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Why are Autistic People Bossy? (from an Autistic Person)
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- čas přidán 15. 08. 2024
- Today I am discussing a topic that hits close to home: why are autistic people bossy? Why do they act that way sometimes and what are their motivations? How can we help autistic people navigate these situations and make collaborations success for all parties involved?
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Hi! I’m Claire, and this is my channel, Woodshed Theory. Here you will find the awkward ramblings of an adult autist. I love being creative and sharing my experiences with you. Subscribe to see more DIYs and Autism Discussions on your feed!
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We aren't trying to be controlling, we are just trying to feel stability
yes i agree
Trying to control people to feel better in an unsafe world?
I agree.
This is such an important topic and the thing that’s been the most difficult for me at work. I was stunned to learn that others perceived me as bossy when I felt I was just working toward the goal that the group had already established. I think this is especially hard for autistic women, as controlling and dominating traits are generally more accepted in men.
i had the same issue you're not alone
I always want and need to work toward a goal, and get upset with groups where the goal is fluid and keeps changing. I have an acquaintance who can start a group and let the group shape the goal. I'm in awe of that -- but why would I bother to be in a group if I didn't know the goal at the beginning?
I soo agree with you. Groups without a goal feel so pointless. Althoug I have to say that in the last few years I realize, that having nice (!) social interactions can be part of a groups goal too. Then again - it seems whenever I try at that part - it always gets out of hand and I seem to become too much for people to handle :'D
One thing I am not disagreeing with but I'd like to question is, if men are generally more accepted to have controlling and/or dominating traits or, as these behaviours are more common in men or male groups, there are systems in place like open or covered powerplay to build a hierarchy and solve the issue. Which again would lead autistic men to often be on the bottom end of that heirarchy and probably suffer with this alot.. Again I'm not trying to hijack your comment or invalidate what you said - this thouhgt just came to my mind and I'm wondering if other people maybe feel the same
Yes!!! Why change what is already agreed upon as the goal?! I struggle with this
I remember when I was a kid coming home from my next-door neighbor's house crying because she wouldn't play my way. I was told to not be so bossy. I just wanted to play the way I was used to. I liked repetition and sameness. I can see how it appears to others as bossiness, but I don't think that's often the intent. Great topic! 👍
A significant chunk of my earliest friends were super bossy, I kind of wonder if that was my parents opting to hang out with people that were more comfortable for them and sticking me with children that also had a bunch of traits. It certainly would make it easier for nobody to notice the rather unusual things I was doing. It barely justified a comment as to why I was singing without moving my lips. In retrospect, that's an odd thing for anybody to do, but these days, I can move my lips largely independently of what I'm actually saying, or hardly at all.
@@SmallSpoonBrigadethat sounds like a trip
love the discourse
By the time I’ve explained how to do something to someone else , I could have done it. When someone else does part of a task, it breaks the chain of events in my head and discombobulates me and I have to adapt my routine, which is always uncomfortable.
This always bothered me so much about group work. I could have done the whole freaking project by myself in no time and it being near perfection, but the weird concept of group projects required some parts to be done by others who took foreeeeever to do it and it would come out mega-flawed in the end. Why, just whyyy? Such a pain to sit through this.
@@alessazoe so true! I still have nightmares about team building exercises from my days in office jobs for much the same reason.
I recognize the group thing for sure. I mean common man, my part is done or I’m waiting for you to be done before I can continue what I’m doing. Just get it done.
Thanks for sharing!
I always had trouble with delegating work to others, and always tried to do everything myself, so I was never referred to as ‘bossy.’ Somehow, I worked as an architect for over 40 years. How could one not try to make things perfect when people’s lives, happiness, and reputations were on the line. I spent a lot of time correcting other people’s work, and sometimes ended up taking over projects from others. I was criticised for taking too much time, and for trying to make things perfect. Years ago, I even became a scapegoat, and developed PTSD. It is a field where one encounters a lot of abusive narcissism.
Hi Jeff I am sorry you went through this
Oh that’s interesting. Never heard that before about architecture specific. I wonder why the architecture field a narcissist magnet?
*ouch* - *direct hit* - *falls over* - I still have to work so hard on this, and some times are so much harder than others!
i'm glad i'm not alone
Another topic that’s soooo relatable! I was upset so many times in school around rules, now that I’m looking back through that lens of self-diagnosed autism. It all makes so much sense now.
Just one other reason why we might stick to rules (esp. in a school or work setting) like super glue: We assume the teacher/boss/etc. set up those rules for a reason. If there was no reason for the rules, they wouldn’t be there. So of course we follow the rules and we get upset when others can just not adhere to them, bend them etc. and it’s okay. Like what? Why? Why is a rule there in the first place when it doesn’t need to be followed? This creates an upset confusion that can bother me for a loooong time, hard to get over at all.
On the other hand, I vividly remember fighting with teachers over rules they set which didn’t make any freaking sense, so it’s not that we are blind to such stuff. Sometimes I only realised later that a rule made no sense and I was angry with myself for blindly following it, not questioning it earlier, sometimes it was set up as a test like a trap ... argh. So many mixed feelings coming up on this one!
Yeah I think I get it - I wouldn't have been able to fathom why someone would make it a rule if it wasn't for a good reason
At a previous job, my favorite store manager was the one that would let me argue with him. And then he would respond with a smirk on his face, "what does policy say?"(maybe because he agreed with me?) Since he had previously held my position as department manager and let me argue with him, I could respect him. In all honesty, usually it wasn't that big of a deal, I know that now. 😂
I relate a lot to this. I still think that most rules are made for a good reason. Obviously there are a fair number of exceptions to this.
hmm i was oposite i WOULD follow the rules if knew the REAON behind them but if its just "listen to me im the adult" card i would disobey. or when was a kid if was told "if do that your gonna be in big touble" i wanted to see what this person's "big trouble" was and would act out JUST to activate the "big trouble" mode. or like at one my schools they basicaly promoted me to missbehave becuase was this wired glass room they put you in if missbehave, which was a "punishment" but for me it was a "reward"
Thank you for your insight in this video. My superior told me a few years ago that some people felt i was “unapproachable” and it took me a really long time to realize it wasn’t me that was the problem, but rather the way people were interpreting my responses and facial expressions. I’ve since learned to interact in a more neurotypical way but it’s still unfortunate that I have to adjust my personality to make others comfortable rather than the work environment adjusting to be more accepting of neurodivergence.
Yeah neurotypical is its own language
I had a massive falling out with my team this which led to me discovering my own Autism. while I dont think for a minute that it was caused only by me and my autism, I agree with your points. one thing that really confused me about my own situation was that people thought i was angry when i wanted to change the way they did things. That was not the case but in retrospect i probably had a couple of shutdowns where i was not aware of my own body language.
The amount of times people think we are having an argument. When all I’m having is a discussion is ridiculous.
this is so relatable, thank you for sharing. i will keep screaming out for adult diagnosis advocacy because it changes a lot
Thank you. What you described in this video is me. It can lead to a great deal of anxiety when superiors don't really understand what they have asked me to do. Left to my own interpretation, I can spend a great deal of time on any given task. The other part that bothers me a great deal is "changing priorities." If "something more important" comes up, I completely abandon the other task or project. I won't go back because, in my mind, I have wasted so much time on something that "they" just said is no longer important. I need to be told to go back to it. When working in a group, I find it frustrating that members of the team endlessly debate over what needs to be done and how it should be done. In my mind, I view this behavior as task avoidance. They want to sit around and "socialize" the project and never get anything done. I hate that and I hate whenever a superior says "we need to socialize" whatever the problem or issue is. No! We don't need to socialize anything. We need to fix it! Sorry for that bit of a rant. Thank you and please keep posting videos.
Hi Brian - thank you for sharing. this was hard for me to talk about because it is a complex topic for me and self reflection is hard
"Socialize the project" I'm totally stealing that line 😂 love it
@@WoodshedTheoryI think you did a great job. I'm sure it resonates with others also.
Another great topic! I’ve been accused of being bossy on many occasions. I stand my ground really well and found at a young age that that trait isn’t always appreciated. I have, on occasion, done advocacy medical and other advocacy work for elderly people in my family and it’s a useful skill in that way.
i can see how it is useful when advocating for others
I agree with everything you said, here! I always need to be in control. I was accused, as a child, of “talking back” to adults all the time. I just knew they were wrong about something, and I had to say something about it. After art school, I got a job at a small, independent, pizza shop. After a short time, I was put in charge of everyone when the owner wasn’t there. I guess he saw that I always had to make sure the food was absolutely perfect, and it bothered me greatly when other employees just couldn’t seem to get it together. I did that for 6 1/2 years, and it was very stressful. After that I worked for a cleaning company, for about 9 months, before quitting and going into business on my own. I was so overworked and underpaid, and it angered me that a lot of the other people there would slack off, and do a really bad job. Then myself and my partner, who were very thorough, would get sent to fix the other people’s mistakes. Everyone got paid the same, no matter how terrible they were. These days it really annoys me when I see people walking down the street, and throwing their garbage on the ground. Don’t they know it’s really awful to do that? A few years ago, I was driving down the hill from my house, and I saw a woman throw a fast food bag and cup with a straw over a bridge, into a creek. What is wrong with people? Basically, everything bothers me. To me, it seems like a no brainer.
i get it - i have had a hard go at learning that work and performance are not the be all end all
My wife comes from a culture where they seem to view every single rule as being negotiable. It's been a tough adjustment, as it means being on edge all the time as I wait to see what she's going to decide she doesn't have to comply with. It can also be very helpful when I need something that requires some advocacy, but it's still very uncomfortable.
i can see how that would be a tough adjustment as we like clear guidelines
@@WoodshedTheory Even more so since I'm like 90% certain that she has her own autistic traits and there's a decent chance that she's PDA profile as well. But that's really hard to tell in a culture where not respecting rules is common.
This has explained so much for me. I used to tell people that my daughter didn't wanna just be in a club, she wanted to be president.She didn't want to just do a project she wanted to be the project lead. To some people appeared bossy.
thanks for sharing - i can relate
I would have said my daughter was the most neurotypical person in our family, but she always takes charge of a situation. When I was a substitute teacher, I asked her what teachers do when students are working in small groups and no student takes charge. She said, "I don't know. I've never been in a group where nobody took charge."
I think I tend to be bossy sometimes because I actually lack the social skills. I guess I simply have less training. And the reason for that may come down to this: I learn stuff that I'm interested in - and I find most people not really interesting.
That's about my working theory.
something to think about
I'm almost certain my mom is autistic and she is very controlling and bossy. I'm AuDHD and do the same thing to an extent. Thanks for trying to spell this out, it helps me think through it all!
I have empathy for where the impulse to control comes from but it's also very hurtful to the ADHD side of me because there is ZERO understanding of where I'm coming from. Not saying all autistics are incapable of being empathetic to people with ADHD but that has been my experience with my mom.
thanks for understanding that i dont have all the answers, i am thinking through it all too
@@wiegraf9009 I have both autism and ADHD and I am difficult within myself. People said I was bossy when I was younger.
I was bossy as a child, but it eventually caused me enough troubles that I flipped and spent quite a while just being a "yes man" as a result. I'd like to think I've learned to be a little more balanced in recent years, but it's always great to hear and learn from other people's experience, especially when it's THIS relatable.
glad it resonated with you
I was very bossy as a child and spent a lot of effort trying to change that as I got older.
Great video, Claire! I’ve never considered my bossiness as part of being autistic but you’ve nailed it!
I’m a trainer with a travel agency. Ohmagoodness, it drives me batty when parameters are laid out and then, when folks blatantly disregard them, the agency owners don’t address it. Whyyyy have the guidelines/rules if it doesn’t really matter.
I get it, I get frustrated with that stuff too
Oh this was so relatable in many, many ways! Gives me once again even more to think about. Regarding workplaces and studying/uni I'd say:💩 on the good vibes .. vibes get too much attention already. Sometimes it IS indeed more important to focus on the work to be done. Thats my perspective.
I don't think you are wrong. It's a big topic and I still have a lot to think about.
Wow, never thought about it that way - “want to control self” not necessarily situation - you just said it self-centered - so hard when being seen this way ……. So much learning to do. Thanks for sharing Claire 💞👊
Yes Kelly - I hope it doesn't appear that I have all the answers. I am trying to bring up tough topics for us to think about not just the fluff stuff. I am still figuring things out
That was really helpful. I recognize that behavior in my cousin, especially when we were kids. Neither of us is diagnosed, I am self diagnosed, but after years of research I am certain that a great deal of my family are autistic. It’s always great when new information leads to a better understanding of another person. Being on the other side of a bossy cousin that I spent a great deal of time with, though, was not great as my needs were rarely met when we were together for any amount of time.
yes if there is one thing we know about the cause of autism there is a genetic component
That's for sure!@@WoodshedTheory
Glad you talked about this. I'm currently really experiencing difficulty with this in my social life. I'm often not flexible enough to change plans and I apparently dictate the situations without me even realising it. Does anyone else get this feedback? And how do you manage it? I feel like I'm already trying to be so aware and give space, but it doesn't seem like enough. Especially when I'm not doing well and I'm not able to give space at all.
Most definitely, people don’t understand that you’re trying to prevent stuff from happening for yourself, meltdown or shutdown for instance. You’ll have people in your social life that either get that it’s because of something you where born with, or people that think your just being selfish.
YES MAR - i relate to you - i really struggle not to take the lead on most things - i only want to feel comfortable but i get now that it isn't my place or healthy to take all situations on
I don't know yet if I'm autistic/ADHD, but this video speaks to my inner child. At 43, many of your points in this video are things I've had to work to overcome/improve on.
Thank you for your comment bethany - i know these can be difficult things to work through
I thought it made sense what you said about being bossy (or seeming bossy) as part of a need to have control of the situation ( to make it more predictable, or more tolerable, or less anxiety-causing).
Thanks glad it made sense
Great topic Claire! ❤ awesome video! I agree with all of whatypu said. I also want to add 2 thoughts. As girls and women, we more often get labeled as bossy for taking the lead (at least my experience as a 90s kid and onward). And nr.2 sometimes the urge to "take the lead" stems from seeibg those who as "leading" as dropping the ball. Either by the project/task moving too slowly or I see deadlines approaching and they will be missed if I don't fix it. Or others are about to make big mistakes and I interveen. This is much more appreachiated now as I het older and the people I work withhave seen me doing things great and being right through the years, but I had many years without that respect (even though I wasright back then as well). Approaching 40, and having been diagnosed at 38, I am learning to lead in a way that seems less bossy, but still gets the point across (I think😅). Hugs from Norway❤
I applaud you for your courage to reflect and change directions. I am in a similar place and I know it is hard.
I think for me it's also that I can't tell how my actions are affecting other people unless they tell me. NT's spend a lot of time hinting at things. We're all, NT's and autistics, just trying to live comfortable lives. But we can't always tell when our moves to make our worlds more comfortable infringe upon other's comfort.
Yes! I experience this as well
Most of the autistic people I’ve met and interacted with were extremely NOT bossy. They struggled to assert themselves and stand up for themselves and set boundaries. It’s a shame because I’m very attracted to the kind of person who is good at all those things, who would probably be called bossy. I’m also bad at all those things.
But some are bossy. My ex is autistic and is an extremely controlling and domineering (bossy) person. I love that quality and wish it was more common. But it needs to be balanced and not go overboard on self-centeredness. Especially when you have a partner (or kids!!)
That's also an issue that we can have, especially when it comes to those of us that are used to not having our needs met or are otherwise traumatized.
Yeah people voicing what they wnt frank, s, first isnt bossy, but knowing what you want is good.
Did your e ever consider SM,that leitis a good outlet tolearn tocare and oundaries and communication and being controlling, can be used well there. And explored. its alsorelly very consentual roleplay.
You are right - some are bossy and some are passive - we all present differently. That is why I tried to focus on the why we might be instead why we all are
@@SmallSpoonBrigadethat was me for a long time. I had a parent who was emotionally abusive.
I haven't been called bossy as often as I've been called stubborn or contrary - I think all for the same reasons of undiagnosed autism. I'm still waiting for diagnosis, but I strongly resonate with the PDA profile, which comes with massive anxiety & need for control. It just fits for me & I've always found ways to subvert rules I considered unnecessary or ridiculous, or just unfair!
thanks for sharing
Wow this really resonated with me. I’ve recently “discovered” I think I have autism. I started the process today to get my suspicions confirmed with a formal diagnosis. This is the first video I watched if yours, and you’ve earned a new subscriber! Being bossy was one way in which Ive always struggled socially.
HI Lauren happy to have. The diagnosis process can be... emotional? hard? please remember to give yourself grace
This is a great video, it helps AuDHD me see why I had problems at previous jobs, too. Thanks Claire!
Thanks for your comment
I so relate to this topic. I was yelled at by my bosses for hyper focusing on my work and asked by a psychiatrist, "Why do you have to be so perfect all the time?"
yeah unfortunately hyper focus doesnt leave much room for others
Oh my goodness. I related to everything you have said. I have lately realized my deep rooted struggle with control and perfectionism is rooted in this.... i had never known why and having a reason helps me to get a better grasp on not responding this way. Also, the whole following the rules to a t is just ingrained in how i do things. I can't understand someone else's viewpoint when they're wanting to have an exception or change things up. I used to think the way i thought was "normal" and was then caught off guard every time which would lead to me getting very upset.
Thank you for sharing this.
thank YOU for sharing, glad to know i am not alone
Thank you, Claire ! Spot on - I am oftentimes bossy - and for all the reasons you listed here ! I try to calm my self and “let go” in various situations, when or if I realise what is going on with me - it leads to a lot of internal discussions in my mind though
i'm glad it resonated with you
In my profession failure is not an option, so all of the qualities that you described as relating to being bossy, are in fact assets. Some people still don’t like those qualities, but management likes the results.
I also prefer to be in a lead role, but that has more to do with PDA than being bossy. I lead in a way that I like to be led, that being from a consent-based foundation. I ask “can you help us with this task?” rather than telling someone to do the task. Not “bossing”, but rather allowing someone to engage through choice.
PDA is def a component
Hi, I was sent over by Niese, and wanted to thank you for putting this video out. It actually helped me to understand my son a little better. I've noticed with him that, even though he's going to be 9 in a couple weeks if anything disrupts his schedule he's not a happy camper. I also understand now why he acts the way he does toward his 6-year-old brother when something isn't going his way. It's hard for him to communicate with us since he's delayed in speech and finding a speech therapist in my area is basically nonexistent, but we have found an awesome online program that he loves, and has helped him a lot! I hope you have a wonderful, safe, and blessed weekend!
Hi Mary, I am so glad to have you. Niese is a gem!
Thank you so much for talking about this. These are some of the things that I have struggled with in the past that someone dear to me pointed out to me and helped me tone down a bit. But the motivations to "take care of things" / be bossy as they make me uncomfortable still bother me very, very much.
yeah i understand, i'm better than i was but i'm a work in progress
I'm autistic and bossy, but I have a reputation for my strong opinions typically being backed up by logic/research. I did struggle in my early career with situations where I'd feel compelled to argue with someone in a position of authority because, well, they were wrong and I could forsee the chaos that would ensue if we did it their way. People don't enjoy having their authority questioned. Now, many years later, I just point out the thing and they go "Oh! Right!" and we do it my way. My clients trust me when I'm super impassioned about something. If I have to work on a team, then I have to be in charge of anything that's under my area of responsibility. My job is pretty niche, so there's no competing with 'peers' for who's idea wins. If I had to give any advice to young autistic people - I'd completely recommend finding a job where you can work towards being the expert so you can be in control and don't have to use up your spoons faffing around trying to deal with the social apects of teamwork. :)
i totally get it - i just dont view others as my superior so i dont think that maybe they dont want my two cents
@@WoodshedTheory right. They're paying me for my particular expertise, so I've overcome any reticence I may have had about 'being a a pain in the a$%" when I was younger and less confident. I have some autistic friends who have run into troubles being too outspoken at work (in their own area) - but I think they shouldn't stop being that way - they just need to find people to work for who appreciate that.
I know these videos are tough but quite frankly as someone recently realizing I am most likely on the spectrum they’ve been very helpful to me. I’ve found these specific videos really relatable - it seems like we were probably similar kinds of kids (tho I’m sure being a boy means it was received differently for me - I was more “stubborn” or “detail-oriented” than “bossy”). Your videos on friendship have similarly resonated. Thanks for putting yourself out there!
i am so glad they are helpful - i know it's hard transition period with late diagnosis so you are very welcome here
When I was a substitute teacher, I asked my high school daughter what teachers do when they put students in groups to work and nobody takes the lead. She said, "I don't know. I've never been in a group where nobody took the lead." She is a natural-born leader and definitely a people person. I learned a lot from her while she was growing up. My son told me one time, "It doesn't do any good to get mad at Sarah, because she doesn't care if you're mad at her." (I see below that apparently I've watched this video before!)
I have a tendency to think that I'm the only one who has thought about a certain topic from "all" angles. To have considered all the what if's. So therefore I feel like I'm the natural person to take the lead. I'm fully willing to admit when I haven't done the mental homework, but when I have, I have the unshakable confidence that something has to be done "my" way
i resonate with this, i also struggle to understand the competency of others.
I’ve been called either “bossy” or “know it all” by people on the work floor. Mostly because unknown to me I’m constantly correcting people. I had a work colleague that couldn’t figure out what floor he was on. Kind of a problem if I’m supposed to check how you did your job and I walk to the wrong floor constantly.
You’re not supposed to but I always want to answer no if I’m asked, during a job interview, if I’m a good team player.
I also have a problem with an open office setting. Great now I can not only hear what the rest are working on, if they are even working at all, but I can also see it. I worked at a helpdesk and people would constantly watch shows on Netflix or visit non work related sites. But the one time I do it I get a talk with the CEO because I’m breaking the rules.
Getting stuck on a task is also a problem not only for myself but also in a team setting. When we decide to make a list I will prioritize what’s on top of the list first and I will work that list until it’s done. If I get stuck on something or someone else hasn’t finished their task on the list and I’m suppose to work on the next point of the list I get stuck.
I do this too. Apparently Neurotypicals don't like to be told when they do something wrong. I never understood this. How do you not grow and fix the mistake if your not told what you did. 🤷♀️
omg i love that you say no to being a good team player - that is a level of honestly i can work toward
I was a very bossy child. As a teenager I wanted to be a leader but I realized that I could not be one because people refused to do what I said. Being a good leader requires having better social skills than I had. I didn't know that I was autistic as a teenager. I just realized that I couldn't get people to follow my lead. It was frustrating. Especially in academics. I did well in academics but people would rather follow someone who didn't know the material as well. C'est la vie.
I resonate with this - thanks for sharing
Hi Claire, maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm bossy. I'm actually really passive, trying to not draw attention to me. Maybe because I was raised in a toxic violent environment, and now the situation isn't much better.
That is completely fair, we are all different
Great question and pondering to do…… 💞👊
yeah i am still thinking about it to be honest
I remember that when we were kids my two sisters used to say I was too bossy. We had 3 girls and only two bedrooms, so a couple of us had to share. Once my middle sister and I used masking tape to divide our bedroom in half -- but we still had to share a double bed. We ended up with the two of them sharing until I went off to college. It was a little strange because they were 5 years apart in age and my middle sister and I were only a year apart. I don't remember being particularly tidy, but I must have been tidier than the one with whom I shared a room for a while.
my sister and i are 18 months apart and we also really struggled to get along
I think our sibling situations and birth order play a large role in how we learn to get along with other people.
Ugh, I have ALWAYS been called 'bossy' and 'controlling' but I don't think that's necessarily true. I mean, I DO like to control things but that's more to do with myself than other people. I want to always be in control of EVERYTHING like my emotions and my environment. I want things a certain way and I get anxious when they aren't. Me and my therapist talk a LOT about my control issues and how those are brought on by my anxiety that's ALSO due to OCD and perfectionism because, as you said, I'm trying to control my anxiety and that manifests as me trying to controlling everything. That control DOES make me feel more comfortable and I just...gosh lol I'm really trying to work on myself. I am lol But iz difficult xD
Gosh, we need to be friends >//< I love your channel and your personality and I relate so much to you. Also...also...pss pss pss...the yarn stash in the back is COACH. I have SO much yarn (I crochet and knit) and it is running me out of happy house and home (as well as my WIPs) and yet...I keep buying MORE yarn lmao pls)
I totally resonate with what you are saying. Working on yourself SUCKS but is also super worth it. I love that you like the fiber arts!
Oh I forgot to mention I just did a video where I purged some yarn if you want to check it out.
@WoodshedTheory Yaaaaas! I would love to watch. I'll check it out now while I'm working on my sister's cardigan :D
And yes! Working on yourself is absolutely 💯 % worth it 🙌🏾 I don't think I will ever stop doing work on myself because I am of the personal belief that I will never ever be perfect lol So there will always be something to work on!
def check it out it's long so good to watch while you crochet @@RootwitchQueen
First, you did a great job on the topic. The whole being a passenger was spot on for me. Also, when working on a team where I had to wait on others to finish before I can start drives me crazy.
The topics you atleast for me are really good and necessary otherwise people won't know.
waiting is the worst!
Oh Gosh! This hit home. I used to be an electronics technician, I had to make sure everything I put together was perfect, I was told I wasn't pumping them out fast enough. They were concerned with quantity over quality which I preferred the other way around. I was making hearing aids from scratch, I wanted the customer to be happy. They were happy with my work but yeah speed was an issue.
When my second child was born I made up my mind I would breastfeed him (I bottle fed my first daughter). He was so difficult because he refused to get the latch correctly. I went to a lactation consultant. Even she was baffled why, she would get the proper positioning but he would go right back to the way he wanted, which meant I was left bleeding and in so much pain. My mother-in-law and my husband both ganged up on me (at least that's how it felt) that I should bottle feed but that only caused me to dig my heels in deeper that I didn't want to give up. Because of the latching issues people assumed he wouldn't gain weight, well this kid was 25 lbs by the time he was 3 months old, lots of rolls. haha! Thankfully as he grew his latch got better, I nursed him till he was 2 y/o, which is when he decided on his own to wean off.
I am a Capricorn, my husband says I am definitely as stubborn as a goat. He has said I'm bossy, I have tried to tame it down or just walk away and tell myself "It's not a big deal." Not easy
Thanks Claire! You explain things SO well! 😊😊
thanks for saying this because i always get nervous when i go out on a limb like this
I’m straight up getting stonewalled by this terrible development of the world. Even my oldest friends from childhood just ghost me. Nobody even attempts any connection with me. I can’t just sit here. I’m stuck in an apartment in Phoenix and I cant go out. My brain is very much necessary to remain as is. They blow up and destroy anything I have.
sorry you are going through this
It's not just you. The only reason I have any friends at all is that I virtually stalked one of my childhood friends long enough that we remained friends. But, there are so many problems with that level of effort just to have a friend.
Just name/moniker autistic he’s undesirable for children! We had too many! But i don’t if you’re this dude or not? He just wants his tinker shop. A calm place to work. Let him Go camping cheap, just so has food that’s the worst. Never ever having food. His girlfriend thinks he’s evil. His nerves are stripped clean. He neuropathy, eating disorders, all these interroception problems. Some can let go, this disrupts my whole life, drinking water, poop too much, eat too much it gets too crazy I couldn’t even work I had too many compulsions 🤣 this is feedback give a little autonomy I needed actual help from but they charge him but don’t do diagnose him. I ended up having to read neuroscience and psychology computer science expert. Too many things I had to figure out. He could just invite friends over who don’t autistic kids from the parents house. They don’t have to all say “he’s gone autistic “ this is used so much it’s ridiculous. My sister shouldn’t my mom . She was my mom first! Telling my mom not to let me stay when I actually need to stay. They lie i don’t know if I am or not. Why hes making not desperate? Everyone around him is autistic so if always autistic then what are they? None of it man’s just let him have a way. I only one life. I could actual money instead these guys stealing pocket change off my person here. I could invest money and make exponential profits off short sale. You don’t do it. It’s not you. Not my fault you don’t know how to think. I certainly understand everything i know ever studied basically, you want to challenge me?
I have to be able to be able to see the future just so I can do anything. No matter what NT sets him up every where. This is why I’m gonna nuke the bitch! The bitch? The fucking this planet. Autism it’s not what you think it is. Nt has no concept or concerns. No knowledge. The next mental state paradigm is the only thing in development?
@@WoodshedTheory at least let’s get nuclear reactors, stop the wars. Retooling the entire system. They’re just make other things. Go build over there. That’s gonna make you more money. I was wondering who’s this zero sum idiot? Just everyone everywhere making more money is the best! That’s the whole problem! There’s nothing in circulation. You’re just stealing money off these guys. You givr no stimulants then kill them put them in jail etc. they need to think. Go play games well pay your weirdly inflated salaries and pay. To make this guys life an uphill battle., you need less NTs more of these guys to think. Nobody else has deep thinking. Csn you see the future? Well it’s a head spinning retard fest just let the same access to everything stimulants, because whatever is wrong. Ive never seen a dumber planet than this one. No neurological recovery? That’s the whole point, nothing else matters or can’t do anything. You cant figure out that I know everything including your thoughts. It’s ridiculous. The worlds going to end soon figure it out. Or do you want me to? Just do the same thing forever?
My strategy in group work is usually to let someone else just tell me what to do, that way I wouldn't risk letting people down by doing it my way and them not liking it, or them challenging me on my idea and stressing me out.
interesting, so follow the lead
Yep, that way I get a clear cut direction on exactly what to do :)
@@shmalex32 I do exactly this too.
This is so bang on Claire. Thank you for spelling it out. And I recognize myself in this. I always end up leading unless I don't feel the rules allow it - like I'm in training. It's hard for me to give up my idea of how it should be done. I want it perfect. My husband is 80/20 rule. He helps me be more flexible. And I get devastated easily if I make a mistake if it affects others.
For me it's anxiety, and the desire for things to be done right and safely. Especially when it comes to children and pets. I want them to be OK, so I am hyper-vigilant at times.
Thank you for sharing
I can't remember the last time I had that level of hyperfocus, except when I used to play video games. I don't really care about my job that much, so I just do what I'm paid to do.
that is cool!
@WoodshedTheory Yeah. I can be hyperfocused if something is important to me.
But I'm autistic so I do relate to a lot of what you say. People seem to find me personable but they probably think I'm a bit odd.
I've never had a partner for example, because most women don't go for guys like me. I've sort of accepted that as "it is what it is".
There was a song about this topic in the early-mid 2000s similar to this topic.
Brownie points to whoever can guess it
i got nothing lol
What I can't figure out is: If you're not really supposed to follow a rule, why is it the rule? It feels like there are always two sets of rules: What's written down vs. what people actually do. People get mad at you for following the written rules, but they won't tell you what the unwritten rules are. Why not have the written rules be what you're actually expected to do?
i get it, i didn't realize there were two sets of rules either
It seems like neurotypical people instinctively know the unspoken rules so they have a hard time explaining it to us. Because how can we not know what comes naturally to them?
Yup. Often they don't realize there's even something there *to* explain.
Thanks for this. I actually don't remember if I was bossy with friends as a kid, but I most certainly was super bossy when it came to my siblings. Based on conversations I've had with my mom, I think I was super agreeable at school and then super bossy at home.
I regards to rules, when my work was in the office we used to have a scrabble board out on a common table. Since I grew up playing scrabble with my family it irked me so much that people at work were breaking the rules... Even though we weren't actually playing a real game. Anyone at any point could walk by and put a word on the board. I ended up making my frustration known with it and starting telling anyone who would listen the rules of scrabble. Not my best moments lol, but then I was undiagnosed (so I didn't understand my behavior) and I just can't stand it when people break the rules even if it's for a game 😅
Yes my sister would have called me bossy too
So helpful! I've wondered about how this plays out in my relationship & if it was related to autism. 🖤 Thanks!
i'm so happy it was helpful
Something I really struggle with is being given very specifc instructions, following them and when the manager decides it's taking longer than they thought it would I get told to just not care as much or do it differently or skip parts of their instructions and it's said in a way like I should have just known to do that... I find it very difficult to switch up the way I'm doing something in that scenario because the emphasis was so strongly put on it needing to be done that way originally. It's exhausting
I get it
Story of my life!
Regarding the last point. It becomes a problem when the NT effects my job, an obituary, or my grade. Things can't be overlooked. Let them do that on their time, with their things. Don't get mad at me because you want to do a half as$ job.
Yeah, wantinga job getting done decent is not bossy, granted therecan be perfectionism, but whats ad about doing it seriously! And if not, make your case.
I understand what you are saying. This is the reason I would take over because I knew I could guarantee good work and I couldn't rely on others.
This is actually exactly why people didn't like to be my coworker because they would want to socialize while working and I can't do both.
Sorry that happened.
@@WoodshedTheory it's okay, I learned my limitations and trying to be mindful of that. I still have problems with taking on more tasks than I can realistically handle. I'm learning.
I think you did a great job with this video. It is a very tricky subject. I am certainly most comfortable when I am in charge of what I am doing. I regularly pick up on others' mistakes (tactfully, or silently correcting) because I am slow, methodical and have an exceptionally high level of attention to detail. I think a lot more than many coworkers. It doesn't mean I feel I am better than them though. They can be great at giving a fast response and then I can work in the background making a near perfect thorough, detailed and accurate second response. Both ways are skills which are needed in the workplace. I am usually paralysed when a fast reply is needed as I'm working through all the permutations and possibilities and just can't give a "ballpark", or very rough first instinctual reply like my neurotypical colleages seem to. It feels to me like a kind of dishonesty and I am incapable of doing it. But I see it's useful.
Also because I spend so long in very detailed anaylsis of tasks I do feel that I usually have the best strategy to solving a problem if given a little while. As you said in your video, I also find I'm great at pattern recognition and seeing trends which lead to the best way to do something. I quickly discard methods which wont work - more quickly than neurotypical colleagues who might just dive in and start on the wrong track then have to halt as it's not working. I'd rather plan, spend time analysing and save time that way. My ADHD wife and I are at opposite ends on this. She rushes headlong into the first action she sees fit while I am screaming inwardly wanting her to stop and think and just predicting all the stuff she's going to do wrong which I'll have to unpick and then redo (perfectionist!) but without her to start things moving *nothing* would get done! She cleans the whole house while I sit in a tiny corner agonising over the placement of small things, surrounded by chaos. Our difference makes life fun! We're learning to work with each others' strengths!
My Autistic inertia means often I see an action happening through in my mind many many many times before I do it. I've refined and found the best way to do that task during that time. So often I really do know the best way to do it as I've put a load of thought into it!
Thank you for sharing your experience with us Julie 😃
This is good information. I see a lot of this in my kids, my husband, and myself. For me, I definitely feel that desire for control and deep anxiety, especially from my mistakes. However, I have actually not encountered the bossy label much. In thinking on it, I realize it may be because I tamp down a LOT of my feelings due to the years of conditioning from my CPTSD. Speaking up was tantamount to getting yelled at and hit in childhood, so I quickly learned to clamp a lid on my voice. So...typically, it boils within until I can hold it no longer. Then, it eventually explodes and heaven help the person who catches the results. I am teaching myself to exit the situation when I feel it coming on, if I am able. Later, when I am more collected, I can come back and articulate a bit better, or else, I write things down in my exit time that will assist me in expressing myself when I feel ready to come back and try to share.
I'm glad it made sense cause sometimes I dont know if I am being clear
No worries. It was clear. I get it, though. Writing is one thing, but if you could hear me trying to string my thoughts together when speaking..oh, boy...
Thank you Claire! I resonated with literally every word, and this explains so much of my life in a way that helps me understand myself and other people's reactions to me better. It's weird realizing we've just been experiencing and thus looking at things different all along. PS I miss the green hair, it's so flattering on you, not to say your aren't gorgeous naturally, because you are, just this look was working for you too 💁♀️💚
Wow! Your videos are really refreshing me. Like orange blossoms in spring. I can relate to all you speak of.
This is a very interesting topic. So this leads me to a question: Do you know that people think you are bossy, if you tend to miss social cues? I ask, because although not diagnosed, I often miss social cues, and share some other traits. I wouldn't really know if people thought I was bossy or not, unless they specifically told me so. Hmmm.....they might. I'm not sure I care if they do think I'm bossy. I mean I care what they think, but don't think of bossy as bad. As a kid, I didn't throw a tantrum if I didn't get to play my way with others. But I did just go off on my own and do my own thing. I knew that I always was kind of on the fringe, but also liked drawing, painting, & making things so much that it only bothered me for a little while , if I wasn't included. As an adult, I'm still a "fringe friend" with most groups. I get along with most people well enough. I just find it hard to keep up socially and still have time for the things that I like to do most. I have to remind myself that staying connected is part of being a good friend to most people, whereas I'm fine not seeing someone or talking to them for quite a while and the time just seems to drop away once we are together again.
I miss A LOT of social cues. Or at least I get confused and have to ask for clarification
Yeah i feel confused by being in a work setting and seeing how people don't take it very seriously, don't exactly follow the rules. Maybe I'm a perfectionist about work yeah, it would basically feel like the world was ending if i was late or god forbid made a mistake with something
yeah i def had panic attacks from making mistakes at work
Im bossy because i know i what i want, what to do, how ,and want it right now!!! well done also 😊
thanks for sharing
I am very blunt and to the point when I speak. And I've very honest. If someone makes a mistake, I point it out. Or just tell it like it is. Before my diagnosis, I would be told that people thought I was a b*tch. Or just rude. I could never understand why because I'm the kindest person and would give anyone the shirt off my back. Lol. But the way my tone is when I speak comes off that way.
i understand, thanks for sharing
You do not seem bossy or character flawed!
I was always called a good leader in school. I’m more ADHD than autistic socially and laid back in that way. I was ok taking charge too 😂😂
But mean family members and frenemies would say bossy! I think we are straightforward and goal oriented, not worried about sugar coating or beating around the bush. We ignore the social cues of communicating at times but not to gain power over others.
I think we all have flaws, even I lol
@@WoodshedTheory True, but don’t be too hard on yourself! You’re lovely! I think there are people who want to feel superior or in power over others & that’s why they control. I don’t think that applies to most autistic or adhd people bc it’s more about coping, not dominating when we get controlling
I'm wondering if masking could create a knock on effect of control as well. When you've spent the whole day being who other people want you to be, maybe it can create a need to be able to be who you actually are for yourself as well.
Being perceived as making mistakes or doing things wrong, could have a big part in this.
And being good at problem solving (the individuals who's skills lie here), so you are given instructions for a task, but you've figured out a more effective and efficient way of carrying this out. As opposed to the original plan.
People who experience the impact of both ASD and ADHD.
Just some areas that came to mind as a possibility.
thank you for sharing!
You're welcome! (^_^)
Sorry I haven't gotten to the end of your video yet, so I'm not sure if you have mentioned those things. But just wanted to put them down before I forgot, lol.
Another part of that could be taking into consideration that ND people are the experts on themselves. And when presented with a task, could map out a way of completing it that suits their abilities as well as getting the task done. That might mean that they may do it differently to NT people, despite having the same end result. Especially when you take into account trouble switching tasks like you mentioned.
I know trouble switching or being disrupted is something that I experience. Then I have difficulty picking back up from where I was afterwards.
I don't know if this problem does apply to anyone else, but it seems possible.
I really enjoyed and appreciated your video. My adopted son is on the spectrum and is diagnosed with ADHD too, but, interestingly enough, I completely identified with all of this myself. Maybe we're just competent and capable leaders too.
But, to add to this, I know my obsessive/compulsive is partly to blame. It's like the need to finish someone's sentence when they're taking too long to say something and you know what they're going to say so you blurt it out.
Thanks for wanting to support your son! That means a lot!
Thank you
thank you!
Thank you for this. This helps me understand my colleague.
glad it is helpful
I experience everything ...
i get it
this was absolutely brilliant 🙏 instant subscription with full bells 👍
well maybe not instant instant, i've seen you in the burnout support video for orion first and that made me prioritise your podcast episode with meg, so it's an instant subscription as in 'i already bookmarked a whole bunch of your videos and it was basically already done (very exited about crafting content too 🥳) 😅
i do have one small addition which is: yes, allistics have a right to be annoyed by us and want us to do better, but i think we also have a right to be heard an believed when we coherently explain that it's not an ego thing. that it's all the things you explained instead, which is sadly often quite hard for allistics to even grasp. like, i don't see why it's okay for some of them to be bossy for the very same reasons they then project onto us. just saying. rawr.
basically i myself have been bullied out of all my assertivenes for a long time now but i can attest that we understand each other's need to take the lead sometimes very well (and i still get plenty accused of being judgy, for my failure at faking pleasing opinions when asked btw). i can literally smell the difference between emergency assertivenes and smug self-importance. so there 😜
welcome!
@@WoodshedTheory thanks 😊
Thank you very much, i understod lot of my misunderstanding in work via your video.
Yup whisper behind back and eye rolls …..
Ha
yup
Yeah, and to my face they called me UrkeI!
Yes Boss! At least I would have an itinerary. 😇
I think I'm flexible, maybe. 🤔
Fair enough!
I was told the same
Hi Leah!
I have to send this to my boss.
I know people don’t always get it
"Bossy" is what many neurotypical males call self-confident women.
Mostly just the NT males that lack any sort of identifiable confidence.
Ummm yeah but sometimes the bossiness DOESN'T come from self-confidence, it comes from insecurity and trying to manage that insecurity by managing others. I think that's what the video is trying to say.
I think that can be true - but also not really what I am referring to in this video. nothing wrong with being self confident
@@wiegraf9009 True
Whatever it is, it's burnout inducing for others.
you know I think I understand what you mean, it's stressful to experience sometimes
Ouch. That´s so me! I feel caught. And I totally subscribe the explanations.
AgainIWanTtoliveinanjustNDworld😭😭😭
Why does it has to feel so complicated! Why there are rules but I am wrong to follow them exactly?
That sucks!
i hear you
Because we were put here to lead... and when not traumatized, or when we recover from the trauma, we generally do lead.
It's evolution.....we were made for the computer age.
thanks for sharing your thoughts. i think asd people can be good leaders
Born leaders..... we are EXACTLY the type of people that can handle power. We don't seek it. Those who seek it shouldn't have it.
I've had quite a few relationships fall apart, because I will not try to control another person.... however, if you try to control me, I will fuck with your head, six ways to Sunday. Doesn't matter how clever you are, I'll sniff out your Motive, and give you 10 versions of the opposite of what you were going for.... just to teach you a lesson..... and if you finally break down, and ask me nicely, I'll get up and do it immediately. It's pavlovian conditioning... and sadly I've needed to use it almost every time I've been with a domestic American woman. That's why I date foreign... they still have manners and etiquette. I've been accused of wanting someone "submissive and weak", but I've actually broken up with women for that. I like REAL strong women.... and Real strong women, take responsibility for their actions and don't feel the need to try to order people around. I laugh at the term "Pathological Demand Avoidance"..... like, way to pathologize demanding the dignity of being asked... not commanded. I really don't care what you do to me, either. You WILL NOT get what you want from me with a demand. I call that "having a strong will"..... it's not misplaced, or narcissistic... I took the Stanford-Binet and scored a 137.... before that, I thought I was stupid, because I would always come to different solutions to problems than everyone else.... turns out Im not dumber than them, but smarter. Didn't know I was Autistic until I was 36. Finding out, allowed me to forgive myself my shortcomings, and now I never beat myself up anymore.
I should also tell you, I have been through 15 years of therapy (on my own volition... was forced as a child), and had a Near Death Experience before my diagnosis.... so it wasn't JUST getting a diagnosis. But I think in a strange way, not having any consideration for my autism as a child, forced me to find ways around everything.... and now Im far more capable than some Autie friends I have, whom received early diagnoses. So there's something to be said for not coddling us, and allowing us to go through what we have to without adding to it.... sadly that last part, I didn't get. My mother made everything I went through worse by panicking.
I think autistic people can be good leaders but usually to be a good leader you need to have good social skills.
@@Catlily5 not exactly, you need to be able to figure out who is good/bad at what, and then organize and properly deligate tasks, to get the most efficient outcome. Those are all things we are naturally good at. The problem comes in where we are traumatized. The social shutdowns are how autistic people display trauma. It shows differently in us. It's also easy to traumatize an autistic child, by simply holding us up to neurotypical standards. However, when we aren't traumatized, and even moreso when we work through a lifetime of trauma, and come out the other end, we're damn near superpowered. I implore anyone on the spectrum, work through ALL of your trauma, before you make ANY irreversable life changes... NOT ONLY TRANSITIONING!!!
If you still feel the same way, once you trust yourself completely (and you'll know because the anxiety will be gone or almost gone), then I support you completely in whatever decisions you make for yourself.... but then and only then, are you TRULY able to consent to anything life altering.
I only even bring that up because it's a current assault against autistic children.
We're born leaders, usually born to families "not meant to lead" by more elite classes. NTs pathologize us...
For example, PDA.... that's pathologizing an ingrained demand for respect. I have this, and if you make demands or try to manipulate me, I'll sniff out your motive and deliver you the opposite.... however, if you simply ask me, respecting my autonomy, I'm more than happy to help, and will jump to do so immediately.
That's just a strong will... pathologjzed.
wow, I really don't see my self that way at all, and I"m a security guard, lol it's more a female thing, makes em' hard to date, I'm sure they're wonderful once you put a ring on it though. great work claire
A lot of girl boss autistic girls out there, and judges and lawyers, cops even, yeah for sure, I've met em'
Fair enough! As I said all autistic people are different. not sure it is a female thing, however, as I have met males like this as well. again, we're all different
R E L A T E.
amen lol
so autism is why im a good administrator?
I don’t know you personally so I can’t say… it’s possible