How Bad is America's 'Christian Nationalism' Problem? | Guest: Nathan Finochio | Ep 430
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- čas přidán 6. 08. 2024
- Today, we're talking to Nathan Finochio, founder of TheosU online seminary. What is "Christian nationalism" exactly? Are they really as widespread among evangelicals as the Left thinks? We also talk about the idea of American imperialism, and whether deconstructionism coming from progressive Christians is more dangerous than the perceived Christian nationalism coming from the Right.
Nathan's website: www.nathanfinochio.ca/
TheosU: theosu.ca/
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How Bad is America's 'Christian Nationalism' Problem? | Guest: Nathan Finochio | Ep 429 crtv talk radio allie beth stuckey cbn
Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord hosanna in the highest praise God praying for everyone everyday God bless you all
Please join me in prayer for all brothers and sisters in Christ praying for the lost to get saved praying for all those in need of prayers in USA and all around the world God bless you all
The Church is a Kingdom and a Nation. How about bring people into the Kingdom?
Nathan is the funniest dude ever. I love TheosU
Wow, this is an excellent interview and conversation. I think the twisting of meaning of words is a tactic of the enemy we are facing, and this conversation helps bring light to the confusion. When I did debate in college, ground rules for debate were to start with definitions, and those definitions guided the conversation. In so many of these conversations and accusations in our culture, the tactic is to twist and move meaning so that we cannot clearly communicate with shared definitions and that slight shifting is causing division. Thank you.
Never expected to see Nathan on with Allie Beth.
Just call it PATRIOTISM. Why "take back" the word Nationalism???🤫🤫🤔🤔
Jesus Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures and that he was Buried and that he rose again the third day praying for everyone everyday God bless you all
SO if true, "3 days” in Hebraic definitions three sunsets, three light days rendering 72 clock hours,
Then are you going to participate if the Easter LIE catholic invented?
Catholic ishtar easter they defined as friday sometime to sunday which is NOT anywhere in the bible, or 72 proper defined Hebraic days” either.
The sunset of darkness determines the “day calendar” NOT 12 PM to 12PM , the catholics define as “days”.
A human cannot kill a god; that is retarded. Even according to the idiotic story he didn't actually die which proves the whole story is retarded.
@@jackgarand7284 God came down as a man in the flesh. Humans killed Jesus' flesh, of course they couldn't kill Him spiritually.
@@ianntmy A person cannot kill a god in any way shape or form. That is an idiotic part of a moronic story and nothing else.
Instead of "putting my country first" maybe we can say "I'm responsible for and to MY country in ways I am not to other countries, and my country is responsible to ME in ways it is not to citizens of other countries. That's what being a citizen MEANS!"
I understand that's what we mean when we say "my country first", but progressives can't make these connections very well. It's why they are progressives and unfortunately we MUST deal with them because they do vote.
Further before we bash them too much it helps to remember that many are brainwashed young people who have been trained NOT to think by schools which should have educated them.
Thank you for this discussion. I found it very informative.
Americans broadly confuse "nationalism" and "patriotism" with *militarism.* That's an error. "Compatriots" are fellow countrymen (of one land). Nationalism is a shared linguistic heritage and sometimes an imagined mythical familial origin (as in "founding fathers"). Etymology dictionaries are good sources for the traditional meanings of these terms.
Jeremiah 29:7 pray for the place where I have sent you into exile, for in it's welfare is your welfare.
Nathan, thanks. So interesting and informational. I'm reformed Presbyterian, conservative, Bible is God's Word. Great discussion.
Eve was NOT the first to question God's Word. That dubious distinction belongs to you know who:
Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God actually say, ‘You shall not eat of any tree in the garden’?”
Did appreciate the discussion of Christian nationalism
He did say, “Eve was the first _person_ to deconstruct.” It’s fairly clear from the context of the sentence that he means first _human._
@@liljenborg2517 Fair enough. The satanic origins of deconstruction are worth noting.
It would be interesting to have an actual deconstructionist involved in this discussion. It seems like it’s two people on the outside discussing something external to them.
In Philippians 3:20, God tells us through Paul, "...our citizenship is in Heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ." In Romans 13, God tells us to be subject to governing authorities because they are established by God. But, He never says to be loyal to them. In Romans 11, we learn that we gentiles have been grafted into Israel, spiritually. We aren't supposed to be trying to overthrow the government. But, I don't think we should be nationalist either. What about the Christians in the rest of the world? If they're nationalists of their nation, won't that put us in conflict with them? If we are one in the body of Christ, Galatians 3:28, how does that work if we are all nationalists?
Fair question. But we have several affinities and allegiances in this world- all valid. While we are to love our spouses in Ephesians, etc, we know Jesus in Luke tells us we hate our allegiances, even spouses, in comparison to our relation to God and His purposes. But what's more, my co-citizenry with a true believer in China for example is stronger than our national allegiances, our politics, our cultures, our familial allegiances, etc. That is the kingdom of God: in how we relate to it in this temporal realm. Like Rocketmanshawn said in this thread, we are in exile (our temporary living arrangements before our eternal citizenship is realized). But that doesn't mean we have no love or allegiances (nor duties) here and now to and in the world. And if our nations war (even due to God's established gov'ts making bad decisions), or we compete in business, or we feed our family first, etc, we still acknowledge our body of Christ all over the world and look at working as one church to bring about Christ's commission while supporting our local communities, local church body, immediate family, etc. I agree with your concern with unnecessary conflict, but just like we can 'hopefully' set aside our sports team allegiance among what makes us true friends, we lay aside this world when it causes us to have no love for our fellow christians and enemies alike. sorry so long.
You do realize that the founders of this nation founded this place as a safe haven for actual Christians to be free of the church being ruled and doctrine controlled and manipulated by the state. It’s highly likely, had the founders taken the same position as most of our very liberal, privileged, western Christians do today, your not i would even be able to access the gospel. You realize that the very reason the west is able to help in so many other struggling nations build churches and spread the gospel is because those before us chose to build a nation “under god”. The west is worth fighting for, and to do that it requires nationalism. This “worldwide body of Christ” Utopia is nonsense and will result in the destruction of the west and modern churches and their ability to minister globally.
@@coreydavis2894 our unity is in Christ alone, not America! In Hebrews 11, often called the hall of faith, the author reminds us of some Old Testament saints! They all considered themselves exiles here on earth because they sought a better country, that is, a heavenly one. Therefore, God is not ashamed to be called their God, 11:16!
Excellent conversation! Thank you!
That was a great explanation of Chesterton.
@thedadchallengepodcast my prayer for you is that you might watch this and REALLY listen! God bless you!!!!
The Bible is specific there are 2 nations. America isn't one of them.
Strawmanning and bad-faith arguments abound in this video. When two folks in the same bubble choose to discuss, and dismiss, outsiders, you know they're more interested in confirming their own views than seeking truth.
Yikes. I made this comment 10 minutes into the video, and things just got worse. So much snarky dismissiveness and gleeful superiority from these two without any consideration that progressive Christians are faithful, devoted, genuine, wise, studied, learned... No doubt fans of ABS are hearing exactly what they want to, but this video is a real disappointment.
Very good explanation of nationalism. Thank you!
Love him in The Royal Royal. 🎼🎵
This was such a fantastic conversation. So many incredible insights on both subjects.
“Christian Nationalist” means “patriotic, pro-American, religious republican”, but by using the word “nationalist” they both distinguish it from Globalism, the essence of leftist political ideology (you know, the right side of history and all that), AND to link patriotism and pro-American attitudes with those German nationalists from the 1930s. That is, so you can call anyone to the right of Bernie Sanders a Nazi.
Allie must have overlooked the fact that Nathan is a charismatic.
Nothing is new being effected with questions of certain churches do embrace God only doing what you think will be possible, the surprise of feeling your firsts but become last, Called some name like cult at least believes God can do anything that defeats christians being the only claim is acceptable by that group. Rebirth tricks you.
Great show, as always! Good explanation of Christian nationalism and why it is a good thing.
Really good interview. I really enjoyed this discussion. 👍
I thought he was Jared from Wisecrack.
“New”. Very dangerous. Souls will rot in eternal separation from God following the false church . People !!! read the word . Get the Spirit . He will teach you . If you have the Spirit the hairs on your arm will stand on end listening to this .
“But the anointing that you received from him abides in you, and you have no need that anyone should teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about everything, and is true, and is no lie-just as it has taught you, abide in him.”
1 John 2:27 ESV
There’s a disconnect about American (and Canadian for that matter) nationalism because in recent history, this is not our land! Chesterton defended Indian nationalism because it had been historically their land for centuries. Our “country” was overtaken by others from the outside! America is not on par with France, England, Germany because we are a nation of immigrants.
He was talking about Indians from...India. Where the British had colonized the country, and British culture was influencing Indian culture.
Not Indians from North America.
Enjoying the interview but it’s super quiet!
I disagree about deconstruction. As evangelicals we are asking those of other religions to deconstruct their beliefs and consider something that goes against the core beliefs they have been raised on. Yet we are not willing to do the same?
No, we’re not asking them to “deconstruct”. We’re asking them to evaluate the truth claims of Jesus and the Bible and the truth claims of their own teachings rationally. Deconstruction is the process of pulling out various “politically incorrect” threads from Christianity (the misogyny of opposing Abortion, or the homophobic/transphobic bigotry of thinking “heterosexual-normative” marriage is the moral standard, the exclusivist idea that Jesus is the only way, the self-esteem destroying idea that humans are sinners who need “saving”) to leave you with the “pure” or “true” Christianity which looks a lot like 21st Century leftist, globalist, socialist, pro-LGBTQ, political ideology and very little like the Christianity taught in the Bible. But it’s a lot more acceptable by the movers and shakers in our culture.
@@liljenborg2517 helpful differentiation and examples!
He was describing deconstruction as questioning the main narratives like “is the Bible even true”. 8:05
Such a misrepresentation of deconstruction. So shallow. I've still yet to find someone on the channel that makes a serious attempt to understand the other side. It's really easy to just criticize, criticize, criticize. The opinions given here are just individualistic views like everyone else. It's just a different viewpoint.
“American Imperialism looks like a Starbucks in Germany or Japan”. I couldn’t even have conjured up a more misinformed statement on American foreign policy in the last 100 years if I tried
That's good you couldn't... because he wasn't coupling what foreign policy was -causally- directly with what imperialism looks like on the ground - results wise. It is misinformed to implicate him to this as a misinformed statement, imho. I agree he has undersold all the methods the US employed imperial methods (at fed level) in his talk here, but using his example of export culture, sometimes actions from other sovereign entities force the hand too. Yes, prior US acts and FDR may had pushed the buttons of war in 30s/40s, but ultimately, our 'imperial' influence on Japan and Germany since WW2 is on them.
@@designbuild7128 I’m struggling to even remotely understand your first point. “he wasn’t coupling what foreign policy was directly with what imperialism looks like on the ground..” lol what?
@@nathanhughes6600 sorry, not well stated on my part. I just meant, it seems, you put words in his mouth, if I can use an idiom; and then you said it was misinformed. He said nothing about foreign policy planting Starbucks.
Meaning we invade with coffee shops? Not tanks... that other countries seem to want and invite in our western ways, rather than us forcing thrm on them. As opposed to russian imperialism as seen in Ukraine.
The USA was imperialist... Hawaii, Puerto Rico, Guam and other’s didn’t get the chance to self determination and they are still suffering the consequences.
Jesus is the conqueror
The ironic thing is that, after being “absorbed” by the U.S., the populace of these three locations have had the opportunity for self-determination and to be free of U.S. government supervision. For the most part, the natives have declined separation and complete separation from the U.S. and have been content to stay under the hegemony of the U.S. Yes, I’m well aware that there is a vocal minority that wants complete independence from Uncle Sam but, from my understanding, that is a distinct minority of the populace.
@@jahjahtucker3135 ...wut
I love Nathan! He's great!
👍😇
God made our conscience as an authority also. Nobody can ever accept the authority of the scriptures or the teachings of Christianity apart from the authority of their conscience. Yet sometimes the teachings of Christianity and its interpretation of the scriptures come into conflict with the conscience. So then there is the turning towards deconstruction, which can lead to a void in spiritual guidance leaving it wide open to be filled with pernicious ideologies like neo-marxism etc. What should fill that void is the teachings of Jesus in the Gospels about the Kingdom of God, which Christianity neglects too often. Even if someone can't possibly believe in orthodoxy and fundamentalism or in the inerrancy of the scriptures, they can still be inspired and find spiritual salvation in the idea of the Kingdom of God. But nobody can really do that unless they hate their own lives in this world as Jesus teaches. Otherwise, they will just be offended and will instead turn to the world.
This comment won't set well with people who don't like to read. I apologize for making it so long, one thought led to another and so on. Sorry about that.
There are three main sources of religious energy which are the Holy Spirit, human soul power, and kingdom of darkness religious spirits. During times of no outpouring of the Holy Spirit (as in this day and time) it is extremely rare and difficult to find someone speaking by the anointing of the Holy Spirit, but it is commonplace for religious people to run on soul power, and/or to have anointings by religious spirits.
The religious spirits are the highest echelon of warrior foot soldier demons in the kingdom of darkness hierarchy who are meticulously groomed by kingdom of darkness overlords (aka fallen angels/principalities) to know how to mimic the Holy Spirit. Both religious spirits and religious soul power seek to mimic the Holy Spirit, and sometimes they can be very convincing with their 'Do-Gooder' persona, their sanctimonious posture of perfection, their mock authority, and their busy 'good works' agendas. The ploy has all to do with manipulation and control of the people who allow themselves to be used by religious spirits as human mouthpieces, and manipulation and control of their followers.
Sometimes soul power can be a good thing, as in construction trades, mechanical trades, sports, music, art, math, science, engineering, higher learning, anything that requires special talent and ability. But religious soul power is always exploited by kingdom of darkness religious spirits, the reason being that the Lord requires for Christians to wait for him to give them the anointing of the Holy Spirit, and if he doesn't give it to them for them to do nothing ministry-wise until he does. But if they go ahead anyway and launch out in presumption and start relying on soul power, they give automatic rights to the kingdom of darkness overlords to lade them with a religious spirit, which is what is going on with practically all of these CZcams religionists who are being driven by the religious spirits operating through them to be obsessed to post their religious videos. If these people could catch even a tiny glimpse of how disgusting it is to the Lord they'd never open their mouths in public again.
One thing these CZcams religionists fail to consider is that because they refused to wait on the Lord to give them the anointing of the Holy Spirit, but went ahead doing their own thing in his name anyway, that when the end-time outpouring of the Holy Spirit comes they'll be left out of it because they have their reward now with their fifteen minutes of fame. That's exactly what happened to the televangelists and the system church priestclass who emulated them (so-called 'pastors') during the mid-90's outpouring of the Holy Spirit (what became known as "The Toronto Outpouring of the Holy Spirit" that lasted from 1991 - 1996). Then when they realized that they were left out of it they got jealous and bitter and vilified it, with many of them blaspheming the Holy Spirit by saying the outpouring was "Of the devil."
CZcams was actually concocted by the kingdom of darkness overlords as a forum for religious spirits to manifest through human mouthpieces for the purpose of making a parody of prophetic ministry (and of Christianity in general), and for the purpose of controlling millions of Christians, and it is working famously well for them. In their esteem, everything else on CZcams is just worldly fluff, but which is useful to them because it helps to legitimize CZcams, which is very important to them as the CZcams religionists are their primary voice to the world now, along with the system church priestclass (i.e. so-called 'pastors' and other assorted ministers) who emulate them.
The kingdom of darkness' highest priority agenda is to use CZcams to acclimate Christians to false prophetic ministry, because they know that during times of no outpouring of the Holy Spirit (as in this day and time) that the Lord keeps the true prophets hidden, and that when the end-time outpouring of the Holy Spirit arrives (which I think is going to be fairly soon) he will bring them out of hiding and anoint them with Holy Spirit power (these will be Christians who nobody has ever heard of). That is exactly what happened during the mid-90's outpouring of the Holy Spirit. And the kingdom of darkness overlords remember it, so it is of utmost importance to them to acclimate Christians to false prophetic ministry now so that when the end-time outpouring of the Holy Spirit comes they won't be able to relate to it, and they'll distrust the Lord's prophets, and will be afraid of them, and will call them false prophets, especially when they hear their messages which will be so totally opposite of the sweetsie-sweet and nicie-nice 'prophecies' they've been being weaned on for years and years, most of which major on the elementary principles of Christianity which the Holy Spirit said not to be doing (see Hebrews 6:1-3 in the King James Version).
As a side note, religious soul power sometimes drifts over into witchcraft which is also always exploited by religious spirits. Psychic phenomenon can be a form of witchcraft (alsoTarot cards, 'law of attraction,' numerology, mind over matter, etc.). Simon Magus of Acts 8:9-24 is an example of that. There are many so-called 'pastors' and other ministers who employ witchcraft control to compensate for their own spiritual powerlessness. Many music ministers and worship teams rely on witchcraft spirits and witchcraft methods to empower them. It's a lot more commonplace than most Christians would ever think.
The story about the Philippian girl of Acts chapter 16 (beginning with verse 16) is an example of how a religious spirit manifests through a human mouthpiece, as in what is going on with these CZcams religionists (i.e. teachers, so-called 'prophets,' and other assorted self-appointed 'Do-Gooders' who are doing their own thing in the Lord's name, some of whom are making a lot of money doing it). Bear in mind that everything the Philippian girl said was 100% correct, and was 100% the truth. But bear in mind also that it was a religious spirit speaking through her, the same as what is going on with these CZcams religionists.
As another side note, politics is actually a lot of people's religion, and politicians and their followers are often targeted by religious spirits. There are a lot of spiritually defunct false teachers and false prophets who have no anointing of the Holy Spirit whatsoever whose credibility is dependent on their ranting about politics (CZcams is awash with them). Since they have nothing of spiritual value to say, if they didn't rant about politics, nobody would pay much attention to anything they have to say.
In Mark 8:15 the Lord told his disciples to beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the leaven of Herod. As I understand it, the leaven of the Pharisees has to do with soul power religion that is devoid of the anointing of the Holy Spirit, and the leaven of Herod has to do with politics, both of which are all about control (kingdom of darkness control). In Ephesians 6:12 in the King James Version the Holy Spirit speaking through the Apostle Paul revealed that the fallen angels run the world system (which is why the world is so messed up). In that verse Paul referred to the fallen angels as 'principalities' who handpick the politicians and world leaders and the elitists who control them, as this verse infers (also Luke 4:6 in the King James Version).
As another side note, whenever someone gives rights to the kingdom of darkness overlords to lade them with a religious spirit, they will also lade them with a deaf, dumb, and blind spirit (per Psalm 115:5-8 in the King James Version), after which they will be unable to hear the Holy Spirit speaking to them, they will be unable to speak by the anointing of the Holy Spirit, and they will be unable to receive spiritual truth (they will have no spiritual discernment). Very often the way someone gives those rights is by making an idol of some religious leader.
Back during the mid-90's outpouring of the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit spoke the following prophecy through several Christian prophets in the US and Canada which was this:
"When this outpouring ends the enemy is poised to retaliate against the outpouring with the biggest onslaught of religious activity in the history of the Lord's church."
That was about ten years before CZcams was invented. At the time the prophecy was given nobody was able to envision what it was the Lord was talking about. Now we know.
I always try to remember to advise Christians to start praying and asking the Lord to give them the gift of discerning of spirits (the Holy Spirit speaking through the Apostle Paul made mention of the gift of discerning of spirits in 1 Corinthians 12:10 in the King James Version), because if ever there was a time in human history when the gift of discerning of spirits was needed, it is now, especially these days when there are so many people falling for the CZcams false teachers and false prophets (and lauding them to the skies).
I also try to remember to advise Christians to seek the baptism of the Holy Spirit evidenced by speaking in tongues, because speaking in tongues is a super-weapon against the kingdom of darkness, particularly against their daily attempts at harassment and oppression.
I also always try to remember to advise Christians to never watch religious CZcams videos, for obvious reasons (obvious to me at least), and to spend the time they'd spend doing that seeking to develop a living relationship with the Holy Spirit in the quiet at home. (per Isaiah 30:15, Psalm 46:10, 1 Thessalonians 4:11, and Hebrews 4:11 all in the King James Version).
We have to honor and love all of our military personnel who have sacrificed so much for our country. Yet, we have so many national sins like mass murder of babies, LGBT movement, pornography issues, drug epidemic, the list goes on. Our country is at a crossroads because our Founders said that our country could only survive and maintain our freedom with our morality in tact. This is the conundrum we are all living in, and frankly very unsettling. However, I think being a "Christian Nationalist" is Biblical due to the fact that God set the borders of each country, and those borders are worth defending. How many churches preach about this in an in context manor. Very few.
Nathan 🤙🏼🤙🏼🤙🏼
Isn't that an oxymoron?
(The title)
It’s all motivated by culture not scripture 100%
what do you mean?
I mean scripture dictates truth not culture. All these weirdos are taking the culture and trying to make God fit in a box
I think your guest made some interesting points. I think we as Christians should strive for a more Christianized Nation however not at the point from a Theocracy. If you want to destroy Christianity here in America you would created a Theocracy. Yes separation of established Church from the State but not a total separation from God. A Delicate balance to be sure so we have to be wise in that respect and not actually cutting Solomon's baby into two. And to be clear I am not a Leftist Progressive Liberal christian but a very Conservative Reformed Christian. We have to be careful not to take the Lord's name in vain.
Weak.
America desperately needs a secular nationalism. Nationalism unfortunately is very much associated with Christian Fundamentalism.