ULTIMATE Guide for Ship Designs in HOI4 | Navy guide part 2
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- čas přidán 15. 06. 2024
- In this FeedbackIRL video, we dive deep into the world of naval warfare in Hearts of Iron 4, exploring the ideal ship compositions and designs that will give you the edge in battle. Whether you're a seasoned commander or a new player looking to master the seas, this guide covers everything you need to know about building a powerful navy. From the best ship types to essential design tips, we'll help you dominate the oceans and secure victory for your nation. Don't miss out on these game-changing strategies!
• Everything you NEED to... Part 1
TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Intro
00:25 Video explanation
06:23 Ideal compositions & destroyer overview
08:53 destroyer recommendation
08:55 cruiser overview
11:52 cruiser recommendation
11:55 battleship overview
16:13 battleship recommendation
16:15 carrier overview
17:53 carrier reccomendation
18:31 outro
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Timestamps: - Hry
-TIMESTAMPS-
00:00 Intro
00:25 Video explanation
06:23 Ideal compositions & destroyer overview
08:53 destroyer recommendation
08:55 cruiser overview
11:52 cruiser recommendation
11:55 battleship overview
16:13 battleship recommendation
16:15 carrier overview
17:53 carrier reccomendation
18:31 outro
Usually I love Feedback HOI4, but take his navy guides with a pinch of salt. The core philosophy, keep the mission in mind during design, is spot on, but some of the designs here are far from optimal.
For example:
- light DD batteries are a very inefficient source of light attack. On CLs you want to stack light cruiser battery 2s (3 and 4 cost 1 steel each), until you reach 60+ light attack after modifiers. With that, you can sink any DD with one hit.
- Hit chance from fire control and radar is only useful on ships with lots of light or heavy attack.
- On CAs you never want to use armor, because anything that can reach you overmatches cruiser armor.
- If you have 4 carriers stacked with naval bombers (fighters and CAS are rubbish in naval battle) and you make sure not to engage in a storm, you will always win as long as your first and second lines don't crumble. New Zealand can take out an entire USN carrier strike force with 2 1936 CVs, 2-3 1936-1940 CAs, and 5-7 1936-1940 CLs. Often without losing a single ship.
- Admiral levels and veteran crews can make your fleet incredibly OP. Try to farm XP without losing ships at the start of the war, then you can steamroll them later.
- Speed is life: aiming for 30/33/36 knots for capital/CL/DD is a good rule of thumb. Of course, if you start with a big old navy, this might not be an option.
yeah light batteries on DD had me scratching my head. I have no idea whats most optimal but cheap torpedo destroyers seem very strong vs AI
Can't wait to use this in my China run it will be very effective
just did a navy China run today, literally just build light cruisers with full light cruiser batteries alongside destroyers with full torpedoes and you'll shred the Japanese navy
A true HOI4 player would put this to use as Bhutan or Mengukuo
@@adhamzayed911Thanks I will also try this
An important note on carriers is that planes are trained to prioritize them over pretty much everything else, so if there's anywhere you want a lot of AA, it's on carriers
Light cruisers are the current king of all ships, here's why: 1. you can put lots of armour on it (same level as heavy cruisers), if you mass produce light cruisers they are basically unsinkable in a fleet while destroyers can't be put on any armour. 2. you can get insane light attack on it, cruiser light turrets are just far stronger than destroyers. 3. you have enough slots to put on some torpedoes as well, after you obliterate your opponents screening ships you can hunt down their capital ships. 4. Catapults, you can get scout planes on light cruisers, on top of radar you can get higher detecting stats than destroyers.
Basically right now light cruisers are all-around and all-mighty.
In your standard Germany game do you spit out mostly light cruisers from day one? Do you build any destroyers for submarine hunting or mine laying? Do you refit your old destroyers or is it a waste of production?
@@AccountNo-fg8fy 1. build as many light cruisers as possible, other ships are supplementary, you can decide if you want some other functions. Germany has enough steel so you shoud get dockyards early. 2. Germany does not have big needs for sub hunting, if you use destroyers to hunt subs Royal navy's main fleet will join in and obliterate all of your old destroyers. If you want to hunt subs you can use CAS to naval bomb, or naval patrol aircrafts for better range. 3. Old destroyers are good with mass but they are too fragile, you will lose a bunch of them in any battle, you only need to refit them if you want special functions like mine laying
Planes on naval strike missions have their targeting weighted significantly towards carriers, then Capitals, and don’t often target screens in a battlegroup. Each ship has only its own AA, and contributes no AA to any other ship. So your carriers and capitals should absolutely have AA onboard. It’s so cheap in relation to the rest of the hull. 5 AA at a minimum. Screens should only get 1 module of level 1 AA unless they are in the patrol and escort roles.
Ive been playing navy alot lately. Even starting as germany and beating UK. Protip\OP strat: put 8-10 sub fleets in a single water zone on always engage and use strike force or manual micro to engage when you catch enemy fleets. Its mad OP cause they cant even reinforce with larger fleets without getting bogged down in endless sub chasing
Oh i hate sub chasing, endless and wasting fuel
You are wrong about the AA on Capital ships, screens and especially on CVs. HOI4 Wiki is very clear how anti air works in navy:
--> Planes choose which ship to attack by giving them a weight: CVs: x200, Captial Ships x50, Screens x1. The ratio will be adjusted if the ships hp goes to 0 by up to x500. That means, if a screen is low life, the planes will attack it. But at that moment the ship is allready lost.
--> Also if the AA of the ship is smaller than 5, the wight is inscreased by 5*(5-AA). So your carrier design will have an adjusted weight of x200 * 25 and will hence always be selected from the planes.
--> When the planes attack, the AA of the ship being attacked gets into action and defends it AND ONLY OF THAT ONE SHIP, NOT FROM THE FLEET. Hence it makes no sense to increase your fleets overall AA.
So this video has two mistakes in it:
1. AA on Screens for a strikeforce fleet. (If the light ships are going out for hunting and scouting AA might be usefull, depending on the scenario)
2. Having no AA on CVs. This will only increase the dmg your CV will get from planes. They will only ever choose your CV.
And because you did a snug comment at the end, allow me one snug comment as well: Whats stronger, 5000h of playing time or reading 3 paragraphs of the wiki for 5 minutes?
I heard it from different youtubers that the overall AA is always the important stat so I always increased the AA of the whole fleet...the more you know...
A good tip I heared was to put heavy fighters out on every seezone where I could engage with carrieres to get air supremacy
ive heard you can use super heavies loaded with max AA to bait and kill nav bombers, been meaning to try it but never got around to it
That only applies to the reduction of the number of planes attacking the ship in a naval battle. After the number of planes attacking the ship has been determined, then the entire navy's AA comes into play. Although it is still much more efficient to put AA on capitals.
Fleet AA is much better in regards to naval strikes from land, as the targeting is weighted by visability but mostly random. I too feel like Dave rushed through this episode. Light batteries on a cruiser is pretty bad if you want it to kill screens.
@@willywonka6487 I think the tactic is: Light attack is king: You build a fleet of Light cruisers with tons of light attack, and DDs with tons of torps. As tanks you build the BBs with a bit of heavy attack and tons of AA. The light attack cruisers will clear the screens. The DDs will kill with the torps the capital ships and the BBs will soak the heavy dmg and AA dmg and radar?. Heavy attack is not really needed. But this is more a MP strat, since the AI is garbage, you can play almoste every strat possible. Maybe I play this strat tonight in a sp run with germany. Refit the Capital ships with tons of AA and only build light cruisers and DDs.
@@Homerisnude like do you think going mix of light atack cruisers and torp DDs is good? isnt it just better to win screen wars by massing CAs ? and maybe adding few empty DDs as roaches ? (you will probably have bit of HA and TORPS on older ships anyway so + nav bombers if you go for CVs)
10:50 - "What you can do is to go super-super-heavy on the batteries."
Proceeds to add destroyer batteries to the light cruiser *facepalm*
Light cruisers
@@FeedbackIRL Mate... you realize you got two kinds of medium weapons for cruisers, right? One for heavy cruisers and one for light cruisers. You don't need to pick the lightest of the weapons (the dd weapon) for it to be a light cruiser... the "lighter" medium weapon will still make it a light cruiser... It will just have like the double of the light attack than what you suggested
Yes! Teaching how to build ships, not giving us the build. That's the kind of guide I want. Thank you.
this was a very helpful video, thanks!
I always use the latest tech on ships and use every slot. To use the positioning advantage quality beats quantity and it is just an amazing thing to watch my small german navy completely obliterate the grand fleet with no loses. Probably not cost effective but it is fun.
Same here, 同樣的一艘船，只要多200的製造就可以增加大量的能力，我實在不懂花一千的製造多一艘船+一根砲管的理由
Great video. Got the light cruiser right this time. Love the channel. Only thing I was wondering about was why no sonar on the sub-hunting DD's. Looks like you feel radar is a better investment. Good to know. Thanks.
I like the Navy game.I know its completely bypassable in SP and in MP its not required but it can make things easier. But I like Navy
what a legend! found you today man! ty!
great explanation ty!
Yes!!!!!!! Finally thanks Dave
What about having some sonar for convoy escorts?
Feedback forgetting sub 4s exist eith snorkles and you need those amazing depths and sonar 2 to even get them.
Fighters and Nav bombers will get ya very far.
can you do a lp and show a navy focused run, explaining methodologies tech and composition? Basically, a navy only USA or UK or Japan run, where you send all land production to market to get the ic for the navy buildout.
Thank you, master
If you can’t be asked to watch. Just ratio your capital shops to screen 1 to 4 and have max of 5 aircraft carriers in each fleet
Dave you rock
One day I'll learn navy
Spam torpedo destroyers and set a fleet of cruisers loaded with max spotting planes to scout and win. Easiest way to win navy. There are other ways to win, mind you, this is just the lowest effort.
CA's are classed as screens in mios
I think dual purpose is a worthwhile addition (or refit) for capitals as they are the main target of enemy aircraft. That way you kill more enemy screens and aircraft for a reasonable cost. AA on screens is probably not all that worthwhile as they are low priority targets for enemy aircraft. There is an argument for strong AA on spotting ships as they will be isolated.
Cheers Dave. How on earth I never fully grasped the rock paper scissor nature of navy I'll never know, you made it seem so obvious😅
When I design ships I almost always build them inspired by hystory.
But there are some exeptions. For example I often go for faster capital ships and carriers I build often dont have more carying capacity than 60-80 because if you build more of them you will have air stacking penalty
God damn, took a while to make part 2...
Oh well, at least we finally got it. Full tank and air designer guides soon?
ive just spent a week trying out set ups for mass navies with minors having 10 to 15 Capitols and over 100 ships with majors all with over 50 Capitols and 300 ships mios full and fuel fully researched for minors and half for majors
Dave's Navy Academy
Which planes to you put on your carriers? Both fighters and torpedo bombers? Weird thing is that naval bombers with heavy bombs can't port strike.
Please do a Vic 2 navy guide next
Can you explain the difference between main light damage guns and secondary battery light attack damage. If I make two ships with the same amount of light attack, does it matter if the guns are main guns or secondary guns?
>Watches 100 hours of Navy tutorial videos.
>Plays hundreds of hours figuring out how to get the entire USN through a refit so every ship has a MIO, is standardized, and max radar/computer before entering the war
>Does a playthrough without doing a single refit to the starting fleet and crushes the IJN anyways
>Sub3 w/snorkel spam for WC
Whats the deal with cruiser subs? I know a handfull of nations get them through focuses instead of research and im a fan of the historical examples but how are they best used in game?
How important is speed stat i personally try to keep it at 30
I don't really understand the point of capital ships... I mean, if all capital ships do is damage other capital ships, why can't you just not bring your capital ships to a naval battle? What are the enemy battleships going to do, it's not like they damage screens, right? I mean I don't think shore bombardment and damaging carriers (when I'm pretty sure other ships and planes can damage carriers themselves) is worth the massive price that comes with building capital ships.
Is there something I'm missing? Pls tell me.
Edit: Nevermind I just found out capital screens and all types of heavy attack can hit screens.
Ok Question: If I can build screens that can launch torpedoes to attack Capitals/Carriers and I can build screens that can have light batteries to attack screens ... what is preventing a composition strategy of just using screens? Is it not cost effective compared to a more balanced screen/capital approach?
You absolutely can in some strategies, say if you want to spam destroyers or light cruisers. The downside is that you can't damage the opponent's source of dps until you've broken their screens first. If they are using carriers too, then you also need to destroy heavy ships before you can damage the carriers. Whereas they will be attacking your dps ships from the first moment. Basically both are viable strategies but I think this just depends on the current balance which one happens to be better in a specific patch. Of course, they both will still crush the ai!
You shouldn't only build light batteries as they are only meant to kill destroyers. To kill cruisers you will need medium batteries so you can get through the armor, or mimize the effectiveness of armor.
Hey Dave, is there a reason in the light cruiser section for the destroyer light battery you used over the light cruiser battery? I thought the light cruiser battery (the one under medium batteries, not rapid fire guns) had better light attack.
Cheap
@@hyperactive1728yeah it’s “cheaper” but also a lot worse. OP, seems like a mistake. 3800 IU for 11 light attack vs the one he shows later with the light cruiser battery getting more than double the light attack at 25, for only ~25% more IC cost (4800)
@JDothan yep true would probably go for battery's myself
Most cost efficient screens against AI in my exp:
Fast 36-40 DD with cheapest gun, full torpedoes in all free slots, 1 depth charge + fast 36-40 CL with 1 light cruiser gun 1 or 2 and full 2nd batteries in all free slots (cheaper and faster than CL guns), and a scout plane 2 + best fire control and radar, without armor.
**the fast CL with good spot can crush the enemy screens very quick without taking much damage, then the cheap torpedo DDs can take out the capitals efficiently.
Most cost efficent capitals against AI in my exp:
Fast 36-40 CA only, mass produce if you can, with 1 heavy cruiser gun 1 or 2, some 2nd batteries optional, basic armor, keep cost close to the CL, no more than 50% to the CL while keep the speed close to CL as well
36-40 carrier with full decks and best engine, that's it
**CA only to keep the carriers covered, if no carrier is planned, just ignore all capitals
***if you plan to use carriers, no need to add any AA gun in any new designed ships; if no carrier, then add best AA to all new ships
**** navy bomber is the only plane for carriers, with best torpedoes, 4x HMG or more, extra fuel tank, self sealing if posible. It can server as navy bomber + fighter at the same time.
That is a lot of ships. How on earth do you manage to produce that many ships. I only manage to build most of the time 3 SHBB 20 new DD and a few subs that is all I have capacity for and refitting my old navy.
@@AccountNo-fg8fy SHBB is way too expensive and least cost efficient (as it does in history)... I only built them when i already wins the navy battle or I want to role play :)
If you start with a big fleet like US, UK or JP, just refitting them will be good enough, especially for the screens and carriers. keep the engine, main gun and armor while adding/replacing the other slots that fit my previous suggestion according to latest tech, the refitting cost will be very affordable, plus the navy refitting spirit and covering tech will help a lot. you can win the entire navy battle without building any new ships (refitting existing ones plus the ones being built at start are more than enough). all the steel can go to land armors.
If you start with minor fleet or none, then aiming for a quick fleet of 36 DD and CL, a fleet of about 6+ CL and 10-12 DD will be a good start to win against a big fleet from US, UK or JP, remeber to put AA in design as you won't have carrier before you win the navy battle, tried to do navy trainning as much as you can, the ship exp level, admiral level and doctrine also plays a big part.
@@AccountNo-fg8fy btw by saying 36-40, I mean 1936/1940 hull... lol
I just spam destroyers with maximum torpedos and a fleet of scout cruisers. Its braindead and it works really well.
oh a navy video, I should watch it to learn how to be better "falls asleep in the first few seconds" great video tho
Davel guide
I have encounter a real life problem that's the old battleship is too slow compare to carrier, bottleneck the whole fleet speed
submarine spam for the win
nothing on submarines? :(
3:37 Everybody, and Feedback is no exception, keep saying - minimum requirement for 100% screening is 4 screen ships per capital. Yet, hoi4 wiki and tooltip here saying that 3 screen per capital is needed.
3 is all you NEED, but you really want at least 4 because if you only have 3 your screening efficiency will drop below 100% as soon as the first screen dies. With 4, you can afford some screens sunk and maintain 100% screening efficiency.
What happens when the 1 of the 3 screens gets sunk?
@@FeedbackIRL which is completely not the point. The point is - 3 screen is needed for 100%. How you apply this info - may vary. Maybe your screens is so beefy so losing 1 is not that easy. Or maybe you have an option to increase your screening from your admiral (Fleet protector).
@@user-wj8hn2yk8yyou've getting hung up on such a minor detail buddy. You've not helping the discussion
Hahaha 🎃hahahahahaha ‼️