This was an exceptional stream even by your standards AM, the mixture of your passion on the subject with your intellectual composure was a highlight for me
AM, I have been a follower of AA's since I was introduced to him by Sargon and I was introduced to you via the Byzantine stream but after your most recent appearances on AA's channel and this stream here, I am officially subscribed. As a history enjoyer I will be bingeing your content.
Very engaging discussion. Could have listened for another hour, not sure the participants could have gone on longer with such heavy themes though. Thanks to all and especially AM for organising it.
No word adequately describes the quality of this stream. Learned and penetrating, a total gem. Thank you AM and thank you all. One thing. I was almost surprised that somebody didn't mention Christopher Hitchens's old book.
I have to admit this is the most enlightened and objective discourse on the British Empire I've heard from Western scholars. AM, I judged you wrongly and too soon. Thank you 👍🏿
Throw some nice artwork up, cathedral choir, and witty upper crust philosophies and opinions and BAM, you have a youtube channel, well done ladingtons, well done.
@@ApostolicMajesty That may be so, buuut.. The Old intro hyped me up to receiving some based and esoteric historical knowledge. The new one does not. That is all I've wanted to say. All in all - a needless change. I'll be skipping the intro from now on. (no hard feelings ofc, mucho
@@misterkefir Tell you what, if I get a voice actor and my channel goes in the direction of Kings and Generals with pervasive dramatic music - I'll revamp the original intro.
The idea of New England as some sort of malicious Anglophile power center that coopted the United States in the Guilded Age is amusing. The economic center of the country had moved to New York, Pennsylvania, and later the Midwest by the late 19th century. New England became a politically irrelevant part of the country, producing no presidents from 1828-1852, 1856-1924, and 1928-1960. New England after 1800 wasn’t a large enough portion of the country to elect a president. Illinois, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and New York were massively dominant, both in population and economy.
there was no british "empire" just people doing trade and basically took advantage of poor people living there, such as India, Africa and Aboriginal people of North America and Australia. They were basically thieves who stole and sabotage Spanish empire.
Great stream, I think I’m in agreement with AA view that there were 3 main periods to the British Empire with the last being the most GAE. However, Oliver makes some very compelling arguments.
When I saw the notice for this video I thought, “I’ll listen for a bit but there’s no way I’ll get through the whole thing.” Yet here I am, four hours later.
Incredible discussion gentlemen. I am sure I speak for many when I say this subject and understanding the periphery history e.g what was going on in South America or South East Asia in the same time periods is a huge black hole in my knowledge. History is so often taught American civil war, WW1, WW2 then Vietnam but it’s the spaces between these events that contain the most fascinating history.
@@jacksonklark6119"the people" cannot be sovereign. Sovereignty by it's very nature will always consolidate into an oligarchy/aristocracy unless it in put in the hands of a monarchy
I appreciate AA being here to bring some needed diversity. He sounds like he's selling carpets in Iraq, but here he is talking about superior European cultures with such glee. Very powerful.
Friends, don’t forget to give AM all of your support by liking the videos and subscribing to the channel. Also check out our AM Fanclub Discord channel to continue the conversations: discord.gg/gFPUAQPS
I was only slightly surprised that GDP and jobs are contextualized to be a net good, despite all. Even though we know this isn't true, it's adopted for the sake of debate.
Semiogogue brings up a good point about the term yank. British people and Europeans often incorrectly refer to all Americans as Yankees for the same reason Americans often incorrectly refer to all British people as English. It’s because they’re both referring to the dominant group. Britain is English-dominated in the same way the United States are Yankee-dominated.
Phenomenal, but a little rigid. The great conclusion coming out of these examples, is that every single republic or democracy always ends in bet***al of the native population by its supposed elites. An actual monarchy, a real sovereign rule of one man from the very top of civil government, is the only remedy against this oligarchic tr***on. Rome, Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, Britain, America, all of the modern "democracies" of the West. Caesarism that goes all the way, for the crown and the mandate of Heaven, and does not stop on "dict*****hip in perpetuity", is the way. The terrible proto-demo-liberal legacy of the ancients senators and oligarchs, invigorated by the French Revolution - must be brought into sunlight like the plage of civilizations it truly is.
🏴This Motivates me as a 26 Year Englishman to bring our Empire back. And I know where to start....🇬🇧 Those responsible for trying erase us will unwilling erase themselves in venegeance hands
The Empire never benefited the average Englishman one jot. It was all done for the benefit of our crypto overlords. It’s nothing to be proud of - we were duped.
Too much focus on conspiracy and incompetence and not enough on economic factors. As AM pointed out Empire didn't pay. If the Govt is losing money and the public dodn't want to serve in the military to preserve it how do you maintain it in a democratic country?
Semi is obsessed with jews. His wording is too conspiratorial at times. Additionally, 'elites' are too vague a term to be thrown around so often. Reminds me of the way marxists overuse 'bourgeoisie'.
Thank you for your consistently well-researched and thoughtful content. Might I ask where you find the historical paintings which decorate your videos? Are they just found through Google searches, or are there any good websites and databases available for locating them?
Early listening but a fundamental difference between liberty oriented movements and those that are woke which is really a form of attempted domination by subversion and grievance politics - the very antithesis of liberty - so not sure I would consider it as the basis of emancipation, as this was focused around morality and perhaps economics rather than grievance politics
I have nothing but love, respect and admiration for the great British Empire and all the wonderful things it gave to the world. I am so sad that it had to end. :(
None of the British oversea territories are Sovreign, Australia and New Zealand esp. were occupied by force as is Ukraine by Russia. Same goes with Siberia.
When your right at the bottom of the empire & you look up , you see a x , if you can manage to go to the top it looks like a pyramid , that’s all I’m saying 😂
Semiogogue's early analysis seems weirdly divorced from the single most salient point of the period he covers - the split in the British elites and that the Yankees stemmed from and remained aligned with one particular side of this split. Entire analysis is just myopic due to this, and it certainly can't be that he's never been exposed to the information. Verdic: Semiogogue appears to remain willfully wrong.
They all do it on various topics on their individual channels too, in ways that cannot be rationally explained imo, given their exposure to all this sort of information. Almost as if the content has an agenda, and it is not just being shared because of their love of truth seeking.
32:24 Semiogogue I am curious to know if “woke” in this context is such a bad thing. AA calling that “woke” exposes his internalized racist tendency. I'm expecting his comeback to be some delusional talk about “Africans also sold slaves”, because to his type, that justifies American slavery.
It's always amusing to see what triggers red flags for less intelligent libs who wander into far right spaces. They could be 30 minutes into a Jonathan Bowden speech before saying "hang on... what do you mean by 'you people?'"
Those takes on slavery were far too cynical. Have you ever considered that the people then might have felt compassion? Why do you even assume that everything was just some cold "we will damage our competitors" thinking. Stop being so paranoid. Also what was that nonsense about Brits abolishing slavery to pirate freighters by claiming there were slaves on board. Baseless nonsense. Get your s together.
@@ApostolicMajesty Do you have some evidence that the Brits were using abolition as an excuse to conduct piracy against merchant ships? inb4 "wanting evidence for baseless rants is muh cute and cringe. Just listen and believe."
Well for one thing they did it. Certainly components of the population were against it for religious reasons, but the actual application of their ideals had a lot to do with the political context of the times and the fact that such a move was useful to other parties for more than the moral satisfaction. Without the Napoleonic wars it likely would have taken a lot longer, though at some point using the RN to harass the trade of rivals would have been too tempting, or the anti-slavery lobby too powerful.
@@vorynrosethorn903 Harassing the trade of rivals was done with various means, including privateers. There was no need to fake morality just to do some piracy. Also how would it look like according to you guys if their intentions were as stated and they weren't just dirty, bitter cynics who lie about their intentions? "Well for one thing they did it." Yes, yes, just trust me, bro. Amirite?
@@TheNotthediver maybe it’s the Anglo in me, but I’m really not down for that. I believe all people should be treated with dignity and respect, I just want England for the English and France for the French, so on… this is way too far into the realm of supremacy. I want the shire, not a slave plantation.
Slavery is an ancient form of social hierarchy, getting rid of it willy nilly because of liberal ideology is a suspect idea. Did the lives of slaves & slave masters improve after it was abolished? Why take an outraged moral stance over it? Because it's taboo not to in our current society? You should at least be apathetic to it.
@@BellBeakerBloke AM yes, but couldn't say so regarding the guests. As for conspiracy theories they were constantly repeating about colour revolutions as instruments of US government. I am Ukrainian who partook in Revolution of Dignity and know that in in its grounds it has people's cooperation and anger and was initiated upwards not downwards as opposition politicians were so clumsy trying to direct it and take charge of it. Also I have Czech and Polish friends that told me so about their colour revolutions as well. I appreciate AM's content and share similar conservative views however rather atheistic. It's educated European conservativism that I am part of. However the guests are rather conservatives of American type of conservativism based on conspiracy theories and American exceptionism. I mean, you guys may have reasons to hate your domestic intelligence agencies, interference, e.g. censoring the Internet, but please do not arrogantly extrapolate it on things you have no knowledge of.
@@BellBeakerBloke thanks for westplaining to me, Mr. I can't name 5 cities in countries I claim expertise in. Actually your comment say a lot of your twisted perspective so I will argue with you - your view seems cemented by years so that traveling to Ukraine or speaking with Ukrainians won't change it + plus you also could say that I am no impartial. So, I just advice you to travel to Ukraine, at least Kyiv and Lviv are safe to "do your own research" and rather use other countries as examples. First, Poland and Solidarnosc. Did you know that Leh Valensa, leader of protest was a simple electrician who as now is revealed collaborated with KGB and Polish intelligence, so no US involvement. I mean I am 99% sure you don't know about country of Kyrgyzstan as well as about it revolution of roses for example, a country which is of zero political importance to the US and which remain alligned with russia after it. Or about Georgia, of which revolution pesky US didn't took advantage and neither approved their accession to NATO nor even use 2008 war to sanction russia, clearly don't even care about it. It's also trully ridiculous how, you guys, who sure consider yourself conservatives adopt literally the same takes as Noam Chomsky, who also denies any Eastern European agency in colour revolutions . Think about it. Personally I can't wrap it around my head if not use horseshoe theory (which i believe is not relevant while you as a AM's enjoyer shouldn't be radical/populist right-wing). I don't want to continue this discussion as English isn't my native language and it demands more time which I don't have. So long.
If you enjoyed this video, please like and leave a comment. It helps the channel a lot. Many thanks.
Can you tell me the name of the opening choral angelic music please?
good work
Nope, the Brits would never have supported the South, so long as it had slavery.
This was an exceptional stream even by your standards AM, the mixture of your passion on the subject with your intellectual composure was a highlight for me
AM, I have been a follower of AA's since I was introduced to him by Sargon and I was introduced to you via the Byzantine stream but after your most recent appearances on AA's channel and this stream here, I am officially subscribed. As a history enjoyer I will be bingeing your content.
4 hours of an AM stream. Yes please. Thank you for blessing us with this gem.
wiv viss gem
A excellent stream with two good guests. Thank's to AM for keeping the history straight.
Heavy stuff, incredible stream. Thankyou to all participants.
The mads lads actually did it, a 4 hour video on the enteral Anglo
Very engaging discussion. Could have listened for another hour, not sure the participants could have gone on longer with such heavy themes though. Thanks to all and especially AM for organising it.
No word adequately describes the quality of this stream. Learned and penetrating, a total gem. Thank you AM and thank you all.
One thing. I was almost surprised that somebody didn't mention Christopher Hitchens's old book.
This is a great day indeed, thanks AM.
This is wonderful. Best program of the week.
Fantastic stream gentleman. Well overdue and executed with grace. My vote for stream of the year.
I have to admit this is the most enlightened and objective discourse on the British Empire I've heard from Western scholars. AM, I judged you wrongly and too soon. Thank you 👍🏿
Recent subscriber here, I feel like I have found the peak of CZcams.
For sure
Throw some nice artwork up, cathedral choir, and witty upper crust philosophies and opinions and BAM, you have a youtube channel, well done ladingtons, well done.
Thanks for the show, gentlemen.
The old intro was infinitely better, btw.
The new intro is more appropriate for the tone and subject matter of my new content and the rhythm of my written and spoken style.
@@ApostolicMajesty That may be so, buuut.. The Old intro hyped me up to receiving some based and esoteric historical knowledge. The new one does not. That is all I've wanted to say. All in all - a needless change. I'll be skipping the intro from now on.
(no hard feelings ofc, mucho
@@misterkefir Tell you what, if I get a voice actor and my channel goes in the direction of Kings and Generals with pervasive dramatic music - I'll revamp the original intro.
@@ApostolicMajesty I much prefer the worse intro to that ever happening, hehe.
The idea of New England as some sort of malicious Anglophile power center that coopted the United States in the Guilded Age is amusing. The economic center of the country had moved to New York, Pennsylvania, and later the Midwest by the late 19th century. New England became a politically irrelevant part of the country, producing no presidents from 1828-1852, 1856-1924, and 1928-1960.
New England after 1800 wasn’t a large enough portion of the country to elect a president. Illinois, Ohio, Pennsylvania, and New York were massively dominant, both in population and economy.
I love the British Empire, and I love this channel.
there was no british "empire" just people doing trade and basically took advantage of poor people living there, such as India, Africa and Aboriginal people of North America and Australia. They were basically thieves who stole and sabotage Spanish empire.
@@Khan_is_mongolIt was an empire by definition and it was better than the Spanish empire.
Fantastic stream, thank you.
Great stream, I think I’m in agreement with AA view that there were 3 main periods to the British Empire with the last being the most GAE. However, Oliver makes some very compelling arguments.
When I saw the notice for this video I thought, “I’ll listen for a bit but there’s no way I’ll get through the whole thing.” Yet here I am, four hours later.
Very good ! Semiogogue helps create such a dynamic
Great stream chaps, cheers.
Incredible discussion gentlemen. I am sure I speak for many when I say this subject and understanding the periphery history e.g what was going on in South America or South East Asia in the same time periods is a huge black hole in my knowledge. History is so often taught American civil war, WW1, WW2 then Vietnam but it’s the spaces between these events that contain the most fascinating history.
AM, "Democracy does not mean rule of the people, it means the expansion of Statism." Based.
So what would be the rule of the people?
there isnt, there is only the iron rule of oligarchy@@jacksonklark6119
@@jacksonklark6119 A pipe dream.
@@jacksonklark6119"the people" cannot be sovereign. Sovereignty by it's very nature will always consolidate into an oligarchy/aristocracy unless it in put in the hands of a monarchy
Will you ever do one on Spain or the Habsburgs with guests?
I appreciate AA being here to bring some needed diversity. He sounds like he's selling carpets in Iraq, but here he is talking about superior European cultures with such glee. Very powerful.
@HalideHelix Persia.
The "carpet seller" has published 2 books and is the only one here with an academic background. Just FYI.
Wow, this empire thing sounds pretty cool. I wish I had an empire.
Friends, don’t forget to give AM all of your support by liking the videos and subscribing to the channel. Also check out our AM Fanclub Discord channel to continue the conversations:
discord.gg/gFPUAQPS
I would if he didn’t pronounce “the” as “vuh”
The discord channel where you bully people ? No thanks
This was incredibly epic. 3 Titans in a 4 hour stream. Excellent stuff!
Appreantly we need to get AM some Rhodesian shorts
Very interesting thank you
Very enjoyable investigation by all. Thanks
Dream collab❤
Fascinating conversation!
AA at 2:15:00 - “But didn’t they raise the GDP?”
I was only slightly surprised that GDP and jobs are contextualized to be a net good, despite all. Even though we know this isn't true, it's adopted for the sake of debate.
Great show.
God Bless you guys.
Fantastic content, lads.
This was a very heavy stream, and was so good
Phenomenal... did it all one sitting. Will look into all channels and works.
Semiogogue brings up a good point about the term yank. British people and Europeans often incorrectly refer to all Americans as Yankees for the same reason Americans often incorrectly refer to all British people as English. It’s because they’re both referring to the dominant group. Britain is English-dominated in the same way the United States are Yankee-dominated.
Very interesting topic and discussion among gentlemen
After this would love to hear a history of the Raj
Good stream, great men.
The word 'loquacious' was invented for Semiogogue.
Phenomenal, but a little rigid.
The great conclusion coming out of these examples, is that every single republic or democracy always ends in bet***al of the native population by its supposed elites.
An actual monarchy, a real sovereign rule of one man from the very top of civil government, is the only remedy against this oligarchic tr***on.
Rome, Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, Britain, America, all of the modern "democracies" of the West.
Caesarism that goes all the way, for the crown and the mandate of Heaven, and does not stop on "dict*****hip in perpetuity", is the way.
The terrible proto-demo-liberal legacy of the ancients senators and oligarchs, invigorated by the French Revolution - must be brought into sunlight like the plage of civilizations it truly is.
Correct, but the panelists are all in favor of authoritarianism and constantly berate AnCaps
@@MisterWebb I'm an AnCap by inclination; a Royalist by necessity.
@@ApostolicMajesty Sorry, I don’t follow. What necessitates support for the Battenbergs?
The will of the divine.
Who wrote and what is the name of the beautiful music at the beginning of the video? Thank you.
Tomás Luis de Victoria: Nigra sum sed formosa "surge amica mea"
Great job, please lower that loud music at the beginning tho!
🏴This Motivates me as a 26 Year Englishman to bring our Empire back. And I know where to start....🇬🇧
Those responsible for trying erase us will unwilling erase themselves in venegeance hands
The Empire never benefited the average Englishman one jot. It was all done for the benefit of our crypto overlords. It’s nothing to be proud of - we were duped.
Look at the industrial heartland and say that.
Too much focus on conspiracy and incompetence and not enough on economic factors. As AM pointed out Empire didn't pay. If the Govt is losing money and the public dodn't want to serve in the military to preserve it how do you maintain it in a democratic country?
Semi is obsessed with jews. His wording is too conspiratorial at times.
Additionally, 'elites' are too vague a term to be thrown around so often. Reminds me of the way marxists overuse 'bourgeoisie'.
I would be interested to see what relation or influence the Milner Group has to the later Bilderberg group.
Perfidy in Albion
Thank you for your consistently well-researched and thoughtful content. Might I ask where you find the historical paintings which decorate your videos? Are they just found through Google searches, or are there any good websites and databases available for locating them?
Curiously enough slavery in Abyssinia was also one of main points in the Italian propaganda used to justify the conquest of that place.
Early listening but a fundamental difference between liberty oriented movements and those that are woke which is really a form of attempted domination by subversion and grievance politics - the very antithesis of liberty - so not sure I would consider it as the basis of emancipation, as this was focused around morality and perhaps economics rather than grievance politics
Carroll Quigley was also a professor of Bill Clinton’s at Harvard, with the latter naming him as a major influence.
It was the Dutch all along
Just to be clear, that's *not* what I was saying :)
18:45 for Foreign Office begs to differ.
AA's comparison between the costs and profitability of wage labor vs slavery is the exact argument Marx made lol
So, tell me what you really think about Jews and Africans?
The English left everywhere they went a better place before they arrived.
I have nothing but love, respect and admiration for the great British Empire and all the wonderful things it gave to the world. I am so sad that it had to end. :(
Can anyone give me a timestamp of when they talk about Gamal Abdel Nasser
Are you a fan of the books of John Charmley?
4 hr stream, AA speaks for 20 minutes, how do you do it?
That's not true
None of the British oversea territories are Sovreign, Australia and New Zealand esp. were occupied by force as is Ukraine by Russia. Same goes with Siberia.
When your right at the bottom of the empire & you look up , you see a x , if you can manage to go to the top it looks like a pyramid , that’s all I’m saying 😂
1hr of woke converstion ... rough start to this one boys
Semiogogue's early analysis seems weirdly divorced from the single most salient point of the period he covers - the split in the British elites and that the Yankees stemmed from and remained aligned with one particular side of this split. Entire analysis is just myopic due to this, and it certainly can't be that he's never been exposed to the information.
Verdic: Semiogogue appears to remain willfully wrong.
They all do it on various topics on their individual channels too, in ways that cannot be rationally explained imo, given their exposure to all this sort of information. Almost as if the content has an agenda, and it is not just being shared because of their love of truth seeking.
32:24 Semiogogue I am curious to know if “woke” in this context is such a bad thing. AA calling that “woke” exposes his internalized racist tendency. I'm expecting his comeback to be some delusional talk about “Africans also sold slaves”, because to his type, that justifies American slavery.
How did you get here?
It's always amusing to see what triggers red flags for less intelligent libs who wander into far right spaces. They could be 30 minutes into a Jonathan Bowden speech before saying "hang on... what do you mean by 'you people?'"
@@Doosteroni my bad, as a Nigerian, I get triggered every time someone associates “wokeness” with slavery & the slave trade.
@SomeGuy56131 Go back to your 🐒 cage! Or should I call the Zoo keeper in blue to escort you?
@@oimate9796 grow up.
I wish youtube would quit suggesting these rambling bigoted social outcasts to me
Semiogogue talking utter nonsense like usual
Those takes on slavery were far too cynical. Have you ever considered that the people then might have felt compassion? Why do you even assume that everything was just some cold "we will damage our competitors" thinking. Stop being so paranoid. Also what was that nonsense about Brits abolishing slavery to pirate freighters by claiming there were slaves on board. Baseless nonsense. Get your s together.
This may be the cutest comment I've ever seen.
@@ApostolicMajesty Do you have some evidence that the Brits were using abolition as an excuse to conduct piracy against merchant ships?
inb4 "wanting evidence for baseless rants is muh cute and cringe. Just listen and believe."
Well for one thing they did it.
Certainly components of the population were against it for religious reasons, but the actual application of their ideals had a lot to do with the political context of the times and the fact that such a move was useful to other parties for more than the moral satisfaction. Without the Napoleonic wars it likely would have taken a lot longer, though at some point using the RN to harass the trade of rivals would have been too tempting, or the anti-slavery lobby too powerful.
@@vorynrosethorn903 Harassing the trade of rivals was done with various means, including privateers. There was no need to fake morality just to do some piracy.
Also how would it look like according to you guys if their intentions were as stated and they weren't just dirty, bitter cynics who lie about their intentions?
"Well for one thing they did it."
Yes, yes, just trust me, bro. Amirite?
Is semi pro-slavery? 😂
Yeah wtf
@@TheNotthediver maybe it’s the Anglo in me, but I’m really not down for that. I believe all people should be treated with dignity and respect, I just want England for the English and France for the French, so on… this is way too far into the realm of supremacy. I want the shire, not a slave plantation.
I was also very confused about that
Slavery is an ancient form of social hierarchy, getting rid of it willy nilly because of liberal ideology is a suspect idea. Did the lives of slaves & slave masters improve after it was abolished? Why take an outraged moral stance over it? Because it's taboo not to in our current society? You should at least be apathetic to it.
@@The1Green4Man chattel slavery is an abomination against humanity and I won't entertain any light talk about it
Conspirological vibes from guests
@@BellBeakerBloke AM yes, but couldn't say so regarding the guests. As for conspiracy theories they were constantly repeating about colour revolutions as instruments of US government. I am Ukrainian who partook in Revolution of Dignity and know that in in its grounds it has people's cooperation and anger and was initiated upwards not downwards as opposition politicians were so clumsy trying to direct it and take charge of it. Also I have Czech and Polish friends that told me so about their colour revolutions as well. I appreciate AM's content and share similar conservative views however rather atheistic. It's educated European conservativism that I am part of. However the guests are rather conservatives of American type of conservativism based on conspiracy theories and American exceptionism. I mean, you guys may have reasons to hate your domestic intelligence agencies, interference, e.g. censoring the Internet, but please do not arrogantly extrapolate it on things you have no knowledge of.
They're right.
@@BellBeakerBloke thanks for westplaining to me, Mr. I can't name 5 cities in countries I claim expertise in.
Actually your comment say a lot of your twisted perspective so I will argue with you - your view seems cemented by years so that traveling to Ukraine or speaking with Ukrainians won't change it + plus you also could say that I am no impartial. So, I just advice you to travel to Ukraine, at least Kyiv and Lviv are safe to "do your own research" and rather use other countries as examples.
First, Poland and Solidarnosc. Did you know that Leh Valensa, leader of protest was a simple electrician who as now is revealed collaborated with KGB and Polish intelligence, so no US involvement.
I mean I am 99% sure you don't know about country of Kyrgyzstan as well as about it revolution of roses for example, a country which is of zero political importance to the US and which remain alligned with russia after it. Or about Georgia, of which revolution pesky US didn't took advantage and neither approved their accession to NATO nor even use 2008 war to sanction russia, clearly don't even care about it.
It's also trully ridiculous how, you guys, who sure consider yourself conservatives adopt literally the same takes as Noam Chomsky, who also denies any Eastern European agency in colour revolutions . Think about it. Personally I can't wrap it around my head if not use horseshoe theory (which i believe is not relevant while you as a AM's enjoyer shouldn't be radical/populist right-wing).
I don't want to continue this discussion as English isn't my native language and it demands more time which I don't have. So long.
You British have a lot to answer for.
Leyland.