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Sons of Sanguinius Detachment (Early Opinions!)
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- čas přidán 12. 08. 2024
- Today I'm checking out the GW app and giving you all my opinions on the Sons of Sanguinius detachment after playing my first game of it! So think of this video as a review and a very early look/opinion!
Leave a comment on your thoughts and thanks for watching!
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Honestly, a lot of sang guards survivability issues would be solved if the sang priest in jump pack could attach to them...he's literally called sanguinary priest
I think you are probably right lol.
My biggest issue for the sang priest as well :(
I thought he was able to and ended up running my first game wrong. Thought hw could run with warlord and not juts a caption. If you could they would be even better than on tenth with the extra ap and 5+fnp
Sanguinary Priests have nothing in common with the Sanguinary Guard. Or Sanguinala. Or the Sanguine Knights.
Just like Blood Angels do not all use Blood Talons or Blood Missiles or Blood whatever else.
Name appart, the Sanguinary Guard is the bodyguard squad of the Primarch. Then to the Chapter master, and then his Captains… No lore reasons to have anything else with them.
@@juliangrunberg5597I wouldn’t say no reason, you could absolutely make a reasonable justification for Sanguinary Priests. They literally hold the living blood of Sanguinius within them, and they dedicate their lives to curing the Flaw, which *is* a sacred undertaking that the Chapter desires more than anything. Both of these traits make them even more integral to the future of the Chapter than the standard Apothecary (who’s already a big deal). Sure, they’re not Command, but they rule the Chapter when nobody else can (alongside the Chaplaincy, of course). They’re definitely massive deals, and one might consider it silly if they *weren’t* protected. The lore might not support the idea that the Chapter protects them to this degree, but at the very least, it makes a lot of sense that a Priest *opt* to fight alongside the finest warriors the Chapter has to offer, in order to secure their legacy. It’s kind of his job, after all.
Mephiston felt very good with assault intercessors. Giving his unit fight first actually made them playable/ survivable. I ran him with a full squad of 10 and it was very killy.
Maybe I need to try the 10 man!
I ran a 10 man with a lt and apothecary and they did some incredible work against necrons, and chewed through a 20 man blob of Warriors with a lord and in range of a reanimator.
They felt very survivable and super killy!
they deffo havent worked as a 5 for me.
@@DeepWoodMegaFaunacan they be run with lt and Apothecary? Thought it had to be a captain or similer for the 2 leader units.
So you were playing not against any shooting meta army. Got it.
I think playing Eldar, the most busted faction right now, has really jaded your expectations BAC. Play some more games against the more balanced factions to see the clue of these units. Any faction will feel bad against Eldar who can guarantee any clutch roll they want or spit out tons of MW
I've got a game vs Chaos Daemons tomorrow! I also found KNIGHTS very tough to deal with and felt the +1 STR from SoS vs Knights is going to be next to worthless too!
@@ba_commander yeah most of the time it won’t matter but thats why I think the Red Rampage Strat is so important, +1 to wound it much better and synergises better with the +1S
@@ba_commander Knights in 10th are stupidly hard to kill. bullshit really
People would not take balanced faction in tournaments.
@@ba_commanderknights are op as eldars
Pumped for the vid John! Those little booklets helped a lot streamline things! Can’t recommend them enough!
Also dig the format seeing your phone screen to show building in real time.
I do wish the app let you change between gladius and Sons easily to swap enhancements without having to make a whole new list
Using the phone app, linking it to be on screen beside you, and you searching through it worked I think, looked good...!
Thanks dude, it was kinda fun to make!
Being able to favourite or bookmark relevant indexes/rules options and thereby reordering/prioritising the list is a great idea for the app John.
Agreed and fav units! I emailed em about it, but who knows who reads those
Hopefully someone!!!
The fact that you pointed it out makes the Blood Chalice of the Sanguinary Priest kind of boringly similar to the Librarian with Jump pack's Might of Heroes which improves melee weapons AP by 1.
Otherwise:
Gladius Stratagem Honour the Chapter in Fight phase when in Assault Doctrine improves AP by 1.
Gladius Enhancement Storm of Fire in Shooting phase when in Devastator Doctrine improves AP by 1.
Storm Speeder Hailstrike improves AP by 1 any unit making ranged attack against an enemy unit hit by it for the phase.
Predator Destructor ranged attack versus Infantry improves AP by 1.
Aggressor Squad ranged attack against closest target improves AP by 1.
Sons of Sanguinius Enhancement Artisan of War only improves the bearers weapons AP by 1.
That's it sadly...as far as I can see.
I did a game against thousand sons over the weekend with a bunch of jump pack units and a librarian dread, similar to what I was playing at the end of 9th, to see how it held up. Everything felt weak, unless it was swinging into the oath of moment unit, and everything felt like it had almost no durability. A unit that did well was a primaris librarian with a 10 man assault intercessor squad that I teleported to the middle of the table; very durable and killy if you are on an objective. The only other units that did really well were the 2 devastator squads with grav cannons, shooting at the oath target, even though the target was never a vehicle.
I'm dusting off my rhinos for my next game to help get the slow moving units, that can actually take useful characters, into battle. Seems like we need a good chunk of shooting to support our melee as well.
Pour one out for +1 to wound and +1" to charge. you will be missed
For their cost, they should be similar to custodies.... but they are worse than DC. They need an invul save and another wound, or innate protection from getting shot. That or reduce their cost to DC levels.
Also I really like the math from lemartes with 10 DC PF/IP with lethal hits with DC re-rolls.
I imagine it's hard to get all 10 IP in range though right?
@@ba_commander absolutely, it’s more of a nice to have cleanup if they, in some dream land, survive their first engagement. We could always take the PP and risk an overcharge though if we are trying to soften up a large threat before charging in.
Also I have a feeling GW wanted the DC dread to be our big vehicle killer… (12/13 S with re-roll hits/wounds at 6 attacks on charge) but I still haven’t figured out a reliable way to get him up the board before getting blasted. Feels like he needs a little more staying power before he could ever fill that role
All the librarians give 4+ invul, except the Libby w JP. He only gives a 4+FNP against psychic. Though he does give +1AP. I think what you say about a JP Capt with Sanguard makes way more sense for free strats
Thanks for watching Cal!
Hi John, first off let me thank for another great video of detailed information a precious feedback. Unfortunately 10th Ed is all about shooting and high toughness (at least for now). GW has punished heavily Melee oriented units/armies (to the point in which the same leader looses 1 Ld point just by equipping a jump pack). Talking specifically about BA's, we have been taken our identity away, that's high mobility and high melee punch. +1S means represents close to nothing in this edition but in very specific scenarios and only by using Gladius Detachment rules we can pretend to be BA. However, without our identity, I fear like we will be playing "Red Space Marines" for some time. I am confident that the meta will swift and we will get better at some point. All that being said, here some conclusions on what I have read about BA. Desolation Squad right now is a must. It is probable the most efficient SM unit (until it gets nerfed). I would include 2 squads, combined with Oath of Moment, Land Speeder and/or Incursors. Maybe complemented by a Librarian to give them Invul. I will probably run the JP DC lead by a regular JP Chaplain for the Litany of Hate bonus. Sang Guard will most likely be led by a regular JP Capt for all the reasons you said, although I may not run any SG due to its very high cost compared to other units. Regarding the Land Raider, I would consider the Land Raider Redeemer (with BGVs) for extra punch and instead of the Whirlwind I will most likely use Thunderfire Cannon. Last but not least, I would consider The Sanguinor. It has some interesting combos and forces your opponent to adapt his/her play style fearing being "intervened" by a Fight First unit. Some of the first things that I considered was Sang Priest along with Sang Guard (for the FnP), but unfortunately even that we have been denied for now. Let know what you think. I hope any of those ideas help you enjoy a little more next game.
In 3rd and 4th edition, BA were the best -shoot and counter-charge' army in the game. I played them as a finesse army that focused first on mobility. The goal was to assault the enemy with at least 2/3 of my army in a single turn. If this could be done twice consecutively it was a guaranteed win. I used a few tactical squads and a scout squad at the time, and the buff from HQ units to land very devastating assaults. Perhaps you should try this. Not with tacticals and scouts of course, with with just a two or so dedicated assault units and rest being mobile shooters with secondary assault capabilities. Bike squads were great for shooting and landing supporting assaults. always support your assaults with cheap units to consolidate into something - to stop their shooting/movement. Just a thought.
Love the video! Here are some of my own observations based on units that overlap which I have used:
Dante - Paired with the VVets and a Sang Priest, this unit is great. It really feels like the closest thing to flying terminators we can make (taking Storm Shields). With a 3+4++5+++ they can take a boatload of damage and still kick back. I fully agree Dante actually feels great in melee and can hold his own, getting him there is the issue. The VVets really like the additional -1 AP from the Priest as well. You also save a bunch of points over SangGuard. This unit has torn through most tyranid infantry (including warriors) and even some of the tougher Ork infantry units. I don't know how they perform into tougher units like the problem you had with Wraithblades though, so still might now solve that problem.
Impulsor - I've actually gotten some good use from the Comms Array on my Impulsors carrying melee units. They are great for sitting on a point and allowing the unit to advance on the enemy. Due to Space Marines (outside of a few characters) not having great CP regen, the occasional ability to gain one back within 6" of a unit using a strat is quite good.
Death Company - Agree on the Power Fist loadout for them. I have run them with both Lemartes and a Chap w/ Jump Pack and both of these tend to be better with the Power Fists. I love the re-rolls built in, because that really helps with consistency. I think there is something to be said for Power Weapons if you are running Lemartes, due to the built in Lethal Hits he gives, although this takes away some of the benefit of Red Rampage (but could possibly save you a CP if you don't need to spend it).
I loved hearing your thoughts on the rest of the units I haven't used!
Is Lemartes better than simply running a Chaplain with +1 to wound on the DC? Are you running these as 10 man squads?
@@ba_commander yes I’ve been running 10 man squads. If I run 5, it would be without a character I think. Full credit to a Reddit User by the name of KingOfParsnips for doing the math, but it works out to be a slight wash between Lemartes and Chaplain on damage all these were done assume 3+ saving throws and no charge bonus:
Lemartes:
T4 = 31.1 damage
T8 = 22.2 damage
T9 = 17.7 damage
Chaplain
T4 = 29.6 damage
T8 = 23.7 damage
T9 = 17.7 damage
As they are so close, I’ve leaned towards taking Lemartes for the added bonus of -1 damage. Although in lists where I’m looking to save a few points, the chaplain will perform just as well. One disadvantage to Lemartes however, is you won’t be getting 1 half of Red Rampage. In my experience though, Death Company are still good at their one job of killing the thing they charge into without it.
I found the Liberian to be goat unit holds OBJ like nobody’s business till the lion goes for him but teleporting a heavy intercessor squad with a bio to a foward OBJ early game is insane I recommend the combo if you can afford to squeeze them in since bio give them lethal and if you pay for the half OC enchantment on bio their really solid units
this edition feels like big units with heroes leading them. I always found the most success with maximizing character-unit buff synergies over raw unit power, even in 9th. 10th doubles down on that. I got a lot out of running a relic terminator squad (save 10 points because why not) with a terminator chaplain, and jumping them with a lib-dreadnought. Strong and durable board control almost anywhere you want on turn 1.
I’m thinking the same but with the new librarian in terminator armour and 10 relic terminators with twin lightning claws 6 attacks each on the charge and sustained hits 1 from lib and could do red rampage for plus 1 to wound and lethal hits also
To answer your question, a Libby with a Jump Pack also improves AC by one in melee. If you're trying to go somewhat cheap with a squad of VV's, a 5man squad with a Libby (who's melee output is almost the same as the VV's) for 205 points isn't bad.
Hmm. Interesting, my VVs haven't really been performing as of yet.
Looking forward to the Gladius video!
How did you find the new fly rules for movement? Did it impact how jump pack units operate much with your terrain setup?
It didn't really as most of the terrain we play is breach-able for infantry, one time it took a 1/2" of movement off!
Pinning Bombardment should really prevent Overwatch (it's in the name!), but as you said GW have screwed up the phase sequence and ability to make the Whirlwind effective now...
Are you still going to run a WW?
@@ba_commander Questionable, it still holds the back field, but given the sequence will it really protect our melee units in combat versus stratagems? The loss of being able to prevent an enemy unit Overwatching is pretty huge tbh given how 'prevalent/broken' out of phase overwatching is!
I have had a good time with this detachment. I use way more characters, like at least a quarter of the points are used on heroes and felt units were way more powerful that way.
Also, I have a couple of points dedicated to heavies and vehicles. My list feels extremely different from 9th. I use them almost like how I used to use my Drukhari army, very strategic hit and run melee and using powerful weapons to take on heavies and vehicles.
You can not use that game as a reference, you were trying new things, trying to figure out 10th and they were using an extremely meta competitive list, like they had almost every broken aeldari thing possible in one list(still had even more pwerful stuff he did not bring), they could have played terribly and re rolled everything and still win.
Exactly this. Aeldari will be getting nerfed first balance update no doubt
I am new to the game, and have 2 games under my belt with the Blood Angels. 1st of all thanks for the Content. 2nd I have noticed that my armies feel overloaded on blast or easier to kill infantry. What units can I look at to be the meat killers, the tank busters. I ran desolation, whirlwind and impulsor. My tank busters really felt like melee only with Bladeguard/Sang Guard. What is a good Range option for support against armor/big bugs
Librarian with JP gives extra AP as well, but nothing that attaches to DC or SG can.
How annoying, I really feel the need more AP!
in the future I'm running 2 squads of 5 infiltrators, but both with phobos librarians giving them 4+ invul vs psychic. but it gives them the 12 inch bubble witch sounds strong.
Infiltrators are good, I'm not sure there's enough psychic to feel you need 2 Librarians?
Hi, so some ideas, i like it and i think these two unit can works good:
- death company dreddy with magna grapple; coming from reserve with +2 to charge against monster and vehicle; for me very strong. He arrive fight, use stratagem for mortal wounds in charge, fight again if no kill the enemy
- 10 assoult marine with jump + chaplain with jump; make mortal wounds in charge with marine and chaplain, a lot of attack, +1 to wounds. 1 sergent 2 eviscerator 2 melta, very strong unit for 315 points
Man I wish I had 10 assault marines, need to dig into the old pile of shame box and see what I have.
Did someone think about the Primaris chaplain for the +1 to wound? This might be something worth considering, right? I want to try hin out in a unit of 3 bladeguard (1000pts game)
Greetings Commander!! I was wondering if you had looked at the newly released rules for the Thunderhawk? I have so little experience actually playing the game that I'm not sure if I'm actually qualified to say this, but I think it looks really good!! provided the points costs stay around 800 or so, I think it could be pretty effective! just abilities wise, it's about the equivalent of 2 land raiders. Weapons look like they will be fairly effective, and if units that can deepstrike (i.e. terminators and jump pack units) are interred, then they can charge after disembarking. If I'm reading the flyers rules correctly, they also only have a minimum movement rule, which means you could literally drop off any unit inside within 1 or 2 inches for guaranteed charges, and also have a FUCK TON of firepower to back up whatever else is there. Now that vehicles are also a lot tougher, and flyers don't just get shot out of the sky (by flamers for some reason!!) I think the Thunderhawk might actually be good! Provided it's not like... 1400 points or something fuckin stupid!!
I now think that SG are just not quite worth it at 43 points, when we have other options. I'm gonna run 10 Jump-pack Assault Marines, with a JP Priest to give them a 5+++ and additional -1 AP. Also running 10 Death Company with Lemartes, giving them -1 to incoming damage. I'm gonna run both of these units up the field, backed up by a lot of shooting.
Also, I really like having 1 squad of Incursors, because if they hit an enemy unit, it gives ranged attacks in your army +1 to hit against that enemy unit. Useful for lots of things but especially for Indirect Fire.
Dante's battleshock with -1 has been really useful for me in stopping combat interrupt. Something to think about.
I like Dante alot I think. Just not paired to SG.
The reality is prob what the Art of War guys are saying, that melee is just significantly weaker in 10th and its a shooty edition. Not great for us
What's leading them to this conclusion? If so why are SG 43ppm?
Sanguary Priest is an option, he grants + 1 Ap....Im fielding him with a ten man vanguard squad with shields. Quite tough to kill thanks to the 5+ fnp. And with red rempage stratagem they were quite killy as well. Thanks to their toughness and the points I think they are our best jump pack unit right now.
I am really wanting to try Dante, +10 VV, + a SP, maybe next week?!
I think running chaplains in many of the melee units is important. Constant +1 to wound even on subsequent turns of combat is very good IMO. Not possible for sangguard obviously.
Commander do you have a LandRaider Redeemer? I’m building it hoping the Hvy Flame sponsons will do lots of D since they ignore cover. Load Mephiston attached to Assault Intercessors and a Sang priest attached to 5 man Primaris death comp
Let me know how you get on with the Redeemer, that I want to try!
I was painting my Powerfist plasma pistol death company as i watched, I think the 3+ hit and the High AP and mid strength of plasma will be nice too
A 10 man squad?
@@ba_commander Just a 5 man, Wanted to test them out with a Chaplin into Armour even 4s to wound hurt
The land raider with flame cannons seems like it would be pretty nuts
While I do think that looks the best for a Land Raider, it's points seem kinda nuts?
Ya felt the same. The sanguinary gaurd in the game I played got killed super easy and did not very much.
What army were you facing?
@@ba_commanderdeath guard. The got killed very easy by big blob of pox walkers and typhus
Thank you for the cool video. Interesting thoughts 🤔.
So now we have 3 choices? Paying around black rage, playing like simple chapter with Gladius (cuz that a bit powerful, then sons of sang), and 3d choice is the sons of sanguinius.
Hmm, it's interesting which choice could be better on games.
I understood your pain abot Gladius is better, but I think we're should using the powerful things for our lovly legion.
P.S. Tycho and Gabriel Seth Flesh Tearers is a D tier? 😮
Tycho is awesome, maybe he'll get his own video this edition! :P
Death Company at least get inherent rerolls to hit with the hammers... I think we need as much Devastating Wounds as possible...Sadly Astorath's Mass of Doom is a one a game thing, but Power fists come with Inferno pistols - which will help I guess...
I think 10 PF/IP is optimal now, when TH get hit with -1 to hit their reliability goes out the window fast?
@@ba_commander add in a Chaplain with Jump pack with +1 to Wound and it’s back to normal BA almost in a SoS Detachment…need to build heavy into SoS, not for the Str but for the extra Att…!
Speaking of Whirlwind, I was looking at the hidden gem - the Thunderfire Cannon
Do you think it is good since it can worsen 4" of threat range to any target and thus synergize with our high mobility.
It certainly looks better than it did before :) It's damage output is poor, I guess how valuable the movement changing is potentially worth it.
You don’t need a range weapon on voidsman to be eligible to shoot its in the core rules. As long as it hasn’t fell back or advanced it’s eligible
I thought you needed an assault weapon to be eligible after the advance?
john, what do you think about running a callidus assassin, its confusion strat is spicey!
It's a decent strat for sure, I don't know if I feel the Assassin has much killing power though?
@ba_commander im thinking its worth 115 to mana manipulate and hold backfield objective, plus its a lone operative
Aristian of war gives +1 AP on top of a Model goes to SV2+ would be nice on judicar however it’s only one model
Yeah that doesn't help me much!
I think the key of the Blood Angels right now It's the Red Rampage stratagem. Thank you for the help Commander.
I mean it'll burn a ton of your CP!
@ba_commander as a BA successor player I'm thinking Gladius Task Force because I'm not taking Dante or any BA characters and I think SG are crazy expensive, I like the look of DC but haven't played yet in 10th, honestly a squad of DC with 4 or 5 thunder Hammers and jump packs for 155 is not bad, still on the fence about SG, kinda sucks not taking at least 5
@@CanadianHunter69 Lemartes or Astorath with an unit of 5 or 10 DC with some hammers charging with red rampage (Repeat charges, letal hits, devastating wounds, repeat hits, +1 to wounds, +1 attack and Str) are u horus come hereeee!!!
@@ba_commander I think Captains sometimes are a good investment for free stratagems, i think we sometimes have to bake into the math/tacticaltheorycrafting what adding Red Rampage brings when we coimpare X and Y characters - the Jump pack one for 100 points giving +1 STR on the charge and free Red Rampage while himself having 6 attacks with a Thunder hammer on the charge is nothing to sneeze at.
Also the only way to play the stratagem multiple times in 1 turn.
Gladius version of red rampage is better
I found sang guard to be really durable in combat (hive tyrant and hive guard only killed one model). But they die to shooting pretty quickly still. That said, with armour of contempt on them they still took a lot of punishment.
I wouldn’t use eldar as a point of comparison as they’re just busted atm.
A few others have mentioned Aeldari as a bad point of reference :)
Sadly the Land Raider`s datacards say charge after a normal move so we cant Advance it then Charge, but i guess the - setup within 3" - makes up for that and we can disembark closer then 9" anyway
And brothers the fact that we dont have to wait for turn 3 for Tactical Doctrine any longer dont mean we have to rush onwards like some traitorous World Eaters or a mindless crazed SpeedWAAAAGH!
Smart sneaky setup, some patience and to strike when the iron is hot will always be benefical.
Alot have changed but the fact that Blood Angels win games in turn 3, 4 & 5 i think will remain written in stone also for 10:th edition.
See I was thinking of going much harder on alpha strike now I don't have to twiddle my thumbs for 2 turns ;)
I had a bad time running Dante with 5 Sang Guard. The true allstars of my army were Jump Chaplain with 5 Jump Assault Squad. The opponent really underestimates them. They multicharged 3 Eradicators and 5 Intercessors and whiped all but 2 Intercessors from all the Hammer of Wrath mortals plus the Chaplain's mortals then cut them apart with volume of chainsword attacks with +1 wound. Giving the sergeant the Astartes Shield to tank on the 4+ invuln save lasted a surprising amount of time.
Interesting, go figure jump pack marines is about the only squad I don't have painted lol.
Love the vid. I think Gladius is better then the Blood Angels Detachment atm.
I'm sorta feeling the same way!
Anyone got any advice for getting a Judiciar into assault doctrine so it can be extra killy? Painting a blob of BGV's to go with him.
I mean there's a strat to put a unit into Assault Doctrine right? But not for the SoS detachment.
@@ba_commander Got to say I'm leaning more Gladius...
Hi John. Who did you use to bring the booklets? Cheers
You mean print?
@ba_commander yeah. My bad, not sure why I wrote that 🤣😅
@@bb7115 I just used my shitty home printer and some card. Some people having been using Snap fish.
@ba_commander lol ah ok. It looked high quality. I will have a look at the snapfish. Cheers
How about Mephiston and Assault Intercessors in a Land Raider John?
I mean maybe? I need to re-read the rules on Advance and Charge and how that works with disembarking!
@@ba_commander The Land Raider’s assault ramp rule allows you to diaembark and charge. It’s definitely much tougher than an Impulsor.
I play successors, and really dont think I will be taking any Sanguinary Guard, rather spend the points on Troops or anything else tbh...How the hell do I take a chapter master in 10th btw? Or is that gone too? How do I upgrade a Captain or is that gone? I feel like Gladius Task Force is the best option. For BA Successors I think Sanguinary Guard are a no go just looking at the info. Maybe for real Blood Angels like you said, a 5 man squad, a shame because I love them as models and lore.
And enhancement can be applied to a captain. And Dante is now our one and only chapter master. No more homebrewing your own. For better or worse.
@vze52fss that sucks for me, I like Dante but homebrews make 40k fun, they should have had a Chapter Master Profile for Space Marines IMO
I fear you are right about the gladius/sons of sanguinius detachments. I wonder if they've made the chapter specific detachments weaker so people don't run them to tournaments and effectively only the gladius/future generic detachments need to be balanced for competitive play?
I doubt that was the plan. I just think they’ve created a gulf between strength and toughness.
Not a fan that Powerfists are now 1 per 5 sang guard. Mine were built all with fists and I really don't feel like popping those off to replace with swords or buying more Guard to rebuild them. Over all pretty happy with so far with Blood Angels and 10th.
Like the Death Company with their bolt pistols/ bolters. Every 3 or 4 editions, we get a major change to our units. Sanguinary Guards got their banner, then it was out of the squad, now it’s back… Powerfist is the same. They always want you to buy more minis to cover all the configurations.
I am almost at the point of giving up on WYSIWYG....
What do you think of Gabriel Seth, a Sang Priest, and 10 Vanguard Vets in some kind of transport?
It would have to be a LR or Repulsor right? It could work!
@@ba_commander 12 can go in a Rhino, but I'm thinking a LR Redeemer🔥
They are 💯 gonna faq the “when model is leading a unit” rule
Into what you think?
@@ba_commandergonna become something like “model has lethal hits and when attached to a unit grants lethal hits to them”
They may be good but I just can't bring myself to play the nerf gun guys.
Thoughts on Bladeguard in a drop pod?
I like it, I was thinking I need to make the drop pod I've had lying about for a year maybe this weekend!
@@ba_commander Stolen part of this idea from Hyperspace Hobbies but a Command Squad tooled up with Astartes shields and led by a captain or chaplain coming out of a drop pod would be very, very annoying.
I think the BA melee units would feel better in Sons of Sanguinius with the +1 attack on charge...more so than Gladius...
Gladius video coming Friday! Recording it last night!
Jon, wouldn't Astorath be better into a 5/10 man brick of double chain sword DC? The devasting wounds would be rediculous on that amount of attacks with reroll hits, no? Would just blend most infantry blobs id guess.
Edit: Just checked the app, Chainswords don't give extra attacks anymore I guess. Why would we ever take them now?
Extra chainswords don't give extra attacks now my friend.
@@ba_commander Wow, I will have to commit that change to memory when I do melee combat with Assault intercessors now 🤣.
I don't like Sanguinary guard much after trying them as a 5 man. Ive moved Dante over to the Vanguard veterans with a sang priest and I'm liking it a lot better. Judicar with BG is super nice too paired with the Lib dread teleporting them into action to make up for their poor mobility.
I need to try the teleporting BGVs for sure. Tell me is your VV squad a 10 man?
@@ba_commander yup sure is.
Try the Baal flamed out. It feels excellent for 125
Mainly for overwatch? How did you use it?
@@ba_commander I advanced it straight up the board T1 and wrecked his movement for his first turn. It's just such a threat it really forces the OP to move around it. It hung around for a turn before it got Oath'd.
It melted 3 Bladeguard and a couple of wounds of the cpt, tho admittedly I hit 11 for the HF and 3+3 cannon
I think I would definitely take the Baal Flamestorm for Overwatch potential, but would likely stick to the Heavy bolter sponsons for the consistent shots and bit of range...Great movement blocker as you said!
@@HighlandPhoenix it's just a massive headache for what feels like a relatively cheap throwaway unit. I'm sure I've heard the expression "distraction carnifex" in 40k vernacular, it feels very much that way. They cant just leave it there but its hardly a priority target. Overwatch in movement is huge, I only came back to the game in 9th so I was surprised just how much that was relevant
i played a game as ultramarines against tyranids i ran roboute guilliman and he’s 355 something points and he got killed by a winged hive tyrant which is 195pts that just seems a bit unbalanced some things are very undervalued for what they can do and it wasn’t really close either g man got wrecked when he should have destroyed just in this new edition the balance is way off
also bloody guilliman doesn’t even get a feel no pain which he really should
Im just hoping that whenever our actual codex drops, we wont feel as if we have pillows taped to our fists anymore.
Agreed!
Man. It feels like our hawkboys really got nerfed. I hope they fix some of these issues (sang guard still need the invul) and tone down those pesky eldar mortal wounds.
Eldar MW are horrific atm.
Is smoke a strat?
It's a core strat in the main book!
I am presuming you want to keep your librarian dread on the back end...Use a Phobos librarian and an Infiltrator squad to hide it. Its not very Blood Angels, but neither are Blood Angels ATM
How does the Librarian hide it sorry?
Can I use the strategems from Gladius and Sons of Sanginius together?
And the Sanguinius Guard and Vanguard is to expensive for that what they can do.
the good old Assault Marines are cheaper and have more and stronger Attacks by the same attack rolls..
I don't understand why the Sanguinius Priest is more expensive than the Chief Priest... Brother Corbulo. He gives +1 Attack instand +1 AP...
And why can the Sanguinius priest not lead the Guard?
to the list...
I think you need 10 Assault intercessoren, lead by a lt and with a Sanguinius Priest.
+5 FNP, +1 on ap, and Lethal Hits from the lt. you get 2 E Fist or Thunderhammers.
this in your Land Raider...
Sanguinius Guard? And Dante? The enemy has s LoS to this Guys, they're death before they can do anythink.
(both Charge Rolls doesn't work...)
A 2nd Terminator Squad has more meelepower ... and with the Teleporthomer and your Liberian Dread they are there, where they needed.
Yes Astorath my unending faith in that finecast axe abomination is proven true once again. Also death company intercessors being sooty puts them in consideration with the overwatch thing they have
10 DC Ints?
@@ba_commander for what they can do it’s a cheep and effective pick at least from where I’m looking at things from (haven’t played them this edition so I can’t say anything definitive)
2 characters give -1 AP, jump librarian, and jump sang priest, and honestly from the math i have done it looks like the best power per point you can do with them is put them on just regular assault marines. Sadly we are limited to 3 assault squads.
On Sang guard, it honestly blows my mind you cant put a sang priest with his actual GUARD that is his BODYGUARD.
Im strongly Considering trying out command squads, without any attached models just to get a tanky unit with heal, and ok firepower from combi weapons, and ok melee via champion. I unno, I like the idea of 3 storm shields and 3 combi weapons, but i really would love to put a captain in there, but sang guard NEEDS a captain to not be UTTER trash.
Im not sure how the balance between Gladius vs Blood Angel Detachment. But considering how WILDLY unbalanced the game is currently for different armies, its not a surprise.
(cough eldar, cough admech)
I don't think we need an invul on SG. AP went down, they already got a 2+, which can become 1+ in cover. You'd need to dump -3/-4 AP into them to even get to that potential invul. It would give them nothing and only increase their points further.
They said a bunch of time this edition is less killy, in practice I don't buy that, both games I've played I was pretty much wiped off the table in 2 turns.
@@ba_commander To be fair, you faced two factions in your first games, which are (among) the best in current index hammer. I agree, melee is not that powerful anymore and we need to find others strategies to win than in 9th.
After enhanced the gold armor in 9th edition where many BA players get plenty of them (good sell on golden boy) they are now useless. We must buy new units to play in 10th edition.
Sad...
I'm sure SG will come down a bit in cost, they aren't viable at 43ppm.
Or a new « Primarised » Sanguinary Guards, new models, differents rules and points…
I dont think comparing BA to Eldar is the way to evaluate BA. Eldar are just broken, and nothing will perform against them.
Good to know! I was worried!
Maybe a match against Aeldari isn't something to draw much information out? I just watched a BatRep with a competitive Imperial Knights list vs a completely casual Aeldari list and the Knights got nuked as early as turn 2. It's just completely ridiculous. I for my part won't play against Aeldari until they got nerfed. Just a waste of valuable lifetime.
Well many more battles to come I guess :) I hope Aeldari do get pulled down a notch!
The 1+ strength just isn't very relevant for high toughness stuff
It really isn't...
“Into the maelstrom strode Ordamael. He ignored the larger beasts, saving his efforts for those creatures that could be harmed by his weapons.” -The Devastation of Baal 😎 By the Blood are we made strong. Don’t give up. Always be charging!
Man, I'm sorry your first game was against Eldar. This index sounds like a disaster. What the hell were they thinking with all those mortal wounds?
Who knows…
i think a lot of this is maybe pinch of salt because no Unit in the game should be able to Mortal wound a unit off the board for 85 points
Couldn't agree more. Especially 5 TERMINATORS....
local community casual games, eldar are tabling people turn 3 ... broken as it gets
They lasted a turn longer than I did…
10 man sqaud with mephiston in a repulser
Assault Intercessors?
@@ba_commander yea i guess you wont be getting the assault out of it, but being able to move that squad around in armor might make up for it and if you set up a supporting unit to follow behind and ether gets charged you can hop em back in the repulser and the repulsers guns aint to bad
Gladius seems better for the moment
Tactical / Assault Doctrine seems really good.
I think if played the right way, our BA detachment can do some serious damage. I played nids for my first time last week and fucked up a bit early on and lost( 1 bad list choice,2 sloppy oath of moment targets. Next game imperial knights,list-
1 x Incursors x 5
3 x DC 5 man squads all hammers
2 x assault sqaud
1 x 3 eliminators
1 x 5 devastators, 2 lascannons, 2 missile launchers
Dante
2 x jump chaplains
1 x executioner
1 x predator anihilator
1 x dreadnought, lascannon, missile launcher
I’ll see how we go. Towering rules seem scary 🤣🤣🤣
Towering is seriously scary! Which detachment did you use my friend?
@@ba_commander the sons of sanguinius detachment