Charge Your RV WITHOUT Solar or a Generator // Alternator Charging // Off-Grid Power
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 27. 08. 2024
- How To Get Power in your RV without SOLAR! Charge from your alternator!
We discuss the steps needed to set up and install an alternator charging system (DC-DC Charger) in your RV. We have dual alternators and installed dual Renogy DC-DC Alternator Chargers in our NuCamp Cirrus Truck Camper. We share the process we went through and how it works. This system allows us to charge our 600AH Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) Battery Bank at 40-80 amps while the truck is running. Since we drive a lot while we travel, this is now our main source of power.
At this point, we will probably get rid of our generator and add a few solar panels for the few times that we stay still for more than a few days at a time.
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These are most of the items that we mentioned in the video. If we missed something, please let us know in the comments!
â Renogy 40A DC to DC Battery Charger: amzn.to/2Xq8SDg
â Renogy DCC50S 12V 50A DC Battery Charger with MPPT: amzn.to/2MQaPa7
â Spartan Battery Cable Set: amzn.to/2UHfsUu
â TEMCo Hammer Lug Crimper: amzn.to/2IXixh1
â 4 Gauge Pure Copper Cable Wire: amzn.to/32YZfyn
â 10pcs 4 Gauge 3/8 Pure Copper UL Listed Cable Lug: amzn.to/2UJQunp
â Young Marine Circuit Breaker: amzn.to/3nM8Y3j
â Tinned Pure Copper UL Listed Cable Lug: amzn.to/39099Up
â Marinco 12VCPS3 70A Trolling Motor Plug/Receptacle- amzn.to/3nIjqc8
â Southwire 750F Infrared Thermometer Temperature Range -4F to 752F : amzn.to/3kOvnep
â Southwire Clamp Meter 400A AC/DC: amzn.to/3kKWua1
â 4 Stud Power Distribution Block BUSBAR With Cover: amzn.to/3k51as1
â 4 Gauge Ferrules (I needed to cut the red plastic off to make them fit):
amzn.to/384aesq
And if you have any other questions, please leave a comment and we will be sure to respond!
As always, thank you for watching!
đ See how we used to use our generator
âą Inverter Installation ...
đ We also made a video about our 5 Boondocking Essentials. Check it out if you haven't seen it yet!
âą 5 Boondocking Essentia...
We are a travel couple and explore full time in our NuCamp Cirrus 920 Truck Camper. The camper rides in our Ram 3500 Dually Diesel CrewCab truck. We love our camper and we are excited to share our life with all of you!
Our plan is to continue traveling for another 5 years at least, we are just getting started. Subscribe and follow our adventures around North America and the World!
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#fulltimetravel #drycamping #nucampcirrus #truckcamperlife #truckcamper #travelcouple #boondocking #truckcamperliving #boondockingtips #alternator #alternitiveenergy #offgrid #drycamping #generator #LiFePO4 #Lithium
Water near the electrical equipment!!!
I wanted to explain the water pump situation. This project had a hard time limit and I had to make compromises. Since this video, I fixed the issue with having the water pump in the same compartment. I havenât made an update video yet. I have made some other changes that Iâll cover in the future.
It wasnât ideal, but there was no other place to move the pump. If for some reason the pump were to let go, the electronics are now protected. Iâll explain in a future video. Thanks for all the comments!!!
Also, I forgot to fully explain why I installed dual chargers!
Due to cable size requirements and amperage limitations on exterior plugs, I could only find parts to wire up a 40 amp charger. I need more than power than a single charger can provide, so running them in parallel gives me more amperage without having to go to 0 or 00 gauge cable. Another âfeatureâ is that I can charge at either 40 or 80 amps and it provides redundancy in the event one fails (power is pretty critical for us). I only run both chargers if I need to charge quickly. If Iâll be driving for many hours, I can just leave one running and reduce the load and heat generated by the alternators and in the chargers in the battery compartment.
Makes sense, thats a great set up, can yout batts handle that amount of current showed down its throat ? how hot do they get at 80 amps ?
I don't believe it would have occurred to me to use 2 chargers. Good idea. Good video. BTW, I have that same truck. Good luck guys!
I found that you can have as many chargers as you want, as long as they are setup correctly. I might add a 3rd in the future. What do you think of your truck? We have had some small issues, like door gaskets and our power steering system is failing.
@@Stonyboot I've had some trouble with mine. It's a 2015 so got it when RAM/Cummins were still trying to figure out the exhaust system so had exhaust worked on after "check engine" light. Warranty job so... It did leave us on the side of the road twice. Water pump once and transmission cooler line ruptured the other time. You get time, check out those metal lines going to your cooler. Another guy I know had same thing happen to him. They rub on something. I still haven't figured out where. Should have asked when mine was worked on but we were a couple hundred miles from home and in a rush to get going again. Both breakdowns were pulling travel trailer which made them really fun. I have the 68RFE transmission and it had to be rebuilt at about 95k so spent a few days in shop for another warranty job. That's been over 2 years ago now and since then all good so hopefully all bugs worked out now. My wife still says it has to go.
Thatâs disappointing to hear. Iâll check the lines and keep an eye on them. I have the same transmission which I have read both good and bad things about. Iâm hoping I got a good one! Thanks for the info!
It reminds me of the, "One thing doesn't belong here"... I know you know,... and realize you are limited in your utility space... I am referring to the water lines and water pump in the same space as all that electronics... :)
100% agree. The real story was that moving the pump wasn't part of the plan. It was originally separated from the electrical side. I had a hard time limit on the project and I had to just get it done. I have since fixed the problem and will have an update video out in the future.
That was my first thought as well. Having had a number of RV's over many years, the water pump was the most common relacement tiem, and it will always result in some leakage.
I use foam as a temporary measure, and then rebuilt the system. I just never made a video.
Sometimes ya just run out of time for making a video.
Thanks for the video, I am about to undertake the installation of my own DC-DC charger and found it very helpful. Your a brave man to have your water pump mounted over your inverter and other electronics, that would be keeping me awake at night!
Good luck with your install! That water/electricity mixture was temporary and has been remedied. Iâll have an update code coming soon, I just got side tracked with other projects. The new video will cover where I moved the inverters and chargers to and my new 1200 AH battery bank. Itâs pretty cool stuff đ, now I just need the time to make a video of it!
awesome, AWESOME !!! You did this so perfectly - I love that you showed temperature, Voltages and Currents, in and out, graphs, charts, WOW, you really did your homework, massive THANK YOU !!!
Iâm glad you enjoyed the details! Thanks for watching đ
Scott, donât replace the copper lugs, just spray some Fluid Film on them and donât worry about corrosion. $15 at Loweâs.
Thatâs a great idea! I was thinking about liquid electrical tape, but Fluid Film is pretty useful too đ
Another great video by a new watcher/subscriber. As an EE, it's rare I see a video like this with no technical errors and a lot of good information. Great job with both content and editing guys
Thank you very much!
I found this fascinating. My dad & I used to tour Europe in a motor caravan back in the 80's. Keeping the 2nd 12v batteries charged was the bane of our holidays. We would have loved a set up like this.
Agreed, I had the same problem with our old trailer. This setup is overkill for most people, but since we need the constant supply of power for our tech, its been working great!
Are you located in Europe?
Thanks for watching!
@@Stonyboot Yeah. Merry old lockdowned Reading in England. :(
Here in Australia we go alternator first for charge usually throughout dcdc charger with the ability to run solar through it as well what I use is a enerdrive dcdc with green power
I think DCDC first is a great strategy! You're already running the truck, you might as well tap into that power source. I'll be adding some additional solar to supplement our power when we are stationary for more than a few days!
Thanks for the comment! Where in Australia are you from? We want to take a long trip there soon!
@@Stonyboot Iâm in Queensland if you look up my other channel Veterans Adventures Australia I have a few clips of some of my trips around Queensland,very basic videos of some of the places we go but itâs a start
I'll check it out. Australia was my original dream destination when I was about 8 years old. I'll get there someday, but I want to have plenty of time, not just a 2 week trip.
Iâm a little too terrified of mounting water over electronics myself. One of the more comprehensive install explanations. Overall worth the time. Thanks!
I was thinking that too, at least PEX is pretty reliable. I would have also considered adding some kind of circulation fan where the chargers/batteries are
The one thing Iâve learned over the years is, itâs not a matter of if a RV water pump leaks but when. So much so that I built a catch pan under it with a cheap 9v battery powered moisture alarm. The proximity of all that $$$$ electrical makes me uneasy. Also all that heat generating equipment in such a confined space may be a concern, perhaps more so further south in warmer climates. Iâd be considering some ventilation, perhaps a thermostatically controlled fan into the interior. Two small louvered openings(one with a small fan) at opposite end of your battery/electric compartments. Keeping the vents small will help keep the fan noises contained. Other than that you have caught all the electrical nuances for your lithium system.
Excellent points! I never mentioned it in the video, but that was a temporary solution due to time constraints and a lack of parts. That water/electric issue has been solved, I just haven't made an update video yet.
I was also concerned with the heat generation issue, but after many hours of testing, it stays quite cool in there. For reasons that would be hard to explain in a comment, that compartment is large and well ventilated. I have made some changes and will be doing an update video in the future and I'll be sure to explain how the air flow works.
One aspect I haven't been able to test is when the weather hits 90-100f. In that case, I might use a small fan to supplement air flow. I have a couple other projects to finish and then I'll get back to work on the charging system. Stay tuned :)
Thanks for convincing me that this is more complicated than I want to ever tackle!
Really enjoyed the thoroughness and detail of this video..
I just installed a dc-dc charger in my truck camper (before seeing this video) and to avoid the 3 prong connector, I used a Anderson connector and I ran the ignition sensing wire to my tail light wire (night lights) on the truck camper. So if I want the dc-dc turned on, I just turn on the truck lights and it sends the power to the ignition wire and turns on the connector. That way I can turn it off if I am stuck in traffic or idling for a long period.
Thank you!
I considered doing the same thing with the tail lights, however, I didn't like the fact that I couldn't control each charger independently and that I wouldn't be able to turn them off at night.
Later, I found out about wireless 12v switches that would have been perfect, but it's built and working well, I might as well stick with it :)
Thanks for the comment!
Well done! We are doing similar (having done actually) with our camper van. You describe some of the details better than any other videos I have seen.
Thanks. I have an update video coming soon with some changes I made and to share how itâs been working.
Wow, Scott -- You're a frk'n genius.
I've long thought that I could use the alternator of a motor to power up electrical systems in my day-dreaming of living on the road, but I had no idea of how to do that, but now, thanks to you, Scott, I have a clear pathway of creating that!
But, first, I gotta buy a truck and a camper shell before setting up anything -- no cart before a horse, right? *grin*
It won't be until early in 2022 before I could start to make my moves in the direction of RV-ing.
Itâs been working really well. At some point Iâll make another video about my power system.
I'm a retired RV Tech and what you are doing makes me want to cry.
Thanks for the feedback, but would care to elaborate? If itâs in regards to the proximity to the water system, that was resolved, I just havenât made an update video yet. What else is making you cry?
That's what I'm talking about!!!! Thanks for actually helping...great idea.
Thanks for watching. I'm glad it was helpful. Not perfect, but it works great. I did fix the issue with the water pump being so close to the electronics. That will be in a future video.
Subscribed to learn where you moved it!
Thanks, I'll get a video out as soon as I can!
Hi just watch your video I have 2014 Roadtrek Agile and added Added 600 amps lithium new Houghtong air conditioning, 3000 Victron inverter, 3 Victron dc to dc 30 amps each total 90 amps engine running , 300 amps solar we sleep two nites with the a/c on all nite long after two days we still have above 27% plus two refrigerator. Extremely happy with the outcome. My alternator 250 amps.
That sounds like an awesome setup! What do you think about the temperatures of the Victron Orion chargers? They get very hot!
@@Stonyboot No
Your technical expertise and initiative are amazing. And you explain it so well. Happy traveling. I will follow you.
Thank you and thanks for watching!
Luckily, with a 34 foot Class A, I don't have the space limitations you have... so I went an even bigger triple supply route. I usually stay the limit when boondocking, so there's 2385 watts (9x265 wired three sets of three in series) of solar on the roof and no AC units to get in the way of the layout (went with mini-split heat pumps, 12,000 BTU in the front and 9,000 in the bedroom. Both running full blast use 70% of just one RV type AC unit!). In addition, there is a 3100 watt Champion inverter generator that, if needed, can supply the power to run the motorhome while still providing some charging to the batteries (I gutted an old roll around 60 amp battery charger). I also installed an additional 135 amp alternator dedicated to charging the house batteries while driving, even though I usually limit myself to 150 miles or less a day. With warm-up and miles and cool down the engine is still running around 4-5 hours. Why waste it, right?! I wish I could downsize, since it's only me, but my requirements prohibit that. I HAVE to have a bathtub (with 110 degree water) to soak the pain away every night to be able to sleep, and in the morning to be able to hike . There are two additional 38 gal water tanks in the pass-thru of the basement. Through several electric solenoid valves, and an additional water pump and heater to keep the soak system totally separate, I draw water from one tank, and drain into the other tank. Then through more solenoid valves, I pump the water back into the supply tank for the next time. I don't wash, just soak, when using the system... so a cap full of bleach keeps the water fresh for 2 - 2 1/2 weeks. Hey... we do what we have to if we want to be out there enjoying ourselves, right???
THAT is an awesome setup! Where are you located, I would love to check it out someday!
Space is our biggest limitation, we can get about 600 watts of solar on the roof, which we will do in the future, but that wasn't enough to keep up with our needs, especially if we got a cloudy day or a shady camp spot. Running our computers and electronics is our lifeline. Redundant power is essential for us.
Sounds like you have a great setup. Do you have any pictures or videos you can share with us on Facebook or email?
@@Stonyboot The panels I have are commercial units (a lot beefier construction) bought used, so they are as browned over as they will get. If you can, try to get the same size and manufacture when you buy your panels. It's much easier to wire them to your advantage. Mine are mounted three on each side up front long ways with 14" between them for cleaning, and three behind the bathroom skylight sideways over the bedroom. Wired three sets of three in series really helps, since they are fixed mount. Less than a half hour after sunup the charge controllers are already switching on, and I get up to 120 volts from each set mid-day. Gotta love those MPPT controllers! I actually built an aluminum catwalk between the panels up front after I realized they were shading the roof and cutting down on heat gain from the sun!!!
I'm stuck down in Florida for the time. Had lung cancer surgery at the VA, half the right side, but they couldn't get it all (too close to the throat). Went through 6 1/2 weeks of daily radiation treatments. I'm halfway through a four dose one every three weeks chemo treatment now. Once that's over with... got a little work to do on the old girl. She ate the cam (chevy 454's are known for that). Installing a RV roller cam and roller rockers for more power and less wear. Then a low rise aluminum intake and Holley fuel injection. Redoing the exhaust, too. Headers and dual 3" exhaust with straight through semi mufflers. That will probably take me through the end of summer. Just in time to head across the bottom on I-10 and get out west again. I subscribed to your channel, so maybe we can hook up in the fall!!!
I don't do much with pictures and videos of my equipment... like to leave no footprints. But, I might video the engine work... who knows.
@@Stonyboot Just thought... If you get smaller panels, cover the roof. Then, you might make a rack that could hold more panels that would be attached to the side of the camper while traveling, but could free stand on the ground once you're stopped. You could almost double the amount of panels!!!
Scott, that blew my mind. Way to go.
Thanks for watching, I'm glad you liked it. Not perfect, but its been keeping the power flowing for a few months now!
Thanks guys , your video helps me a lot on my 3500 long bed Promaster van conversion project I'm working on now, it is my first try and I learn as I go.
I'm glad to hear it was helpful. We made another video with some updates to the project called "Breakers vs. Fuses", It might shed some additional light on the problems I ran into after this video was released.
Youâre a brave soul to put a water pump near an inverter!
Nice upgrades regardless!
Amorphous solar and Polycrystalline solar, are options for low light regions no like Alaska or wooded areas!
That was a temporary solution. I was short on time, patience, materials and tools. The pump situation has been solved, I just haven't gotten around to making an update video. I'll get it done soon!
Thanks for the tips on the solar. Upgrading solar is on the agenda for when we are stationary for more than 3-4 days. Mono/poly/amorphous all have tradeoffs. I haven't finished researching and deciding the final design, Poly might be the winner though. I'll get a video out when that project gets underway.
thanks for the details and thorough explanations! I really appreciated the way you walked through it all. I'm happy to say, I have done a similar build using my Tacoma and a GoFast Camper. I have an AGM battery as the house with a RedARC DC-TO-DC charger and I ran the heavy copper wire to the the bed. It works really well and I did not have issues with the alternator. I have been using this for a while and now I also supplemented with a 700 watt Bluetti Solar power station that uses a a mix of solar, AC and DC to recharge. If I had to do it all over again, I would probably get the lager 2000 or 3000 watt Bluetti - it's just so much simpler - especially since I have heavy gauge copper running to the back to make it easier to charge. Thanks again for the video!
Thanks for watching and it sounds like you have a great setup!
This was your answer to being able to go up to 440 amps continuous and not needing to use a 70 amp plug. Im using these thru the inside of the bed of my 01 Dodge ram. There are tons of options without having to use two chargers.
Dual chargers was a design decision. It allows some flexibility that a single larger unit does not. It lets me run at either 40 or 80 amps of current and it provides redundancy in case of a failure. After researching 60-120 amp chargers, I decided to go with 2 smaller chargers with the option for a 3rd in the future if we need it. Our alternator has a theoretical max of 440amps of output, but they would burn up really fast. At max load, we only pull about 1/4 of the max and that is well within the safe limits for continuous operation. Many thousands of miles of charging with no problems yet. I am going to swap out the breakers for fuses now that the weather is warming up. They tend to trip when the sun gets hot.
Great video!, You both do an excellent job commentating, and I also enjoyed the bloopers. I'm getting ready to start my road trip and will likely use a lot of the knowledge in this video for my setup.
Thanks for watching and good luck!
I used 6 ga pure cooper and not going to a bigger cable to keep charger from pulling to much and so far it has been great .
This is pure gold!
Thanks!
Thanks a lot, Scott and Sasha for making this excellent video. You really explained and demonstrated exactly how to do this. If you ever get time adding Amazon links would benefit us and you. Your clear tips should enable us to duplicate what you did if adding links is a hassle.
Thank you. There are links to everything in the description. If there is something missing, just let me know and Iâll update it!
Pretty impressive setup! The only issue is long term idling is one of the worst things you can do with the Diesel engine.
Thanks fir watching. Thatâs a great point, and to clarify, we never idle it to charge. Itâs only while driving. The most idling we do is while driving in traffic. The hour idle test that I mentioned in the video was simply for testing heat buildup while not moving. Luckily, the alternators never got too hot!
Renogy makes a 50 amp DC -DC single unit charge controller which has hook ups for Solar Panels, Alternator and Lithium Battery bank.. Approx $300.00 however this unit allows the Solar panels to also charge you vehicles battery also...
Check it out...
I did look at their DCC50S. I ruled it out due to a lack of Bluetooth connectivity and the 25 volt solar limit. I want to keep my DC-DC Charging system separate from my Solar setup. However, I think its a great idea, I just didn't fit my specific needs.
Are you using it? What do you think?
Thank you for all of the information. Especially for the bus bar at the battery, I have been looking for a multiple connection battery terminal and haven't really liked anything I've seen. I don't know why, but I hadn't thought to just move the connections to a bus bar. Great idea!
Exactly the video I've been needing! Thank you so much for taking the effort and sharing all those details. 2014 Livin Lite 6.8 truck camper
Agree with the waterpump omission from the overloaded electrical compartment being a very wise choice !!!
The rest of the system is in my experiences , a endless headache .....
Though, the best of luck and happy trails ......
Cheers
I failed to explain that in the video. That was a temporary solution due to lack of time and parts. I have since solved water pump/electrical proximity issue and will make an update video in the future. Too many projects, not enough time.
What do you mean by "the rest of the system"? Headaches abound, but I'm just not sure what your referring too.
Thanks for watching :)
Great video.
Just FYI:
Silicone dielectric tune up grease is your best friend when it comes to all of your electrical connections even the battery lugs.
Also if you ever plan on making more of these vehicle wiring videos , buy yourself one of those hydraulic terminal crimping tool sets rated like 12 tons.
They typically cover crimp terminal from 10 gauge to 0000 , 4/0 or 4 ought some larger.
You'll thank yourself.
I do use that on exterior and frequently used connections, but prefer to keep fixed interior connections dry.
Thatâs funny I have the same trolling motor plug and works great and I like how you used the extra post for your signal wire and I have a flush mounted switch that lights up when charger is on. I did this to let my truck charge up and then flip switch to tur charger on or off .
Hello from Australia - enjoyed your tube - cheers ! Crow
Thank you! đŠđș
One of the best up grades I did was to change my fuel tank out for a 60 gallon tank and I needed it bad and after I got in in and a few months latter I realized how much better it is with all that extra fuel and it just drops right in only drawback was the price of the tank .
LOL the bloopers almost make it worth subscribing, great video and description, thanks ;)
We don't always have good bloopers to include, but sometimes we just can't get it right! Thanks for watching!
I'm full time in my 86 Toyota Dolphin. 500 watts of solar, 280ah lithium with another 280 on the way. Works well for me. But I am concerned I'll have to run the generator (which I've only done twice in emergencies) as I had North again. I might look into dc-dc charging if solar isn't cutting it. Good work!
Oh wow! I love those Toyota Dolphins, I have always wanted one. Do you have any pic of it online?
@@Stonyboot shoot, no. I did some raw video of my solar installation, thinking people could benefit from it, but its not any fun to watch. I've really tricked it out to have so many things to make it awesome for boon docking. Everything is keyless (except the ignition) - so nice going hiking/riding/spearfishing without keys. The solar, lithium, inverter, so nice. Skylights, usb plugs all over, led lights, fans, filtered water...endless upgrades perfect for me and my 25yr old son. I even detailed the engine so it is really clean. It's fun.
Can you send me some pictures? I gotta see this rig! Where are you located, approximately? info@stonyboot.com
Great job guys
Information will help me for future projects
Thank you so much! We're glad it was helpful!
You need some cordless Dewalt tools I sold tools for 35 yrs the last 20 up to 2015 it was Mac Tools and Dewalt was in our line. I love tools and cordless is the best. You are very good with your explanations and when I get my Cirus I'm going to incorporate your system.
I have a full set of cordless tools, I just couldn't fit them in very well. Tough space to work in.
I actually saw these guys today at Nevada Hoover dam it was sooooooo cool
The Hoover Dam is super cool for sure! We were hoping to go on a tour, but it was closed. May be next year!
Are you an electrician? I would have to hire an electrician because this went right over my head. Also... Have you considered driving to NuCamp and showing them your set up? If Cirrus could duplicate what you did, it would really give them an advantage over other camper manufactures. They would have to build the breaker/fuse board you have over your truck batteries so people like me would just have to mount it and then connect the board terminals to the battery terminals along with zip-tying the wires under the truck to the camper. You obviously put a lot of thought, sweat & tears into this project. Too bad truck camper manufacturers haven't done the same.
I'm not an electrician, but I do have plenty of experience tinkering. I'm sure that the RV manufactures, NuCamp included, have excellent engineers that could build systems like these. However, I think the business model doesn't support it. They are trying to build campers to fit the middle of their customer base. Now that there is such a demand for electronics and power in RVs, I do see a move towards better electrical systems. But there will always. be a side market for upgrades and modifications. Upgrades like this would add a great deal of cost to the camper, but it would be nice if you could order it as an option. I love out new office renovation and would have paid to have someone build it.
I fall into the same category. In fact, I think I'll just be able to do the zip tying part! Lol. Yes, it would be great if Nucamp or others had this kind of well thought out setup. I'm in the market for a camper and this sounds neat.
I know that companies like NuCamp would love to hear from people like you with these requests. They use this information to make decisions on future products and offerings. Iâll mention this to NuCamp the next time I talk to someone there. Thanks for watching and leaving an informative comment!
@@Stonyboot I have left suggestions with both NuCamp/Cirrus, and with Northern Lite. Hopefully they'll listen, consider, and implement these ideas.
@@renaissancepoet Excellent work! I would love to hear what they have to say if they respond to you đ
Great info.. I bought thos same cables.
Thanks for watching! I'm very happy with the cables, I'd like to make my own, but have limited space and storage. So, I just buy what I need for each project.
Very nice setup! Great video. You're a genius in my books!! Hope it all works well for ya!
Thank you đ itâs been working really well. I might add a 3rd charger in the future to speed up the charging process. But all in all, itâs awesome!
THANKS FOR THE IMPROVING OF POWER SOLUTIONS ON YOUR TRUCK CAMPER
PAUL IN Ottawa Ontario CANADA.....WE IS THE BORDER....HAHA
Thank you for watchign!
Great video! Iâm interested in doing this in my Northstar TC and 2017 Ram 3500 with dual 220 alternators. Please keep us updated on how itâs working and any additional info you can provide would be helpful! Well done đ!
Thanks for watching! I do have some changes to make and I'll put out an update when I get things squared away.
Stubby screwdrivers or a ratchet and a bit holder work wonders in tight spots. Also useful are wobble extensions and universal joint adapters, use em with an impact driver !
I have those tools, well, the stubby screwdriver has gone missing. My trouble was the location, no space to get tools in there.
@@Stonyboot I tend to construct things that way, makes your stuff harder to steal
Hehe, thatâs true. My issue is that itâs not worth the 10 minutes to unpack my tools for a 5 minute fix. When Iâm planning a project, Iâll pull everything out, but sometimes itâs raining, muddy or freezing cold, we really puts a damper on things. After that project, I move my extension and wobble bit to my normal tool bag.
I like your dual DC to DC charging solution! Thumbs up and sub. Stumbled across your channel and can't stop watching your videos.
Thanks for watching and commenting! Let us know if you have any ideas for future topics đ
We love this! You both rock!
Thanks for following along, we like our home on wheels!
I am very satisfied with my own setup. I have 6 T-105 Trojan 6 volt batteries. With my Honda EU2000, I can burn 1 gallon of gas for 9 hours, and sit for two days if I do not use the desktop pc and 32 inch tv. I have a 100 amp smart charger that will recharge fairly quickly as well. I can run my aft AC unit and the charger, if the batteries are not down too far. 30 minutes will bring them up high enough to start the AC, or I can switch to the smaller 50 amp charger. Being as how I am boondocking in the northwest, my gas and propane is just over $400 per month. I paid 12k for my class A, 12 years ago. That is about $45 per month for rent. I could throw it away, and still be tens of thousands ahead in money saved from house payments or rent.
Thanks!
I was kinda worried about you until you used your Leatherman to make it happen and then I knew you would be fine. !:- )
99% of life can be solved and fixed with a Leatherman!
Your awesome †so full of knowledge and understanding †so fun and kind †very inspirational, thank yous â€
Great, detailed video, thanks from a nerd whoâs always looking for more information đ. Especially useful was the comparison between connectors, was thinking Iâd need Anderson connectors which handle the amps, but was worried about fishing that wire size. đđ»
Thanks for watching. The setup isnât perfect, but itâs been servings itâs purpose for the last 1.5 years.
Good info brother thank you
Thanks for watching!
Somehow having a water pump in the same place as electrical seems a bad idea.
Exactly. water and electricity don't mix well.
100% agree. The real story was that moving the pump wasn't part of the plan. It was originally separated from the electrical side. This was a temporary work around. I had a hard time limit on the project and I had to just get it done. We live full time, so having our water and electrical system down wasn't an option. I have since fixed the problem and will have an update video out in the future.
100% agree. The real story was that moving the pump wasn't part of the plan. It was originally separated from the electrical side. This was a temporary work around. I had a hard time limit on the project and I had to just get it done. We live full time, so having our water and electrical system down wasn't an option. I have since fixed the problem and will have an update video out in the future.
@@Stonyboot don't leave it too long or forget about it all so to prevent extensive water damage you can get battery powered water alarms just wrap some cloth around joints etc and pop 1 in this won't stop leaks but will alert you to them hopefully before any damage is done
The problem was solved, I just never made an update video. I'll get around to making a video in the near future.
Great video on DC system charging, itâs very much appreciated! Thank you and God Bless you!
You're very welcome! Glad it was helpful!
This is just a FYI, for anyone wanting to get a generator that runs off propane, performance wise, you will get 20% less power capacity opposed to gas, run time is roughly 2 to 4 hours less than gas. It may burn cleaner but the performance is terrible. I have a 4000 Watt for the camper and a 7500 Watt for the house, I get roughly 3 to 5 hours less running off propane than I do on a full tank of gas.
Again, just a FYI.
Wow! Incredibly well done video. Love how you explain things. Maybe slow down just a little bit. Thank you!
Thank you for watching. I love feed back and I'll keep that in mind. We haven't yet found the right pace for things, trying to find balance between too fast and too slow is rather challenging :)
I think you can adjust YT playback speed. Hit the three vertical dots for the drop down menu.
To store portable solar panels would be between the cab area and camper.
That would be a great spot!
Look forward to the battery build video. I too plan to build my own using 280ah LiFePO4 raw cells and 200 amp BMS. Probably put 2 in parallel for 540ah and 400 amps (only need 250 amps max for my 3000w inverter, but donât want to drive the BMSs to hard). There is a serious lack of quality BMS with temp sensors.
Which BMS are you going to use? I'll have a video out about that in the future, still in development.
@@Stonyboot That is what I was hoping to hear from you. Overkill Solar makes a great BMS with low temperature cut off but only 120 amps. A DALY one would probably be ok if batteries are in heated compartment that will ensure they donât get below 32 degrees while charging.
If I go with DALY, probably the 200 amp model. Eventually (2) 280 ah batteries in parallel for 560 ah and up to 400 amps (but wouldnât need more than 240 amps to drive a 3000 watt inverter). The oversized inverter would run cooler.
I'm running a JBD that's also good for 120 amps. I only need to run a 2k inverter and never get close the 240 amp max. My biggest need is run time for the computers, so big battery with a medium BMS. If I wanted to max things out, I could simply install a contractor/relay, but they complicated things and reduce reliability. Finding a good BMS with low temp protection has proven hard, especially anything over 200 amps and with Bluetooth management. DALY has some great options, but I really love the JBD.
Very informative.
I'm glad to hear that! Thank you đ
This is very helpful. Thanks for doing all the figuring for us lol
We bought the new 920 and put it on an F350 dually, also new.
There may be times when having the 930 watts of solar may not be enough, like when we are in the northwest, so this will help us a great deal.
Our truck comes with a 250 amp alternator, so I may go with the 60 amp charger. I'm thinking that I may also have the ability to wire it into the upfitter switches.
Fun stuff, but still requires some planning. Your video will help a lot.
I hope you get something from the affiliate links.
Thank you guys
Thanks for watching!
Love the rig, the only thing missing is a passthrough hatch for when I bigfoot territory
I wanted the same thing, but I just couldnât find the perfect setup. In the last 1.5 years, we have never needed it, but it would be a nice feature.
Great video. Convinced me to pass on the project.
While I do love the power, the project was a little difficult, mostly due to lack of space.
Another thing that's amazing to me is the fact that nearly everything is 12v. TV, laptops etc. Take out the transformer that takes the 110 down to 12v and no need for an inverter. I don't see why people don't do this.
Correct , but , most flat panel TV's have an internal power supply.
I personally took at the ones that have a power pack in the cords for this exact reason.
I installed many more 12VDC accessory outlets throughout my camper for plugging the low voltage stuff into where I need them.
Except for the AC units , microwave and water heater , everything else runs off the 3 coach batteries.
I was so close to moving everything to 12v. However, I hit a wall with some of the adapters I needed. It also meant that for each new item that I would want to use, like an electric razor, hair clippers, hair dryer, microwave, a 19v laptop, my 120volt internal power supply RAID array, and the A/C I would have to find and order a special adapter. The ease of sticking with the existing standard was much simpler and more future proof. I also have 120 volt power tools that I need to run from time to time, so regardless of my small electronics setup, I need at least 2000 watts of 120 volt power. Am I overlooking some simple solution? I would love to have a new project to figure out! Suggestions?
Our TV, small electronics and the like, all run off of 12v. But, the AC, Microwave, and some power tools need 120v. So the inverter solves that. In a pinch, I can even run an electric heater and our hot water from the batteries.
How do you keep your batteries charged?
Thank you! This is exactly what I want to do and I have not found enough example.... As we have a trailer, I am thinking about putting a connection at the front of the vehicle too that I way I can have more options to connecting the charging system.
I'd love to know what you come up with! I do have some updates about this project and I hope to make a video about it soon.
How the the charging effect your gas mileage?
Would the current decrease automatically when the batteries are charged?
What is the size of your dc to ac pure sine wave converter to your appliances?
Great video, thanks.
Great questions!
I have not seen a noticible impact in my MPG, It obviously uses more fuel, but I don't have an accurate way to measure it. I don't charge all the time, so it averages out to less than 1 mpg, much less from what I can tell.
Two things happen. First, Lithium likes a constant current, constant voltage charge profile. As the internal resistance increases, amperage decreases, but only at the last 5-10% of capacity. Second thing is handled by the BMS. In my case, I have the BMS set to disconnect charging at a cell voltage of 3.55v instead of the maximum 3.65v. This gives me a buffer on the fully charge side which helps prolong cell life. Once any cell reaches 3.55v the BMS will disconnect the charger. That means the battery pack will charge to around 14.2v and then disconnects. It will quickly settle down to about 13.5-13.6.
On the other end, I have about a 5-10% buffer on the discharge side to also help prolong cell life. A good BMS really helps protect the battery from over-voltage, under-voltage, over-current, high and low temperatures and insures that nothing goes wrong.
I have a 2000 watt primary inverter/charger to run our appliances and big items. I also have a dedicated 1000w inveter that just runs our computer/electronics, that smaller inverter only handles 200-300 watts with our computers, so the cooling fan never even kicks in :)
Let me know if you have any other questions!
You do your homework that's for sure
Thanks, I try to be thorough, yet always miss something :)
Listening to all the problems trying to fit batteries and cabling into a small area had me thinking maybe I'll just put my batteries in the back seat floorboards. I will be traveling solo and this makes a lot of sense to me
That could work, just keep and eye on cable length and size. Space is always at a premium!
@@Stonyboot I make cables, wire harnesses and power boxes for NASA, I've got that part đ
Oh cool! That sounds like an interesting job!
Now that's a awesome job, like it.
Thanks for watching! It was a long project, but it has been working really well!
I know one thing I would get that water pump out of there .It springs a leak and you can kiss all that electrical good bye.Just coming from someone with a sailboat , I have seen it happen to others
I agree. That was a temporary setup. That was fixed long ago, I just havenât made an update video yet.
Excellent video and installation!!
Iâm happy that you liked it, thank you for taking the time to watch đ
Why not put a small wind turbine on top or even 2 . You'll get great wind while driving and even a bit while parked sometimes. Your alternator only works while driving.
I did look into them briefly. They would be a delicate item on the rig that would get damaged by trees, branches and other stuff that scrapes along and on top of our camper on a regular basis and didn't want something that I have to setup and take down. If we were stationary, that would be a REALLY cool option! Someday :)
I was looking forward to this video and I have a few questions.
The output of your DC-DC chargers are tied directly to the batteries. You also have your solar charger tied to the batteries. I assume you only have the DC-DC charger and not the DC-DC Solar controller/Charger. Did you think about removing your Solar Controller and using a combined DC-DC Solar Controller/Charger? If you were doing this from scratch, would you choose a separate Solar Controller and DC-DC charger or would you try and use a single unit? This assumes that the single unit could provide you with the amount of power for solar panels and DC-DC charging.
Why did you install 2 DC-DC units? I understand if your 600AH batteries need a full charge (assuming you are at 20% Capacity) it would take 12 hours of driving for a full charge at 40Amps and 6 hours at 80 Amps. However, are you actually depleting the batteries every day to need 2 DC-DC chargers? Based on your current experience with your setup could you do this with one DC-DC charger with your current battery setup? One battery means drilling one hole in the camper!
More power is better and 600Ah batteries is SERIOUS! With only the Solar panels (assuming you are parked in an area to get solar), how many days can you last before you need to turn on the vehicle using the DC-DC charger? Without Solar panels (cloudy/rain/ surrounded by trees) how long can you last with 600Ah before you need a charge?
Thanks for the video. I'm looking into something similar to charger the batteries as I go down the road. Right now, the target is only 200 Ah and I think that only one DC-DC charger would be needed. I'm not sure how easy it is or where to add additional batteries in a NL 10.2 unit.
I'll try to answer these in order:
1. I did look at the Renogy DC-DC/MPPT chargers, they are very nice and a great value. I contacted Renogy in hopes that they would have some kind of bluetooth monitor available soon, but after waiting for 6 months, there was still nothing. I decided to go with a dedicated DC-DC charger setup, then, select a MPPT solar controller when I'm ready to do that project. I plan to run panels of at least 24 volts, which will actually output closer to 30. The Renogy DCC50S DC-DC MPPT has a hard 25 volt limit on solar connections that would restrict my solar setup too much. When I'm ready, I'll probably go with a Victron MPPT controller. The solar controller that's in the camper now is the factory installed PWM controller.
I just pinned a comment about why I used dual chargers. I'll paste it here:
Due to cable size requirements and amperage limitations on exterior plugs, I could only find parts to wire up a 40 amp charger. I need more than power than a single charger can provide, so running them in parallel gives me more amperage without having to go to 0 or 00 gauge cable. Another âfeatureâ is that I can charge at either 40 or 80 amps and it provides redundancy in the event one fails (power is pretty critical for us). I only run both chargers if I need to charge quickly. If Iâll be driving for many hours, I can just leave one running and reduce the load and heat generated by the alternators and in the chargers in the battery compartment.
A single charger would not meet my needs. I'll probably add a 3rd charger at some point too. With that much power, I would have a much easier time keeping the batteries charged. We use a ton of power because of our computer equipment. So fast recharge times would be nice. I also want to be able to get rid of the generator completely and still have all the power we need.
My hope with solar is that it will extend out stationary times. Right now, I can get 2-4 days. before the batteries are dead, having 600 Watts of solar, should extend this by a day or two, which would be perfect. We seldom stay in one place for longer than 2-3 days. If we can keep the batteries topped off, it wont require as much drive time to get them charged.
I have been looking at the Battery compartments in the NL campers, I think that a battery setup similar to mine would give greater AH capacity for the same space. But, it's still early in development. If I come up with something, I'll be sure to post a video about it! Thanks for watching and keep the questions coming. Good luck with your project!
@@Stonyboot Thank you!
Awesome Job! Thank you for sharing.
Thank you, and thanks for watching :)
Dang Scott now my brain hurts!
That's not good! You should take some pain killers đ€Ł
Ice cold crown royal is my pain killer.
Great instruction, thanks
Thanks for watching, I hope it was helpful!
Can you tell us sometime how you custom- built your Lithium batteries ? And what wiring set ups you used ?
A video about that is coming. Since they are prototypes, I want to finish working out some details and then I'll do a full explanation on them. Stay tuned!
Thanks, looking forward to your lithium battery podcast.
Scott, what was your major in college. Youâre very technically and electronically smart.
Thanks! No major and no degree. I did go part time for IT/Networking in 99/2000, but quickly got bored. Iâm self taught, I just like to play with stuff. In no way am I pro at this stuff.
Awesome Sasha and Scott. Good tip on the trolling motor connector! No issues with it wriggling loose?
I was bit nerve racked about cutting into my TC wall but now I am confident.
I also bought breakers but read somewhere about high heat environment tripping them so I changed directions and am planning on a fuse in the engine bay. Breakers by the charger in the rig.
Great job on the video and project.
100% agree. The breakers have tripped on me due to engine/ambient heat. Iâll be putting them inside the camper and using terminal fuses in the engine bay. I donât like making holes in the camper either, but that was a nice protected place with a plug designed for the task. Time will tell, but so far, so good đ
I'd like to know how they have a cell signal in the mountains.
We actually made a video about how we stay connected on the road! czcams.com/video/JeQ8xIHrNZ8/video.html
I would probably add vents and a small fan to keep your electronics from overheating and shortening their lifespan and more importantly a fire hazard!
Hi Guys, I appreciate you taking us through this. I realized today from your video that I really need to protect my cables much more. I have most of the components and I'm anxious to get this going. I figured out a route for the cables on my Ram 3500 including the cables to my auxillary switches but that may change. It's a good thing I stopped installing when I did. Something about the cables being too exposed to danger. After watching you I'm looking to go the PVC route. Maybe you have some more pointers regarding your cabling route after the PVC and up through the fender even to avoid the engine compartment. I appreciate your quality work and want to do this right.. At the 11:46 mark I noticed something I want to ask you about. The PVC fasteners. I hope you decided to go with a something stronger to fasten the PCV up there than what looks like a small zip tie. I bet this was just to hold it there while you figured out and made a bracket of some kind... I wonder where you decided to screw into. I think you pieced together your footage wih your demonstration super well done. I'm learning that this is not something to be rushed especially if your not sure on something or it's your first time installing something like this. Thanks for sharing you insights and lifestyle with us all.
There is a lot to learn about the electrical side of things. I'm always learning and always making mistakes. My videos aren't really a "how to" guide from a professional perspective, but a "How i did it" perceptive. I spend a lot of time reading, watching YT videos, talking to friends, etc. I assemble the project in my head, then on paper, then order the parts that I think will work. Then, I realize all of the faults, and adjust accordingly.
Circuit protection is definitely your first step with any electrical system. Fuses and breakers are very important! And for the cables under the truck, I just wanted to prevent the cables from getting hooked on anything or chafing. I did use medium zip ties, 2 separate zip-ties at each area that I could access. Later, I found my aluminum baling wire and used that to wrap/secure the PVC to the truck. I hesitate to drill holes as it promotes corrosion. Also, 98% of the stuff I install is installed in a way that makes it removable later without leaving any damage. So, I tend to use methods like this to prevent making permanent marks/holes/damage.
That pipe has been under there for about 30k miles without any problems.
Iâm installing mine right nowâŠ. I went with Victron 12/12 30A Isolated Charger. My truck has a single alt. and itâs a 105 Amp output. Hoping to do the same and take advantage of travel days and charge up the battery bank
I only worry about a Water Pump so close to all Your Electronics . YIKES !!!
Agreed! That was a temporary setup due to time constraints. I have fixed that issue, but haven't made an update video. I'll work on that soon!
Great job and great video!
Thanks for watching and the kind comment!
Would you consider posting your setup schematics and links to products?
I did post the links to the products/parts used in the description. I still have more work to do to the system and I can try to put a diagram together. I mostly work from a notebook and my head, but I'll see what I can do đ
As every system varies it's crucial for each to have specific diagram. Draw out an idea, shop for parts then use as a guide to install. Installation will possibly vary more.
I put a off - on switch the lights up when on that way I canât let alt and engine warm up and charge starting batteries and then I turn on Renorgy dc to dc charger and I donât know if it helps but it seamed good to me . Iâve got a 05 Bigfoot 10.6 with on board Gen from factory and 2 LG 425 watt solar panels because I donât have much room on top and I do run 3000 watt inverter and 2 Battleborn 100 watts a piece and so far it all works great and itâs funny I have the same trolling motor plug that you have. I guess people like you think a like and just to see how long the batteries would last has a lot to do with the temp out side. They ran the 110 AC 4-5 hours and I have room in my basement to a lot more batteries in the slide out try but I would have to find a different place for my fishing gear but the battleborn batteries are so light , I think they 37 lb a piece and AGM or lead acid weigh so much more. I like your rig. My truck is a 05 Dodge 3500 4x4 with 4 door long bed dullay and 6 speed manual and I bought this new so I know how well itâs been takin care of and no tuners for hp it does great stock with 3.37 gears so that makes for good fuel mileage the 4.10 gears are just to low for me. I turn 2000 rpm for 70mph but if I set my cruise by rpmâs my fuel mileage is great when I do it that way and thatâs like 65 mph. I put the big air bags with compressor and tack and it comes with a kit with quick chucks and gauge built in so I can air my tires up and down. And I did put Big wig rear sway bar and you can tell the difference soon as you drive it and I put 5100 Bilstiens on and they are really good when under a load. But when you drive with no load they are stiff and rid stiff but loaded they are the best money can buy. If I have to do it again I might go with the blue and yellow ones and I think they are 4100. People think the 5200 are for lifted trucks only and thatâs not correct they range for 0-2 inch leveling kit and I tested them by putting a mark on the shinny rod and it never wiped it off so they work like the are supposed too. Sorry for the long ramble but Iam sure you know what I mean, you wonât know if you donât ask . Good Day !
What you have done here is trun your fuel guzzling truck into a generator. You already have a 2000 watt generator that is fuel efficient. All you needed to do was buy a 120 volt charger for it and set the generator away from you vehicle. Hope this helps in the future. Cheers!
We do have a generator it runs on gas and propane. We also have an inverter/charger to charge the batteries while using the generator or shore power. What this project did, was allow me to charge the batteries while I'm already driving. Since we drive almost every day, it means we can use the truck, thats already running, as our primary power source. I certainly don't run the truck just to charge, that would be a huge waste!
Can you tell me more about the distribution block on the battery ?
Great video finally! Looks fantastic. How come you are using two dc-dc units?
Are you using two dc-dc. One for each battery? How many amps each battery?
Due to cable size requirements and amperage limitations on exterior plugs, I could only find parts to wire up a 40 amp charger. I need more than power than a single charger can provide, so running them in parallel gives me more amperage without having to go to 0 or 00 gauge cable. Another âfeatureâ is that I can charge at either 40 or 80 amps and it provides redundancy in the event one fails (power is pretty critical for us). I only run both chargers if I need to charge quickly. If Iâll be driving for many hours, I can just leave one running and reduce the load and heat generated by the alternators and in the chargers in the battery compartment.
@@Steveski70 They run in parallel, so each battery gets about 50% of the total. If I run a single charger, each battery will charge at 20 amps, and 40 amps if I run both.
Found your video by chance. Do you have a shunt to monitor the amps coming in?
For example a 130amp alternator will get burnt out quickly consuming 80-120 amps when only 50 amps coming into the battery bank so one would have a deficit.
So the plan is to install a 300amp alternator and dual 50amp DC2DC charger with lithium profiles to get roughly 92amps due to loss in efficiency and then the other 40 to 50 amps from solar on a sunny optimum day. to get a surplus or net out when consuming 120amps.
So it be cool to see your data and numbers in real world applications.
Superb setup
Thank you so much!â€ïž
I hope Renogy gave you that charger, and I'm sure they did. Because this was a commercial.
I wish, but nope, all out of my pocket. And, almost a year later, its running perfectly! The chargers have been flawless!
Have you noticed lower MPG due to the alternator working harder? I just ordered a Victron DC-DC charger
Itâs hard to see with the gauge, but I had a friend help calculate it. Itâs something like 0.25 MPG. But various factors like temperature, engine RPM etc effect it.
Itâs not too much.
just found your channel and would recommend if at all possible relocating the water pump and all water lines to different location away from all your expensive equipment.
That was a temporary solution. I have since fixed that problem and will make an update video in the future. Water and electricity donât mix!
I was following along great until I saw that you installed 2 DC-DC chargers. Why did you install two? One for each battery?
I forgot to fully explain why I installed dual chargers!
Due to cable size requirements and amperage limitations on exterior plugs, I could only find parts to wire up a 40 amp charger. I need more than power than a single charger can provide, so running them in parallel gives me more amperage without having to go to 0 or 00 gauge cable. Another âfeatureâ is that I can charge at either 40 or 80 amps and it provides redundancy in the event one fails (power is pretty critical for us). I only run both chargers if I need to charge quickly. If Iâll be driving for many hours, I can just leave one running and reduce the load and heat generated by the alternators and in the chargers in the battery compartment.
I was gonna ask the same thing...
Today was a perfect example. I had many hours to drive, so I just ran a single charger. We were charged when we got to our destination. Itâs been awesome having control over the charging rate.
What's cost involved in a dc-dc charger?
@@cirrus820travelers9 The cost for the renogy 40 amp dc/dc charger is $200. However you must consider the cost of cables , connectors, lugs, breakers, fuses, and special tools, the expense really goes up not to mention the significant time and effort. I put the same type of charging system for lithium batteries on my truck and camper. I like the high amp connectors that were used. I wound up using Anderson connectors which require some practice to learn how to crimp correctly. Dave Anderson
As we all know there is no free lunch. You mentioned that before the install you had been running the generator a lot and it was expensive. An alternator typically takes about 1 HP (horse power) for every 25 amps of power generated. Now that you are using the truck alternator did you check to see how much your MPG changed/dropped and how long does it take too fully charge those batteries empty to full off the truck system you now have?
No free lunch!?!? But I'm hungry!
I have not been able to measure the impact on my MPG. I have done a ton of driving tests to compare it and the average MPG is always about the same within a margin of error. I know that it has an effect, but I just don't have a sensitive enough tool to measure it. I see a much bigger change in MPG by changing my speed by 5 MPH.
We still have the generator and use it if we have to, but we have only needed it once in the last 3 months. Also, I never idle the truck to charge, only when we are driving. The generator uses a lot of propane which is much harder to get than gas. So I started using gas to run the generator. 3 gallons of gas, gives me about 2.5 charges.
As for a full charge... to charge from 0% to 100% (i usually cycle between 20% and 90%) would take 7.5 hours at 80 amps. We average about 1-4 hours of driving per day. When I know I'll be driving a lot the next day, I will use more power than normal to take advantage of the longer time to charge. Solar will help extend our non driving run time, but that's a project for the spring.
@@Stonyboot thanks for the reply.