a 5 gallon tank as she has been told is on her truck than a 2.5 gallon blu def should fill it from half. It doesn’t and we aren’t the first to notice this. Plenty of stories online but FCA and dealers offer no response. Help lol
Surprised how many people buy these, all mine have been very top of the line, ram limited mega cab with air ride and PW with 75th pkg etc. I'd like to get the fancy interior and camera pkg but not the ACC as I don't use it on the truck as much as SUV. I'm also sure I can't live without cooled seats.
Those “anti spin” American axles are a torque biasing differential. One wheel slips too much you have to apply the parking brake to get the other wheel to grab. The old Danas with clutched posi were better imo.
I had a 21 Ram 2500 with the 6.4 and 3.73s. Now I have a 21 F-250 with the 7.3 and 3.55s. Next truck if I can afford it will probably be a diesel, or the Gas turbo i6…..
I just went all out and got a limited when I bought mine
Isn't the 2022 HD ram equipped with the 8-Speed transmission now?
Nice looking truck. Great engine. Transmission not so good. I haven’t seen anyone on the internet that gives the 68RFE high marks! Potential for many tranny rebuilds before that engine wears out.
4425 payload in my single rear wheel 3500 2022 cummins tradesman regular cab long box 💪
The base model gm come stock with a brake controller
I got lucky with my 2020 tradesman level 2. 4x4 crew cab, parking sensors, cab lights, 8” screen, break controller. 51k after taxes. Got it on a year end sales event December 2020 brand new. You’ll never find a deal like that again. Would it be nice to have all the luxury features? Sure…. But I don’t really need all that.
You ever see those chevy base trucks. On the
tailgate it says in red W/T. Do you know what
W/T stands for?
Work Truck.
!
Big horn with thr 6.4 hemi and a few options be $70,560 Canadian
Still luving my 15 AEV American Expedition Vehicle Prospector P.W. True 4x4 with the trusty 392 Hemi V8 4:10 Ratio. I would argue the best truck for towing off road and beach or desert sand. Save the 10,000 dollars for the diesel and get your 392 Hemi Blown. 🤫🤔🤭😁
D.S.R. Hemi v8 1155 hp/ 974 lbs torque
I want a mega cab. My current ram is an old 04 SLT and I always wished I had gone with leather, so I would get a Laramie. I think I would go 3500 because of the low payload# with a 2500 mega cab.
I'd stick with the Tradesman and the standard Cummins. No need for the high output I believe. I'd still get a dually and possibly 2wd.
So much for anyone being able to afford any new truck. I guess it doesn't matter since they can only produce so many with all the shortages.
For a while I have been looking for a Ram 3500 tradesman dually but for some reason the Ram website hasn't been offering a base model dually.
I can build a 3500 Tradesman dually on Ram's website, and I would post a link for you, but CZcams would probably delete my comment for doing that.
@@G53X0Y0Z0 Its Ok, I can always wait a few years to build up my finances to buy a lightly used diesel anyway
Why did Alex get rid of his 1500 rebel??
Tradesmen with 4x4 & towing package, Led lights & defroster
I bought a tradesman and it came with more options than that bighorn. I do wish I had remote start
I am absolutely gobsmackked that the bighorn doesn’t have a rear window defroster.
Lets do some testing with a hard sided Truck camper.
Odd question but can you get a better deal by purchasing towing options on the aftermarket than the dealership . Also with stuff like the step tubes on the more expensive truck.
Yes, for the brake controller. If you look at the back of the truck and have the 7 and 4 pin harness, then all you have to do is buy a brake controller and harness. The plug for the truck harness is real easy to find under the dash just watch CZcams videos for it. I use the Tekonsha primus iq, but you can buy whatever you want. You will have to get a model specific harness to go from controller to truck harness. I got everything from Amazon for like $140 bucks. Super easy.
@@huemongus3742 I put one in my 88 GMC from scratch. Took a few hours and cost 135 or so. I have noticed the factory ones are cramped up and small. In an emergency I'd rather have a big one with controls spaced out a bit
Guys,do u have an app on iOS??I can’t find them in UK store!!
www.tfl-studios.com/mobile. Just save it as a web app to your desk top.
What kills me about the tradesman no audio controls on the steering wheel. Even when you upgrade the dashboard and display.
You can add them get yourself a obd genie and add them to your steering wheel did it on mine 👍🏼
Base model and I still can’t afford either lmaooo. I remember not too long ago well equipped trucks went for mid to high 40s
I didn’t grow up around trucks but have been using them my whole adult life. Not a fan of rams
Lol I know they are priced that much for sure but I'm trying to sell a 2017 2500 4x4 diesel tradesman with all the tradesman bells and whistles with only 22,300 miles on it for 44k and not one person has called about it...yeah they may be that much but hardly anyone is buying at those prices!
You forgot to say what year is the trucks
Add factory trailer controller not much used to be like $150
I have no need for a 2500 tradesmen, but I am going to own one soon, just another big truck guy!!!!
Don't let the diesels die
One thing you should recognize is that dealers have the ability to delete options when they order the trucks from the factory. The Tradesman very well may have the brake controller standard, but the dealer may have deleted it to save a few bucks.
Ford dealers are notorious for that- SEL trim levels come with leather as standard but many of the SEL trim vehicles don't have leather. The dealers get to advertise as an SEL hoping ill-educated consumers don't know it or notice it.
Drop the night edition package and move up to a Laramie makes more sense.
The basic Tradesman has lots of black. To get cloth seats and carpet which replaces the vinyl seats and flooring, and you must also add a chrome package. Then the Bighorn comes standard with chrome grill and etc, but you can add a night edition package for almost $3,000 that turns most of the chrome back to black. But if you spring for the high dollar Laramie or Limited trim trucks you get a nice chrome grill standard, but for more $$$$$$$ you can change it back to black with a night edition package. I have had Rams with Cummins engines before and just ordered a Laramie Dually with the H.O. Cummins, but the way Ram's options and packages are I was seriously tempted to order a Chevy or GMC, because their options and packages make a lot more sense, and they are less money. To get LED headlights and two front power seats on a Ram we should not have to add $12,000 to the cost of a truck just to get those two items.
I would go Tradesman, it is bogus that neither one has LED lights, you would need to go for a school bus or trash truck to get those!
The cheapest trim level for RAM trucks is Tradesman.
And?
Tell Alex that the tailgate strut can be purchased and added, also the sliding rear window with electric defrost is an option on tradesman. Trucks without the lined rear window, have a hot air defrost driven by the HVAC system.
I keep seeing Patriot Blue trucks more and more, it is a great color. I think a 1500 with the 6'4" bed would've done him good too.