Is Avengers Secret Wars Destined To Fail Or Break Records
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- čas přidán 7. 03. 2023
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No matter how to the MCU is doing, if we get a trailer with a shot of Cap, SpiderMan, Wolverine, Mr Fantastic and Iron Man standing side by side….people will forget all the bad lol
Secret wars should’ve been the next endgame. There’s no bigger marvel story in the history of comics and yet they decided to blow their load and jump right to it
It is the next Endgame. It’s the culminating Avengers film of a three-phase saga.
By the time it comes out it would’ve been atleast 7-8 years since Endgame, wouldn’t call that jumping right to it
There will easily be more projects and story told between the time of endgame and the time of secret wars than there was between the first iron man film and endgame.
Secret wars IS the next endgame
with almost every project now being delayed, we might be getting secret wars 10 years later or sooner, they will slowly build up to there like infinity saga, hopefully.
It doesn’t need to get bigger it just need to get better .
I would buy a ticket if I saw Steve Rogers and Wolverine side by side. On that premise alone.
I just don’t know how you top something like EVERY MCU character EVER stepping out of those portals in Endgame, and then “Avengers…assemble”. That was one of the most exciting, joyful moments I’ve ever experienced at a movie theater.
I’m sure there’s a way to at least match the magic of that moment without feeling like a ripoff or retread, but damned if I know what that is.
Maybe Tony and Steve showing up together at the last minute to help save the day?
No Way Home would not have made as much money as it did without the nostalgia of having characters from the previous Spider-Man iterations. Marvel is going to try the same thing with Secret Wars and bring in characters from previous Marvel adaptations. I have serious reservations about what the quality of Secret Wars will be, but the nostalgia will be a driving factor at the box office. Do I think it will be as big as Infinity War? No. But $1.5 billion is a possibility, I think.
@@leonkennedy2400-z3d yes, Far From Home did crack a billion. But I don’t think No Way Home would have made 1.9 billion without the actors from past iterations. I think it too could have been a billion dollar film, but not almost 2 billion.
If Matthew McConaughey doesn't play a shiny disco jumpsuit-wearing THE BEYONDER, complete with '80s Jeri-curl, it won't work....
Thanos is obviously iconic. But really, he’s just a big strong dude with a space army and infinity stones. Kang is inherently more interesting. To me at least. And it’s Jonathan Majors, arguably a top 5 current actor, maybe the best working right now. If they’re somehow able to tie all this multiverse stuff together (which is a big IF), it could be something special.
Kang is just a time traveler that wants to rule the world. Boring. At least thanos was insane and have more interesting motivations than "i want to conquer all the timelines because i'm the bad guy"
Honestly it feels like every day we get a new MCU is failing or future of the MCU segment. Unless it's about a movie that's going to come out in 2023/ early 2024 or has already come out, can we just please stop trying to predict the future of the MCU?
Especially with the new reports of them pulling back on projects, extending release dates, and going back for multiple rewrites, the MCU that we know now and the MCU that we know by the end of 2024 could be completely different even just in their base overline quality or subject matter.
Agreed.
Thank you. These armchair critics won’t even let the phases develop like they did with 1-3. Like if they want the MCU to fail so bad they should just say it
Kang aint that much of a big deal to comic fans they should of picked a better villain
Yeah Dr. DOOM should of been the one
I believe the next AVENGER movies will be better than the rest of the MCU flicks
Marvel have coasted on a lot of post infinity saga goodwill for the past few years and they've really exhausted that now. They need to start making great movies that deliver what we want again.
XMen vs The Avengers would be the closet thing to beating Endgame
Nah, I think Avengers vs X-Men will be your Civil War but dialed up to 100. Age Of Apocalypse done right or even Onslaught is where it's at for your Endgame level finale to what will hopefully be the Mutant Saga next.
Absolutely agree. That will bring on the casuals and the nerds. Without a doubt
Theres plenty left for the mcu to do when weve never seen dr doom or magneto and so many other great villains and heroes
Needs to be much further into the distance, doesn’t feel long enough from endgame
Kang is just not that guy...he's boring. Basic powers and a astronaut looking suit. Thanos was really menacing and felt like a force to be reckoned.Kang just doesn't feel like the next big bad guy
Also, it doesn't help that he was defeated by ants
How does the MCU go bigger after Secret Wars? Two words. Doctor. Doom.
"You can't do Galactus in a movie, he's too big"
Aren't you the same guy that thoughts the Celestials were going to be the next big threat instead of Kang?
Huh??? "Galactus can't work in a live action movie...How is he a character you can use in a movie?" Has John not read all the amazing stories with Galactus in the comics? I mean the MCU has already had Thanos, Celestials, and Ego, all of which you can't fight head-on in the comics...Yeah they may reimagine Galactus a bit for the MCU, but i don't see it as an unsurmountable issue.
@@realjohnlove It's all very subjective, but I don't see how everything up to Endgame is "grounded", with Galactus somehow being a bridge too far. But I agree, that he will be reimagined for the MCU, like every character so far.
It will be tough to top Endgame when it comes to records. Its tough to imagine the hype building up to that level in 3 years time.
I still remember summer 2018 with all the theories after IW's ending
Galactus shouldn't he used in the MCU? Mr. Sinister shouldn't be called Mr. Sinister? Do you even like Marvel?
Yeah odd things to say 🤔
I love Mr. Sinister and I can’t wait for them to eventually bring him into the MCU once the x-men & mutants finally arrive in the next few years. They could really do some great stories with him as the main villain, love it, good one John!
It should definitely be 2 parts, like Infinity War was going to be.
"Bringing an even bigger bad like Galactus"
It genuinely pains me when people don't know the Greatness of Doctor Doom.
You and me both dude lol
It will be the cameos that save secret wars. All they need to do is put in a few fox x-men and fantastic 4, toby and andrew, a live action miles or something in the trailer and everyone is turning up to watch the film.
How the hell are they gonna do secret wars and they haven't even introduced Dr Doom yet?
I heard that Marvel’s going to push back the release date for Avengers Secret Wars to May of 2028 either to celebrate the 20th anniversary of Ironman or to hire better writers within that time span.
Psssssh, there is no way that secret wars catches endgame. No way.
It's too early to tell how Secret Wars will do. Come back to this question in the next two years or later if they get delayed again.
It's hard to tell for me tbh but I'm still very very very excited for it
Of course Avengers Secret Wars is going to break office records I just hope they adapt the 1984/1985 Secret Wars storyline I Absolutely can't wait to see the Avengers The Xmen and the Fantastic Four meeting each other for the first time it's going to be epic
I would want that version more than anything but because of the Multiverse I doubt we'll get that version of Secret Wars
@V 1000 I know but either way I'm seeing Avengers Secret Wars no matter what
So afraid especially as they still have Rick and Morty writer on this project. We still don’t know who’s directing it. Wish they bring back The Russo Brothers and the writers from the Cap trilogy. Phase 4 and seeming the beginning of phase 5 are let downs
I agree with John…even if the MCU course-corrects and Secret Wars and the films preceding it are well-received, they’ll still be playing catch-up due to this current dip in enthusiasm.
Plus the excitement leading up Infinity War/Endgame will be almost impossible to duplicate.
I wouldn't mind if they set up doctor doom as an evil iron man type character. An evil genius. They should make a movie with him being the star.
If they can do him without making him a joke
@@Gundam4 sincere take on Doom. Literally like the opposite of Tony but evil/take over the world intentions. Shows his rise and how he takes over Latveria by the end. Addresses the villain issue and sets him up as a tier 1 antagonist. Could work like Joker did. Would also be a fresh idea.
@@z5m2 sincere is putting it mildly. They'll most likely do him worse than Josh trank's Fantastic Four and I know nobody wants to talk about that
"I don't know how the Marvel heroes could ever beat Galactus?!?!" = STAKES!!! Sign me up
The Celestials SHOULD have been the bigger-badder Phase 5 built up to. But now how that kind of came and went with a whimper , it all feels like empty spectacle at this point.
ALSO Avengers is NOT really the Avengers WITHOUT Tony Stark and Steve Rodgers. They were the pillars of the MCU no other characters have come close being stalwart replacements.
Agree. Falcon is boring
Absurdity. It's so far away. Who actually knows. Especially if these new reports are true, they're getting moved to 2027/28. And I'm sure the film will do fine either way. But come on. This doesn't need to be a segment. Is say when it's close to Kang Dynasty or after it's reasonable to ask questions like this.
Exactly my thoughts as well. Three years is way too long to even hypothetically be talking about this movie and it's succeeding or flopping. We can talk about hopefuls and what we would like to see in the movie... But trying to predict its excess before even getting the post-credits teaser that is going to lead up to it... It's like trying to figure out which stock is going to perform well over the next ten years without even knowing what you're trying to invest in.
If the quality and storytelling of MCU properties start improving, starting with Gaurdians 3, I say Kang Dynasty can't break records.
If things stay the same, then I think it'll do well, but not break records.
Edit: I don't necessarily think phase 4 has been bad, just inconsistent.
Hmmm, I don’t know about this. The MCU has been going down hill for a while. Can they come back after all the “flops” they’ve been doing? (What I mean by “flop” is that none of the MCU movies last year cracked $1 billion and the percentage rates for the first Phase 5 MCU movie had quite the drop in its second week.)
Imo secret wars is basically the cosmic version of civil war lol…
Listen, I love comic book movies. But, marvel is dipping too far into nerd territory for most people. Even in the comics, I absolutely hate the multi-verse concept. It is a huge copout whenever these companies want to reset something. It’s over done, and in the MCU come up very poorly explained.
What are they suppose to do, abandoned the decades of history to make something new no one knows about?
This movie is going to be a clash of multiversal characters! It's looking so promising ! Xo I can't wait
More balanced tones and compelling character focus like an HBO show, or a Nolan film, and less like entertainment you’d find in a theme park ride queue.
I have faith 3000.
Given who Marvel Studios have been hiring as writers I don't think the quality will be HBO or Nolan level
That was before. Now is not even a fun park ride, The Avengers 2012 was a rollercoaster. Quantumania is a boring kiddie ride
Kang is the right character the issue is Kang doesn't have Infinity Stones to use that connects the Saga together... No Nick Fury to bring an Avengers team together as a thread between movies to keep people excited.
I dont think GoTG can be a momentum builder storywise. Maybe as a good film though. I say that because only Adam Warlock will be moving forward. Also, its an end to a chapter.
GOTG will be a great movie but not a consequencial movie for the multiverse saga.
@@arturocastroverde3349 at least people might stop waving the "Marvel makes crap movies now" flag. So that might be momentum in terms of people's feelings.
Sigh. The film will do fine. It's like, potentially 6 years away if some of these reports are true. And alot of build up to before it. Like, this segment is terrible.
I don’t think galactus will be the big bad in secret wars I think it will be god emperor doom will be the big bad
It won’t do as good. They are gonna loose the casuals and no one is going to care about it enough by time it comes out. I’m sure all the die hards will see it but not casual film fans.
The movies will do incredibly well regardless. I think people are counting their chickens way too early before they hatch and doing a little too much of doom posting for the sake of chasing clout.
It really just depends on the viewers point of view. I don't share in that "lack luster" feeling fans are experiencing with recent Marvel releases. I do feel that the films will get better as we near Kang Dynasty though.
Only 3 years until secret wars?? I’m pretty sure they will get pushed back. There’s no way they can put together secret wars in 3 years. Especially if it’s supposed to be bigger than endgame. I bet both avengers movies gets pushed back
I think with MCU movies/tv series for me at least, they're not a must see to me like they had been. With Thor Love and Thunder, I tapped out. I'll wait to hear word of mouth, even if/then I hear positive feedback I'm so very skeptical. And, I think most of us have reached this same point. And, I'm thinking this will affect the box office.
feel like they should do a hard reset with x-men. it's already convoluted now, so I can't imagine what the MCU would look like with Avengers + X-Men teaming up. Somethings, like John said about Galactus, are really better in cartoons or comics.
Alternatively, the MCU could copy DC with its Elseworld plans. I feel like there are so many cool stories left untold because they don't fit in the larger Thanos, Multiverse, etc. saga.
X Men makes sense when you have not watch 1,2, First Class, and Days of Future Past.
If they don't learn from am3 then it will be the nail in the coffin
Is this y’all victory lap? Waiting for a poorly received Marvel film to power y’all agendas as if they haven’t had Thor 3, the hulk film, and Ironman 2? MCU ain’t goin no where
@@healthiswealth1452 it was ok. Better than love and thunder in my opinion
Marvel has a quality issue they need to address first and drip feeding these b/c characters and holding back the X-Men till after secret wars isn't smart, since Endgame everything in cinema or D+ aside from MoM has been substandard and often pointless show's that seem just rushed for D+ content, I haven't even seen Ant Man and not in any rush kinda say's where there heading imo.
The only reason i am more excited for Doom than Sinister is ive seen two bad versions of Doom already and i deserve to see an amazing version. Sinister is really a different kind of character altogether that they need to build over many movies or d+ shows
They haven't introduced enough characters to do Secret Wars yet. It will be anticlimactic like Civil War was. These were massive events that crossed over between a lot of titles, not just Avengers. The Infinity Saga wasn't even as big as it should have been for the same reason.
Honestly the MCU needs to stop chasing hype trains and just focus on making these newer characters interesting and unique how do they stand out
Secret wars and kang dynasty will make two billion dollars each that’s just simple.
Not even it. Over a billion each not 2 each
It’s possible with the original avengers and Russo Brothers! But Phase 4&5 movies aren’t looking good for Avengers Kang Dynasty.
Biggest movie? Thats a big question mark. I hope it will be. Everybody is excited about Kang Dynasty and more excited about Secret Wars. I think Galactus will be in it. I beleive Doctor Doom will be in it. Maybe we will see the Red Skull again. I hope I see him again. Mannn, I hope they really write a great stroy before they start filming. 3 or 4 years away is really not a long time to have it done.
At this point I think it’s a little too close to regain the kind of hype that Infinity War and Endgame had but I think it ultimately comes down to how is this next phase of the MCU that we just entered into with Quantumania gonna turn out? If it continues to be the same kind of mixed bag that phase 4 was then I think it’s probably not gonna do all that well, however if by chance the MCU starts cranking out some really great stuff one after another with no real glaring bad spots then I think they could build up enough goodwill with the audience to have it open really big, I still think it’s a little too late for it to reach Infinity War and Endgame level hype but I think they could get to something like Civil War level hype, but I think it all really comes down to how is our perception of the MCU gonna be within the next 3 years?
Preach brother!!! Facts…🔥🔥🔥
THANKS for this! Galactus and the Silver Surfer are my favorite characters in all of fiction so I believe that a focused Feige can make the Big G work!
Does it always to be bigger after? It can be like prequel. Just enjoy and movies, thats want its for, to be entertained. Maybe its better to start slow then it goes big, that is much easier
I heard or saw that SECRET WARS could be broken up into two films and really, I don't see how it can be done any other way and still have a respectable return on investment. One problem Marvel has is that besides having to top its previous movies, it also has to keep improving on its own mold because as it stands, the current model and expectations for superhero movies are the ones that Marvel established and set. What most audiences seem to want from superhero movies and maybe even some non superhero sci-fi and action films is what the Marvel Cinematic Universe gave us between May of 2008 and May 2019. I don't think you can top the setup and payoff of the portals scene at the end of AVENGERS ENDGAME. Yet unless Marvel can somehow pull back a little and condition audiences to want a more intimate or subdued finale, something like the portals scene is probably what will be expected from SECRET WARS, yet ultimately disappoint as well. The reason ENDGAME works so well, though, by Marvel's own admission, is that it broke up the leadership of the Avengers into Iron Man and Captain America and then put them at such odds over such well established stakes and themes that it broke up the team, itself (like a band as Bruce and Tony say). We cared because each had demonstrated heroism and because the Avengers as a team had already fought so valiantly before ever even hearing of Thanos. Right now, there is no established team, so KANG DYNASTY, at least, is going to expect us to care equally for what will likely be a whole new roster of characters that we barely know (on-screen anyway) and, in my opinion, at least, have very little reason to care about beyond the fact that someone calls them Avengers. Black Panther was a huge draw in the last two Avengers films, but (spoiler alert) can anyone really see Shuri fighting alongside Shang Chi and the Marvels? I mean, for reasons other than their gender and race - though the way things are going, Marvel may believe those things to be motivation enough.
Agree. The story was interesting cuz we see the team join, Tony and Cap fighting and split the team apart. In IW we have a consequence for their actions in CW. In EG, the reconciliation of the leaders and the teamwork showed the best our of the worst scenario.
With their current level of writing which is mediocre at best, secret wars won't even reach the first Avengers box numbers
I stand by the belief that after Endgame, Marvel should have taken a small break. What they are doing now just isn't must see. Feels like season 5 of a show that we all know could have stopped a season 3. They are gonna have to slow down and revamp how they intend on telling the multi-verse saga story. Especially because for a "multiverse" saga they haven't introduced or made us care about any other realities besides the main continuity.
We did have a break. Do you remember we didn’t have any marvel movies in 2020???
@@kadencastro8168 Because of COVID. Black Widow and Eternals were originally 2020 release dates, plus we got Far from home in 2019 after Endgame. I mean a small break to really think about the next steps and then the next movie releases set up who the new "main characters" are going forward.
@@danterose6673 like again we still got a break. Especially Covid got in the way so they had to shuffled nine projects a year. I think the main character would’ve been Black Panther if Chadwick boseman didn’t die.
@@danterose6673 also I think the reason why that they’re putting so much projects is because some of the actors are getting older and they want to put many projects as possible so that they don’t have to do 8 or 10 year of the multiverse saga. If that’s the case then I could see why they’re putting so much projects.
I feel like now more than ever wether Secret Wars/Kang Dynasty do “just ok” or “exceed expectations” depends on the strength of Phase 5+6 going forward.
I think the idea that ANY movie with Avengers in the title outright *fails* is ridiculous.
Love the Leafs reference. It's a hard life rooting for them.
I've gotten increasingly bored of the news cycle telling us how good or bad a product is doing.
'Less Subways were sold this month... The biggest failure"
... Who gives a f. If the product is good for you that's all that matters.
The problem is that the multiverse isn’t that intriguing of a story and feels too gimmicky
The multiverse just isn't working. Thanos and the infinity stones were things people could comprehend and understand. It made sense and felt real. The multiverse is nothing but lines in the sky and a dependency on being told, not shown, that it is a big deal. In their quest to become "bigger," they instead just became more confusing and less interesting.
True words.
If you want it spoon fed to you just say that lol
@@ovovenger Let me know how that mentality works out for the MCU in the long term. It's their job to make people care about the story being told, and they have not done it. You can act like you are the smartest person in the room, but at this rate the room is getting less and less full. I love the MCU and always will, but that doesn't make it immune to critique.
@@travisgowen5044 I just see complaining not really critiques from the statement you made. It’s been one phase since the end of endgame. Let the phases play out like you did with phase 1-3 bc you obviously kept watching after Incredible Hulk, dark world, and age of ultron. Then we can definitively say if something didn’t work or not. These click bait segments of trying to predict the MCU’s demise is getting old.
I don't know why anybody thinks the next avengers film will be the biggest thing ever. We had 2 avengers movies, and civil war before we got infinity war.
For decades there’s been comparatively smaller, more personal Avengers stories in comics.
The idea that *EVERY* Avengers movie needs to get progressively more massive is something I’d like to see challenged.
DOOM. DOOM. DOOM. DOOM. DOOM. DOOM. DOOM. DOOM.
I know I'm a bit late in this question but why the set change?
Why are MCU fans rooting for the franchise to fail so badly? It's REALLY creepy...
because those who are are not MCU fans. It is ok to be skeptical and keep expectations under check but the moment it turns into hate watching you are no longer a fan.
They loose faith in MCU. We are not in 2019 when they ruled the world, we are in 2023 when they made money but the movie will be less and less succesfull
I doubt it will fail. But people are tired of the super hero movies. I wouldn't be surprised if it underperforms. Only time will tell.
Imagine if Jonathan Majors was the new Tchalla initially
You save galactus for last
Doom, mr sinister, magneto, bring them all in. Hell, bring in apocalypse and galactus too. Not all in 1 movie of course 🤣
The question shouldn't be how big will Secret Wars be and how well it will do, the question that should be asked is, will anyone still care about Marvel in 3 years?. My answer is no, to some yes but mostly no.
facts, peoples interest is starting to go down
I think part of the problem was that they sacrificed too much in phase 4 but I set up new characters. They don't have the 1 character trying to tell them all that there's a big threat coming like nick fury did and phase 1 and 2. I'm hoping Loki will be that character but they have to try to do better with their End credit scenes trying to get them all together.they could have been a better job of setting new characters and seting up Kang as a threat and phase 4 would they sacrifice 1 for the other. I wouldn't be surprise to see Robert Downey junior or Chris Evans come back as different characters in secret wars.
when i saw the picture of mr sinister I immediately thought of keanu Reeves
I could kinda care less either way at this time. If the Marvels fails to deliver, i'll have my prediction then.
MCU‘a glory days are gone. They will make money but their hay days are gone. I enjoy the films/series but I no longer feel the need to go to the theaters to see them anymore. But they will make money
Secret Wars will be somewhere in between NWH and IW/Endgame
Balls of hope?!
The scale of the movie doesn't need to be bigger after secret wars, it needs to be good
Unless there's a helicarrier there with a sergeant at the helm.. I won't say anything else.
Comics are a great source to get villains from
As a fellow Leafs fan I know the misery John! At least we got to experience the glory days of the MCU!!
i wish phase 4 ws setting up dark reign type story lines nd we went smaller after endgame then do multiverse l8er
phase 4 : (2021 to 2023)
FATWS
Shang Chi
Loki (Multiverse)
Spiderman 3
Hawkeye
Doctor Strange 2 (Multiverse)
Daredevil Born Again Part 1
Avengers (Street Level) : Secret Invasion
Phase 5: (2024 to 2026)
Ant Man 3 (Multiverse)
GOTG 3 (Space)
BP 2 with TChalla
Echo
Captain America 4
Thunderbolts
Daredevil Born Again Part 2
Avengers (Street Level) : Devils Reign
Phase 4 to 5 : Kingpin Saga / Devils Reign Saga
Phase 6 to 8 : Multiverse Saga
Go little smaller and individual stories that build new characters and maybe change to a darker tone especially use their more darker characters instead of using the same family friendly tone as most of the previous films did.
I'll never understand why the titles of the avengers movies were revealed.
Kang Dynasty tell me that movies like antman 3 Kang was either gonna win (very unlikely back then and now we know that didn't happen) or it will be a different Kang which seems to be the case. And like John as implied as well I just don't know if any Kang we see moving forward until we see the BOSS Kang we aren't gonna care about them.
Secret wars apparently the beyonder is the big bad and they make him into a Kang variant but still doesn't excites me just worries me.
The hype for the title release of endgame was next level. Idk why they didn't just announce 2 new avengers movies no titles.
Honestly they should have just taken a break from building up to different phases for a while and focus on making movies just focusing one thing at a time in their movies. Could have done some collab of superheroes in between.
Then slowly plan out the rest of the phase that would lead to the next avengers movie.
The problem was this time they rushed it too much and put so many unnecessary fillers that won’t make a difference at the end of it
Man it sucks that no one wants to be a fan anymore, everyone wants to be critics… I remember back when people use to just go to movies and enjoy the right now versus worrying about what’s next, why even go see something now if you already focused on what’s next potentially sucking.
Then maybe Marvel should refocus on making excellent, self-contained films that aren’t endless setups for more setups and don’t require homework beforehand. There’s no way I’m subscribing to D+ just to watch dozens of hours of filler TV so I can get caught up on the various characters and storylines.
@@tronam you talking about filler and you aren’t even subscribed? That’s y’all problem 😂
@@ovovenger Disney can make whatever they want. I have no problem with them catering to hardcore Marvel fans who like keeping up with all the various TV shows and movies. My interest has been waning anyway since Endgame and I haven’t found the last 3 or 4 films very appealing, so maybe it’s time for me to move on. The question is whether or not their blockbuster business model can still thrive without normies like myself. We’ll see.
@@tronam Fair, I don’t think many people find age of ultron, Incredible Hulk, dark world, or iron man 2 all that appealing but I guess they eventually bought into it. But we’ll see.
I hope Mr Sinister is coming and is the first xmen villain he is a interesting one and could be really good
The Avengers movies are doomed from here on out😢 there I said it
I think GotG3 will get a pass because it's Gunn's swan song with the series and with Disney. It's the next few films after that that will be under a microscope. If GotG3 bombs though, then Marvel is in some serious trouble but I doubt that'll happen. The delay of Marvels isn't a good sign, on the surface at least.