I don’t limit myself to one caliber, My god hunters and shooters, Buy and shoot as many of these calibers as you can, I’ve shoot 300 mag, For around 40 years, 7 mm,300 wsm, 270 wsm ,270, 308, 243 wssm, For the past 20 or so years, Then started hearing a lot about the crappy 6.5 creedmoor, So about 4 or 5 years ago I purchased one, After 40 or so deer later I’ve had no issues with it, All 1 shoot kills, From 10 yards to 300 yards, Just purchased another with carbon fiber barrel, And a 6.5 prc, I had a hunting buddy that shoot and hunted with a 22 hornet, I laughed when he pulled it out to head to the stand, One shoot kills everytime we went hunting, And we are talking about which caliber is better, There’s no caliber better than the other, It’s all in the shooter, I know people who can’t hit a barn with the best money can buy, Shoot straight, Buy as many as you can, Have Fun.
Breaking news! Heavier long action cartridge beat out short action cartridge in energy inside 500 yards! If I had to have a PRC it would be the 7mm instead of the 6.5 anyway, but at least the 6.5 is good for those who want a powerful short action rifle.
My Initial thought would be if they both do the job, how dead does it really need to be. I would prefer to hike around the mountains with the lighter of the two rifle/ammo options. But the grizzly comment pretty well changed that thought. Dangerous game can never be TOO dead. Lol
I picked up a 6.5 PRC 2 years ago and I love it. Great for white tails here in Alberta. I would never hunt elk or moose with it though. I’m sure it can get the job done most of the time but I have a 300 win mag that gets the job done every time.
I have had one for a couple too. I get 2978 fps pushing a 156 berger EOL with 56.8 of N560 very accurate and it is better than the 30-06 loads he is showing
Different tools for different jobs. In most cases I'm taking the 30-06, but if I'm hunting Muleys or antelope in open country I'll take the 6.5 all day long.
In the same loadings from Winchester for each, the 6.5PRC is flatter (by 1.5" at 300) with far less wind drift (.018 higher G1 at 270fps higher velocity). So it obviously wins anything that isn't a "which one is bigger" contest.
You said you aren't trolling, but the title of the video is meant to be provocative. To which I say good on you; you'll satisfy the YT algorithm and get engagement. If the video were solving a problem, you'd frame the discussion around it. You compared a 30 cal long action cartridge to a 26 cal short action cartridge highlighting a single variable (external ballistics). I'm left asking if 30-06 beats the 6.5 PRC in retained energy (based on your data), so what? Big game hunting is a broad category that includes pronghorn and Couse deer up to Yukon moose and water buffalo. There are guys shooting 260 Remington that effectively kill heaps deer and pronghorn every year. Would a video titled "30-06 Beats 260 Remington" make sense? You chose 6.5 PRC to get views. Be honest and own it.
I said my community post wasn't trolling. Of course my video is meant to get people to watch. Kind of the name of the game. If I did 30-06 vs 260 Rem... no one cares because no one shoots the 260 Rem. I truly believe for big game (elk and bigger) 30-06 is better than 6.5 PRC. Now for deer and Antelope hunting the 6.5 PRC is better.
Won't own any prc cartridges, have a 30 06 though. Enjoyed you take on it. Agree with the frontal diameter, it certainly makes a difference shooting game.
Match the bullet and cartridge to the game species you're going after. Just like everything else, there are typically compromises (I.E. higher BC and faster in a lighter bullet vs using a slower but heavier bullet and having more retained energy at a given range). I enjoy your videos!
Look into the .277” Barnes LRX 155gr for the .270 going a tad bit over 3kfps. That thing is a MONSTER if loaded properly. The .270 has been factory loaded so poorly for such a long time because of the cup and core bullet velocity issue that it has (too fast). In fact the standard loading used to be 130gr at 3160fps, but now they chop off 100fps at minimum.
@@AlaskanBallistics I have a .270 Win Ruger No.1 with a 26" barrel and it gets 200+ fps more than my Rem 721 22" barrel .270 with the exact same load. This is with old school IMR powders.
If it goes bang im a fan. The thing about it is it will always come down to capacity. I know some cartridges aren't that efficient but more is still more. Thats why the 6.5 prc was designed, the creedmoor was a bit lacking so capacity was increased. Same for 30-06 vs 300wm you put more behind it you get better numbers. The real question boils down to what are you willing to put up with in weight and recoil to achieve your goals. Yes 6.5 prc will always outperform the creedmoor at the cost of recoil . The 300wm, prc, weatherby. Will always beat the 30-06 at the cost of recoil. If the argument is always going to be well if i load this its a match or better then, 6.5x300 weatherby is the best because its the most powerful 6.5. 30-378 weatherby wins as its the most powerful 30. 28 nosler or 7mm rum i cant remember which one is more powerful is the best 7mm. It all comes down to what you are willing to take and accept as ethical for the given target animal.
I was able to get a load with IMR4350 and a 150gr bullet down to a 2.5 SD and an ES of 5, i will be using that and my 22-250 for my first f-class comps this year. great video, love to see it!
I reload but I keep all my loads within pressure spec. With the right powder you can shoot the 190 ABLR at 2850 out of a 24" barrel and the 210's at 2800 in the 30-06
🤔 You Really Can't Like the 30-06 Without Liking It's Offspring - Nor, Like It's Offspring Without Liking the 30-06! 🤗 When I Think of Hunting, This Cartridge is the One I Always Visualize in My Mind! 😴
@@ReloadingWeatherby can it ever be too fast with copper? That’s screaming velocity. I guessed 3500. 3766 is a whole different level compared to most rifles.
As someone who loathes the 30-06, it’s easily the most versatile do all one rifle cartridge. 6.5 prc is a great cartridge for guys that deer and antelope hunt and might harvest an elk one day.
Problem with the 06 in 190 is that the recoil is the same as a 300 win mag or 300 prc. Those both push the same 190 200+ fps faster. 30 cal to 30 cal the 06 is an inferior 30 caliber to what is out there. I will take the less recoil and shorter action in the PRC over the 06 any day. Inside 600 yards it probably doesn’t matter as long as you use a good bullet and have good shot placement the critter is going to die.
☹ Here is the Problem - the Word "Probably"! Then, You Will Take the Shot, Wound the Animal, and Wished You Would Have Listened to The Experienced Hunter That Told You Not To Do It! Will You Listen? "PROBABLY" NOT! 🙄
Any rifle will do the job with a accurate placement .. I use a 30/30 on all my game and it works just fine .. I also own a 6.5 PRC .. mind you where I live .. there no 400 yard shots .. there all close encounters with game out here
🤠 Point #3 - No Experienced Hunter is Going to Be Shooting Past 1/3 of a Mile (587 Yards), Because They Are Going to Try and Get Closer and Will Be Using Their "Hunting Skills" to do so! 🥳
Great comparison. Either would be great for any big game in the US at reasonable hunting shot ranges with good bullets. I’ve been using the 180 grain CX in 30-06 and 127 LRX in 6.5 creedmoor (don’t have a prc) and have been impressed with both in terms of accuracy and terminal performance on critters.
Indeed, the 6.5 PRC isn't the best for elk size game. But I will still get my next rifle chambered for it. Great for target shooting and deer hunting in one package. Can also be pretty light since it does not recoil much. For elk, I've got better!
Hey everybody did you notice how similar all the results are? Thats because of powder capacity just go into your reloading manual find the grains of water capacity of the case,that is the capability of the cartridge everything else can be tinkered with to get similar numbers ie: twist rate barrel length and bullet weight. The only real differences are how a cartridge uses its capacity, that is what powder it uses well without pressure and the other is chamber tolerances which has been greatly exaggerated but does make a difference Just remember if powder capacity is your baseline than a 30cal ie 30-06 will have more energy downrange and more transfer because of the wider back of the bullet in the chamber and the wider front on impact. The payment is more drop and a less flat trajectory. Against the 270 win (27cal) will have a higher bc per weight a flatter trajectory and less recoil.
You are right. Spicy meatball. A 190 @ 2750 is a thumper. It may require 24" barrels though. If the guess about 6.5 Staball is correct, you have me wondering about 6.5 Staball in .30-06 with the 200 grain Speer Hot Cor. That is a pretty decent "conventional" game bullet. For a timber load to 200 or maybe even 250 yards, that 200 grain Speer would be a decent economical workhorse for .30-06. Mind you that I'm thinking deer through moose. Not any deer out there that need a 200 grain bullet, but there are bear, elk, and moose that could use one.
The data on the 30-06 box doesn’t add up. Using the BC from Nosler for that exact bullet and the speed from the box - I can’t get the numbers to match. Ballistic calculator says it’s 1745ft/lbs at 500. Even if the box muzzle velocity isn’t a lie, it doesn’t add up.
Lets start talking more than just numbers, how accurate is the 3006 with the accubond LR? Do you actually get 2750 like the box claims? The thing is the 3006 was never designed to push long high bc bullets at high velocities. You can have the energy on target at 500 yards but you must still make a good a shot. Just get a 300 magnum of your choice to shoot big game at longer distances. Thats why they are there. My issue with videos like these is you give info without testing things first on the range. Go out check the velocity, shoot a couple of groups and verify your drops before drawing up a chart and giving the info out as the truth.
@@ronlowney4700 all im saying is real word data means alot more. I did not argue that the velocities could not be achieved, my argument is that the video would have alot more back bone if there was actually any testing done. And talking about reloading. Ive worked with stable 6.5 and yes it does give great velocities, but in most cases the accuracy is not acceptable at those velocities...
🤔 Yes, Accuracy is Much More Important Than Velocity and Where I Live, Using Temperature Stable Powders Is a Must! That is Why I Always Evaluate My Cartridge Purchases Based Around What They Will Do With Powders Like H4831SC (For Non-Magnums) and H1000 (For Magnums)! 🤑
@@ronlowney4700 Varget and H4350 are great aswell. Ive been playing with Vitha powders and must say Im starting to see why it is so popular around the F class scene.
Why compare 2 totally different cartridges? Why not do a comparison of the 6.5 PRC , 6.5 x 284 and a 6.5 needmore? Why not do a comparison of a 30-06, 308 and 308 Norma magnum?
Good luck! I’ve heard the ABLR is a real PITA to tune since it’s pretty aggressively designed (much like VLD of F-open vs regular hybrid target bergers). If the combo doesn’t play nice together, RL16 or n555 seem to be well regarded for accuracy, stability, and velocity within the window. H4359, 4831SC, or H100V would also be strong powder choices.
I’ve tuned ABLR’s in my 270 win, 30-06, 6.5 prc, 7 rem mag, 7 prc and I didn’t find them hard to tune at all. Small groups. I’ve used H4350, Viti 555, H1000, H4831SC, RL-22 and they all work with the ABLR. Good luck! Also haven’t found VLD’s hard to tune. Haven’t messed around w hybrids much.
As of this week I now own 2 new Tikka T3x Hunter rifles in 30-06, have a bid on another tikka 30-06 with the laminate stock, a custom Rem700 30-06. And have a 6.5PRC Tikka Roughtech, a Badrock Southfork 6.5PRC PRS rifle. Hoping my son and I can go on an elk hunt this coming season. We'd be fine with cow elk tags since we're looking just for the meat. If we go, I'm taking a 7PRC and a 300WSM. My son will take his new Tikka 7RemMag Deluxe Hunter (he doesn't know he has it yet), and Tikka 270 Win.
@@ReloadingWeatherby me too. I have a ton of Speer Impact 30 cal 190s to load, the 210 BVLD also for the 300WSM. And, a ton and a half of 180 Nos ABs. Just a matter of working up loads which I plan to have done by April.
@@ReloadingWeatherby Just found a 3 day old video from Federal Ammunition regarding their all new Federal Fusion Tipped. I've never heard of it until just now. You? It's another bonded tipped bullet so it will compete with Bondstrike, AB, ABLR, Speer Impact (unless it's the same bullet. It's my understanding Fed Fusion ammo uses Speer bullets)
It is great that we have various options with similar performance. Here is my feeling of the day. I will use 6.5 prc for deer, sheep and antelope. 30-06 is good for elk, red stag and smaller game. 300 win mag or 300 prc for Nilgai, Eland or other exotics in Texas, because that is the minimum at the ranches I visit. 338 or 35 calibers are my choice for bear. Anything larger gives me an opportunity to dust off the old 458 win mag.
I enjoy your videos and simplicity of your reloading. I am 70 years old and do things just like that. I recently purchased a 6.5 prc and would like start reloading. What dies do you like or recommend? I am a hunter and don't shoot over 500 yds. Thanks again Barry
For a young guy you’re really old school. That Eldx is going to make a 6 inch permanent wound cavity and that ABLR is going to make a 2 inch permanent wound cavity’s So you’re not taking that into consideration. My son saw a Elk shot at 700 yards with a 6.5 prc with a boat tail hollow point and it was devastating to the bull. High shoulder shot. Dropped like a rock. That Eldx is a boat tsil hollow point with a plastics tip in it. It’s going shred things. Old school bullet guys are missing out. Bergers, Eldm s and X’s are devastating to this animals. .
@@ReloadingWeatherbyI know exactly what a mono and an ABLR and neither make as big of wound cavity as the Eldx does. You’re the one that put different bullets with very different terminal characteristics. You’re just worried about energy and energy means nothing.
@@ReloadingWeatherby your charts were comparing energy at 500’yards and you were basing performance on that???? You said “ 30-06 wins “ based on that. Do you remember your hand written charts?
Look at the hornady 178g eldx. Better than the 6.5. But shoot what you will. 30-06 will shoot 150g to 220g what other rifles will do that? One and done. I did buy the new 7mm prc. Great round.
I'm not sure this will be killing any other cartridge off any time soon. I'm a 30-06 fan myself, but i ran across this video by Ron Spomer here shortly after seeing this video and he is suggesting there may not be as much difference between some of these cartridges as we may think. He did say there is still more to the story with wind deflection, but at a minimum, from a max point blank range perspective, there isn't a huge difference. czcams.com/video/gykclCvzfrQ/video.htmlsi=4bQpcV58S9DQlQJI
You need to bring in to the mix a 225grain 35 Whelen, and with a much lower drop yet a more efficient set up would be better than either one of these for Elk, not to mention much safer in beer country. Call me crazy, but while in beer country the cartridge choice should be something that can handle a beer, so in the worst case senerio you can live to hunt another day.
🎯 Point #4 - Any Experienced Shooter Can Adjust For a Couple of Inches Difference in Wind Drift and The Adjustments For Bullet Drop At "Ethical Hunting Distances" is No Big Deal To Correct For! The Only Question is, "Can YOU Make The Shot?" 👀
I love my 6.5s but you need 6.5x300weatherby to beat .30-06 and even then you're limited in bullet weights. But a well placed shot from a 6.5prc will work fine
@shanejarratt9800 i mean it technically is a better 270 but i disagree heavily with the wsm style cartridges i find them harder to load for and dont cycle as well.
@@awsomedude12345678 I don't personally load for any wsm but I have a buddy that does and his shoots sub moa to 700 yards and my 6.8 western cycles flawlessly
Statistically speaking it doesn't matter what caliber you have. Just having a gun and actually putting rounds on the bear shows survival. If you look at all the bears that have been shot in defense they literally have all been killed no matter what was used. More bears have been killed in defense to 9mm than anyother round that I can find proof off. Makes sense cause that's what most cops and people carry every day. About as far from an ideal bear defense cartridge as you can get in most peoples opinions. And before i get quoted as saying 9mm is a bear killer i am not. Just going off the bear defesne studies and the data we have. Not trying to fight just people don't ever think outside the box. As far as what's better than what I got Over that a few years ago. It aint my job to judge what some feels capable with. If that was the case everyone would be running around with 300 win mag or bigger. 6.5 prc produces enough at ethical ranges to get it done. Just like any other cartridge that can produce enough speed and energy. Lol you never know what the hell I'm gonna use and no matter what I use someone is gonna have something to say. I've used 300 prc and been told I'm trying to compensate for something and I've used 6.5 creedmoor and been called a manbun needmoor bugie bitch. Lol the one thing we can all agree on is everyone is gonna disagree on what's best but as long as your shooting a good enough cartridge it shouldn't matter.
If I’m in bear country I’m taking my my 338 win and every other gun I have didn’t make the trip. Unless the guide says different and he has a big gun. A friend of mine got charged by a brown bear trying to take his caribou and 2 300 win mags were emptied into that bear before he dropped 10 ft from my buddy.
@bobmcmillen4502 that's why remaining calm and making sure the shots are good shots. The same thing can happen even with your 338 if you don't put the bullets where they need to be. It's should not have taken that many 300 win mag to kill the bear. They didn't get any head shots and probably didn't get any solid core shots. It just is what it is.
Hate those silver winchester shells... ive seen them split cases after firing from many different calibers,especially the WSM calibers.. Thats a Red Flag for me.
StaBall 6.5 probably isn’t gonna do it for you. I’ve loaded for .30-06 over the recent years, and StaBall 6.5 has been the worst performer for me. H4350, and IMR 4350 have been the best. Loaded up some 200gr Accubonds, with a max charge to 2,550fps, with a 22” barrel. With a 190gr ABLR, I’d expect velocities to be around 2,600-2,650fps. If you’ve got a 24” barrel, perhaps more. I’d be very surprised if that factory ammo got anywhere close to 2,750.
Trying to shoehorn cartridges into, "...ethical hunting distances..." is an exercise in futility. The pro and anti camps all have their own opinions about what is ethical. That being said, it is up to the shooter to be aware of what their gun, equipment, ammunition, and shooting skills are capable of. There is no magical distance where ethical becomes unethical based on someone else's opinion. That discussion is as subjective as the myriad calibers out there for everyone to choose from; the operative word here is "choose." Anything else is little more than opinionated, "What works for me should work for everyone else in making those choices..." nonsense!
@ReloadingWeatherby My point exactly, although a bit more crudely extrapolated here. Nevertheless, no one can pass judgment on anyone else as to what distance they should shoot or with what equipment they should take the shot. That all falls under the category of being a responsible hunter/shooter. We don't anoint one way or another. Everyone has to take responsibility for their own actions in that regard.
Who knew the larger cartridge produced more energy 🤷♂️. I’d rather the flatter shooting cartridge that has less recoil and still has plenty of energy to kill anything at 500 yards
I challenge you to watch the Hornady podcast on the 6.5 creedmoor not the prc. They brag how they take elk at 600 or 700 yards with the creedmoor because they know what they are doing and then to top that off they hunt brown bear with the creedmoor, I consider both hunts insane however I still to this day don't even bother hunting with my 6.5 creeds. Still love the Weatherbys. Another thing they still claim the Eldx is the best hunting bullet money can buy. I will agree that crimp on that bullet is radical, scratching my head when I look at that. Cheers.
This type of comparison doesn’t make sense. Of course the 190 grain 30 cal has more energy than the 147 grain 6.5. If kinetic energy is all that matters when we are determining which is better, then shoot the 300 PRC. It beats the 30-06 in every category.
This is just my opinion but I think that the biggest advantage of a 6.5 PRC or any modern cartridge, over rounds like 30-06 or 300 win is the availability of accurate rifles. It seems like the modern case geometry and bullet length lends itself to accuracy in more rifle offerings than older calibers.
Well if we are shooting about performance and 30-06 is superior then 300WSM beats them both handily Nosler says they got 2880-3000 fps with the same 190 AccuBond long range a clear increase vs 30-06.......all while using nearly the same powder charge
I have a 6.5 prc shooting 140gr nolzer accubond long range out of a savage ultra light with a 24inches prove barrel using rl26 powder and rem 9 1/2 primer gives me 3150 I'm shooting ar less than a 800ft above sea level
So if projectile performance has improved over the past 100 years is it possible that there is some performance overlap between a 6.5 caliber projectile of modern design and the antiquated original 30-06 projectiles (which were excellent for elk remember)? I mean the 6.5x55 sweed was used on big brown bear and moose. On a side note Jim Bridger carried a .40 caliber muzzleloader ( in grizzly country) when everyone else was packing 50s and larger. He was pretty screwed though probably just saving lead.
@@ReloadingWeatherbyI would be very interested in those results. My RPR in .300 PRC and my Bergera b14 HMR in 7mm PRC with a suppressor have very manageable felt recoil. I want to get a similar weighted gun in 30/05 or 300 WM to see the difference. The last 30/06 rem700 I shot was awful. It was that real light synthetic stock and pencil barrel
7 prc is the easy button for the 7’s. Factory ammo is really good. My 7 rem mag out performs it w hand loads but factory ammo offering aren’t very good for the rem. 7 mm are the long range hunting king for various reasons.
@@bobmcmillen4502that’s the reason I went with one. I’ve always wanted a .300 WM and a 7mm REM Mag but the factory options have been the killer for me. I’ve hand loaded in the past but I can’t find many components locally and I’m finally starting to see primers and powder back in stock online. But for the money I don’t think I could get a 7mm RM to shoot better than my PRC
I'm of the belief that Hornady cherrypicks their box velocities, which is dumb, seeing that that isolates 98% of their shooting population and gives you no usable data.
Yawn. Most people hunt within 400 yards and very likely most animals are taken within 200 yards. Animals shot with either cartridge are dead. Who cares. If you decide to also shoot long range for fun, the PRC is the better cartridge with the higher BC and subsequently less drop and drift. The cartridge wars and bickering over numbers that can be measured but don't matter are old and tiresome.
🤷♂️ Point #1 - Using a 143 grain ELD-X Bullet From a 6.5 prc Only Gets You 30% Weight Retention - or 43 Grains of Bullet To Drive Through an Elk! ☹ You Might As Well Be Hunting With a 22-250 and a 55 grain Copper Bullet, Which Will Shoot Just as Flat and Penetrate as Deep! 🤯
The only advantage in having an 6.5PRC would be for some type of competitive or target shooting. For field hunting the 30-06 is superior with its higher mass and larger frontal area. For most people who go after sickly sized deer once a year theres nothing gained by trading in their 270win, 308win, or 30-06 for some new rifle. The ammo and especially rifle companies would have you believe otherwise but the reality is theyre just wanting to lighten your wallet.
In a world where 300 weatherby and 30 nosler and 338 rum exist why would you want a 7 prc?? It's a comparison. Why buy chevy when you can get a ford or Toyota? Why eat steak when you can eat lobster, why watch football when you could watch basketball? Why ski when you can skate? Life's all about choices. Choose whatever you wish. This is comparing a "Fudd" cartridge to a modern cartridge. The 7 rem mag does everything a 7 prc does, so why choose 7 prc? Why why why?
🤔 As A Target Cartridge, The Short/Fat Cartridges Do Have An Advantage! Powder is Burned More Efficiently and You Do Get Less Recoil! But, As a Hunting Cartridge, Why Wouldn't I Want An Extra Round or Two in the Magazine With Let's Say a 30-06? WHY...WHY...WHY NOT? 😜
That is an easy one, I have several 7mm rem mags, not a whole of difference between the 7 prc and the 7 rem mag. Vortex just did a podcast on the two and they believe the 7 rem mag out performs the 7 prc, go check it out. Still your question has merit.
🕵️♂️ But, in the "Penetration Test", the 270 Outperformed Them All and Did It With 30% to 40% Less Recoil Than Those Two 7mm Cartridges! GO WATCH AGAIN (Just Saying)! 😜
Oh brother! Your really stirring the pot. LOL. Everyone has their own opinions so heres mine... I have a 6.5 prc, 300 prc, 223, 243, 6.5 creedmoor, 22 creedmoor and a few more. The 30-06 is the only cartridge ive ever gotten rid of. Yes it may can kill big game but is it the best? No. The most important thing when hunting is accuracy. Period. Then pick the right bullet to do the best job. So if i were to get an elk tag and spend all this money in getting prepared to go on this possible once in a lifetime trip and could only chose the 30-06 or a 6.5 PRC, i would chose the 6.5 PRC all day long. I would also use a solid copper bullet. Chances are that elk is not going to walk in under 100 yards, and probably not even 300, so im taking the more accurate cartridge. IMHO.
The objection was to the intentionally inflammatory verbage "6.5 killer," insinuating this is in any way going to disuade 6.5 owners or somehow convince people to reverse the industry trend away from the .30-06. It's not. People are not going to give up the efficiency, light recoil, and flat shoot characteristics of the 6.5s and go with a long action just to get .30-06 performance when they can stick with a short action mag and push that same bullet from that same ammunition line over 100 fps faster with a .300 WSM. If people are going with a long action, the 190 gr ABLR at 2900 fps from a .300 Win Mag makes more sense. The .30-06 isn't king of the hill anymore. People want efficiency, doing more with less. There is next to no demand for long action standard cartridges. Short actions outsell long actions by many orders of magnitude in this market, and those buying long actions only want true magnum performance. The .30-06 will probably never be dead in this country, but it simply isn't relevant in this market. The 168 gr ABLR .308 load will do 99% of what people need from a hunting rifle and will do it from a rifle several inches shorter and a pound and a half lighter than your basic long action sporter rifle. The short mags will trounce the long action standard head cartridges like the .30-06, again from shorter and lighter rifles. The only incentive to go with a long action is to get legit magnum performance. This is a nice option for those who already have .30-06 and are looking to maximize performance, but the demand for new .30-06s is and shall remain low. The vast majority of new rifles are and shall remain mostly short actions, and those that are long actions will be magnums like the 7mm and .300 PRC, and the .300 Win Mag. This has been the market trend for five years or so. No, you're not killing the 6.5s. I don't even like the 6.5s. But I make a lot more money off of 6.5s than I do the .30-06.
30-06 does beat the 6.5 PRC for large big game hunting. My intention is not to make the 30-06 the number 1 seller again. My intention was to show how capable it still is in a 6.5 dominated market. It's really a love letter to 30-06 fans.
I shoot both rounds at 1000 yards. The 6.5 PRC is very flat shooting with very little bullet drop. I can take the 6.5 PRC to a mile easy. The 30.06 has between 300 and 400 inches of bullet drop at 1000 yards. That's about all it's got. It's still doable, but a hassle. But your comparing apples and oranges. The 30.06 is almost an 8mm round. The other is a 6.5mm. 2 different things all together. Its like saying a semi beats a Lamborghini because it can haul more.
Let's review the rifles from the last few years... 2020 SHOT Show saw the introduction of the Mossberg Patriot LR Tactical, the Savage Axis II Precision, the Springfield M2020 Waypoint, the SIG Cross, and the Rem M700 PCR Enhanced. Of these, all are available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creed, and only the Savage can be had in .30-06. In 2021, we get the Nosler M21, the Bergara MgLite, and the Christensen Modern Hunting rifle, all available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creed, none available in .30-06. At 2022 SHOT, the Big Horn Armory Model 89, Wilson Combat NULA M20, and Bushmaster BA30. The Big Horn is a lever action, the Wilson and Bushmaster are available in .308 and 6.5 Creed. Again, not one available in .30-06. In 2023, we got some new configurations of the Browning Xbolt, the Stevens 334 Walnut, the CVA Cascade XT, of which all are available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creed, only the Xbolt is available in .30-06. More often than not, we see even when long actions become available, they are only available in magnums. So tell me again what is killing the 6.5s! The 6.5s outsell the .30-06 by a wide margin and will continue to do so. The .30-06 is a vacuum right now, negative space, a non-issue at best, avoided like plague rats at worst. The industry is actively seeking to not support .30-06 because there is negative interest in it, like literally less than zero.
@ReloadingWeatherby I obviously struck a nerve with you. And you obviously missed the point. Even the guns that are still available in .30-06 are also available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creedmoor, and the short actions still outsell the .30-06 by a significant margin. There is still a lot of .30-06s out there, and they still put in good work. But the market trend is hard away from the .30-06 now and has been for years. There is simply no legitimate reason to buy a new .30-06 today, other than Fudd lore, and most people prefer the efficiency of the short action cartridges over nostalgia. I didn't make the rules, bud. I am just observing market trends. Nothing is killing the 6.5s. Again, don't hate the player, hate the game.
I don’t limit myself to one caliber, My god hunters and shooters, Buy and shoot as many of these calibers as you can, I’ve shoot 300 mag, For around 40 years, 7 mm,300 wsm, 270 wsm ,270, 308, 243 wssm, For the past 20 or so years, Then started hearing a lot about the crappy 6.5 creedmoor, So about 4 or 5 years ago I purchased one, After 40 or so deer later I’ve had no issues with it, All 1 shoot kills, From 10 yards to 300 yards, Just purchased another with carbon fiber barrel, And a 6.5 prc, I had a hunting buddy that shoot and hunted with a 22 hornet, I laughed when he pulled it out to head to the stand, One shoot kills everytime we went hunting, And we are talking about which caliber is better, There’s no caliber better than the other, It’s all in the shooter, I know people who can’t hit a barn with the best money can buy, Shoot straight, Buy as many as you can, Have Fun.
I agree!
Breaking news! Heavier long action cartridge beat out short action cartridge in energy inside 500 yards! If I had to have a PRC it would be the 7mm instead of the 6.5 anyway, but at least the 6.5 is good for those who want a powerful short action rifle.
For a lot... it is breaking news
My Initial thought would be if they both do the job, how dead does it really need to be.
I would prefer to hike around the mountains with the lighter of the two rifle/ammo options.
But the grizzly comment pretty well changed that thought. Dangerous game can never be TOO dead. Lol
I picked up a 6.5 PRC 2 years ago and I love it. Great for white tails here in Alberta. I would never hunt elk or moose with it though. I’m sure it can get the job done most of the time but I have a 300 win mag that gets the job done every time.
EXACTLY 🤣
And someone that uses a 338 would never use a 300.
🕵️♂️ But, Does It Make It The "Best Solution"? 😏
I have had one for a couple too. I get 2978 fps pushing a 156 berger EOL with 56.8 of N560 very accurate and it is better than the 30-06 loads he is showing
Different tools for different jobs. In most cases I'm taking the 30-06, but if I'm hunting Muleys or antelope in open country I'll take the 6.5 all day long.
Solid reasoning
Exactly. Cous and sorts in open country 6.5 every time
In the same loadings from Winchester for each, the 6.5PRC is flatter (by 1.5" at 300) with far less wind drift (.018 higher G1 at 270fps higher velocity). So it obviously wins anything that isn't a "which one is bigger" contest.
2.5 inches at 500 yards is a lot better in wind drift?
@@ReloadingWeatherby Ob-viously...
You said you aren't trolling, but the title of the video is meant to be provocative. To which I say good on you; you'll satisfy the YT algorithm and get engagement. If the video were solving a problem, you'd frame the discussion around it. You compared a 30 cal long action cartridge to a 26 cal short action cartridge highlighting a single variable (external ballistics). I'm left asking if 30-06 beats the 6.5 PRC in retained energy (based on your data), so what? Big game hunting is a broad category that includes pronghorn and Couse deer up to Yukon moose and water buffalo. There are guys shooting 260 Remington that effectively kill heaps deer and pronghorn every year. Would a video titled "30-06 Beats 260 Remington" make sense? You chose 6.5 PRC to get views. Be honest and own it.
I said my community post wasn't trolling. Of course my video is meant to get people to watch. Kind of the name of the game. If I did 30-06 vs 260 Rem... no one cares because no one shoots the 260 Rem. I truly believe for big game (elk and bigger) 30-06 is better than 6.5 PRC.
Now for deer and Antelope hunting the 6.5 PRC is better.
Why have a 30-06 if you can have 300 win mag?
Won't own any prc cartridges, have a 30 06 though. Enjoyed you take on it. Agree with the frontal diameter, it certainly makes a difference shooting game.
😏 Point #2 - Experience Would Tell You That The 30-06 Bullet Would Drive Deeper, Due To Conservation of Mass of a Much Heavier Bullet! 💥
Match the bullet and cartridge to the game species you're going after. Just like everything else, there are typically compromises (I.E. higher BC and faster in a lighter bullet vs using a slower but heavier bullet and having more retained energy at a given range). I enjoy your videos!
Thanks for your comment!
I would love to see if the results changed if the PRC was launched using the 150ABLR at 3,100 fps.
Look into the .277” Barnes LRX 155gr for the .270 going a tad bit over 3kfps. That thing is a MONSTER if loaded properly.
The .270 has been factory loaded so poorly for such a long time because of the cup and core bullet velocity issue that it has (too fast). In fact the standard loading used to be 130gr at 3160fps, but now they chop off 100fps at minimum.
Getting that fast with a long copper bullet will be tough without a 26" barrel
Nahhhh RL 26 will do it @@AlaskanBallistics
@@AlaskanBallistics I have a .270 Win Ruger No.1 with a 26" barrel and it gets 200+ fps more than my Rem 721 22" barrel .270 with the exact same load. This is with old school IMR powders.
@@451whitworth4 NICE!
There’s no replacement for displacement 😂
If it goes bang im a fan. The thing about it is it will always come down to capacity. I know some cartridges aren't that efficient but more is still more. Thats why the 6.5 prc was designed, the creedmoor was a bit lacking so capacity was increased. Same for 30-06 vs 300wm you put more behind it you get better numbers. The real question boils down to what are you willing to put up with in weight and recoil to achieve your goals. Yes 6.5 prc will always outperform the creedmoor at the cost of recoil . The 300wm, prc, weatherby. Will always beat the 30-06 at the cost of recoil. If the argument is always going to be well if i load this its a match or better then, 6.5x300 weatherby is the best because its the most powerful 6.5. 30-378 weatherby wins as its the most powerful 30. 28 nosler or 7mm rum i cant remember which one is more powerful is the best 7mm. It all comes down to what you are willing to take and accept as ethical for the given target animal.
Thanks for commenting!
I was able to get a load with IMR4350 and a 150gr bullet down to a 2.5 SD and an ES of 5, i will be using that and my 22-250 for my first f-class comps this year. great video, love to see it!
I reload but I keep all my loads within pressure spec. With the right powder you can shoot the 190 ABLR at 2850 out of a 24" barrel and the 210's at 2800 in the 30-06
Very impressive. I'll find out soon how fast I can get it out of a 24 inch barrel.
🤔 You Really Can't Like the 30-06 Without Liking It's Offspring - Nor, Like It's Offspring Without Liking the 30-06! 🤗 When I Think of Hunting, This Cartridge is the One I Always Visualize in My Mind! 😴
Majority of Roosevelt Elk meat I've eaten were courtesy of the 30-06
🤠 You Made Teddy Proud! 🤗
Think you're data would have been more interesting had you used Berger ammo and the 156 EOL bullet.. JMO
.308 > .264
.308 = bigger hole and more lead = more better.
You gotta try the 130 ttsx in your 300 Weatherby.
I have! 3766 FPS and sub MOA
@@ReloadingWeatherby can it ever be too fast with copper? That’s screaming velocity. I guessed 3500. 3766 is a whole different level compared to most rifles.
As someone who loathes the 30-06, it’s easily the most versatile do all one rifle cartridge. 6.5 prc is a great cartridge for guys that deer and antelope hunt and might harvest an elk one day.
Can’t wait for those test results and hand loads! Thanks for the video 👍🏼
Sir!! You never fail to deliver, THE TRUTH, this channel is ballistic gospel
Thanks for watching!
Great video, im looking forward to the results (particularly as a 30-06 owner)
Problem with the 06 in 190 is that the recoil is the same as a 300 win mag or 300 prc. Those both push the same 190 200+ fps faster. 30 cal to 30 cal the 06 is an inferior 30 caliber to what is out there. I will take the less recoil and shorter action in the PRC over the 06 any day. Inside 600 yards it probably doesn’t matter as long as you use a good bullet and have good shot placement the critter is going to die.
☹ Here is the Problem - the Word "Probably"! Then, You Will Take the Shot, Wound the Animal, and Wished You Would Have Listened to The Experienced Hunter That Told You Not To Do It! Will You Listen? "PROBABLY" NOT! 🙄
Any rifle will do the job with a accurate placement .. I use a 30/30 on all my game and it works just fine .. I also own a 6.5 PRC .. mind you where I live .. there no 400 yard shots .. there all close encounters with game out here
Flatter, lighter platform, capable I’ll take that
Thanks for commenting
🤠 Point #3 - No Experienced Hunter is Going to Be Shooting Past 1/3 of a Mile (587 Yards), Because They Are Going to Try and Get Closer and Will Be Using Their "Hunting Skills" to do so! 🥳
Great comparison. Either would be great for any big game in the US at reasonable hunting shot ranges with good bullets. I’ve been using the 180 grain CX in 30-06 and 127 LRX in 6.5 creedmoor (don’t have a prc) and have been impressed with both in terms of accuracy and terminal performance on critters.
Indeed, the 6.5 PRC isn't the best for elk size game. But I will still get my next rifle chambered for it. Great for target shooting and deer hunting in one package. Can also be pretty light since it does not recoil much. For elk, I've got better!
Nice!
Hey everybody did you notice how similar all the results are? Thats because of powder capacity just go into your reloading manual find the grains of water capacity of the case,that is the capability of the cartridge everything else can be tinkered with to get similar numbers ie: twist rate barrel length and bullet weight.
The only real differences are how a cartridge uses its capacity, that is what powder it uses well without pressure and the other is chamber tolerances which has been greatly exaggerated but does make a difference
Just remember if powder capacity is your baseline than a 30cal ie 30-06 will have more energy downrange and more transfer because of the wider back of the bullet in the chamber and the wider front on impact. The payment is more drop and a less flat trajectory.
Against the 270 win (27cal) will have a higher bc per weight a flatter trajectory and less recoil.
In case you missed it the 30-06 and 270 have an almost exact powder capacity as does the 6.5 prc and 25-06
You are right. Spicy meatball. A 190 @ 2750 is a thumper. It may require 24" barrels though. If the guess about 6.5 Staball is correct, you have me wondering about 6.5 Staball in .30-06 with the 200 grain Speer Hot Cor. That is a pretty decent "conventional" game bullet. For a timber load to 200 or maybe even 250 yards, that 200 grain Speer would be a decent economical workhorse for .30-06. Mind you that I'm thinking deer through moose. Not any deer out there that need a 200 grain bullet, but there are bear, elk, and moose that could use one.
The data on the 30-06 box doesn’t add up. Using the BC from Nosler for that exact bullet and the speed from the box - I can’t get the numbers to match. Ballistic calculator says it’s 1745ft/lbs at 500. Even if the box muzzle velocity isn’t a lie, it doesn’t add up.
Same
@@ReloadingWeatherbyI wonder how they calculated those values? Also the box ammo is better than Noslers published hand load data? That seems suspect.
@@merlinofnew They might have calculated it at a higher elevation.
Why use the 190 for the .06, when the standard being used is the optimal 168?
Either works great
Lets start talking more than just numbers, how accurate is the 3006 with the accubond LR? Do you actually get 2750 like the box claims? The thing is the 3006 was never designed to push long high bc bullets at high velocities. You can have the energy on target at 500 yards but you must still make a good a shot. Just get a 300 magnum of your choice to shoot big game at longer distances. Thats why they are there.
My issue with videos like these is you give info without testing things first on the range. Go out check the velocity, shoot a couple of groups and verify your drops before drawing up a chart and giving the info out as the truth.
🕵️♂️ While I See The Point You Are Trying to Make, The Reloading Manuals Already Have Published Data That Supports These Velocities! 🤷♂️
🤔 Most Serious Hunters Reload Anyway! 🤷♂️
@@ronlowney4700 all im saying is real word data means alot more. I did not argue that the velocities could not be achieved, my argument is that the video would have alot more back bone if there was actually any testing done. And talking about reloading. Ive worked with stable 6.5 and yes it does give great velocities, but in most cases the accuracy is not acceptable at those velocities...
🤔 Yes, Accuracy is Much More Important Than Velocity and Where I Live, Using Temperature Stable Powders Is a Must! That is Why I Always Evaluate My Cartridge Purchases Based Around What They Will Do With Powders Like H4831SC (For Non-Magnums) and H1000 (For Magnums)! 🤑
@@ronlowney4700 Varget and H4350 are great aswell. Ive been playing with Vitha powders and must say Im starting to see why it is so popular around the F class scene.
Why compare 2 totally different cartridges? Why not do a comparison of the 6.5 PRC , 6.5 x 284 and a 6.5 needmore? Why not do a comparison of a 30-06, 308 and 308 Norma magnum?
Doing something different
Because he likes to compare apples and oranges
@@Kmecha84 I like all of my fruit
Bullet Frontal Diameter is a Real Thing, there is no way I would even consider a 140 Grain 6.5 anything hunting Big Game.
Good luck! I’ve heard the ABLR is a real PITA to tune since it’s pretty aggressively designed (much like VLD of F-open vs regular hybrid target bergers). If the combo doesn’t play nice together, RL16 or n555 seem to be well regarded for accuracy, stability, and velocity within the window. H4359, 4831SC, or H100V would also be strong powder choices.
I’ve tuned ABLR’s in my 270 win, 30-06, 6.5 prc, 7 rem mag, 7 prc and I didn’t find them hard to tune at all. Small groups. I’ve used H4350, Viti 555, H1000, H4831SC, RL-22 and they all work with the ABLR. Good luck! Also haven’t found VLD’s hard to tune. Haven’t messed around w hybrids much.
As of this week I now own 2 new Tikka T3x Hunter rifles in 30-06, have a bid on another tikka 30-06 with the laminate stock, a custom Rem700 30-06. And have a 6.5PRC Tikka Roughtech, a Badrock Southfork 6.5PRC PRS rifle. Hoping my son and I can go on an elk hunt this coming season. We'd be fine with cow elk tags since we're looking just for the meat. If we go, I'm taking a 7PRC and a 300WSM. My son will take his new Tikka 7RemMag Deluxe Hunter (he doesn't know he has it yet), and Tikka 270 Win.
Hope you get a tag!
@@ReloadingWeatherby me too. I have a ton of Speer Impact 30 cal 190s to load, the 210 BVLD also for the 300WSM. And, a ton and a half of 180 Nos ABs. Just a matter of working up loads which I plan to have done by April.
@@ReloadingWeatherby Just found a 3 day old video from Federal Ammunition regarding their all new Federal Fusion Tipped. I've never heard of it until just now. You? It's another bonded tipped bullet so it will compete with Bondstrike, AB, ABLR, Speer Impact (unless it's the same bullet. It's my understanding Fed Fusion ammo uses Speer bullets)
It is great that we have various options with similar performance. Here is my feeling of the day. I will use 6.5 prc for deer, sheep and antelope. 30-06 is good for elk, red stag and smaller game. 300 win mag or 300 prc for Nilgai, Eland or other exotics in Texas, because that is the minimum at the ranches I visit. 338 or 35 calibers are my choice for bear. Anything larger gives me an opportunity to dust off the old 458 win mag.
Dumb 308 can do all that 😂😂
That's great and all but we need to push nosler to make more components.
Yes
I enjoy your videos and simplicity of your reloading. I am 70 years old and do things just like that. I recently purchased a 6.5 prc and would like start reloading. What dies do you like or recommend? I am a hunter and don't shoot over 500 yds. Thanks again
Barry
RCBS or Hornady works
🤗 We Finally Can Agree! 🤯
For a young guy you’re really old school. That Eldx is going to make a 6 inch permanent wound cavity and that ABLR is going to make a 2 inch permanent wound cavity’s
So you’re not taking that into consideration. My son saw a Elk shot at 700 yards with a 6.5 prc with a boat tail hollow point and it was devastating to the bull. High shoulder shot. Dropped like a rock. That Eldx is a boat tsil hollow point with a plastics tip in it. It’s going shred things. Old school bullet guys are missing out. Bergers, Eldm s and X’s are devastating to this animals. .
I think you're confusing the ABLR with a mono bullet. Only a 2 inch wound cavity huh? You do realize there is a 178 gr ELD-X in 30 caliber right?
@@ReloadingWeatherbyI know exactly what a mono and an ABLR and neither make as big of wound cavity as the Eldx does. You’re the one that put different bullets with very different terminal characteristics. You’re just worried about energy and energy means nothing.
@bobmcmillen4502 I'm all about energy huh? Guess you didn't really watch this video...
@@ReloadingWeatherby your charts were comparing energy at 500’yards and you were basing performance on that???? You said “ 30-06 wins “ based on that. Do you remember your hand written charts?
If you would have put the 178 Eldx in your example we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
Look at the hornady 178g eldx. Better than the 6.5. But shoot what you will. 30-06 will shoot 150g to 220g what other rifles will do that? One and done. I did buy the new 7mm prc. Great round.
I'm using those 190gr noslers for my 300 win mag, poppin out a 26" barrel. They're screaming.
Nice! They shoot well?
@ReloadingWeatherby So far I have them at 1/2 moa out to 300 with a .030" jump. Still dialing in the charge.
@@MIchigan-Savage Very nice!
+
Both excellent cartridges
Isn’t the 6.5 PRC a modern version of the 6.5/06 in a short action?
Or very similar to the 6.5/284??
Yeah
Because I think a 190 gr will hit harder than a 143 gr at the same speed what will a 140 or 150 gr do compared to the 6.5
I'm not sure this will be killing any other cartridge off any time soon. I'm a 30-06 fan myself, but i ran across this video by Ron Spomer here shortly after seeing this video and he is suggesting there may not be as much difference between some of these cartridges as we may think. He did say there is still more to the story with wind deflection, but at a minimum, from a max point blank range perspective, there isn't a huge difference.
czcams.com/video/gykclCvzfrQ/video.htmlsi=4bQpcV58S9DQlQJI
Killing off was the wrong word.
Nice to see 30/06 vs 8mm mouser !
You had me at spicy meatball.
Ramshot hunter looks pretty good too for velocity
You need to bring in to the mix a 225grain 35 Whelen, and with a much lower drop yet a more efficient set up would be better than either one of these for Elk, not to mention much safer in beer country. Call me crazy, but while in beer country the cartridge choice should be something that can handle a beer, so in the worst case senerio you can live to hunt another day.
🎯 Point #4 - Any Experienced Shooter Can Adjust For a Couple of Inches Difference in Wind Drift and The Adjustments For Bullet Drop At "Ethical Hunting Distances" is No Big Deal To Correct For! The Only Question is, "Can YOU Make The Shot?" 👀
I love my 6.5s but you need 6.5x300weatherby to beat .30-06 and even then you're limited in bullet weights.
But a well placed shot from a 6.5prc will work fine
People take elk and other big game with 6.5 cartridges... it works. But there are better tools for the job
That Is a pretty powerful 30-06 load....I push a 225 eldm at 2650 with my 30-06 from my 22" howa.
That is really good
@@ReloadingWeatherby I would not hunt with my load, I'm really only a target shooter...never actually hunted...but it's real accurate in my rifle.
Gotta admit, if you want engagement on this platform, just put prc in the title, bravo on you sir. Might as well benefit from Hornady in some way 😂
If I want engagement... I do videos on the most popular cartridges
6.8 Western beats them both! ##savethe6.8western!
6.8 western is just a worse 270
@@awsomedude12345678😂😂😂😂
@shanejarratt9800 i mean it technically is a better 270 but i disagree heavily with the wsm style cartridges i find them harder to load for and dont cycle as well.
@@awsomedude12345678 I don't personally load for any wsm but I have a buddy that does and his shoots sub moa to 700 yards and my 6.8 western cycles flawlessly
If you were hunting elk and ran into an angry grizzly would you rather have your 6.5 140 gr baby bullet or a 190gr of bring it energy.
190 gr
Statistically speaking it doesn't matter what caliber you have. Just having a gun and actually putting rounds on the bear shows survival. If you look at all the bears that have been shot in defense they literally have all been killed no matter what was used. More bears have been killed in defense to 9mm than anyother round that I can find proof off. Makes sense cause that's what most cops and people carry every day. About as far from an ideal bear defense cartridge as you can get in most peoples opinions. And before i get quoted as saying 9mm is a bear killer i am not. Just going off the bear defesne studies and the data we have. Not trying to fight just people don't ever think outside the box. As far as what's better than what I got Over that a few years ago. It aint my job to judge what some feels capable with. If that was the case everyone would be running around with 300 win mag or bigger. 6.5 prc produces enough at ethical ranges to get it done. Just like any other cartridge that can produce enough speed and energy. Lol you never know what the hell I'm gonna use and no matter what I use someone is gonna have something to say. I've used 300 prc and been told I'm trying to compensate for something and I've used 6.5 creedmoor and been called a manbun needmoor bugie bitch. Lol the one thing we can all agree on is everyone is gonna disagree on what's best but as long as your shooting a good enough cartridge it shouldn't matter.
well not the ABLR since it will probably just break apart at that close of a distance
If I’m in bear country I’m taking my my 338 win and every other gun I have didn’t make the trip. Unless the guide says different and he has a big gun. A friend of mine got charged by a brown bear trying to take his caribou and 2 300 win mags were emptied into that bear before he dropped 10 ft from my buddy.
@bobmcmillen4502 that's why remaining calm and making sure the shots are good shots. The same thing can happen even with your 338 if you don't put the bullets where they need to be. It's should not have taken that many 300 win mag to kill the bear. They didn't get any head shots and probably didn't get any solid core shots. It just is what it is.
Hate those silver winchester shells... ive seen them split cases after firing from many different calibers,especially the WSM calibers.. Thats a Red Flag for me.
the prc rounds are just hype just line the 28 nosler is so much better than the 7 stw witch holds 1/2 grain less water koolade drinkers are everywhere
StaBall 6.5 probably isn’t gonna do it for you. I’ve loaded for .30-06 over the recent years, and StaBall 6.5 has been the worst performer for me. H4350, and IMR 4350 have been the best. Loaded up some 200gr Accubonds, with a max charge to 2,550fps, with a 22” barrel. With a 190gr ABLR, I’d expect velocities to be around 2,600-2,650fps. If you’ve got a 24” barrel, perhaps more. I’d be very surprised if that factory ammo got anywhere close to 2,750.
We will see
Trying to shoehorn cartridges into, "...ethical hunting distances..." is an exercise in futility. The pro and anti camps all have their own opinions about what is ethical.
That being said, it is up to the shooter to be aware of what their gun, equipment, ammunition, and shooting skills are capable of. There is no magical distance where ethical becomes unethical based on someone else's opinion. That discussion is as subjective as the myriad calibers out there for everyone to choose from; the operative word here is "choose."
Anything else is little more than opinionated, "What works for me should work for everyone else in making those choices..." nonsense!
Opinions including mine are like butts... everyone has one and they all stink
@ReloadingWeatherby
My point exactly, although a bit more crudely extrapolated here. Nevertheless, no one can pass judgment on anyone else as to what distance they should shoot or with what equipment they should take the shot.
That all falls under the category of being a responsible hunter/shooter. We don't anoint one way or another. Everyone has to take responsibility for their own actions in that regard.
What kind of ballistic software are you using for your data?
shooterscalculator.com
I just bought a 6.5-300 weatherby mag. What are your thought on it
Speed demon! Have fun with it!
I know what you are saying but you can’t compare a 30 Caliber to a 264 caliber
Why not?
What if you used a 143 gr bullet in the 3006
Would be very similar in drop, however wind drift would be much worse and the energy a lot less.
Who knew the larger cartridge produced more energy 🤷♂️.
I’d rather the flatter shooting cartridge that has less recoil and still has plenty of energy to kill anything at 500 yards
Thanks for watching and commenting!
What the difference between accubond and acubond lr. They both have a good bc and bonded
the normal accubond wont fall to pieces if you are too close
The ABLR is a softer bonded bullet with better B.C. Nosler created it so it could open up at longer distance than the normal Accubond.
I challenge you to watch the Hornady podcast on the 6.5 creedmoor not the prc. They brag how they take elk at 600 or 700 yards with the creedmoor because they know what they are doing and then to top that off they hunt brown bear with the creedmoor, I consider both hunts insane however I still to this day don't even bother hunting with my 6.5 creeds. Still love the Weatherbys. Another thing they still claim the Eldx is the best hunting bullet money can buy. I will agree that crimp on that bullet is radical, scratching my head when I look at that. Cheers.
Watching it now...
338/06 230 grain eldx @2740 from a 24" barrel
Very nice
This type of comparison doesn’t make sense. Of course the 190 grain 30 cal has more energy than the 147 grain 6.5. If kinetic energy is all that matters when we are determining which is better, then shoot the 300 PRC. It beats the 30-06 in every category.
You would be surprised how many people don't get what you just said.
This is just my opinion but I think that the biggest advantage of a 6.5 PRC or any modern cartridge, over rounds like 30-06 or 300 win is the availability of accurate rifles. It seems like the modern case geometry and bullet length lends itself to accuracy in more rifle offerings than older calibers.
@petermurphy9854 It has an advantage with factory ammo. If you reload you can get any none lemon gun to shoot extremely well
Well if we are shooting about performance and 30-06 is superior then 300WSM beats them both handily
Nosler says they got 2880-3000 fps with the same 190 AccuBond long range a clear increase vs 30-06.......all while using nearly the same powder charge
I load 190s to 2680fps in 24inch barrel
I got 2883 FPS with the 190 in 30-06
I have a 6.5 prc shooting 140gr nolzer accubond long range out of a savage ultra light with a 24inches prove barrel using rl26 powder and rem 9 1/2 primer gives me 3150 I'm shooting ar less than a 800ft above sea level
Nice! Thanks for sharing!
@@ReloadingWeatherby your welcome try it and see what you get I know that rl26 is hard to find but it turns on a lot of calbers
I think I used the load from the hornady book it's a max load
@ladon.grantiigrantii5701 I wish I had RL-26... we tried a max load of Retumbo, book says 3100 FPS... we averaged around 2980 FPS
@ReloadingWeatherby the best I got with return was 3030fs with a 147elm just once
The 6.5s are great for folks that are sensitive to recoil
i know of people getting over 3050 in a 30 96 ,go out west hunting is done at less than 300 yds REAL F LIFE
I have a question. Has the 3006 always been good for elk?
Yes
@@ReloadingWeatherby could we agree that projectile performance and technology has improved over the past 100 years?
@@jacktrout5807 Yes
No sir only 308 win or 300 win mag.
06 bounces off elk someone on
Internet said in forum..
So if projectile performance has improved over the past 100 years is it possible that there is some performance overlap between a 6.5 caliber projectile of modern design and the antiquated original 30-06 projectiles (which were excellent for elk remember)?
I mean the 6.5x55 sweed was used on big brown bear and moose.
On a side note Jim Bridger carried a .40 caliber muzzleloader ( in grizzly country) when everyone else was packing 50s and larger. He was pretty screwed though probably just saving lead.
Thoughts on 7mm prc
I'm getting one soon
@@ReloadingWeatherbyI would be very interested in those results. My RPR in .300 PRC and my Bergera b14 HMR in 7mm PRC with a suppressor have very manageable felt recoil. I want to get a similar weighted gun in 30/05 or 300 WM to see the difference. The last 30/06 rem700 I shot was awful. It was that real light synthetic stock and pencil barrel
7 prc is the easy button for the 7’s. Factory ammo is really good. My 7 rem mag out performs it w hand loads but factory ammo offering aren’t very good for the rem. 7 mm are the long range hunting king for various reasons.
@@bobmcmillen4502that’s the reason I went with one. I’ve always wanted a .300 WM and a 7mm REM Mag but the factory options have been the killer for me. I’ve hand loaded in the past but I can’t find many components locally and I’m finally starting to see primers and powder back in stock online. But for the money I don’t think I could get a 7mm RM to shoot better than my PRC
I'm of the belief that Hornady cherrypicks their box velocities, which is dumb, seeing that that isolates 98% of their shooting population and gives you no usable data.
Most of the time you won't get box velocity with Hornady ammo.
Yawn. Most people hunt within 400 yards and very likely most animals are taken within 200 yards. Animals shot with either cartridge are dead. Who cares. If you decide to also shoot long range for fun, the PRC is the better cartridge with the higher BC and subsequently less drop and drift.
The cartridge wars and bickering over numbers that can be measured but don't matter are old and tiresome.
I mean... people love arguing and discussing the differences between cartridges.
For ethical hunting…..30-06
🤷♂️ Point #1 - Using a 143 grain ELD-X Bullet From a 6.5 prc Only Gets You 30% Weight Retention - or 43 Grains of Bullet To Drive Through an Elk! ☹ You Might As Well Be Hunting With a 22-250 and a 55 grain Copper Bullet, Which Will Shoot Just as Flat and Penetrate as Deep! 🤯
The only advantage in having an 6.5PRC would be for some type of competitive or target shooting. For field hunting the 30-06 is superior with its higher mass and larger frontal area. For most people who go after sickly sized deer once a year theres nothing gained by trading in their 270win, 308win, or 30-06 for some new rifle. The ammo and especially rifle companies would have you believe otherwise but the reality is theyre just wanting to lighten your wallet.
The 6.5 PRC has advantages that translate to hunting, not just target shooting. Lower recoil and flatter trajectory are two of them.
142gr
In a world where 7 PRC exists, why would anyone buy a 6.5 PRC?
In a world where 300 weatherby and 30 nosler and 338 rum exist why would you want a 7 prc?? It's a comparison. Why buy chevy when you can get a ford or Toyota? Why eat steak when you can eat lobster, why watch football when you could watch basketball? Why ski when you can skate? Life's all about choices. Choose whatever you wish. This is comparing a "Fudd" cartridge to a modern cartridge. The 7 rem mag does everything a 7 prc does, so why choose 7 prc? Why why why?
🤣🤣🤣
🤔 As A Target Cartridge, The Short/Fat Cartridges Do Have An Advantage! Powder is Burned More Efficiently and You Do Get Less Recoil! But, As a Hunting Cartridge, Why Wouldn't I Want An Extra Round or Two in the Magazine With Let's Say a 30-06? WHY...WHY...WHY NOT? 😜
That is an easy one, I have several 7mm rem mags, not a whole of difference between the 7 prc and the 7 rem mag. Vortex just did a podcast on the two and they believe the 7 rem mag out performs the 7 prc, go check it out. Still your question has merit.
🕵️♂️ But, in the "Penetration Test", the 270 Outperformed Them All and Did It With 30% to 40% Less Recoil Than Those Two 7mm Cartridges! GO WATCH AGAIN (Just Saying)! 😜
Oh brother! Your really stirring the pot. LOL. Everyone has their own opinions so heres mine... I have a 6.5 prc, 300 prc, 223, 243, 6.5 creedmoor, 22 creedmoor and a few more. The 30-06 is the only cartridge ive ever gotten rid of. Yes it may can kill big game but is it the best? No. The most important thing when hunting is accuracy. Period. Then pick the right bullet to do the best job. So if i were to get an elk tag and spend all this money in getting prepared to go on this possible once in a lifetime trip and could only chose the 30-06 or a 6.5 PRC, i would chose the 6.5 PRC all day long. I would also use a solid copper bullet. Chances are that elk is not going to walk in under 100 yards, and probably not even 300, so im taking the more accurate cartridge. IMHO.
I've loaded for very accurate 30-06 rifles as well. You do you!
🤭 Of Course It Does! 😜
Never been a fan of 26 caliber always owned 27 to 30 caliber
30-06 is, and always will be, the KING of calibers!
Thanks for watching
I knew it!!🎉🎉🎉
Frontal diameter of the 06 will displace more energy on game. 30/06 all day long.
Nothing beats the 30-06 as an all round game cartridge.
Thanks for watching
The objection was to the intentionally inflammatory verbage "6.5 killer," insinuating this is in any way going to disuade 6.5 owners or somehow convince people to reverse the industry trend away from the .30-06. It's not.
People are not going to give up the efficiency, light recoil, and flat shoot characteristics of the 6.5s and go with a long action just to get .30-06 performance when they can stick with a short action mag and push that same bullet from that same ammunition line over 100 fps faster with a .300 WSM. If people are going with a long action, the 190 gr ABLR at 2900 fps from a .300 Win Mag makes more sense. The .30-06 isn't king of the hill anymore. People want efficiency, doing more with less. There is next to no demand for long action standard cartridges. Short actions outsell long actions by many orders of magnitude in this market, and those buying long actions only want true magnum performance. The .30-06 will probably never be dead in this country, but it simply isn't relevant in this market. The 168 gr ABLR .308 load will do 99% of what people need from a hunting rifle and will do it from a rifle several inches shorter and a pound and a half lighter than your basic long action sporter rifle. The short mags will trounce the long action standard head cartridges like the .30-06, again from shorter and lighter rifles. The only incentive to go with a long action is to get legit magnum performance.
This is a nice option for those who already have .30-06 and are looking to maximize performance, but the demand for new .30-06s is and shall remain low. The vast majority of new rifles are and shall remain mostly short actions, and those that are long actions will be magnums like the 7mm and .300 PRC, and the .300 Win Mag. This has been the market trend for five years or so.
No, you're not killing the 6.5s. I don't even like the 6.5s. But I make a lot more money off of 6.5s than I do the .30-06.
30-06 does beat the 6.5 PRC for large big game hunting. My intention is not to make the 30-06 the number 1 seller again. My intention was to show how capable it still is in a 6.5 dominated market. It's really a love letter to 30-06 fans.
I shoot both rounds at 1000 yards. The 6.5 PRC is very flat shooting with very little bullet drop. I can take the 6.5 PRC to a mile easy. The 30.06 has between 300 and 400 inches of bullet drop at 1000 yards. That's about all it's got. It's still doable, but a hassle. But your comparing apples and oranges. The 30.06 is almost an 8mm round. The other is a 6.5mm. 2 different things all together. Its like saying a semi beats a Lamborghini because it can haul more.
As I said... 6.5 PRC is a better long distance cartridge
No, just no.
Let's review the rifles from the last few years...
2020 SHOT Show saw the introduction of the Mossberg Patriot LR Tactical, the Savage Axis II Precision, the Springfield M2020 Waypoint, the SIG Cross, and the Rem M700 PCR Enhanced. Of these, all are available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creed, and only the Savage can be had in .30-06.
In 2021, we get the Nosler M21, the Bergara MgLite, and the Christensen Modern Hunting rifle, all available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creed, none available in .30-06.
At 2022 SHOT, the Big Horn Armory Model 89, Wilson Combat NULA M20, and Bushmaster BA30. The Big Horn is a lever action, the Wilson and Bushmaster are available in .308 and 6.5 Creed. Again, not one available in .30-06.
In 2023, we got some new configurations of the Browning Xbolt, the Stevens 334 Walnut, the CVA Cascade XT, of which all are available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creed, only the Xbolt is available in .30-06.
More often than not, we see even when long actions become available, they are only available in magnums. So tell me again what is killing the 6.5s! The 6.5s outsell the .30-06 by a wide margin and will continue to do so. The .30-06 is a vacuum right now, negative space, a non-issue at best, avoided like plague rats at worst. The industry is actively seeking to not support .30-06 because there is negative interest in it, like literally less than zero.
I obviously hit a nerve with you. I'll get back to you on all the rifles still chambered in 30-06
@ReloadingWeatherby I obviously struck a nerve with you.
And you obviously missed the point. Even the guns that are still available in .30-06 are also available in .308 Win and 6.5 Creedmoor, and the short actions still outsell the .30-06 by a significant margin.
There is still a lot of .30-06s out there, and they still put in good work. But the market trend is hard away from the .30-06 now and has been for years. There is simply no legitimate reason to buy a new .30-06 today, other than Fudd lore, and most people prefer the efficiency of the short action cartridges over nostalgia.
I didn't make the rules, bud. I am just observing market trends. Nothing is killing the 6.5s. Again, don't hate the player, hate the game.
@MTMILITIAMAN7.62 Nah! You gave me a great video idea. You're right people are getting 6.5 over 30 caliber.
backfire.tv/popular-cartridges/
30-06 is a dinosaur
🤣😂🤣. 🤣😂😂🤣🤣🤣🤣. 🤣😂😂🤣🤣🤣🤣
Glad you enjoyed it