Upgrading JBL 14001 amplifier to run 1ohm!?
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2024
- So a friend of mine came in with a JBL GTO14001 and wanted to see if it could be made to run more reliably at 1ohm! Remember, the amp will NEVER see 1ohm when connected to a subwoofer, so the fact it benches down there fine means this should run sweet!
Protection circuit: "OVERCURRENT, SHUT'R DOWN! whew, that was close, we kept it safe."
*Thirty seconds later*
Bare vids: "We're gonna bypass this cause it doesn't work."
Protection circuit: "Am I a joke to you?"
I'm happy you made this video. I own 2 of these amplifiers and always wondered what kind of actual power they can do. I'm considering the same upgrades to run a 1.5 ohm load.
Love your videos from here in the USA! You have a gift for speaking your mind. You remind me of myself for wanting to help those who don't know, and making them, those who do know, what you know. You're a great teacher. Thank you for sharing.
I would love to see Pioneer, and Orion amps benched. (Some class D's too)
I love ur videos man.
I found these videos yesterday after I ate dinner. I've now watched 4 videos including a double that was like 2 hours long. Cheerio my good gents. Look now I'm starting to speak English, not the American type but British.
Ok, that was a cheesy joke but I'm still excited to watch all these amp repair videos. Ive zlways wanted to learn how to repair blown amps. Now it feels like I found some lost treasure.
Nice work Sam. JBL Power!!
Amazing video! I love my JBL 14001 and my jbl 12011 amazing amps!
i have a jbl m4 that sudenly stoped driving its 4 chanels, the fan and led turn on, i did a little work on its circuit and its has some ic pc1298v driving some fet at his outputs, for every chanel. these ic's get the signal from opamps, wich are being feed with +30v, altough its datasheet calls for 18v max. i just have 1 multimeter. i dont know how to haunt the fault. need help
Hello, I have my dbo for bass that does not work on my amplifier could you help me please. It does not work on the amplifier with the adjustment screws and with the die control! The rca exit from the station must be a sub rca socket! Because I don't have any!
I heard you say changing the power inputs would be a pain. I have a skar skv2 100.4 that came with a stripped neg Allen screw. What would you remand I do to fix it? Hard to get a tap and die in there since its so shallow. Def dont want to risk further damage by drilling through. Thread insert or?
I have the 2005 gto1201t. I wish u were in usa, great vids mate!
Great Knowledge. This helped me alot!!!
I learn more every time I watch your videos.
Theoretically, if i can keep the amp cool enough and have enough power supply, i can possibly run it below the manufacturer recommended impedance?
Hey i have an old apcl 15000.1d and the protect light is on and the blue light is blinking, any idea whats wrong with it ? I have opened it up and none of the fets are burnt so idk. Im thinking the output fets are done for, is there anyway to test since there inst any visible damage?
I don't understand why the schematics show on both the board and the diagram 80V 4700Uf caps, but the parts list shows 100v 3300uf caps, which is what the amp contains. My issue is finding caps that are 30mm high, I can only find 35mm high in the 100v 3300uf which I already have 10 of. Was 73v the max you read on the output section after it was modified and did you know the voltage before modification? If the voltage were below 70 I would be willing to switch to the 80v 4700uf caps which are readily available for pretty low prices.
Do you think it would be possible to upgrade a factory Mitsubishi amp from an Eclipse? I'd love to have a sneaky stock looking upgrade. Part number is MR158402. I can send you one if you want to check it out!
Found the video I've looking for! I just subscribed to your channel !!!!!😎💯🔥
Hey brotha, need to have 2 jbl gto 14001s fixed and modded to run 1 ohm. Please and thank you. I'm from the states and no one hear that I know will take on the task. Please please 🙏 help.
Awesome video like usual, although I would have definitely left those fuses in place. Yes, the power wire has one(hopefully) but any internal issues the on board ones will blow quicker than the power wire one.
i had one of that back a couple year...was a great amp and very sexy to look at too!!
great job! thanks for share your knowledge
I had a 1999 jbl 1200.1 that thing was a beast . I wish I could get my hands on another one .
Have you ever done any work on a crossfire vr 2000d output stage. I have one and the left side out put mosfets keeps popping. Any advice?
Change drivers
You are one crazy man, I like it!
Hi, i changed my jbl gto1000.4 amp to a gto14001 for my subs, and now i hear an alternator noise in my system, if i put back my old 1000.4 the noise is not there, what can cause the problem? Thanks for your help, and thanks for this video!
I just had to go through an A3000gti. The output fets get out just from idling. What would cause that? My first thought was, sketchy fets that aren’t matched. I have another batch coming..
Check the shape of the gate drive going in. It's probably fine. Many do get warm at idle.
barevids well the other half of the amp fets don’t get warm right away. I’m going to go through the gate driver board again. The shit pisses me off. If you ever run out of content, I will start a life stream from my house, just so you can watch my amp being probed, and tell me what I’m overlooking. Then you can live stream you watching my live stream... lol
Most underrated you seen , what about the Orion hcca 3000.1 splx ? Keep making great video’s
Hi, @barevids any chance you have any info on if the AMP Surivived long term with this mod?? im considering doing it myself, wondering if there is anything you would do different, or if it runs good
It's still running good now to this day, even with the user running 0.5ohm..
@@barevidsBrill, Thanks :) will be doing the upgrade to mine next month when the parts arrive from mouser
@@barevids The upgrade went well, sounds great and runs great @ 1 ohm, seems to run much cooler than before also :)
Thanks and Keep making Great Videos :)
Nice. Using a calibrated mic for recording. Awesome!
for the static dummy load are you just using resistors?
I'm sorry I might look stupid but what formula are you using to calculate the wattage? All I could get is the voltage output of the amplifier times it's self then that times something else equals wattage..but what's that something? Amperage? And is there a way to measure wattage without a tool to read off amperage?..cause I don't have anything like that..
Ohms law. I have a static 1ohm load so you use that and the voltage to work out current. You then do voltage times current to work out the power. You then do resistive square law correction factor based on input voltage to 14.4v.
@@barevids oh ok..but how can I figure out the wattage without having a meter to measure the amperage draw? Or is that not possible?
@@lazy4life207 Yes its possible as barevids stated. Output power= (V^2)/R = ((Vnom/Vin x Voutrms x 2)^2)/R. where Vnom is typical input voltage 14.4v, Vin is the measured input voltage on amp 11.92v, Voutrms is output rms voltage measured on oscilloscope across his 1 ohm load, and R is the 1 ohm load. In his last calculation he did (14.4/11.92x20.33x2) all squared=2412 Watts. The 2 is there because of the H-bridge output swings both output voltages, not just 1 voltage with ref to 0v. AND we did not divide by 1 ohm coz anything divided by 1 is itself. If he was using 1.33 ohm output or 2 ohm or 4 ohm then this value would be divided into the result as in formula.
Great video!! I would like to ask you this though:
I have a TAS5630 class D chip amp(on mono PBTL) that I want to play with and this is rated at 2 ohm. Now, since the datasheet says its minimum load is 1.6 *with recommended filter*. Now how could I get this driving 1.33 ohm or so by modifying the output filter? Increase the inductor value or up the capacitors?
Problem with chip amps is that they can't handle more output current, they have small legs so they are limited by that resistance. You might get more power but it's not worth it, you are either gonna burn it or THD will rise over 10% .
+Dave Micolichek not really. This amp dosen't have any compression or any specialized circuits.
The programmable output is programmed at 19 amperes, rated at 52 volts(63v absolute maximum). What I want to do is to make sure the output filter is good enough as some of these amps do better with a different filter.
What's more, this is a bass amp with a 9dB/oct filter. 50-150 hz.
My personal favorite is the TDA7293, with its parallel mode offering you to drive lower impedances.
It is Class D chip, all graphs they provided are at 2 ohms or higher which means you are most likely pushing it hard even on 2 ohms. You can draw 500W from it, that means about 15A, at 1 ohms you would get 250W with same output current (1% THD). You can probably run it at 1 ohm but don't expect a lot of power, or at least low THD at higher levels.
You can also see filter in datasheet.
Ive been thinking is it possible to super charge for say a amp to do more power with upgraded internals
I just "repaired" an alpine mrp m1000, just replaced both banks of the ouput section, the drivers and 10ohm 3w filter resistors. It is working but i find one of the drivers and filter coil running hotter. Do you have any sugestions where to look at? (Everything at low volume)
Oh man. I am mega stressed out with the exact same amp at the moment. One bank is cutting off the top of the sine wave when over 75% amplitude. I've changed EVERYTHING on this board. Can't resolve it. Too many hours wasted.
Oh crap.. My osc fried so i cant probe the wave, was hopping this was a simple fix. Something funny happened when i wiggled one of the coils, and it got back to a continuos power cycle like it was before. Another thing i dont like is the lack of an output relay..
Im finding the rail voltages too low, around +-36v.. On a 12v computer psu
That's about the right rails
I have a schematic
It has a dedicated pop reduction circuit instead of relay
The drive wave looks good, but are the PS fets getting a full 10 volts into the gates ? Well that might be a thing about testing on reduced voltage :)
hello guys, how many amperes do you need to operate this amplifier in 2 ohms?
200a would be the correct fuse to run.
Hi. Is it normal that when this board is out of the heatsink that the 2x KA7812 get pretty warm but everything else stays cool? (normally bolted somewhere between all the the other transistors to the heat sink). Great video! The amp is working I just wondered why those two were getting warmer but perhaps they just run like that continuously and they were not on the heatsink.
Yes totally normal
@@barevids Phew. Thanks for the reply Sam. The guy told me the amp was in amazing condition but he had drilled and tapped out most of the connectors. those JBL connectors are a piece of shit, all the pins had snapped off and then I blew my new 500W soldering iron gun. I think because I turned it to full power it's labelled 220V and I'm on 230V.
Anyway I soldered cables directly to the board and post fuses. I had to throw the binding post, all the pins were snapped but happy days it now works. Having fun arguing with the guy who sent it to me and sent him all the photos of the repair to prove him wrong. lol
He also sent me the 7001 but at least that one was in good Nic!
How do you calculate the output effect ?
RMS voltage * RMS voltage / load resistance.
Example:
28v^2 (RMS)
______ = 784 Watt (RMS)
1 (Load in ohm)
voltage times voltage divided by impedance.
thanks for another great vid, i love learning more and more about amps !
FULL BRIDGE -RECTIFIER- AMPLIFIER!!
electroboom style
Full bridge output gives twice the supply capacitor utilization.
@@dunckeroo1987 ikr
Why would the power supply run cooler at 14.4 than 12V. Does Ohms law not apply in this case?
less switching losses with the higher primary side voltage in this case. Not true for all amplifiers, depends where the sweet spot is in regards to deadtime.
@@barevids I'm very interested in this as it is a common belief in car audio that low voltage leads to amplifier failure. I can understand that in regulated designs where the amp increases its current draw to maintain output at lower voltages, but not with unregulated designs. Could you elaborate?
Wow Professional upgrade , is it cleaner output on 2ohm ?
EXELENT!! I love modifications like this!! Is there anything else that can be done, besides thickening traces?
Rewind the transformer to higher voltage on the secondaries, and upgrade caps etc as required for the new voltage.
I love the live streams but I really miss these edited videos as well. It's all good!
Trying to do a few more like this ☺
barevids good job. I like being able to go back and use videos like this as a reference when I'm having a problem. For example i did a power supply mosfet upgrade the other day and didn't realize why my fets where getting hot and the had a wave just like the one you showed. Now I can go back to that amp and fix it with the proper resistors. Those little tips like that are the ones I'm in need of at this level. I do about 2 amps a week but I am in desperate need of some knowledge. Your the only person I have to learn from besides Perrys download.
at 38:25 when you probed the back of the mosfets why do some show the drive waves and some don't?
Highside and lowside
@@barevids k thanks so do just the highside mosfets show the drive waves?
Would you think about checking out the Gravity war zone amps i see them all over online and they look to be audio pipe clones but cheaper price
All arc audio car amplifiers have a protection circuit that causes the car amplifier to shut off if you run it at a impedance that is lower than what the car amplifier is stable at for an example the arc audio fd4150 car amplifier is stable at 2 ohms run it lower than 2 ohms and it shuts off run it lower than 4 ohms bridged and it also shuts off
Great video!
In the beginning of your video, I see you resetting the gain for the different ohm loads. My question is what's the best way to set the gain with a DD-1? Would it be with the subs hooked up or should I have a static 2ohm load on it? I have a JBL GTO 1400.1. It's definitely an awesome amplifier.
Subs hooked up. Always.
@@barevids thank you. That's the way I did it. I just wanted to make sure. One of these days I want to make that amp work at 1ohm.
awesome job !
U went from 2ohm to 1.33ohm and only gained 100watts =/ that would be a RED flag for me
well the point was to make it run at 1.33ohms not gain more power but anyway
So yeah I got 4 amps that's in need of you help were to send them or you can buy them
lol the most underrated amps are orions, albeit they are cheater amps though.... just a question, do you beef up the traces by just adding solder to them like I would if I was freshining up a pad? awesome vid btw I learn something every time I watch through an amp mod/repair and look forward to seeing more in the future!
You would add a nice silver wire and solder it in. (So short, it just looks like a solder blob)
thanks i sure hope solder wick would hold alot of solder ;)
@Dave Micolichek And its copper. Way better than straight solder. Great comment :)
Great Video man i am liking your series. Keep up the good work. Do you ever test your amps into reactive loads? if so can you tell me what you use? PLEASE dont say a speaker ;)
But a speaker is a reactive load haha. There aren't many other reactive loads that would present the amplifier with a speaker-like condition. When testing reactive, I still leave one or two dummy loads hooked up to stress the amp more than just the speaker.
@@barevids Thanks mate.
I know this is a two year old vid. But I had a Eclipse 4 channel amp that had the B+ and Ground traces that were broken due to board flex.
I used some thin copper sheet and soldered t as a bridge. You should have done the same on the fuse connection connection traces.
I e. Bridge the trace with a copper strip the width of the trace.
With those Fets I normally use 22Ω resistors as well.
52^2/2 = 1352, lil under the 1400 spec. The output will be defined by the turns ratio of the transformers, clip power isn’t real, it FFTs out closer to a square wave so RMS conversation will be off unless it’s a true RMS value, regardless the cone achieves no more excursion because the peak amplitude is the same as the rail not higher, the voice coil sees it as DC, so it’s just producing substantially more heat which is why clipping kills drivers quickly. The thing I would worry about is how well the snubbing network matches the complex drive impedance vs T’on of the switches. Maximum power is transferred when source impeadace is equal to load impedance, the circuit could also become unstable with complex signals and oscillate (or at least be under damped) there could be some combination of frequencies that the output filter disagrees with. L = RL/2PFc so the corner frequency of the LC filter is heavily dependent on the load impedance. So you must change the inductance of the filter when changing load impedance to maintain the class D filter criteria. Good fun though...
He's fudging the number up as he said by square law by assuming that the output clean voltage will raise at the same ratio as the input voltage. He is providing 12v to the amp not 14.4. 52/12X14.4 is 62.35. 62^2/2 is 1922 AKA pretty much the same as what he showed on his calculator. I don't know if said assumption is correct but it works I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Daniel Armstrong perhaps, I’m not familiar with the design, but most switch mode power stages will have feedback to regulate the output, so the voltage should remain constant but draw more amps at higher duty cycle from the input, I would think... I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure I’m seeing the amp produce almost exactly what it’s manufacture’s rating is on the video... so we may never know... in the end I’m not sure it matters all that much since power isn’t linear, it’s 10Log(P2/P1) so a couple hundred watts when you’re already over 1Kw wouldn’t be really noticed, it’s only 1.3dB gain, assuming the drivers aren’t power compressed already, so probably even less actual acoustic power output... I also seriously doubt the amp will be stable for more than a few seconds as the output filter stage will be horribly misaligned from the original design parameters... but I learn new things everyday so maybe I’ve missed something... As an EE I would have to redesign the entire product from scratch to get additional power from it, so I’m not too sure how wise it is, but I guess if reliable operation isn’t a goal....
@@robertw1871 My thinking exactly, right down to the old rule that it takes ~6-10x the power to double the perceived volume.
Just to be clear here though, there are automotive 12v powered amplifiers that are unregulated and advertised as such, that is the push-pull DC-DC converter always runs at its max duty cycle and the transformer turns ratio determines the rail voltage. No idea whatsoever if this unit is one of them.
I've got an Audiopipe APCLE3001D. Only rated for 2 ohms... would be nice to get it at 1 ohm. Scared to cook it tho. Damn things very expensive
Very interesting!
this amp if it works at 1 ohms?
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻🤯
I’ll be running with dual 00input cable and 15v probably seeing lows of 14v a little overkill.
U were testing the final @ 10v?
10v is only used when being worked on since rail voltages are lower and everything is safer if a failure was to occur. Final testing done at 12.4v and 14.4v.
Hello sir is there a way that I can learn to fix amplifiers do you recommend a CD or something like that
plz upgrade your camera
Send him money or a camera if you want to see better quality videos.
what if you want to see better quality videos but don't have money or a camera to send?
It's not cameras fault, this was broadcasted live so video quality is turned a bit down to match upload speed.
Look at his normal videos and you will see.
Cool vid..
Good edit 😄 is this Gian's work?
Nah I just slapped this together real quick at 3am lol there's some mistakes and stuff I forgot to cut 😂
@@barevids went well for a 3am job 👍
Haha, I still offered to help him, but he was too quick
do a bpx2200 next
I have an alpine mrd m500 that went to e-3 current overload . How can I get u to fix it ? Probably make a good vid 😉
Are you in the UK?
The U.S.
I've had the amp for 14years. Bought it brand new had it repaired once already . I'll fed ex it lol
Sorry, only taking on work from the UK!
Oh man. I'll pay for everything
Cool mod. Not keen on bypassing fuses tho bro
Most amps don't have on board fuses, you run your fuse on the power wire. Look at any proper car amp 3k and up. None have fuses.
@@barevids fair enough. In all fairness to you, I don't really work on car audio stuff. I'm more pro audio. Pa amps and mixing boards. They're crammed with fuses, movs, filters and varistors. So that wasn't meant as a dig. I'm liking your vids man lookin forward to the next one!! Just discovered you on YT.
I think the power you're getting is VA not watts. If you're doing Volts x Amps. You need to know the power factor % to get actual watts out of a AC system.
He is driving into a resistive load so power factor will be pretty much = 1. So VA will be watts. However I would like to know if he drives amp output into a reactive load as well for testing.
You are supposed to fuse every so many meters along a chunky positive cable along a long vehicle run. Something like every 3 or 4 meters. This is because if the positive cable connects to ground too far back from the fuse the cable can heat rather than blow the fuse, you can't really rely on battery located fuses when your amps are in the rear, rear located fuses are a good idea for safety. Most people who run more than one amp in the rear usually have a fuse block somewhere in the rear.
Btw i find the gto 7001 beefier then the mrp m1000
You could have just modified the rail voltage, for more output
It's easier to install different fets than it rewind transformer
@@barevids Most amplifiers torriods are "overwound" so you case increase rail voltage, by modifying the resistors on the error amps, of the power supply ic.
I would love to see that put on the SMD amp Dyno. I'm running one of those on 2 Skar VVXV3 12's. They slam hard with that amp.
Its essentially what his bench test is
boards not hot
Amps are more effecient at Higher Voltage - try it at 15.4v / 16v
1900 watts of static. Amazing! Lol.
2 ohm*
@@RWL2012 Yeah, i kinda sound like jerk with that comment :/
If you run your car amplifier at the lowest impedance and run it at the the impedance the it's stable at the car amplifiers spl becomes 115 db and your subwoofers will get all the power from the car amplifier when bridged if your car amplifier is bridgeable and you will definitely be able to hit 150 decibels if you have a really good subwoofer box
@ higher Voltage it draws LESS Amperage making it run cooler = my amps never saw less that 14.7v dropping from 15.4v = so what i am saying is anyone running amps this Large are also upgrading the Alternators & Battery & Wires ( BiGG 3 ) testing at 12v is useless - only Noobs run Big amps on Stock charging systems
I have one i love it im going to hook two 2 ohm dvc subs to it i know a little about wiring but cant find alot of info on amp specs how should i wire the subs to the amp do i bridge it or one to each channel
Coils in series to give you two 4ohm subs. Then parallel the subs. This is a mono amp, there is no bridge.
@@barevids okay what I meant was on the amp there's a left positive negative and a right positive negative and then underneath the channels there's a line from one negative on the left to the right positive on the right so I wire the subs the way you said and then use one negative on the left and one positive on the right correct
@@mattfarley6068 bro like I said it doesn't matter both positive are the same and both negatives are the same it's a mono amp
nice vid