That gas manifold just dangling there like a Christmas tree ornament. Whoever installed that and thinks that's okay and the inspector who passed off on this work needs to be banned from ever working in the industry again. This is borderline criminal negligence and the homeowners should take legal action against the builder and the sub-contractor who installed that catastrophe.
I'm an old Electrical out of NJ but am also Certified in HVAC due to me sailing as a Chief Engineer in the Merchant Marine. A couple of years ago we had the entire HVAC system replaced in our Ranch stile home in Central Florida, I did tell the guys on my experience but stepped back and didn't say anything accept for buying lunch for the crew while they were here. After they were "Done" with the install and told me how great my new system was, I went up in the attic for a quick look around. I was only up there for a minute when I knew how this was going to go, they had left runs off and had others bent so tight that there was no air flow. I told them that someone had better check this "Completed" system before anyone left. Long story short but they had 2 crews at my home for another 3 days. The saving grace in all of this is the Service Tech that I have is worth his weight in gold!
I'm not even an HVAC technician and that flex duct setup just left me shaking my head. The amount of friction that air has to overcome has to be astronomical
Oh man, leave us hanging! Definitely need a follow up video on this one. All that ductwork seems crazy and actually more cost and effort than doing it right.
What a wonderful looking neighborhood. Ranch houses. Us baby boomers need ranch houses. My knees are so bad and ranch houses are so hard to find that I am having to build one because no one else is. And you find a whole neighborhood full.
As an electrical contractor for 25 years with 43 years experience in construction it has always been amazing to me that my State does not require licensing for General Contractors. I know I am completely liable for any electrical work I do but these jokers who oftentimes negotiate with every sub to build and complete a project just skate away with nothing to lose except the relatively small chance of being sued successfully. If, as the General Contractor, there was more responsibility for All work performed there would be less hack work like this.
As a state employee for a major university and 15 years of private sector hvac service and install work I have found that big name contractors are just as big of hacks as moonlighters when code compliance does not apply( or EPA). None have figured out how to wire an encoder properly and it is comical.
yeah but it's so damn expensive, the time involved is insane simply because it's already sealed and insulated. Ripping it out and starting over is such a monumental task that just accepting the decreased efficiency is more cost effective. It's the main reason I'm so pissed at new construction where I'm at, they're all shit at ductwork and once it's in, it's not going anywhere. So often I have to tell customers that they got the raw end of the deal with the HVAC in their 3 year old house.
HVAC contractor here, and we see this kind of result from builders all the time. Criminal doesn't begin to describe this kind of craftsmanship. We are supposed to check heat rise, gas leaks, and airflow, among so many other things prior to "completing" any installation. My guess is you've got business lined up throughout that "new" neighborhood. "Out of warranty?" That builder shouldn't be profiting from dangerous and shoddy work like that. It's shameful and it sets the industry back with regard to respect and professionalism.
There is no professionalism or craftsmanship in building homes anymore, the faster they go up the more they can build and the more money they make on the crap they put up.. here in eastern part of West Virginia we have a big builder company ( Dan Ryan) he buys up all the land and puts hundreds of homes on it and the homes within a year are falling apart.. its sad to see..
This is what happens when builders only concern is maximizing profit. Hiring unskilled labor is rampant. Unfortunately with the overall housing shortages In many major cities I don’t imagine the sub par labor situation changing anytime soon.
This is what happens when you ring the very last dollar out of the project, driven from the top down. Have seen it a few times here in New Zealand 🇳🇿 when companies are taken over by Americans. First thing that happens are job cuts etc. You then get a brain drain due to working conditions and it just perpetuates from there.
Great video Ted, that ductwork made me cringe. Most of the new homes seem to be slapped together as quick and dirty as possible, I’d be pissed too if I bought that mess. I’d like to see a part 2 on this one if they approved the repairs. Well done sir.
I have done a lot of duct cleaning in new construction. It is amazing how many times I've found coils plugged with sheetrock dust, sawdust, and other debris. I've also seen ductwork that could have been taken out and put in properly with about half the material and it would have worked much more efficiently. I remember one where the homeowner said it looked like someone blew up a spaghetti factory.
I was changing some light switches in my friends brand new $million dollar home when I dropped a screw in the floor register. When I opened it up I found a pile of drywall scraps, a pile of dust, and a coffee cup. I was fucking livid. I wanted to talk to the builder myself but she wouldn’t let me
Totally agree. My old boss. Would not allow the HVAC system to use while any sheet rock or floor sanding was going on. He actually had in contract that it was not allowed to be use so we had disabled the system a couple times. GC would be pissed but unless they want to ruin homeowners equipment and duct , oh well...
This happens in New construction all the time because once the house gets gas and electric meters hooked up. The GC calls us out to start up the equipment to get the house conditioned to Temp for the floors, paint and any thing else. Filters can only pick up so much dust and the h/o is left with dealing with the after affects.
@@smacleod69 As a contractor could you build a portable return filter, say a 1in at whatever the contracter could find, then maybe a 5in merv 10 and a 5in merv 13 or 16? Put it fine print that builder pays for filters if they need the unit used during certain times? Plug the returns and us this filter setup? Just spit balling . As I know completely and thoroughly how some builders care about the new home owners, ha ha! I was a flooring installer and hvac was definitely needed to prevent material failures.
Shame on the lazy HVAC inspector for the city that probably never climbed up to look at that rats nest. That would have been a red tag fail in our area on many counts.
If they did a rough hvac inspection on the build out it would have been visible from the ground before drywall and insulation went up. I’m not a fan of the flex duct systems used in the south however I’m sure it would run and pass code if it was sized, installed, and hung correctly
want to hear the result as well. Its possible the homeowner could go back to the builder to get this paid for since it poor installation causing the problems
You are absolutely correct,the 325-3 can handle 100,000 btus with a single gas appliance & max out at 150,000 btus with multiple appliances ( not sure why you get 50,000 BTUs more when you add extra appliances (?)). So yes it is too small for this application.A 325- 5 should be used on this CSST manifold & a separate 325-5 used for the tankless water heater. Working and lockup pressures should always be taken when dealing with any regulators plus manifold pressures at the gas appliances. I usually set the Regulators at about 7"working pressure ( all gas appliances on) & check lock up pressure (all appliances off) to make sure I don't have a creeping regulator.
rite from the maxitrol spec sheets: "Total load of multiple appliance combined 325-3L (3/8”, 1/2”): 250,000 Btu/h;" "Largest single appliance served by the regulator: 325-3L: 140,000 Btu/h;" I'm not sure where you got your specs from but maxitrol spec sheet differs.
@@mackb.8262 yep. Its 250k. Nothing wrong with this reg. They either have low pressure gasline or undersized gaslines. The first tee is going to the tankless, guaranteed.
@@mackb.8262 You're looking at two different regulators is why. The 325L series, is a line regulator meant to feed multiple appliances and falls under a different ANSI spec than the 325 which is an appliance regulator. You can tell the one in the video is the L series because of the yellow banding around the adjustment stem.
@@ozm8642 Undersized gas from the meter. Assuming this is a typical 5.5-8.5 inwc service, what looks like a 1" coming in to that mess, and guessing about 40 equivalent feet of piping from the meter. You are only looking at pushing 243 CFH which is a touch over 243k btu of gas for all four of those runs.
Nobody has any pride in their workmanship. My father was a bricklayer and used to say that if you hung these guys for being bricklayers you'd be hanging innocent men.
Homeowners can only notice if they experience a full year of seasons. But it so happens that right at the end of that year after a homeowner finally realizes what's going on, the warranty expires.
Wow, it would be easier to start fresh, Leave the furnace, put a proper plenum and cold air return box. At 90,000 btu,even if you put in a single ceiling return grill, it would be loud, don't you use insulated steel ducts. The resistance with flex is about, 30foot equiv, to 10 feet of steel pipe, for a 10 foot section. A nice home with only a single stage gas valve vs 2 stage. I won't even comment on the lack of insulation, I am from Ontario, Canada, the price of heating and cooling goes up but you only have to insulate once.
That was not a case of out of warranty that was a criminal case. The quality of an installers shoddy and bad work are a good and direct reflection of the contractor who owns the company. Everything that goes wrong up in an attic or under a crawlspace is 100% in every situation direct responsibility and result of the owner of the company. All fines and levees and penalties should also levied against the builder he’s responsible for picking the cheapest bid. But this is why Ted picks up new lifelong customers fixing work like this and making a customer happy.
The whole ducting system needs to be redone.. the gas lines were poorly designed.. What a hack. If this is what you produce on a blank slate, you don't belong in the industry.
I enjoy these videos--and I think they only really can help your business and reputation--especially on those 2nd or 3rd opinion calls. I am a surgeon and recorded all my operations and gave a copy of the recording to the patient so we could talk about exactly what was done and why. It became part of the medical record--and it built trust between the patient and me. Keep on recording. Thank you.
That's what I would do, plus legal costs of course. They'd probably settle out of court quick, fast, and in a hurry. They keep on doing it because they keep on getting away with it.
@@purplegoose7907 wrong, they would get a %, if that state has a Consumer Protection Dept you wouldn't need it, but repub states generally don't because they don't care about people, it's profits and rip offs for rich guys, they don't protect the consumer at all, most of the major issues in HVACR are in states with no regulations and no licensing, you can't learn this trade anymore by riding in some clowns truck, you need basic skills training and factory training for the rest of your career, I know, I was a factory rep for Carrier, techs that called from states that had regulations and licensing that needed help had already checked things out and were truly stumped, techs from states that didn't were a joke, questions like "the blower doesn't run" so I ask "what's the voltage going to it" reply "I don't know" "where's your meter?" "in the truck", or my favorite on many calls "what's the voltage coming out of the transformer" tech reply - ""uh, 24 a good 24" there and then I know several things, he doesn't know what he's doing and either has no meter or doesn't know how to use it, he's a hack, a parts changer, never been properly trained and in fact most of the deaths on the job in HVACR are in states with no regulations or training requirements. Florida for example, requires nothing, the owner has to register as a contractor, he can hire anyone to do any HVACR work, it's a joke.
@@purplegoose7907 They would more than likely fix it and give you some boot. They wouldn't like this video sent anonymously by third party, to their customers after the home owner posted it without naming any contractors, to protect them selves from liable. And certainly they would have a thorough home inspection, to see if their lives are in danger from other faulty systems that were not installed properly.
I live in a house built in the mid 1860s...i can't imagine living in one of these cookie cutter houses that are built as quickly and cheaply as possible. This house is so well built it blows my mind and the new construction is so cheap it's pathetic.
yelorsirhc, our house was completed in 1900. Huge beams for the framework, and NOT 1 nail in the frame. Its all mortise and tenon with a 1" dowel pin in each joint. I am an HVAC installer/ service tech so I go under a LOT of houses, I've seen a 5 year old house that was ready to fall apart. But I've never seen another like the one we bought. TOTALLY SOLID. If yours is 1860 then YOU understand exactly what I mean.
My grandma lives in an 1887 farm house and it's dead solid after all these years, was converted from wood stove to boiler heat at the turn of the century and finally got air conditioning near the next turn of the century, my old house was built in 1892 and what did it in was termites, constantly had a moisture problem and the landlord was too cheap to fix it, and I'm in the process of buying a house that was built near the turn of the century and still doesn't have central air, house is solid as a rock, zero drafts and a surprisingly high insulation value, luckily I have a sizeable stash of window units ranging in age from 1981 up to 2001
I know what your saying. My house was built in 1970 and when you go into the attic, you can see the size of the rafters that you can't find in a new house.
I don't work in residential construction (Industrial) by I can tell this man knows his stuff. Subbed for the great trouble shooting. Looking forward to a part 2 update.
The fact that inlet volume dropped so significantly when adjusting the control valve says it all. Props for chasing it down instead of condemning the whole thing. Most companies around here just see that as a prime opportunity to sell a system. That’s why I work in refrigeration and food equipment, lol.
That is only 1/3 of the problem though(Gas/Airflow/Crappy ducting). As he stated there is almost no air flow. That rise in outlet temperature will make a difference but not much.
That's the problem/benefit of a new system, you can't "just replace the whole thing." Of course on the other side of the coin you can't assume it worked OK before you got there, as I've often heard from my service manager, because this looked like it never worked right to begin with.
Reminds me of this vacant 1890s home I showed twice to clients last January 2021. Had an 80% furnace that was running non-stop for at least the 3 weeks that we visited. Seemed to be clicking on and off. Noticed the ductwork for return in the basement was all opened up. That was the least of that home's problems. I told the listing broker. No one cared, I guess they didn't mind a high gas bill. Needless to say it never sold and it went back as a rental unit. Heat probably hasn't ever stopped running a year later, either.
With the market the way it is I'm surprised it didn't sell. Our real-estate agent a couple times was wondering if the listing agents had ever been to the properties because of how awful condition some stuff was, including a flooded basement that was audibly squishing on carpet but still up for sale with bidding wars. Also other fun things seen included animal-poop on carpets and a dead bird in a garage.
@@matthewmiller6068 This home in particular was a bit odd. We have a hot real estate market but sometimes it's not hot enough for even the most weird of things. In this home none of the bedrooms had closets either, lots of mice poop everywhere, even found a hefty bag of Mari Jane in the kitchen cabinets. The home was remodeled sometime 30 years in the past but it was horribly outdated. A lot of things that just didn't fit the home especially for the price they wanted.
Before condemning the Reg. and gas valve on the furnace, you should confirm the outdoor Reg. on the meter is properly sized. It is not-common, but it has happened and would cause what you were seeing. That and tell them to engage the builder for a ducting Re&Re, either in good faith or through litigation, that is straight up B.S.
This attic looks like the underside of my house. I don’t have any issues with the air, but my dryer vent line is buried in between all the hvac flex tubing. I’ve had to slither underneath the flex to reach the dryer vent when we first moved in because the line was full of rock hard lint. Great video my friend. This was very enlightening.
Our second home was about 15-years-old when we bought it. The house was warm enough, mostly because the insulation is superb. But it seemed as if the furnace worked overtime. One night I smelled gas. The manifold cracked and the gas company shuttle furnace down. When the replacement furnace came, the installers noticed something odd about the old furnace. It was actually a furnace for a small, modular home - and it was five years older than the home.
Retired HVACR Mechanic here. Industrial Commercial common occurence. 3MBtu airhouse off an 8in suppy supply regulated for 1.5MBtu... contractors do what they do... Learned real quick if insufficient heat up you go and start reading regulator specs..95 times out a hundred Undersized regulators. Nice catch and if course gas valve destroyed by over adjustment.. At least it ain't 1.5in valve. They ain't so east to replace in top of an automobile assembly plant or a chicken processor!
I actually hired a smart trade guy, ordered a good man heat pump and air handler. Had the whole thing delivered and installed for around $3500. Our energy company also gave a $2500 rebate. Working great for the past 2 years. I paid the guy about $50 an hour. Quotes for the same thing from local companies was over 10k.
Thank you for sharing this video and being a truly professional and honest person. It's so sad that we are living in a time when some people no longer care about what kind of service and product they are getting paid to provide to their customers.
Use that manometer to check the external static pressure of the furnace. That will diagnose your airflow issues. Even if that burners are heating correctly, the airflow issue needs to be addressed before a compressor fails.
There is NO WAY that system passed an inspection. That builder had his inspector "BUDDY" give it a free pass. I've been an HVAC installer and service man for 16 years and I have seen many like this. We just rip it out and "HARD PIPE " it all. There is NO EXCUSE for work like that. And that unit should have came WITH a 10 year warranty. Most likely the builder didn't register the unit. I know a builder here in Alabama that actually has over 30 units registered in his name, so that it was covered NO MATTER who bought the house. TOTALLY LEGAL . TOTALLY LEGITIMATE.
Builder grade work. A house that I got had 4 inch ducting running from the kitchen vent, typically that is 8 inch. When I upgraded the hood and exhaust from the builder grade stuff I had to upgrade everything including the roof cap to 8 inch, one of the things when we made the deal on the house was that I needed to set aside a few thousand to do this work and we actually got it.
With that setup you will never get enough gas to run everything. We do not install a regulator inside a house. The Black Iron pipe coming in from the meter 1 1/4 inch to 1 1/2 inch to a manifold to each gas run.. I run no plastic or copper inside and no flex pipe. All for safety reason.
Actually a 2lb system will give you more gas than you would ever need in a home this size but you would need proper regulators and an installation that meets the National Fuel Gas code ( it's quite obvious this installation falls short in a lot of ways). I'm not really sure why this particular gas utility allows 2-pound systems in homes with small to moderate gas loads. It's apparent you deal with mainly low pressure Delivery Systems of about 7", which is a tried-and-true system that's been around for over 150 years but it's sad to say they're always trying to find different ways to cut cost.
I stumbled across your video. I'm always impressed when a professional simply knows his/her stuff and can ID the flow rate of a regulator just by looking at it. Keep up the good work.
When I was a contractor I had one inspector that was ever worried about HVAC. I don't really think any of the others knew what was going on. We had a big advantage in that we had basements and nothing much was up in the trusses. If I'm honest I didn't know much about HVAC until the fourth house I built when I put geothermal in a spec. What a nightmare. It wasn't the furnace, it was the ductwork. Probably 40% of the return air was coming under the basement door. Thank heavens the manufacturer got involved. They sent an engineer and resized the returns. I was lucky. I learned a lot.
This job is screwed, I was in HVAC for over 50 years and an instructor and rep for Carrier, this has to go back to zero, load calculation, ductwork designed, gas lines checked for size, everything, maybe the builder has prints with some spec's, this is never going to be right, you might get it to work, but still, if the heat doesn't work with that poor excuse for ductwork the cooling def won't work, you need the btu/hr ratings for the home in heat and cool for that are, once the load calc is done then you can design the ductwork, and that unit may not end up being the right size. Also in your area hopefully you have a Dept of Consumer Protection and local building inspector, WHO INSPECTED THAT AND GAVE IT A GO??? I'll bet you're in a state or locale that doesn't believe in govt regs or licensing trades, and this is the result. If these guys did all the units in that neighborhood what the what?? I can't see all the gas piping but it sure looks like they used PLENTY of pipe dope, again, like the ductwork, the gas line has to be checked, all appliances btu in rating added up, total =? and go from there, from the meter to that regulator, is that reg right?, etc, but be careful because if you crank down on the reg on the unit due to low press and then the pressure comes back, that reg is going to over feed the unit, wow, what a mess.
What's worse is...new construction installs are way less difficult to do than an existing home changeout by a good mile. Path of least resistance seems to be the core plan with this contractor.
did you not pay attention to the hacked mess of jumbled random trusses? you couldn't run a real trunk more than five foot without needing to use offset and large bends. by golly they designed it fast as hell, designed by junk computer program it seems and nobody looked it over nor cared too, likely a green/wet behind the ears/no field knowledge architect did the mess to start.
@@throttlebottle5906 It's a pointless hip roof cobbled together McMansion style. I bet it has a "stone" or brick front, and the cheapest vinyl siding on the sides and back. Builder-grade vinyl windows too... "Craftsmanship, function, and footprint-efficiency be damned, I want my money spent on making my house look like I won the lottery... or at least a scratch off..."
You made the best comment...(paraphrasing) you can have the best materials in the world, but if are clueless.. they become worthless. I have seen a great many new construction job. The vast majority are rigged up messes. What the average buyer doesn't realize is that incidents like this, of poor construction, are going to cost them a fair % of the cost of the home to repair. As an aside, did they run out of dimensional timber when they built that space. They have 2x3 support timber lapping into the joists and not into structural horizontal members fully integrated into the walls and supported by load bearing walls. On way to see this is the decking and exposed joists relative to where the ducts punch through to the lower floor.
As a retired electrician (UK based) who spent many many hours crawling through roofspaces while running cables, I can only say "Wow". The ducting and the joinery work in that roofspace must have been thrown together by people while they were blindfolded and had their hands tied behind their backs. It's easily the worst work I have ever seen - Newbuild, or otherwise.
I can't believe that with the poor air flow, that it won't be going off on high limit now. My first thought was somebody turned down the gas pressure for that reason
first time visitor here... I design homes in the U.S. and loved the commentary during your inspection... Bowl of spaghetti indeed... And whatsmore I second the lack of craftsmanship and experience in new home construction industry. Today's middle/upper class development is tomorrow's ghetto...
I am a stickler for duct work. I'm a lead installer and one thing guys can't to in my area is duct work. They size it too small and never have enough return. Looking at the supply with no main trunk. No wonder why the air flow sucks. Them techs don't check gas pressure or static pressure or fan speeds for that matter based on the size of the unit. See a lot of call for furnace cutting off and usually high limit because of all that crappy duct.
I personally have found some new construction errors..one time I went to a house no heat call. Went down and seen furnace running great but no air. After checking everything I found they had put a main supply outside thinking it was fresh air…lol..
In the fall of 1993 I was installing an instrumentation upgrade for CNG at its Lebanon, Ohio pump station. One cold morning they asked me if I'd mind driving to Washington Court House and troubleshooting a no heat issue in the office. The facility had been constructed earlier in the spring. When I removed the thermostat I found wiring on the AC side but nothing on the heat side. An hour later the office was warm and I was a hero. A day earlier I had troubleshot a no heat issue at Lebanon to a hot water check valve that had a piece of rubber holding it open resulting in a cold building. Sometimes it's the little things...
The amount of insulation looks like a problem also. Some places it looks like there's barely any. When our house was built a couple of young kids came out to blow the insulation into the attic. After they left I went up to check and there was hardly any in most of the places that were hard to get to. They probably figured nobody would ever bother to check. I made the owner of the insulation company come back and see for himself and correct the problem. Unfortunate that nobody ever checked on this person's house while it was being built.
This is they kind of work when a contractor hires his workers from the Home Depot parking lot. Untrained, unskilled. Just because you can physically hang or hammer, doesn't mean you know how to do it properly.
Since it was not heating properly I bet the gas logs were staying on full blast, if you were to close the gas line to the logs wouldn't that give more power to the furnace? At least as a temporary fix. Love your videos and your craftsmanship thank you for the upload
When I moved down here to the Dallas area I worked for a company who installed those systems the exact way I was there service technician smh . I can’t even tell you how many houses I went through and had to try to fix the problem and have the owner come out and argue with me about how shitty the install where needles to say I left them. I’m came from the Philly area we always had to run a plenum then flex to again 5 in or 4 in pipe . Out here they do whatever is cheapest.
I wanted to move to Colorado a couple years ago and ran into this company that only paid it's employees by their sales. I knew I wouldn't fit in at that company. I a lot like you, although I need to improve on my attention to detail. I take shortcuts like not using a nitrogen bleed as much as you do and probably should, but here's my point. I am very technically inclined, I love the work (most of the time when it's not 20 degrees outside working on a heat pump owe), I strive to double check my work and try to make sure I do a good job. And I always leave my work area cleaner than when I got there. It's really downheartening to see these companies who don't care about that , but about someone who can walk up and BS the customer into a new unit that they don't even need. I'm 59 and that's one of the things I've noticed about the AC industry lately. These incentives and bonuses for selling equipment, could cause a technician to be dishonest. I worked with one in Beaumont, Tx awhile back and he told me he took his zoom spout oiler and just squirted a little oil on the condensing unit, told them it was leaking, and sold them a new unit. He got an extra 50 dollars on his check for the sale, didn't have to work on the unit, and didn't even have to go back and install the stuff. The installers did all his work and he sticks money in his pocket. What a sorry %$@&%@ he was. The boss loved him though. Things like that make me really not like my chosen field, but it's just really good to see someone like myself who does just exactly what a unit needs to work again without trying to trick the customer into a sale. Faith in humanity restored.
I like flex, it's basically all we use in Florida nowadays for residential, aside from truck lines and mixing boxes for the most part. But when people do it like this and kink it everywhere and don't hang it properly it sucks. But it's so much easier than cutting and sizing duct board.
I have personally seen ac techs that couldnt even check for power properly. The guy had his meter on a PLASTIC disconnect asking me if it was off! Another trying to bs me into buying a whole new compressor when I already checked the cap. It was bad. I basically had to force the cap from him and put it on myself. Been working great for a few years.
The gas line had more connections than most European highways. Definitely bad job. As mikeselectricstuff said wouldn't be allowed in the UK. Gas lines free hanging, not allowed, to many fittings and the regulator being so far out that the pressure doesn't exist. These new construction sites are really bad, its about quantity and not quality, despite new legislation that is better. I don't think the inspector looked at that house. The one he saw was probably almost perfect, with hardly any filler or sealing agent, good connections and all clean straight lines, unlike that spaghetti bowl we just looked at. It's to bad :( and Sad!
Where I'm at, flex pipe is never supposed to be longer that 15 ft, and it's only supposed to be used to connect the main trunk to the register boots/diffusers. Also supposed to be well supported AND STRAIGHT!
Absolutely correct! As a Manual D and J instructor, this job was totally wrong on so many level’s. This is why we need strong HVAC state codes! Amateurs have no business destroying ours!!!!! Thanks 🤬
While this kind of work will keep you busy… you also have give the bad news to the homeowner. That can take more than HVAC skills! But I really like that you didn’t get rattled as you found things you didn’t like. You didn’t just get ticked off and start cussing and all that. Your approached the problem, you worked at finding the problem, and fixing the problem (what you can do now VS how you want to redo it the right way), not being the problem! Well done!
Long ti9me home inspector, on my new home construction I write the flex duct installation up as poor before I enter the home, if its above adequate I revise my report. This type of installation is way to common. Great find on the gas pressure.
Some of these "companies" that build 100's or even thousands of homes each year really do cheap out on anything they can. The problem is they take the lowest bid without asking questions. I am a landscaper. Last year, I installed 2 French Drains at 2 different residences, because their property was constantly flooded. The problem ended up being an UNDERGROUND WELL that wasn't capped. Many of their driveways in this neighborhood had been replaced within the first year, cracking and sinking. The concrete people they used thought it was ok to use 3 inches of base, and poured the driveways to an inch thick. These people are paying 400,000 dollars for these places and getting shafted so hard. It's disgusting
I go to new construction finding crap all the time, in fact I can’t remember any of them being good. When I tell the homeowner the ductwork needs replaced, they have a serious issue since the house is fairly new (as they should) Builders are to blame for this nonsense.
we live and we learn you cant blame them for trying. plenty of unproductive citizens on welfare out here with no purpose in life and your concerned about some butchers trying to make a living ?
@@VNOMOUSDYALISIS building a house I have to live in yes. I would be concerned. What is not concerning about poor craftsmanship? That is the better question I ask you. The house burned down but oh "he tried his best" .......... see how yiu sound ?
As someone who works for a company that does new construction. I can totally get that a system would be doing that. You would not believe the crap I have seen.
I would go to city hall and get a copy of the "approved" inspection and along with video you shot, show up at a city council meeting and start asking questions about the inspection process and the inspectors. (The owner that is)
Lol, the amount of pipe dope is crazy, that’s what’s plugging up your regulators. I do hvac commissioning for a living in the commercial world. I really need to start my own residential home commissioning business. I could really make an impact on these hacks that prey on new home owners.
This is a great example of a quality service call, done by someone that knows his profession! I really enjoyed this one! Remember kids, never use permanent heat for temporary heat! It’s not fair to the customer! 🐧
Imagine the energy savings our country could achieve if there was an incentive to have attics ductwork inspected and improved. This would be an actual “ build back better “
Warm air furnace stuffed in a ventilated attic. What complete garbage! At least they had a folding stairway and some OSB on the attic floor. Some of these new houses just have a 24x24 panel in a closet for access and no flooring except under the furnace.
In my area about 90% of homes have a single undersized return air duct and grill. Usually a 14" or 16" round flex duct. We are constantly installing a 2nd return air duct and grill so we can get proper airflow. I always start with a static pressure test.
That regulator was my first concern. Why do you need to regulate meter pressure? If you need to be regulated for gas logs the put it in the gas log line. Instead they made a manifold after the regulator. Then everybody gets regulated that's why they had the gas valve regulator cranked. The incoming pressure was to low. Your monometer showed you never got to the factory recommended pressure at 3.5" wc. Then all 👉All that flex needs to come out. Duct and hard pipe insulated. Good news though you can pull the membrane out of the flex and use that as pipe insulation. How did that pass inspection? Because where I'm at any flex longer that 3' gets violated.
Supply duct sizing looks like no one knows how to use a duct calculator. A given static is only good for an equivalent length of duct of 100 feet. When your equivalent length of duct is longer, you raise your static pressure to compensate. Or you will lose all of your pressure before you even get the other side of the house. All kinds of pressure problems, I swear those poor people were the ones the most sabotaged.
Ima an ACCA certified system design specialist . I live in NJ and I can tell you this is normal to see pretty much every where you go. Just rule of thumb stuff .
That is crazy to us in Wisconsin, that duct system would never be allowed here, lol. and who installs a 80% furnace in resi new construction these days???? And what do they insulate at there? R-19? LOL
I spent 2 years in HVAC as a helper/apprentice for a family friend during a building boom way back when. My site boss would have fired everyone on that crew that installed that system. It's like they looked at the laws of fluid dynamics and said "ok lets install this duct work exactly opposite of what this science and math says."
That gas manifold just dangling there like a Christmas tree ornament. Whoever installed that and thinks that's okay and the inspector who passed off on this work needs to be banned from ever working in the industry again. This is borderline criminal negligence and the homeowners should take legal action against the builder and the sub-contractor who installed that catastrophe.
Whoa there buddy 🤣🤣
the real shocker is that code enforcement allowed all that crap.
yep also city's fault
Wanna bet they didnt inspect it. We have commercial inspectors that we know what he will and won't check. They are lazy
In most southern states no one cares or even looks
Yeah, code enforcement is usually very detailed. Can't believe they missed this 🤣
The bigger shocker is that the general contractor allowed this sub on the job site in the first place
I'm an old Electrical out of NJ but am also Certified in HVAC due to me sailing as a Chief Engineer in the Merchant Marine. A couple of years ago we had the entire HVAC system replaced in our Ranch stile home in Central Florida, I did tell the guys on my experience but stepped back and didn't say anything accept for buying lunch for the crew while they were here. After they were "Done" with the install and told me how great my new system was, I went up in the attic for a quick look around. I was only up there for a minute when I knew how this was going to go, they had left runs off and had others bent so tight that there was no air flow. I told them that someone had better check this "Completed" system before anyone left. Long story short but they had 2 crews at my home for another 3 days. The saving grace in all of this is the Service Tech that I have is worth his weight in gold!
I'm not even an HVAC technician and that flex duct setup just left me shaking my head. The amount of friction that air has to overcome has to be astronomical
Yup flex is crap for flow. Plenums were too small...... Total crap install.
That unsupported gas piping looked terrifying. That would most likely be immediately condemned in the UK.
Yall don't even have a/c in the UK lol
At least it had a drip leg xD
Should be here in US as well but it all depends on the inspector
if you look closer, you can actually see that it is supported. there is a bracket that is secured to the truss.
Nobody cares what you do in the UK. We got rid of you in 1776.
Oh man, leave us hanging! Definitely need a follow up video on this one. All that ductwork seems crazy and actually more cost and effort than doing it right.
What a wonderful looking neighborhood. Ranch houses. Us baby boomers need ranch houses. My knees are so bad and ranch houses are so hard to find that I am having to build one because no one else is. And you find a whole neighborhood full.
As an electrical contractor for 25 years with 43 years experience in construction it has always been amazing to me that my State does not require licensing for General Contractors. I know I am completely liable for any electrical work I do but these jokers who oftentimes negotiate with every sub to build and complete a project just skate away with nothing to lose except the relatively small chance of being sued successfully. If, as the General Contractor, there was more responsibility for All work performed there would be less hack work like this.
As a state employee for a major university and 15 years of private sector hvac service and install work I have found that big name contractors are just as big of hacks as moonlighters when code compliance does not apply( or EPA). None have figured out how to wire an encoder properly and it is comical.
But i thought in the states you had to have a permit anything on your home but anyone can build it with no papers or qualifications?
Nice diagnosis Ted, that ductwork is unreal. I’m sure it’s not in the cards but it’s a tear out and start over job.
I bet the AC works realll niceee
Was thinking that would be best but it’s not usually what can happen. They should make an insurance claim or sue the builder. That is not acceptable.
yeah but it's so damn expensive, the time involved is insane simply because it's already sealed and insulated. Ripping it out and starting over is such a monumental task that just accepting the decreased efficiency is more cost effective. It's the main reason I'm so pissed at new construction where I'm at, they're all shit at ductwork and once it's in, it's not going anywhere. So often I have to tell customers that they got the raw end of the deal with the HVAC in their 3 year old house.
I agree. Crap like that makes me angry.
@@joea5183 sue the builder. That company hired shoddy lowest caliber workers and received premium fees.
HVAC contractor here, and we see this kind of result from builders all the time. Criminal doesn't begin to describe this kind of craftsmanship. We are supposed to check heat rise, gas leaks, and airflow, among so many other things prior to "completing" any installation. My guess is you've got business lined up throughout that "new" neighborhood. "Out of warranty?" That builder shouldn't be profiting from dangerous and shoddy work like that. It's shameful and it sets the industry back with regard to respect and professionalism.
There is no professionalism or craftsmanship in building homes anymore, the faster they go up the more they can build and the more money they make on the crap they put up.. here in eastern part of West Virginia we have a big builder company ( Dan Ryan) he buys up all the land and puts hundreds of homes on it and the homes within a year are falling apart.. its sad to see..
This is what happens when builders only concern is maximizing profit. Hiring unskilled labor is rampant. Unfortunately with the overall housing shortages In many major cities I don’t imagine the sub par labor situation changing anytime soon.
This is what happens when you ring the very last dollar out of the project, driven from the top down. Have seen it a few times here in New Zealand 🇳🇿 when companies are taken over by Americans. First thing that happens are job cuts etc. You then get a brain drain due to working conditions and it just perpetuates from there.
If I had of said that I would have been called a racist for telling the truth
Plenty of unskilled labor crossing the southern border. Thanks Joe. FJB
@@BernardBethea6339 what? Lol unskilled labor comes in all colors
Maybe a good time to start a home inspection company?
I'd like Holms on homes?
Great video Ted, that ductwork made me cringe. Most of the new homes seem to be slapped together as quick and dirty as possible, I’d be pissed too if I bought that mess. I’d like to see a part 2 on this one if they approved the repairs. Well done sir.
I have done a lot of duct cleaning in new construction. It is amazing how many times I've found coils plugged with sheetrock dust, sawdust, and other debris. I've also seen ductwork that could have been taken out and put in properly with about half the material and it would have worked much more efficiently. I remember one where the homeowner said it looked like someone blew up a spaghetti factory.
I was changing some light switches in my friends brand new $million dollar home when I dropped a screw in the floor register. When I opened it up I found a pile of drywall scraps, a pile of dust, and a coffee cup. I was fucking livid. I wanted to talk to the builder myself but she wouldn’t let me
Totally agree. My old boss. Would not allow the HVAC system to use while any sheet rock or floor sanding was going on. He actually had in contract that it was not allowed to be use so we had disabled the system a couple times. GC would be pissed but unless they want to ruin homeowners equipment and duct , oh well...
How is the duct cleaning business? I was thinking of adding it to mine.
This happens in New construction all the time because once the house gets gas and electric meters hooked up. The GC calls us out to start up the equipment to get the house conditioned to Temp for the floors, paint and any thing else. Filters can only pick up so much dust and the h/o is left with dealing with the after affects.
@@smacleod69
As a contractor could you build a portable return filter, say a 1in at whatever the contracter could find, then maybe a 5in merv 10 and a 5in merv 13 or 16?
Put it fine print that builder pays for filters if they need the unit used during certain times?
Plug the returns and us this filter setup?
Just spit balling . As I know completely and thoroughly how some builders care about the new home owners, ha ha!
I was a flooring installer and hvac was definitely needed to prevent material failures.
I've installed over 500 new homes in my life time 95% by myself, that duct is an embarrassment .
Shame on the lazy HVAC inspector for the city that probably never climbed up to look at that rats nest. That would have been a red tag fail in our area on many counts.
If they did a rough hvac inspection on the build out it would have been visible from the ground before drywall and insulation went up. I’m not a fan of the flex duct systems used in the south however I’m sure it would run and pass code if it was sized, installed, and hung correctly
When you see pipe dope in a mess all over the gas line you know it's sloppy installers.
Nice catch Ted. Kind of a cliffhanger though. Hoping there’s a part 2?
Probably still talking with the homeowners about how much hackery there is!
Customer doesn’t have any money, it’s “better” and poor Ted’s married to that.
me too he's left us hanging
All the duct work needs to be replaced. Not a small task
want to hear the result as well. Its possible the homeowner could go back to the builder to get this paid for since it poor installation causing the problems
You are absolutely correct,the 325-3 can handle 100,000 btus with a single gas appliance & max out at 150,000 btus with multiple appliances ( not sure why you get 50,000 BTUs more when you add extra appliances (?)). So yes it is too small for this application.A 325- 5 should be used on this CSST manifold & a separate 325-5 used for the tankless water heater. Working and lockup pressures should always be taken when dealing with any regulators plus manifold pressures at the gas appliances. I usually set the Regulators at about 7"working pressure ( all gas appliances on) & check lock up pressure (all appliances off) to make sure I don't have a creeping regulator.
rite from the maxitrol spec sheets: "Total load of multiple appliance combined 325-3L (3/8”, 1/2”): 250,000 Btu/h;" "Largest single appliance served by the regulator: 325-3L: 140,000 Btu/h;" I'm not sure where you got your specs from but maxitrol spec sheet differs.
@@mackb.8262 yep. Its 250k. Nothing wrong with this reg. They either have low pressure gasline or undersized gaslines. The first tee is going to the tankless, guaranteed.
@@mackb.8262 You're looking at two different regulators is why. The 325L series, is a line regulator meant to feed multiple appliances and falls under a different ANSI spec than the 325 which is an appliance regulator. You can tell the one in the video is the L series because of the yellow banding around the adjustment stem.
@@ozm8642 Undersized gas from the meter. Assuming this is a typical 5.5-8.5 inwc service, what looks like a 1" coming in to that mess, and guessing about 40 equivalent feet of piping from the meter. You are only looking at pushing 243 CFH which is a touch over 243k btu of gas for all four of those runs.
Nobody has any pride in their workmanship. My father was a bricklayer and used to say that if you hung these guys for being bricklayers you'd be hanging innocent men.
Good one,
My dad always said doing a job is like signing your name, everyone will know you by it!
“Is that enough pipe dope John?”
“Did you use the whole can on 3 fittings, Bill?”
“No Sir, only half a can”
“Well it needs more!”
From other comments, I know I'm not the only one who would love to know what the homeowner said, what you got to do, and how it looks in the end.
The homeowner wasn't involved or didn't care enough to ask. Now, waits a full year to complain. Always more to the story People lie
@@zack9912000 Homeowners aren't us so they don't notice things until something isn't working.
Homeowners can only notice if they experience a full year of seasons. But it so happens that right at the end of that year after a homeowner finally realizes what's going on, the warranty expires.
Wow, it would be easier to start fresh, Leave the furnace, put a proper plenum and cold air return box.
At 90,000 btu,even if you put in a single ceiling return grill, it would be loud, don't you use insulated steel ducts. The resistance with flex is about, 30foot equiv, to 10 feet of steel pipe, for a 10 foot section. A nice home with only a single stage gas valve vs 2 stage. I won't even comment on the lack of insulation, I am from Ontario, Canada, the price of heating and cooling goes up but you only have to insulate once.
That was not a case of out of warranty that was a criminal case.
The quality of an installers shoddy and bad work are a good and direct reflection of the contractor who owns the company. Everything that goes wrong up in an attic or under a crawlspace is 100% in every situation direct responsibility and result of the owner of the company.
All fines and levees and penalties should also levied against the builder he’s responsible for picking the cheapest bid.
But this is why Ted picks up new lifelong customers fixing work like this and making a customer happy.
The whole ducting system needs to be redone.. the gas lines were poorly designed.. What a hack. If this is what you produce on a blank slate, you don't belong in the industry.
Umm the owner literally did nothing wrong it was the installers fault lol
Don't they have building inspection as a part of the permitting process? If a building inspector passed that something is very wrong.
@@donbob3343 they're incompetent. I worked closely with inspectors for my company, they are worthless and lazy.
I enjoy these videos--and I think they only really can help your business and reputation--especially on those 2nd or 3rd opinion calls. I am a surgeon and recorded all my operations and gave a copy of the recording to the patient so we could talk about exactly what was done and why. It became part of the medical record--and it built trust between the patient and me. Keep on recording. Thank you.
Ted did you advise them to sue the builder for the cost of re working the entire duct system?
That's what I would do, plus legal costs of course. They'd probably settle out of court quick, fast, and in a hurry. They keep on doing it because they keep on getting away with it.
Good luck with that
@@tycobb8621 Exactly. Spend more on useless lawyers than you would fixing the system yourself.
@@purplegoose7907 wrong, they would get a %, if that state has a Consumer Protection Dept you wouldn't need it, but repub states generally don't because they don't care about people, it's profits and rip offs for rich guys, they don't protect the consumer at all, most of the major issues in HVACR are in states with no regulations and no licensing, you can't learn this trade anymore by riding in some clowns truck, you need basic skills training and factory training for the rest of your career, I know, I was a factory rep for Carrier, techs that called from states that had regulations and licensing that needed help had already checked things out and were truly stumped, techs from states that didn't were a joke, questions like "the blower doesn't run" so I ask "what's the voltage going to it" reply "I don't know" "where's your meter?" "in the truck", or my favorite on many calls "what's the voltage coming out of the transformer" tech reply - ""uh, 24 a good 24" there and then I know several things, he doesn't know what he's doing and either has no meter or doesn't know how to use it, he's a hack, a parts changer, never been properly trained and in fact most of the deaths on the job in HVACR are in states with no regulations or training requirements. Florida for example, requires nothing, the owner has to register as a contractor, he can hire anyone to do any HVACR work, it's a joke.
@@purplegoose7907
They would more than likely fix it and give you some boot.
They wouldn't like this video sent anonymously by third party, to their customers after the home owner posted it without naming any contractors, to protect them selves from liable.
And certainly they would have a thorough home inspection, to see if their lives are in danger from other faulty systems that were not installed properly.
I live in a house built in the mid 1860s...i can't imagine living in one of these cookie cutter houses that are built as quickly and cheaply as possible. This house is so well built it blows my mind and the new construction is so cheap it's pathetic.
yelorsirhc, our house was completed in 1900. Huge beams for the framework, and NOT 1 nail in the frame. Its all mortise and tenon with a 1" dowel pin in each joint. I am an HVAC installer/ service tech so I go under a LOT of houses, I've seen a 5 year old house that was ready to fall apart. But I've never seen another like the one we bought. TOTALLY SOLID. If yours is 1860 then YOU understand exactly what I mean.
My grandma lives in an 1887 farm house and it's dead solid after all these years, was converted from wood stove to boiler heat at the turn of the century and finally got air conditioning near the next turn of the century, my old house was built in 1892 and what did it in was termites, constantly had a moisture problem and the landlord was too cheap to fix it, and I'm in the process of buying a house that was built near the turn of the century and still doesn't have central air, house is solid as a rock, zero drafts and a surprisingly high insulation value, luckily I have a sizeable stash of window units ranging in age from 1981 up to 2001
Yes, pride in work is non existent. Most of the labor today is unskilled and they cannot read.
Your old house is drafty and un-insulated though. That's where all of the effort goes in the new homes.
I know what your saying.
My house was built in 1970 and when you go into the attic, you can see the size of the rafters that you can't find in a new house.
I don't work in residential construction (Industrial) by I can tell this man knows his stuff. Subbed for the great trouble shooting. Looking forward to a part 2 update.
The fact that inlet volume dropped so significantly when adjusting the control valve says it all.
Props for chasing it down instead of condemning the whole thing. Most companies around here just see that as a prime opportunity to sell a system. That’s why I work in refrigeration and food equipment, lol.
That is only 1/3 of the problem though(Gas/Airflow/Crappy ducting). As he stated there is almost no air flow. That rise in outlet temperature will make a difference but not much.
That's the problem/benefit of a new system, you can't "just replace the whole thing." Of course on the other side of the coin you can't assume it worked OK before you got there, as I've often heard from my service manager, because this looked like it never worked right to begin with.
Lmao ... that is just silly !!
We're a new construction company. Our installs, duct work, and craftsmanship is great. Sad to see some new construction do this.
There are still contractors out there who take pride in their work.
Keep up the good work 👍
Reminds me of this vacant 1890s home I showed twice to clients last January 2021. Had an 80% furnace that was running non-stop for at least the 3 weeks that we visited. Seemed to be clicking on and off. Noticed the ductwork for return in the basement was all opened up. That was the least of that home's problems. I told the listing broker. No one cared, I guess they didn't mind a high gas bill. Needless to say it never sold and it went back as a rental unit. Heat probably hasn't ever stopped running a year later, either.
With the market the way it is I'm surprised it didn't sell. Our real-estate agent a couple times was wondering if the listing agents had ever been to the properties because of how awful condition some stuff was, including a flooded basement that was audibly squishing on carpet but still up for sale with bidding wars. Also other fun things seen included animal-poop on carpets and a dead bird in a garage.
I am a home inspector and poor installation of HVAC is in my top five issues I find. It’s disheartening.
@@matthewmiller6068 This home in particular was a bit odd. We have a hot real estate market but sometimes it's not hot enough for even the most weird of things. In this home none of the bedrooms had closets either, lots of mice poop everywhere, even found a hefty bag of Mari Jane in the kitchen cabinets. The home was remodeled sometime 30 years in the past but it was horribly outdated. A lot of things that just didn't fit the home especially for the price they wanted.
Before condemning the Reg. and gas valve on the furnace, you should confirm the outdoor Reg. on the meter is properly sized. It is not-common, but it has happened and would cause what you were seeing. That and tell them to engage the builder for a ducting Re&Re, either in good faith or through litigation, that is straight up B.S.
This attic looks like the underside of my house. I don’t have any issues with the air, but my dryer vent line is buried in between all the hvac flex tubing. I’ve had to slither underneath the flex to reach the dryer vent when we first moved in because the line was full of rock hard lint.
Great video my friend. This was very enlightening.
Our second home was about 15-years-old when we bought it. The house was warm enough, mostly because the insulation is superb. But it seemed as if the furnace worked overtime. One night I smelled gas. The manifold cracked and the gas company shuttle furnace down. When the replacement furnace came, the installers noticed something odd about the old furnace. It was actually a furnace for a small, modular home - and it was five years older than the home.
That's why in Canada we put the furnace in the basement and all our duct is rigid 28ga duct and pipe. We also ductseal all our joints
Retired HVACR Mechanic here. Industrial Commercial common occurence. 3MBtu airhouse off an 8in suppy supply regulated for 1.5MBtu... contractors do what they do...
Learned real quick if insufficient heat up you go and start reading regulator specs..95 times out a hundred Undersized regulators.
Nice catch and if course gas valve destroyed by over adjustment..
At least it ain't 1.5in valve.
They ain't so east to replace in top of an automobile assembly plant or a chicken processor!
Good stuff as always ted,I see terrible practices in new construction where im at also,no pride or standards, just hurry up and slap it in.
I actually hired a smart trade guy, ordered a good man heat pump and air handler. Had the whole thing delivered and installed for around $3500. Our energy company also gave a $2500 rebate. Working great for the past 2 years. I paid the guy about $50 an hour. Quotes for the same thing from local companies was over 10k.
Shame on you, I'm in the trade's & should been 80 -100 an HR ya cheap bastard, dude probably NEVER do any work for you or anyone you KNOW.
🤦🙄
I really like your channel; you’re well spoken and great camerawork as you diagnose the problems and troubleshoot. Very awesome to learn from
Thank you for sharing this video and being a truly professional and honest person. It's so sad that we are living in a time when some people no longer care about what kind of service and product they are getting paid to provide to their customers.
Use that manometer to check the external static pressure of the furnace. That will diagnose your airflow issues. Even if that burners are heating correctly, the airflow issue needs to be addressed before a compressor fails.
Yes, two separate issues here. Any follow up?
There is NO WAY that system passed an inspection. That builder had his inspector "BUDDY" give it a free pass. I've been an HVAC installer and service man for 16 years and I have seen many like this. We just rip it out and "HARD PIPE " it all. There is NO EXCUSE for work like that. And that unit should have came WITH a 10 year warranty. Most likely the builder didn't register the unit. I know a builder here in Alabama that actually has over 30 units registered in his name, so that it was covered NO MATTER who bought the house. TOTALLY LEGAL . TOTALLY LEGITIMATE.
The inspector BUDDY was also paid something for his troubles.
@@Garth2011 OH YEAH ! He probably got a case of beer or a steak dinner. Or some other form of payment. But yes, I think he probably did get PAID.
@@c.blakerockhart1128
You are thinking small, I met an inspector, out of New York in Mexico. He was on a "free" all inclusive scuba vacation.
Builder grade work. A house that I got had 4 inch ducting running from the kitchen vent, typically that is 8 inch. When I upgraded the hood and exhaust from the builder grade stuff I had to upgrade everything including the roof cap to 8 inch, one of the things when we made the deal on the house was that I needed to set aside a few thousand to do this work and we actually got it.
Yikes! That would not pass at all here in Ottawa, Canada. This installation is almost criminal. 😡 🇺🇸🇨🇦
With that setup you will never get enough gas to run everything. We do not install a regulator inside a house. The Black Iron pipe coming in from the meter 1 1/4 inch to 1 1/2 inch to a manifold to each gas run.. I run no plastic or copper inside and no flex pipe. All for safety reason.
Actually a 2lb system will give you more gas than you would ever need in a home this size but you would need proper regulators and an installation that meets the National Fuel Gas code ( it's quite obvious this installation falls short in a lot of ways). I'm not really sure why this particular gas utility allows 2-pound systems in homes with small to moderate gas loads. It's apparent you deal with mainly low pressure Delivery Systems of about 7", which is a tried-and-true system that's been around for over 150 years but it's sad to say they're always trying to find different ways to cut cost.
I stumbled across your video. I'm always impressed when a professional simply knows his/her stuff and can ID the flow rate of a regulator just by looking at it. Keep up the good work.
When I was a contractor I had one inspector that was ever worried about HVAC. I don't really think any of the others knew what was going on. We had a big advantage in that we had basements and nothing much was up in the trusses. If I'm honest I didn't know much about HVAC until the fourth house I built when I put geothermal in a spec. What a nightmare. It wasn't the furnace, it was the ductwork. Probably 40% of the return air was coming under the basement door. Thank heavens the manufacturer got involved. They sent an engineer and resized the returns. I was lucky. I learned a lot.
This job is screwed, I was in HVAC for over 50 years and an instructor and rep for Carrier, this has to go back to zero, load calculation, ductwork designed, gas lines checked for size, everything, maybe the builder has prints with some spec's, this is never going to be right, you might get it to work, but still, if the heat doesn't work with that poor excuse for ductwork the cooling def won't work, you need the btu/hr ratings for the home in heat and cool for that are, once the load calc is done then you can design the ductwork, and that unit may not end up being the right size. Also in your area hopefully you have a Dept of Consumer Protection and local building inspector, WHO INSPECTED THAT AND GAVE IT A GO??? I'll bet you're in a state or locale that doesn't believe in govt regs or licensing trades, and this is the result. If these guys did all the units in that neighborhood what the what?? I can't see all the gas piping but it sure looks like they used PLENTY of pipe dope, again, like the ductwork, the gas line has to be checked, all appliances btu in rating added up, total =? and go from there, from the meter to that regulator, is that reg right?, etc, but be careful because if you crank down on the reg on the unit due to low press and then the pressure comes back, that reg is going to over feed the unit, wow, what a mess.
Inspector should be fired and construction co. should be sued.
Agreed, but neither will happen; they will point to the contract and small print. City inspectors have immunity, and they will spend years fighting it
What's worse is...new construction installs are way less difficult to do than an existing home changeout by a good mile. Path of least resistance seems to be the core plan with this contractor.
did you not pay attention to the hacked mess of jumbled random trusses? you couldn't run a real trunk more than five foot without needing to use offset and large bends.
by golly they designed it fast as hell, designed by junk computer program it seems and nobody looked it over nor cared too, likely a green/wet behind the ears/no field knowledge architect did the mess to start.
@@throttlebottle5906 Yeah them trusses were a fucking mess. It looks like they hit a "maximize 2x4 usage" button.
@@throttlebottle5906 It's a pointless hip roof cobbled together McMansion style. I bet it has a "stone" or brick front, and the cheapest vinyl siding on the sides and back. Builder-grade vinyl windows too... "Craftsmanship, function, and footprint-efficiency be damned, I want my money spent on making my house look like I won the lottery... or at least a scratch off..."
You made the best comment...(paraphrasing) you can have the best materials in the world, but if are clueless.. they become worthless.
I have seen a great many new construction job. The vast majority are rigged up messes. What the average buyer doesn't realize is that incidents like this, of poor construction, are going to cost them a fair % of the cost of the home to repair.
As an aside, did they run out of dimensional timber when they built that space. They have 2x3 support timber lapping into the joists and not into structural horizontal members fully integrated into the walls and supported by load bearing walls. On way to see this is the decking and exposed joists relative to where the ducts punch through to the lower floor.
As a retired electrician (UK based) who spent many many hours crawling through roofspaces while running cables, I can only say "Wow". The ducting and the joinery work in that roofspace must have been thrown together by people while they were blindfolded and had their hands tied behind their backs. It's easily the worst work I have ever seen - Newbuild, or otherwise.
I can't believe that with the poor air flow, that it won't be going off on high limit now. My first thought was somebody turned down the gas pressure for that reason
Dang that’s a nightmare.
Hoping there will be a part two :)
This video just randomly popped up for me to watch so I gave it a go. Nice work. Hope there is a part 2. I would love tonsee how this shakes out.
I inspect another of new construction at 11months before the warranty runs out and I see this stuff all the time. Builders don't like me.
first time visitor here... I design homes in the U.S. and loved the commentary during your inspection... Bowl of spaghetti indeed... And whatsmore I second the lack of craftsmanship and experience in new home construction industry. Today's middle/upper class development is tomorrow's ghetto...
I am a stickler for duct work. I'm a lead installer and one thing guys can't to in my area is duct work. They size it too small and never have enough return. Looking at the supply with no main trunk. No wonder why the air flow sucks. Them techs don't check gas pressure or static pressure or fan speeds for that matter based on the size of the unit. See a lot of call for furnace cutting off and usually high limit because of all that crappy duct.
I personally have found some new construction errors..one time I went to a house no heat call. Went down and seen furnace running great but no air. After checking everything I found they had put a main supply outside thinking it was fresh air…lol..
In the fall of 1993 I was installing an instrumentation upgrade for CNG at its Lebanon, Ohio pump station. One cold morning they asked me if I'd mind driving to Washington Court House and troubleshooting a no heat issue in the office. The facility had been constructed earlier in the spring. When I removed the thermostat I found wiring on the AC side but nothing on the heat side. An hour later the office was warm and I was a hero.
A day earlier I had troubleshot a no heat issue at Lebanon to a hot water check valve that had a piece of rubber holding it open resulting in a cold building. Sometimes it's the little things...
The amount of insulation looks like a problem also. Some places it looks like there's barely any. When our house was built a couple of young kids came out to blow the insulation into the attic. After they left I went up to check and there was hardly any in most of the places that were hard to get to. They probably figured nobody would ever bother to check. I made the owner of the insulation company come back and see for himself and correct the problem. Unfortunate that nobody ever checked on this person's house while it was being built.
This is they kind of work when a contractor hires his workers from the Home Depot parking lot. Untrained, unskilled. Just because you can physically hang or hammer, doesn't mean you know how to do it properly.
Since it was not heating properly I bet the gas logs were staying on full blast, if you were to close the gas line to the logs wouldn't that give more power to the furnace? At least as a temporary fix. Love your videos and your craftsmanship thank you for the upload
Good video sir, no one checks W.C. on gas valves after initial fire up of gas furnaces. Youre a good tech!
When I moved down here to the Dallas area I worked for a company who installed those systems the exact way I was there service technician smh . I can’t even tell you how many houses I went through and had to try to fix the problem and have the owner come out and argue with me about how shitty the install where needles to say I left them. I’m came from the Philly area we always had to run a plenum then flex to again 5 in or 4 in pipe . Out here they do whatever is cheapest.
You the man. Honestly its pretty scary having jakelegs work on/install a gas appliance. Real danger there.
I wanted to move to Colorado a couple years ago and ran into this company that only paid it's employees by their sales. I knew I wouldn't fit in at that company. I a lot like you, although I need to improve on my attention to detail. I take shortcuts like not using a nitrogen bleed as much as you do and probably should, but here's my point. I am very technically inclined, I love the work (most of the time when it's not 20 degrees outside working on a heat pump owe), I strive to double check my work and try to make sure I do a good job. And I always leave my work area cleaner than when I got there. It's really downheartening to see these companies who don't care about that , but about someone who can walk up and BS the customer into a new unit that they don't even need. I'm 59 and that's one of the things I've noticed about the AC industry lately. These incentives and bonuses for selling equipment, could cause a technician to be dishonest. I worked with one in Beaumont, Tx awhile back and he told me he took his zoom spout oiler and just squirted a little oil on the condensing unit, told them it was leaking, and sold them a new unit. He got an extra 50 dollars on his check for the sale, didn't have to work on the unit, and didn't even have to go back and install the stuff. The installers did all his work and he sticks money in his pocket. What a sorry %$@&%@ he was. The boss loved him though. Things like that make me really not like my chosen field, but it's just really good to see someone like myself who does just exactly what a unit needs to work again without trying to trick the customer into a sale. Faith in humanity restored.
I like flex, it's basically all we use in Florida nowadays for residential, aside from truck lines and mixing boxes for the most part. But when people do it like this and kink it everywhere and don't hang it properly it sucks. But it's so much easier than cutting and sizing duct board.
I have personally seen ac techs that couldnt even check for power properly. The guy had his meter on a PLASTIC disconnect asking me if it was off! Another trying to bs me into buying a whole new compressor when I already checked the cap. It was bad. I basically had to force the cap from him and put it on myself. Been working great for a few years.
If that was in my home, I would IMMEDIATELY call to get that duct ripped out regardless the cost!
The gas line had more connections than most European highways. Definitely bad job. As mikeselectricstuff said wouldn't be allowed in the UK. Gas lines free hanging, not allowed, to many fittings and the regulator being so far out that the pressure doesn't exist. These new construction sites are really bad, its about quantity and not quality, despite new legislation that is better. I don't think the inspector looked at that house. The one he saw was probably almost perfect, with hardly any filler or sealing agent, good connections and all clean straight lines, unlike that spaghetti bowl we just looked at. It's to bad :( and Sad!
Where I'm at, flex pipe is never supposed to be longer that 15 ft, and it's only supposed to be used to connect the main trunk to the register boots/diffusers. Also supposed to be well supported AND STRAIGHT!
Absolutely correct! As a Manual D and J instructor, this job was totally wrong on so many level’s.
This is why we need strong HVAC state codes! Amateurs have no business destroying ours!!!!! Thanks 🤬
While this kind of work will keep you busy… you also have give the bad news to the homeowner. That can take more than HVAC skills! But I really like that you didn’t get rattled as you found things you didn’t like. You didn’t just get ticked off and start cussing and all that. Your approached the problem, you worked at finding the problem, and fixing the problem (what you can do now VS how you want to redo it the right way), not being the problem! Well done!
Long ti9me home inspector, on my new home construction I write the flex duct installation up as poor before I enter the home, if its above adequate I revise my report. This type of installation is way to common. Great find on the gas pressure.
What sloppy work on that heat system. The inspection should be fired. Love your videos. Thanks
Some of these "companies" that build 100's or even thousands of homes each year really do cheap out on anything they can. The problem is they take the lowest bid without asking questions. I am a landscaper. Last year, I installed 2 French Drains at 2 different residences, because their property was constantly flooded. The problem ended up being an UNDERGROUND WELL that wasn't capped. Many of their driveways in this neighborhood had been replaced within the first year, cracking and sinking. The concrete people they used thought it was ok to use 3 inches of base, and poured the driveways to an inch thick. These people are paying 400,000 dollars for these places and getting shafted so hard. It's disgusting
I go to new construction finding crap all the time, in fact I can’t remember any of them being good. When I tell the homeowner the ductwork needs replaced, they have a serious issue since the house is fairly new (as they should) Builders are to blame for this nonsense.
LOVE the title of this video. I feel the same way about some of the installers of houses hahha!!
we live and we learn you cant blame them for trying. plenty of unproductive citizens on welfare out here with no purpose in life and your concerned about some butchers trying to make a living ?
@@VNOMOUSDYALISIS building a house I have to live in yes. I would be concerned. What is not concerning about poor craftsmanship? That is the better question I ask you. The house burned down but oh "he tried his best" .......... see how yiu sound ?
As someone who works for a company that does new construction. I can totally get that a system would be doing that. You would not believe the crap I have seen.
Glad it’s not just the UK that has horrific standards of new build properties
I would go to city hall and get a copy of the "approved" inspection and along with video you shot, show up at a city council meeting and start asking questions about the inspection process and the inspectors. (The owner that is)
That's horrendous. Rip out all the flexible ducting & replace with sheet metal ducting. Then make the builder pay for the retrofit.
We got that problem in new houses in Florida. Builders use illegal crews and pay off city.
Lol, the amount of pipe dope is crazy, that’s what’s plugging up your regulators. I do hvac commissioning for a living in the commercial world. I really need to start my own residential home commissioning business. I could really make an impact on these hacks that prey on new home owners.
This is a great example of a quality service call, done by someone that knows his profession! I really enjoyed this one! Remember kids, never use permanent heat for temporary heat! It’s not fair to the customer! 🐧
Imagine the energy savings our country could achieve if there was an incentive to have attics ductwork inspected and improved. This would be an actual “ build back better “
What is all that garbage framing all over the place? It looks like they just used all the scraps to brace and hang ducts
low bid always wins! Also the city's fault too for approving this mess
Bigo, the customer went to the cheaper bid and got what was expected. See it all the time with "my friend installed my system"
@@zack9912000 Of course, the "customer" in this case is the builder. They go with the cheapest they can.
Warm air furnace stuffed in a ventilated attic. What complete garbage! At least they had a folding stairway and some OSB on the attic floor. Some of these new houses just have a 24x24 panel in a closet for access and no flooring except under the furnace.
In my area about 90% of homes have a single undersized return air duct and grill. Usually a 14" or 16" round flex duct. We are constantly installing a 2nd return air duct and grill so we can get proper airflow. I always start with a static pressure test.
Ted, please do a follow up!
Those are tough calls. You think it will trip the high limit after you get gas pressure right?
That regulator was my first concern.
Why do you need to regulate meter pressure? If you need to be regulated for gas logs the put it in the gas log line.
Instead they made a manifold after the regulator. Then everybody gets regulated that's why they had the gas valve regulator cranked. The incoming pressure was to low. Your monometer showed you never got to the factory recommended pressure at 3.5" wc.
Then all 👉All that flex needs to come out. Duct and hard pipe insulated. Good news though you can pull the membrane out of the flex and use that as pipe insulation.
How did that pass inspection? Because where I'm at any flex longer that 3' gets violated.
🤭This is why I've never looked back on residential and do strictly commercial. Good find 👏
This is awesome! My grandfather was in HVAC his entire career after the Army.
Would like to see a part 2 , with a 3/4 reg . Good video
Supply duct sizing looks like no one knows how to use a duct calculator. A given static is only good for an equivalent length of duct of 100 feet. When your equivalent length of duct is longer, you raise your static pressure to compensate. Or you will lose all of your pressure before you even get the other side of the house. All kinds of pressure problems, I swear those poor people were the ones the most sabotaged.
Ima an ACCA certified system design specialist . I live in NJ and I can tell you this is normal to see pretty much every where you go. Just rule of thumb stuff .
That is crazy to us in Wisconsin, that duct system would never be allowed here, lol. and who installs a 80% furnace in resi new construction these days???? And what do they insulate at there? R-19? LOL
I spent 2 years in HVAC as a helper/apprentice for a family friend during a building boom way back when. My site boss would have fired everyone on that crew that installed that system. It's like they looked at the laws of fluid dynamics and said "ok lets install this duct work exactly opposite of what this science and math says."
Horrible. Insulation job shady also. Thanks for video
I hope you are able to get the job fixing this mess. If I were the home owner, I would have it done right and go after the Builder.